Can'r get to sleep without pills

I can't sleep if I don't take something to put me to sleep. I try and try every night to sleep withiut taking anything ang lay awake until all hours of the early morning. Tonight is no exception - can't sleep and waiting and waiting to get tired and nothing so I take an ambien. AGAIN I am so tired of having to take something to get me to sleep. Last night it was an xanax, night before it was lunesta. I am on a flippin merrygoround of pills to get me to sleep. It has to stop.I don't know how. Anyone out there know how to stop this and be able to sleep withouttaking a pill to put you out. this has been going on too long, since last september.

[LettinGo]

I don;t think I can do this much longer. I want it to end.

[sadinmichigan]

I am so sorry..I wish i had some advice,,i do know what being sick of things are..have you detoxed off of something prior to this non-sleeping issue? That will usually cause pretty bad insomnia..is this something that has gone on for a long time?

[soreadytodetox]

i can relate to lisa i have been clean 3 weeks monday, and i still have sleeping issues, im up all night and sleep about 2 hrs during the day! its a good thing im on layoff from my job to detox of of the perc's(snorting) i dont sleep, and i still crave,and stillhave alot of anxiety.i stop on thing and it causes something else? crazy, crazy, crazy.  hope you find out what is causing you to lose sleep. take care    sherri

[gustaria]

I am dealing with the exact same situation. I am of heavy narcs for 25 days. I think I am OK that way; just have the ambien thing still going on. I am fixed to start studying this issue tonight, but I started taking/breaking the ambien into smaller peices to wean off. I don't sleep great, but I get some sleep. I think that if we can not find the right subsitute we might have to suffer sleepless for a while. I THINK that the reason we can not sleep is due to the dependancy of the ambien. So weaning or cold turkey for I don't know how long (I am going to find out). I am awake now and was going to post amost exactly what you did. No I am going to do some searchs

[worried878]

I guess trying some natural sleep inducers may help...but i know it would be nice to not to have to take anything....i saw a sleep med at the health store that looked interesting by irwin naturals....followed with a .com and all one word...i am not one that has this problem but i do know many that do

[LettinGo]

Finally got to sleep around 4 AM and managed about 3.5 hours. Then had to get up to feed pets. Thank you guys for answering, I had just about had it last night. I am addicted to sleeping medications and xanax. I get terrible anxiety attacks which is why the dr prescribed the xanax. I have never taken as much as he prescribed which is .50 up to 3 times a day. The max i have taken is 2 pills (.50mg each) at one time. I know this may sound like not much to some but I know I am addicted and cannot wait until the night I allow myself to take it. All the other nights I will either take ambien or lunesta or even benedryl and hope they put me to sleep.

I know taking these things every night is not good for me. I thought rotating them would stop me from becoming addicted - now I think I am just addicted to them all.

Does anyone know how to stop this vicious circle?   Thanks

[enemy48]

Hi there,

Well I haven't slept in 18 years and still counting.

I've just learned to either live like a zombie because I'm brain dead and exhausted from insomnia, or take meds and have a life.

I did the sleep study thing, hypnosis, diets, etc.  I'm just one of the unlucky ones.  So I deal with it by taking meds, but alternating, such as OTC some nights, then maybe xanix, back to OTC, then valium or ambiem, etc.  But I always cut the prescribed meds in 1/2.  I don't do whole, unless half hasn't worked for me.

I don't use melatonin b/c it doesn't work for me.

I feel your frustration.  

What I don't know is why did you start the meds in the first place.  Did you develop insomnia all of a sudden, or is it from detox, or something else in your life.

Mine started at the death of my brother.  I didn't have a problem falling asleep, but I would wake up and cry a lot for him.  That turned into a habit of being awake in the night.  It's still with me 18 years later.  

Best Wishes.

[justlikeyou]

im over a year clean and still not sleeping right, i saw a psychiatrist and a drug called 'seroquel' allows me to sleep well, im trying to quit the seroquel now but if i dont take a tiny  amount i sleep very poorly.

but it is getting better very slowly.

[Victor322]

Your situation is almost identical to mine except that the sleep issue has been ongoing since my first clean day  of 5/22/08. If I don't take something I wont sleep and the anxiety will also  drive me up the wall, but when I do take a sleep aid(s) i feel tired and foggy the next day, plus anxiety still does appear in the night but not as bad.

I've read on this board that with tons of exercise through-out the day and a hot shower before bedtime that it could help tremendously but for what-ever reason (habit?)

Anyway, please post anything you might find of potential help if you can, thanks!

[JDRMinSD]

Hi-
A couple of things...I had a TERRIBLE time sleeping coming off all the narcs + benzos (valium, ambien, etc).  I just hit the wall and had HAD it and stopped it all.  Obviously not the easiest way to go and so for weeks and weeks I didn't sleep.  It drove me insane!  Then I just one day figured I'd give my body time to adjust (I've read on here it can take 90 days) so, off everything, I just stayed awake longer, woke up at the same time each day to get to work.  Was tired all the time...exercised and used the aminos on the protocol on this site that talk about anxiety and sleep as well as melatonin.  I switched from narcs and benzos to aminos, minerals and melatonin.  Oh and exercise.  It took weeks (I was SO productive those weeks) then slowly my body adjusted and now I sleep 7-9 hours a night.  It's actually hard to get up again!  I almost set the alarm on Friday (still don't really need to do that).

Bottom line:  Aminos/calcium, magnesium/melatonin as described on here eventually worked, it just took a while.  In the meantime, I realized that my own anxiety about NOT sleeping was only making it worse, so I just changed my outlook and it worked.  

Good luck, I know how terrible it can feel but you can stop everything and still get to sleep (and it didn't take me but a couple of weeks, definintely not the full 90 days!)

[Victor322]

forgot to finish my thought...LOL

"but for what-ever reason (habit?) I haven't done that yet, yes I get exercise everyday but not enough to actually wear me out."

[JDRMinSD]

Here's the actual things I've been using with doses.  They've really helped me....I hope they help you too.

Natural Sleep Formula (adapted from the Amino Acid Protocl Page to the right)

1. Exercise!

2. L-glutamine--amino acid required for GABA production, a relaxing neurotransmitter of our brain.  Up to 1000 mgs at bedtime.

3. L-Thionine Complex (with GABA and Valerian root)--2 pills at bedtime (about 250mg of L-Thionine and GABA).  

4. Calcium 1,000mgs at bedtime Magnesium 1,000mgs at bedtime  nourishes the central nervous system and helps control tremors like RLS and other muscle spasms calms and relaxes the body, helps sleep.

5. Melatonin 10-12mg at bedtime.

I've also heard that L-Taurine can be helpful but I've never used it.  FYI.

[Victor322]

"Good luck, I know how terrible it can feel but you can stop everything and still get to sleep (and it didn't take me but a couple of weeks, definintely not the full 90 days!)"
-JDRMinSD
-----------
JDRMinSD, thanks for sharing your experience and knowledge!

It has motivated me to now begin the Klonopin tapering process down to at least where I was @ the pre-Tramadol detox day.

At the start of the Tramadol CT (after the extended taper) I had begun to increase the Klonopin intake to help offset the Tramadol wd effects but now that the physical withdrawal is pretty(?) much over (denial?) I am now going to do a quicker Klonopin taper back to pre 5/20 levels.

Stage 2 has begun.

A little anxiety hasn't killed me yet and like you had said, "my own anxiety about NOT sleeping was only making it worse" really struck Home for me!

Words as if read from a written history about me!!! Oy!

Since I am also out of Ambien I might as well just go for it!!! I'll just have to let my body adjust, I'm not going to drag this Klonopin taper out! It was intended to be a short-term booster and that's what it's going to become real quick! If I'm tired for the next week, so be it.

Will keep you all posted!
-Vic

[JDRMinSD]

definitely keep in touch...we're all here watchin out for you!

[kimmieb]

i hear ya,too.....haven't sleep well in 10 years (well, except for the 5 years i was on ativan every night for sleep....but i tapered off of that and have been off that for a few months now)....my sleep is good some nights, not so good on others....but i've found a product that, if i take it religiously like you're supposed to, DOES help me to sleep every night....it's from a program called "the road back" (a program to help with the issues of tapering off of benzos and such)....i use their Body Calm and Body Calm Supreme every day and night....if i take it as instructed, it definitely works for a good 7 hours of sleep every night....a friend on the forum from the u.k. who's currently tapering off of valium is now using the products and finding relief....something to check out if you're really needing something for sleep and want ONLY NATURAL and want OFF of the sleep meds merry go round....which i can totally relate to....cuz i tried everything and then some and was so sick and tired of that myself....

good luck to you!  if you find something that specifically works really well for you, please post and let us know....thanks!

blessings,
kim

[LettinGo]

I had no idea so many people have sleeping issues just like mine.

Why is it that we can't sleep? I have a lot of pain but never take pain meds because it doesn't treat the cause, only masks it and I have always been afraid of addiction. Now look at me. Addicted to the merry-go-round of sleep meds. I am sort of glad that I am down to my last 3 Lunesta. I will not refill it.

Tonight I am going to brave the sleep thing by hopefully reading a BORING book. Hopefully that will help. Tomorrow I am going to go and look for the aminos and things JDR recommended.



  

[untwisting]

Doc said that ambien can definitely result in some "rebound" sleepless nights if it's taken for an extended period (and of course for me pills always wind up being for an extended period). The herbal sleep aids help some & I have had to just stay in bed and flip and flop. I also find that I freak myself out - no pills, won't be able to sleep. So ... now I'm off to bed to flip and flop with the rest of you :)  Since there's so many of us up at all hours, maybe if we synchronize our flips we can change the earth's rotation.  Good luck and sweet dreams!

[NewLeaf]

So, the sincronised flip and flop. Maybe we should get it put on as an olympic event for this years games since there are so many of us out there doing it. HA

If we all flipped to the left instead of the right would we be able to change the course of human events and perhaps reverse the Bushe administration fauxpas?

[professionalwithdrawler]

Try remeron oral dissolve it not addictive and works great for me. I sleep like a baby. Just let it dissolve on your toungue  an hour or 2 before bed and i get a good 6 to 8 hours sleep without the fog the next day. It's classified as an anti depressant sleep aid

[NautyOne]

Melatonin......GNC sublingual ONLY !!  it really does work.  Not the drug store junk....I am the insomniac from hell and it worked for me.......but, it has to be that brand only !  I swear by it.

nauty...........

[studiogirl]

What about Valerian root? I recommended it to a friend of mine who was detoxing off alcohol and he said he it worked well.  It might be worht a try.  That and excericse and patience.  I sympathize -- nothing is worse than no sleep.  I am amazed by people on this forum that say they have went days, even weeks without sleep and been okay.  I cannot imagine that.

[GoingToMakeIt]

I too have had good results with Melatonin. I haven't tried Naughty's brand lol but I have found different brands don't work as well as the one I use, which is Natrol.

[Sandman1981]

It may sound dramatic maybe even drastic, but I quit taking sleeping pills cold turkey, my life depended on it. I was drinking on the weekend and wanted to stop but couldn't sleep so I popped sleeping pills with the beers until I would crash. Wake up again and do it again, I finally woke up around 4 am feeling horrible my mind was awake but my body was not type deal, I though I was close to dying, I did everything I could to stay awake, threw the pills away and I have been clean from sleeping pills for 2 years.

[worried878]

and buy good brands....gnc, solaray, etc,,,some are just junk...valerian root, gaba, 5htp, walmart passion flower, melatonin...not so well for me as it must have a long half life,   plenty of cal/mag at night..drink it with milk...cold temps in the house to lower metabolism and brisk exercise during the day/not at night...read/yoga or meditate at night...bundle up like an alskan and throw blankets off as needed...read a book that will put u at peace or that will take u away from ur worries and daily struggles...for me it has to be something wacky like serial killers or something..then i am too scared someone will break in verses worry about my co-worker and **** that goes on all day.  it works for me

[mm27]

I feel for you have only been in detox for 5-6 days now.  was taking 20-30 vicodin es per day and stopped cold turkey.  All the withdrawals are gone except sleep.  I have RLS any way on top of the stopping of the vicodin.  I have tried melatonin, some valeron (excuse my spelling) root that smells like someones *** who hasent wiped after about a dozen craps.  I take klonopin for the RLS that I have had for years and here I am another night can not sleep.  The withdrawal from the vicodin was far easier than the sleep issue.  My brain is dead tired cant even think straight but as soon as I lay down my legs begin to twitch.  I lay down for about 2 hours then get up watch tv walk around.  then get on my laptop.   then try and lay down again.  normally about 4-5 am i fall asleep only to hear my alarm go off at 6:45 to get up for an 11 hour work day.  6 days a week.  Dont know how long this takes to go away but if anything I will go crazy before long.   Sorry I am not telling you any information to really help your situation but just had to vent as well.  good luck and if anything works for you please let me know.

[livia1881]

Good leads on natural and potientally helpful things to help with falling asleep. I am going to GNC this weekend.....Do you take all of these at once?

I appreciate the information.

[livia1881]

Ooooh, thought of another question. Are these all GNC brands and if not what brands do you use?

[umustbdreaming]

what helped me was valerian root extract (2) 500 mgs and night, but more importantly as bad as i felt during the day i ran or worked vigorously around the house until i was physically exhausted and my legs were sore. lol As funny as that sounds i was so tired and run down, i had no choice to crash hard without any rx sleep aids all through my wd process.  I felt like **** doing all the running but at that point all i could look forward to was sleep lol....

[Astray]

I'm taking Valarian to help sleep too, plus doing as much exercise as I can put up with but I think whatever we do we all know we are still going to have a lot of trouble sleeping during withdrawal.

As I understand it to avoid going completely bonkers we only really need one proper delta/REM sleep cycle, which can take as little a 45 minutes. So my approach over the last two weeks has been accept I'm not going to get much sleep and only go to bed when I feel theres some realistic chance of it happening. Instead I've found ways to keep my mind occupied, mainly by playing the strategy game Civilisation on my PC but whatever works I guess...

Its just my personal view but for me at least the worst thing I can do is lie awake in bed, it just reinforces the anxiety making the whole process harder.