Fioracet W/ codiene/ fioranal w/o coediene & darvocet

Okay. here goes.  new here! hi-ya. nobody knows of any of this, and I feel so all alone. I'm your typical at-home mom who loves my husband and children more than anything on earth. I love God eternally, but I also have a deep solo-secret...

I don't have a lot of time, but I'm going to dish quick, so I can get an answer by the time I return home.
I started darvocet while pregnant, because I get mirgraines so severly and couldn't take imitrex while preggo. that was 5 years ago. On and off, I've had that refilled, since it does help, and doesn't have the nasty imitrex side effects that I get.  I then got pregnant soon after (our kids are 22 mo. apart) - on the same thing...

Once children and breast-feeding were done, I went back on Imitrex, treximet, maxalt, relpax, etc, all of wich my body chem. has taken to worse now to them, than before, giving me such bad side effects I'd rather suffer with the headaches... at any rate - I was prescribed the fioracet. both with and w/o coediene, with asprin at times, sometimes not. I come up with stories to switch, I have been doctor hopping (some docs are becomming aware of this, now)  I am an "on and off addict", I believe. right now, my finances and marriage is rather in shambles, my kids and my pills are really the only thing making me happy. I feel I neeeeeed them both.  I know I need my kids, but I know I DO NOT need these pills. I'm taking (at the moment) about 6-8 (every four hrs) pills a day the fioracet w/codiene. I don't know how to get off, and I AM RUNNING OUT AND MY INS. WON'T REFILL YET - TOO SOON....(I've been upping from my usual 4-6 to 6-8 to get through some rough days OR to really get rid of the headache, OR to prevent... however, my concern is...
I don't want to withdrawl (withdrawal).... I know it can be dangerous and my brothers best friend died from drug issues... at any rate.. I have both fioranal (without) codiend, with ASPRIN, not tylenol... as well as Darvocet in my "care" right now... can I keep taking them as a substitute right now?  I want off, but I don't know how to correctly "wean"  My next script will be my last, as it's my last refill, for 40 pills (of the fioracet w/codiene) - as soon as I can get it... but it's the last doc that doesn't "know" and there's no way around being DONE at this point.  
How can I quit?  Advice?
I canNOT tell my husband at this point, since our marriage is already rocky...really rocky.
I can't lean on my friends for fear of judgement and my parents, they have had to already deal with two extreme drug addictions with my brothers - I can't break their hearts too. What do I do? Help!!!!  
I should also mention that I have anxiety and ocd (fear of dying, mostly, fearing me to do many things and fear of cancer) - so I am supossed to be taking Prozac, 40 mg. daily, but I'm too afraid to mix it with anything else I take (pain-med-wise) that I haven't taken them much.... Husband is noticing my mood changes (probably from the pain meds)  -- I also have kolonapin (can I take that as a detox method?)  I need help and nowhere to go!

I stay at home, like I said and I'm very lonely, and don't have many friends. I'm a really hands-on mom who loves to be with and do things with my kids. we really do bake and do art, daily... but these pills have taken over, I need to watch the clock for my 4-hr mark, and I hate it!!!

Oops- this wasn't sort after all... thank you in advance,
Mom who should have never gotten to this point...
:( :( :( I'm really disapointed in myself. What started off as an "innocent" pill to help my horrid headaches (that I've had since I was 11) -- turned into a physical addiction and emotional crutch. :(

[vicki595]

Hi~   Whew!  Okay...First,you really need to share this with someone you trust.

Next,get rid of the the Fioricet with codeine. You can cold turkey from the codeine but NOT FROM THE FIORICET.  You need to taper the Fioricet slowly over time. You need to let your doctor know and seek his/her advice. Please don't say you can't because you can. This stuff will hurt you in the long run. Five years will turn into 20!!  You need help with this so please call your doctor.   You cannot stop this cold turkey!!!   Taper down the plain Fioricet with a doctors' help.

Those headaches are probably rebound headaches. The whole thing is self perpetuating.
Also,be careful with the Klonopin. Right now you're taking an opiate,a benzo,and a barbiturate.  The Klonopin needs to be tapered also.

Good luck~

Vicki

[mommyshouldntbehere]

hello there;

I forgot to clarify, that I don't take them all in one day. I stick with one. when I run out, I go to the next, etc.

I've been "on" for about 3 mo. solid, now... not 5 yrs.. on and off.. months here, months there...

also - my doc is not only a family doc, who sees my whole family - THE doc I trust, but also a family FRIEND. there's no way I can do that. not at all. can't talk to husband either- we are on the brink of divorce,that would just give him unnecessary fuel to the fire...trust me. and I have no friends I can trust... the only one i did... turned into a lust for my husband. :(

[vicki595]

Okay...  Can you just stick with the plain Fioricet?   You will feel some withdrawals from the codeine but it shouldn't be bad.  Just taper down over weeks. The thing is,Fioricet is a real bugger. If you taper down too quickly,you'll experience a lot of anxiety. If you stop abruptly,you run the risk of seizure.  I tapered off of a very large,daily dose of Fioricet that I had taken for many,many years. I spent 9 mos. tapering.  If I tell you I LOVED this drug it would be an understatement. But the time came and I had to do it. My life is sooo much better. I promise you.

You really should be under a doctors' care to get off this.  I understand your dilema but I have a suggestion: Find a doctor to help you. Be honest and explain everything. You'll be really surprised how kind they can be.  Also,your current MD is obligated to keep
all info private. He cannot say a word without violating federal law. So,think about it.

Keep posting~ I'll help as much as I can

Vicki

[mommyshouldntbehere]

thank you for your kindheartedness. that makes me feel less alone. I feel truly alone right now. My fear is what life will be like without them. like if I tell my doc that I am seeing, I will never be able to get it again, and that truly kind of frightens me.... I also LOVE the drug, and am also amazed at how quickly I have become both physically and mentally addicted.  How many a day were you taking?  Would the dose I am on, risk seizure? at the max/day?  that scares me that I've been doing that to myself.  Also, I was put on "topamax" which I have NOT STARTED yet, because, basically, I'm having too much fun on my own with my pain meds, to want to start to freak my system out.  I'm actually scared because of all the drama going on at home with my husband, and then you add in the money situation, if I start seeing doctors, he's going to be like "why are you going and spending copays" and I'm afraid he's getting suspiscious, which really could make him turn things to such a bad, bad formation at this time, if we do decide to split.  I'm held a prisoner in so many ways, and I hate it!! :(  so badly!!! so much!
I hate that I love it, but I do.... :(

[vicki595]

I know how you feel,believe me. And although I need to tell you to stop now,I can understand how it would be difficult given your current situation. Just see how it goes...
maybe you'll be able to see a doctor for cash when you have it. In the mean time,start
cutting back. It's a slow process anyway.

I took 20 plus a day at the height of the addiction. I built up to that dose over years and thought I could never live without it. I live quite nicely without it.

Yes,you can have a seizure at 8 a day if you stop abruptly so don't do that.  Another thing would be to speak with a pharmacist about a taper plan. They are a great resource. Explain you want to stop taking it and know you need to taper and they can help with that.  We can't give taper plans on the forum.

Do what you can to get with a doctor though. That's your best bet.   I do have to say that
you really need to want to do this.  It's difficult to taper and you need to be strong. You
can get a lot of support on the forum but you need to do the work.

Vicki

[avisg]

First of whether it has the codeine or not It would be in your best interest to come clean with your doctor . I think it would be beter to just do both at the same time but that it is really up to what the doctor thinks is best.yes there is a real risk of  seizure CTing off barbs.I will say for  me topmax was really helpful I hope it helps for you. There is another member that has tons of into on Fioricet .MYmay and vicki seem to know  alot about them ..I will you mymay link  http://www.medhelp.org/personal_pages/user/1135275?personal_page_id=865802 I will send  a copy of this post to mymay as  as well

[mommyshouldntbehere]

thank you vicki, really. thank you. from my heart!  
I just want my kids to have their mom back, and if I'm going to officially leave my husband, I will need to do it, without him having anything to use against me. I will see about calling the pharmacy tomorrow when I "try" to fill my other script.  also, if I inform my doc, would she prescribe me more if I am supossed to taper? I am terrified to tell her that I have gone through all that she's given me refills for, in a matter of three weeks. It's horrible, embarassing, and I'm so afraid of being judged. ... by everyone.  Even God.

[avisg]

I know its scary the fear of being judged but you are a very courageous person to admit you have a problem and be willing to get help for it .Let us know what happens .

[mommyshouldntbehere]

would the anti-anxiety meds I have (kolonapin) help with the w/d anxiety, if I taper faster than "normal?" I'm afraid I may have to, if I don't have enough pills.

did I mention I hate this? it consumes my whole thought process when I'm solo. uggh!

[mommyshouldntbehere]

thank you avisg. :) thank you. It's nice to hear(see) from someone that I'm not a total disapointment. I mean, I'm your typical "surburban mom" who's got "it all" and a "good life" -- I have no idea how this happened... but it seems to happen alot... :(

[vicki595]

Do not taper fast!!!   Get with your doctor,tell the truth and start getting this fixed!!  You'll
feel so much better.  Read FEEL. We don't feel on this crap...it's the drug of no return.

Your doctor will help and yes you'll need a refill for the taper. Doctors have heard all of this before and your doctor should want to help. No one should judge you but if so...
it's on them!!  You're asking for help. That takes guts. So,as Nike says,"just do it"!!!
You'll feel better doing this the right way. Call tomorrow...

And,by the way,God won't judge you for being human...Chin up!!!

Vicki  xo

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I'm so sad. thank you so much. I'm so afraid of making that call. she just gave me the script and for 2 refills, and I've whipped through this many already... she's going to be floored, nobody would expect this from me. I'm just so ashamed.
Do you think that one more 40 pill script is enough to taper me off completely? then I can keep it quiet, and move on with my life.... Because I can't get any more...
I know it's on them, but even the pharmacy judges me - I can see it in their eyes - "pill popper" it's an awful feeling.
Thank you for the God comment. This world is tainted with this kind of garbage, pills and such. I'm just glad that it's not just me. That, there, makes the world of difference.

[my_mayberry]

well first of all the pharmacy probably doesn't judge you as much as you would think. generally they dispense so many controlled substances that they probably don't even notice. secondly, even if they DO judge you, what difference does that make to you? do you know them? are you friends with them? if you have a BBQ next weekend, will they attend? i'm guessing not, so what they think simply doesn't matter. put that out of your mind.  secondly a proper taper with barbiturates should be a slow process, just like with benzodiazepines. indeed, it should be even slower since the risk is even higher for seizures, etc.  clonazepam is NOT suitable for withdrawal. most commonly if the drug is actually changed for a taper, it would be substituted with phenobarbital or mephobarbital or the like. they are very long acting barbiturates with much lower risk of addiction (though the risk is certainly there).

come clean with your doctor. a good doctor will plan a taper...BUT you MUST stick with your taper. they can't help you if you don't help yourself. it's best to put someone else in charge of your meds or find a method to plan your doses out for the day.

you mention switching between different drugs. barbiturates, opiates, and benzo's are all different types of drugs. to me this suggests since you don't have one single drug of choice, that perhaps you would benefit from some therapy. you have an addictive personality not exclusive to simply one drug...perhaps therapy would help with this. it's dangerous to jump around drugs like that....for example if you take 8-10 fiorinal/fioricet daily for about a month then abruptly d/c and go to darvocet, you could experience life threatening w/d's.....propoxyphene doesn't replace butalbital as far as your body is concerned, so the seizure risk is there as if you simply discontinued the drug entirely.  this is very dangerous. a similar risk exists when you d/c clonazepam.

you have a long road ahead of you and it sounds like your life right now may be causing a lot of stress for you...this will make it even harder because discontinuing butalbital or any barb/benzo completely shreds your ability to deal with stress in any form....this is another reason i would highly recommend a psychologist or psychiatrist. i STRONGLY urge you to develop a taper plan with your doctor. if he/she is unwilling, find another who IS willing to do so before you run out. there is no taper advice available to you that could be considered 'safe' namely barbiturates are hands down the most physically dangerous drug to w/d from and w/d varies from person to person. any taper not monitored buy your doc is NOT a safe taper.

best of luck to u and keep us posted.

[Rdelgado23]

All I can say is that you are NOT alone! I started Fioricet and Vicodin for severe headaches almost eight years ago. Started abusing a little over a year ago as well as being perscribed klonopin. Now I am only starting day 2 of tapering off vicodin and weeks into klonopin withdawal. The lack of klonopin in my system caused me to shake all day long and felt like I drank 3 pots of coffee, and I wasn't even taking it every day! Best not to add anything else addictive at this point. I do switch from drug to drug based on what's abailable and I am a VERY guilty mom. I'm embarassed too, but there should be a point where you're ready to come clean and know that loving, amazing people get addicted to drugs. You deserve help and support and I hope you find it. God bless.

[mellie4]

You're getting great advice here from people who know what they're talking about.  No matter how hard it is, please follow it.  Is there anyone at all you trust enough to share this with?  What about your local pastor?  Even if you're not religious or not a member of the church, they may be able to help you.  They'll at least talk with you and help guide you and not judge you.  Please don't feel like you are all alone in this.

Personally, I believe there are way more women suffering from addiction than anyone knows.  Moms who drive the minivan and take their kids to school and sports, who help them with their homework and from the outside look like they're living the life and who secretly are drinking or taking pills.

It's too bad this disease of addiction still has so much shame attached to it.  Would you be ashamed and embarrassed if you had diabetes?  Or any other chronic illness?  

You have a lot of stress in your life right now.  You need help with this.  I hope you will find the strength to talk to a doctor or pharmacist about a taper.  Pharmacists are really a very valuable resource in so many ways.  

Best of luck with all of this.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

Thank you all.  It was really hard coming to anyone for help or advice. I've been living in my own world for quite sometime.  It's nice to be in a 'world' where nobody does judge me, and most of all,whom have been there, so they know and understand.  They get that I LIKE the way it feels. I so much enjoy right now, the way it just magically takes away all the emotional pain that my husband has inflicted on me, and makes me able to function from day to day with our kids. It makes me able to get out of bed "knowing" they are there waiting. They are there as the crutch to help me not sit and bawl my eyes out knowing we have no money, and if I choose to leave him because of his emotional abuse along with so many other things, the pills give me the strength to "think" that I CAN do it, I can find a job after not working in 6 years, our children WILL recover and I can work through this.  

Today is Thursday, I'm afraid of what's to come. I only have enough to last me today and a few tomorrow, then I'm in deep. Unless I make a phone call that I fear is going to add SO MUCH more to my plate. I'm so scared. so so so scared.  
I still don't get how it ended up this way. :(

[vicki595]

Hi~ Good Morning!

First off,you need to refill the rx. It's not good to go without. Then,get an appt. to work on a taper.
I wish you had someone nearby to share this with. You need the support. Also,try not to make decisions while you're taking this stuff. Believe me,your thoughts and emotions are not quite right. It really affects us greatly. Be careful.
We here~
Vicki

[mommyshouldntbehere]

pharmacist was zero help - he wouldn't give me any kind of weaning plan, even when I told him the story and how much I was taking. some pharm...

[vicki595]

Oh man...I'm sorry.  So,what now?  Tell me what you're thinking/planning.

V.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I know, vicki - where are you located? ;) :)  with my marriage in shambles and having two little ones (3 and 5) and school, gymnastics and dance, and church functions, etc, it's really a struggle.  I think it's even harder, given I do stay at home... :(  *****.
thank you hon, I appreciate it!  

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I have no idea what to do. My husband is leaving on "business" for three days... I am honestly afraid to be tapering at that point, when i'll be moody and it will just be the kids and I 24/7 and they have sleeping issues and behavioral problems... my parents are around, but i can't break their hearts right now with this, I know they'd help.. but I just can't - 2 members of our family were diagnosed with cancer in the past 2 weeks and my mom's brother, with needing open heart surgery asap... why does everything happen at once?  
I'm trying to explain to my ins. co. that I need my refill for obvious reasons (for 40) now... or withdrawl (withdrawal) will happen.

I don't know my next step.  
Husband leaves sunday

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I should also add, that he'll be here fri-sun... and alot of things planned... and for some reason I'm afraid to do them solo w/o my friend (aka fioracet)

[vicki595]

LOL   Yeah...I could fix you but you'd end up hating me. I can be tough!!  LOL

You know,this is just my opinion but, I'm not sure you're ready to do this.  You really need to have things in order for it to work. Otherwise,relapse will loom big!!  When you stop the pills,it has to be the most important thing in your life and you need to dedicate everything to staying clean.  You need a support system be it therapy,meetings,your pastor etc...   It's an enormous life change.  Life is far better without the burden of addiction but the process takes some work.

Right now,while you're working on a plan of action,try taking less fioricet per day. Even if you drop one per day and stay there,it's something.

V. xo

[vicki595]

Okay...Usually the ins. co. won't budge. Sometimes the pharmacist will allow it for cash payment but they reserve the right to deny too.  Tell the pharmacist(and make sure it's the pharmacist) that you need it and know it's early. He may not give it to you.
How many do you have left? When can you legitimately get the refill?

V.

[sway1]

in your original post you mentioned loving god eternally i believe. fear and worry indicate a lack of faith. take all the wonderful suggestions that have been given here, but also, try and re-connect with your god. faith can get you through so much, and this is coming from a wiccan! strength is there for you if you just reach out to it. i wish you the best and hope i didn't come off pissy. peace, sway
      ps. they are not your friend. make no mistake

[my_mayberry]

if your doctor called in fioricet without codeine, this is a different drug and insurance would likely cover it.

a pharmacist legally can't give you a taper plan. this is something only a doctor can do. especially with barbiturates where it will also need supervision. TELL YOUR DOCTOR. if you don't, you'll be in for one hell of a ride and luck is the only thing that will (or won't) be on your side.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

sway- I have to admit, even with my bi-weekly bible studies, and church two times a week, my faith is severely low, yes. things in my life have gotten bad, and I'm very sad and unsure of things. The love of my life is not any longer the person I thought he was! My heart is utterly broken. I don't want to hurt my children in any kind of divorce, or separation, so I stay. over and over, same thing after thing, and here we are, yet again.  Lack of faith.. yes.

vicki- I just called the ins. co. and another chain of the same pharmacy, talked to them, and got the most helpful and wonderful pharmacist ever. He helped to piece together a 'non-legal' plan that I still should discuss with my doc, but yet, we know that I'm still not at that "acceptance" point of it.   With the dose I'm on, he said that I can lessen my dose by the day by 1 or 2, then drop a couple more. I'm also supossed to start the topomax (topamax) as soon as I feel ready, which is also an anti-seizure medication...  

my_mayberry- telling my doctor is truly, truly going to hurt relationships. how should I look at her at picnics, parties, get togethers? things just will not be the same. I know that she cannot legally say anything, but in reality, that doesn't always happen, as a "friend" she could still drop hints to what's going on if she knows, not necessarily come out and say, 'yeah, she's recreationally pill popping', you know?

I'm sorry if I seem bitchy, my husband just laid another big bomb on me this morning. I'm so just utterly sad. I want the help, I need the help. My therapist is OUR therapist, which would make matters worse, I fear, at this point in the game.

at least the script is being refilled, I have 48 more, and a semi-plan to get off them.

thank you so much for your help. I fear the future, but know that it will be okay. luck or God...

[vicki595]

Okay great!!   Sometimes a pharmacist can be soooo helpful;they know a lot of chemistry!!   Really do stick to that taper. Sometimes it helps to take out what you need for the day and put the bottle away.  When I tapered,my husband was in charge of the pills and handed them out one at a time...

Is the Topamax for a seizure disorder or for migraines?  Just curious...

Get working on finding a different doctor. I understand the problem with your current Dr.
We like to think we can totally trust our doctors but the reality is they are human.  I saw a dentist years ago who was a personal friend of ours. Naturally,my medical history was in my record and I was okay with that.  THEN,he was at a function with mutual friends,had a few thousand drinks and started blabbing about me AND my personal info.  I was furious and made his life a living hell!!  

So...keep posting with how you're doing. I'm happy to help any way I can.

Vicki  xo

[mommyshouldntbehere]

the topamax my doc has given me to prevent my headaches, but the pharmacist had told me it was originally a seizure medication. I have no history of seizures.

vicki- boy, am I glad I'm not the only one with a doc that you "know, know" -- it's truly hard. I will work this afternoon at naptimes to see if I can find one locally, a female, that I can meet with.  thank you. I will keep you posted and thank you, truly for the help and kindness you've shown me.

all of you! :)

[mommyshouldntbehere]

One more question...

I did p/u my 40 pill script. last one. have a "plan" to taper with that... wanting to know if I can/should add in my fioranal (butalbital/asprin/caffiene NO codiene or tylenol in that one) as a taper method when counting out my pills for the next days. Is it considered the same, since it's the 'butalbital' that I am addicted to?
thanks.

[cathy5841]

hi mommy, glad to see you are making progress with your plan..i know you dont want to tell your parents about your addiction, but when w/ds do get here maybe you can say you have the flu and get some babysitting help...you have gotten great advice from viki and the others..armed with the advice and the taper plans you will succeed...keep us posted.

[vicki595]

I'm not sure how to answer your question.  Are you using both plain and with codeine?

Tell me exactly what you have of each one and what the pharmacist told you. For me,
I would taper with the Fw/C and then switch over to the plain F and continue tapering.

I think you're probably dependant on both codeine and butalbital.

V.  xo

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I feel horribly guilty at this point, I've taken 8 w/codiene today. ugh. my highest ever. spaced apart, of course. here I am, trying hard to get off this sh*t, and rock bottom for my marriage issues today. I know, it shouldn't affect me like this, but that combined with my kids biting one another, fighting and this and that, I'm just overwhelmed. I haven't gotten away for time for myself since last July. (time meaning, more than an hour here or there, and not doing something that's an "errand", you know?) It's really hard right now. :(  Anyways,
Vicki- I have 48 of the but w/codiene
and 11 of the asprin/but/caffiene
I'll leave the darvon out - I don't prefer that... unless I'm desperate to "get out of my head" if you know what I mean.  (yet, I still dont' know how I got to this point)

the pharmacist said that I should taper down a few at a time, judging by my refills and how many i've been taking per day (I was honest with him) - that it shouldn't take more than a week or two, if I drop one/two a day.  I started with asprin/caff/butalbital, then went to codiene (for the past three/four-ish scripts), and I've went through those pretty quickly... so I've not been "on" solidly, for a long time... If I remember correctly, Jan. was when I went "on" - and did the asprin one w/o codiene for a month, then switched to the tylenol WITH codiene, then went back to w/o.  Then went good and clean for a month or two, and in May, I hit up the docs, and have been "on" pretty much since then.... mostly w/o codiene, but for the past 3/4 scripts, have been with codiene... and it hasn't been a "long" period of time... 30-40 pills/script then taking 6-7/day.  
I know you can't give a "plan" but any advice?

[mommyshouldntbehere]

also - should I be taking my prozac or no?
I kinda skip b/c I'm afraid of putting too much garbage to my liver. :(
(my ocd)

[my_mayberry]

your pharmacist isn't qualified to give you a taper plan.

you're worried about image. vanity. you can call it what you will but it's putting your health at risk and it's very frustrating.

i'm telling you, as a person who works in a pharmacy, a pharmacist is HIGHLY educated but NOT qualified to give you taper advice. you simply will not listen.

you care too much about what people think. in the field of medicine addiction happens ALL THE TIME. it's nothing new to anyone.

[vicki595]

Okay...yes...I'd still take the Prozac.

Don't be sad,this is totally doable. The pharmacist gave you good advice. You'll do fine if you just do it,you know?  You already took 8 today. That's it,no more;that's your limit okay??    Part of this process is developing good coping skills.  I know exacly how you feel: kids acting up,laundry piling up,dust,dirt,heat,crabby husband,no time alone,not having read a book in 5 years,need a haircut,need a manicure,need money and on and on...  This is life and I know you know that.  You're a smart girl and a caring Mom. You can do this...

When you feel the urge to take another pill today drink a cold glass of water and take a vitamin or a Motrin. Tomorrow drop down to 7 pills for the day.  Put those aside and put the bottle away. Wait a few days and drop another one as the pharmacist told you.

You can totally do this!!  It's a mindset.  It helps a lot to have support.  I know you can't share this right now with the family but you might try an NA meeting in your area. They are free and you only need to sit and listen.  I really hate that you're so alone with this.
It doesn't help you!!
Feel free to post as much as you want~Always happy to help

V. xo

[mhfla]

I agree. I as well take my prozac 40 mg every day and tomorrow will be the start of me trying to go c/t. I'm so nervous but I think the prozac may help. I have soooo much in common with mommy it's ubelieveable. I know what you are going through with the kids, husband, ect.... taking pills to sometimes escape. But I want out. I have done this for 6 years and I can't do it anymore. I need to save my family and my children don't deserve a mom that somedays just fades out ya know?

[mommyshouldntbehere]

mayberry- I'm sorry, but your really making me sad. yes, call me vain, but yes, I AM worried about my image. I live in a town where everyone knows me, I'm highly known at my kids' school, I'm the PTO mom, my town has 800 people, and like I said, everyone knows everyone and everything. Hence, nobody knowing about my marital issues, and why I can't go seek help from anyone or our church. Vanity, yes, but, this is my home, and when this is all said and done, I will still be living here and have to face my community, the parents, the people, the church, the school... you just are not understanding where I am coming from. not at all. I know this happens all the time. I've seen it in my own family. My aunt - addicted to pain pills for years... my brother - crack/cocaine, my other brother, vicodin... I know this happens, and for innocent reasons, however, I am trying to do this the best I can, with my situation, with what I've got. I have no money, I stay at home, I have two children, and my marriage is at wits end.... I've got alot to deal with right now.

Vicki- No more. promise. I will start again tomorrow. I am pondering calling the one doc I have seen once or twice, but has prescribed meds for me, and telling him what's going on... though I too, think the do think the pharm gave me good advice, given me telling him everything and him being able to see, in front of him, my list of scripts and how often. I am so glad that you see/know the home responsibilities and issues that can just be so overwhelming on a person...  some people do not understand that. my husband for one...  I mean, I NEVER am really 'out' of the house solo. Aside from my 4 day trip with friends last july, it was 5 years since I had been away.  I mean, my kids have never even been overnight yet - it's been close to 6 years.  we have never been on a vacation w/o kids, it's just an utter mess. trust me. mess. all I do is cry with all that is on my plate right now. it hurts.  thank you for your faith. It really means something that 'someone', really, anyone, believes me. or even notices me. I am not invisible. At least, not here... and that truly means alot.

mhfla - I know what you mean - on so many levels! If we both are in this - let's do this together! I sit here, taking my "2 minute computer breaks" and wonder if I'm the only ****** mom who is feeling like this... has a ****** marriage, who is truly, The great pretender... it helps to know you are here too, and I'm thankful.   How many are you taking a day, did you say?  

I will keep with my prozac, on again, off again, isn't helping matters, I'm sure, with that, just making me more depressed. thank you hons! :)

Hugs and I'll keep ya (haha - literatelly!) posted!

[vicki595]

I sent you a private message. Check your in box.   :)

[mhfla]

oh boy do I know about those 2 min computer breaks!! I sent you a private message too. We can do this together!!! I take about 6 vicodin a day. I was also taking rocicet 30mg about 5 a day but am out of those today so tomorrow is a new day! Wish me luck as I am soooooo worried!!! *hugs* ~Melissa

[Melka76]

I have been there - and for me it got worse.  I accidentally overdosed 2 times - once they did not think I would make it.  I almost left my children by dying on my sofa, at the time they were 3 and 5. It started with Firocet (spelling) after my second was born - and then it just got out of hand with anti anxiety meds, drinking... my marriage ended.. I had to have supervised visits with my children - it had taken me 2 years almost 3 to get some level of normalcy.  I am in horrible debt, still fight with ex husband about custody - I did get supervision lifted and back to 50/50 - but I will never be able to forgive myself for the time I lost with them.. 2 years of supervision and one year of pill popping prior to that.  Please do everything you can to get help... I know that you are worried about your image - but trust me... things can go downhill a lot faster than they have for you.  Maybe a lot of your marital issues are because of the pills - your behavior and such is not what your husband is use to and he has no reason other than to think things are just not working that things are failing... if he knew what was going on - I think he could help.... If you are truly that much into faith - he will forgive and understand.  As for your dr.  they take an oath - he/she can not tell anyone what is going on... and it is time for you to stop being selfish and worry about what they would think of you at a picnic and think more of what would your children do without a mother.  I am sorry to be hard on you - but nobody was on me... everyone enabled me and that did not help.  It has taken a while but things do work out.  I wish you all the luck in the world and if you need to chat - message me....

[my_mayberry]

i'm understanding you perfectly, truly i am.

and if you fail you still have your doctor willing to rx the drug. this is the worst part of all. oh well. my words fall on deaf ears. not for the first time.

i'm telling you the only way to do this is openly with your doctor. if you fail, odds are you won't try again for a long long time. more importantly if you encounter any physical withdrawal symptoms that others may have been LUCKY enough to avoid, there will be no one to consult. more importantly, and i'll say it again, you still have a source for your pills. if you can't trust your doctor to keep this kind of information just between you, perhaps this isn't the doctor you should be seeing?

well good luck. i see your decision for your method is made, and i've expressed my view that it is a method to be avoided. we all go our own way, though...so hopefully it works for you. but don't say i don't understand. i probably understand far better than you can imagine.

[vicki595]

"LUCK has nothing to do with anything.  Hard work gets the PRIZE everytime."


                              ~a quote from my journal~
                                                                     V.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

just when I think things cannot get worse, they do. I really think that God is testing me right now.. and I'm failing, and falling- I'm just heart broken. My mom got into a car accident this morning. By the grace of God, himself, he kept her alive, knowing that I need her so desperately bad right now, in more ways than one.  She is okay, bumped up and shook up, but seems to be okay. Car is totalled. I can't help but blame myself. I'm sure she was thinking about my marriage issues and our financial issues. She and my dad have helped with money for about a year with us, but recently, my mom has been 'teaching' me about all of my bills and finances (I know, I know... I should have known all along, but it's not any longer my  husbands job, it's both of ours to figure this all out, we've been beyond sinking..  SO - she has been helping there, it's stressful, but then there's my husband and I - we were the couple that was always thought to win, and my parents are trying to help us in any way they can. My mom and I are extremely close, which is WHY I can't tell her, I know of all of the things she's doing for me/us AND dealing with her own issues, her work issues, my brother's drug issues, her brother's heart surgery, her brother in laws' prostate diagnosis, our other cousin's diagnosis with leukemia, and my recent abnormal pap (which I have failed yet to mention that is adding to my stresses)
I'm just at my wits end already today... my husband is home, that's good. I won't go over my 7 pills for the day, but damn, I'm at 3 already, I'm heading to see my mom soon, so I'll let you know how that goes once we see her.  It's amazing how fast emotions, feelings and plans can change... we had an actual family day and I was doing well, until I got the phone call about my mom, then I got upset, and (this is a huge marital issue) nothing is a big deal to my husband, and shows no worry, care, or even a hug or a back rub or anything encouraging to me about her.  THIS is why I can't tell him. He'd rip me a new one and just verbally put me down more..

keep ya posted.

[vicki595]

Hey~  Sorry about all this.  At least your Mom is okay.  I know how you feel!!  Every time my Mom just sneezes,I'm ready to jump on a plane!!

I don't know your husband ( I promise  LOL ) but he sounds a lot like mine. I knew his ways going in;he's just not that physical OR verbal. But he's a good man and loves me.
I'm the touchy/feely one. So,if I need a hug I just go for it. I don't wait around and he's always so damn surprised!!  After all these years he's still surprised. Go figure. I think he wakes up every morning with a clean slate and no memory. It's comical!  But,I can tell you this:  I was scared out of my mind to tell him of my addiction. He's a doctor,a
health freak,very logical,very pragmatic,conservative and always right.  I was convinced he'd call a lawyer and divorce me!!   Well,it was just the opposite. He said he'd help me taper off,take the control,get me healthy again and take care of things until I could do
things on my own. I was a mess but I got it together pretty quickly.  He told me I'd be fine.  I was weak from his kindness and will never forget it.  So....maybe at some point you might have the same experience.  I hope so....

Post back about your Mom~

Vicki  xo

[mommyshouldntbehere]

Hi all;

okay, so first - I went to reread my original post, and I think that I was totally misunderstood, the way I wrote that orig. post it sounded like I take more than I do. I take, every 4-6 hrs. as directed, TWO pills. sometimes I will pop an extra third to gt thru the day. I know some I have clarified that to, so you know what's going on, and get me. :) ;) thank you so much!  :)  I'm glad I am able to confide in someone.

I spoke with my mom all day long, got to see her, she is doing well. My daughter, bless her sweet little heart, and I am so truly impressed and proud of her (not to mention wish for this faith) says, "I'm glad that the God took the deer, and not Grandma, we still need her here."  She's so right and far wise beyond her years.  My mom is doing well. She's still really really shook up. She doesn't believe how there can be that much glass, that much blood... you know? just very shook up, but will be okay.  My dad, actually, (love this day, right, lol) was in the doc today - fortunately he and my mom were close by eachother in all of this) he hurt his foot and will now have an air boot for awhile. She's just glad that he wasn't with her when she had the accident, she said that he would not have survived.  Would have broken many hearts, her's, mine, my children, my husband, all of us... I can't bear to think that. SHE can't bear to think that. they've been together 33 years now, and have so much life ahead of them, as my parents just hit the 50yr. mark.  I'm just so thankful to God for watching out for my mom (and dad) today. so thankful. <3

As for me, I'm doing well. I'm only "on for 7" today... have taken 5, so far so good! :) I'm keeping with my plan! And, I'm sticking to it. EVEN through these trials... I will kick this sheeeit! :)

[mommyshouldntbehere]

vicki- I didn't forget about you. :)  Thank you for your comments on my husband. He truly IS a great guy - things have just gone wrong somewhere, where we both are not quite sure. He is very much how you describe yours to be. Sometimes, it can be so fusterating!!  Maybe, we are still "new" at this marriage thing (7 years) -- sometimes I think the "7 year itch" is true! :D  lol.  I should just go up and hug him today, he'd be so shocked, I think he'd actually be happy about it! I think what he and I both need are time away to do our own hobbies. things have been rough at home, and with the kids and we both need that "time" for ourselves.  What we need is a good old fashioned talk. like we used to. Nobody ever tells you what work life is going to be. And, you never get to go to school for the things that are THE most important things in life - your marriage and your kids... your just kind of thrown in there, then things get tough and I wanna run, that's how I always was and now I'm like 'I can't' - I just can't.  what I CAN run from though, is the pills. and I will.   (funny, you say he's a doctor, my husband too, is in the medical field.)

[allk00]

mommy...all I can say is I SOOOOOOOOO Feel your pain. SO SO much you hardly know. I have posted some things almost identical to you. I don't have much time, but if you do, read the 4 or 5 posts I have made and the helpful replies I have received. This website is a god send!
I hope today turns out gettting better...for you and me both!

[mommyshouldntbehere]

allk00- I thank you for posting!! and, I will be sure to check yours out. It feels so much better to me to know that I am not alone in this. I honestly, thought I was the only "mom" like "me" (totally, hands on, in everything, happy go lucky,etc) who has this deep dark secret.  Thank you for sharing with me! I too, don't have much time - I just sneaked on here quick before hubby/kids pop inside for the night, then we have baths/game and movie night planned.  So, I gotta run. But, I will most definitely read up on your thoughts and posts. Hang in there and LOTS of hugs to you!!! :)

Mom is doing better. I'm glad to know that she's at home now! :)

[mommyshouldntbehere]

another question, if you tell your therapist, do they legally have to disclose that information to ANYONE?

[Melka76]

Unless there is a risk to someones life - I would think they are not permitted to tell anyone anything without your written authorization - but you can check the HIPPA laws for more detail.  

[my_mayberry]

your quote doesn't relate to what i'm saying. if a person follows a very aggressive taper (as this one is) that was given to them from someone not qualified to give it without doctor supervision while detoxing from the most physically dangerous class of drugs there is and DOESN'T experience withdrawal effects, then it is LUCK, not hard work.

though i certainly do understand what you're saying. i made it a decade clean of this drug and have made it over a year having not smoked a cigarette (went from 2 packs a day to none)--hard work was the cornerstone of those achievements. i'm very proud of them. alas, this monster is with us forever and ever and it only takes one slip to undo it all. short term, this is easy to avoid. long term, as i'm sure you're becomming aware, it's much harder to avoid. think about it vicki....i made it a decade and it still came back to get me.

so yes, i truly DO know what hard work is and your quote is an inspiration to us all. unfortunately it can't apply to everything....it certainly doesn't apply to anything i've cautioned against. but none the less, my cautions haven't mattered, so no worries.

[vicki595]

Mayberry~  I know you're concerned about this gal;please don't think I'm not. I've read every word carefully. As you,I'm not exactly comfortable with the status quo. But,there are a few things that make me feel okay with this:
She happened to find a sympathetic pharmacist. He gave her advice and told her it was not legal and she should see a doctor for supervision.   She also stated she would search for a different Dr. during the kids' naptimes.  There is a Dr. she has seen for rx's
in the past that she can call,also. She plans on doing this. She's a bright girl and truly doesn't want to do anything to hurt herself.  I believe that. She's also been without the drug for one and two months at a time recently,having picked it back up daily in May.

I know what you're saying and I know how passionate you are. This incidious drug has hurt both of us badly.  I'm glad to be rid of it...grateful...thankful...because I feel so much better.  Honestly,I hardly think about taking even one. Actually,never. It's like an abusive friend...you just stay away!    I've worked myself into this mindset and have had
a lot of support,at great expense.

V.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

i don't have much time. yoga, class actually! first time 'out' in a loooong time. just wanted to pop in and say hello- it's only 7 today, 6 if I'm super-strong,which I know I can be!  mindset mindset.  yes,. vicki is correct in all of that. and I have c/t'd before after a few sripts have run out, I guess I was "lucky" I had never taken them solidly for more than a few months in a row at a time, so I think that the pharmicist,seeing my chart, was able to help me with a good plan.
I just need to be strong and stick to it. ;)

[vicki595]

Hey,Hi !!

Good plan!  Be strong!!  You sound better!       I do yoga too!  

I'll respond to your PM when I'm more awake...Sleepily trying to get some work done now...YAWN...

xo

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I need to just 'man up' and go to my doctor and hope that she keeps it inconfidence - I can't do this anymore. I also, need to tell my husband. I am at an emotional breaking point with all that is happening around me, with my mom, my uncles, cousin, and all the bad news, I'm hoping he will understand. Church had an effect on me today. There I sat, praying and asking forgiveness, and something just snapped in me. I must tell him. I am living a lie, and he's my best friend, who better to tell this all to. The more I hide it, the more emotional I become, the more he's clueless, the more we fight... it's a vicious circle.  I know he won't leave me, he will be uber-dissapointed, but maybe he'll understand more about my emotional issues and help me to keep this confidential and help me to wean.

I figure, if I tell my doc, have a "plan" (plan, meaning, official plan via my doc, that HE knows as well), by the time he returns home (on weds) I can have HIM be in control and distribute my meds.  How, exactly, did you tell your docs? I'm so so so afraid of finding the right words, not looking like a total loser mom addict, not looking like a crapper, and putting it in a way that she knows I want help. I'm afraid my doc will tell on me and take my kids.  My measly 8 pills a day certinley are NOT worth the risk of losing my kids!! That's for certain!!  

The hard thing, is going to be trying to get in to see her tomorrow (monday), she's always full, and then to find a sitter, esp. with nobody knowing all of this... and all of the running I do with the kids (sports, classes and me being the only one to do so.) tomorrow.

I'm just weak. So weak. I'm a failure. I say I'm going to wean, and I can't stick to my own plan. I fail, over and over and over again. And, I'm running out of pills.... and time. Time of having a decent life free of this ****.

Everytime somthing 'bad' happens in my life, they have been my comfort, and continue to be, and even with the pharm.'s 'game plan' I can't stop. I need someone, anyone, in my real life to help me get through this. I want so desperately, for it to be my husband. I just am so scared!!! so so so scared! but, I'm just stuck right now. I LOOOOOOVE the way it makes me feel, but I need to LOVE the way of life, soberly. NOT on this drug. it's ruined me. :(

Now's the time. not later. I have realized I can't do this alone.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

ps- and the "vanity" is making me panic.  The sheer anxiety of how I'm going to LOOK to her, is just utter disgraceful. :(

[RyRyBoosMom]

You really should be concerned about how your children and husband feel and how you look to them, not some dr. I take both these medications and it is tempting on a bad day to pop another one, but just stop and look at your kids. Aren't they worth going to this dr.? Would you feel this way if it was any other medical problem? Life's not easy and it's to short to waste. Don't worry about those not close to you. 800 or 800,000, your family and friends should know, if they don't see you need help and support, kick em to the curb. Do you want to look back some day and say vanity stopped you? Good luck, some day your family will thank you for putting them first, trust me, my girls are 11 & 13 and they can tell when mommy has had to take her medicine, it changes you and I think you will be amazed once you are off them.

[RyRyBoosMom]

Oh, I almost forgot, my sister works at my dr's office, so I understand the concerns you are having. Every time I call in for a refill, you wonder if this is the time they decide you are taking too much.
You may be surprised that this may not come as a surprise to the dr. As I said in the last post, this medicine changes a person. Please know that I am not judging you in anyway. There is something about finally finding a medicine that works, that you want to hang on so badly! I get an aura with mine and have searched for years for relief. But it is also easy to get up in the morning and say "hey that feels like a migraine, better take a pill" because it does seem like it's helping you through the day, but it isn't. Please talk to your husband and see the dr. you are no good to your family this unhappy. Again, best of luck to you.

[my_mayberry]

i think you are doing absolutely the right thing in telling your doctor and possibly your husband. i don't know your relationship with him....but if you trust him to help you deal with this, then i think its absolutely the right thing.

you'll have to forgive me if i come off a little rude sometimes, but i firmly and totally believe the best solution is to be honest and straight-forward with your doctor. #1---they can provide the best taper and supervise it and #2--when they say you're done, you're done and they aren't rx'ing any more. thats the way it needs to be. i wish you the best of luck.

perhaps you should tell your doctor you want to discuss your meds and say that you are concerned about your usage of the med. tell him you feel you might have become addicted. you could mention your stressful situation at home -- this could have been a contributing factor in the first place. you may mention that you aren't usually the type to abuse medicine and you don't know how this happened (only if thats true) and that you just want a safe taper plan to get off it. maybe suggest switching to regular fioricet first and then slowly taper...see what he thinks of that or if he would think its better not to switch.

anyway, best of luck! you're doing the right thing in telling your doctor. and on rare occasions, a doctor will say 'just stop taking them' without suggesting a taper. forwarning--this is not good advice. i'd demand some sort of taper or find another doctor to help you if this is the response you get. most doctors understand the importance of a taper, though.

and try not to be too nervous. like i said...and like others have said...doctors see this all the time. whats rare is when someone has the courage to face their addiction and make plans to fix it. doctors would much rather discuss this with you than to simply let you abuse them. thats why they are there...to HELP you.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

thank you for all of your helpful insights. I did call my doc first thing today... she's booked until WED!! That is TOO long, so I am having the doc's nurse whom I am comf. with, call back, explain my situation, and hope that she'll talk with my doc and then either she or my doc will call back with a plan or a "hey, we can fit you in, here."

I agree with the "just stop taking them" -- I've been at a point where I do feel withdrawls when I stop taking it, I guess, it's best to let her know that, too. I'm SOOOO nervous! I hope this goes well. I just am so sick of hiding. I need to GET OUT of this mess!

It DOES take courage... I've never had that before. Except for what you've all shown me, and for that, I am extremely greatful. you have no idea!

[mommyshouldntbehere]

very appropriate devotional that was in my inbox this morning..

So be strong and courageous! Do not be afraid and do not panic before them. For the Lord your God will personally go ahead of you. He will neither fail you nor abandon you.
~ Deuteronomy 31:6, NLT

[vicki595]

This is good.  You will feel such relief having shared this. Also,tell her your fears about
the friendship part of your relationship. Most doctors(and nurses) know things they take to the grave!!   Wednesday isn't too late. Make that appt. when you speak with the nurse.
Chin up!!  This is getting fixed!!!

V.  xo

[RyRyBoosMom]

Wednesday is as good a day as any! It is true about the dr's, nurses, even the staff in the office, you are protected. One doctor was fired from my sister's clinic, a patient heard him talking about her and her medical issues in the hallway, he was fired that day.
Good luck to you, be honest and I think you will be amazed at how quickly relief will come to you.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

Thank you all! For your support. I'm not feeling better about spilling, but I don't know if that's because of the circumstances, the fact that I haven't yet told my husband, or if it's because I'm alone with the kids and I'm very overwhelmed.  Day two of his out-of-town trip , two to go - and then a four day "on" work week... but I plan to talk to him on wed. when he gets home, after the kids go to bed.

I did talk to my doc - what's hard is that I was gone from here to there and now even all the fricken receptionists know my "issue" my name, my birthdate.. not very confidential. not very reassuring.  The nurse was extremely helpful and caring, so much so, I feel I should bring her flowers! :)  I spoke directly to my doc and she got me in tomorrow with her after I talked with her one-on-one.  The first call, she referred me to a neuro... that she doesn't really "do" taper-plans.  THEY were confused that she referred me to them, so I got bopped around there. PLUS, it's a "specialist" - so it triples my copoay seeing them. SO..... I called her back and then told her that, and she told me that the reason for that was to get to the 'headache' the underlining problem, which is good.... but right now. NOW, that is NOT the issue. I will deal with my migraines and headaches AFTER I am off of this garbage, and no rebound headaches. I kind of felt like the doctor here. I told her about the forum and withdrawls - how they can happen even with what I am on... -- when she told me that some docs/neuro's will just tell you to "cut it" or "stop" or work with OTHER medications to get you off of it. I told her about seizures - she told me that with the amount I'm taking (I told her "9" a day, because I needed it to be at the higher end, but still - apparently, that's not "enough")  is not enough to cause that. I told her about the "flu" (which is what I thought I had, but now know better) the last time I just "quit" and I can't have that -- I need to FIX this, and FIX it right, slowly, and do it so I am NOT sick, so I can do my camp trip with my daughter, so I can fix things in my home life, so I can FIX MYSELF! I don't know what I'm mad at, really.... the fact that I felt like I was being shoved aside, because she knows me, or the fact that I dont' think she has an effing clue.  What do I do if she doesn't give me more meds to wean and taper? what if she gives me something else, which is NOT WHAT I WANT OR NEED!! I don't need to start something ELSE.. I need to slowly, get off of this. My only wish is that she goes home (was in office until noon today) and actually researches this. Maybe she'll even come up with THIS here, I'd be so pleased if she found this!!   I was bawling on the phone, and they were compassionate, don't get me wrong... they commended me for stepping up and admitting all of this and I asked about confidentiality over and over again. I told her how much I just want my life back and how I NEED to deal with this now. How I don't know how this happened, or when it went bad.... she and the nurse both explained that I am not the first person to have this issue with anything like this. while I know this is true, I still feel like - 'woah, she's going to tell someone and have the kids taken away.'  or 'I'm going to be the talk of the town. nice.'  

I'm scared.

At any rate 3pm is my doc appt tomorrow. Now, off to find a sitter w/o having to dish to anyone about where/why I'm going.  THIS is not going to be easy. not even a little bit.

[vicki595]

It's never easy but it's not the worst thing in the world either.  You can imagine the worst thing right?

Worst case scenario is that someone in the office blabs to someone who blabs to their
cousin's first husband!  So what!!!  I know what I'm talking about when I tell you there comes a time when it just doesn't matter anymore!!!   And usually,nothing happens
anyway...AND...your kids won't be taken away and she won't call anyone.She can't.
Don't worry...

V.

[my_mayberry]

well as far as 9 per day not being enough to cause seizures...this isn't always the case. the half-life of butalbital causes it to build up in your system to a level higher than just the 9 a day. also opiates and barbiturates potenate each other, so i don't know if that would increase the risk or not.

that being said, the vast majority of seizures are from those taking .5gm to 1gm daily. your dose is around .25gm. a taper still is best because there still is a risk...but more imprtantly going cold turkey is like going cold turkey on xanax. at theraputic doses, there likely won't be a seizure, but it's still highly likely to experience very major problems with anxiety....afterall, thats what this drug actually does best...it relieves anxiety. it sedates you. this rebound anxiety can be described as an absolute nightmare for people which is why a taper is ideal. what good would it do to d/c this drug only to replace it with a benzo for the anxiety/insomnia/etc?

but i'm very glad you talked with your doctor even though you might not have gotten the exact answer you wanted. ask her tomorrow if she will be willing to do a basic taper. ask her what she thinks about plain fioricet for the taper. tell her this is what you are most comfortable with. BUT as i said before...you MUST stick to your taper. if you don't it defeats the whole purpose and the doctor will have no choice but to eventually make you go cold turkey. once a doctor is aware of addiction and the drug is no longer serving a theraputic purpose, legally they are obligated to d/c it. this is what she'll want to do eventually no matter what...so if she gives you a taper, please try to stick with it. i know it's really hard to stick with a taper...but planning your doses at the beginning of the day and NOT going over that can help. if i remember right, vicky had a good system for this when she tapered.

[my_mayberry]

i'm sorry, i was wrong. the dose you are taking is closer (but not quite) 0.5gm/day. i just got off work so my brain is done functioning for the day. haha

[mommyshouldntbehere]

ugh - I have a real banger of a headache today. it's horrid.  Next to no sleep last night, kids up before 5 am, and I have already even taken a relpax in hopes to free my headache up before my doc at 3. oh well, looks like I'm going to go looking like hell. what can I do. This solo-mom stuff not easy!! Another reason I can't wait to work things out with hubby. :D  I haven't even really spoken with him, this confrenece he's at has all of his time, and that's sad. It's made me realize how much I love him and our family. I'm praying that he comes home feeling the same and when I drop the "hey, I'm a pill popper" bomb on him, he is supportive.  My head is pounding, and so is the rain outside... ick - anyone else notice a cooralation between humid and rainy weather and sinus and migraines? My whole head hurts today, and it *****! went from being just cloudy and mild to huuuuumid and rainy thunderstorms. ick. just another glorious day in wisconsin. blech.

[butalbee]

Your headache today is most likely from your body being confused by you cutting down on those evil fioricets.  It's the same for me.  I went from taking on sunday 15-20 pills to monday only 7 pills. It's a butalbital rebound headache.  

[vicki595]

Yes,barometric changes have a LOT to do with headaches,sinus pressure pain etc...
I'm not certain dropping that one pill is causing a rebound headache but with this stuff...nothing surprises me!!!
Since I've essentially been without these for 7 months,I've noticed a tremendous change in those headaches and all pain in general. My tolerance for pain has increased vastly.
I have had ONE migraine in 6 mos!!  I take Maxalt and it works great. Also,nearly every morning,I wake up with a pain in my head. It's all sinus from weather changes...I take:
2 Sudafed,2 excedrin,and a cup of steaming coffee. MMMM...Also,lying flat makes it worse so I get up and get going. It works great. You'll get to that point...

xo

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I still have a headache, but am plugging away - today will be over at some point! :)

On the bright side, I'm taking the kids to the sitter and heading out to the doc now.

here it goes.....

[vicki595]

Good luck Honey...It's all good from this point on...

xo

[mommyshouldntbehere]

hi all;
just wanted to post a quick note that my doc was so understanding and I am so truly happy that she is a professional woman who is going to help me.
We have an 8-day wean plan, 26 pills, drop 2 a day I think. She said that she didn't think i'd feel "Too" crappy, but I'm scared ******** at this point. The first day will be the mother and daughter camp for three days.  I have a few w/o codiene and with asprin. Now, my question is, do I take them with to camp incase I start getting withdrawls and get sick? I truly canNOT dissapoint my daughter and not go to this. she has been waiting since last year! :(  I can't wait to go, either. I'm in tears right now, (making my headache worse) wondering how my luck always finds me, badly... :(  (yes, I am in the "poor me" card right now)  ALSO, she had me do a blood test to check my liver - just to cover all bases. what if it comes back badly?! She said I'd have to be hospitalized, wtf?! I can't do that!!! Then, everyone would know, obvously, as they just would. I would be beyond hurt. as, my uncle is still in the hospital after open heart surgery yesterday, and my other uncle is going in for treatment for cancer... I wonder what the plan for me will be.
I'm scared.
and very sad.
and, I miss my husband so terribly badly, all I want right now if for him to hold me and tell me that I'll get through this, and I'm all alone.

Do I give him my darvocet, my fioranal and the extras and go with my plan, or do I tell him that I should hang onto those (one a days) incase I start w/ding at camp.  

What should i do?

[vicki595]

Okay...When are you starting the taper? Today?  I'd just wait and see how you feel right BEFORE you leave for the camp. Then call the doc and ask her. This is all about getting off the pills...forever. You'll adjust while tapering. If you feel really awful,call her up. You may have to call a few times. Don't worry so much about the future. It's all just about TODAY.

Yes,it's good to put out the # of pills you take for the day and not have the bottle around.
When I tapered,every morning my husband put the pills in a cup in my bathroom. I knew when to take them. If I took them all at once it was my problem. I had to put forth control on my own and I spread them out throughout the day. I never saw the bottle and he NEVER gave me more no matter what I said.  Your taper is not as long as mine. I was a HUGE baby in the beginning but I got used to it. Any way,don't have the bottle around or the Darvocett. Tell him to hide them.

Testing for liver function is very prudent on the doctors' part. No point in worrying about it.  We're all different...my liver function was perfect and I have only my parents to thank for that. It's all in the genes.  I abused my liver BAD.  

You haven't been on THAT high of a dose daily. It's not great but not horrible. Just go with it and continue to keep busy,don't think about it,push,push,push.  You want this!!!

xo

[mommyshouldntbehere]

Vicki - that's exactly what my doc said - this is your last script, so if he hands you the pills, and you take them, your going to hurt yourself in the end... which is so true!!  I did mention camp to her, so she does know about it, but she said that the first thing that's on the plate is getting me better and healthy again, so I should go with it. Some people have no side effects, she said, maybe some slight dirreah, and I should pick up some Immodium, tums (if they work for me for tummyaches), start back up with my clonazapam as needed for the anxiety (not too much - as that can be addictive too, and I SO don't want that) but def. start back on my Prozac. W/o that, my anxiety will just increase, increase, increase while trying to detox from this stuff.  

I will give my husband my "drug purse" - lol - the old purse that I have to hide all my stuff. Pathetic, right? and tell him exactly what the doc said. Plus, the plan is on the bottle. I'm picking it up tomorrow. I am supossed to start the plan tomorrow... my problem... is that I have drugs here - that are not part of the "plan" so my inner me wants to wait it out and prolong it so I start day number 1 w/o pills when I'm at home cuz I'm paranoid, scared and a wuss.  

I'm also totally afraid of liver issues. I was floored when she said that I had to be checked via blood (helllooo - needles and I are not friends. lol) so, here I am, totally upset, migraine pounding, makeup running down my face from the crying, and it pouring rain outside, yeeeck - then to add the blood draw. not a fun day. All in all, though, I think I have a plan.. I just need to stick to it. Day by day... and the first step is to pick up the script (and also for the relpax and imitrex, though I have issues with them, that's the only way we're going to treat the REAL bad headaches right now, otherwise it's excedrine or advil sinus, etc.)

I just am so afraid to tell my hubby. I don't want him to think of me as a loser. I already feel lonely, and that I don't "do" anything all day, since I stay home with no "career" - I am just afraid of losing that "control" and my secret being out.  I guess now is as good of a time as ever, though, since doc knows... and I desperately want his support.

On a side note - when talking to my mom tonight about my headaches, I casually said, "gosh, my liver is probably shot, I"m so concerned about it" to see what she had to say, and she said that both of my brothers who had MAJOR issues, like bottles of pills a day, whatever they could get their hands on, chasing it with cough meds w/codiene, and using crack/cocaine.... they are ok... and there are tons of people she worked with at a time in her life who are total alcholics now, and they are still okay, my liver is fine. This coming though, from her - not knowing what I've been "up to" and knowing of my ocd issues with things like that.  Good to know though, that there are other people that are in the same boat as me, some less worse, some worse, and still have a clean slate. I'll take that with me to sleep tonight, because I am a big ball of nervousness waiting for that phone call tomorrow. I'm afraid she's going to have to admit me and my husband isn't home, and I have literatelly NOONE here - I'd have to have my parents called home from work... and have them take my kids.. ugh, that's just too much to think about. what would they do in a hospital for you with liver damage anyways???  I'm scared. I hate this ****.

also, my doc did say that it's totally not my fault... as we all know (she knows our family) and that part of this IS in my blood. I have an addictive personality, and it's in my blood... lots of my family have had this go on. she was very helpful, and for that I'm eternally greatful. I just hope she keeps it to herself!  :D

[mommyshouldntbehere]

oh, I forgot to mention - I'm to start the topamax as well. :)  so that should help with my migraines.

I did notice through my "off" times, that I too, would get very few headaches... this med is making them... I think. ;)

[vicki595]

Okay...FIRST:  Stop worrying about your liver!!  If you had a liver bad enough to be hospitalized for,you would be one sick cookie. Don't worry.  If you're LFT's are at all elevated,the numbers will drop after you're off all that tylenol. I'm sure you're okay based on what your Mom said!

You're not a loser. Stop it!  I had a whole glorius career before my daughter was born and I stayed home with her!  That was MY job and it has paid off,trust me!!  As she got older, I worked PRN and did some consulting from home(which I do now) .  I learned a long time ago that I couldn't live by the standards of the status quo or give in to the
pressure of" being something".  I AM something,even if I'm the only one who thinks so!!
LOL    It's all good.  Get to the bottom of this "being perfect" thing,okay?

About the "other" pills in the house...Flush them!  Do it right now...it's very empowering!
You'll get your rx tomorrow and start just as you've been advised.  Those other pills will scream your name. Don't set yourself up like that.  You'll be okay. You have the doctor on board now so if you have ANY problems,just call her. She wants to help you.

Flush 'em and post back to me so we can celebrate how strong you really are!!!

xo

[my_mayberry]

well first i am thrilled at how this has progressed...even though you still have a long long way to go. i'm thrilled because if you HADN'T come clean with your doctor, i think things could have been very different. i'm sure some can't understand why i preach DOCTOR DOCTOR DOCTOR all the time...but this is why. you've got a plan, you've got a date, and after that you're not getting any more, period...like it or not. if anything goes wrong, your doctor is well informed of your situation and can help you accordingly. it's SO much better than if you had tried to do this on your own.

now, the taper you've been given will be rough and you won't feel well. it'll be very hard, actually. if you truly want this to work, though.....you have to follow it completely and you HAVE to flush the rest of your stash. don't let yourself think about it....just flush them. be gone with them. DO NOT THINK about it...just do it and think about it after. once you do that, you've pretty much gaurenteed you're gonna get clean. then you need aftercare....or you'll eventually fail just like i did. there's many kinds of aftercare, you just need to find the right one for u.

you asked if you should postpone your taper for your kid..my answer is NO. do it. there will ALWAYS be a reason in your mind NOT to quit. "i'll just do it this once...i'll quit tomorrow...opps, just one slip.."--the excuses go on and on.

so what if you're in a bad mood for the mother daughter camp? one day if you tell your daughter "sorry i was so aweful to be with, but i was detoxing..." and explained to her that was the day you got clean and stayed clean, i'll bet she'd be thrilled. odds are you would never tell her, but IF you did, she would know it was for the better.

i would caution about the clonazepam. benzodiazepines aren't quite as addicting as barbiturates, but they can produce their own little hell too. i sometimes use xanax when i 'get clean'......the anxiety can become unbearable and so can the physical withdrawal at times and xanax really does help.....but i'm VERY careful about how often i take it. i've only taken 10 in the past 6 months and it's the lowest dose. i'm only saying make sure you don't replace one addiction with another.

the #1 thing you can do now to make sure you get clean and stay clean is get rid of all your butalbital drugs,  period....don't keep ANY. if you don't have chronic pain i'd get rid of the darvocet too. the #2 thing is focus on after care. beating addiction is a DAILY event and so you have to make it part of your life. vicky has done amazing in this respect, and you could learn a lot from her.

[my_mayberry]

oh and lastly....excedrine helps with the w/d headaches. it was a life saver for me during my withdrawal! but i wouldln't take it for any more than 2 weeks after u finish your last dose of fiorinal...reason being you may end up taking THAT everyday like i do. in a dose, there's enough caffeine for 4 sodas...so needless to say it can become a morning habbit.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

my_mayberry- that's what I fear most, is the caffiene withdrawl (withdrawal).. as sad as that is. I remember in high school, being addicted to Nodoz.... crazy. I sould have known! :D  

At any rate, you are all right - -  I do need to get rid of them. I am "officially" starting tomorrow as my start date, since I just picked up my script, and got home, having already taken 4 today... I know, not much of a winner - but I'm alloted "6" for the next two days, so from there, we go down, down. My last "pill" should be Friday, the 25, and if I plan it, I will be okay as far as w/d's and NOT be sick. I did stock up though on immodium, sudafed, excedrin and tums to take with us.  I don't plan to take the clonazapam if I don't have to - just if there is extreme axiety being at camp.  It's hard for both of us to be away from home, and I can't let her see that I'm uneasy b/c of my meds or my personal fears.  It's a Christian camp, which makes it even worse, and i just want to be that mom - actually - the mom I was a year ago... funny how much can change!  It was the only weekend we havet his camp, only from thur morning until Sat. afternoon, so I'm praying with my whole heart that I can make it. I know I can do this. i know I can.  

The fear that stands before me is my husband. I'm afraid... He'll be home after dinnertime, so once the kids are in bed -- I have to spill the beans. Give him all my pills (we can't actually flush them here -- we're on our own septic, and it's bad for our well, and can get back into our water... eek! - but HE can definately dispose of them safetly, since he is at the hospital daily)    

I am playing phone tag with my doc right now, she did leave me a message saying that my results are in and there's nothing to be concerned about, but to call her back, so I'm hoping that means good news! :)

Thank you ALL ALL ALL SOOOOOO much for this help!! you are phenomonal people and I thank you all so much for giving me the courage to get clean!

Vicki- thank you for those kind words. I do not hear those enough. I get put down all the time by working moms, even my family, for staying home. At first, things were great- but we found our way into debt via credit cards. That's where the financial burdens come from now... paying off the tv... the other things that were "Wants" and not "needs." ugh... those too - will get ya everytime.  Thank you. I truly thank you for your help and your kind words. you have no idea how happy I am knowing I have you guys here to be able to talk to.  

When all is said and done... I'm still gonna need you guys... is that okay? :)

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I am wimping out. He's almost home. no, STILL not home yet. FOUR solid days alone with the kids, and I'm really stressed out. He has the nerve to tell me that he's got a headache and he's soooo tired. I am just about ready to scream. I don't think I can do this. I just don't. I am so weak right now. You have no idea. I want to clobber him upside the head and tell him that "hungover" from a weekend with coworker buddies is not your "get out of being a father" pass after I've been ON solid without one freaking break aside from the doctor that I needed to pay my neighbor to watch the kids! I just cannot stand the respect that he has for me. I'm honestly second guessing telling him at all. .. with the way he's treating me, what's to say he's not going to just be an *** even more to me?

[vicki595]

Hey~    Don't get mad at him.  Kids are hard and work is hard.  Think about it...if the tables were turned and YOU worked all week,traveled from home,were with your co workers,would you go out with them at the end of the day?  I know I would and I have!
I'm not a drinker but I can sure dazzle til dawn!!!    
Try to lighten up a bit. You're stressed about what's ahead and I know what that's like!!
But,you need him and he's going to be your best friend. Hang on,okay??

What did she say about the tests????

xo

[mommyshouldntbehere]

here it goes... minutes before. me... just popping to say, here it goes.

I forgot to post back about my test! soory, lol. Bussssy day.

All in all, she said my levels were "a little higher than she would like them to be" but due to the amount that I was currently taking (that day, and lately) -- that's normal.. That, all should be well once I'm tapered completely down/off....  

here it goes.. wish me luck.

[mhfla]

Good luck hun!!

[RyRyBoosMom]

I'm so happy the doctor was good to you! Good luck with this, you can do it :)
As for the staying at home, DO NOT listen to others! You are doing one of the best things you can for your children, when we had our first daughter, it was tough, I had always worked, it felt like I had to ask for money. My husband worked nights, we had one car, not fun. But as they have grown up, they are charming, well behaved girls. You are able to go on camping trips because you stay home, when they are sick, you are there. Anyone who has the guts to insult you has never stayed home, it is was of the hardest things you can do! Imagine if you put that job posting in the paper how many people would apply :) It is not for everyone, but your kids will remember that when they came home from school, you were there!

[mommyshouldntbehere]

ryry - thank you so totally much, that makes my <3 full!! :) Makes me feel like what I am doing for my kids is worth something. So many people think because there's no "paycheck" that I'm nothing.  

And, that hurts more than anything!

Thanks mhfla!! :) :)

well...

we talked, and it's all okay!  He was shocked, thought something else was going on, but wasn't mad or upset and just wants to get me better again. He said he sees this all the time, with other drugs... (he works in the med. field)  -- he just wants me back to "me."   i told him my fears about being "sober" how I won't have my "numbing" thing and he said it's good to 'feel' things and now maybe we can work on getting our marriage back on track. So, that's that, in a nutshell. He's taken EVERYTHING I have... counted it out so I can "detox" and won't let me count anything, plan ahead or plan my day around my pills. Has given me what I need for tomorrow, and that's that.... We WILL do this together. :)

Sorry that's so short, but I'm wiped... heading to bed.

thanks so much you guys!! lots-o-hugs!

[vicki595]

This is great!!!   I'm happy for you and I AM wiped,as well...

You'll sleep better tonight.  :)

xo

[my_mayberry]

wonderful.

[mhfla]

Thats so awesome to hear!! EXACTLY what my husband did! And it worked out perfectly! Good luck!

[RyRyBoosMom]

That is great! I'm so glad he is being supportive. I think this will help you on your way to recovering and do some mending! You are in everyone's prayer's or thoughts here! Good luck!

[vicki595]

RyRy~  Are you taking Fioricet?

[RyRyBoosMom]

Yes, I do, the generic. Both with and w/o cod. Why?

[mommyshouldntbehere]

ryry- are you on a plan to wean or are you currently taking it?

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I'm really getting to the shakiness and sick to my tummy feeling... down to 4/day. tomorrow it's another 4/day - then hops down to two...

it's been a very rough road.... and I'm totally beat. I'm going to head to bed now, but will update again soon.

I did get an "I am so very proud of you, honey." from my husband, and even with my gut-churhning, I know something is going right.

[RyRyBoosMom]

No, I'm still taking it. No issues with it yet. I've had migraines since I was 17, but I found out I have celiac disease on Tuesday which can cause the migraines. I have a healthy fear of this medication(I also have addictions in my family, alcohol, but I have an aunt that enjoyed this med way to much) and I'm hoping by taking care of the celiac, it will cut back the migraines and I can toss these pills. Cross your fingers!

[RyRyBoosMom]

I'm sorry I forgot to say how well you are doing! I'm glad you are getting the support you need!

[mommyshouldntbehere]

ryryboo- I'm sorry to hear about your celiac! I have a good friend and our sitter who have celiac and it's been a difficult thing to deal with and overcome.  Both girls have learned to adjust on a gluten free diet and now have a wonderful life. :)  As far as the pills go, I know the feeling! I have had migraines for years! since, puberty, and they can consume your life once you get physically and then mentally addicted. try hard to not take them everyday, and then try to get off of them. They are a beast, let me tell you... I want them so badly!  Thank you so much for the well wishes, I am hanging in there. :)


_---->

On another note - I have a question... I am doing okay.. Okay, I say, because when I get up in the morning, it truly has been hell.. I am physically ill and have no energy. I do take vitamins and am trying to drink water, but still, I'm sickly. which *****.  I have come to see that most of the withdrawl (withdrawal) with this weaning is from the codiene.  I am down to TWO pills today! YAY!  I took one this morn and I will take one in the afternoon/evening and then be done with it. Hopefully get to my zumba class to sweat some of this sheeeit out. That's if I have the energy tho - that's the problem right now.
Anyways, my question is, my last days, go like this - TWO tomorrow, then ONE, then ONE.  My last ONE got screwed up and I am wondering if I can switch to the Fioranal (just asprin/caffiene/butalbital) as my last "1"  
Also - I have a call into my doc, hoping you guys could help me cuz it's mon and she will take forever to get back to me.   CAMP is on Thurs.  The last day.  I need to get thru camp w/o these symptoms in the a/m.  Wondering, can I take the "1" thru camp (sat) just to get me by w/no physical symptoms until I get home do officially do the full-on detox w/none?  I will be away from home, and it's too late to cancel - I am not, NOT going, my daughter is psyched and doesn't need to know this, she's 5, plus we cant' get back the $300. At any rate, those are excuses and if I can NOT take them and come home with two pills, I will be SO incredibly proud of myself!!! And, so will my hubby!  Right now, I'm consuming my energy and I'm extremely anxious about my daughter and me trip and fear of being sick like I have been. I just take my "1" for the day and my symptoms slowly subside and I get on with my day. I just don't know how I am going to be able to do that. If I don't need them, physically, GREAT. I just want to know if you can switch from the butalbital/caffiene/acet/codiene to the butalbital/caff/asprin.  I'm afraid of just dropping that codiene AND butalbital... and doing it as "day 1" at camp.

Help????

thanks!

ps- I can't WAIT to start up a clean days ticker! you have no idea!

[RyRyBoosMom]

Thank you, that helps :) I know you have enough to worry about! The celiac is going to be tough, you can't imagine how much you can't have till you start looking at these lists! Some lipsticks and chapsticks have gluten in them, wow. I guess you just have to think of what you can have.

I don't know about the pill subbing. I hope Vicki sees your post and can help, sadly it seems like this drug has made an expert out of too many people.

I was a girl scout leader for both my girls and enjoyed the camping trips so much. You are in my prayers, I know you will make it through for your little girl :) My 13 yr old graduated 8th grade and as we went through pictures for her yearbook, we laughed and talked about those trips! Thanks to one of the girls, I know that glow sticks are not toxic :) Your daughter will remember that you were there, I know you can do this!

[vicki595]

Hi~  I am far from an expert,myself. LOL   Yes,it's okay to take the "plain" Fiorinal.It's probably better if you do.  Removing BOTH drugs from your system is quite a shock.

What you're mostly feeling right now is codeine withdrawal. Keep tapering off the Fiorinal at a comfortable pace: slow and easy does it....

Keep your doctor in the loop and keep posting here~
V.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

My doctor is the biggest ***** ever. I came clean, I did what I  needed to do to get clean. Right? "Call your doctor and ask for help if you need to."
I call to tell her that I'm one short and then ask her if I can substitute that one for the fioranal along with the few days I am at camp because I will be there for three days. DAYS ONE TWO AND THREE OF BEING SOBER!  She's a huge ***** and tells me that I have to do the best for myself (excuse me wench, but um, my kids come first!) and said that "unfortunately, it's always going to be something."  BUT NOT IN MY LIFE!  I am SO secluded, so devestated and this is the first outing in a YEAR, since LAST year, actually that I will be able to be 'out' - I stay home everyday, and we've been looking towards this for a year. A weeks tapering has been hell - a week is not long enough, in my opinion, anyways, and I was going to continue on, but I went in and sought help, and THIS is how I am repayed?!  SEE! this is why I didn't want to tell her. She's probably thinking that I'm just a pill popping junking who's begging for more. that is NOT the case! I want off, and I'm so close, I just don't want to be in detox and like she said, "it will take about three days to feel yourself after this taper plan."  then I ask her if I can just stop now, because of camp and then I can still have those three days. She says no.  I. am screwed. my heart just aches right now. hurts so badly in fear of what's to come. I know, day at a time, but how do you do that when your five year old is already packed up? :(

This effing *****!

any suggestions? Apparently going by my doctor was a bad idea and now I have nobody to talk to.  Like I said before, I don't think she has ANY idea about these barbs to begin witn.
wench.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

ps- I am bawling my eyes out and so close to calling and refilling my other script with a doc that I have previously seen. help!

and my husband will only listen to the doctor. Even if she is a wench, he is only listening to her, and isn't understanding at all where I am coming from and keeps saying, "oh, you'll be fine. "  and "you've been doing great." Yeah, um... your not inside my head and my body!  

Help me help  him to see and understand! because I can't!  

I'm not asking for an effing bottle, just a continued taper... one a day. that's not alot!  she took me from 9 to 6 the next day. ... not right.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

oh your going to love this one, she called back, and when we were talking she said that if I want to take it through the weekend it's "comparable to a heroin addict saying that they need the heroin just to get through camp."  (Like, it's JUST camp) she does NOT get how important this is!  I told her about how this was a fast taper plan, and she says, "well, maybe on the online community, but not in the medical world." SERIOUSLY!?    Had I waited...had I waited... had I waited.. JUST THREE EFFING DAYS! I hate myself right now!

[vicki595]

Hi~  I'm sorry about this. I'm not sure what to tell you. From where I sit,the only thing you can do is decrease more to last through the weekend. Did she understand what you were asking?  Do you have any plain Fiorinal left?

Having been there,I KNOW 8 days is a fast taper for Fiorinal(not for codeine).

V.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I have like 14 of the reg. fioranal left. I'm only asking for 1 a day to get me through camp. Right now I have only taken 1 today, I was supossed to take two, and i can barely move my legs from the pain and the restlessness of them.  My husband thinks I should just have one tomorrow and then be done.  He doesn't want to give me any more than what is there for the codeine... than what the "plan" says - and that is one day short, so I'd be w/o Day number one at camp... which is going to suck. Just having going from 4 yesterday, to 1 today, hurts in every inch of my body.

[vicki595]

It's the withdrawal from the codeine that's bugging you. Why is the "plan" one day short?

I know what she's trying to do and it's fair as far as the codeine goes...the F. needs a
longer taper time. If anything,you need a refill for that and a plan for tapering.

V.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

she said that I "just need to be done" when I talked to her, she wasn't going to do any OTHER scripts for me...

The plan is one day short because I did dip into it. I was planning on taking one fioranal to drop me off, and keep it with and not tell my husband about those, and get myself thu camp, but I was honest and gave him everything, and now I'm flipping out with the 'what if I get sick.' Nobody listens to me when I say that it needs a longer taper. She says it's the addicted side in me just wanting more drugs. THIS is not the case. YES, I do want more drugs, but only to help me slooooowly progress to nothing so I have no major symptoms. Right now, I can barely walk from the pain in my legs. I mean, horrible headache and aches so bad in my legs I can't get up.  Not to mention no appetite and I can't stomach a single thing...

[LeaAnn807]

Hey!  You seem really stressed out.  I know that you want off the pills, and you have this camp coming up, but I do agree with one thing your doc said.  You have to take care of you!  Regardless of what else you have going on.  I know that your kids look forward to camp, but you HAVE to get your own health and well being under control right now, ok?  This may be a really bad time for this???  You just don't seem ready to be without the meds completely yet?!  Sorry.  I don't want to upset you, but I think your taper has been WAY to fast!

Good luck!  Vicki can really help you.  You should listen to her about this, ok?!  

[mommyshouldntbehere]

can I take advil for this awful muscle pain in my legs? is this from the codeiene?

[mommyshouldntbehere]

tramahater- Thank you for your opinion and help - yes, the taper has been to quick. my doctor is a qucak and after a bunch of thought (many thoughts actually, esp. with her knowing the whole family - and so help - me if she breathes a word of this!!!!) I have decided to switch docs.  Camp is EXTREMELY important. I wasn't going to even breathe a word of my addiction to anyone ever - and was going to just continue on. But, when my marriage started falling apart, I realized something needed to be done. I finally decided enough was enough.   Since I do stay at home, things are very stressful, all the time, Add that with a concoction of a rocky marriage, many illinesses and a car accident, along with my norm. everyday fears and anxiety, I feel like a big ball of crazy!   What's hard, is that I am not and will not let our daughter down. there's just no way. Not to mention I want to go. I NEVER get out of the house. ever... not more than an hour here or there. My kids have never even been overnight anywhere... this is very important on so many levels. It's not just 'camp.'   I wish I would have just kept quiet a few days longer. ...

I've only taken 1 today - and it *****! I have hard muscle cramps, nausea and a horrible headache.  I don't know what's to come, but I will continue on my "one" a day until the codiene is gone, (dropped down from two today and two tomorrow) to get the "plan" back on track, doing one and one, etc... then I will be given (from my husband, after he read this and is seeing what I am going through) two of the Fioranal to take IF I need it at camp.

THANK GOD!  I hope I don't need it, but it's there if i do - a slow taper is better in the long run, I know this. Going the way I dropped today, is NOT something that should be done.  

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I should clarify, the car accident and illnesses are people in my fam.

[LeaAnn807]

Ok....here's what you need to try.  Get some epsom salt and put it in a hot bath.  Also, if you can get some Hyland's Leg Cramps.  It was an absolute lifesaver for me when I was going thru WDs.  It helps leg cramps and pain better than anything I have ever seen.  It made a believer out of me!!!  I'm not a vitamin-taker, usually.  Also, get a mag/cal supplement at Wal Mart or drug store.  It helps so much too.  I could not have done without those things!

Good luck....ball of crazy!  LOL I love that one!!  Reminds me of....ME! : )

[mommyshouldntbehere]

tramahater- lol -I totally feel crazy right now! I feel like I am in a box and can't get out, my legs want to run a million miles but feel like they have the flu pain, severly. Thank you so much for your advice!! I just got out of the tub with bath salts. I will pick up some of the leg cramp stuff and the epsom salts (which, I usually have, but am out.. :( :(  )  I do actually have a magnesium supp. that I have for my daughter, for her restless legs. I think I'll go have a drink with that pwdr. mixed in... that should help.

Thanks. :)

[mommyshouldntbehere]

advil okay?

[LeaAnn807]

Yes, advil is good.  But the leg cramp stuff is the bomb!!!! : )

[RyRyBoosMom]

I am so sorry! What kind of doctor's are these, it seems like they have NO idea what they are giving you and then God forbid you do the right thing and ask for help, they can't be bothered to truly help. Try not to be too down, you got stuck with a lousy doc.

[my_mayberry]

so you're going to find a whole different doctor and  get a new script just because of camp?

if you do that, you will never get off this drug. fair warning. what you are experiencing is the road to sobriety. there IS no easy way. there WILL always be an excuse. i'm telling you....drugs will do anything to convience you to take them just one more time. your taper was fast but its already done....going back now would do FAR more harm than good. undoing everything just because of this camp will end the whole thing...period.

in the end we all make our own decisions. best of luck whatever you do...but your doctor is right. i know you'll disagree with me.....but i remember very vividly being in your position and i would have done ANYTHING to get my pills and i HATED anyone who stood in my way. i understand that. but your doctor and your husband both are right. your sobriety is FAR FAR FAR more important than one day of camp.....its the drugs that is telling you different.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

NO. I am not going to get a new script. I mean, I didn't agree with the things she said to me, and how I was treated, and so, in turn, she is losing ME as a paitent for future issues and medical care.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I got thru the night - and I feel like hell again today, I'm guessing it's the codiene?

I went from 4 on Sunday to 1 yesterday... should I just nix it right now, then?  Why play it out?

[mommyshouldntbehere]

ps- I'll say it once again, it's not "just camp"  -- think whatever you may, but if you stayed home, while your husband worked for 14 hours a day and took care of two kids by yourself and never really left the house, not to mention ever get away from home, you would understand just how truly important this is.  And, the fact that my kids are way more important than I.  i'll suck it up and deal with it, whatever may come, but I will NOT let my daughter down. do way, no how.

[vicki595]

Hi~Yes,just nix it now...  It IS the codeine for the most part.  You have the Fiorinal. If you have them avaiable to you,this is what I would do :Take 2 today and tomorrow and 1 a day Thurs through Sunday.  You should be fine. If you have a headache, take Excedrin and have some coffee.
I know you're furious with your doctor BUT you did the right thing. Don't dismiss her so quickly. She's trying to do the right thing,as well.  Also,I wouldn't refill that "other" rx.
It may put up a "red flag" if it's too close in time to your current rx.
You're doing a good job here !!!  It will be okay. Put your head in a good place and try not to be so angry.  You may come to understand why your doctor is being so tough with you.   I do.

Vicki  xo  

[mommyshouldntbehere]

thank you vicki. thank you sooo much!  :) hugggggs!

I AM going for day #1, right now! I have them, available... but I don't feel I need (moreso want, I guess my body NEEDS them  right now - but I don't want to do this all again)  So, I took two excedrin, two sudafed (70 percent humidity today, bleck, it's just a few degrees hotter than that outside.)  and my b12.  Hoping to one-two punch this migraine out. Right now, I'm going to go on a bike ride with my hubby and kiddos, gonna get these legs moving.

[vicki595]

Good girl !!!    The exercise AND being with your husband and kids is great therapy !!!!

Just keep pushing through !  You're going to feel so much better without the pills and the burden. I promise you !

I take the same cocktail of Excedrin and Sudafed and it works great with coffee...

Very proud of you~
V.

[NorcBgone]

Keep up the good work! I'm on day 6 of pain meds and this is the first morning I've woken up feeling alive. Still a little low on energy, but I can deal with that. Keep pushing, and best of luck to you!

[mommyshouldntbehere]

again, vicki- I can't thank you enough for everything and the encouragement! all of you - it helps more than you can imagine!  

I am wiped and the headache is really getting bad, so I just took an Imitrex, in hopes that it will be gone by therapy time... today's should be intersting... we're going to splurge my secret.. eek!

[RyRyBoosMom]

It sounds like a better day :) Good luck with therapy, I can't say I know how you feel, but after telling your husband, I can't imagine this will be harder. You had the guts to ask for help, so many people never do! You are strong enough to do that, you will make it through, it won't always go great from the sound of it, but imagine what a joy it will be when you feel better!

I totally understand the need to get out of the house! There I know how you feel! It takes a strong person to leave behind work, etc and become"just" mom. But the gft you are giving your kids is great and soon you will be doing it healthy and feeling good! Hang in there :)

[mommyshouldntbehere]

day one completed and done. going to soak in a epsom salt bath for my minor aches, and hope this junk is gone due to my great feeling afternoon. :)

[mommyshouldntbehere]

feelin' good today! other than stupid stress that I'm now the gossip of my husbands work... everyone is talking that "they may divorce. psst psst psst" oh, I'm so pissed! Especailly now that I have a 'clear' head and really want one, or two or five... but moreso because I really was thinking that there was hope for he and I -- and now I have to finish and straighten out this mess. ugh!

[RyRyBoosMom]

There is hope! Imagine once you are off this junk. I learned awhile ago (it wasn't easy) but you really have to do your best to worry about the people who are truly important. And it is not the gossips that your husband works with or any were else you run into people like that! Wait till the kids start school, sadly there are people out there who are only happy when someone else isn't. Forget about them and take care of you family :) Camping is tomorrow? Good luck and have FUN, it's been to long for you.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

Hi everyone.

I thought I would pop in and give you all an update.

I was doing WONDERFUL until a few days ago.

I got hit with a killer headache. I was home alone (with the kids and begged my husband for my meds because i was out of the imitrex and couldn't even drive to the pharm to get more (not to mention, he doesn't get paid until THIS fri) -- he said he trusted me ( and that's what hurts the MOST!!!!!)  And told me where they were.  All of them, the darvocet, the fioranal, everything.  That was thursday... today is Monday... and it's ALL gone, as of five minutes ago... I just took the last of it.  I am going to enjoy the last of it. For. ever.  I'm not going back to it. I am not going to do this rat race.

Please tell me theres hope for me. That someone else had a little setback, a party, a whatever.  I had an actual MIGRAINE... but then... I slipped. and slipped, and tumbled, then fell.....

but, they are ALL gone now... and I start a fresh as of tomorrow....

Am I alone?

Please, don't make me feel worse, I'm so so so so so ashamed of myself, after over a week of being clean...... I'm so disapointed in myself.  The only thing I can chalk it up to is the business of the overscheduled parties (6 in the past 8 days, my hubby worked, just me and the kids) that led to the headache, dehydration, depression, and overwhelmness.... :(

[LeaAnn807]

Ok, don't fret about this.  Get up and get some days counted back toward where you were going the first time!  

FYI------DO NOT EVER TRUST YOURSELF WITH MEDS!  I had major surgery in March, and I did not trust myself one bit!  I have been burned before by being overconfident, and it wasn't going to get me that time.  SO...I gave the pills to hubby to give to me.  I didn't like it....my addict brain didn't anyway.  But, when it was over, I wasn't going back through weeks of misery or maybe more.

You can do this!!!!  Just reset your brain, and start over, ok?

[vicki595]

Okay...You're not alone...you're not hopeless.  What you are is an addict and this was addict behaviour and nothing else.   Most of have relapsed and it's an awful feeling but you learn much from it.  It's much worse than withdrawals,I think. It's such an emotionally horrible feeling.  Just pick up and push on...

What you need is support. Professionally or NA ...you need help with recovery. It's very hard to do this alone.  Pain is a huge trigger for all of us...so are pills.  You just can't have them nearby. Your husband just didn't know...

You need to fight now...and frankly,I hope you DON'T enjoy the last of the pills now...for
your sake.


Vicki

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I know... but, now I'm all scared of NOT enjoying them.... and getting sick and something happening... like "that was the last time SHE did them" ugh, horrid!! :(  I can't even fathom if something happened to me b/c of this stupid choice.

what's good, is that they are gone. forever.

thank you, vicki for your help and support, and I am SOOOOOOOOOOO thankful.  I will look for help in the area and see what I can do. :)

[vicki595]

Nothing is going to happen...you're writing and thinking just fine.   Like all of us,you can NEVER have pills around.  I think I'm fine,feel great,very happy...BUT,if someone put a bottle of pills in front of me...I'd go nuts I think.  I just don't ever want to test that AND the whole world knows !!!  So,I feel somewhat secure...but not cozy!!!!

Check out support groups...it will help a lot...you'll be fine.

V.  xo

[mommyshouldntbehere]

vicki.... coming from a totally sober me at this point.... I could just hug you and am sending you the biggest virtual hug right now for not only NOT judging me, but for not putting me down, being in my shoes and being able to HELP me through where I'm at in my stage right now. THANK YOU. you have NO idea what this means to me.

[vicki595]

I love you,too!  LOL    You'll be okay and don't worry!!  Just do the work like the rest of us and you'll be fine...you can do it!!

xo

[RyRyBoosMom]

I am so sorry! It sounds like you are back on track. No one said this was going to be easy, listen to Vicki and all the people who want to help you. No one is judging you! You are in my prayers.

[tiggz1977]

don't leave your husband while you are high. don't do anything major untill you are clean. don't do something with your judgement impaired you might do something you will regreat later. try to stay clam and tell your doctor they have the resouces and help you need to get through this. you are not alone in any aspect of addicition. deciding to stop is the first step. your soberity is the most important thing. Pray and ask for help, he will help you through everything. he did with me ;)

God bless and good luck!

[mommyshouldntbehere]

tiggz--- I think you may have missed the big "middle" of the sandwich... I got the help and got clean, and my marriage is back on track. :) Through support here, the docs, my husband, and me, I am doing it. I slipped, but I'm back up and doing it. :)

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I'm a big ******* failure. I went back to using. again. I am currently on (only for the time being, two scripts- one for 12 (gone) and one for 20 (15 left) - then done) of Fioracet.  I have been taking the midrin with sudafed and clonazapam to put me 'out of my mind' so to speak, because it's been SO bad here. My husband and I, though reconciling, for the first month, it was GREAT - honeymoon, if you will. I did everything that was asked, everything was perfect. we never argued, disagreed, fought, life was grand. Then, he scheduled a work (fun) trip the same time as his duck hunting trip (same week) - so SEVEN days away from me and our two kids- under 5.... mind you he works 14 hour days - 6 days a week....  He doesn't see a "problem" with him leaving like this. Though he leaves like this all the time for EVERYTHING. this is his THIRD union trip this year.... now we're rolling into duck season, then bow, then deer, then ice fishing, etc - all of which he leaves town for an average of at least 5 days for, leaving me with the kids - no money to do things or go anywhere (or out to leave them with  a sitter - no fam. around) and he can go and tap the checking accnt? doesn't seem fair or right. while I'm on ebay/craigslist selling **** to get money for pills and groceries.  pills to keep me sane or I'll lose it... really. though I KNOW I don't NEED them..... I'm really lost right now.
We see a therapist. I see a therapist. I am on anti-depressants.... but nothing seems to help. Plus the kids are starting school for the first time ever.... major changes... I have a guy friend I am walking a fine line of having an affair with b/c I'm so lonely (just companionship) - and our son is having walking issues -still not sure what the deal is with that - but of course my husband doesn't "see" anything wrong with him and it's "all in my head" -- really, he wakes up and can't walk, and is walking crooked. He's been to the doc twice, sounds like a pulled groin, but still shouldn't be limping after 5 days....  don't know what to do there...

I'm just ****** up in the mind I guess. My kids are my everything and it's killing me that their dad is being such a **** that I have to literatelly BEG him to stay at home with us and give up vacations and fun trips of his to spend quality time with us. what the ****, really?

[vicki595]

You're taking the pills again because it's your escape. It's addictive behavior and it's bad.
You're taking them because you don't like your life. But,you made this decision,as many of us have,to be married and have children. That's your life right now. It's NOT easy. Ask anyone.  Talk with your therapist about this.  Some things just need to be accepted...The "no money" issue is NOT right. You need to tell your husband that...
But,the pills aren't going to help anything. They will make everything worse!!
Stop the pills and have a talk with your husband. I don't recommend having an affair!!

[janet19]

I was in the same boat with you although my drug use was a little heavier than that. I was terrified my husband would find out. He noticed the mood changes and so on. I just finally one day told him what was going on. Shock the **** out of me, but he took it well. He is now my biggest supporter and I am trying to get off. I am going to doc tomorrow and hoping to start the suboxone treatment. I have nothing to lose at this point.

With draws are horrible even if you took the med as prescribed it would be the same withdraw. Taper off is best. Figure up how many it takes tapering to on pill or even a half a pill. I went cold turkey and it is not easy and now I am using again.

I had a friend that got caught dr hoping and she had to start drug court and a bunch of ****. I do know they can catch you thats why you show your driver L.

I wish you luck and I hope everything works out for you, There are alot of people right her to listen and not judge you. I am new and it took 3 days and I think I am a pro now. I have never found a site with this much info or anyone so willing to listen.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

Thank you all for your support and kind words. I now am "sober." as the pills have worn off for the day and I can think "clearly." I DO want to be clean - and my 5 days of "fun" aka "fioracet daze/high" are done with. It's back to school with the kids and back to reality with me.  I have to face the deamons in my marriage and my personal financial situations. It's time for ME to be happy, whatever that is... and that's not including drugs.

I just needed to tell someone.... ANYONE that I did what I did. That I used again. I felt so ashamed. so horrible. so useless and no good. I'm glad to hear that others have been there too.

Each day is a new one, and every day is a step to recovery, I know this. And, I will strive to reach it. My kids mean everything to me. My husband does to. Through counsling we WILL work this out. He wants to, he just needs to break away from the 50s style way that he saw his family brought up and how his dad could come and go (and have affairs) as he pleased and his mother never muttered a word.... and that is NOT okay with me.  

I AM truly lonely. an affair isn't the answer, I know. I haven't done anything, I don't plan on it, I'm being careful and keeping distance from this temptatious man... so nothing happens.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

okay - there are NO MORE. this time, for real - because the OTHER docs are onto me, and the other one, there are no refills for - so unless I go and find another doc (which won't happen, cuz my husband will find out) I can't get any more...


my question is...

I had fioracet - 12 tabs - no codiene -  gone
then w/codiene 20 tabs - gone
one day in there (yesterday) only had 3 (non-cod) that were fioranal
have rest of 30 CAPSULES left.
Do I need to wean, or can I just take them? I don't have willpower to wean. I have to face it - if they are here - I will take them... I'm more productive and **** here at home isn't good. I need to "feel good" right now.. until things get emotionally better so I don't have to "feel" this pain. all of this pain.  


At any rate- if I've only been on the Fioracet/Fioranal for about a week - do I need to wean? that's my ?

[vicki595]

Hi~  I'm a little confused...Are you out? You have 30 now?  You want to stop? You don't want to feel this pain?

You're all over the place here.  Do this: Don't take anymore!!  It's only been a week so just stop! Throw out what you have. Get a grip!!!

Post back to me...

[mommyshouldntbehere]

Emotional pain. plus,the physical pain of the headaches with my sinuses and crying (because of the emotional stuff) causing the physical pain - thus wanitng to take more.

yes. I'm on the 30...

I have
about 20 left.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I guess also add into rejection, rejection, rejection in finding a part time job, my son going to school too (adding to the empty nest - now it's just ME) -- me having to now earn monies, change my issues per our relationship reconcialiation... plus be all the things that I feel he (and his parents) want me to be. (yes, his parents... they hold big weight at this point... a big threat, if you will)

[vicki595]

You need to stop. This won't help the problems. You need some support,counseling,NA.

If you plow through the 20,I don't know if that will change things. By then,you may need to wean so you don't have a seizure.  This is just not something you can mess with. Do you see that?   Find your rational mind and throw out those 20 pills and get your life back.  You know,everything looks a lot better when we're not stupified on Fioricet. It's just not a good fix.

I feel badly for you but you need to find some strength here...

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I know I need help and support - but it's just not feesable... this is all I've got. Honestly. I risk losing everything if anyone gets wind of this.

I don't believe i would get a seizure after only a week of doing firoacet...really?

I know your doing whats in my best interest, but you were there... you know what it's like. it feels like your chucking your best friend, your crutch, your money, your help, your friend when your bored, everything, in the garbage.... if you just 'throw them away.'

[vicki595]

Yes,you're right. I WAS there. Thank you for that. That's why I'm not there now. That's why I'm saying what I'm saying. You need to stop. And you will stop. I want it to be your idea,not just because you ate them all and now they're gone. It needs to be YOUR IDEA!     You'll take those 20 pills and then you're done. What then? Then you will be desperate. I'm trying to offer you some control.

I don't know what else to say to you. I've said everything I can possibly say.  I DO wish you well and hope you find you're way...

[mommyshouldntbehere]

thank you.

[mommyshouldntbehere]

I know you were there - that's why I said it - I wasn't trying to be rude - just that you should know how I am feeling...

[vicki595]

Do not lecture me!!!   Do not tell me what I should know!!!   I've been very sensitive to you and your feelings.  I've given you my time and some excellent advice!!  You can't follow it.  You need a lot of help. My understanding is not going to help you. You need therapy and probably in-patient treatment.  And you need to get it pretty quickly...

There's nothing more I can do for you at this point.

[loveJwhite]

This didn't go so well. That's too bad. I will keep you in my thoughts...as far as I can tell, no one was judging you, only tring to help you...good luck dear.

[dominosarah]

Come back and talk to us.......sara

[laurel453]

you speak of  going for a doctor's help as if it were something not good and i think you were the one judging Vicki not she ...Besides it is not as much as the quantity as we are all addicts...we really need help with our behaviour... if we keep finding excuses to use then it is the time to find some help, this is what viki tried to tell you... Maybe you are feeling so down that you are taking her words the wrong way but you don't have to leave the forum because of this... we are our worst enemies, we are impulsive and controlled by our inmediate emotions... don't let a moment ruin your work fighting addiction, please :)

[laurel453]

then NA meetings.... we all need help and you need it as much as the rest of us, we need addressing our addictive behaviours.

[laurel453]

oh i don't see your life as negative at all...it is only that you keep seeing  the negative aspects about your life, about this forum ... about whatever... and sure, i know we are no poison at all and you haven't had either 1,000 different opinions about your life.

until we are ready to stop we keep finding excuses to use again and again ..... and we all do much better if we ask for some aftercare to address our addictive problems... you are in a sort of denial and prefer to see these advices as an attack to you, they are not .

[vicki595]

Well, this nightmare wasn't exactly fun to revisit!!

JPHannah76:  This thread is a year old...and the original poster is gone.

[vicki595]

She's gone. The post is over a year old... just thought I'd let you know... This happens quite often as folks scroll through the threads and then post on them, the old thread comes to the top with the new threads.

[vicki595]

Matt:  No she didn't, the last screaming PM I got was very sad...

I didn't like revisiting this one at all...Man!!

Did you post to Jan from Canada yesterday; or read it..?

[Emily_MHModerator]

Hi everyone -

This thread is now closed.

Have a great day!

Emily

***************************** CLOSED THREAD ************************************
                             NO MORE POSTS, PLEASE