Concert and ADHD

I do not have a question but I have a comment. My son is 8 years old and he has been on concerta for 1 year. It has been upped four times. He started on 18 mg upped to 36 mg upped to 52 mg upped to 72 mg. Every time I spoke to the doctor about it not working as well as it should they would up it saying he needed a higher dose. when they moved him to 52 mg he started hitting kids at school, throwing fits and then they upped it to 72 saying the impulsiveness is there and his body adjusted to it and needed a higher dose. Now he is kicked out of school for bitting and hitting and is conciderd to be a danger to kids. He is talking about killing himself and even ask me to do it. He is seeing a doctor but we robbed peter to pay paul and now he has tics and depression and he told me he thought he was a monster. CONCERTA RUINED MY LIFE AND MY SON'S LIFE. PLEASE CHOOSE ANOTHER FORM FOR ADHD. SAVE YOUR SELF AND YOUR CHILD.  It may not turn out my my child but where is the promise of that. my heart is broken. I wish I would not of trusted doctors and did not take the easy route with his adhd for maybe he would have a good life.

Signed
I broken mother

[Melissa0116]

I totally understand what you are going through.  My son went through all of these problems with Concerta, as well.   He was never kicked out of school, but we had a lawyer to protect him as well as an advocate.  We also had changed meds under our terms not the doctors.  

The only reason I knew to do the changes was due to myself having ADD and lots an lots of research.  Most parents are not aware of what to do since they never had to deal with this.  The main problem is that parents are to trust the doctors.  Doctors are supposed to help with the issue not make them worse.  They make money on these meds and that is a major problem since the more of the med that they give out the more money they get from the pharmeceutical company.

I wish you the best of luck with you son.  As a mother it is extremely difficult to watch our children suffer.  I was even thinking of homeschooling my son next year so that I know he is getting the education he deserves.  He surely does not get that at school..............................

[broken999]

I wish I was educated enough to home school my child but I am afraid he would not get a very good education with me. I have ADHD also and I day dreamed most of my early child hood education. We never Knew about adhd much. All I know is all my kids have ADHD and they are older and gone. My youngest son has had the most troulble with the meds. My older son is now 20 and he was taken off of Adrall. I was told Concerta was safe, a slow release. He now does things he never did before. The tics he developed is horriable. His life will never be normal with out help from above.

Thank you for your post. Sometimes you feel crazy and you think maybe You as a mother did something wrong. I am very depressed and I do not find much happiness any more.

thanks :)

[Melissa0116]

I will tell you that when we took my son off the concerta, the tics and temper got alot better.  And then after a year he was fine again.  He is on the med Vyvanse now that he is 11.  But, he is a very big kid and he is only on the lowest dose.  He is 5'2" and 130 lbs.  He has done well on this med and it is extremely consistent.  But, I would like to take him off the meds this summer and try a new homeopathic approach.  L-theasine is used in China in the tea that they drink and they did studies here in the U.S. that has shown to really work with children and adults with adhd.  You do not hear about any asian children having adhd in asia since they eat right and drink tea all the time.  I really hope and pray that your child does well and I will keep you in my prayers.  Good Luck..

[broken999]

I hope things are better before a year for his school is ready to send him to a special school for behavior issue kids. I am completely torn really. He also keep talking really loud like I can not hear. I do not know what that is all about. He never use to do that.
broken999

[Melissa0116]

My son talks really loud as well.  I do not know why this is but he has done this for a while.  When he is tired, he talks even louder.  I will have to do some research on that to find out why this is.  

[Sandman2]

Hi Melissa,
  I think the talking loud has more to do with being tired and a lack of control than anything else.  I did want to add that the reason you don't hear about kids in Asia not having ADHD is not because of diet or drinking tea.  There are plenty of Asian kids in the states with ADHD problems.  Its just that there is a strong cultural bias against getting psychological help.  Unfortunately, the situation is ignored in the Asian countries.  If you know anything about most of their schooling situations, it must be hell for a kid to have ADHD and to be in school.  Of course, they do have a very high suicide rate amongst high school kids which --awe, I not going to go on.  But the Asian school system for all of its wonderful educational scores, does have a few problems.

[Melissa0116]

I was curious since you are an were an elementary teacher and middle school teacher.  How do you deal with children with ADHD?  See, with many of my experiences, teachers just want the kids on meds and do not want to help the child with their issues.  Instead, they would rather shove them into an IEP program so that they do not ruin the schools chances for getting funding and also just want them put on meds to make the problem all better.  

Well, meds do not make things all better and this is the main issue with ADHD.  Immediately the teacher or District expects the parents to medicate them and most of the time meds cause even more issues.  

Of course, their are problems in the Asian school system.  Their are problems with any school system whether here or other countries.  The one thing that I have found is that children and adult with ADHD or ADD, have issues with concentration from the food thay eat as well.  And diet can definitely help with the symptoms.  

I am not saying that you are a bad teacher or Principal.  I just would like to know what other schools do to help with their children.  Children are our future.....................

[Sandman2]

Wow, good question.  I could do a book on this.  Will try to keep this kinda short.
  Got my first ADHD kid (he was highly hyperactive) in about 72 or 73.  No one had a clue what to do.  I tried the normal discipline stuff and it quickly became apparent that for this child, it didn't have any affect.  So I started trying other things.  
  Basically, that's partially how I learned.  By about my fourth year of teaching at middle school, I was getting all the "weird" kids - so I was learning rapidly on the fly what worked and didn't.  I probably learned the most when I was a elementary school principal in the early 90's and sat in on ALL the IEP's.  We had a school psychologist who was an expert on ADHD and I learned a ton from him, which I was able to use when I went back to teaching at the middle school level.
  To your questions and statements.  First from an earlier statement.  Don't give up on your school just yet.  I got all the special kids because the other teachers were older and very set in their ways.  You might get a teacher next year that can work wonders with a child.  It could be the best experience of you and your childs life!  But you gotta be agressive to find them and to get them. (sounds like you have some experience with that).  If you can't find that special teacher, then that's why you have IEPS.  They really are there (if used correctly) to help the child.  If its written right, you can make teachers use techniques that will help your child.  So, any way, research what is coming up.  You might even look at any other close schools.  
I realize your first part about shoving the kids into IEPS was a generalization, and of course all states are different.  But usually any state or government program that is mandated is underfunded.  We always lost money on  child in special ed.  Yes, there are a lot of reasons why teachers might want a kid in special ed - more money is not one of them.
   I agree with you completely that meds are not a magic bullet.  If that is all that is done for a child, its never enough.  I have always written that the first thing a parent must do is to become an expert in ADHD so they can help their child.  You read about a lot of the problems meds cause on this forum.  What you don't read is about all the successes.  Meds do cause problems.  Doctors who don't have a clue or don't follow up on their patients cause more of a problem.  I could go on here for quite a while.  
   I also agree that diet can help with the symptoms.  I have seen cases where they thought it was ADHD and it was a gluten problem.  The sad thing is that kids with poor diets also don't have the parents who are going to do anything besides shove a pill down their throat.
   So what can schools do to help kids with ADHD.  The single most important thing is to become educated as to what it is.  Everybody is so focused now on "no kids left behind", that they aren't looking at why some are being left behind.  The resources and meeting times are going into how to teach math, etc.
   Teachers have got to look at their students as individuals.  They need to learn methods to deal with the ADHD child that is different from the non ADHD kid.  I think parents really need to get more involved in working with their child.  Someone has to explain to the kid about ADHD.  Someone has to teach him coping skills.  If a child (or young adult) understands why he is acting the way he does, then maybe he won't go and self medicate to cover up the messed up feelings he has.  If a child learns ways to cope with ADHD in school and in the real world (study skills, etc), then they will have a much better chance of becoming successful.  I think that if the last two things are done then a child has a chance without meds.  However, if meds are done properly (and, of course, needed) with the last two things I mentioned, then the child has a huge chance to be successful.
   These are all kind of short answers to big, involved topics.  Hopefully it helps.  If you have any more questions - maybe start a new topic so we don't kidnap this one.

[broken999]

I wish I could try that. My son also has (SID) Sensory Intergation Disorder. Some ADHD children have that and most parents do not know. My son  has eating issues with food. he does not like 90 % of food. We thought he would grow out of it. He hates ketcup and all candy , He only like certain suckers. He eats mostly yellow stuff. The color of the food his brain reacts to. Google ( SID ) if you do not understand what that is. So to the tea comment, If I could give him tea I would. I wish he liked food. He goes to OT to deal with the SID. We try to intergrate good food. He has trouble with texture to. I have older kids, 20 and 18. All my kids have had ADHD but my youngest one is the worst case, I think it is because of the SID.

Broken999

[Sandman2]

Have you ever had your son checked out for Gluten Intolerance Symptoms?  It sounds like he could have more going on than just SIDs.

[Melissa0116]

Well, the thing is that you can give him the tea in supplement form.  It is called L-theanine.  It is the same thing used in the tea.  Here is the website that explains this supplement and how it works:

www.healthmad.com/Medicine/L-theanine-Shown-to-Work-for-Children-with-ADHD.163297 - 37k

You can also got to the 700 club's website.  They did a report on this on July 10, 2008.

Many doctors will not agree to use this since they would rather prescribe the meds that they make money off of.

[Sandman2]

   Thanks for mentioning L-theanine.  I googled it and read a ton.  Very interesting!  Bottom line is that it is worth trying.  There are no serious side effects.  Definitely want to do it in tablet form.  If it works - thats great.  If it doesn't, you are not out too much money and no side effects.
   Not that I want to defend Doctors, but there is no way they could prescribe this.  As yet no scientific studies (several reasons for this - most probably relating to the fact that drug companies can't make money off of something this common), and of course, its not  a perscription drug (which means you could sue the pants off the doctor for doing so).

[broken999]

Gluten Intolerance I looked that up and he does not have that. Children's Hosptial tested my child for SID. Sensory Intergration Disorder is linked to many other things like ADHD. You need to read up on SIDS> It has to do wit ALL Sensory funtion like , sight, hearing, touch, taste, smelling. It is not just about liking or dis liking food. Most of the time the child can not right well, has clothing issues like my child will not wear jeans. The fabric upsets him. Loud noises, too much going on at the same time will effect them. Each child is different, some only have one or two effected, like sound and touch. My child has all five of the senses effected. He has this on top of ADHD.

Broken 999

[Uncertain328]

I'm sorry to hear about your struggles. I'm just curious to know more about what SID is? What are the symptoms?
My brother, who is now 22, spent his entire life being the "monster child" and my mother was always convinced that he had ADD or ADHD, yet everytime she had him tested they said no. He was always very hyper and mischevious, both in and out of school, and wouldn't pay attention in class. He never listened, no matter how he was disciplined. He was always in and out of detentions and getting in fights with other kids, and sometimes even teachers. Since elementary school, he was held back multiple times, up until his Junior Year, at which point doctors confirmed that he did have a learning disorder, but didn't know what it was.
He was also a picky eater. He literally ate ONLY pizza, chicken fingers, or pasta his entire childhood. Now, he's very successful in the Navy, he's very well-disciplined and motivated and eats EVERYTHING. Sometimes I think it's just the temperment of certain kids, or an individualized reaction to a certain enviornment.
My brother seems to have completely grown out of his former attitude and behavior, so I'm just curious to know if maybe it was one of these diagnoses that are all suddenly coming out now, or if he was just a "bad seed" who turned out alright anyways.

[Sandman2]

  Besides googling SID, you might post over on the child behavior forum.  There is a member over there who is highly educated on SID's.
  Good question on your brother.  Its pretty unusual to hold a kid back numerous times, so I wonder a bit about that schools methods for dealing with kids.  Its always possible that your brother was just pretty hyper and intelligent enough to manipulate your parents.  He must have gotten a lot of love though - I think that always makes a difference in the end.

[specialmom]

SId is sensory integration disorder.  It is a developmental delay (as is add/adhd-) that affects the nervous system and how the brain processes things.  It can affect many areas of a person's life.  Behavior is often affected and a child with SID may come across as inflexible or difficult and highly emotional.

Some kids don't get strong signals for example and they need "input" into their system.  They will play rough, bump into things, break the lead on their pencil, and do things that look like crashing and bumping.  They are usually hyper looking because their brain and nervous system need stimulation.  The crave it.  They can't sit still because their brain is in overdrive.  They recommend something called "heavy work" which is things that work the muscles, provide deep pressure, resistance, etc. to provide this input for a child.  Given enough of that at other times during the day, they'll crave less of it at times when they need to sit.
Focus can be hard because they are easily distractible.  Auditory issues can come into play in that all things are at the same volume-------- the teacher's voice, the air conditioner, the person breathing next to them, etc.  Also, if you think of the brain having flood gates that hold back all the different things going on in the mind so that you can concentrate, well in a sensory kid, if they are overwhelmed, excited etc.---- the floodgates lift.  Then the brain is just flooded with everything and can't concentrate of focus.
Picking eating could because of tactile defensiveness.  That involves texture.  They can't tolerate certain textures and a base level reaction of spitting happens.  Motor planning is another area of sensory that can make eating difficult.  It takes a lot of coordination to chew. Meat is one of the things sensory kids have a tough time with.  Did your brother have issues with articulation when learning to speak?  Did he have trouble learning to hold a pencil?  Those are areas of motor planning that you might see too.
Regulation/modulation is part of sensory and is most troubling for some kids.  They can't self soothe easily.  They have outbursts and meltdowns and can seem very volatile.  

Anyway, that is just a small bit on sensory.  Hopefully your brother found his way in life and is doing fine.

[Sandman2]

  boy, are you psychic or what?
Question?   do people grow out of SID as they approach adulthood?  or learn to cope with it better? or?

[specialmom]

They learn ways to get by but become adults that will tell you that they never felt comfortable in their own skin.  Things just aren't "right".  And unfortunately, much of the social issues with sensory lead to self esteem problems that wreak havoc in their adult lives.  They become people that often "self medicate" in various unhealthy forms.  They often suffer depression and anxiety and feel they just don't belong.  They participate in extreme sports and other risky things to get that input.  It follows them in various ways in life.  Pretty sad.

I think that normalizing some of the nervous system issues my son has is a goal but a big part of his treatment is to give him lifelong coping skills.  He won't outgrow it.  

By the way, we all have sensory issues.  I do not like turtle necks at all and hate that feeling of condensation from a drink on my hand.  BUT . . . I can deal with it.  A person with sensory integration can not.  A child shows it more through over the top reactions vs. an adult will just avoid it.  

Just my thoughts on it anyway.

[lovemykids465]

OMG That sounds just like my 9 year old!