Do I just have to suffer?

[Sanguinity]

Those of you who are in here who still have significant pain, please respond:

1)  Do you feel it's ok to take medications that you know you will become dependent/addicted to?

2)  Do you feel its ok to suffer?

I think the answer to first question should be yes and second should be no.  But now that I am off the hydrocodone, I don't want to take it ever again and I know that is totally unrealistic b/c I am in so much pain.  My daughter has activities with friends tonight and I am in so much pain I need a good cry before I can drive her to her friend's house.

[Marce4]

Thanks...it did answer everything....How do you feel about taper v methadone?  Is it hard to get off the methadone? I just have heard from several here that they are now addicted to methadone and it is just as bad, if not worse than w/d from opiates. Again, I would assume this is a drug that must be used under the strictest supervision.  Any drug can be abused I would think! I guess I am looking at this in much more simplistic terms than you as I do not have even close the the background that you do! I'ts very impressive! In simple terms would you recommend that someone should detox under the supervision of a dr?  I think some here are either not willing or unable to do this.What would you tell them to do in this case?  I probably should have started a new thread! If I don't get a response from you I will post again.

Thanks again for your wealth of information!!!!! I think my brain would be completely saturated!!!!!LOL
Marcie:)

[Marce4]

I think medications were made for a reason, so we don't have to suffer! I totally agree with you on that one.  Unfortunately, I am an addict and find the sufferring of addiction worse than my physical suffering. I have chronic back pain. Somedays it is tolerable with Motin and days like today it is not.  I've had a rough day today...bad pain (still nothing  like labor!!!!!) If I had a pain pill, honestly, I probably would have taken it!  I don't have any power over these pills! It sounds like you do....you have just built up a tolerance!  All I can say is be honest with yourself....if you are suffering and you feel you truly are not an addict, then you deserve to get some relief!  Or if you know someone you can trust to dispense the pills to you as needed, go that route. I wish you the best no matter what you have to do! Just stay strong!
Peace,
Marcie

[FLaddict]

dependant and addicted are differnet things with a fine line between the two. Only you can say you are an addict.  No one can say that for you. You may be someone with cronic pain that is dependant on meds.. that does not always make you an addict. An addict like myself starts out on meds for legitmate pain and then abuses said pills, steals pills, raids friends and families medicine cabinets,  runs out early on scripts, takes pills when not in pain.. So for your questions I think it depends on the person

[Sanguinity]

I agree difference there, I can absolutely say and its not denial that I am not an addict. I have never taken anything other than what was prescribed and never more than prescribed.  But, my body became dependent on the hydrocodone and I was taking them so long, they were not working well and dr. told me to take more and that made me itch, so I was in a place where either take more, or itch and it didn't make much sense to me.  I also don't like the dizzy feeling you get when you first take the hydro either, some people have referred to this as euphoric and to me it feels out of control, and I hate not being in control.  I know many of my posts today have not been as upbeat, but I am in pain and I think its delusional for me to think I can take something else/do something else except take the darn pills.  I loathe looking at the bottles and knowing my body is dependent on them or I will be out of control from w/d.  It has been so hard hiding the w/d from my spouse.  He doesn't know I stopped taking them, he only said "why are you limping today honey".  It's not fun to actually be sick, it doesn't feel fair either -- I know many of you inhere know exactly what I am talking about.  Pain bites, pills bite, worrying about it bites...still having to function w/ your family while all this is going on bites, too. For those who think, wow you are spazzing out -- well everyone has a right to from time to time that's how you keep good mental health. thank you everyone for letting me vent, now I will go have my good cry and have to shower and drive.

[Mindtraveller]

I will say this, in your mind take that dark image of pain that you see in your well lit room put it in a box and throw it outside. Continue to find that pain, box it and throw it out until it is all gone. You got to want it gone too. Along with it take any feelings of hydro, put that word in a box and throw it out to. Do it only after you breath for 10 mins. 7 secs of breath in and 8 secs out- that will give you 4 full breaths in a one min. Do this for ten mins to get relaxed, then breifly imagine boxing up hydro and pain and all negative things assiocaited with it and throw it out then see how you feel.

[oxysbliss]

I can sooo understand why you would question it so much, i really do..

I have been actively getting clean since Dec.....and I have worked very hard at it..I was a full blown oxy user.....sometimes I would shove 25 20s in one day.....in ONE DAY...lol I am so shocked over that...

Thats going on 4 months the end of April......I have changed the way I eat, I try and force myself to get exercise EVERY DAY....
I have a treadmill at home...so that is just awesome...I do a 20min light jog or a 7 klm walk...I live a VERY ACTIVE lifestyle yet Im not in the best health I do know that...I drink a heck of alot of water.....and alot of green teas.....
I take ALOT of hot baths with all sorts of things..I am on a iron, and calcium supplement and a multi vitamin, as well as one for stress....lol....

I eat alot of veggies and the meat i eat is Moose and Deer...its the only meat I can digest better than processed meat...I have alot of issues with different kinds of foods so I am careful..I eat alot of fibre and beans...all of thesee help my levels...

I have come to realize I cant function on no pills whatsoever.....I actively take 2 pills a day and somedays like today I dont take anythign at all.......
I take them for pain, I dont snort them, I dont share them, I yes buy them on the street but things are messed up with my doctor right now...but besides that..........I am quite comfortable not abusing them, however I need help too...

This has been my expereince and I have been actively taking pills again for about a week or so..something like that......I have only been recently open with it...

I hope this helps you to some degree, because if you CANT DO IT ALONE...Dont do it AT ALL....

Happy thoughts and prayers your way

C

[Mariyah2]

I am so sorry for your pain and I don't feel you should suffer. I don't know your story but if you are prescribed pills for pain, take them as directed. Hang in there!!!
God Bless,
Mariyah

[DutchessGolden]

Yes and Yes. Yea I kow I just disagreed with most of this forum but almost all pain medications are opiates. When pain gets to be severe and chronic Naproxen and Motrin have pretty much become not an option anymore. If you take them as directed it won't change the dependence that will develop but it will make a HUGE difference. Taking more than needed for long periods of time make your body become more and more tolerant to opiates and you will keep needeing more and more (not to get high) but just to be effective. I have found that pain doctors will not try to strip you of hydrocodone or a stronger prescription cold turkey, of course unless they really want to risk their medical license. It is torture in itself to ask yourself these questions. And you have all the reason in the world to ask them after going through the hell of withdrawal. Seeking alternatives to opiates has been very successful for many people, it also takes time and energy that often times you do not have. I have taken liquid hydrocodone for over 8 years. It usually takes less than a week to start feeling any type of witharawal when you don't take it. I expected some mild withdrawal when I didn't take it. However, I didn't withdrawal for the first time until 7 years later. Imagine my suprise. SInce then I made real sure that I had my prescriptions filled before fri. if i was running low. My body is dependant on hydrocodone. And like someone said earlier dependance is different than addiction. Clinically the difference in addiction is really just actions, addiction is when you will turn to criminal acts or whatever you have to to get the drug. I've always had an issue with the dependence/addiction defiition but anyway.....If I was in your position I would take my meds.!  My husband has had 6 surgeries between both knees, and had back surgery 2 months ago. He has always had prescription for vicodin, darvocet, ultram, and tylenol3's and he has never eperienced major withdrawal. He just stays on top of it. When he is in pain and needs medication he takes a half of darvocet, if the pain is worse he takes a full pill. He doesn't continue taking them every 4 or 6 hours, but instead he only takes another when he feels the pain again. That could be 4 hours, could be 8 hrs., cld. be 2 hours. He deals with the pain that he can, and takes medication for the pain that interferes with daily life. If he takes medication daily for a while like after his back surgery, he makes sure to taper the pills off as soon as the pain starts to lessen and become bearable. You definitely seem like the typw ofperson who would have no trouble doing that at all.  

[irishsiren]

You should really see another dr if he tells you to take more. Thats how addiction forms and it'll only get worse, trust me I live with chronic pain too.  Your body will get immune to the amount you take then you'll "need" more for the pain, then dr may tell you to try something stronger (i.e oxycontin) cuz its 12 hr time release...woo-hoo scrip dr's are great aren't they? Maybe the Fentanyl patch may work for you...it's still opiate but supposedly without the "high" for the way the low dose releases into your body. For 10 yrs I've dealt with pain...because of my addiction (and dependence) to pills I denied the actual things that now actually do work, like moderate excercise, yoga, physical therapy, water therapy, acupuncture, etc. I hope you are able to overcome this. It's so much easier to "cope" with everyday life like taking your daughter to her friends, by popping a pill. I used to think that i actually needed to take my oc to be normal and cope with everyday life. I wasted so many years of my life because of it. Take care, and Good Luck!

[Marce4]

Hi...with all due respect....I agree that pain meds have their place but I think while it may not be necessary to suffer with the pain, of someone is admittedly an addict, they cannot responsibly take these pain meds and may need to look for other options. You gave us the bee sting, irishsiren talks about acupuncture, yoga, exercise, meditation...many other ways to deal with this.  Taking more and more of a pain med means it is time to turn to something else if the body is not getting relief from the pain. Addiction brings just as much suffering as the actual pain.

I also know that someone else on the forum asked where the information comes from that says c/t from hydrocodone can kill you. I have never heard that; maybe if you are on a higher dose or if you are on benzo's which I do understand  can be very dangerous!  Isn't there a limit to how much a dr can prescribe to a pt. If they are continually exceeding this limit, would this not jeopardize their license?  I didn't realize that cutting someone off  if abuse is suspected could cause them to lose their license? I'm just very interested to learn how you have gotten your information! You would obviously know much more than I as this is your field. I just find a lot of this very surprising and a little unsettling!  

I'm not trying to be disrespectful, just trying to understand where you are coming form.

Peace,
Marcie:)

[DutchessGolden]

I don't feel that you are being dis respectful or combative at all for starters. A lot of what I have talked about are very little known facts. I have a double major nin biological psychology and biology. I have a masters in clinical psychology and pharmacology and I have a doctorate in clinical and biological psychology and pharmacology. So that is where I get my info. I have been studying and researching this hands on with real people in real eperiments for over 13 years. Aside from the books i indulge in whenever I get a free moment to bury myself in the medicine section at barnes and noble and i subscribe to just about every medical and psychological journal there is. I have been published in psychology today mag. a few times for my work in addiction, certain terminal diseases and their effects on the brain etc. It has long been thought that heroin withdrawal was the worst of them all. We now know this is not true. It has also long been known that opiate withdrawal can be fatal, but it is very very rare and usually only occurs in uhealthy people. For instance, my husband has over 100 patients he treats at a methadone clinic here. Over 98% of those patients are BOTH hepatitis C and HIV positive. Many more fatalities from opiate withdrawal are seen in this type of population.

As far as prescribing opiates, yes doctors can get into trouble if they are reported, for prescribing opiate medication in large amounts. This is very rare that a doctor loses his license over this, less than 1% of cases. Think about it, most pharmacists don't question the doctors prescription. I know a couple that have and the doctor got a phone call that was it. Not even a permanent letter in his file. Doctors are getting a certain amount of money for every prescription they write. And they are well aware that they are likely to lose a patients money if they do not continue to refill medications their patients want. On the flip side, once a benzo or opiate is prescribed that doctor becomes liable for that patient more so if the doctor stops prescribing the medication b/c a patient is much more likely to report a doctor who causes them pain and distress by cutting off a medication that caused them to withdrawal. A big stink is going to be made about someone having a stoke b/c of benzo withdrawal. Not so big of a stink is going to be made about a doctor prescribing more of this medication than he really should be. I personally know doctors who have prescribed 90-100 2mg ana bars to patients for years and then just cut off the script when they said they were becoming dependent. Many of these doctors get away with this b/c they know who they are dealing with, and too many people are unaware of the liability that doctors carry in withdrawal. There's a reason doctors pay out of the ass each year for mal practice insurance and for attorney's like my mother!

As for Sanguinity, her first post as I understood it was that her medication was effective she just wasnt aware of the withdrawal that would take place if she didn't take the medication. I can't imagine what it would be like for withdrawal to hit you like that having no idea what's happening to you. 5mg of hydrocodone......and the withdrawal landed her in the hospital. Maybe some of what I said was more misunderstood than anything else. Either that or I misunderstood Sanguinity's post. I apologize if I did. What I basically wanted to say was what I said in the section about how my husband takes his meds. I hope that answers your questions, let me know xoxo- D.

[sosad5306]

Wow, I really feel for you.  No, you should not have to suffer. The best advice I can give is this: Take the meds ONLY AS PRESCRIBED.  Because if you really need them to achieve a good quality of life, you can't go wrong.  It is about balance.
Good luck!