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Dealing with the pain and loss of dignity associated with addiction
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Dealing with the pain and loss of dignity associated with addiction

I hope that I don't offend anyone with this posting.  That isn't my intention.  I just feel that this story is worth sharing.  And, I do also have a question that directly relates to addiction.  

I myself am not an addict.  I lurk and read your posts; it helps me to understand.  I feel that I know you.

For several years, I was in a relationship with a gentleman who became addicted to opiates (oxy). He didn't have pain but was just abusing drugs.  We were very much in love and at one time engaged to be married.  He was a successful professional and to outsiders appeared to have the perfect life.  But inside, he was always struggling.  He fought the addiction.  He went through treatment several times and tried attending both AA and NA.  Eventually I had to end our relationship because I could no longer deal with the "craziness"... but I never stopped loving him.  He took a leave of absence from work and spent last summer on a big bender (we worked together).  That ended with getting arrested at a drug house and sent to treatment.  After that he came back to work.  He was clean from drugs (I think) but heavily abusing alcohol.  His work suffered A LOT.  He bleached his hair and let his physical appearance go.  He got several DUIs.  

On March 3, he didn't show up for work.  His manager and another co-worker went to his house to check on him and found him in his bed.  He'd shot himself in the head.  I went to the hospital and sat with him until he died later that day.  

This disease kills.  Now those left behind suffer.  Please don't allow it to take more lives.  -J
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Thank you for your compasionate response.  I can honestly say that I don't blame myself for what happened.  All I ever did was love him.  I know other's who judged and said or did things that they now regret and can never take back.  I've been attending 12-step programs for myself for a few years now and learned that I could love him and still hate the drugs.  There were times when he said terribly unkind things and tried to blame me and others for his pain, but I know that was the addiction talking.

It scares me that I see the same behaviours in the posts of some of the "regulars" here.  I feel that a part of this disease is the tendency to blame others for your feelings rather than taking responsibilty for your own happiness.  I know that the addict I loved often allowed things that I considered inconsequencial (even the rather offensive things that I've seen posted here) to affect him in a SEVERE way.  It just isn't worth it... life is short enough as-is.  Why waste any of the precious time obsessing over something someone else says, does, or feels that you have no control over.  Why not slow down and see the beauty in the world around us?  Just appreciate the little things.  Life hurts a lot less when you let go of the pain.  I often watched him self-medicate to try to escape reality.  

Oh well...  I'll get off my soapbox now.  I wish you all the best.
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I hope I'm doing the right thing in sharing a few beliefs that I have.  I've had them throughout my entire life...and I pray that I don't offend anyone...but, after reading Zoe1's message, I feel compelled to write it down...hoping to share some GOOD and POSSITIVE aspects of being an addict (hard to believe there actually are any, right?).  I consider myself to be an 'Old Soul'.  I haven't been around that long, but have lead many lifetimes in this one already.  The belief I have is what I call..."The Toolbelt Of Life".

We are all born with a 'Toolbelt'.  It is empty, except for a couple of 'tools' that God gives us a birth...crying to let our parents know when we're unhappy and smiling to let our parents know when we're happy.  Besides that, there's not much in there.

As we go through life, we have the OPPORTUNITY to pick up 'tools' along the way and place them in our 'toolbelt'.  Good times bring the easy tools and we willingly and happily grab up those tools and proudly put them in our toolbelt.  We pull them out when we want to share an uplifting story or event that happened to us.  As important as those 'tools' are...they are not the most useful when it comes to helping others...and it seems that there are so many people in this world with toolbelts FULL of those types of tools...God Bless Them for such a simple, uncomplicated life.  However, I've found that many of those people have absolutely no compassion or even tolorence for those of us who have chosen (or simply found ourselves on) a different path.

The bad or difficult times in our lives are another story and the 'tools' from these experiences are worth more than all the gold in the world.  However, with that said, it seems that there are a lot of people out there that have gone through wicked-aweful times, yet they don't have these tools in their toolbelts, either. What they went through hurt them so much that when they did come out on the other end of it, they actually resented having had the experience or the pain was just too overwhelming that they couldn't even LOOK at the tool, let alone CLAIM IT and put it in their toolbelt.  Instead, they made the choice to ignore it or simply toss it to the side...feeling ashamed or ignorant for ever getting themselves into the situation in the first place.  BUT ... These are the most useful, powerful and life-changing tools that one can possess!

Where am I going with this?  Well, look at what all of us have gone through.  For some of us it has been hell...for others the hell is upon us at this very moment...and for even others the hell awaits us, nawing at our very core, afraid that the pills will run out, or we'll die before we get ahold of this damn addiction.  BUT ALAS!  This is the only truly POSSITIVE thing that we can take with us from this whole ordeal.  Because of this,  our compassion for others is so strong that we feel completely compelled to reach out to someone else who is going through their own hell and say "I know"..."I've been there"..."It WILL be ok, just trust me and let me help".  OUR TOOLBELTS ARE FULL!

So as to not take up any more space here...I'll just close in saying that...We have SO MANY TOOLS in our toolbelts that can truly help others!  THANK GOD for the wonderful people here and for the way that they have taken this 'tool' borne out of dispair and depression, anxiety and pain, and have chosen to put it in their 'toolbelt' for the good of mankind, rather than hiding their past pain and ignoring the benefits that can be had through them!  

Zoe1, you now have a new 'tool' as well.  You have been through hurt and pain and loss of a loved one.  Be sure to take that tool and place it in your toolbelt.  You will be able to help so many others who are right now walking in the shoes you wore down that perverbial path of loving an addict.

Just the musings of a tormented soul....

Peace and in One service,
Nana

ps.  Hope I didn't offend anyone...it was NOT my intent.
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Yes.. you're absolutely right about the toolbelt.  And about the goodness in the hearts of addicts.  I truly feel blessed and thankful for the years I was able to share with the addict I loved.  He was a wonderful, and extremely caring human being.   As a result of what I've seen and experienced, I am MUCH more spiritual and feel that I can now live a fuller life.  I want to be someone he'd be proud of... something good must come from this.
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You're truly amazing.  I love you.  Thank you for sharing your experience with us...and always...be gentle with yourself.

Nana
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Zoe,
Thank you so much for sharing with us.  It really made me cry.  You are a wonderful and special person and you do have so much to offer.  He was so blessed to have you.
Thank you again and you will be added to my prayer list.
Take care,
Sandy

Nana,
You are also a very special person.   Your post was so uplifting and you are absolutely right.  I would not trade anything for what I have been through, because I would not be the person I am today.  When you go through really bad and dark times and you come out of it,  you can really see how beautiful life can be.  I made up my mind last night to start volunteering and give back what I have been blessed with. I am so glad you got things straighened out with your doctor.  I will be thinking of you.
Take care,
Sandy   Good luck to all of us!
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I am not trying to beat this in the ground but I need some help. I hear that Bup. is addictive, What do you guys think a safe time frame to use to get over the w/d. All docs are differant. I just want to be educated so I don't get my butt in trouble with a new addiction. Has any one used this before? I read the thread before this one but that individual only used it a couple of days and someone suggested longer, If ANYONE has heard of info or used it before PLEASE respond. I used Hydro 20 a day.
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First off, this is my first time posting here.  When I try to start a new thread it says that the site can only have "x" amount of new topics a day because of lack of manpower.  So I apologize for breaking in on this thread...

My question is rather strange.  Regardless of my path here, I'm here.  But the reason for my addiction hasn't been addressed on any thread, so maybe you can give me some insight.  I'm terrified of dreaming.  Not so much bad dreams, just dreams in general.  I found out a long time ago that if I took vicoden, then I didn't dream (or acknowledge the dream.  And typical, the longer I took it, the more I needed.  I'm up to 20 a day, chased with 3-4 Unisom sleeping pills.

I've tried Valium and other benzo's, and I still dream.  Not sure how to break this cycle.  I know I want to quit (who doesn't), but then I DON'T want to quit because the hell of taking medication is not worse than the hell of dreaming.  Yes, I'm working with a doc on the mental aspect (why I'm afraid), and while I hope for long term results, it doesn't help with the short term.  So I keep medicating.

I feel like I'm in a Nightmare on Elm Street movie.

What is it about Vicoden specifically that keeps you from dreaming/ acknowledging dreams, but still feeling rested?

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Your story was so real to me. I have been where he was, believe me. I had the tools to die also and almost chose that way but I stopped because some of us have the ability to stop and change the direction we travel. Everyone should know that you can change this thing we suffer from. Addiction isnt a death sentence unless you let it happen. Zoe1, I hope you know that all of us arent 'just' using, My using is because of my Chronic Pain comdition but yes I am an addict. I could just be a loser and die in a dope house like he did bascially and it is a scareyass thing to think about but thank you for posting and sharing this with us, maybe someone will see this and rethink their own lives, thank God I did 8 months ago because I would have joined him. Great story!
                   Bmac
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I'm glad that you were able to change the direction of your life for the better.  I would never take it upon myself to judge you or anyone else for what they put into their own body.  For whatever reason.  I'm just one little person who struggles to get myself up in the morning and live my own life.  

It is terribly difficult to watch someone who can't do that self-destruct.  I prefer not to think of my former fiance as a "loser".... rather, I see him as a very ill person.  He just couldn't find a way out.  

BUT, I think it is important to clarify what I think of as his "illness".  He often said things like "you would never leave me if I had cancer -- why leave me if I use?".  I don't see choosing to abuse drugs in the same way as I see cancer.  Rather, I see it as an illness similar to a compulsion to run a car into a tree.  The 1st time he did it, I pulled him out and nursed him to health (risking my own safety).. I did the same the 2nd time but with reservations... the 3rd time, I left him to pull himself out (I didn't want to be burned again)... finally, he continued to run into the tree and was unable to pull himself out.  

In open NA meetings that I attended (yes, even non-addicts are welcomed in the *open* meetings here -- I truly love some of those guys), I often heard that you either quit abusing drugs or you end up in jail, institution, or dead.  Its scary but true.

The same goes for everyone.. either we take responsibility for our own actions or we don't.  Either we live life to the fullest or we don't.  Either we allow others to pull us down, or we don't.  Its simple concept -- but harder to really live.
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WOW! this is one heavy forum today! I guess I will share as well, that is how we learn about eachother right? I use to be suicidal as well. Actually, 4 yrs ago, I tried to kill myself! This was the time I was on herion, methadone,pot, alcohol, just everything! I tried and tried to stop but couldn't. I pulled over on the side of the road (I can't believe I'm sharing this) anyway I figured my family would be better off because yes, they would be sad for a while, but they would get over it and It would be less painful in the long run because they wouldn't have to worry anymore! I figured I ought to pray before I kill myself just in case right? So I said "God please just take me, put me out of my misery! Please hurry and end my suffering!" He did. Just not the way I thought. I got arrested after putting way too many drugs into my system. My being arrested saved my life and was the best thing that ever happened to me. I decided to surrender my will to God because I gave up! I couldn't do it!I got to know my Lord,to whome I owed my life. I got off everything! I got to see so many miracles in my life if was exciting and almost scarry in a good way! I knew he was there! Is there! I got my family back, a great career, schooling, my health, and most of all my self! He showed me I'm not a piece of garbage that should be thrown into the garbage! I am a proud strengthened christian and proof that Jesus is a savior!

I don't always do everything right! I still get my self into stupied situations like taking these tramadol foolishly when I knew I should have put them down (and I could have)! But he is still here for me. I am glad I have my faith to comfort me because I today am afraid to kill myself because of it. I'm not quite ready to meet him yet!   KimH
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I am so proud of you and with as much faith as you have you will make it through those awful little white "demons". Keep posting!  Thank you for sharing!
Take care,
Sandy
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Hi everyone. Haven't posted for a while, but, I will tell a story that even I should have thought about before starting taking perscription narcotics for pain relief at age 40.  When my best friend who was 30, we were the same age and went to H.S. together, was missing for a week, they found her by the river in her car, she had put a gun in her mouth and killed herself.  A few years later I visited the state we were from and where she had still lived until her death.  I went to see her mom.  My friend, worked for a while in a emergency room in the small town.  She was divorced from her first husband and had 3 little girls by him  She married an intern at the hospital.  He go her addicted to drugs.  Left her.  She went back home to her mom, couldn't get off the drugs, left a suicide note and took her own life. Although I hadn't seen her for a few years, I just didn't get it.  I never knew her to even drink.  So I should have been smart, since my pain I have had since age 23, but, man when they gave me vicoden and the pain went away and I had more confidence and energy, I started using more and more.  But, I have never done any illegally.  I get my meds from my doc, but, I am ready to going back to being me  I go through withdrawal every month as I run out a week early, and I know that wll kill me eventually.  Plus, no matter what or who I am, I want to really be me again.  I may have to take anxiety meds off and on, because I think that is one of my major problems.  But, boy, they are addictive too.  I can't stop all right now, because of my job and preparing for a big summer, so as soon as summer is over, no more painkillers, or maybe 10 a month for severe, severe pain. I am going todo this.  For me!!!  And for all those who love me.  I have heard so may horror stories lately , that life without painkillers has to be better.  I will deal with my pain some other way,more exercise or whatever it takes.  I will pray for you,me and everyone who wants a better life off drugs, legal or not legal.  An addict is an addict.  I love you all
Sugarbeens
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Anyone in this forum believe in karma?What you do comes back to you kind of thing?When you're on the pills and you reduce your standard of living, spend all your money on pills, lose your job and all that you can expect bad karma for making bad decisions. When you try to quit the pills and get your life together when does the bad karma go and the good karma come. Sorry,just feeling a little sorry for myself. Im having a bit of bad luck but Im trying so hard to do everything right.Had to get it off my chest. Thanks for letting me babble,Doner
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Doner, That is what I love about this site! It's ok to be discouraged, because when you are, someone else will encourage you and when someone else is discouraged, maybe you will be able to encourage them and pull them through! Everyone has good and bad days, so when we share, that may be the encouragement you need to hear and vise versa! I am PUMPED I can tell you that! I have no idea why, well I normaly should be feeling WD's and moping right now but I just never wanted anything more in my life right now than to be clean! I know I'm gonna do this! I gotta do this NOW! YESTURDAY! I have been prayin and it must be workin cause can you believe, the last 2 days I have taken 2 less than I needed to in my taper! I don't even care, bring on the pain, I'll take more to get this done faster! I have NEVER wanted anything more than to be done with this so I can get on to encouraging others to do this to! Who wants to beat this thing? Who wants to join me? We gotta be tough and take some pain but we can do it! Sandee, I couldn't do this without my faith and I am praying for us all! KimH

By the way, I got laid off today! But I got an interview tomorrow and another on tuesday! Not gonna bring me down!
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Happy to hear you are so determined because thats what it takes to beat this thing.I too want to taper doses faster than I should just so I can be done with it. Good luck and thanks for reminding me Im not the only one with problems.Yours,Doner
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Just don't talk to me when I have PMS! LOL KimH
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Glad to see you back and posting again!I was wondering where you went to!?!I wish you all the luck in the world you can do it girl!!!Love to ya..Jerri
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Wow, a thread that hasn't reached the maximum comments allowed, so I shall post a miniature post (yeah, right). ;)

I'm taking bup, and really decreasing my dosages drastically.  I honestly want to be off of ALL of this **** as soon as possible.  I had the most horrific stomach flu last Sunday (started at 7:00 a.m.) and is still somewhat there, although I don't know whether it's from the withdrawals or the remnants of the flu.  I've been really, really nauseous and have been trying to keep an open mind.  I'm running this mantra through my head over and over and over...."I'm not in this for short term gratification that will lead to long term consequences, I'm in this for the long haul that will eventually lead me out of the open door on the other side of a life filled with joy, as I once experienced it."  So I'm going to stifle the short term pleasure (it really doesn't seem so pleasurable after taking the Norco's for 2 years now - I've become a recluse, a hermit, a redundancy (ha) and a withdrawn angry person - this is NOT me.  I need to realize this, and I won't unless I'm off of this ****.  I've said this TIME and again, but I have to to do this NOW, because the longer I wait, the longer and harder it's going to be to come off of these pills.  The only reason I'm writing this is because I was once a lurker (and still am) and I know that others out there are and need to know that people here do care about you A LOT and understand what you're going through.

I had a true moment of clarity this weekend while I was so sick I couldn't keep anything down.  Since I'm on benzo's, this didn't work out so well so I had some strange goings-on and I KNEW deep down that (and I read this here just recently!) karma, or whatever you want to call it will follow you.  Every time I get a script, I get a big dose of bad karma.  Every time I do the right thing, I get rewarded by seeing my family happy and I see that my world shifts into a better place - things start looking up.  I feel like I'm constantly living with a dark cloud over my head when I take those pills, when I don't, I can see that silver lining (so much for the short post - I don't do those, though).  Yeppers, I've said that I've had enough of this **** way too many times to count (I've been on this forum for a year so this song with my tiny violin has been played too many times), but I know that I can't keep on doing this to myself ANYMORE.  I was thinking the other day (because of my clearer head) about the time my Mom took me to a wonderful little cafe when we lived in NC - it was all cherry wood inside and made THE BEST hamburgers and milkshakes.  I was only 10, but I remember it well.  I had lots of good childhood memories, but I just had such a joy inside of me - that pureness of heart that only comes from an un-altered state, and of course being a kid - but I did get those joys without these pills, and all too soon you forget what life's about when you take them.  I'm looking forward to reading a book, traveling, putting that money away for my kids that I formerly spent for drugs.  I know there's a long road ahead, but I'm taking it day by day, hour by hour if I have to.  I have no choice at this point.  I've already cut my benzo dosage in more than half, and am on a small amount of bup.  I'm not going through this again.  I just wanted to thank ALL of you guys (you know who you are - there are so many that I've talked with who are incredibly special people) who have been so instrumental in helping me.  It's not an overnight occurrance that you can combat, it may sometimes take YEARS (2 years in my case - this is TAKING those pills, not coming off of them), but this volleyball game is ending NOW.  I know my posts lately have been so self-involved, and I apologize for that, I just don't know quite what to say to others when I'm going through what I've been through these last 2 weeks.  

My mom has also just been diagnosed with possible colon cancer after having a stroke, which my Mom-in-Law just passed from last year about this time (colon cancer), so it's been really rough, although I know some of you are going through very hard times yourselves as well.  But there are so many positives when you feel like you're giving yourself and your family the best 'YOU' you can give them - can't change the current path, only can change how you react to it.  That's my goal now.  Take care, all. (my apologies for taking up too much bandwidth)
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Kia ora, I just found this forum tonight. I'm on about day three of w/d and feeling damned low and alone in the world.I'm addicted to Morphine, Heroin and Methadone. My problem is that i am a secretive addict, so the only people who know i am using are my drug buddies.  I have a new partner of about 6 weeks.I injected in front of him on our first date because i thought it was better to be straight up and then he could leave then and there if he wanted. I must say he wasn't very comfortable with it, but for some reason he stuck around! He has no idea that i'm in w/d because he thought that i had cleaned up . i did, for about ten days, then stupidly turned back and went in for more.  He has no understanding of opiate addiction, thinking that when i cleaned up about 5 weeks ago, that i was cured or something. He didn't even acknowledge the hugeness of this for me. (I managed to clean up for about 6 weeks last year, but then as soon as i had just one taste, it was all back on.) So anyway, as is expected,all the emotional stuff i had been supressing for the last ten years began to rear it's ugly head again once i was clean. I couldn't deal with it alone and so one night after ringing up Drug and alcohol counsellors begging for help,("sorry we might be able to see you next week. We'll give you a call") i decided just to get wasted instead of face my emotions.Since then,i have been using nearly everyday. I hate that i am not being honest with my man, but he said in the beginning that he wasn't going to stick around if i was using. Originally he was a great reason for me to give it all up, but it wasn't as easy as that.( if only!) My last boyfriend left me and stated that my 'insincere and half hearted voicing of wanting to give up' was painful to watch. that made me feel like a right idiot. I don't want to lose another partner due to my addiction, but i am coming to realise that i can't do this on my own, I need fellow addicts to talk to. My privacy about being an addict, " a dirty junkie" is a big deal to me. NZ is a small place and i have a career to protect, so i am glad i found you guys. NA is not an option for me. Neither is residential treatment, slthough i sometimes wish i could go there. I'm really struggling here.  i live in shame and fear of being found out. Sometimes i envy my other friends who can outwardly admit " I'm a jumkie!" Cos they are then able to access more support than i can. I suffer in silence and feel like one big fraud most of the time because of it. I also am quite a spiritual person, and am having this problem with karma too. I have it in my head that if i use then nothing will go right, and if i don't use, then it will all get better. One of the resons i relapsed last year is that life just DIDN'T get better by not using. In fact. it was harder. Obviously this way of thinking isn't right is it! oh well, that's all i have to say.
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Kim- You have a GREAT outlook and attitude when it comes to "Life".......... I'm glad you posted what you did-- You probably helped more people than you realize.

Some of you "Old-timers" may get a kick out of this article I stumbled upon tonight:

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=638&ncid=762&e=1&u=/nm/20030618/en_nm/people_hunter_dc
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just like when we plant somthing it takes a season to grow.
a season is 3 months.
so when we say we reap what we sow, we have to be realistic
about how long it takes for things to come to frutation.
as addicts we are addicted to instant gratification.
we want thing s to happen yestersday.
things take time , patients is a virture.
patients is faith.
recaprocity -we reap what we sow is a principle,
if you plant corn you get corn, if you plant goodness you get goodness.
this topic started about derpression, something we all have
experence with, we learn not to pay to much attention to our feelings, because as addicts they always in the end tell us to kill our selves.
when we put down the drugs it takes months before we get past
depression, in the 1st few weeks it can be severe.
things like l-tyrosine help a lot, along with 5htp.
and some of us need meds like prosac or paxil.

as we stay clean things do get better, we just have to
folllow those who have gone before us and let them be our example.

peace!!!!!hippy
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Maybe if you are struggling with your addiction now would be the time to take it slow with a relationship.  You should be really selfish right now and not be concerned about what others think.  If you are serious about wanting to quit then do what it is going to take.  Honesty is always the best policy and and deserve someone who accepts you for who you are.  If you lie and cover up then it is you that loses in the end.  Six weeks is not a long time and I really think that taking it slow and more importantly taking care of yourself and being honest is most important.  Do not sell yourself short, and sell yourself out.  Goodluck!  Pammy
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Hello!Most of you probally don't remember me but I've posted a few times.This time is different.Ok,I have been addicted to oxy's for 2 years now and I've tried desperatly to get off but never had much success.About 3 weeks ago I started getting the strangest feeling,like something was about to change.So me and my husband went to see an addictionologist and told him everything.He gave us clonidine and phenobarbital.I was like comatose that day, after I took this,I have a 5 year old to take care of so needless to say I could'nt cont' this.So back on pills I went (200-250mgs.aday)Then june 13 my world fell apart.My mother found out EVERYTHING!(I'M ONLY 22)She came over to my house took my daughter and refused to give her back untill I could pass a drug test.I was screwed!!So,I decided it was time to quit so I bought 3 and a half methadone wafers and took 1 every 24 hrs and I had no wd's and now it's been 5 days clean from everything but I feel so down.I don't know how to act.I feel like I'm learning to live all over agian.How do I get through this?I feel like I don't have anything to look forward to.I'm bored.Any advice or just someone to talk to would be great.My email address is ***@**** so long-Tobie
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My advice although I am still on meds hang on it gets better.  Find some outpatient group for support, and maybe see a doc about a depression med.  Also Make yourself exercise and do stuff.  You are in the time when the depression is bad and you starting to think why did I get clean so that I can be depressed all of the time? In no time you will be better but really it takes as long as it takes.  Sounds like your mother in a harsh way really showed you how much she loves and cares about you and your family by giving out some tough love.  I bet it was a hard thing for her to do but she did it because she loves you.  Best of luck to you and I hope it all comes out ok.  I think if you stay the course it will!  Peace Pammy
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I agree with Pammy. Your mother wants you to get better. Wouln't you want your daughter to be well.  Tough love is hard on a parent.  Remember, when your depression is so bad that is when you are on your way.  I know it is hard to remember when you feel so bad, but you will get better, I promise.  I got so depressed I really wanted to end it all and I thought of ways to do it, but I knew in my heart I would not. It was a hard 4 1/2 months, but it was so worth it.  Hang in there and I will be thinking of you.  Keep posting!
Take care,
Sandy
I kept reading this post every day and it really kept me going. Every day even though I was not posting, because I felt too bad to type, I would read something that would give me inspiration. So, keep reading.
Thanks to everyone.
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I was glad to read your post.I feel the exact same way.But this is like the 3rd time I've detoxed off oxy's and that feeling will past.Me and one of my friends were talking today and she said you know before the pills you were the 1st one in the club and the last one to leave and now I don't even go to the store for cigarrettes.I feel like I have no personality and I don't know if I even want one,hell yes I do.See I'm just as confused as you.But hell,I go through this so much you'd think I liked it.Remember this it helps me a lot:IT DOES'NT MATTER IF YOU WIN THE FIGHT AS LONG AS YOU WIN THE WAR!!    email me if you wanna whine together sometimes it helps and I been doin'a lotta whining lately.                     Tobie  (***@****)
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No new questions allowed today. I have one. I have to assume that most of the people on this forum have kids. I do 6&8.When you are having one of those bad days, how do some of you handle your kids. Mine are pretty good,compared to some Ive seen. They are just very busy and I know it is my job to entertain them,but on one of my bad days I wish they would just watch a little tv.Do the rest of you fight off the bad days and ride bikes and go to arcades with your kids? I never let them know Im sick(dont want to scare them)but sometimes tell them I just need a nap and they freak like it's supposed to be a three ring circus around here 24/7. Its summer vacation shouldnt they want to go out and play instead of sitting inside playing with mom. Just wondering how you other moms/dads deal with stuff like this? Doner
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By the way I was wondering if anyone knows if there's a difference between methadone and methadose. They keep changing the label on my b/f script and the pills look different almost everytime.Do they do the same thing and have the same effectivness? Thanks,Doner
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My kids are 6 and 9. I've really used them as my inspiration this last month.  I've looked through old photo albums ad remembered what it was like when there were no drugs around.  It does sound as though you have it much tougher than I do, if you are home all day with them during the summer as their entertainment.  Thats got to be tough for any parent day in and day out.  Hang in there!
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To the many people that suffer, have suffered, or will suffer from an opiate addiction...I write this now to let you all know
that I am going thru withdrawls for the 3rd or 4th time in my life. In july of 99, I was struck by a vehicle that pulled right out  in front of me. I was driving to a fourth of july party in my freshly waxed 71 Chevy Nova SS. One the accident happened my foot was in a lot of pain, but I kinda shrugged that off and was wprried about my car. The hospital sent me home
with some medicine for the pain Tylenol w/codeine. No big Deal, I was 24 at the time and never even took pills for a headache nevermind this addictive stuff. So, as the pain continued I went to an Ortho-Surgeun who without care, prescribed my Vicoden, then up to vicodin es. I guess I was probably taking 7-9of those a day.I remember one night wondering why I was so talkiitive and excited about everything, because I always took 1 pill just sleep thru the night, eventually I figured out that it was he medicine and, that night I became an addict. It seems to always come back though, I recently pulled a tendon in my arm at work and they prescribed me vicoden. I know..I know, I should have said something, but I didn't. I took the pills ad used em all and the hunt was on for more. I had a person suplying me with morphine pils, he is now in jail for selling drugs. I don't want to end up like that and i don't think any of you do either. It soes seem like forever, in fact I feel so week and crappy that all I wanted to do is get to the computer and tell my story. Thanks for readig, and believe me, the sooner you stop the better. Last summer I was clean and I never felt better. Now I ave lost wirght, have constant shakes when I try to sleep, nothing I enjoy doing works as my concentration sucks.....Well good luck to us all and God Bless..take care of your body's it's the only thimg you truly own and have power over..bye 4 now
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I have to share this! I am in a college cert. program for family child care and have been rethinking my career. I know some people who have their own and had to get into it because they couldn't afford childcare for their own kids. They are having hard times with this and I'm seeing it is not all I thought it was. I don't have small children at home, and do I really want to turn my home into a daycare? I prayed about it last night and went to a job interview today. I started telling the woman what I had for courses and she said "why don't you go to center for life long learning to get credit for your 7 yrs experience?" I am an associate level teacher and she began to tell me how I can get the most for my courses to be able to use them for family child care, or center based, or preschool, ect. It turned into a long talk about my future. She took so much care and concern into helping me! She told me she only hires people who have much more education, but to come back wednesday, she is going to find somewhere to put me! wannabclean, I am glad to be an encouragement, you are very much an encouragement to me too!
Doner, if the kids want to stay in the house, try putting out construction paper, glue, paint, child scissors, markers, crayons, and I don't know if you have any creation books, but if not they are cheep. Kids will play for hours with this stuff. They may make a mess, but it dosen't take long to clean. Then stick them in the tub with cups of shaving cream mixed with food coloring, small containere, empty water filled spray bottles. The yogurt containers with the plastic spoon are good, they can pretend they are shaving, and is another activity they won't get board of too fast.                 Kim
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Email me at ***@**** if you are thinking about going back to school.  I am a fiancial aid counselor at a medical school and I know a lot about how to get cash for school.  GO FOR IT!  Now if I could only get MrMichael to come to my school and do the Pharm D program?  Pammy
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Hey sweet lady!  I need to talk to you sometime about returning to school, funding, etc.  No hurry!  I am interested in this field of Addiction Medicine.
Love,
Suzie
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I was reading the post and could'nt help but read that you know how to get more money to go to school.I am in sonography school and I'm about to have to quit because i can't hardly afford it anymore,I get a grant but it does'nt cover all of it.email me brandy6347@aol
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Anytime Babe!  Pammy
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Hi,
This is for Zoe 1--wow what a depressing story.
I am so very sorry for you and really empathise with you.  My boyfriend of 1 1/2 years is on oxy's and cannot stay away from them, he just uses them for entertainment, not pain....I travel out of town on business alot and always have this dread fear of coming home to something as awful as you had to face.  It really becomes an unmanageable crazy world doesn't it.  I am not sure how you were finally strong enough to let go, I really admire you for that, but I am certain that it did not help to ease your pain in losing him. How are you doing now?  I am glad to hear you do not blame yourself in anyway...it's just so difficult to understand why they cannot see how terrific life is and how much better it can be without the drugs, I'm just am thankful and pray that I never have to know it from their side.
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Hi...  I know that my story is sad.  I lost someone that I loved and that hurt.  But it isn't all bad.  I was able to have a long relationship with a wonderful person and for that I'm grateful.  He wasn't abusing drugs when we met (neither of us even knew what oxy meant).  The first time he went through treatment, I went to family week and was introduced to 12-step programs, specifically Al-Anon.  For me, that has changed my life.  I have been able to apply the 12 steps to my own life and slowly, slowly change my own life.  

Don't get me wrong.. it wasn't easy.  Toward the end of his life, watching him self-destruct was *very* hard on me.  During that time, I went to extra meetings and also saw a counselor.  I finally realized that I had to be responsible for myself.  No matter what he did, my happiness was/is up to me.  

The week before he killed himself, a peaceful feeling came over me... I just sortof realized that we were never going to be us -- that although I loved him, it was over.  (I'd broken up with him months before that, but this was different).. so, I told someone who I knew I could trust that if he were to ask me out, I'd go.   I went on a date with a different man in the 1st time in over 6 years -- nothing wild, just a movie.  Then the day before he shot himself, my ex-fiance called me.  For some reason, I just let him talk and listened without judging.  He was obviously drunk or high or both and wasn't making a whole lot of sense, but I still just listened.. no point in nagging.  He told me about some crazy plan he had and I just said that it sounded like a good idea and that I was proud of him.  

That was the last time I talked with him.  

I believe that everything that happened to me throughout that time was my higher power guiding me.  Without Al-Anon, I never would have let go enough to let things happen as they did.  Of and by myself, I probably would have told my ex that I knew he was drunk and lectured him.  Then I would have regretted it forever.  That goodness that I had turned that control over!  

I can honestly say that I just loved him..  as he was.  That doesn't mean that I would have subjected myself to life with an active addict;  I wouldn't/couldn't have done that.  I also love myself.    

Well, I'm rambling on...  I know this is a forum for addicts and not really people like me.  If you want to talk more, kiki, let me know.
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God I feel so stupid for having so much self pity after I read everyone elses posts. At the top part of the thread there was alot of talk about depression.It helped to know Im not the only one going through it.Its really bad though.I scare myself.i am naturally a very strong person and tell anyone that doesn't like it to f*** off. Now coming off meds I feel like the smallest most useless person in the world.Is that normal? I only have one true longtime friend in the world and he told me today that I am not at all the person he knew before the pills. I feel weak and sorry for myself when really I did this to myself. I dont even have a right to whine.I rolled the dice ,time to pay the price.I guess my question is can little pills make you feel this crazy when you quit? I feel so little when I should be proud as hell for as far as I have come.So what do ya'll think?Can coming off pills make you think you've lost your mind.I dont even know where the real me is anymore. I used to be cool as hell. Now I am just a little whiner who cant decide if life is worth living.Can coming off this junk make someone feel like this or am I bound to this depression forever?To anyone who suffered from bad depression after quiting(some people dont)some input would be awesome?Thanks for your time,Doner
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Hey hippie,
You said, "just like when we plant somthing it takes a season to grow."
Um... were you referring to a good hemp crop?  Cause about every three months, it's time to harvest. :)
Just doin' my share to help "stick it to da man".
Peace,
Methman
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I just used bup for 7 days (actually I used it for 5 days previous took 60 hydro over 3days felt horrible Then used it for 7 days ending this Tuesday) Thanks to Kim and others @ this site I've made it so far today and Wednesday and feel damn good. We actually took our kids to a ballgame then a movie, it was about 11 when I went to be and sleept thru the entire night w/o sleep aids.  Thinking of what I did yesterday is giving me so much strength today! LKM if you need the site for Drs that RX bup.,so far I'd swear by it, but what I took was an inj and what the Drs RX is an oral but from reading the site it doesn't seem much different.  Kim- Thanks again for the positive thinking advice, it was really the support I guess I needed. I'm not really religious but I do believe in a "higher-power" and asked for help when I took those last pills and the next day I found this site and subsequently you, so hopefully someone's listening
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Yes, I can relate too.  I used to work full time - managed a nice home, 2 beautiful kids and a demanding career as an Analyst, and tonight, I was huddling in my bedroom with the lights off at 5:00 p.m. sobbing because of the intense depression (I'm weaning off of Norco and benzos).  I'm still taking a small amount of buprenorphine and lowering my Klonopin dosage ever 1-2 weeks, but it's hell.  I KNOW that it will be worth it for you and I both.  

About an hour or so after this 'episode' (my kids were at the pool), I got a call from our re-financing agent that our closing was approved and our mortgage is now almost $200 less per month than it was originally, plus we have an extra month that we don't have to pay.  I know that has nothing to do with withdrawals, but it made me feel a little better.  

The depression is really horrendous, but with time, you'll begin to feel like yourself again.  I can't believe that I'm going through it again, but I know this time I don't have a choice.  It's hard to put into words, but I have a very deep feeling that the choice has been made for me and there is no way I can ever go back to that way of living again.  It's from here onward, not backward.  Please just take it in daily increments, or even hour by hour.  Cry if you need to, scream into a pillow, have a positive outlet (exercise is good if you can manage), drink lots of water to flush your system.  Know that you're giving yourself the best gift you can, and that a certain amount of suffering is natural (Oh, so easy to say and so hard to go through).

I came here tonight (can't sleep again) because this depression is just overwhelming and read your post and just felt that commonality of what so many of us here go through and it's just so hard, but I have to keep reminding myself that it's just my body re-adjusting itself to normalcy, as your's is.  I have to remind myself that I cannot be in self-destruct mode anymore, and that after I'm clean I have to be REALLY aware of the dangers of relapse.  Take care and know that there are others out there that are going through this and can totally empathize with what you're going through.
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I wish you wouldn't say you don't belong here with us. You do. I wish my soon tobe exwife was on here telling you about my addiction and how she thinks I should handle that. I really would like the person that said she loved me to talk so freely about how she felt about addiction. All we did was fight and scream and now divorce. Your input is worth alot more here than you realize I think. I know I did not do a good job at replying to your original post and it sounded agrumentative. I didn't mean it like that. So stay and talk to us and tell us why we are ******* up,LOL Thanks  Bmac
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You have lots of ladies who you can talk to bout whatever you want that love and care for you unconditionally.  Pammy
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I have been on percocets for the last two-three years.. big time.. 10-20 a day.. fighting.. trying to stop.. tapering only to break and go back..

Life sucks.. but today is my first day.. pill free.. and I am not the least bit scared.. I have been through withdrawals before and they suck.. bad.. real bad.. but I have gotten to the point where I feel like I am losing myself.. losing my soul.. I have gotten to the point where I think if I can't be my own.. be myself.. I would feel better dead.. now bear in mind this is not a suicidal message.. but the exact opposite.. i am coming back to life.. i am going completely cold turkey.. no benzos.. no immodium.. no l-tyrosine.. not even hot baths.. i want to feel the pain.. the pain will let me know i am alive.. let me know that i used to deal with it.. the pain.. but for the last 2 years.. i have been hiding.. not anymore.. now i see the light.. now i want my life back.. now i want to stop lying.. and sneaking.. and pretending.. i want to feel.. i want to heal.. i want to be me..

i just wanted to share that with you.. i am the happiest person alive today.. the way i see it.. bring on the w/d's.. bring on the sleeplessness.. bring it on.. fear is my friend..


Pink Floyd

So, so you think you can tell
Heaven from Hell,
Blue skys from pain.
Can you tell a green field
From a cold steel rail?
A smile from a veil?
Do you think you can tell?

And did they get you to trade
Your heros for ghosts?
Hot ashes for trees?
Hot air for a cool breeze?
Cold comfort for change?
And did you exchange
A walk on part in the war
For a lead role in a cage?

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That is how I felt when I went c/t 19 days ago
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This has been interresting, I'd like to share how it is for me. I used just because I am an addict. No pain, no med explanation, Just seemed like a good idea at the time!I have learned that it is alot more devastating than I ever imagined! After a long long run with drugs (and i do mean just about everything you think of)I got sober 4 yrs. I had a med situation, my doctor gave me a perscription, and I got addicted to the non addictive drug ultram. I think someone who dosen't understand drug addiction would say,"Why didn't you just get off them? You know what you went through before, why would you want to do that again? Obviously, with rationalization, I wouldn't, but once that drug enters my system, and my brain chemestry changes, my rational goes out the window. Alot of people think drug addiction is a moral thing. Why on God's green earth would people "choose" to loose their house, family, career, self, life ect and "morally" to do it again to see how much more we could loose? Juat listening to haw hard everyone struggles to get off drugs spells it out. KimH
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I will keep you posted.. I don't know how much access I have to a computer after today.. I plan on staying outside for most of the w/d's.. last time I stayed inside the whole time and thought about how bad i felt.. not this time.. i want pain.. it will make me human.. and i want to be active.. it helps to take my mind off of my heart beating fast.. but honestly.. i dont feel bad.. and i know i wont.. its all in my mind.. everything is in my mind.. and my mind is made.. i am ready to experience whatever i need to.. to get myself back..

today is the first day of my life.. i am reborn..

one love.. thanks for the support..

i love you guys..

-true
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Hey True, I remember you posting a lit'l while back.

I came off a 20+++/day percocet habit of many years last August, after tapering.

I'm glad you have such determination, because that will definately help you get your life back!!!!

I understand wanting to feel the pain and all, but if you are going to use nothing, please keep yourself hydrated!!! I would still suggest some Immodium, but hey its your call.

I want to tell you, getting control of my life again(after so many years on percs), has given me a much better appreciation of life period.  It is sooooooo worth it.

Please keep posting, as you continue in your recovery(ie. share the hope)

percs
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Thanx Doll!
Unconditional?  I am a lucky man! Bill
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i could not have said that any better.....thank you...Jack
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Hi Zoe1
I know this thread is almost 10 yrs old (!) but I couldn't at least try to make contact with you after reading your terribly sad but inspirational story. I have been through something similar to you and identify so much with your story. It is very sad that the victims central to these stories are rarely given compassion and understanding and then their support people even less so. It is so tough being strong and loyal for someone you love who is hurting you out of fear. Just like the fearful dog who has been let down by humans... Ugly and vicious on the outside but really just scared and damaged on the inside. Still, so very hard to live with. If you happen to see this I would be so happy to make contact with you. Lily
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