Affects after withdrawing from Xanax

[Starbucks]

After being on a prescribed dosage of Xanax (6mgs daily) over 12 years for panic attacks, I went into a drug rehap center to get off of them. I was in the hospital for almost a month and was given Kolonapin in tapered doses while there. Towards the end of my stay and afer another decrease in Kolonapin, I noticed that my throat area felt "funny". What I mean by that is it felt like something was inside my throat and I had to make myself swollow though I din't have any real difficulty with food. Even my voice sounded different. It's not really painful but is VERY disturbing and VERY uncomfortable.
After getting home, within a few days this feeling became much stronger. I uses moist heat to allivate my discomfort which helped though sometimes it didn't go entirely away.
After another week or so the feeling came on so intence and strong that I decided to take a dose of Xanax which helped make it feel pretty much normal. (I'm careful to not get addicted again because I only take it now as needed and not on a regular dosage as before.)Before I pose my questions I should also tell you that I usually dissolved it in my mouth. So, my questions are could I have done some damage to my throat and voice box from dissolving it orally or could it be a form of anxiety manifesting itself in my throat? Or both? Or could it be that Xanax targets an area that feels the most "stressed". Or
something else? Is this "normal"? If so do you have any idea
when this will go away?

Thank you kindly for your responses to these question.
Sincerely,
Starbucks

  

[Witchywoman]

Hi Starbucks, and welcome to the forum!

I wanted to reach out and give you support, but I don't know what the answer to your question is. Maybe Dr. Steve will know. Have you told a Doc about the throat symptoms?  
My guess would be that it may be related to muscle tension due to anxiety, that somehow manifests in your throat, but not being an MD, I really can't say for sure.

I do want to congratulate you for getting treatment and getting tapered off the Xanax. I here that is a very tough med to get off of, and that it can be dangerous if not done under medical supervision. I'd love to hear how you are doing these days with the panic attacks. Did they return? Have you gotten good old fashioned therapy to help with the Panic Disorder as well? There are some really effective, wonderful new therapy approaches specificaly for Panic Disorder these days.

Anyway..welcome among us, I'd love to hear more, and I hope someone here can answer your question..but I encourage you to tell your Doc also.

love,
WW

[cindi]

even though ww is a therapist and i am a nurse there is really no answer we can give you,,,I have one question  do you think the feeling in your throat had something to do with anxiety and when you took the xanax  that anxiety went away?  I'd have it checked out.....good luck and keep us posted            love to all  cin

[Francoise]

I had a similar reaction when I began taking oxycontin. As a result I went to my own doctor, to a GI guy, and finally to an ENT. The GI guy put me in day surgery and poked a scope down my throat to have a looksee. While he was there he went all the way to the pyloric valve, technically known as the pill gate. Found nothing. Also was scanned. Nothing.

Don't have any idea if my case and your case are in any way related, but there it is. I understand your worry. Why don't you just do what I did and go to a GI guy and ask for an upper endoscopy? Insist on going to day surgery and being knocked out for this procedure. My father had it done wide awake. Once. Said he'd never do that again. Apparently they grease up this flexible pipe with about a half a ton of KY and tell you ya gotta swallow it and it's bigger than a garden hose. Screw that!

Anyway, I'm digressing all over the place. There's my opinion; worth every dime you paid for it.

Frank

[PHILLYCHAD]

Sorry to bust in but I am feeling dumb again!

PLEASE MAKE ME RICH!!!

I AM STARTING THIS MAKE CHAD RICH PROGRAM...
I would like everyone in the US to send me one dollar...
Why you ask, would I send a complete stranger a dollar?
Because you will have the satisfaction of knowing that you greatly improved a total strangers life. Please include your name with your donation so I can add it to my contribution hero list. I will write everyones name down on a list to have it engraved on a bronze plate to be mounted to the front of my new home. In a few months when this takes off you guys will see me on Oprah and Extra. I plan to take out billbords across america to reach the maximum amount of people. Thank you for your support! Chad

Adress to follow.........

[SHOTSY]

Okay while I'm feeling mostly stupid, let's finish me off.I think you're referring to the $1 donation Bush asked our kids to send for Afghanistan children? I was planning on doing that, to teach my kids,hell,what is it... One of the virture's I believe.Anyways, I take it you think it's not a good idea. Tell me why. Thanks, SHotsy

[Francoise]

I just did a search of the entire board and discovered that ALL of my prior posts have been deleted. ALL. As in 100%, except for the two in this current thread.

I'd like to know why.

Has anyone else had this particular experience? I don't remember anyone complaining about anything like this.

If the sponsors of this board have some personal objection to me or my posts, I think they should have the courtesy to say so, out front for everyone to read - you know, act like they've got some modicum of character.

What do you all think?

Francois

[SHOTSY]

Click on an actually thread you know you've posted on. I think the main page only shows so many posts. Shotsy

[cindi]

you are not alone  last week i was very upset that an important issue i posted was deleted in a heartbeat..and severl others have had the same thing happen   cindy from med help at one point said that they do not delete things  and if something is deleted we should try and remember the dates we posted  she said that something may be wrong with the software or something.....nice to hear from you again         love cin

[cindi]

God help me  why do I love you so much,,,,,you're a trip....

[CASEY]

Help? Just found a vial of Sentanyl. Thought son had been clean since detoxing in May after a near death blood infection. Please tell me about this opoid. How addictive?  Is is it like oxycontin? Anything. I am so fearful for him. thanks, Mom

[Shea]

I am sorry for addressing so many in this post. I can't believe when you are away for a couple days how much there is to catch up on.

CINDI...as far as the bad luck your hubby is having...him and I  must be birds of a feather..if it wasn't for bad luck I would have No luck. I know days like that can be so damn frustrating. I hope his trip from here on out goes well.  Also I hope he didn't' encounter any tempted gators :)


THOMAS...Thank you for your reply about the "recipe." I wasn't sure if I should be using it still or if ti would still be of benefit.
Also for the advice on how to handle things with the doc regarding my dosage. I greatly am appreciative of the advice I receive here and the time people give into giving it.

WW...Wow coming on two months, how fantastic that is. And I am glad to hear the pain is manageable. That was my problem. If the pain would have stayed manageable I would have been able to stay away from the meds. The 2 Vics a day are ****. they do next to nothing. But I am going to play it for another week and goo back to the doctor with the suggestions I have received here. I still get the cravings for more but I don't take more. I just swear a hell of a lot more.

CHADD....GOOD FOR YOU..You sound GREAT and it sounds like your in a good mind frame. you should feel proud as I am sure everyone here is of you. Good Luck. I think a good frame of mind is the first step. My thoughts and prayers are with you. Your in Philly right? I am by Harrisburg and if Three-mile Island get hit by a terrorist attack I am heading your way.

JBEAR....When you wrote how you called your Mom regarding the pills and she said flush them...I can relate. My parents were the same way.."just stop taking them" oh..okay Mom I never thought of that..duh If only it could be that easy. Just goes to show you how some people don't have a clue. Yes, this is the first time we have wrote to each other but I can tell by your posts what a caring soul you are and how well liked you are here.

SKIPPER...did you read my post to you regarding the Zofran I wasn't sure if you knew of this drug and I know the misery of food poisoning. Like I said Zofran is a wonderful drug to stop nausea/vomiting. Just file the name away for future reference. Hope your feeling better.

FRANK LEE...I was reading back through some of the posts and I think instead of my hubby going with me to the doctor I need YOU to go along with me. LOL i know I would get results :)

Francoise, Shotsy, Milo, kstuebin, Jennylfa,  J.B.and all on this forum....May WW magic sparkles glisten on you all.

I WONDER HOW BRADD EVER MADE OUT. ALSO MICKYTIM HASN'T POSTED FOR A LONG TIME.
May you find peace

Shea

[Starbucks]

Hi All~
Wow! Thank you all so very, very much for your responses. I can't express how much hearing from you all helped me.
FRANCOISE~Thank you for sharing with me your tests experience. That is a real eye opener. Though I wouldn't wish this on anyone I feel better knowing it's not just "in my head" and that someone else experienced a similar situation.
CIN~To answer if the throat condition could be anxiety related, I'm 99% sure it is now. That's why I was relieved to read Francoise's post. Moreover, it simply seems to make sense that it MUST be anxiety related if when I take a dose of Xanax it goes away. Does this make sense to you all? Does it sound sane?
WITCHY WOMAN~Thank you for your interests in my disorder and that you know of some effective new therapies. I'm certainly open for any and all you know of so PLEASE let me know. I haven't had a full blown panic attack but have absolute horrible moments (hours) of anxiety. Sleep is almost non-existant. Just to name a couple. But, I understand my brain is "rewiring" so I guess under the circumstances I'm doing OK.
Thank you all!!! I feel like I've made new friends and look
forward to hearing from you again!
Love~
Star

[Starbucks]

Dear Witchy Woman~
After reading your letter I started to post my question to the doctor but I haven't a clue as to how! I can read English but still can't figure it out! Egads! Could you please advise me on the procedure? Thanks bushles.
Love~
Star

[Thomas]

I ran a search on Sentanyl and found nothing. However, since your son was apparently shooting Oxy's, what you have there could be a vial of Fentanyl. Fentanyl is by weight many times more powerful than heroin or morphine. It is a synthetic narcotic. Usually, when you hear about "designer heroin" killing addicts, they're talking about Fentanyl. VERY dangerous. If your son is shooting this stuff, the potential for overdose is quite high.

[skipper]

Thomas:

my hat is off to you Thomas! I missed this one completely! I spent an hour before work plugging into all the search engines on my computer  there. finally went to the on-line reference of my university's college of pharmacy. got myself sidetracked in a fe intresting things, but nothing  about sentenyl. guess everything i consulted couldn't spot the obvious!

1021:

how are things going for you? i know you come here to seek ways to be supportive of your son's recovery, but what about you? i certainly hope you are doing something for yourself. codependants become every bit as isolated as the addicts they try to help. it    
makes no sense that both of you should ruin even one more day of
your life because your son isn't "ready for recovery."

keep an angel on your shoulder!
kip

[CASEY]

Thanks for the support. I think  Fentanyl is as close as I could find also but mostly anecdotal stuff. Your info was more helpful. Kip, I am actively involved in Alanon which has been a lifesaver. I am much more detached emotionally than I was even 3 months ago. I do like to keep informed though, so I know what i am dealing with. You guys are awesome. thanks.

[Frank Lee]

FranC, Shea, Thomas, WW, Stevemd  and EVERYONE ON THE BOARD

I have had the disappearing ghostpost syndrome half a dozen times in the past month. I am not sure whether it's a logistical housekeeping ploy or if our ol' buddy Doc. Steve is experiencing an anal moment (Klonopin, Doc and maybe a glass of wine watching a fall sunset - or heaven forbid a chill pill). I really do appreciate you doc, for this forum and I know you have to cover your ass, and please don’t threaten to take your sandbox elsewhere – we need this community. But why not let one of your interns/gnomes monitor the board and make some real contributions rather than the usual “get thee to a program” that you spew on Sunday nights.  

Without being grandiose, this can be done by a core of us who have marginal online skills. I simply don't have the time, now but I ain’t ruling it out and I suggest we keep in touch should Stevie ray pull the plug. To that motion I am willing to communicate with anyone at ***@****. And I would suggest that those of us who are regulars set up some sort of back channels should the good doc pull the plug. Thomas and Cindi and WW have all shared their email addresses.

Doc, if you are censoring based on sound medical judgment, I have no problem with that – you’re the man and this *is* your sand box. However, I’ve seen constructive posts regarding philosophies different than yours that turned into ghostposts. If you are censoring those, shame on you. You provide a valuable service but you ain't the only game in town.

Shea, I don't think you need anybody to go to the doctor with you - you showed true courage, hang in there and hope you are feeling better.

Thomas and WW - total relapse on my part. I approached the vista of a drug free state and freaked. I could site situational factors - am finishing a yearlong project with national implications - but in the end all is an excuse. Am reading The Thinking Person's Guide to Sobriety by Bert Pluymen and wondering if I am in there somewhere.

I need you folks.

Peace,

Flee

[Thomas]

whenever you want the straight story on a prescription drug, try:

www.rxlist.com

you can search by generic name, brand name, even by the imprint code on the pill. The information there is not dumbed down like most internet med info sites. Rather, it's the same info you'd find in the Physician's Desk Reference. Check it out sometime. I sincerely hope your son isn't shooting fentanyl. In saying Fentanyl is by weight many times more powerful than heroin, I somewhat understated the case. Fentanyl is by weight an order of magnitude more powerful than heroin or morphine. Fentanyl is used in the Duragesic patch for chronic pain and is quite effective. It's so potent that the dosage is measured in micrograms rather than milligrams. Hope this helps.

[Thomas]

I understand about relapses, believe me. In fact, most truly current writings on recovery characterize it as a serious of recoveries and relapses, with the long-range goal being to go longer between relapses and gradually lessen the severity or duration of the relapse. So don't get down on yourself. I also understand about trying to quit while facing mega-pressure in your life. I started a new job about the time I began trying to taper off of benzos. The first few months at this job were so stressful that I simply couldn't handle the job and quitting. I had to wait until my job stress decreased before I could even begin to taper.

It's funny about these disappearing posts. You'd think if anyone's posts would be deleted, they would be mine. Francoise commented on the same thing. I can't remember a post by Francoise that could be considered offensive or improper. Go figure.

As for recovery, there's no blueprint for accomplishing it. It's a long and winding road (apologies to the Beatles).

[Witchywoman]

Hi Frank,
Thanks for your suggestin to Doc Steve...I agree that I would hate to loose this community, and very much think we should all stay in touch in case this ever gets yanked from us.
My email is ***@****, anyone is welcome to use it at any time.

Frank, thanks for your honesty about the relapse.  My take on it is that you never have to treat relapse as failure. Relapse is part of the disease that we have, and it doesn't mean we have to loose site of recovery. What is recovery anyway? I don't buy a "one and only way" party line about recovery, I think we each know in our guts what recovery is for ourselves.  So...any way that I can support you Frank, while you keep going on the path to resolving the hold these substances have on you, I will do. Anything in my power...even if it is just to let you know that I admire you, care about you, and will never judge you, no matter what.

Besides, if I ever relapse, knowing that others here have gone through it and can bounce back gives me great relief.

I worry about it, 'cause of the pain. The back pain gets to where it is almost gone some days, but days like yesterday and today it is back in full force. I did take some valium last night, and it helped the pain a teeny bit, and at least let me sleep. Valium was never a drug of choice for me, it just makes me sleepy..I don't understand its recreational value, so I don't feel taking one was a relapse for me.

I need you Frank. Thanks for being you.

love,
WW

[Frank Lee]

Thanks much for your response - I really value your opinion. I am in a fix. If I tell my therapist and doc about the relapse they will not work with me or, will demand an in patient scenario. So, I am left with the option to lie or wait untill I've tapered back to the level I was at.I have a major project in November and a family reunion in December ( I know these are excuses but they are also situational realities).I can taper during these time but not stop. I am going to propose that I put all therapy on hold until January 1st. We'll see.

My overwhelming feeling is that of failure and lonliness - other than you folks on the board, I can't talk to anyone. The post earlier this week by Danielcc bothered me because he doesn't realize how meaninful this board is for so many of us who are at least trying.

WW I value your input and admire what you have done. My relapse was brough on by severe myofascial pain, probably stress related. Now I can't jog which of course was an aid in tapering. I know what it is like to live with pain and I admire your ability to do it. Once off these drugs I will research drug or at least opiate drug free medication and other alternatives.

As one whose been on valium for 12 years, I must say an occasional dose to sleep would appear valid to most pratcitioner's. You sure have come a long way. Thanks for being there, you and the rest of the board.

Frank

[Witchywoman]

Hi Frank,
sheesh that is a tough dileman! I think the approach you plan to take is a good one. I say, never give up, no matter what, and don't give them a chance to give up on you.

I guess I feel that anytime an addict gets into a contract with a therapist and doc, that we need to put in two things...a very clear "relapse prevention" work plan, and a "what to do if relapse does occur" plan, so that the addict does not feel they have to choose between dishonesty and continuing to get treatment.

It isn't fair to you to be medically abandoned just because you relapsed, and I think addiction specialists should be aware of that. Harumph. I want them to take good care of you!!!!

I am not doing so well dealing with the pain though Frank. Last week it was so low..I thought I was on my way to pain free life, but the past three or four days it has been very high again. Bleh. My stomache hurts from all the ibuprophen and I am TERRIFIED of taking hydro again. My husband thinks I'm nuts to not take it every once in a while when the pain gets really bad. He doesn't understand addiction. He still has the bottle and I asked him to hide it from me. I don't trust myself to be able to handle taking it. Am I being masochistic and foolish? I don't know. I'm afraid if I say yes, I am being masochistic, that I am just rationalizing a reason to use. And that if I do take it, boom..I'll be right back where I was. I don't want that. I really don't.

Anyone that may have words of wisdom for me on this..please speak up. I need support and help. I know I failed repeatedly when trying to take appropriately for pain before. I probably would again. It just seems safer to stay away. It does get tough when the mental cravings come at the same time as the pain gets high.  
Thank Goddess my depression is gone at least!

love,
WW

[jennyfla]

Hi girl!
The mental cravings and your physical pain must be terrible at times.
I wanted to say how proud I am that you keep finding the strength to stay clean.
Just some words of encouragement saying how proud I am of you!!!!
Just hold on to your feelings of 'feeling' again, and don't let some little white pill steal that away again.
It sucks on this side!
Lv Jenny

[Witchywoman]

Thanks Jenny,
I need the support..and it's really nice to get it from you.

I don't know about the strength part..to be honest, it is not strength that has kept me from going back into addiction, it has been fear. LOL  Isn't that a hoot? Fear keeps me clean.

I am praying for you Jenny, and sending you love and light. Please take notice with what Cindi said to you as well..how are YOU doing? I hope you are taking good care of yourself and being able to put your needs at the front.

love,

WW

[Wizard]

WW, I think you may be confusing masochistic and realistic. You know deep inside where you are at. Let's look at some realities here. Reality one: You were having very good days last week right? Didn't you also go back to work after a long lay off? Hmmmm....Being back into the mainstream after so long off can have a physical effect that may be catching up to you now. Just an idea, you know sitting for long periods now at the office???
You know my backround so I won't bore any of you with it again but I can tell you that after feeling really good with my back pain now, just this morning it has flared up to a very high level of pain that would have normally sent me to the hydro bottle. I like you am terrified of taking it again after being clean so long, so I will take my Motrin and deal with it as best I can....I'm no martyr or hero, but I know that I'm going to have good days and bad days. As long as I can keep focused and know in my heart that kicking the "Dragon" again is WORSE for ME that the pain I'm now experiencing then I'm going to try to "suck it up".
Reality two: I know that if the pain gets unbearable then I can make the choice as you can to take something stronger if the need arises. Like yourself, I have a bottle that has been locked away for a REAL emergency. Been locked up for six months. Just knowing it's there lets me fight the cravings in small increments till they pass. Kind of like my security blanket. You must have the strength to know the difference between REAL emergency and just the desire to use. NOT FOR EVERYBODY. Works for me.
Reality three: Your own advice......relapse whether for for legitimate reasons or not DOES NOT MEAN FAILURE...as long as you keep trying. Above ALL ELSE!!! All of us! We are here always to lean on each other. I have found that at any given time SOMEBODY is on the forum to reach out to.
WW, you "know" the "TRUTH" within you. Follow it down the path with the heart. The Light of freedom is before you as is all of our LOVE.
Thank you for the Magick sparkles :-)
Power & Magick 2 U,
Love Wiz

[jennyfla]

Thank you sweetie!
The Wiz comes through again, his words are wise and straight from his beautiful heart!
I hope that your pain grows less and less so that your inner battle becomes easier and easier for you!
It's very hard, and I really do think you are an amazing women!
Fear is good because the power of addiction is definately something to fear and respect!
I wish you all the best, always!
Lv Jenny

[Frank Lee]

First, Franciose - thanks for your kind post. You seem to be taking care of everyone and I wish the best for you. You are a great addition this board. I gave you nothing you didn't have. I just wish you could get 20mgs. a day instead of 10mgs - we know that's like a lite beer compared to a shot of vodka. You deserve to be pain free.

WW and Thomas re: my relapse. Well, it's a new day and I have some new thoughts. They are long and rambling so skip this one if you bore easily. WW,

Thanks for you wise words. I will discuss a relapse plan with my therapist today. You and Thomas have given the sagacious input I needed. I appreciate Thomas’ metaphors – I think those of us who have a love affair with opiates and some writing skills really know how to turn warm and evocative phrases – the long and winding road is one. The difference between Thomas and me is that Thomas knows who he is and where he is going. I admire his outright honesty about using opiates. I still don’t know where I am going – totally drug free, occasional moderation – the specter I would love but it hasn’t been possible the last 5 years, or use only when in severe pain?  Everything I am reading now points to some sort of group. It is my opinion that most AA groups are cultism – good, effective cults, but cults. I may end up in a good cult, :-/.

WW, Regarding your pain. When I am clean yoga really helps. I have been practicing yoga daily for 3 years. Approaching 50 (agggghhh!!!) it seems simply necessary that one’s body maintain flexibility. I have the best physical therapist in my city, really, the neurosurgeons use him. He knows my twisted myofascial - racked, osteophytic and herniated spine and can tune me up simply by looking at me when I walk in the door. He does not know of my drug abuse. Then there are two books that really have helped. The first is PAIN FREE by Roger Escue – no matter what pain you are in if you follow the steps in this book usually with 48 hours you can get relief. These are mainly yoga based. The next book is a new one (I may have discussed this before on the board, sorry, opiate memory fog). It is called Grow Younger, Live Longer by Deepak Chopra. While I previously thought him a yuppie guru, once I read this book I became inspired. It is simply a beautiful book about detoxing emotionally and spiritually and physically. WW, you are the kind of gal who reads this stuff, try it, it will help. Next, like me, you work with doctors. Find one who will give you a script for flare-ups. I would suggest Norocos 10 mg 3- 4 times a day – a script of 30 should last one week. Or Tylenol #3 or #4s same count – they are just as effective for me but don’t produce the euphoria the hydros do. NO refills without an office visit and be up front about it. I think you can find a good doc. I don’t like the idea of our spouses doling out our medicine, although it may work for some.

Finally, your positive and selfless personality is going to make all the difference in the world. Everyday is a new day. I really want you too succeed. I feel like you are a friend. I want you to role model for me. Take a deep breath; we are all just little specks of spirit on a small planet in a large universe of many universes. Let’s do our life work today and keep our eyes on the prize. I will keep you in my thoughts today.

Take care all,

Frankie Lee

[Witchywoman]

Hi guys,
Tnanks for the kind, insprirational words and advice. I need them.

Frank, I used to do a lot of yoga, stretching, and pilates, in addition to my three times a  week bellydance class and weekly performance.  Thing is...I am not allowed, per my Doc and my Physical Therapist, to do anything at all that flexes my spine forward or backward, or twists or rotates the torso.  Up till my surgery, I used pain meds to break through the discomfort and kept up my workouts and dance very regularly.  So, maybe in December, when my Doc says dance is safe again, i can go back to yoga as well, but for now...I can't do it without risking blowing the surgery.

So now I am still doing my PT excercises and modified Pilates, with home equipment. Yesterday I joined a gym and had my first orientation...surprisingly, my body fat ratio was only 17%. I've always been lean and toned, due to my dance, but figured I'd lost some of that in the 5 months of not dancing or working out. I can do eliptical cardio machines, and some upper body weight machines, and ab work so long as my torso is stabilized.
It did seem to help my pain though.

As far as using any opiates for pain...that is playing with fire for me. I know I don't have it in me to not chase a high with them, at least not yet. I am just an addict, and that first warm fuzzy would likely send me looking for more.  So...I also hear Tai Chi is an excellent option for someone in my position, so I'll look into that.  If the pain doesn't subside, or gets worse I will reconsider..I am not a martry, but I'm TERRIFIED of going back into the hell of addiction just as I'm getting my life back.

I'll also look into the books you recommend..thank you!

lots of love,
WW

[skipper]

Wizard??!!:
welcome back! i truly mean this from the bottom of my dried up
junky heart! just got back from a unpleasent but necessary trip to
visit my parents. anyway, it really warmed up my old heart to see
a post from you on this old forum!
keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[Wizard]

Kip my friend, so nice to hear from you! I have truly missed reading your words of wit for sure! I hope all is well with you this fine weekend. Although I have been away from the board you and the other "Angels" have never left my thoughts, heart and as you say "shoulder".  I seem to recall that your "parent" situation from before had been a trying ordeal for you in the past, so I pray that things have either gotten better or shall get better for you now. If you ever want to talk or whatever I believe you have my personal e-mail address. The line is always open to you as you know. Keep on Keeping on my man!
Power & Magick 2 U,
Wiz

[cindi]

Just now have started to feel human,,,funny thing  I slept about 14 hours last night,,woke up and felt about 80% better,,went to jenn's soccer game  (they kicked butt 5-1)  went on a hayride to the pumpkin patch and felt like **** again..but all i can do is sleep..i took a couple vicodin and they had such a negative effect on me, they made me feel more comfortable as far as the back pain etc. but i felt totally opposite of how usually feel when i take them i noticed that with other pain meds when i am sick they make me so tired...my glands are still swollen etc. and i am ready for bed again..God I hope i don't have mono..doug got laid off again  the steel industry sucks but,,there is a good side to it...we can get this house finished and sell it quicker now that he has more time to work on it..and then off to florida...during the time i was sick when i finally got online and opend my mail I was amazed to see how much i had received..alot of it from you guys here on the forum..just wanting to see how I felt (ummmmmmmmmm  I don't recall a get well greeting from DANNY BOY)  LOL  i am trying to read and get caught up on things i have missed so I will simply say this..I can't respond to each post..God Bless you all and I hope things work out for each and everyone..  Jenny follow you heart..and thank you all for just being great wonderful caring people.. and one more thing.....I did get a cell phone,,so i get 350 free minutes a month and 2000 free minutes after 8 pm and on weekends,,,so start sending your numbers  LOL  this will be a blast....love you all I'm off to bed again     love cin

[jule1]

Iwas thinking about you alot on Friday and then saw your post I am so happy to see that you check on us.  I really miss you but totally appreciate your devotion to your family they are so blessed to have you.  Well here is a little peace and majick to you.  Jules

[Wizard]

Hi dear friend! Thanks for thinking of me! I really missed you too.....Thanks for the peace and Magick you bring to my thoughts!
Power & Magick 2 U always,
Wiz

[jule1]

Hi I am not sure if you will get this or not but this is something that has been in my thoughts for a while and I thought I would ask the Wise Wiz for your opinion.  I know in 12 step programs you are supposed to make peace with those you may have hurt along the way.  I am so close to being clean without using a 12 step program but my qestion is this I have taken pills from family and friends without them knowing and do you think in order to be freed or forgiven I need to confess?  Actually writing this makes it seem like a stupid question it seems like I should confess.  I don't know what do you think?  You always give answers without making one feel stupid.  Take care and many blessings to you and your family.  Jules

[Wizard]

Good morning Jules,
I'm going to answer this from MY point of view so it's going to be MY opinion and it doesn't neccessarily mean I'm right but here is how I see it. First ask yourself a couple of questions. Do the people involved even know that you are in recovery or have even been using? If they do not know that you have been using and are in recovery then what purpose would confessing to them serve other than relieving your guilt and possibly hurting a now intact relationship? On the other hand, if they know about you and what you did then an apology might be in order. I will probably get some disagreement on my opinion and that is okay but the way I see it is this, you only need FORGIVENESS from YOURSELF and your HIGHER POWER. Your Higher Power in my opinion has already forgiven you because you are already asking for it or you wouldn't have even posed the question to me. YOU need to forgive yourself and LOVE yourself and the rest will follow. I became clean without a formal 12 step program of sorts. It worked FOR ME. What I did to relieve the guilt I had was to be TRUTHFUL with myself and my wife who didn't have a clue about the extent of my use. We addicts can sometimes be very clever as you know. There was no need to add to the initial hurt and shock how much money I cleverly went through. It would not have accomplished anything positive at that time. If she would have asked me I would have told her. There was no need. I received her support and her love and that helped me through my recovery. What I'm trying to say is don't try to fix something that is not broke. Again, just my opinion. LOVE yourself and continue on your path to the Light. By your new ACTIONS will come the love an acceptance of your TRUE friends and family. Make peace with yourself and be TRUE to your own heart. Trust me when I say YOU ARE FORGIVEN.
For those of you who dissagree with my method, I say, I in no way think it is the ONLY way. I try to be a seeker of knowledge and would welcome the chance to read other opinions.
Jules my friend may God bless and keep you as you walk down your path to freedom.
Power & Magick 2 U always,
Wiz  

[jennyfla]

You asked the right person Julie!!!
Wize words from a wize and wonderful person!!!
I agree 100%!!!
:)
Lv Jenny

[Wizard]

Howdy Jenny! Glad to see you in such good spirits. I was wondering if you came up with a decision on that job offer? I've been hoping things would work out for your situation. You have a great evening my friend and Peace and Happiness to you and your husband.
Power & Magick 2 U,
Wiz

[jule1]

Wiz - Thank you so much for your wonderful and timely response.  I kept thinking of that Seinfeld episode where the alcholic friend keeps pissing George off because he didn't apoligize for saying his head was big or something like that anyway that is truly one of the reasons I know about the asking for forgivness step in the 12 steps pretty pathetic I get my wisdom from Seinfeld HA HA!!  I feel pretty much the way you do but you put it into words so eloquently.  Your line about true friends hit home I don't know if you read about my best friend issue but its been a huge hard thing for me I am basically breaking up with a friend I have had for many years.  It is still not resolved and breaks my heart.  The libra in me wants to avoid it all, run to her and say its ok because that is what I have always done. She has walked on me a lot anyway any more advice on the friend issue would be appreciated as you are the Wise Wiz (or should I say cheese wiz).  OK I am going to bed to curl up with my book and hopefully have wonderful dreams.  Goodnight my good friend!!!    I feel honored to call you my friend  Peace and happy dreams to you:)

[Shea]

Wiz,

I have been posting on this forum for about 3 months. Was a lurker (damn that word sounds nasty, like "Chester the molester" or something. Anyhow, I was a spectator before I became a participant. Thank God I joined in. the people on this forum are terrific. I wish they were my neighbors, coworkers, sisters and brothers. As they have  shown more compassion and understanding and offered more beneficial advice then the above mentioned.

Anyhow, before you started posting again (recently) I would see some of the old-timers make comments and refer to you from time to time. Always in a very positive and loving way. I have been reading your posts since you returned and I can see why. but I have to comment on the post you sent to jbear about Forgiveness and whether she should confess etc. I have to say your reply and experience (regarding not telling you wife how much money you spent since she didn't ask) really hit home. your post was of great benefit to me also. I agree, if it is not broken don't try to fix it. Your reply to her was so uplifting and I am sure it eased a hugh burden off her. As I know it did me. Thank you.

May you find peace

Shea

[Wizard]

To you both I must say THANK YOU for your replies back to me. Both of you ended your posts with an offering of Peace to me. To that I say I have received it. Not only in my everyday life as a clean addict, but also knowing that if only one word of my sometimes rambling here helps ease the pain and suffering of a fellow brother or sister, then I know that maybe I have made a difference. And if I can make a difference in the world then so can everyone. So many here have made a difference in my life just as you two have done. Bless you both and may the Light of Freedom be closer to you for it. I'm off to work now but know that you will be in my heart and thoughts today.
Power & Magick 2 U,
Peace & Light 2 U 2,
Wiz

[susanlea]

I have missed you so dearly my friend.  I have posted some comments to you the last couple of days, but funny like Francios they seem to disapear.  I have wanted to talk with you my Magic Man.....love Susan

[Wizard]

Susan my dear, dear friend! I'm so glad to hear from you. I don't know what's up with the missing posts but it seems from reading the others that it has been an on going problem. How are you? I hope all has been well in your life. As you can see I just took a peak and got hooked again. I just can't seem to stay away from this special place! I've only got a minute here tonight but I'll try to write you more tommorrow. do you still have my e-mail address? If so drop me a line there so I know I get it. May God bless and keep you this fine evening my friend.
Power & Magick 2 U,
Love Wiz

[jule1]

Hello my friend I just read the post to The big Chesse Wiz and I was wondering if you had put yourself into the same situation as I had and did you wonder about the steps towards healing as I did?  I was always a medicine cabinet looker and somehow could always justify taking a few pills here and there if they were  there and since I have come to this site I had wondered about how I was going to reach peace with myself about this.  His response was truly how I felt he just put it into words that I needed to hear.  I just love how easy it is to be so brutuly honest here and not be judged my anyone.  How is everything with you.  Are you taking care of yourself and being kind to yourself?  I hope so and I am here as your friend if you ever need me I love to be needed.  Have a happy day and many happy and silly thoughts.  Julie  (Actually it is 12:30 est past my bedtime and yours I hope so good wishes for tomorrow)  HUGS

[Shea]

jbear,

I think Wiz put it in perfect words. Yes, I was a cabinet looker also. I know this is one of the basic ways addicts "seek and destroy." But I think it is a riot to hear some of the ways and stories addicts use to get their drugs. The funny thing is when I started going to a multitude of Drs. to get my drugs I really thought I was so cleaver. Like no other addict had thought of this. I would always tell the doctors I did a mail in so I could get 3 month supply at a time. then i would say I needed another script for a local till my mail in came. And I would make sure they wrote it for either #20, so I could add a one in front of it to make it #120 or for #30 so I could change the 3 to and 8 and add a 1 so it was #180. Asking for 20 or 30 to hold me over till the mail in came was never a problem for a doctor to do. Geesh, Dr, Steve will probably kick me out of the forum for writing that. LOL Anyhow, I don't think it is nessacarily to come clean with these people. First of all, it could instill mistrust in them towards you that is not nessacary. And second I believe the guilt and shame we have caused ourselves and experienced is punishment enough. No need to make it worse. the idea is it is time to heal. Not to further the damage. and I believe that is what you would be doing if you told these people.  Now, I am saying this if the people are UNAWARE that you took the pills. If they are AWARE then you should consider apologizing, that way they know you realize you are taking responsibility for what you have done. I guess that is where the saying comes from that Wiz used "If it isn't broken don't fix it." I would suggest that if they Don't know but you have a need to confess go to confession. Confess to us. confess to someone that isn't going to judge you or mistrust you in the future. As I said this is a time for healing. And if you bring it up and people aren't aware of it then that adds more **** to your plate. And I am sure our plates are full of enough **** already. And yes, taking a few here and there or many is something addicts can ALWAYS justify. **** this is probably the LEAST of our evils we have committed.

May you find peace

Shea

[skipper]

people:
gee i fell like a real scum, i used to break into drug stores
(or poision shops as jim fogle called them). personel, house hold
medicine...there was never enough to bother. after using street
drugs a couple years with just the right people to learn a few
simple things...a good skam like adding numbers to an Rx...it was
like an on going fantasy..land of pills and injectables...it was
as addictive as the drugs themselves....even though at on level i
new i couldn't continue to win at this game i was powerless to
stop...about the time i thoght at another level "i'm too good to
get caught,"i did...and even that wasn't as bad as i always
thought it would be!
ah well the good old days...i don't know how or why i got thru
when so many of my contemporarys didn't...some in prison, but
most just dead. today i go over and over that 20 years of my life
and it's like a horror movie i can't shut off...to this day, not
a night goes by with out me remembering someone who died, who
should be alive instead of me.
i lucked out with my first sponcer...he too is dead, but i still
hear him tell me to love myself..

need all the angels of the forum, so i can live down what i've done!
kip

[skipper]

hey that last post...maybe i need someone to throw a net over me!
i apologise. i can't expect anyone to forgive me, thats my job!
it's my job even if it eats me alive.

hey Cindy and Dr. Steve: if i have been inappropriate or out of
line...i'm sorry. all i can say is just walk in some one's shoes
before you pass judgement,,,,i've been to hell, and i'm on my way
back...have either one of you, if not then i'ld beter move along
'cause i haven't anymore use for you than you have form me!
needin all the help i can get!
kip F. drug addict

PS to Cindy and Dr Steve: my E-mail is ***@****
e-mail me if you have a problem with what i say!

[jennyfla]

Well i'm glad you love yourself, because we all love you here very much too!!!
You are a very good person, I hear it over and over in the words you speak, so i don't give a rat's ass what you did in your previous life, it's what you are all about TODAY!!!!
We all need you here too!!!
Lv Jenny  --- aka, drug addict!  (working on loving myself too)

[CheeLim]

Please dont take Xanax in Asian country... You will never face up after you QUIT XanaX.

CL. (Seven years with XanaX / Even worst after Quit it) ***@****

[CheeLim]

Is The Humans we need to face for our Come Back after Xanax. Please help.... Thanks... Alone and still Fighting..................

CL.