Advice/experience w/ Tapering? Detoxing?

Hi everyone. I'm wondering if anyone get give me advice on a tapering plan or recovery plan or whatever.

I'm addicted to 30 mg Roxicets (percocets basically), as is my boyfriend and my best friend. I've been on pills for... 7 yrs maybe? , but addicted to these specifically for about 3 or 4. my boyfriend its been about 2. I've posted once on here months ago and then never ended up getting clean. I don't have time to go to a rehab, i have two jobs and school. I also don't have time to be sick, which really doesnt work well when i'm withdrawling. I have tried getting off pills for years, i know all about how difficult it is, and I know alot of people don't agree with tapering. In the past I've just gone cold turkey but it won't do this time around, so i'm trying to get an idea of how to do this. Does anyone have experience tapering off a drug? I've gotten it down to between 30-60 mg a day, maybe more like 30-45 really (i'm trying..)

I'm open to any and all suggestions any one has! Have loaded up on a few supplements too such as fish oil, bcomplex. I just really really wish there was some way to get through this without the physical being so debilitating.

[cleanmom]

Personally, i think if we had the ability to taper ourselves successfully, none of us would even be here in the first place. And look at it this way, jobs and school will still be here when you come out of rehab, these options could be dead to you if you continue the way you are now. My best advice is either cold turkey with lots of support in place or inpatient rehab. I have never seen someone self-taper successfully, including myself. You should definitley seek your doctors advice as he/she will best know how to help you. Keep posting here, we are all here for each other. Best of Luck to you-----------Jacky

[cleanmom]

Oh and no matter which method you choose, there will be some discomfort involved, really no way around it. Take your vitamins, drink lots, excersize( as much as you can, this one may be hard at first), check out the health pages to the right of this page.   Jacky

[gnarly_1]

hey girlee....well tapering is possible I had no choice I was strung out on 150mg of methadone so C/T wasn't an option ....I was given a taper schedule from a neo/natal nurse that brings babys off heroin methadone oxy ext ...and I figured if it was safe for a baby it would be safe for me...it goes like this....10% drop in dose every 72hrs...it worked good for the most part but there where times that I had to wait a week or so b/4 lowing my dose again to avoid major withdrawals ...im familiar with most pills but im not shure if roxy is time released or not or how your taking it...but you can break it up if its not time released and take a little less each time you drop doses you can taper off
just do the math the best you can cut the pill into little 1mg piles and break it down like that...tapering requires a lot of discipline and perseverance its best to set up a schedule and do your best to stick to it...let your body be the final judge in when its time to lower your dose..but do your best to stick to the taper...there is a certain amount of discomfort that comes with tapering that's unavoidable "you just got to be ok without being ok for a wile"" till your thew it ...keep posting here for support
message me if I can be of any help and good luck and God bless...Gnarly      

[Greatgreebo]

I can help you with a tapering schedule if you need one. Drop me a PM and I'll make one for you....I need to know how many pills you are taking a day and how many pills you take at one time and what mgs they are. Also need to know how many pills you have to do the taper with................................

Time for some technical talk... One of the things which increases "dependence" is a spike in drug blood plasma levels. Addicts do this on purpose to get a "high". They do it by Snorting (Very fast delivery), IV Injections, Chewing up meds and taking on an empty stomach.

The above all produce the most amount of drug in the blood in an attempt to get a buzz. These spikes are one of the reasons we addicts get hooked faster than a COMPLIANT Chronic Pain Patient.

Being compliant means they take only as directed. The goal of compliance is to maintain an even blood plasma at the minimum amount to treat PAIN and NOT to produce euphoria (a high).

Since the blood plasma levels are lower, the levels of dopamine at the synaptic cleft do not spike so the receptor sites do not downregulate or decrease in number in response to the initially MUCH higher level of dopamine released as a result of spiking.

Addictive dosing behaviors, the large doses associated to Spike the blood plasma level, vs the lower low dosing and more often which is the KEY factor to the physical changes the brain makes which cause dependency.

Dependency is the actual physical changes to your body which cause withdrawal. Addiction is the BEHAVIOR of taking the drugs to get high, not as prescribed, and when not needed for clinical reasons. It is the un-manageable behaviors associated with lack of control.

Which comes first... Dependence or addiction? Usually it's addiction, but it can be the other way, but the key issue which causes the progression of addiction are the behaviors.

Addiction is what makes you take more and more, spiking doses, etc. This in turn increases dependence. The higher your dependence the higher the tollerance... Round and round you go. The addiction merry-go-round.

How to break the cycle? The only way is to change the behavior. That is a very difficult thing. Pain is usually a very good motivator. So is Euphoria. When the pain out weighs the euphoria one starts to consider breaking the cycle. Unfortunately the pain being eliminated by the drug is a driving force. Then the addict associated the RELIEF of th pain to the drug instead of the drug being the CAUSE of the pain.

SOoooooooo what to do? Break the cycle.

Many have to hit bottom to do that. That's the point where the pain of using overwhelms the relief of using. It's an emotional point which is different for different people. Not every one has to hit a bottom to quit. The sooner you quit the less pain and suffering you have to experience.

For folks who are on smaller doses and their disease has not progressed very far, they have not felt the extent of pain addiction can cause. Only conceptualizing how bad it can get may not be good enough to motivate a person early in addiction to quit.

Intellectually we know what lays ahead. We hear the truth from others, but yet we continue to use. It is not until we get a glimpse of the pain that lays ahead do we become to believe we need to quit. One HAS to believe that in fact addiction does lead to the loss of everything and eventually Jails Institutions and Death.

Addiction is a lot easier to nip in the bud physically but maybe not emotionally because one has not experienced the pain first hand. Some need more pain than others to quit. Some don't make it and end up end stage and their addiction wins.

If you want to get off of the pills you have to change your behavior.

1) STOP SNORTING your pills!
2) Stop spiking your dose!
3) stop taking enough to get high

You will never quit until you do that. Weather you can or not is up to you.

You have to come to a point where you make the decision you want to quit. The en you have to make a plan then you have to execute that plan. SIMPLE .... but not easy.

The solution from a clinical point of view for you at your point of addiction is so easy. A simple taper, and change the behavior. In short break the cycle.

How to do a taper is easy. Changing the behavior is the HARD part, but you have to want to change.

If you are taking 6 pills a day... then start taking them in even doses and don't take like 3-4 at a time. 24 hrs divided by 6 = 4 hrs. So only take one pill every 4 hrs. Then take 5 pills in 24 hrs. That's 4.8 hrs. Then 4 pills a day... break pills into 1/2's so you have 8 1/2 pills. and take 1/2 a pill every 3 hrs. Etc.

If you can't stick to a taper give the pills to a friend to dispense.

Mean while .. you have to start changing the way you think and the things you do... You should educate yourself... Good place to do all of that is NA or AA. It's FREE and takes up time. It forces you to be doing something other than sitting around with nothing to do and just thinking about using.

It's not the only way, but it's a good place to start. Take what you need from it, and leave the rest.

If you take the same amount or less every day and don't spike your dose you will eventually quit.

30 mg of Hydro can be tapered to 0 in 2-4 weeks painlessly. The PAWS will be minimal too.

The ball is in your court. We can not make you do anything. Only YOU can.

When you are ready is up to you. If you need to stay "out there" using and see for yourself how bad it will get that's up to you.

My recommendation.. Start to QUIT now! It will be a whole lot easier.

Like I said....PM me if you want help with a taper schedule. Also, I'll need to know how many pills you have to do the taper with.
Greebs

[Greatgreebo]

ps.....people do successfully taper-it happens all the time. You need to be motivated and stick to it. If you think you will weaken...do you have someone you can hand the pills over too who can dole them out for you? Definitely not your boyfriend OR bestfriend. By the way, are they quitting also? If you are serious about getting clean you are going to have to change lots of things. Including not hanging out with addicts who are actively using. It's just the way it is. Are you committed to this? Are you willing to leave your boyfriend if he choses to keep using? How about your bestfriend? Will you give her/him up too? You've got to take this seriously. This is your life. Did your boyfriend start using with you? Did he pick this up on his own? Does he want to quit?

PM me back.....you don't need to go into the answers to all my questions.....we can keep it basic for now i.e how much, how often, how many left.
Greegs