Helping a Vicodin addict

[jam]

My boyfriend has been batting vicodin addiction for over 1 year. At one point a few months ago, he stopped and got his life back on track after being unemployed, depresseed and addicted for 1 year. He continuously lied about the addiction and doctors visits even though it was completely obvious what he was doing. I really thought that he got his life on track, but he hasn't. He has started back up..seeking out doctors, getting the drug on the internet, etc. He tells me to "mind my own business" and let him handle this. Being that we live together, sharing not only our lives, but expenses etc, I feel that this is my business. He will not accept my help, I am willing to help him through this even though he has continuoulsy lied about this and his problem to me. I have lost alot of trust and respect for him at this point however. What do I do now? leave him? stay around and watch this whole cycle again? I love him and do want to share my life with him, but at this point, he is either in denial or just doesn't care what happens. Any advice here?

[Kerri to JAM]

Dear JAM:

You are not alone. I am in the same boat as you, and there is hope. It is my husband who is an addict. He has been addicted to painkillers for years and I had no idea... I even married him not knowing! He's lied to me so many times and when I finally confronted him,(I found some pills about 4 months into our marriage) he broke down and admitted that he needed help and wants to quit.  I, of course had so many feelings running through my head and heart... I felt cheated, angry, fooled, stupid for not knowing, and finally sympathetic, knowing he needed me to help and support him. I was so angry that he lied to me so many times, including when we said our vows. He married me keeping this big secret.. I didn't even have a choice.  Although, given the choice, I still would have married him, I love him too much.

Anyway, he did get help. Once he admitted it, and once he decided that he can't go on taking pills, he needed my support and the support of his family. He wasn't getting the pills from a doctor, but on the street, mostly from a so-called "friend" who was recently arrested on a variety of charges. So, his source was taken away and that made it easier to quit. He also confessed to his whole family... mom, 4 sisters, brother, sister-in-law... who all have been a tremendous source of support for both of us.  He also went to his family doctor and has called some counselors, although, he hasn't gone to any professional rehab or meetings or anything like that. He's getting closer to going, though.

It isn't easy. I am still having a very hard time trusting him and forgiving him for lying to me. It's been 2 months and we have had many a fight because of my suspicions and mistrust. But, as I learned from this forum, he needs your support... As long as he wants to quit. You can't do it for him... he has to want it himself. It sounds like he is in denial and isn't ready to give it up just yet. I'm not sure what to tell you to do now... I basically made it clear to my husband that He has to stop...I won't put up with it... I can't live with that. I guess in so many words, it was an ultimatum, however, I never really said the words "I will leave you if you don't stop."

Anyway, I hope I helped you a little. It also helps to confide in someone, if you have a friend or family member to talk to. This forum is also very helpful... read previous posts, there is alot of good information and support. I'll be checking back if you have any questions about my situation that may be helpful.

Good luck.

[tom to Kerri]

Kerri,
Rather than wearing out my keyboard, let me just tell you, as a 25-year rx narcotic addict, death, taxes and your husband going back to pain pills are the three things in life we can all count on -- unless he does the full-boat rehab and total-immersion 12-step (AA) program. He's made a good start -- honesty with the family and friends -- but it's not enough by a long shot. He really must do it all or you'll be right back where you started, finding pills, confronting him, etc. etc. etc.
Insist on it, or you will be walking a trail of tears for a long time. Take care.

[tom to Kerri again]

Kerri,
After my last post to you I found myself thinking of something you said in your post about your husband lying to you and how your trust in him has been compromised. Consider these words:

All human beings have opiate receptors in their brains. Therefore we are all suseptible to narcotic, i.e., opiate addiction. Becoming addicted was not a moral failing on the part of your husband. It was a human failing. Don't hold that against him. As for the dishonesty, believe me, narcotics would have turned Ghandi into a liar and a sneak. Secrecy is part of every addict's life. If your husband has been otherwise faithful and good to you, don't assume that he is somehow not the man you thought he was. Drugs make the best of us say whatever we have to in order to obtain and use. It doesn't mean he isn't a good man. Besides, he has come clean now, which should tell you that you are more important to him than the pills. Don't shame him just for that. I've said this already on this board, but I'll say it again: Shame is why we all get as bad as we do before we finally seek help. Shame is the great killer. Your husband didn't tell you before you married because he was ashamed. He was afraid you wouldn't love him if you knew.  

Without shame, there is hope and redemption. As long as he does the right thing, love him for it. Stand by him. He may one day have to do the same for you.

[Sherriq]

Tom - THANK YOU SO MUCH for what you said about shame - you hit the nail on the head.  And about the "faithfulness," too!  As you, and many others have said, only one who has been there can know.  And we DO get worse because of the shame.  A gazillion gracias' for putting so much good into such easily understood - and CORRECT - words!  How I wish the rest of the world could see us you describe - and not as moral failures.

And to Kerri - I married my husband without telling him I was addicted.  It wasn't "drugs," it was "medicine from the doctor."  We struggled with my problem (note the "we") for 17 years until I finally ended up in rehab.  That was almost 5 years ago, and in  September, we will celebrate our 22nd anniversary.  I never would have made it without his love and support.  And believe me - I sure tested it.  I am so lucky that he stood by me (and still does) and for that, I am eternally grateful.

Good luck!
Sherri

[tom to Sherri]

You're most welcome, Sherri. My wife and I will be celebrating our 16th wedding anniversary in September. Congratulations all around. As the song says, "hold your head high ..."

[John G. Lebro]

If it's Viccodin, Percodan, Morphine, or Heroine.It's all the same. Frist of all, withdrawal takes 4 to five days. Thats the physical withdrawel. Then there is the mental. This is the hardest one. Options, Drug centers, Halfway houses, Methadone Clinics, or Personal Gratification Help. Personally, I don't think to much of the Methadone Programs, They are set up to keep one addicted. I can explain that, but it takes awhile. If your interested in the methadone contact me first. Drug Centers like Charter, are just there for the almighty dollar. I'll explain that also. Halfway Houses are good, if it is a good program. The Personal way! is the most gratifing way. But, One has to want to quit. That is the first step. If your interested contact me, ***@****

[aj - in same boat and need helptoo]

One of the replies said to look into the person's eyes to tell if they are on the drug - or addicted. What does this mean and what do you look for? My husband has been using Hydro for over 3 years - from "chronic back pain" that no doctor can identify beyond tight muscles - and other treatments didn't work. Sometimes he says he's quit, but he always has a fresh bottle on hand! I've confronted him before. Worried now, cause he shows with intensity the side effects listed on websites, and he's falling asleep during eating,etc. and also suddenly developed sleep apnea. Somethings wrong with him - and I need to know how I can tell if it's the medicine, addiction, or neither. I found a perscrip. dated 4/3 for 20 tabs of hydro, and another dated 4/5 for 120 tablets of zydone. both bottles are now empty - and were filled by same doctor. 10 mg dosages. Also found cyclobenzaprine 10mg filled 4/5 that's empty (90 tabs). What does this mean?? How could he get two bottles of similar sounding stuff two days apart? I hope someone has ideas - I'm nervous and need a resource for help!

[To aj (in the same boat)from Elizabeth]

I can totally relate to your problem, except it's not a family member it is myself!! I know one way to tell if someone has taken several (more than 1-2) hydrocodone, they will usually have a pretty big increase in energy that lasts for 1-1 1/2 hours after taking them and then really fast, they get really sleppy and thier eyes will look droopy! Also in the energetic part, they will seem to be in a really good mood and talk more than usual. This has been my experience, but remember drugs effect everyone different, although these are very common side effects in most people! If you have any questions feel free to ask, I hope this helps you.

[tom t aj]

Falling asleep during eating? You don't have to look any further. That's called being "on the nod." I should add, though, that Flexeril (the cyclo) hit me like a freightrain, causing me to sleep for a long time. I hated it. It's a tricyclic, with the soporiphic effect of Elavil, an especially unapetizing anti-depression drug. That almost certainly has something to do with it. But, yeah, he's most probably getting high. Trust your instinct on this one.

Not to promote AA, but they could certainly plug you into the whole Treatment/Recovery world, such as it is. There are so many choices. I would start by lining up the detox part of this journey. You've got to get him to accept treatment, first. Good luck to you, aj.

[Cristi to aj]

Regarding looking into the persons eyes.  If someone is high on Vicodin their pupils will be tiny, even in low lighting. -Cristi

[Cristi to aj]

Regarding looking into the persons eyes.  If someone is high on Vicodin their pupils will be tiny, even in low lighting. -Cristi

[Cristi to aj]

Regarding looking into the persons eyes.  If someone is high on Vicodin their pupils will be tiny, even in low lighting. -Cristi

[aj - in same boat and need helptoo]

Thanks for all the replies. I found more bottles and such after I sent the email. From 7 different doctors! Sounds like a major mountain is ahead. So much of what you describe is him. Guess my challenge is to see if he can realize it, then help during treatment. I will research AA and see what help they have. Geeze, how can normal, healthy people get so hooked? Makes me hate the drugs. Wonder in what % of patients they do more harm then good. Makes me feel like we're lab mice - our brains get hooked and we get blinded by a drug. Guess all the extra intelligence points don't help us out much there.  If any have more advice I'll gladly listen.

[Mike to Brighty, Brian et al]

Now, I've done a LOT of drugs. The only time I hit the nod was with Percodan. For me (or your husband) to hit the nod with hydrocodone (zydone, vicodin etc.) he would have to take a LOT of them. Check your husbands car. I'm sure there's more bottles out there. Sock drawer. Hell I've got 4 empty in my car right now...from ages ago...but they are STILL there. Like an odd reminder. By the way - Vicodin pin my fathers eyes like nobody's business. After I heard/saw about that - I looked at my own after imbibing - No change. If anything they were bigger. So don't go around expecting to learn anything from the eyes only. The first time I nodded in the middle of the sentence was probably the first time ANYONE ever realized I was on ANYTHING. I thought - damn - this is getting a little out of control. Haven't done it since. Don't get me wrong, the feeling is great - and that's the problem with getting your husband off. Like Lenny Bruce said about shooting up Dilaudid - "It's like kissing God!". So, once you've "kissed God" WHY would you want to do anything else? Especially wash the dishes or something. That's the problem. No one wants to come back from paradise...even if it is only in their own mind. But like I said, if he's nodding on Hydrocodone, he's taking alot or is very effected by it. My concern would be for his immediate health - the amount of acetaminophen that he is taking is more detrimental to his body than the narcotics are. If he has finished off just what you said in your original post (140 tabs of hydrocodone this month, and you said you found more so 140 is conservative) there's a huge problem and he's in for a bad withdrawal. Stick with it. Most of us who are using are looking for something that we're missing in our lives. If you can find what he's "missing" and you can help him get more of THAT, it will be an easier road.

[vinnie]

can some one help me please, i have been on vikes for over 1 year and i must stop. i live in suffolk county long island and need to seek profesional help. is there a doctor out there for me.

[KimP]

I am in the same boat as you.  I only hope I can find this website again...I was actually searching for some and found this instead!  All I know is that you must first begin to be hones with people.  I told my closest friends and family members...then I called my family physician.  I have completed a "day treatment" program...but I only remained "clean" for 2 months.  I am beginning to beleive that it is true...in patient tx is most likely the only way.

[FROM VINNIE TO J. GINO LEBRO]

THE PERSONAL WAY IS THE ONLY WAY I BELIEVE !!!!!

[TINA]

I feel like so many of you. I love the affect of the vicodin. It all started about 2 yrs ago. when I had my wisdom teeth pulled. They sat in my closet for the longest time then for some reason I started taking them again. I would take just one at night for the longest time. Then I recently started taking 1-1 1/2 at one time because of course one is no longer giving me any affect.
My husband kind of knew something was going down hill. I filled a scrip for 50 pills and I took them all in one week. Now of course he has a bottle that he keeps hid from me and it is driving me nuts but it is the best thing for me... I want them so bad but yet I want my life back before the codon I really hate to feel like this. What are the major withdrawal symtoms and has anyone ever quit cold turkey or is that not a wise thing to do...

PLEASE HELP!!!!

[vinnie to tina]

your addiction has just started. i was up to 24 vikes a day. thats right i would take 4 pills 6 times a day. just to be normal, i would'nt even catch the buzz, i loved so much.there are certain people in this forum that have great ideas for help.i am still fighting my addiction & have a long way to go. Tina stop and read a certain posting . j.Gino Lebro, i will owe my life to him, so please read. i started just like you. 1 or 2 vikes a day. now look at me

[SA.MD WON'T ANSWER MY SIMPLE QUESTION.CO]

That's all!!!!!!!!!!!!!

After that it's all up to you. If you don't have pain then convince yourself that pain meds like vicodin are not even a high. I get more of a buzz on a beer than a 10/500 of lortab.

So once the withdrawls are over which is no worse than having a bad flu,and we all have had 4+ days of a bad flu,then be excited and look at life as precious. Think about the rut you were in. Make yourself sick when thinking about that ****. Soon you will be on your way to complete recovery.

People are so afraid of the withdrawls. 4 to 5 day flu. Are you that afraid of a 4 to 5 day flu? If not,then don't fret about a 4 to 5 day withdrawl from vicodin. It was much easier than the 5 day flu for me. And I was having morphine,demoral shots like there was no tomorrow. With 10/500 lortabs 6 times a day,maybe much more maybe not for 5 years. Then bang!!! I stopped for 2 months. On the 3rd day of not taking anything I asked,"WHERE IS THE BIG WITHDRAWL?" A week later I asked again. Nothing but a little nervous. Like stopping coffee. BIG DEAL!!!  But my back pain from my multiple fusions hurt soooooo bad ALL THE TIME,that those baby pain meds didn't touch it. Even so I didn't want to start on the lortabs again,the doctors had nothing else that could touch the pain. Still I am happy to know that I have control over the med,and not vise versa. That helps. Some times just for security and peace of mind I will go three days without. Pain abounds from my back but the Lortabs (Vicodin) is nothing more than a little discomfort. Nothing more. Maybe I am different,but this is the way it is.

[Karen to Vinnie]

Vinnie--
I think the approach depends upon the type of person you are.  If you are a strong loner type, then on your own perhaps with the help of a good doctor (not one who's watchin is own butt/wallet).  On the other hand, if you are social and like being around people, Narcotics anonymous might be helpful.  If you have to be taken care of for the first few days and your insurance will pay, the treatment center (though heavily after $$$)will provide that type of care, and take you to your first few variety of meetings (AA, NA, CA, and in bigger cities Rational Recovery).  All of these options simply require a few phone calls and a whole lot of courage.  Good luck.  There are people who can help.

Karen

[Vinnie to Karen]

Karen, the 1st step and the big one is DO YOU WANT TO STOP? if the answer is yes and im sure it is. look at your self in the mirror, Karen we all love the vike buzz, can you live like this forever? ***@****

[jbro]

I am a morphine addict.  I became addicted thirty years ago from medication I recieved for wounds suffered in Viet Nam.  I went through withdrawals and treatment in 1971. I then went about my life and never really thought about my addiction as a serious problem.

In 1994, my wife had colon cancer and was prescibed Lortab in large quantities.  Later on she had to have morphine and Dilaudid.  To cut a long story short, I was hooked again.  I remember crying as I took her morphine and injecting it into my own arm!  I also wrote perscriptions for more over several months which eventually got me busted and into Detox.  Now, after several years I still think about narcotics daily.  It is like a lost Lover that I am seeking.  Does this make any sense to anyone out there?  The saying is "Once a junkie, always a junkie".  I still have dreams at night about the stuff which are more real than those of even SEX.  I think that the feeling one gets from narcotics can be compared to an orgasm and the delivery method is the act itself.  Can you relate?

Thank you!
JBRO

[To JBRO from Elizabeth]

I was just wondering about what happened when you were writing your own scripts and got busted? I have a good friend that has been doing the same thing for awhile, and I am so afraid they are going to get caught!!!!!! I would like to know how you were doing it and how you got caught,if you would please give me any info. it would really help. I keep telling my friend they are going to get caught and he does not think so!! So I was thinking that if I could tell him a story of someone, like you, getting caught it may help?? Thanks for any help you can give!!

[Brian to JBRO]

Yes, I can definately relate.  Studies with monkeys have shown they will choice an opiate over food and sex ALL of the time.  They will even choose the opiate over food until they starve!  Since our brain chemistry is similar, your own experiences are commonplace and expected with this serious disease.  Relapse, even after many years is not unusual.  The drug dreams are also pretty common and can continue for what seems like a long time after use.  The good news is that with time the cravings, drug dreams, etc. diminish.  The bad news is that you never know if they are gone for good, or are only lurking and waiting to come forward.  I guess that's why a program like NA seems to be so successful.  By keeping the addiction in the forefront of your mind, you are best equipped to battle it.  Good luck on the future and thank you for your service to our country.  I have high regard for those of you that served during the war everyone seems to want to forget.  Best wishes.

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

The way I got busted was my pharmacist told me he was out of MSIR but that he called another pharmacy that could fill my script. While leaving, I was met by two officers who took me into custody.  I confessed to the whole thing later when I realized that the police and my pharmacist were trying to help me out of this nightmare.  I live in a small town and everybody pretty much knew that I was in trouble.  I agreed to Detox and treatment and no charges were ever filed on me.  I was very lucky indeed.  I had taken over $740.00 of narcotics in less than four months and morphine is very inexpensive at about 50 cents per 30 mg dose.  It was a nightmare in every sense of the word.  

JBRO

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

To Elizabeth:

     Tell your friends to stop because it is just a matter of time before they get caught.  I had made copies of all my wife's scripts so it was easy to duplicate them on to script blanks I found at the medical center.  You really have to be desperate withdrawals or totally stoned to pass forged scripts.  When I look back at what I did it is mindboggeling considering that I was supposedly an outstanding member of my community.  Your friends may not be as lucky as I was!

   Take care,   JBRO

[DJG]

I started taking Vics in 1981 when I started having BackSurgeries now in the year 2000 after 6 Back Surgeries,Strokes,and having Diabetes I'm on Lorcet10/650 plus Oxycontin 80mg. Is there any hope for me, or am I doomed. The doctors say my pain is so severe it causes my blood pressure to rise, which effects me having mini strokes,and my sugar, so what do I do???????????Can anyone answer me or talk to me????????

[Brian to Sick and Scared § ALL you guys]

Narcotics are perfectly appropriate for chronic pain patients.  Tolerance will develop but this is NOT the same as addiction.  Please do not feel bad about using narcotics for chronic pain.  Those of us who are addicts are different from those with chronic pain and tolerance to their medications.  Are you having problems due to the medications?  Why do you ask if you are doomed?  Some people have to stay on narcotics for their entire lifetime.  Use a cost-benefit analysis.  Would your quality of life be any better if you stopped the narcotics and lived in terrible pain?  Doubtful.  Only you can decide however.  I know it is a difficult thing to face.  I wish you luck.

[janie]

Hello,

      If there is any men out there can can help me with some questions about Lortab/Vicodin addiction that my husband has would you PLEASE email me at ***@**** I am wondering about  could these drugs make him sterile!  Please reply!

[John]

You know everyone is asking about how much is too much, or if you need help.  Whatever the question may be, if you are thinking about being on pain killers allot as (maybe) being a problem,  99 percent of the time you are already crying out for help.  In my case I have been taking the hydrocodone for about 3 months straight, because I have severe dislocations of my shoulder on a regular basis, and have already had 2 operations.    I just came off the vicodin two days ago, after abusing the drug for about a month, taking much more than the recomended dosage.   At my peak I was taking 15 plus of the Vicodins each day.   So after taking that high (abusive) dosage of the drug for a period of time, I noticed ways it was effecting my life.  I was having more arguments with my girlfriend, I was turning into a lame person, that just wanted to sit around on the couch all day, meanwhile I usually am a very much an outdoorsman.   It was like I was going into hibernation.  Well realizing that being on the drug for the summer, has really destroyed my summer, I came off of the drug 4 days ago.  They way I did it, was called my doctor and had him cancell my prescriptions, telling him that I was abusing the drug, then flush the remainder of the pills down the toilet.  Next the little withdrawel kicks on.  Nothing serious, just feels like a weak version on the flu, with hot/cold sweats for a couple days, dizziness, stomach upset, and so on.  Dont worry about the symptoms,  they are strong enough to know why you are sick, and what you are going through, however, weak enough as not to affect your work or life.    So just hang tough, because they go away on the third or 4th day, and thats it, you are off.   Now the first leg of the battle is won.  The way I plan to finish the fight, is work only with my doctor who understands my problem, and this way we can work out alternative medications, instead of the narcotics, that some of us fall prey too.   Just remember, you ar e never alone, just seems so at the time,  but you bounce back quick,  its human nature.  I have never felt better than the past week,  back into my old routine of riding and working out everyday,  taking it day by day,.

[Bethanyatg]

You can not help someone that doesn't want the help. Your husband needs to have the energy and will to quite for himself. You should join alanon or one of those types of support groups to get help for yourself. You need to find your own happiness because your husband is not going to be there for you like he once was until he decides to get clean. An addiction is an addiction whether it be vicodin, methadone, percocet or even smoking. When your husband wants support be there for him but don't ruin your life trying to fix someone that doesn't want fixing. I am working at finding my own happiness and Alanon is giving me the support to do just that.  It is horrible to watch someone you love suffer so terribly. It hurts but there is help out there for him when he is ready and for you during these trying times.

[wait2long]

sorry hun, but you are posting to an old thread from year2000, 7 years ago.... we have all done it...LOL

[Tonie47]

It sneaks up on you!!! don't do it!!! its not even good, you get rebound headaches and you think you need it to help the pain.,but you really really don't.  It took me a week.  I was restless, stomach pain, tremendous joint pain!!!! my bones ached, I thought I was developing arthritis.  The good part, no more constipation!!!!!! and now I can think better.  I must be very honest and say I never exceeded 5 or 6 a day.  I'm not sure how others do it, it gives you a severe stomach ache, and dry mouth.  You become sleepy...never good for a professional person, or anyone for that matter.  Just stop is all I can say.  I'm 125lbs, so maybe that amount for a female is excessive if you think about it.  It becomes an addiction, in my eyes, when you think you need it, you don't want to run out of it, you don't want to share it, you think about it all the time....Its like a love affair...sadly.  Most of us have had to get over at least one great love, so that's kinda how it is.  The best thing is you do get over that feeling of having to have it.  Then you find yourself and all the beauty you were missing.  Even food tastes better.  Your senses are awaken, and you also see everything you let go!  Fix it!!! You can do it.  Even if your life is a mess, you will be able to get the things you need to make it better once you're more aware.  Find your friends, your family, your support group, church, this forum!
Best wishes to all, I have the messiest house to clean, and I don't just mean my home.

[ektnef]

I empathize with many of you in all these situations (friends, spouses of users and addicts themselves).  I've been through some things myself and am still finding my way out.  I want to say that the help of loved ones and treatment programs are essential to overcoming addiction.  Still, there's one thing that seems to be lost in many of these discussions.  Addiction of all types (not just drugs and alcohol) is often a symptom of other issues.  With many people there is something that gets them to start and continue using.  But, as we all know, after a while, the catalyst for drug use becomes eclipsed by the psychological effects of the drug itself.   Basically, the alcoholic who took his/her first drink can no longer have one drink without drinking the whole bottle.  Psychology and biology conspire to make quitting feel impossible.   Most of us with any experience (personal or otherwise) know this well. The question I want to ask everyone here is, what do you do with your emotions when you leave your addictions behind?  

I don't have too much to offer "jam" except to tell her that if my husband actually noticed and was worried enough about me to post a question on the internet, I would be grateful.  Granted, I'd feel angry and violated for about five seconds before I realized he was actually observant and interested in my well-being.  No drug I've ever done would ever compare to him sitting me down, looking at me and saying, "Honey, what's going on in your head and how are you feeling right now?"  

I haven't done it in a while, but I've taken vicodin in the past to make the things in life that sadden me more bearable.  I know a lot of it is poorly-treated depression.  But I think that to overcome any drug problem, you have to replace it with something better...communication, expression, intimacy, exercise and so on.  

For "jam", the only advice I can offer (beyond what everyone else has said--treatment, therapy etc...) is to talk to him without judgment.  Just get him to talk (not too easy with most men!) Try to help him find out what exactly it is about drugs that makes him feel better (is it feeling high, happy, numb?)  It's different for everyone.  Try to help him think and feel before and beyond the drug use.  Help him figure out who he is, who he wants to be and what he wants his life to turn out like.  Try to see the drugs as a symptom of a problem.  But also help him see that while drug use may start out as a way of coping with other things, they eventually become the problem itself.

Good luck to you and your boyfriend.  

[ektnef]

I just looked at the time/date stamp on the original question and realized it's from 2000, eight years ago.  Well, I'm an idiot.  Still, I think the painkiller problem is just getting worse and the issue is still quite valid.  I don't post things on the internet much but if anyone reads any of my postings here, let me know. good luck to all.

[Rose703]

Hi and welcome to the forum!! This is a very old post but I wanted you to know I still read it and it sounds like you've overcome addiction yourself? I loved your response to Jam as it hit the nail right on the head.

If you ever need a friend let me know or post a question yourself and you will be amazed at the knowledge and caring from the people on this board. I found this board at the most important crossroads of my life and thanks to everyone here, I've never looked back. Thanks for your caring response and I do wish you would join in on the up to date posts as you have alot of caring insight!!

[ektnef]

Thanks for your response, it was quite kind.  Can you direct me to some of the up-to-date posts for this type of topic?  I cannot say I've overcome the desire to numb myself and/or change my emotional state with drugs/alcohol completely.  My issues are very directly related to what they call "treatment resistant depression" (I also call it 'ongoing existential angst').  Still, reasons for drinking or taking drugs can quickly take a second place to results of drug/alcohol use itself.  What starts as 'self-medication' becomes dependance and addiction. I empathize with people going through all of this.  Living isn't the easiest thing sometimes.
Thank you so much for responding!   I'm glad someone actually read what I wrote (given the date of the original post!) :)