A New Day...A New Post

[PainKilla]

Good Morning Everyone,

Just thought I would start a new post for today since the other ones seem to run into each other.  I am new to the site.  I have only posted a few times.  I have been on painkillers for a year now due to two MVA's.  Started with Perc's then I was perscribed OxyContin.  When a friend suggested sniffing them that was the start of my addiction I think.

I would run through the scripts at least a week early every time and have to suffer the awful withdrawals.  Over time my back and neck pain is starting to get reduced so my doctor is trying to wean me off of all pain meds.  I see a pain doc every two weeks for trigger point injections.

My car was broken into a month and a half ago and my Oxy was stolen.  My doc decided that would be a good reason to switch me to Methadone.  I took it for three weeks and I could not take it anymore.  I was a walking zombie.

So for about three weeks I have been on straight Oxycodone.  The 5mg tablets.  Sure enough...I ran out of them early.  My last dose was Sunday.  I am suppose to take 6 a day...but I take more.

You would think I would learn my lesson right?  Why is it that we don't?  Why do we keep telling ourselves "I will take X amount extra today and then make up for it X day down the road?"  IT NEVER HAPPENS.  I keep taking more than I should every single time I get a script.

I bought a bottle of Ultram to help and it is.  I hardly have any withdrawals.  I just miss the high I guess?  

Well...I have written a book now so I will stop.

I hope you are all having an okay morning.

-CM

[Rex1]

You are dealing with the same set of issues that the rest of us are -- the issues that surround addiction.

There seems to be such a clear divide between those of us that are addicts and those that are not.  One of the coaches for my sons football team recently threw his back out, and was prescribed Vicodin.  Although he was in a lot of pain, he took the Vicodin for only a few days, and then got off of it -- and the story ends there.  Of course this amazed me, because he worked so hard to get off of the pain killers, something I could not do without great effort.

And so it goes for addicts and alcoholics. You either are or you aren't. for the most part if you are, then you overuse like you stated above. If you aren't you don't use at all unless you are in authentic pain.

And who knows why...

Once you recognize you are an addict though, you have to turn on all the strategies that people talk about here, and that are listed in the NA/AA literature and work them.

(There is good news though. I am comvinced that once you go through this process, which involves helping others, not only are you stronger, but you become a better person.)

But there are downsides too. My deal, when I drank years ago, was Bacardi rum. I still walk past it in the grocery store, and I swear it calls to me.  (Imagine that Homer Simpson voice, "OOOOOOhhhh Bacardi")

And like somebody else here on this forum once said, I may always remember how I felt when I was on the Vicodin, that euphoria, that "I'm in no pain today" feeling. What's the end game though for this feeling? A living helll that so many if us here are in.

I actually went to see an addictiononlogist when I was drinking, and he told me this:

"There are a lot of things that you can do in your life.  Drinking is not one of them"

And so it goes with both drinking and drugs. It may be helpful for you to think of it like this. There are certain things that diabetics must avoid.  People who have had heart attacks must avoid certain foods or activities.  Lots of people with lots of the diseases must avoid lots of things.  There are a lot of things that we drug addicts can do in our life, a lot. Howver, addicts must avoid drinking and drugs. Period. If we don't, for the most part, were not part the way back in, were all the way back in which means high doses, higher than were supposed to take.  I mean, there's no such thing as being a little pregnant, right?  You either are or you aren't.  For me anyway, when I'm taking drugs, I'm taking lots of drugs.  What's the solution then?

Take no drugs. And during the taper process, you will hate that solution. However, I'm convinced that the same thing that happen to me after I stopped drinking will happen after I have stopped taking drugs.  Does everyone recall that thing that we used to call "our lives"? As many on this forum have told us , we get that back.

Good luck to you PainKilla....

Rex

[suzieneedshelp]

I just wanted to say wut a special guy i think u r!  You have helped many on this board.  I have lurked for weeks since you have been so active and always am inspired by your posts.  You do not know me, i used to be very active here.  But thank God, now i can be back here and feel like i will not get harrassed for expressing my true feelings.  Keep postin. You are so right, this addistion makes us grow in ways others could not imagine.  So that is the up side.  Without it, we would not at all be the people we are.  The helping is what makes us grow.  To me that is what religion is all about.  When Jesus was asked how do we get to heaven, he did not say go to church he said help your neighbor.  Our ministry is the depth of our salvation.
Take care and i am so proud of you and your detox!
Keep that Angel on your shoulder!
Suzie

[PainKilla]

Just wanted to say thank you for your advice.  It means so much to be able to speak with people that are going through the same issues.  I HATE that I love these pain killers.  I wish there was some side effect that made me not want to take them.  Like alcohol.  For me...it makes me throw up so I choose not to drink.  Occasionally I have a glass of wine or two but it stops there.  Pain Killers are the only thing that I have ever abused.  I hope I can beat this.

CMM

[FINISHED?]

Rex,
  First off...Kudos on the Simpsons reference!!! You can never go wrong with Homer.
  Secondly...You hit the nail on the head. We must avoid drugs if we're not honest with ourselves regarding them. I have stated before my injuries & pain. I have also openly admitted to taking a pill or two occasionally since my detox. The only way I manage this is that I am COMPLETELY honest with myself. I AM an addict...however...I DO HAVE a tremendous amount of pain...daily. I CHOSE to be clean. So far...I CHOOSE to STAY "clean" (meaning no abuse). I have a lot of pills worth of scripts in my wallet & I don't fill them. I can't speak for tomorrow...only today. I know that this statement's killing a lot of people still feeling withdrawls today...the fact that I DO have 50 or so pills of vicodin es in my desk & a lot of prescriptions I can fill but that's not my intention nor my point. My point is, I HAVE to live day by day. I can't see into the future far enough to say that I will never abuse my medication again but the memories from 4 months ago are still very vivid & very clear...so I CAN see far enough into the future to say that as of now, I WILL NOT abuse my meds anytime soon. My life has straightened out but I can never reclaim a career that I dreamnt of my whole life...MOTOCROSS!!! I may still be in the industry & I may still make pretty good money riding but I will NEVER see the kind of cash I did before VICODIN took over. We can't ALL avoid medications...but we should if we can.

[Rex1]

Hey, I hope you are doing better, and hope this new plan will work wonders for you.

Thanks for your kind words, but what I learned I learned from Hippee, Methman, 1day, and many others.

PEACE!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;-)

Rex

[teeitup]

What is it about Hydro that won't let go. I've done weed, coke, mandrax, Lemon 714's (the best) etc. and was always able to say yes or no! Why does the hydro only make you say yes?

I'm on day 5 of tapering a 6 year hydro habit, took 1 1/2 ES's yesterday and 1 .5 zanax last night an slept for 5  hours straight, no hot bath nothing. What a great night! My goal is nothing today but the hot baths.

Thanks to all for the postings it has made want to change for the first time in 25+ years of being high on everything but life!

[Rex1]

Yeah, I did those Lemon 714s - long time since I heard that terminology. You think I would have learned.

by the way, the difference between the Qualludes and Vicodin, can be best explained by the following bit by the ever-vulgar Sam Kinison. (I am substituting some terms here...)

"A Vicodin never caused me to drive my [freakin'] car into a [freakin'] wall!

To use another comedian, and substituting again from Richard Pryor:

I got tired of waking up in my car...........doing 80mph! ;-)

Qualludes were not the best, but the worst. The Pharmies were extremely potent and could turn a pissed off charging Rhino into turtle on Valium!

The answer to your question is technology. Huge drug companies with billions of dollars in R&D investment dollars and really intelligent scientists create this stuff, as opposed to "two guys growing some stuff in a 12x18 patch of grass in their backyards in So Cal", or some Methlab in a mobile home in Tulsa.

This Vicodin is a highly engineered Opiate and because of this, it works REALLY REALLY WELL! Guess what though? When you abuse it, it grips you REALLY REALLY WELL!

I have said this before, but I know - I KNOW! - that somewhere right now in a conference room at Merck, Wyeth, ect, managers, engineers, and CEOs are having meetings on the "Addiction vs Profit" discussion.

The minute any of these guys go public to say "We think there may be a problem with addiction of our products", their stock gets hammered, huge losses ensue, stockholders lose thousands or millions, and so there you are!

In a highly ironic twist, they _could_ be developing a anti-opiate to help people with the original opiate addiction get off of the drug. They will then sell that product and boost their profits to an absolutely silly amount. Here's the concept -- sell the opiate for the huge amount of profits, and then sell the anti-opiate for huge amount of profits. In other words, work both ends of the spectrum, both sides of the coin.

This can be illustrated by a bit by yet another great comedian - Steven Wright:

One time I bought a humidifier and a dehumidifier - I put them in the same room and let them slug it out!

Rex

[G-rhymes]

Hello everyone,
This morning I think I may of had a godsend. I had gotten an 80 of oxy that night and in the morning when I planned to take it I was washing off the coating and it went down the drain.Holy ****! My dad got a scrip for 5 20's. I said I would take 2 today two the next and then one.That was my contract and I sure fu--en hope it works. I can't believe that happened.

[suzieneedshelp]

Yes, Hippee, Methmike, Skipper, Michael, Thomas, Jesse, Chezz and other old timers are all huge stores of knowledge and generous support.  Some have left here unfortunately due to the flaming.  Thank God i still have them as friends to lean on.
If you ever want to e-mail me it is ***@**** or chat on yahoo messenger it is suzanne32308
That goes for anyone.  I would love to hear from any of you!
Take care!
Suzie

[FINISHED?]

Hey!!! At least you didn't get out your monkey wrench & start taking the sink apart. I actually had a friend fish pills out of the toilet after he vomitted them up. Sorry for the graphic detail but it's all TRUE. Now THAT'S an addict.

How ya feeling today?

Did you share my story with your friend?

I'll tell ya what G...If you can get your friend completetly clean & yourself as well...I'll personally take you both to the X-GAMES as V.I.P. guests...all expenses PAID. How's that for some incentive. I'll introduce you both to all of the top riders & anybody else in the industry or any other...skateboarding, BMX etc. This will include ALL ACCESS PASSES, LODGING, FOOD, TRAVEL & maybe even a souvenier or 2. You have about 3 months to complete this. You can return the favor when you sign with the NBA by taking me to a game or 2. Your friend would get a lot out of this being as he will meet the top pros, sponsers & contacts galore. I would love to do this for you & your friend but I will not drop a single dime if you're both NOT 100% CLEAN.

GET TO IT G-RHYMES...

[G-rhymes]

What an incentive. . .
You may be in trouble when we get clean and i try to take you up on this offer. Thats the nicest thing anyone has ever said to me. As far as I am concernerned when i make it to the NBA you can be my personal agent. How bout that for a deal ...

[diso]

Hey G,

You should take the 20s that you get by swallowing them rather than snorting them.  I used to snort my oxys as well.  You can use a lot less without feeling the withdrawals for a longer period of time if you swallow them. This worked for me.  Just some advice.

[PainKilla]

Hey G

Sounds like things are betting a little better day by day.
How are you feeling now that you have been able to put a small amount of opiate in you?  Hopefully it has eased the pain.

I have dropped a few OC's down the drain.  I used to freak when that happend.  I even made my fiance open up the drain pipes once and get it out!!  What a fool.  Do I dare say...I miss the Oxy's. It has been about a month and a half since I have had one.  Now I just take OxyCodone 5mg pills.  They don't even effect me.  I may miss the Oxy's but I don't miss the way the effected the rest of my life.  The ruled my life.  I think my car getting broken into was a godsend.  God was giving me a chance to get off those Oxy's.  I truly belive that everything happens for a reason.

[Jennibean]

What is my freakin problem?? I am so full of anger today. Angry at ME and these damn drugs! I have always been so "normal" at least I thought so. Why did this happen to me? I have been through so much! I tried to get pregnant for 7 years I had 2 miscarriages and then lost a son at birth. I finally had a daughter 3 years ago on the 10th and started abusing these pills when she was 4 months old? Why? Why did I ruin my life when I finally had everyhting I wanted? My mother thinks it has alot to do with my son. She may be right I spent all day everyday crying in so much pain over his loss. When I injured myself and took these pills I stopped crying finally. I saw it in a new way a better way I thought. You know it helped the physical pain but also the emotional pain. If there were no such thing as tolerance I would have to say these would be the worlds best antidepressants! But the tolerance gets you and you keep taking more and more. I am taking so much now. I look at people who take 15 a day and think I wish I was back there again even though that seemed overwhelming at the time. Detox would seem a little easier than from 40 oxycodones a day. I already kicked a couple months ago from 160mg oxy and 32 percs a day I went through hell and right when I was feeling better from the detox I screwed up. How many times can I do this to myself? It is killing me and my spirit. I am so jealous of those of you who are even through like day 5 of detox right now. I want what you have. those of you who have months....I am so proud of you, I want what you have more than anything. Your life back!!! Please God give me stregnth to taper. I know I cannot go cold turkey on this much, surely I will die or want to. I know opiate detox isn't usually dangerous but cold turkey from this amount I can't do it. Back in October I used my last inpatient benefeit through my insurance. I knew it had to be my last time. Here I am again...DAMNIT!!!!!!!!!!! I need to taper today and I need to do it alot. I am running out and while I usually come up with a plan as I am not one of these people who allows myself to go through withdrawal each month when I run out early. I can't think of my plan to get more just yet. I got two bottles of oxyfast Monday that is two weeks worth if I keep taking what I am taking I only have a bout 1 1/2 days worth left. I have real pain and am being reffered to pain management. They want to put me back on oxycontin. I refuse to go there again. I need help. I will learn to live with this pain somehow as I am not responsible enough to have pain relief this way. This is causing more pain if you ask me. I just really needed to vent today. I wanted to start my taper today and ended up having to keep my nephew along with my two girls today so I used that as an excuse why it couldn't be today, it is always something. My family is really really sick of me. I won't have their support much longer I fear. You know my Mom keeping my kids so I can go inpatient for 6 days, she just did that in Oct. She wants me to suffer this time so that I really learn. You know cold turkey at home with two kids. That outta learn me huh? I have a hard time putting a sock on during detox, sleeping FORGET IT! restless legs make me insane. I think each time I detox I come closer and closer to just giving up on myself and I cannot do that. I want to be the old "normal" me again! I didn't realize then how much I loved myself. I wish I would have enjoyed being normal more when I had it. I will get it again, I want it as much as anybody else. My husband is the best man on earth and I have doen nothing for him in two years. I have been a zombie as far as emotions go. He deserves better than this. I hope he doesn't realize that before I get better. I don't want to lose him either. I love my kids more than anything and i want better for them. I am so full of love yet obviously don't love myself very much. maybe that has to be mny start. Love myself!

Jennifer

[FINISHED?]

I wont be in trouble...I'll be STOKED!!! The deal is that you both get clean. Although I have a lot of connections, only the ALL ACCESS PASSES are free to me. It will be pretty expensive for me to fly you both out & pay lodging & such so don't dupe me on this. I want you to look me in the eye & tell me how good life is as we sit & watch 5 days of the best EXTREME atheletes in the world. Let your friend know this is not a joke & I am not going to back out. If you knew my real name, you'd know that I am a well known person in the industry & have established myself over the years. If you do not get clean before then, we'll have to extend it until next year or arrange a concert by my friends in LIMP BIZKIT or a handful of other bands. It should be obvious how important your recovery is to me.

As far as being your agent...right on. I'll be the tattooed freak handing you a towel on the sidelines.

FINISHED

P.S. Whereabouts are you from so I can figure how much cash this challenge is going to end up costing me when you get CLEAN?

[G-rhymes]

Whare are the Xgames going to be held because it may be easier depending where they are.

[Rex1]

Jennifer,

Slow down a little...  You're getting too far ahead of yourself by thinking about next week, when you need to stay focused on today.  What can you do today that will put you on the right road toward recovery?

Beating yourself up over the fact that you are an addict does nothing but make you feel worse. You have your mom, your doctors and trust me on this, once you get into see a pain management Dr., things will likely get much better at that point.  Pain management doctors, in my opinion, are so much more knowledgeable than the general practitioner, and are also well skilled in detoxification and of course pain management.

Don't forget also, that we are all pulling for you and praying for you. It might be helpful for you to sit and write down on a sheet of paper all of the great things that you have in your life.  I know right now that seems like a flippant comment, but you'll be surprised at how long that list is, starting with your kids and your family.

I have no experience with Oxycontin, so it is best for me to let somebody else comment on that, but there is some solace in knowing that this is not easy.  You know that right?  It is not easy and will not be easy, but there is a point you'll reach where it does start to get better. Gather up all the courage, tenacity, sheer and raw attitude, and blinding anger that you have and direct it towards the drugs.  Tell yourself that you will be tough for your kids sake.

We will be praying for you, and think of what you can do just for today to start your recovery, contemplating the fact that the pain management Dr. will also be another weapon you can use in your arsenal.

Rex

[G-rhymes]

In no way was I trying to offend you with your offer. I promise I am sincere about this and you will know whether I am clean becuase my dad is going to be testing me all the time. I am going to try and get my friend off as hard as possible, meating his all time heroes would knock his head off.

[reborn]

hello everyone
i have been lurking around this web site for months reading all the stories.WOW i did n't know how many people were going through the same thing i was. i have witnessed some incredable compassion and wisdom on this web site which i can say w/ all honesty gave me the strength and tools to get this monkey off my back THANK U ALL I OWE MY LIFE.
MY HISTORY- started smokinking pot @ 17 on and off(innocent enough)
never really a drinker in 92 i tryed crack bad idea 6mos later i was self cured. in 2000 my friend got hurt badly and was on meds  so needless to say i was 2 on and off his pain meds,till i cultivated my own black market connections oxi, percs, vics , lorset,lortab ,norco, valium u get the picture. in july i started using everyday just to get by. around aug 20th i tryed comming off
BAD IDEA. I WAS AN A-TYPICAL MESS, SO BACK ON I WENT FOR SURVIVAL. i knew i was in bad shape with these little pills and hooked( hard to accept). so i read alot off your stories got educated , took 12 days off work.and tackeled this demon(i'm not religious) it was hell i'll say no more on  the subject. my last dose was thanks giving 7pm . that night i fell out during dinner i was asleep at the dinner table, i didn't last as long as my 85yr old aunt(BAD HUH) needless to say my family knew something was up. i have since then come clean w/ my mom, sister and a few supportive friends
THAT WAS A BIG HELP
I STILL FELL TREMENDOUS SHAME FOR ALLOWING MY SELF TO GET HOOKED THAT FELLING IS PASSING AS THE FOG LIFTS. HANG IN THERE PEOPLE

        
NOTE TO PAINKILLA-
SORRY FOR POSTING ON YOUR THREAD IT WAS THE LATEST. HOPE YOUR DOING WELL.  

[Rex1]

Take me too and I'll introduce you to Darin Shapiro, the Michael Jordan of wakeboarding!!! ;-).

Just kidding - G you had better take him up on this, or I will go back on the Vikes just to come back off to get the offer [kidding - kidding!]

Rex

[teeitup]

Finished - How cool are you, great job! It's great to see someone who has a little being willing to share his fortunes with others.

G-Ryhmes - What a chance in life someone has  offered. I let alot of opprutunities fly out the window for not having the balls to admit I was the problem. Hope you and Finished have a great friendship!

Vicojen - YOU WILL MAKE IT!

[G-rhymes]

I live in Arizona. I wish I lived in cali ...

[FINISHED?]

Rex,
We might be able to work something out as well. You seem cool & if your interested...let me know. Wakeboarding's been another fun way for me to abuse my body over the years. I wish I had enough money to invite everybody but I don't. I'm sure I can get extra passes it's just the travel part that'll get costy. I'm not quite sure of your situation but if you want to get clean, I'll make this the LAST offer. You do it, I'll pay your way as well. If you can't or you need something else, you're not far from me so we can figure something out to get you clean. Let me know your deal (story) Consider me as a sponser for Rex1,
G-Rhymes & his moto buddy. It'll be great to have a hand in your recovery.  

G
The GAMES are in Philly. If you live in AZ. I'm out there at least once a month for contests, meetings etc. I've also got a lot of friends in AZ. so we can probably hook up there & fly out of Pheonix or something. YOU CAN DO IT JR.!!! Get your buddy on board & let him know about my problems & my offer. Like some people have said, this is a good oppurtunity & the least I can do to help a fellow addict get back on track.

Like I said, I WISH I could offer up incentives for everybody here...but I can't. Sorry. Just trying to do something above & beyond to help the YOUNG people figure out the error of their ways before it's too late.

[FINISHED?]

Listen,
You can't feel shame if you've learned your lesson. Beating yourself down for a mistake is self-destructive. Acknowledge the fact that you made a mistake & move on. The sooner you can do this the better you'll feel. Don't give the depression any further fuel than it has. You did a good thing in getting clean. Give yourself credit where credit's due. You'll get by O.K. You've already kicked crack in the ass...now kick this in the ass. Soon you'll be writing us & saying how hard it was but you made it. COME INTO THE LIGHT MY FRIEND...

[FINISHED?]

Hey all...I'd really like to change my "handle." I chose FINISHED? because I wasn't quite sure that I was indeed FINISHED when I first posted a question. Now that I know, I'd like to change it. How do I do this?

THANKS,
FINISHED?...NOPE...FINISHED!

Also, another thing I had a question on was the crushing & snorting of pills. Is this only with the time released stuff or is this common amongst all pills including vicodin. I could never picture myself doing this...even at the height of my abuse. This question is NOT in any way for future reference or anything like that. I'm just trying to educate myself further as I'm SERIOUSLY considering writing a book on mine & all of YOUR experiences. I figure with the name & respect I've obtained in the "EXTREME" sports world, I may be able to keep at least one person/ kid from diving head-first into the empty pool known as PRESCRIPTION DRUG ABUSE. Any & all info is truly welcome. I have printed every page & comment since the beginning of my visits here. If any of you would like your story told...please advise. My literary background is as follows: I've got a BA in English & Creative Writing from Cal State Long Beach. I have 37 articles, most of which were published in Motocross Magazines & other EXTREME sports publications & I've recently re-enrolled at Cal State Long Beach to work towards further degrees. This has become my new passion. I would really like as much info/ advice as possible. I started an outline about 3 weeks ago on this subject matter & hope to get as many Professional athletes & celebrities opinions & experiences as possible. With my past career, I have made a tremendous amount of contacts & friends in these areas. I think this will do really well but I don't know that I'd be able to do it with out everybody's helps here.

THANKS,
FINISHED!

[PainKilla]

Finished...

Congrats on being FINISHED!! :)

As far as sniffing goes.  It really only works with OxyContin or straight Oxycodone.  If you sniff a Vik or Pec it is going to be very painfull because 1. You have a lot more to sniff to get high and  2.  You are sniffing the Tylenol/Asprin.

Believe me...I never in a million years thought I would put anything up my nose until this past May.  I always thought it was very gross.  Then I tried sniffing and OC and LOVED the way it put my at ease.  Like I said...the begginning of the end.

[FINISHED?]

Yea,
That's kinda what I thought but I could swear that I had read somewhere about somebody actually "cooking" up Vicodin & shooting it so I thought that maybe if you were really hurting for a fix or a high, snorting might be common amongst the "HARD CORE VIKEHEADS."

Thanks for the reply...whatta ya think about the book idea? It may help. I might have just enough influence on some of the younger people into motocross to keep them from EVER abusing prescription meds.

A little ways down the road, I will reveal my real name for those of you interested in motocross. You may reconize my name as I have raced many Supercross events as well as X-GAMES & other Freeride events...but not just yet.

Thanks,
FINISHED!

[teeitup]

Day 6 of tapering, nothing in over 26 hours! I decided to give myself a test.

I have 2 great kids, 15yr old son and 12 yr old daughter. Over the last 2 years of my 6 year ES habit when I've been home, probably 50% of my time has been spent on a 3'x6' section of my bed watching sports or the discovery channel. Everytime the kids would start their normal brother sister fights my nerves were so shot I'd take another ES or Zanax close the door to my bedroom and veg. out.

Today when they got home from school and had one of their daily discussions I made myself sit there and listen to it! Man, that was harder than the withdrawals!

[FINISHED?]

CONGRATULATIONS!!!
You're doing GREAT!!! Hang in there. As far as the kids fighting, no advice there. Still not a Daddy but maybe soon. My fiance thinks I should settle down on my sports before jumping into that world...I have to agree. Whether you know it or not, you're a great influence to many here. You have a lot to be proud of. KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!!!

FINISHED!

[Rex1]

How are you doing today?

Rex

[emmy22]

Hey guys,
I am so sorry to cut in on your thread, but I have been trying for weeks to post a question and it always says there are too many, so this is the only way i know how to post. Could someone please help me? I have a few questions. First, I have been taking painkillers on and off for 5 years, im 22 with no health problems. I always knew Tylenol 3 made my heart palpitate, so sometimes (even though i had a normal ekg) i take vicodin instead. I have been taking it for years off and on, but lately it has been making me itch and get red splotches on my chest. I am going to the doctor for blood tests on my liver and kidneys, which i had done a few months ago and it was normal, but i just want to be sure again. Why is it making me itch? do you guys think it has done permanent damage? I am all out anyway and i am planning to start withdrawal tomorrow, but i am worried about the long term damage that may have been done from abusing something that i am possibly allergic to. PLEASE HELP!!! Thanks, emmy

[G-rhymes]

Hey whats up man,
I hope I havn't cuase you grief with all the other people talking about our deal. Going to the X-games would be a dream for me. I want to succeed in this so much, kicking this habit could be the crucial point in my basketball career.

[teeitup]

Baby girl your okay, just your body asking for more! Don't give it to it! Today can be the start of a new world. Cut in any time you want. I'm 42 just started posting this week and it's what has gotten me to this point. Rex1 commented earlier your age group is the ones who need help the most, us old farts have already lived the lives of 10 people and I want to see people like you and Finished make it to my age a lot easier.

[FINISHED?]

Itching is VERY common. The only long term effects from your use would be not quiting. Then you'll potentially have bigger problems that itching. I used to get a tickle in my nose that wouldn't stop for anything. You'll be just fine as long as you quit taking the meds. The itching is nothing serious & will not last.

[FINISHED?]

No...nobody's jumping on. Everybody seems thrilled that I'm in a position to offer this to you. Don't worry about it bro. I made an offer to Rex because he/ she seems cool & is also in need of a little fun reward.

DID YOU TALK TO YOUR BUDDY?

I'm, very interested in his response to this. I hope me offering him an oppurtunity like this will be enough to kick him in the coolo & help him to clean up. I don't know if you know the extent of what I AM offering. He will make unbelievable contacts & it could really "kickstart" his career. PUN DEFINATELY INTENDED!!!

You play any ball today? Next time I'm in AZ, I'll have to take you out & hoop ya up a little. I played some ball in high school but haven't gotten on the courts much lately. Besides that, I'm old (29) & broken. Lets see what ya got!!!!!

[G-rhymes]

Remember how good you are at motorcross. Well im that good at ball. Now i may be just alittle white kid but thats peoples most commen mistake when they look at me. Im gonna run circles around ya .. .

[FINISHED?]

WHITE MEN CAN'T JUMP...Wait a minute...I'm white!!! But I'm 6'4" & about 230 pounds of muscle...I'll just pick ya up & move you outta my way!!! Seriously, I don't doubt for 1 second that you'll whoop my butt but it'll be fun. Ya gotta remember I'm old & broken...but I'll give ya a little run.

You still haven't answered my question regarding your friend!!!

[G-rhymes]

Man i never thoght that i could even attempt to get off pills. the last couple of days may change my life and you may be the one to see it threw. I think writing a book may be a huge idea. it could help toins of people not only kids.

[G-rhymes]

well im 6 foot and on a good day can dunk. try 6ft 7in 235 and black who can jump out of the gym. I love it every time i've supprised the hell out of them and after a game there saying who is this little white kid. Im down for a game any time any place. I used to live in Alaska over the summers and still played evry day on a small island off of Kodiac.

[FINISHED?]

YOU STILL HAVENT'T ANSWERED MY QUESTION REGARDING YOU FRIEND...
Are you avoiding this topic?

[G-rhymes]

No, sorry i tried to stop my last writeup before it sent so I could but I didn't. I couldn't get a hold of him becuase he is working till 6 at a atv and bike store.

[teeitup]

For a different perspective when you can go to www.prescriptionabuse.org andd click on stories of recovery(family). It gives the side of the story from those we love that have had to put up with ****. Check it out!

[Rex1]

Am I a man or a woman?

Actually I am a Eunich, from greek mythology. That is "a brainless, sexless giant" ;-).

So it has come to this. The personal disclosure thing. Actually, no problem - really. I don't mind.

Twighlight ZOne music comes on.

So I am a 40 year old guy, that until these back problem could probably pass for 32 (really!). I have always done lots of stuff that the younger crowd has been doing - wakeboarding, watervolleyball, tennis, softball, and of course, the best of all - Frisbee. Are my South Florida roots coming out yet?

Who am I? Could be described by describing some of the best times of my life (besides the birth of my three boys - now 13, 11, and 7 - )

Born in Miami 1962
------------------------
Fast forward to 1982
South Beach, Miami (before south Beach was "the spot")...
Me and 10 of my buddies...
Beach volleyball...
two cases of ice cold Heinekin on ice...
Other "stuff" not good to mention here..
Blue Skies...
Warm sand...
Cool sea air...
Warm florida water...
Frisbees flying...
High fives everywhere...
Smiles...
Beach volleyball with no rules (aka Jungle ball)...
Slammin', jammin' chillin' and killin brews (before I knew I was an alkie)...
Sun setting...
Cruise ships coming in to port...
palm trees swaying...
Van Halen on the radio...Eruption maybe!
tanned bodies in ultimate shape...
Great times on the beach...
no worries...
no schedule...
no to-do lists...
no internet...
no problems...
Just life in Florida  - "Hurry up and slow down"
God is smiling on me...in 1982.

That's who I am, or was anyway.

Pink Floyd - "Then one day you find, 10 (20 actually) years have got behind you, no one told you when to run, you missed the starting gun"

Today, computer expert in SoCal working for a company famous for laser printers, inventing things..can you guess? I am to Computers what you are to motocross - near the top of my field...

Loving God and hating back pain, but trying to get better...

I am me, u b u,

Rex

[G-rhymes]

I feel abit out of place being so young.

[teeitup]

As you can see addiction knows know age. Be glad technology is where it is at your age, being able to listen to us old farts will hopefully let avoid our mistakes. Besides when I'm on the golf course nothing I like better than taking money from some young stud!

[G-rhymes]

There nothing like crossen up someone who's older than you on the court either my friend.

[teeitup]

I hear ya, a couple of weeks ago I was talking smack to my next door neighbors son (20) who use to play high school ball. So we went in my driveway to my goal and after about 10 minutes when ES rush wore off and he was making me look like a fool I bowed to him and said lets go to the course. Keep strong!

[Chezz2]

Finished,

I've been reading here lately. I stopped coming here and posting after I found out some people were messing with the forum. I came here when I stopped taking my meds. I met some pretty cool people and got a lot of support. From then on I stayed and helped others detox for a few months. I know how hard it can be, especially emotional, confusing, painful, ect.
I loved doing it. It helped me just by helping others.
Glad to see you have the same outlook.
Pretty nice offer you have put out to G and his buddy. That is definetely a cool idea.

If you need help changing your ident., email me. I won't post it here. We have problems with it already.
BTW - I was born in LB, grew up in SC. Right down the street from Cameron and Grant. My Aunt owns The Surfers Journal, if you have heard of it.
I am now up in Santa Barbara. I just moved here from Tokyo, I lived there for the last 5.
Its nice to see someone using the grace afforded them helping others.....
Chezz

***@****

[emmy22]

hey, thanks for responding! So you or someone you know has "itching" when you take a pill? It is so wierd and usually it goes away when the pill wears off. I wonder what causes it??

[southernbelle]

we need your input, wise one!  how are you doing?  please let us know how things are going.  i care for you and i know you'll be able to give us the REAL, TRUE, LOW-DOWN on the bup.  i've been thinking about you.  i don't know about anybody else, but i look for your posts and read them...i feel like they are so honest and truthful.  just down-to-earth.  love to you.

[Rex1]

I am not intending to break in on BodyMechanics answer here, but - 6 a day! Way to GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

You're almost there! Cut in half one more time for two more weeks and you will be ready to cut the cord!

Lisabet, please listen, nothing will feel as good to you as when you get past that 5th day of CT. Yeah, I had some ups and down with the physical pain part like you are now, but mentally - soaring happiness hits you.. you feel....free.

Stop right now and pull up your calendar. Suggestion time: cut to 3 per day until the 20th, and then cruise through Christmas on .5 three times a day. You can do this!

Kick off the new year at zero.

I know some people here, they'll help you do it.....

Rex

[Rex1]

Hope things turn around for you. Still praying if that's OK...

Glad the anxiety is better...

Rex

[lisabet]

Me - strong?  If you only knew the times I've tapered down and almost had it licked and ending up with my head in the pill bottle (not to mention the Jack Daniel bottle)... :) And back to Square One again.  You? A Loser?  No way; I've read your posts, and admire your strength and honesty (even though you may not feel too strong right now)...You know what? One of these days we're gonna give up these damn things for good; we'll have relaspes but sooner or later we're gonna succeed; we have to believe that. This forum is filled with people who have been where we are, and they've done it...we will too. These are the posts that keep me going.  My biggest fear is the mental cravings; I can deal with the physical withdrawal, cause you know sooner or later those will go away.  I'm terrified if I completely quit, I'll wake up every day still craving those damn hydros.  This is what scares me most.  You hang in there girl, and thanks for your encouraging words.  Right now I'm just trying to hold on through the holidays (a really stressful time for anyone, much less addicts).  We're gonna be OK. Love/Peace, Lisabet

[lisabet]

A whole hearted "Thank You" for your encouraging words. Everyone has learned they can always count on you coming through with just the right thing to say at the appropriate moment. What a gift! Wish I had it; more often than not I just stick my foot in my mouth!!! ha.  Right now I'm not thinking ahead too far, I'm struggling trying to just stick with the 6 a day, but I read all the posts and am trying to absorb everyone's experiences. It really helps. As I told Southernbelle in my previous posts, it's totally inspiring to read about the people who have actually beat these horrible addictions; it makes me believe, a little more everyday, that maybe...maybe if they can do it, I can do it too.  Just keep all us "strugglers" in your prayers; we need all the help we can get.  How are you feeling?  Hope you're hanging in there.  Have a great weekend.  Love/Peace, Lisabet

[bmac]

Good to hear from ya.It's been awhile.I hope you are doing OK these days.Life is good here and I hope you have a good holiday
             Peace to ya!  bmac

[theGolden1]

I almost cried when I read your post. You do not deserve to suffer! No one does. It's so funny. I think these pills cause pain. Really .... I take my meds as the doctor said, and I still have back pain. I remember taking vicodin. I hated it so much. I think the levels are so up and down .... not steady and that's why it messes with your mind. You are a sweet person. Work with the pain specialist and move to something long lasting and steady for pain. Then forget about it and enjoy your loved ones. Once you feel better, you'll be able to break the obsession because you will already be "feeling no pain" (sorry for the pun) You have alot of gratitude in your heart and you care about people. You have a great life and you are already on your way ... one day at a time. Don't second guess yourself about the last time you went to detox ..... you weren't ready. Make a better plan this time. I shouldn't but in ... but if you are a chronic pain person .... why are you going to detox at all? I mean why can't you change to something time-released and stay on a regular affective dose for now. Being completely clean might not be bearable .... I can't really say because I'm not sure how bad your pain is. Be fair with yourself. You know the difference between pain meds for chronic pain ..... and taking pills just to get high. I will be praying for you ..... only a power greater than yourself can restore you to sanity..... Goldie
My email is; "***@****"

[giveitupcj]

OK DUDE I've read your responses on this site and wonder who u are. My sister is
Madonna Thorn and I know about every X Games guy on the clue. Why don't you tell us who u are and quit with the games with peoples minds? Are u for real or just a wanna be? People here do not need promises broken! They are here for reasons other than some wanna be long beach guy who wishes to be in the X games! I don't care if I get offed by my words.. I can't stand by and let you promise these things to these guy's and not say a word! This may be crazy but it's funny were both here huh? I did not advertise I was a celeberty's sister and offer usless tickets that NOONE recieves before the first week of the games!!!! Everyone in this game knows we don't recieve game tickets until 2-3 weeks before the games! Tell me who is Robert Earl,Madonna Thorn and Jason Ellis without looking it up on the net? I will get thrown off this site for this but u touched on the wrong family here! My family is going to the true X games and I'm sooooo sorry for the few u offered tickets to... U must have a lotta time on your hands! Your probley more like 17 if I had to guess!

[reborn]

makes sence i've always done that(beat my self up). low selfestiem i guess,however your right. i dont think i'll ever be able to look back at this time in my life and feel rightous about my experince mainly because of the pain i caused others time wasted, money spent etc.
p.s.
write that book now people will read it

[teeitup]

giveitupcj - man chill on Finished, if he aint the real deal he will be the one to suffer!

Finished - deep breath before you respond dude!

Everyone - About 3:30 am, starting day 7. What a night,I've got 10 different incisions from 2" - 10" long spread over my beat up ass. A cold front came through last night around 9:00, raining 40 degrees, damn fuse blew on the Christmas lights. Had to fix that ****, now I can feel where every stitch, staple, calcium deposit and piece of scare tissue has been.

Around 2:30 could'nt stand it no more, took a .5 Zanax filled up my garden tub and soaked. Man I can hear the hydro calling my name, been about 30 hours since I had one. Itching, shaking ****!

Luckily I work out of my house and live in a small town. It's going to be one of those days of going see a customer for couple of hours, come home soak for 20 minutes and back out again.

Remember help each other, assume will all have good intentions and the good will be rewarded!

[PainKilla]

Hi Finished,

Thanks for the comment on my screen name.  It's just seemed "Right".  

About the book...I think it is a GREAT idea.  I am not a celebrity so if your only looking for celebrity stories than I can't help ya there.  I work for a large company in Boston doing Marketing.  


Emmy and Jen...How are you ladies feeling today?

[PainKilla]

Hey T

How are you feeling now? Is your morning any better than the night you had?  How is the taper going?  

Last night I had a hard time sleeping.  I think I got about 4 hours.  That is one of the worst side effects of withdrawal for me.  It drives me CRAZY.  Nothing seems to work.  Sometimes I will take a hit of a joint and that will do the trick but that also can cause me to focus more on the pain.  So it's a no win situation.

TGIF!!

[teeitup]

Not much better, luckily I found a Darvocet. It's helped some and I figure its better than reaching for ES's. I agree on the weed to commint to. Thanks for the support!

[FINISHED?]

First off...I can appreciate your concern about me being a "wannabe"...but let me ask you this; what do I possibly have to gain by this? You have no idea who I am & that's fine. Why don't you just sit back, relax & let the cards play themselves out. Like teeitup said, if I'm not the real deal, it'll show itself eventually. As far as the passes...I'm nor quite sure, but I really don't remember me saying I had the passes in hand. I CAN get passes, have gotten passes & WILL get passes...ya know what? I'm not going to justify myself anymore to you. You're a chump with nothing better to do than call people out. Let
G-Rhymes tell you whats what when this offer goes through & I'll see you at the GAMES...then we can talk man to chump about this, face to face.

Rex,
I guess THIS is what you meant about "flaming" huh?

G-Rhymes,
Don't get discouraged by this DORK...I ASSURE you that this is the REAL DEAL & the proof will show it's beautiful little head.
As I said, I have nothing to gain by making empty promises here. You get clean, then you & I can laugh directly in this nerd's face...If he'd be man enough to take that challenge that is. I'll reveal my real name 1 week before the GAMES so he knows exactly who to look for...but something tells me he's a spineless little chump with 0 courage & no ability to admit it when he's proven WRONG!!!

teeitup,
Thanks...lets hit the course. I'm pretty new to the game but have played at least once a week for just over a year. The first 6 months I actually played more like 3 times a week & was at the range EVERYDAY...not that it matters much...I'm still nowhere near what I would call good!

[Rex1]

We don't need your attitude here.

Rex

[FINISHED?]

Listen...I'm apologizing for the name calling. Regardless of your unsupported, "flaming" words...I shouldn't have reacted with calling you names. Again, I can appreciate your scepticism here. If the tables were turned, I might be sitting here thinking the same things you were. Difference is, I wouldn't feel the need to lash out or comment further than a pat on the back for the intent. You will see that my intentions are sincere & my offer is VERY VALID. Until then, just do everybody here a favor & keep your thoughts on this to yourself. They're not needed nor appreciated by any.

TO EVERYONE,
Again...I'm sorry. My reactions though valid, were uncalled for. Teeitup, I actually did take a deep breath but that only lasted so long. I kinda feel like I've been kicked in the crotch here. I'm trying really hard to make a decent offer to a couple of kids in return for them getting clean & I get bashed by a member for no other reason than their own amusement. Please understand everybody, I AM THE REAL DEAL. I'M NOT YANKING ANY CHAINS HERE FOR SH#TS & GIGGLES. I HOPE YOU ALL BELIEVE THAT. I really respect each & every one of you & have come to value all of your opinions...but not enough to lie about myself or my abilities to help some young folks with their recovery. REX...This quotes inspired by you..."Do unto others as you'd have them do unto You" I don't think I'd be too stoked to get yanked like I've been accused of doing to G-Rhymes.

G-Rhymes,
The offer still stands...if you BELIEVE ME that is.

Take care,
I FEEL REALLY "FINISHED" RIGHT NOW!

[Bodymechanic]

It sound to my like you are developing a sensitivity reaction to narcotic drugs. Consider your self bless by god.

[PainKilla]

True that...

Don't I wish I could have some side effect from Opiates that would make me not want to take them.  I can dream can't I? ;)

[G-rhymes]

I never said I didn't believe you. you don't have to tell anyone who you are and I think that would work fine to just tell me at the airport. I really don't care, but I never said I didn't believe you and trust me I do. My dad said he would even pay for all the flight plans to make it alittle easier, this a out of this world kind thing your doing and I believe you 150%.
Please right me soon. . .

[G-rhymes]

Hey, give it up like your name. if you don't like this and think I'll get  hurt that is my buisness and I can't wait when I laugh in your face. Just because evryone can read these comments doesn't mean there for evryone to comment on. Your acting younger than me now stop before you **** off the wrong people.

[FINISHED?]

You have just shown maturity years beyond your age. I WILL follow through 100% on this offer as long as you keep up your end of the deal. I wasn't implying that you didn't believe me but it's pretty discouraging for me to be willing to fork out a lot of money from my own wallet to give you & your friend some incentive to clean up then get blind-sided by some clueless person. I am NOT IN ANY WAY reneging on the deal!!! The offer STILL STANDS & we WILL laugh in CINDY'S face. (aka giveitupcj) The funny thing about her is that she's previously mentioned ALOT about God & religion in her earlier posts, then attacks me & my credibility. What happen to the Bible mentioning something about judging others. HMMM...sound hypocritical to anyone besides me? Anyways...I'd just prefer to forget about Cindy, her opinions & her hypocritical ways & REALLY laugh in her face with my buddy G-Rhymes & his Bro at the GAMES. Whether or not I qualify (which isn't looking really good...too many youngsters out there just tearing up the scene) we WILL be there. Also, the things you said about giveitupcj were incredibly witty. Man...I actually laughed aloud. GOOD JOB...As far as your Pops paying for travel...that's not the deal. I would LOVE to do this cost free for you. This means EVERYTHING!!!

AGAIN...DID YOU GET A CHANCE TO TALK TO YOUR BUDDY?

TAKE CARE,
FINISHED!

[G-rhymes]

My buddy said he would call me right after he gets off work today. I didn't want to tell him over the phone, and felt that this should be a in person kind of thing. I promise that it will happen today, promise. I don't know mabey I shouldn't of said anything to her but people **** the hell out of me somtimes. What was she trying to get out of this-hate stupid peole with no respect.

[FINISHED?]

Alright G,
   Just let me know what he thinks. As far as our "friend" Cindy, don't worry about it. You said nothing mean or even wrong for that matter. Some people live a miserable existence & choose to bring the rest of us down with them instead of working on becoming better people themselves. We've all hit rock-bottom at one time or another, how we deal with it determines the type of person we truly are. Those who act hypocritical or uncivil towards others for no reason are obviously not very well adjusted to their situation. Some of the previous posts from giveitupcj seemed very caring & sincere but that all became null & void when she chose to lash out unsolicited & completely contradict every belief she claimed to have in the way of religion. She showed her true colors so to speak. She is obviously not a very happy person with herself therefore chooses to attack others for their intentions. I have no doubt she is who she says she is. Why can I accept her statements but she can't accept mine? Maybe because I'm exactly where I want to be in my recovery & I choose to take EVERYTHING at face value & not contradict my own beliefs. My point to all of this is not to "bash" giveitupcj but to maybe make people understand the possible source behind some peoples anger or frustrations. Recovery is hard enough without the constant bickering, bashing & anger that seems to accompany many in their progress. I hope that people understand that I AM indeed sincere & REAL in my intentions. I am NOT a 17 year old "wannabe" as giveitup mentioned, but a 29 year old recovering addict who happens to have a little money from a fairly lucrative career in Motocross...That's willing to share a little of that to help a young man get clean & start his adult life on the right track. Along with sharing my experiences, advice & opinions with those who ask.

Thanks for listening,
FINISHED!

[G-rhymes]

I will tell you the second I talk to him. Thank you so much for trying to help me. I hope we can continue a great friendship far beyond our X-games adventure.

[teeitup]

Now that we all had a good healthy vent lets get back to why the hell we are here, to get help and give help. Autumrose, Vicojen we need to hear your okay!

[FINISHED?]

YOU ARE 100% RIGHT!!! I've noticed there are no new threads being started today. Is eveybody doing O.K.? Teeitup, how are YOU today? The hot tub working for you?

[southernbelle]

wanted to say hello to everybody.  i've been reading all the posts.....i am in NO position to offer advice or counsel to anybody here.  I'm in the worst shape of my life.  But I DO HAVE the capability to LOVE each and everyone of you.  I think about everybody here so often...you are all on my heart and mind.
It's the holidays.  I wish I felt better.  Somebody posted they were just MAD....well, I am too.  I'm MAD, SAD, BLUE, FRUSTRATED.  But most of all today, I feel SCARED.  I am so afraid.  I'm afraid to leave my house in the mornings.  I had the car wreck Tuesday, I'm already out of my meds.  I've got some darvocet, but you know how that compares to tylox/percocet....UGH!  Why can't I just be normal?  I just feel like I'm sitting in my own world, and everybody else is running, skipping, hopping around me with smiles on their faces --- "nah! nah! nah!  We're sane and normal, and you arent'! HAHA!"  I hope that doesn't sound too nuts.  There have been some sweet, honest and sincere references to God here on this forum.  Well, at this point in my life, he's just a figment of my imagination.  I'm well versed in what the Bible has to say about life...my favorite book of the Bible is Ecclesiastes...but, right now, I'm such a wretch and I've done things deliberately.  It's more real to me NOW than ever before that God is not real, he's just something man has invented over the course of history to explain things that just can't be explained.
I'm sorry for rambling...I doubt anybody even reads down this far.  If you are the one person that reads down to the bottom of this post, then please know I love you and we are in this together.  You are not alone.

[ChiTownGirl]

Hello everyone.  Can anyone give me a tapering schedule to follow this weekend?  I have my last bottle of 20 norcos (no refills) along with Clonidine, Trazadone and Bentyl to ease my symptoms.  I have managed to reduce my intake of 15-20 vic's down to around 8 per day or less, along with the timeframe between doses.  Does anyone know exactly how long vics and norcos stay in your system?   I am scared and need the support from everyone, I cant do this by myself.  
Emma & Vicojen, how are you ladies doing today?  please check in with us.
Also, I think everyone needs a reminder to not use this forum as a "chat room" or so to speak - we have gotten several warning from Cindy/Phil about using this board correctly, so lets do it! I'd hate to see this place shut down because certain members continue to ignore those warnings.   Peace to you all.  CTG.

[southernbelle]

wish i could help... i don't know what to tell you as far as a tapering schedule.  just know that i'll keep you in my thoughts.  this road is NOT an easy one for us to walk, it's just plain yucky.  but you have my support; honest, sincere, non-judgemental, unabashed support.  i know you can do it.  i know we all can.  i'll keep you in my thoughts and on my heart.

[FINISHED?]

Belle,
  You are NOT in your own little world alone. We're here right next to you. It's like the old "FOOTSTEPS" story. If need be, replace Jesus being the one holding your hand with this forum & it's members holding your hand & carrying you through the hard times. I used to say a little thing to people about me going off into my own little world.
"Sometimes I go off into my own little world but it's O.K...everybody knows me there."
I used to see the same things you do...people walking around, happy, content with life & here I was...withdrawling, miserable & far from happy. I just reminded myself, that'll be me in a couple more weeks. It did help. Try not to let this get the better of you. It's very common to phase God out of your life & it's O.K. to do so. The most religous people in the world have done this & it will always happen. You just have to TRY really hard to believe that it will get better...because it WILL. Keep your head up belle & let people hold your hand through the hard times.

Chitowngirl,
I can't personally help you with a taper schedule because I didn't taper. I believe that the hydros only last about 3 to 5 hours for most but I may be corrected by somebody who actually knows the facts on that. The fact that you're working on getting clean is GREAT & I will keep you in my thoughts.

As far as the chatroom comment...you're 100% right & I will try not to let people get me riled.

[Chezz2]

ChiTown
If you are referring to the half-life of Vics and Percs. It isn't that long. It really doesn't make too much difference either. Oxycontin's half-life is long and is worth concidering during detox, although it really won't make that much of a difference either.
With opiates in general, withdrawals normally start 12 after your last dose, as a general rule.
Where med half-life come into play for real, is with benzodiazapines. That is a whole nother ball game though. The risk of seizures and everything else makes detoxing from them not very pleasant.

Chezz

[teeitup]

Belle - the best thing is that you are feeling, sad, mad whatever is good. Just means your getting the **** out of your system. Hell I tried to so long to just get numb and not feel happy or sad. Once I realized I was at least feeling it gave me the strength to keep trying.

I've been biting my tounge on this religion thing but her goes. I was raised strick Southern Babtist, so I have seen some serious church time. Once I was old enough to form my own beliefs I came to the choice that their is a god but religion is man made. What made me realize their was a god was @ 15 years old watching my mother dying of cancer just having my father (alcoholic)kill himself because he good not live without her have so much faith in God she wrote her own OB column. Not thats faith.

Ever since then no matter how many times I cussed God I still believe in Him!

Tapering was my choice, to me tapering is doing anything as long as it is less each day. Depends on the indiviual and their inner strength. 9 is better than 10 and so on.

At this point there is no right or wrong just do something!

Sorry for the sermon on the mount!

[teeitup]

Belle - the best thing is that you are feeling, sad, mad whatever is good. Just means your getting the **** out of your system. Hell I tried to so long to just get numb and not feel happy or sad. Once I realized I was at least feeling it gave me the strength to keep trying.

I've been biting my tounge on this religion thing but her goes. I was raised strick Southern Babtist, so I have seen some serious church time. Once I was old enough to form my own beliefs I came to the choice that their is a god but religion is man made. What made me realize their was a god was @ 15 years old watching my mother dying of cancer just having my father (alcoholic)kill himself because he good not live without her have so much faith in God she wrote her own OB column. Not thats faith.

Ever since then no matter how many times I cussed God I still believe in Him!

Tapering was my choice, to me tapering is doing anything as long as it is less each day. Depends on the indiviual and their inner strength. 9 is better than 10 and so on.

At this point there is no right or wrong just do something!

Sorry for the sermon on the mount!

[kell737]

Hi everyone.   I haven't posted in awhile,  Been reading and coming in about 1-2 times a week.   Just wanted to let everyone know I've been clean from percocet for almost 4 months now.  I'm still not 100% but I would have to say I'm 95% better than I was  3 months ago.     Let me know how everyone is doing.   Hope everyone has a wonderful Holiday!!

~Kell

[emmy22]

Thanks for responding! Do you think the sensitivity is an allergic reaction? A serious reaction? What should I do?

[Bodymechanic]

I used the word sensitivity reaction because it is milder than an allergic reaction. The treatment for all allergies including yours is to avoid the allergin. Why are you taking these medication?

[Pinkit]

Hello everyone!! I havent posted in awhile as you may have noticed. I'm back now though. I had to go to my first appointment at the pain clinic today. The doctor prescribed me Pamerol for my cronic endometreosis/back pain and also for a long history of depression. I've never taken this drug and am wondering if anyone has taken it and has any info about it. I'm on Ativan 1mg. 3 times a day for withdrawls, Zoloft, and now this Pamerol 25 mg. I'm also down to 3 vicodin es a day for my tapering which is outstanding for me, but I feel like shi*. If anyone has taken Pamerol and has info on it please share the info with me. The doctor says it is prescribed for depression and also cronic pain. Has it helped anyone with pain???  Thank you for your answers. God Bless everyone...

[Rex1]

Here's my orginal post on tapering. adjust it according to when you want to be at zero...
Rex
---------------------------------------------
Here's some ideas on how create your taper schedule, keeping in mind that everyone's plan will be different.

Think of two anchor points:
--------------------------------------------------------------
START - Your dosage today
END - Your dosage on Jan 1st - ZERO
(ChiTownGirl - modify this date to be your zero date)

(Note, you may want to change the end date to something sooner. If so, build your schedule from today to whatever you pick as your end date)
--------------------------------------------------------------

Rather than think about this upcoming week first, go to Jan 1 and build backwards. You must decide, along with your doctor or person who is helping you, what that last week on your meds will look like, but it should be as low as possible, perhaps 1.5 or 1 pill/drug dose per day.

Example: .5 tablets of Vicodin three times a day.


Here's an example of a Vicodin schedule, again working backwards from Jan 1st, 2003. Adjust accordingly for Percs, Meth, ect!

--------------------------------------------------------------
December 22 23 24 25 26 27 28
--------------------------------------------------------------
dose/day  2  2  1  1  1  1 .5

--------------------------------------------------------------
December 15 16 17 18  19 20 21
--------------------------------------------------------------
dose/day  3  3 2.5 2.5 2  2 2

--------------------------------------------------------------
December 8 9 10 11 12 13 14
--------------------------------------------------------------
dose/day 6 6  5  5  4  4  4

--------------------------------------------------------------
December 1 2 3 4 5 6 7
--------------------------------------------------------------
dose/day 9 9 8 8 7 7 6


OK, so there's an extra 3 days at the end of week 4 where you may want to be effectively at ZERO on these days, where many will be off of work, Dec 29th, 30th, and 31st. But you may need to use the days as a fudge factor, that is, either to accelerate or catch up if your drift from your schedule.

Summary points;

* Plug in your own numbers based on your two anchor points
* Build backwards from Jan 1st, 2003 to today.
* Design your schedule for a very slow taper during the final week
* Share this schedule with someone who will help you/force you to stick to it.
* Please let someone here now that YOU HAVE ACCEPTED! A post to I Accept might be good. That way, your committed....

CELEBRATE YOUR SUCCESSES HERE WITH EVERYONE ELSE!
You will be pleased to see that at the end of every week, you took less than the last week!!! You're winning! you will win!

Please post if you additional ideas, or items that have helped you succeed..


Rex

[Pinkit]

Sorry about posting again.  I meant to ask about Pamelor not Pamerol.  If anyone has taken this medication for pain please let me know. I know this forum is for addicts, but most addicts have pain and that's why they are addicted atleast that's why I'm in this situation so I hope it's okay that I ask about this medication on this forum. Thank you for your help.

[Bodymechanic]

The medication you are taking is Nortiptyline. It is a tricyclic antidressant. It is used to help sleep, control compulsive behavior anziety and depression.  I have taken it and like all other antidepressants, it did nothing positive for me.

[southernbelle]

i would like your realistic opinion on something, if you don't mind......if a person knows they are an addict, that they have a problem with narcotic pain pills, is it truly better to tough it out on your own, or should we seek professional help?  i mean, what is best....seeing addictionologists, checking in to a detox center, going cold turkey all aone, or what?  as you know, i'm seeing the psychiatrist, which just meant more medicine.  it's helped with my anxiety, it truly has.  but, i'm a firm believer that addiction is a disease....i will always want the drug, whether i'm in pain or not, you know?  it seems like a never-ending cycle, that i'll be like this all my life.  (boy, that's a sad thought).  just wanted your opinion......i value your straight-forward approach to our struggles.

[lisabet]

I'd like your input on something also - I've tapered on the hydros (except for a few day binge over Thanksgiving) from about 12 a day; now I'm down to 6 a day.  I do fairly well, except in the morning when I wake up. My nose is stuffed up and runny, my eyes are watery, and I sneeze my head off; sort of like an alergy (allergy) attack. However when I take the 1-1/2 pills I'm now taking first thing in the morning, all symptoms cease in 15 or 20 minutes. I vaguely remember (I think it was your post) reading about something refered to as the "wets" or something. Is this what I'm going through?  Any suggestions to help with this; I feel absolutely miserable in the mornings.  Hope you're doing well with the Bup. Take care and thanks, Lisabet  :)

[southernbelle]

i know i don't really have an answer to your question, but i have noticed that when i am without, don't have any more of my meds, i sneeze a good bit and I get the sniffles.  don't know if that's what you are talking about, but i have noticed it myself.  love to you...sounds like you are doing pretty good.  keep it up, your being strong is an inspiration to me (the world's biggest LOSER).  keep it up, it helps me to see people succesfully beating these demons and getting control of their addiction.  hats off to you!  love to you.

[kell737]

Thank you!   I'm doing pretty good.   Been a rough 3 1/2 months but things are looking up again.  Didn't think I would make it for the longest time.   Same to you by the way....... Have a great Christmas and new year!!   I think I'll stick around this time LOL  see ya around.

~Kell

[Bodymechanic]

Southern Bell

You must decide without a doubt exactly what you want.  Your goal may be complete sobriety or to simply find a way of using your medications in a responsible way.  Responsible use separates the drug dependent from the drug addict. It is much easier said than done. Only you can decide if you are using drugs to treat you pain or feed your addiction. Examine the hard evidence of your drug.  Try to put your own perceptions on the side as they can be distorted.  If you have repeated failed at tapering then it is probably time to change your approach to the problem.  This does not mean you have failed.  But at that point you may want to get another person involved.  It does not have to be a professional.  It can be your husband who controls you drug use.  In my case it is my wife. Some people have gone as far as locking their drugs in a safety deposit box, which would greatly limit access.  I believe that professionals should be used as a last resort in a non life threatening situation.  Professional intervention always involves locking up you or you or the drugs that you use. It always leaves a paper trail that can follow you for the rest of your life.  The important thing is that you get clear about your goals and keep changing your approach till you find something that works.  Above all, never, ever surrender to dark forces.

Lisabet

What you are experiencing are symptoms of early withdrawal first thing in the morning.  Runny nose, runny eyes, congestion and coughing are sometimes called the wet symptoms of addiction. These are most effectively controlled with clonidine. Clonidine is also helpful with sleep, controlling high blood pressure and anziety.  The downside is that it will drain your energy.  

Email me and I will make arrangements for you to try a few. If they seem to work for you then you can get some more on your own. You will of course have to send me a copy of your famous video in exchange. (just kidding)

***@****

Everyone

If you have anything that you want to ask me, please post it on the board and I will answer you.  There are days when I have as many as 15 messages from people asking questions.  I can no longer keep up with them.

[lisabet]

You've got mail!  :)

[teeitup]

Good morning all, day 8 no hydro in 70 hours! But I'm a wreck, the pain from the med. problems I have is killing me. Haven't slept in sevral days. The first few days a Zanax before bed would give me a couple hours of rest but not now.

Had to make a 200 mile round trip to Houston last night for a company Christmas party. About half way their I had the worst anxiety attack yet which increased the pain. Brought an ES and Zanax with me, took the Zanax but did very little. About half way during the evening my stomcah decided it didn't wont to be their. Spent the rest of the evening ditching to the bathroom.

Miseral ride home. Spent most of the night in the bath tub. Hate to see my water bill this month. I don't know how much longer I can keep from reaching for a hyro, I've got to rest!

Keep me in your thoughts, I'm not looking forward to this weekend. I've got several functions to attend and i"m afraid I'll give in to my weakness!

Thanks for all your support so far, I would not have made it this long without these post!

[Bodymechanic]

Unless you are determined to go cold turkey, why don't you take a lortab before bed. Better still, take a darvocet and a clonidine.  If you take only one it won't be a big setback. This way you will at least be able to sleep at night. You will need your strength and energy to fight the addiction during the day. In the long run all that matters is that you get and stay clean. It is better to slow down the process than risk total relaps. If you have genuine pain you will need to have a plan on how to deal with it once you are off the drugs.

Peace

[Bodymechanic]

Buprenorphine is a partial opiate antagonistic drug.  That means that it acts like an opiate in low doses but acts like a opiate blocker in higher doses.  It is this property that makes it a great medication for the pain patient with a secondary addiction problem. If abused by increasing the dose it tends to make you feel sick. If one tries to take another opiate such as oxycontin or even ultram it tend to make you feel very sick. This is why it is said to have a low abuse potential. Abusing it is just not fun.

This does not mean it cannot be abused. There are some people who are taking 8-10mg a day.  The dose that I intend to stay on is 1-1.5mg a day. The big downside to buprenorphine is the cost.  My current drug bill is $250.00-300.00 a month.  That comes to $3600.00 a year.  A heafy sum over a period of time but much better than many other alternatives.

It does work great for me. I get from this medication what I expected to get from antidepressant medication. Not  high,just "normal". It has relieved me of many of the negative emotions and taken away most of the pain.  It has allowed me to be the person I always knew I would be if it were not for the cloud of pain, depression and sleeplessness.

[teeitup]

Thanks and I sent you something via email, hope you don't mind!

[Bodymechanic]

I did not recieve a message. Go ahead and send it again.

***@****

[hyjack]

I just wanted to respond to your post about 8 mg. being a lot.

The sublingual form that I take is equivalent to 1.9 ml injectible.  So, in essence, we are taking the same dose.  The liver eats up most of my dosages, where the injectible is almost completely used.

There is a big difference in dosing sublingual vs. injectible.  I just wanted to be clear, that I am taking them sublingually, that's why my dosage is so high.  Some people can take up to 32 mg. sublingually/day.  It sounds like a lot, but in comparison to injectible, it's not.

I just can't wait until it is available here, so I won't need to get them compounded for me anymore.  Soon, I hope.

[minime]

Hello do you have to go to a clinic to be prescribed that, or do you have a doctor that does?  Are you on it for pain?

[hyjack]

I intended on detoxing from methadone and saw an addictionologist who prescribed it to me.  I started tapering, and my pain broke through, so I continue to take it.  I was told indefinitely, as long as there are no problems.  

It does alleviate about 80% of my pain.  I do still have some, but nothing compared to what it's like without it!

[flashk]

I have two days without a pill. The anxiety is horrible. I take kava and it helps a little. I struggle through work a nervous wreck. I cant sleep at all. Please tell me that this will pass soon. Through my addiction I loved being alone. Now I feel so alone and insecure that I am ready to have an anxiety attack. Thank you everyone for being here. This forum has been a miracle.

[ChiTownGirl]

Congrats on 2 days w/o any pills.  Its a small miracle that you've been able to come this far.  Try and think of your detoxing this way,  you've simply got a bad case of the flu and it will pass in a couple more days.   As posted below many times, can you get a script for clonidine, trazadone & bentyl?  These 3 meds will help you along and ease some of the symptoms you are experiencing.  Believe me, they will help you get the sleep you need too.

Did you quit cold turkey?  What exactly is your story, I don't recall seeing any posts from you.  Hang in there and keep us posted on how you are doing.  ChiTownGirl.

[Rex1]

The anxiety will really start to subside in about 72 hours or less. Get your mind off it until then.

You are doing what you need to do to get well.

Use thomas's recipe, and use the other suggestions here. Don't forget this little thing called 'The most powerful force in the universe!"

Prayer.

Good luck and God's Grace -

Rex

[tce37]

hey chi-town girl,
how has your days and nights been? hope that you are doing good and that you have a nice holiday season. well from me to you goodbye and have a nice day.  tce37

[flashk]

Rex,
Thank you for all your advice and support through my detox. It is day four of being totally clean and I am starting to feel a little better. It seems the leg restlessness is gone but the insomnia is still very much there. I still have anxiety and feel uncomfortable in my own skin.I feel like the worst of the physical pain is over and it is time to start "feeling" again. I find that AA and prayer helps me a great deal when I am feeling overwhelmed.
thanks again to everyone!

[Rex1]

Hey, your are welcome, but you are doing it.

Do you have the benzos as part of the Thomas recipe, like Ativan or Klonopin? Use them sparingly, but they will work for the anxiety guarateed.

You just want to use them when absolutely necessary.

Also, the imsomnia, what can I say? I was at the beginnign up at 3:45 sometimes. Then it was 4:20 for a week. Then it was 5:00 am sharp. Now I seem to be sleeping till 5:30 - 5:40, so it gets better.

If you have insomnia, pick up a Barbara Streisand box set of her movies - that'll get you to sleep guaranteed!

Way to go - your are beating this thing!!!!

Rex

[mwh]

I have never made it more than a month off this stuff.

I seem to be planning,plotting,or thinking about my next script or hand-full all the time.

Is there any hope of freedom?????

michael

[Thomas02]

rex, you don't want flash to have nausea on top of everything else ... Flash, if you're not on an SSRI anti-depressant like Prozac or Zoloft, you can use 5-HTP (available at the health food store). It's like having a warm glass of milk only several times more potent.

Thomas