vicoden question

[1968mustang]

My wife was addicted to Vicoden more than a year ago. I have more than just afeeling she's back on them again.

She has a deteriorating vertebre in and was in recently to see a specialist. I know the pain is real,
but I fear when she went in to genuinely check it out, she was offered a script and didn't turn it down.
During her addiction I discovered she was getting prescriptions from several doctors and using an on-line drug seller from Canada to get more. She fessed up to me afer I confronted and even informed the doctors involved so she couldn't shop them again. Her cell phone has been ringing lateley when I'm with her and she;s admitted that "its those people I hate" calling again. While she shrugs it off, and likely feels like that admission is close to the truth, I think she's using them again.

I need to know what these things look like or if they have a V symbol on them Not sure iwjhatf the Canadian (generic) looks like, I think she's hurt herself on purpose and is now contemplating going
to the doctor. We're sliding downhill fast. Please help. This is getting scary.

[uglyfish]

Sorry that your relationship is rocked with suspicion and fear . Only heartache and resentment will appear, often .If she is honest will life return for you?.  If you do not hear what you want  will you leave? I know you lose part of yourself, without honesty on something so serious and often fatal the love you offer is stymied and pointless. She will be pissed but I would tough love until her life is stable. Reminder her the pain from withdrawal sucks as much if not more than her injury, Hard facts sometimes help.
Good luck
   Mike

[macprincess]

I found your wife's answers about being happy on different days to be very interesting. You mentioned that she had a crappy childhood; well, I had one too and was reading online about how the brain is forever affected by depression when one is growing up. The explanation was this: early life traumatic events, occurring during a period of neuronal plasticity, appear to permanently render neuroendocrine stress response systems supersensitive. These physiological maladaptations likely represent long-term risk factors for the development of psychopathology after exposure to additional stress.
(I don't know how to link to the page, just Google childhood depression effects on the brain).  So, this is likely what she is facing.

Sorry for all the posts, but as I think of things that might be helpful, I am writing them.

[macprincess]

There are two sites that specialize in identifying any sort of pill, because pills often differ in appearance depending on the manufacturer and company (shape, color, imprint, etc). I do not know if I am allowed to list them, but you can find them on Google fairly easily by typing in the right key words.

There are also forums dedicated to buying meds online. Some have very innocuous names, so they would not immediately pop out. Once again, this is where Google search comes in, so you can figure out if she visits them.

[macprincess]

More on buying drugs off the Internet. I first heard of them being available in '99, but according to people on forums dedicated to buying meds online, they were available well before then, one person even talked about buying meds online in '95. The companies bill very innocuously, you would never be able to pick out the names from the list on the credit card bills. In my case, they never used 'medical names', they billed in the name of the credit card processor (like Veripayment, etc).  Over the years, the prices went up as the demand increased. You mentioned that your wife ran up extensive CC bills three times, so I believe she may have been buying quite a bit (no disrespect to you or your wife).

[macprincess]

1968mustang when I used to order vicoden off the Internet in 2005, I was paying $289.00 for a bottle of 90. They were not cheap at all. First, you could pay via credit card, that stopped and then payment was via COD.

Since then things have tightened up and it is not so easy to get. Extensive medical records have to be sent in and evaluated by a doctor; if you are seen as a chronic pain patient, you can buy. I am not and can no longer buy.

I am also familiar with the phone calls from pharmacies. You buy once and they will call you periodically to offer to ship you more.

I have the same reaction your wife does to narcotics. I can get tons of stuff done, I have energy; I even moved a whole apartment (except heavy stuff) by myself thanks to vicodin. Most of all, I'm happy, I feel confident (I have PTSD due to a bad childhood and all the accompanying problems).

[believe0509]

Thank you for your words of encouragement.  Sounds like your the strong one now...keep up the good work.  I do have his love, but not his trust, but I will earn that back someday.  Good luck in your situation, it will work if you work it.

[1968mustang]

Hey, sorry your husband isn't more supportive. Though, when my wife went through this the first time I could have been MORE supportive. I'd discovered the pills and found out that the usage was increasing and that she'd been Dr. shopping the first time. I addresssed it, but it was more from a tone of anger and disappointment. Later, she came to me again and wrote me a very lengthy note about her relapse. I did a better job.
She was scared I wouldn't be there. I was. Her doctor helped her wean off and things were apparently fine. My support for her faded as I thought the problem was over. I never really knew if I should ask how she was doing later on, months down the road. We never re-visited the subject until now....and we haven't had it out in the open yet. I think she's scared to say anything (obviously). I am very tentative about bringing it up also. We are in a very raw place between us at present. I have no intention of being anything but supportive, but I don't always do it very well, at least in her eyes.  This time, finding the pills and putting together the signs of use again left me scrambling. I looked up various drugs on the net trying to find out what she was taking. I think they are Vicoden, but I have so many conflicting posts, I don't know. I would think that would be natural to gravitate back to what was used before, but I don't know. This relapse just hit me like a ton of bricks. The thought of losing her is unbearable. We've drifted for a long time and drifted apart. I really want to get past this and have a strong marriage. She's an absolutely wonderful person and mother, but she's off track now. Time is ticking and I don't want to look back at a black hole of time wasted.

I hope you can hang in there with your husband. Would he be open to marriage counselling instead of a drug rehab meeting? Who do you have for support? Do you have a pastor or priest to share with?  

Have you tried writing your thoughts to your husband? I know in my relationship, we sometime communicate better in writing. It eliminates "tone" that sometimes causes reactions during spoken communication. My wife can express herself well to me that way. I can at times, but not as well.  Have you just flat come out and told him I NEED YOUR HELP WITH THIS. WILL YOU PLEASE HELP ME? Sometimes I find it easier to
have it laid out on what my wife needs. For long term health, you are going to need him and likely others too. I hope you can find what you need to stay on track. 38 steps in the right direction have you in a better place, even though it's still a challenge. You deserve credit for your progress. Tell your husband you need his feedback and tell him you need his love.

[believe0509]

Not really, he thinks this can just go away...like alot of people do.  He feels I went through rehab now lets get on with our lives.  He did say he would go to a meeting with me, but the weather has been pretty funky in PA. and by the time I get home from work I am exhausted, but on the other hand if I take him to a meeting this is admitting to him that I am a drug addict and I don't think he could handle this so I keep it to myself.  It would be a huge help if I could confide in him, but I have ruined alot of trust so this is my fault.  What kind of communications did you and your wife have the last time you found out about her addiction...did she come to you (sorry if this is in one of your previous posts).  Why wouldn't she come to you now?  This stuff is tough on a marriage.  You can have all the support from a spouse, but sometimes enough is enough and one or the other will just throw in the towel.  I am very close to this so I have got to make myself well and with the help from God I know I will.

[1968mustang]

Congrats on 37 days clean, if I'm interpreting your post correctly. :-)  Good for you.
Do you and your husband have an ongoing discussion about the addiction and staying
clean? I'm unsure as to how to address this setback for my wife in the future. I don't know if bringing it up will make her feel ashamed, or if bringing it up will let know know I care?  Does excercise help to detox? My wife and I have discussed an exercise facility
nearby as a time for us together, just us.

Thanks for your reply. I was hoping to see a message from someone this morning.

Mustang

[believe0509]

My husbands job dictates his absense, he has always been married to his job first then me, but we were together 11 yrs before we got married almost 4 yrs ago and I knew he traveled, but it just made it easier for me to self medicate.  This does drive a wedge between a marriage no doubt, but if she is coming off of the pills she will get better and the two of you can get close again.  My husband and I are very close despite my addictions because we do love and need each other very much.

I am on day 37 and still want to crawl in bed after I put in 8.00 hrs of work, but if she is just a couple of weeks into this...she is extremely tired and distant, but this will pass its just the withdrawls,, but it will take some time.  Just respect her healing time and the fact that she may be embarrased and know that YOU cannot fix her.  Talk soon hang in there.

[1968mustang]

Hi Lucy, I checked the site and photo you mentioned. It's close, but not what I saw.
The pill was a beefier version, sribed in the middle. This pill looks smaller in diameter
to me. The V is similar, but I was sent to a link by someone else who claimed it was percocet (link is--www.pharmer.org/files/images/ed642eaf057775fe38b5dd1515a-797.jpg)
I have also had 2 people claim they have the pills in front of them with the V on them.
I'm wondering if the V is a specific pharmacy imprint and they offer all types of meds?
All of the info conflicts.

I do appreciate your info though

Thank you.

Mustang

[lucyred68]

I realize this is an old post, but for everyon's info, from the pill description she is taking a muscle relaxer called methocarbanol.  i looked it up at drugs.com.  they have pictures of the pills. you type in a description, and they come up with a bunch of pictures.  i found the pill you described on the third page of pictures.

[1968mustang]

Hi believer, I got your reply. Thanks for sharing.  I'm sorry you too are not together more.
My wife and I have that issue. She works part time, evenings & weekends. When I'm gone during the weekdays, she's home. She's at work when I get home. She gets home
around 10:00 after I've put the kids in bed. We see each other for about an hour and a half at night, though she only works 2 or 3 nights a week. Still it isn't as much as it needs to be.  Does your husband's job dictate his being gone, or is his absence from the
lack of interaction due to the addiction? I ask because I'm trying to figure that question out in my marriage. Is there a way to stake out some specific time together for you and he? I know that if I can focus on time together ahead, I'm much more prepared as a mate
to relate to my wife.

As far as the withdrawls, do you get very tired, very quickly? I'm sure she feels guilty and embarrassed, but I wish she'd be able to let it out.

Thanks for the post. I hope you and your husband have an opportunity to focus on each other soon.

Mustang

[Crowbarnola]

I had my share of Vicodin and indeed they make a pill with the V just like the Van Halen V is on it with a line through it.

10000000% Positive!

I wish you the best with everything in life!

[believe0509]

Thank you for your kind words, they make a difference in the life of someone whos life is falling apart even though "I" am on the mend, my husband still will harbour the resentment of the distrust and lies, but he says we will get through it for the second time.  I too lost all interest in intimacy, but partly because he is gone so much and I did get bored and self medicated.  He does not understand this at all and would probably go to counseling, but I feel he still will not understand.  Unless you are that person and go take this journey you will not understand.  They best I could recommend is nar/anon (sp) but I know he won't go by himself.  And you know sometimes there just are not enough hours in the day!! especially if you have children which we do not, but you do and that could be tough, but if you want to save your marriage you will find the time I know you will.  I do understand your grief we as the addict carry the same grief only we are the opposite person trying to hide everything.  I have a wonderful life with my husband and would have probably given it up for the drug if I had not cried out for help.  It sounds like your wife may be trying to keep her withdrawls at bay.  I have been taking alot of advil for tremendous headaches that go along with the withdrawls and benedryl will calm her nerves so try and give her a little time to come through this and just let her know you are there without bringing the pills up.  She will tell you when she is ready, but is to ashamed right now.  Believe me she knows what she is doing to your relationship, but the addiction is so much more powerful.  Have a great day mustang...talk soon

[1968mustang]

I appreciate your candor. I never know if asking things from others in your situation are
harmful, or theraputic in some way. Someone in the thread had posted that my wife may have a source she was buying from and that had never entered my mind. That was mainly because her original addiction was supplied (after the doctor shopping quit) by
a Canadian pharmacy. They still call her & she's mentioned that, all under the guis that
she's mad & bothered they still call.

Is your husband involved in counseling with you,,,,or go on his own? I know most men may not want to. Inward reflection is tough for most guys, even if they genuinely try. We're wired differently I feel.

Keep in mind that everyone makes mistakes and has weaknesses. This board and the country littered with people who have weaknesses. You're not alone and your not failing,
you are coping, recovering and learning. Those are good things. I've disappointed my wife
I don't know how many times. Trust can be rebuilt but it takes time. From a spouse standpoint, it's a contrast between loving trust & concerned suspicion when something like this happens. I have trouble overcoming the feeling that I was disregarded with each step, each lie, each decision made to start/continue the addiction. I'm still learning how the judgement clouds when under an influence. How does a person foster trust if their spouse elicits something innocent and it's taken as suspicious? If it is an innocent action misconstrued, the concerned spouse risks coming off as doubting their partner.
This in turn, makes the person who had the addiction feel like a failure. It's a cycle and it's also hard to break. Open communication will be the key to trusting.

You mentioned your husband works out of town. I'd guess lack of one on one interest and time together left an empty feeling in part of you. I know that I work alot too, which is part of our problem. My wife feels neglected when work overtakes family. Our one on one time, communication and intimacy really suffered. I've read on other threads that the addiction takes the place of or mutes the desire for intimacy. Do you feel that is a truth in your situation? It seem in my situation that my partner has been either numbed or become oblivious to what intimacy adds to a relationship. It's like the desire is snuffed.

I'm a very lucky guy. My wife is drop-dead gorgeous. She's my every fantasy every day.
She can melt me with a look and put me on cloud nine. When her interest in me is gone,
I feel really down. This may be a fault in me, but it really puts a strain on the relationship
when she's uninterested in me. I feel alone and held at a distance.

I hope in your journey to regain trust, you can feel open to him for communication of both types. I wish you well and hope you have bright days together ahead. :-)

Mustang

[1968mustang]

I appreciate your candor. I never know if asking things from others in your situation are
harmful, or theraputic in some way. Someone in the thread had posted that my wife may have a source she was buying from and that had never entered my mind. That was mainly because her original addiction was supplied (after the doctor shopping quit) by
a Canadian pharmacy. They still call her & she's mentioned that, all under the guis that
she's mad & bothered they still call.

Is your husband involved in counseling with you,,,,or go on his own? I know most men may not want to. Inward reflection is tough for most guys, even if they genuinely try. We're wired differently I feel.

Keep in mind that everyone makes mistakes and has weaknesses. This board and the country littered with people who have weaknesses. You're not alone and your not failing,
you are coping, recovering and learning. Those are good things. I've disappointed my wife
I don't know how many times. Trust can be rebuilt but it takes time. From a spouse standpoint, it's a contrast between loving trust & concerned suspicion when something like this happens. I have trouble overcoming the feeling that I was disregarded with each step, each lie, each decision made to start/continue the addiction. I'm still learning how the judgement clouds when under an influence. How does a person foster trust if their spouse elicits something innocent and it's taken as suspicious? If it is an innocent action misconstrued, the concerned spouse risks coming off as doubting their partner.
This in turn, makes the person who had the addiction feel like a failure. It's a cycle and it's also hard to break. Open communication will be the key to trusting.

You mentioned your husband works out of town. I'd guess lack of one on one interest and time together left an empty feeling in part of you. I know that I work alot too, which is part of our problem. My wife feels neglected when work overtakes family. Our one on one time, communication and intimacy really suffered. I've read on other threads that the addiction takes the place of or mutes the desire for intimacy. Do you feel that is a truth in your situation? It seem in my situation that my partner has been either numbed or become oblivious to what intimacy adds to a relationship. It's like the desire is snuffed.

I'm a very lucky guy. My wife is drop-dead gorgeous. She's my every fantasy every day.
She can melt me with a look and put me on cloud nine. When her interest in me is gone,
I feel really down. This may be a fault in me, but it really puts a strain on the relationship
when she's uninterested in me. I feel alone and held at a distance.

I hope in your journey to regain trust, you can feel open to him for communication of both types. I wish you well and hope you have bright days together ahead. :-)

Mustang

[believe0509]

I did have a person I was buying from at $5.00 each and I could take 10 a day aside from the other things I bought and took Plus! the meds I aquired after my mother passed away...Morphine etc.  It did not take long for husband to notice money going out of the checking account, but I lied about it (and he knew I was lying), but we just went on.  He works out of town most of the time and I had alot of things on me one of them taking care of my mother and was not even getting paid so my husband was paying my bills, but there was so much more money being spent.  I finally spilled my guts when I started withdrawals, but the whole time the guilt just killed me and made me use more.  I can't say I was releived, but maybe a little.  Not angry I couldn't be angry I was the one lying and stealing, but I am an addict, but some people use anger as a defense.  I have never been on your end, but I have seen the hurt in my husbands eyes and have seen the damage it has done to his trust in me and it brings me to tears, but I have a disease and only I can fix it and I am doing this as we speak and will spend the rest of my life trying to make this up to him if its not to late.  Hang in there mustang.  If you love each other it will be worth it and stay in counseling with her and make her bring it out somehow.  God Bless your family.

[1968mustang]

Hey there. Thanks for the note. I've not been saying much lately, just waiting for my next
appointment with my counselor later this week. My wife is going the day before me,,,we have the same counselor. The big white elephant is still sitting in our house just waiting to be addressed. I'm not sure if I can do it myself with my wife. I may see if she'll go in with me and perhaps we can address the question of use then. On the bright side, we have talked about a lot of other relationship things and we both feel worlds better. The world isn't perfect, but there is air to breath and sunshine in our hearts.

If you feel like answering any of my questions below, I'd realy appreciate it. If not, I won't be offended or anything.

How did you get your pills? How much did they cost? How many were you taking?
How long did it take for your husband to notice, if he did? When he did, how did you feel?
Were you releived, or angry?

I don't believe my wife is on anything at present which would mean about 2 1/2 weeks.
She's taking a **it load of Motrin right now for a sore back? or so I am told. She's gone through about 76 of the 160 bottle in about 10 days. She's also carrying Benedryl everywhere she goes. Are these used for withdrawl?

Reply if you wish to.

I am glad this forum helps you too. I am new also, only posting for about two weeks.
I'm glad it's here. Many people have offered info, encouragement and an unbiased perspective, which I desperately needed to wade through my racing thoughts, anger and hurt. I want to handle the subject in a caring way and feel I am prepared to do so if I can muster the courage to utter the right words.

Thanks. I hope to hear back. :-)

[believe0509]

Percocet is the same feeling as vicoden only 4x stronger, but it works the same way.  You will always keep needing more and more to stay normal.  Your situation is the same as my husbands and mine.  That is the only pill I ever saw with the fancy v at the bottem and I don't believe I could ever find it on the internet because they were to new to the market, they sound like the same thing I was buying and just about put my husband and I in the poorhouse and landed me in a rehab.  This was my first relapse in 3 yrs. but I was taking care of my Mother who had cancer and passed within 2 months of diagnosis and I just went off the deep end and took everything I could to numb the pain.  Your wife will know when she has had enough and will come to you, just be there and just try to keep things as normal as you can for now and please keep posting this site seems very helpful.  By the way I am new here and thank you all for help you provide to the world wide web.  You are awesome.

[1968mustang]

Problem is, I don't have any of them. They were either moved, or she's out. I didn't take on originally, I should have. I was so shocked to find them and I wasn't ready to ask about them. I thought if one was missing, a confrontation may occur without me having time to think things through and steady myself emotionally. I have not found anthing anywhere since. I don't want to over-react, but not knowing what it was, and the fact that the resembled hydrocodone with a V on them, white, 7.5, scored to be broken in half and a V on them leads me to the Vicoden conclusion. I've looked up Percocet on the internet and they don't resemble what I found....but who knows where they are manufacturered etc.

I appreciate the feedback on the feeling it creates. I guess i'll keep an eye peeled and see if anything shows up. The container I found is still where it was. It has white residue
in it. Not sure if it could be identified from residue?

Thank you.

[hopeless]

All you have to do is look up in your phone book, "poision control" and call them. Play stupid, tell them you were cleaning out your medicine cabinet and found a strange looking pill. They will ask you what it looks like and just describe it to them, they will be able to tell you exactly what it is. I had to do this once, it was no big deal, they don't ask your name or anything. Just tell them that you are concerned and wanted to know what it was. I think you really should do this, cause if she is getting pills sent from Canada, that can be very dangerous. They can be sending anything, God only knows what it is.
As for percocet, i was addicted for over 4 years, they just make you mellow, relaxed, give you energy, and make you talk alot more than often. Overall, just a good feeling, but not like a "high" feeling.

Good Luck,
Hope

PS...Let me know what poision control says they were, if you call, ok?

[1968mustang]

Thanks for the reply, but I've googled everything from Vicoden, to Darvoset, to Valium,to Percocets and still haven;t found the pill I saw. I'm going to assume that it was a generic of something like Vicoden. The pill was just like a Hydrocodone with a V on the back. If it was Percosets, From what I read, they are stronger that Vicoden, and addictive also.
What do they make a person feel like and how do people function when on them?

Let me know how they affected you if you don't mind?

Thanks.

[believe0509]

They are Percocets.  I'v bought many of them with that fancy v at the bottem