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COMMENT ON OVER DIAGNOSIS
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COMMENT ON OVER DIAGNOSIS

This comment is to any parent who questions whether their 2-5 year olds have ADD/ADHD, or any child, of any age, that is being incorrectly diagnosed with anything and everything these so called professionals and teachers come up with because these children don't fall into what they call the "norm". Whatever that is.  Have we all as parents just given up on raising our children and let the pharmacuetical companies do that for us? We have allowed schools to pressure us into medicating our children so that their jobs can be made easier, which is why I have homeschooled my wrongly diagnosed son, and not just one diagnosis, but many, which were all wrong, but they sure did try to throw out as many as they could. I know there are some children that do truely need medication, but the other 90% DO NOT.

It is a cop out, and our children have to pay the consequences with the horrible side affects of these meds. Please think about it before you allow someone else to decide your childs future. My son will be 18 soon, and he is a wonderful, kind, happy, young man. And my diagnosis for him back then was, he was an individual, and no 2 are alike.
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Avatar_m_tn
No child that I know of at age two is in a public school classroom, so you can't blame that on teachers.  You have homeschooled your child for many, many years to protect him from the public schools.  I commend you.  That takes a very dedicated person.  Most parents have to earn a living and do not have either the time or the money to do what you have done.  What they can do is learn what ADHD is and how it can affect their child and teach their child how to cope with this in the real world because it does not magically stop at age 18.  Its there for life.
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Avatar_f_tn
First and foremost, my comment was in response to a post that a parent of a 2 year old posted about the possibility of her son having ADHD. Also, I am not blaming teachers, and I apologize for making it sound that way I know they do not make the decisions, but I am blaming the public school systems for thinking that the answer to the problem is lets just throw all these kids with a label into a seperate classroom, away from the non-labeled kids. How do you think that affects a childs self esteem when they know they do not belong in there, and do not understand why they would have to be in a room with kids that have to be restrained and have major pyschiatric issues when his only issues is that he may need a little more stimulation in how he is taught not because he is incapable of achieving the same goal as his classmates, but achieves it in a different way. There is no middle ground for kids like my son, there is just black and white. More should be done about this instead of everyone taking the easy way out, except for the child involved, who has to pay the price.

And I do have to work to earn a living, and have only homeschooled for 2 years because of years and years of frustration and disappointment with the sysytem. And I understand that not all parents can homeschool, I never said that was the answer, but labeling and medicating kids that do not need to be is not either. Also there is no test to prove ADHD or many of the other labels out there, which it seems there is a label for everything now and a drug to go with it. Drugs do not teach and do not solve everything, like you said yourself, teaching your children about life and the real world is a parents job, and pills will not teach life lessons.
I am  proud of standing by my beliefs and fighting for years against a system that thought they knew what was better for my son than I did. My son had one person in his corner and it was me the "dedicated parent" as you referred to me as, which I was, still am, and always will be. And speaking from experience, some parents are pressured into putting their kids on medication, made to think that it is the only way for their child to succeed, which I was naive and young when he was in 1st grade and knew nothing about ADHD.
Now I try to in any way I can to reach as many parents as possible with this information so they can be better prepared than I was. I do agree that there are some that truely need to be on meds, but many kids like my son who are slapped with a label and treated as though he is not like his classmates, not directly of course, suffer the consequences.

Regarding your comment on parents learning more about ADHD, have you yourself done any research on this? Do you have children that have been on Adderall (adderrall) or Ritalin, and do you know the long term effects of taking a stimulant and how it changes your childs entire personality and turns them into a zombie, especially if he does not need them.

Data from the U.S. National Ambulatory Medical Care Survey suggest a 250 percent increase between 1990 and 1998 in the number of children receiving a diagnosis of ADHD? Why all of a sudden the huge increase? Can you answer that?


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Avatar_m_tn
    Good question on the large increase of ADHD.  Part of the increase is probably due to  coverage of ADHD under the Individual Disability Education Act of 1990 (ADHD was not included in the list of covered services until 1991).  This made a huge difference for parents who were struggling to get help for their kids.  My guess is that since insurance could now pay for the medicine, the pharmcy companies  started a lot of advertising which increased public awareness (and lined the companies pockets with money)  and thus the increase in diagnosis.  And I am sure there are other factors involved.  And yes, I have done a lot of research on ADHD.  If you read some of the 300 posts that I have added over the past 3 years, I think you would get that feeling.
  I agree with your feelings completely about how your son was handled by the system. I just don't like the generalization to all public schools.  The schools are getting better.  In the 70's, the children were often in school entirely for them and never stepped into a normal classroom.  With the "full inclusion laws", this thankfully now is changing.  Probably much more so in middle schools and high schools, and it probably varies by state.
  I really agree with your comment about taking the easy way out.  It happens way to many times.  ADHD and treating  it is a very complicated matter.  A lot of what goes on in this forum is about providing information to help people deal it.  My posts almost always say that the best way to help your child is to become an expert on ADHD.  Your experiences with helping your child are important.  Its those generalizations that get in the way of the really good advice that you may have to offer.
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765070_tn?1384873394
Vako23    
I totally agree with you on this subject of overdiagnosis.  It is pretty much a way for the public school systems to separate certain children into categories or separate classrooms in order for the state testing and requirements are met and the only way they can do this is to label the children.  I have been dealing with this since my son has been in Kindergarten.  He is now in 6th Grade and we are taking him out of the public school system in January so that I can Homeschool him.  My issues have to do with the extreme frustration with the teachers and school district who continue to hold my child back from the learning that he deserves.  My son is totally bored and understimulated in the classroom.  But, since he is not at all an athlete, he really gets pushed to the side.  My son is very intelligent but not allowed to show any of his intelligence and instead is learning the same subjects and curriculum as he learned in 3rd grade.  He comes home extremely frustrated and totally upset with the way he is always treated.  He continues to have no friends at school and the teachers treat him like he is an outcast.  It is ridiculous and it seems to just get worse and worse year after year.  I am fed up and the system just isn't working any longer.  I totally understand where you are coming from.  Thank you for you post, and this will help many other parents so that they are aware of what truely happens in the public school system.

Sandman
I have spoke to you many times in the past and understand that you are or were a great teacher and Principal.  But, unfortunately, not all teachers are like you and not all care about the students like you may or do.  The problem is you say that the public schools are getting better by letting ADHD kids in the regular classrom, but this is definitely not the case.  They are actually singled out more than ever especially since most children with ADHD do not do well on long test and timed testing.  The public schools say that they give them extra time but in reality they do not and continue to put pressure on these children.  Their State testing scores are more important and achieving the District funding they need is priority over the students needs.  I have read so many journals on this site that have major issues with their public schools and it continues to get to be more and more frequent.  It is not always the teachers, it is mainly the restrictions that the State and district officials put on the teachers and unfortunately teachers hands are tied.  

The substantial increase of children diagnosed with ADHD is ridiculous and is all a way for the pharmaceutical companies, physchiatrists, psychologists and Public school systems to make more money.  It is just out of hand.  The long term effects of the meds is not known and many children have issues with their heart and growth due to these meds.  Some may certainly need the meds but most of the time, they need a stable home, parents willing to have patience, behavior modification, and teachers that understand that not all children are exactly the same.  Most children that need the meds have other major problems that go along with ADHD.  ADHD meds are used to make our children into societies mold.  I mean look on Tuesday every single child will hear about how the President expects each child to learn and what they want them to learn.  So, it is the state and Governments that set these requirements and if you want to have a job or be a teacher you must do what they say or don't teach.  It is just becoming more of a problem.  I totally respect your opinion and feelings on this matter but do you actually have a child that has been put through any of this?  If you have then I would think that you would understand where we are coming from.  Our children are our life and we want them to be raised to be the best they can be by trying their best not by being told they have to be a certain way or they will not do anything in Life.  
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Avatar_f_tn
Hi Melissa,
Your post was very well written and it is so nice to hear from someone that knows exactly how I feel, I felt like I was reading a chapter from my life 6 years ago and the battle continued until I pulled him out to homeschool in 10th grade.  I am so happy that you are going to homeschool your son, it is the best decision I have ever made and believe me changing schools many times only ended with the same result because the  iep says he is ADHD then right back into special ed. class, and the nightmare starts again.  

My son did not have alot of friends at that age either, how are they supposed to make friends at school when they cannot socially interact with their other classmates from other rooms because the special ed classes do not intermingle with the "regular classes", and people wonder why our kids have self esteem issues. I just don't understand how they think that it is ok to put all the "labeled kids in one room, some of the kids in there are violent and have major psychiatric issues and they think my son should be in the same room because he talks  too much, cannot sit still for long, and learns better interactively than by reading a book.. I don't get that at all, do they not see how damaging that is to their spirit and confidence.

Anytime you need to talk I'm here. I wish I had someone to talk to back then that knew what I was going through. I have seriously considered a career as an advocate or do something that will make a change. I wish these schools could see the damage they are doing to kids like ours that do not fit their cookie cutter mold, but they absolutely do not fit the other end either, there needs to be more than just black and white. Take care and hopefully talk to you soon.


Sandman2,

Just so you know when I say "they" in my comments or posts. it is not directed at the teachers and I have never blamed any teacher for what happened, I blame the system and its lack of options for parents like Melissa, myself, and many others. Not all teachers are the same, just like not all students are the same. Also, I need to apologize for getting so upset with you but you did comment on things I never said that made it looks at though I am a teacher hater and you also said in a post  that not all parents have the luxury of homeschooling like me,  because they have to earn a living, well not once did I say whether I had a job or not. So I hope you can understand my defensiveness.
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Avatar_m_tn
Hey Melissa,
   Its nice to hear from you again.  And thanks for a wake up call.  I sometimes forget that not all schools, school districts, and states are the same.  I over generalized.  I agree with virtually everything you said.  It is sad that in the rush for test score competency some (many, most ?) schools are completely forgetting the human side of the equation.  I do blame the state and federal government for a lot of this.
   I am sorry to hear that your own school is doing such a poor job.  Do keep in mind that (mainly because of size and thus more choice), middle schools  and high schools can do a more acceptable job helping kids (without shoving them into a corner) then elementary schools.  So do check up on those choices as they become available.  The curriculum does get tougher (mainly math) as your child ages.  If I can be of any help to you either in curriculum or getting the schools to listen to you, please let me know.
  Hi Vako23,
  Kinda realized that I overgeneralized and definitely got defensive myself. I'm sorry.  I found it interesting that you mentioned a career as an advocate.  I have sat in meetings in our kinda small district here in California where the parents brought in a child advocate.  It really made everybody sit up and pay attention to what was being said.  Most parents that go to special ed. meetings really have no clue about the process (or even how they or the schools could help their child).  I think that advocates could have a very useful function in schools.  In many ways, that is what we are doing here.   I look forward to more of your posts.
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Avatar_f_tn
Thank you very much for putting this out there,hope and pray people read this.

I myself have seen what the medicines can do to a child and how it changes them.

The side effects to these medicines are not worth it,and the school and teachers need to realize these things.
My son has been in a school where the teacher should not be teaching ,would call and ask me to come get him if he did things she couldn't handle and would call my son a liar er. And also pushed for us to put him on medicine so she could handle him.

The thing now is that after putting him on two different medicine adderall (adderrall) and then concerta,back in 2006 he started having seizures,witch can be a side effect from both medicines.Witch he was taken off of right away.And never put back on anything.Ans still having seiuzres every even thou on medicines and the VNS put in June 24th this year.

My son is now being home school because he needs it and is best for him at this time,and seem to be doing better with the one on one with a teacher from the school coming to our home for 2 hours a day Monday threw  Friday.
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Avatar_f_tn
Obviously the system must be very different in the US to the UK. Here in the UK we have severe UNDER recognition of ADHD and the trauma it causes to children and parents.

Even so, there will be very few pre school children who are given medication in the UK. It is amazing how differently the problems that children with ADHD have are viewed.

How people choose to manage their child with ADHD is a personal matter and I think it is wrong to suggest that all medication is wrong. For some, along with good behaviour management, medication is an excellent, and in some places vital, tool in the toolbox.
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757137_tn?1347200053
Cheers. I came to the same conclusion vis-a-vis one of my daughters. She is a highly unique and intelligent individual and I never let anyone dumb her down. Every day she surprises me. Imagine what she would have been like if I had drugged her!
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Avatar_f_tn
I am a special education teacher and we have many wonderful parents who do everything to help their child, awesome teachers who accommodate the child, but they are still not successful. The people who say ADHD is not real or medication is rediculous have obviously never worked with a child with ADHD (maybe the child they did work with or their own child had something else...many mental health or behavioral disorders have similar symptoms of ADHD). .

With that being said, both of my children are diagnosed with ADHD and they have a strong family history on my husbands side of the family (all the men, including their father).  My oldest son was diagnosed at 5 and we tried medication (meditate, focalin, concerta) and all of them caused mild seizures (screaming uncontrollably for 20+ minutes when the medication left his system). I gave up on medication and homeschooled him for the remainder of kindergarten. During that time I worked with a behavioral specialist and in first grade he returned to school. We worked very closely with the teachers and did everything research suggested was effective. For 2 years my son never develop friendships, never went a day without getting into trouble (impulsiveness) and failed all tests (but could answer the questions if asked orally). In third grade we drove 100 miles to see a pediatric pshcologist who partnered with a neurologist. The neurologist suggested Vyvance and the psychiatrist said it was obvious medication was the only choice left to help him. The neurologist did a few brain scans when he took each medication and Vyvance was the only stimulant medication that did not cause seizures. Both of my boys have been on Vyvance for 2 years. They have NO side effects. They eat, no belly aches, no neurological problems and they both are making straight A's!

To answe your question, yes in some cases medication is needed but I think general doctors should not be able to prescribe ADHD medication. Just like you wouldnt go to your general doctor if you had a heart attack, because a heart doctor knows the heart inside and out. A pediatric psychologist can make sure the child is properly diagnosed and medication is monitored more closely (and how it responds to the body). Every child is different and every child has their own needs. One medication may be aweful for one child but a blessing for the other.
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Avatar_m_tn
If you look at the Notes section of the Nurse’s Edition of the psychiatric Diagnostics and Statistics Manual IV under both ADD and ADHD you will see that they both start with, and I quote:

“Cannot be proven to exist in laboratory conditions.”

And yet millions of children are drugged every day with US FDA Class II drugs (this is the same classification as cocaine and heroine) and millions more are treated as if they have this invented “disease “.

What fantastic job those snake-oil salesmen have done…
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757137_tn?1347200053
Before diagnoses are made, a thorough evaluation of the home is in order. Abnormal behavior may not be abnormal if it is engendered by the child's home upbringing. On this forum, when speaking of children with ADD, very little attention is given to its home life.
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757137_tn?1347200053
If ADD/ADHD is so prevalent, why isn't it a problem in other developed countries? That is a very embarrassing question for those who are financially involved in this sort of diagnosis.
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973741_tn?1342346373
I must say that I find it insulting to suggest that my son's developmental delay which is very similar to adhd in terms of how it presents is made up and actually a result of my poor parenting skills.  

I don't believe it helps to alienate or demonize the parents that struggle with helping their kids.  

It is one thing to suggest a child should not be medicated because who really WANTS to give their kid drugs but another to say that add/adhd is a made up diagnosis by parents who provide a rotten home life.  

I have no financial involvement in any diagnosis but am a mother that does the best she can to make my son's world a happy and healthy place for him.  I would tell him----------  that those who present nothing but negativity are not healthy people to be around.  

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757137_tn?1347200053
You are putting words in my mouth. I speak of no particular child and no particular parent, but only of the prevalence of this diagnosis which is at variance with the rest of the world.

To offer a generalized support when the diagnosis is in doubt does a disservice to those concerned. What I question is not the parents for succumbing to pressure by persons presumed to be more knowledgeable than they, but to those who apply the pressure. More and more, and this goes beyond the diagnosis we are discussing, there is an increasing resort to drugs to treat conditions that can be handled in a less dangerous manner.

Big drug houses and their ad and detail men spend untold billions psyching up the public, and the medical community, to accept and promote these treatments. The sort of advertising we see on television was once considered unethical and was banned. It should be again.
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535822_tn?1389452880
Thank you allmymarbles couldnt have put it better myself I also thought you were speaking in general not directing it at anyone person..I also deplore this emphasis on 'disorders 'and the drugs they do pump into children  ..I agree it is all to do with finances  and the psyching up of people.. ..
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973741_tn?1342346373
I'm so glad that we as parents have options!  That is what the world is about, making informed decisions that are of best benefit to your child!  Luck to all doing the best they can to parent a child who struggles!
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973741_tn?1342346373
By the way, I will say something to the first line of the original thread.  I think ages 2 to 5 are very young to have a child diagnosed for add/adhd.  And drugs in children that young do worry me.  However, my son was diagnosed with sensory integration disorder at 4 and that put him on the path to success.  The help we were able to give him once we got to the root cause of his issues made all the difference in the world.  No drugs involved, just attention to the nervous system.  peace
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757137_tn?1347200053
It is obvious from the many threads on this forum that there are two distinct attitudes concerning the handling of the child diagnosed as having ADD/ADHD. There is the pill approach, aimed at eliminating symptoms, and the behavioral approach which seeks to treat and hopefully eliminate the cause of the problem.

As to whether or not a child has ADD or ADHD is a related issue. That this diagnosis is pervasive only in the United States, it is necessary that we examine the cause of this anomaly. And it is important that we do so, given the extreme measures often employed in treatment
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Avatar_m_tn
    As the main poster on this forum, I have never advocated a pill approach.  In over 2000 posts I have always said that information is the most important aspect.  I have always said that the "pill" is just one part of a possible treatment, and not the most important part of that treatment.
    Consequently, I am upset at your generalization that there are two distinct attitudes on this forum.  I try very hard to make sure that parents are directed to information that will help them make good decisions - what ever they may be.  Its not my place to decide that for them.
  
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Avatar_m_tn
   Ok, allmymarbles does have a point.  Many people who have posted on this forum have either used these meds or given it to their kids.  And any one who has had a positive experience might well favor the medical approach and post accordingly.  Just as those who have had a bad medical approach will also post their experiences.  But it does mean that many of the posters have been involved with the medical approach - one way or the other.  I apologize  for taking it personally.
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757137_tn?1347200053
You take offense where none is meant. I don't doubt that there are cases where nothing seems to help but medication. I do believe that these cases are rare. I read your posts and for the most part we are in agreement.
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2021410_tn?1330943783
thank you vako23 for your great influence.  the numbers of children and adults on meds is rising in the millions.  the middle class is targeted systematically. i believe if i was home schooled i would be great. i also was in a secluded room for most of my schooling and i am very deprived in academics due to chemical induced behaviors and routines.

In a Congressional hearing,  July 15, 1996, Rep. Christopher Shays observed:

“In ADHD, we are trying to draw the line between personality and pathology, and we are placing millions of children and adults on either side of the social, medical and legal boundary that divides the healthy from the sick.  We should do so only with the greatest care, and with particular reticence to make our children medical patients...”

      at the young age of 2 i was diagnosed with localized scleroderma(auto immune disease) after receiving multiple vacccines.  a scar across my chest and left forehead was aquired and this resulted in a disorderly insecure social complex that would grow throughout the years.  thankfully i found jesus at an early age to achieve something that is over looked by most "adhd" sufferers(families equally included), called spiritual growth.  we all have a deep spiritual connection with the earth moon sun and even the stars(this effects the ingestion of any substance in the body). what i mean to say is that our bodies reject these drugs if ingested daily and our chemical producing glands are constantly preparing for adulthood with this substance.   i was suppressed by flawless systematic big pharma at the age of 6 through extensive tests, anti-social seclusion at school and home, prejudice from agnostic beings, and the over-stimulation(atrophy) of my mind, body and, soul. they pulled me away from Jesus and i am innocent of this. we all are. the biggest question i have to face on a regular basis is that of our own making; AM I CONDEMNED TO HELL FROM MY ALTERED BIOLOGICAL, AND SPIRITUAL ABUSE THROUGH THE IMPORTANT YEARS OF GROWTH(ADOLESCENT SPIRITUAL GROWTH) BY DEFAULT? OR IS IT JUST MY PARENTS? OR IS IT JUST BIG PHARMA SUPPORTERS(PARENTS INCLUDED)? IS THIS REALLY THE MARK OF THE BEAST?   here i am at 23 expressing what millions of CHILDREN are trying to say to their parents and doctors but are too young to even know what to say.  we have the spiritual power to refuse such demonic accusations on gods work.  i will leave you with this important quote:
     "Our institutions are established that the sick may be treated by hygienic methods, discarding almost entirely the use of drugs. There is a terrible account to be rendered to God by men who have so little regard for human life as to treat the body ruthlessly, in dealing out drugs. . . . We are not excusable if, through ignorance, we destroy God's building by taking into the stomach poisonous drugs under a variety of names we do not understand. It is our duty to refuse all such prescriptions. We want sanitariums where maladies may be cured by nature's own provisions, and where the people may be taught how to treat themselves when sick; where they will learn to eat temperately of wholesome food, and to be educated to discard all narcotics, tea, coffee, fermented wines, and stimulants of all kinds, and the flesh of dead animals." - Ellen White
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2021410_tn?1330943783
Melissa0116 you are amazing. as you speak the truth to the right people, they will listen. i have witnessed much of the exact same environmental barriers from being labeled.  i am the only person in my family with equal views such as yours. when i was 17 i started to tell my mother what i feared for so much of my childhood, and that is stimulants had a nullifying effect on my mind body and soul.  she broke down crying and right then i new she feared the same for her son all this time.  i have gained much expertise from stimulants but i weened off them when i was 16 and i was literally not the same ever again.  i will never forget your true actions expressed in this post, because you truely are educated on this debilitating subject.  if anyone ever doubts you (including your special son) remind yourself that your not the only one to make the correct environmental changes for your family...and thier children....and their grandchildren....and their grandchildren......
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2021410_tn?1330943783
here here
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2056978_tn?1330574547
I like the quote you included about the line between personality and pathology. However, i don't believe taking medication for a disorder is right or wrong if the disorder is correctly diagnosed and if other types of therapy haven't helped.  I believe that is up to each individual who is dealing with or has a child with a disorder to do what they think is best of course. I just think we should all be very cautious in terms of diagnosis because there isn't a clearly defined line between a child's "personality" or "pathology," when there is no single test for ADD/ADHD. The criteria for diagnosis is the presence of a certain number of symptoms and the ruling out of other possible causes of those symptoms. For a young child, it's not easy to know for sure whether your child's inattention/hyperactivity is normal or abnormal.
    When it is not obvious that the child's behavior crosses the line, another option is to wait and see if the behavior persists when the child is in grade school and if it is disruptive.
   When/if medication is the only option, I'd personally look into the meds' physical and long term side effects rather than just how effective it is reported to be in treating the child's ADD/ADHD symptoms. There are non-stimulant drugs such as Strattera that can treat ADD/ADHD.
  
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2056978_tn?1330574547
Now that I think about it, I am just gonna have to say that I am completely against children of the ages 2-5 being prescribed stimulants for ADD/ADHD treatment whether they truly have the disorder or not. The child's focus/ inattention and hyperactivity at that age is not at all a good reason for them to have to take a Schedule II drug.
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973741_tn?1342346373
In all honesty, I agree.  I think that age range you give of 2 to 5 is too young for medication and I'd be hestitant to use it on my beloved kids.  My son WAS diagnosed with sensory integration disorder at 4 but medication isn't involved with the treatment of that.  Occupational therapy is done and this is basically physical activity that calms or wakes up the nervous system and behavioral management along with other things like fine motor/gross motor skills that a lot of sensory kids lack.  That early intervention put my son on the right track after struggling so much early on. He's never taken medication----  we stayed on the sensory path with great success.  My point is, working with a child that has add/adhd should involve much more than medication.  And when they are little (especially preschool years and early elementary) and you suspect add/adhd, there are many things parents can do to help a child that should be considered.  Just my opinion.  
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973741_tn?1342346373
I did want to just comment as well that I am not anti medication and have seen wonderful results in many that have taken it----  but think the  utmost caution should be used in young children.  In my area, they try not to diagnose/medicate kids before the age of 6.
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