How long?

[twindad]

Hello everyone, yesterday I tookmy last percoset. I was able to sleep OK last night, but I feel no energy this morning. How long will it take before I can wake up? I had been taking the percs for 2 years. I was up as high as 20 a day. I am glad I quit, but feel like ****.

[groovygirl]

Hi and welcome.  I don't remember seeing any posts from you, but I haven't spent a lot of time here lately.

I'm sorry to tell you, but it's going to be awhile before you feel human again.  I was taking about the same amount of meds as you, and I tried detoxing many, many times by tapering, cold turkey the "recipe" etc.  I couldn't do it...finally I started taping Buprenex...I've been on it since April.  No withdrawal symptoms whatsoever, however, now I'm hooked on bup.  Most people have a much easier time getting off the bup than I have, but I also have chronic pain issues.  I have tapered the bup so that I am taking approx 1 amp per day...as opposed to 6.   I can live with that for awhile I guess, but eventually I'd like to be off it totally.

You should really try "Thomas' recipe" if you are going the cold turkey route.  I've heard it works great if done correctly...I didn't give it the chance to work.  When I get off the bup entirely, I will use it.

Anyhow, you are probably going to feel worse before you feel better.  Stock up on Immodium and perhaps get something to help you sleep.  Drinking lots of fluid, especially Gatorade, really helps too...you DON'T want to get dehydrated.

Anyhow, do a search on this site for the "recipe" - you can get everything at your local vitamin store...GNC or whatever.

Keep writing, and try to stay positive...I know, easier said than done right?

[twindad]

I have chronic pain issues as well due to a broken back in an auto accident some 20 years ago. My new doc tapered me down starting a six 10/650 per day, then 4 per week until my last script was this weekend of 6 pills. Of course, I took them right away because if they are there, I will use them. I don't have the shakey body anymore, just feel weak and tired. I know this will be it for me this time. I nearly lost what means most to me, my 4 year old twin boy and girl.

[groovygirl]

Well, you sound determined...that's a good thing.  Plus, you have your priorities straight...another good thing.  Now, you just have to deal with feeling like **** for awhile.  It seems that for most people, they really don't feel "normal" again for about a month.  

The lethargy is the thing that seems to drag on the longest...and the depression.  Has your doc suggested antidepressants?  Has he/she given you anything for sleep or anxiety?  There are things you can take to ease the discomfort...you don't have to be in total misery.  

If you've tapered very slowly, it should be somewhat easier.  I've never known anyone to get thru it quickly...actually one person here claims to feel great after a few days, but I find that VERY hard to believe.  It took you a long time to get to this point, so it makes sense that it will take awhile to get back to feeling good, right?

Just think, in a few weeks you will be able to enjoy your precious babies without feeling like you're in a fog...congratulations on quitting.  You're doing the BEST thing for yourself and your family.

[CATUF]

How long you feel bad and how bad you feel will likely depend on your level of use prior to quitting.  If you went from your highest use to zero it will be worse and longer than if you tapered down to minimal use.  Even if it's bad, you should only feel like pure hell for 3 or 4 days and that's really no more than a bad case of the flu.  For me, the worst part was the Restless Leg Syndrome (aka RLS) and the general feeling of wanting to crawl out of your skin.  It helps if you can take a few days off work -- at least this is not a bad time of the year to be calling in with the flu.

In either event, you'll want to check out the Thomas Recipe, which is availble on this site and which helps alot with the worst parts of WD.  Also, start getting exercise as soon as you feel half way up to it.

I'm on day 29 and have been feeling pretty much back to normal for a while.  I'm not exercising enough yet, but I'm eating, sleeping and sticking with he Recipe.

I feel better than I have in a LONG time -- maybe not as good as those first few highs back in the old days when I thought I had found a miracle, but WAY better than during all that time I chased, but never quit caught, that feeling.  Better than how I feel physically, however, is the mental and I guess I'd have to say spiritual changes: I'm back in touch (as opposed to removed) with my family and the world; and I no longer feel like a fraud (who might be unmasked at any moment).

Good luck to you.

[Tucker's Pam]

Just a word of warning on the Percocets.  I just had a client die from the overdose of the acetominophen from the Percs.  If you are still taking a lot of them, take Percodan or talk to your doc about this.  It was enough for me to quit all narcotics but now I am in so much pain, searching for a middle ground.  I am trying everything, neurontin (gross!!), buckets of Ibuprofen, Aspirin, etc.  Going to the doc today and hope there is something they can do. Nothing really works like the narcotic tho.
I detoxed (in the hospital!! do NOT try this at home)from daily 160 mg of oxycontin on September 4th so no more of that **** but what else can I do to treat the pain but not be so risky?  I am at the point where I am ready to ask for a light narcotic but I am so scared of the addiction/withdrawal.

[twindad]

Thanks all for your words of encouragement. I weaned down pretty slow,so fortunately for me, I don't feel "sick". Although, I can't quit yawning and little bit of shakes. I am still in a lot of pain in my back, but I know now, I am an Addict and therefore do not have the ability to moderate myself when it comes to Percoset! I would rather live in pain the rest of my life, then to not be daddy. The sounds of those words alone, make the pain not so bad.

[nena65]

I wish I could answer your question, but I am just nowstarting my detox from Vicodin.  This is day 2 without them and I pretty much feel like ****.  I did buy the ingredients for Thomas' recipe and it seems to be helping (I was able to drive my son to school anyway).  I actually have detoxed the violent way once, but I didn't know I was going through withdrawal.  I ran out of pills, couldn't find anymore and several days later was in the emergency room.  It didn't hit me until later that I was having WD.  You know what has helped the last two days....an ice pack.  I don't know about you but from my neck up, I get soooo hot.  I have been sleeping as much as possible and keeping my ice pack with me.     Hang in there......

[twindad]

You know, it might sound a little crazy, but I feel like for myself, it has to be somewhat uncomfortable. Because it feels like a reminder that there are consequences from doing what I did and letting my life spiral out of control. In all reality, I have a pretty good life. I have a Master's Degree in Counseling, a cushy job working for the State, we own a nice homeand I have a beautiful wife and two great kids. I guess addition knows no boundries!

[ChiTownGirl]

Any chance you can get some Clonidine from your doctor?  Believe me it will help with the anxiety.  Welcome to the forum, I don't think Ive ever seen your name posted!   ChiTownGirl.

[Sugarbeens]

A Master's in Counseling!  Now someone who I can relate too, like Witchywoman.  Me, I have a Master's in Social Work, same thing , huh!  Working on getting my license as a LCSW.  I never took drugs or drank much, but, when I turned 40 my new pain management doc gave me vics.  All my back pain and emotional pain went away. I even left my husband of 20 years and felt like I could do anything.  I go back and forth now thinking did I leave because of the pills, or was I really so unhappy when my last child left home, that I had to get out. My marriage wasn't perfect, not by a long shot, but, Iwas determined to make it work.  I no longer wanted to deal with it.  So now I am 48 and alone!! Do you want to be alone???  If you have a family, do everything you can do to keep it together, unless, the relationship causes you emotional pain.  I am going into my monthly withdrawal.  It is not too bad, probably because I do it every month.  I do not pay for illegal drugs, I take what my doc gives me and then when I run out, I make myself suffer.  If you are very determined and want a beautiful life with your family, then stay clean if you can.  All it really takes from what I can see is to really want something more than the drugs. Me I am alone, but am very active in my grown childrens lives.  They are my world.  I was always a mother first, didn't know anything else, and had a horrid childhood.  Then my kids got married/or moved away.  I fell in love with another LCSW, even though I knew he was not relationship material.  Just one of those real charmers.  We are still friends, but, if I could go back, I probably would have stayed in my marriage. I have never told this story here before, but, after seeing your post and your anquish, I had to reach out to you.  Remember what we learned in school, we have both weaknesses and strengths!  Reach for the strengths you have to save yourself and your children.  I will be thinking of you.  Love to all on the forum.

[suzieneedshelp]

Congratulations!  You go gurl!  I am so proud of you!   I envy your courage.
Suzie

[nena65]

Addiction has no boundaries....having Masters degrees (I wasn't planning on bringing my education to the forum, but mine is in Behavioral Sciences) makes us no different.  It doesn't mean we have more to lose, because those who dropped out of high school still have children to lose, family to lose and above all, self dignity to lose.  In fact, through my work I have met some poverty ridden mothers who were great parents and through my own life, I have met people who live in 250,000 dollar houses who were horrible parents, so I personally don't think that having material possessions or diplomas will help us beat this addiction.  What will help is a strong desire to quit and feel good about our lives whether we are having an extraordinary day or a shitty day.  I want to know that if I have a bad day, that I at least faced it without being under the influence of drugs and that I can strive to make tomorrow better without the pills.

I agree with you twindad, I also didn't want my WD to go too smoothly as I might think it is okay just to relapse temporarily......

[FesterTool]

Hey everybody. It has been awile hasn't it. Just when my life was getting the best it has in years, (14 days off), it takes a drop into the worst moment of my life. I got the phone call on the 17th, a thursday, at a little after 11:30. I was suprized to hear the sound of my father crying whom I have only heard cry once before in my whole life. He was crying hard while he talked. He told me that mom was gone. I suddenly felt my throat close and the tears come. I gasped out a "What!?!" in between sobs and we both cried together on the phone. I had a flight in the morning. After the funeral, (Still too sad. The doctors said she died of a massive heart attack.) I stayed with dad untill last saturday. I still cant believe she's gone.
Change of subject---

The good news is I am still clean. 25 days. I hope and pray that everyone is ok and doing fine. Bmac? Still running strong? Pixi? How have you been crazy.

Stay cool
festertool

[Sugarbeens]

Nena, you misunderstood what i was saying.  Believe me, I know addiction has no boundaries.  My degrees mean nothing to me, it is my family that is important.  I went into the field because I have always wanted to help people.  Problem is, I never let anyone see who I really am, so someone could help me. Even though I got addicted to painkillers because of pain, my intentions on this earth is to help as many people as I can.  Festertool, if I got that name right, I am so sorry about your mom.  Some people like you, are very lucky to have such wonderful parents.  We are not all so lucky.  Maybe, Nena, I have worked hard to be able to help others, because I can't help myself.  Bless you, and I hope you understand what I mean. Love to all.

[groovygirl]

I like what you said about "addiction knowing no boundaries."  I don't think our educational backgrounds have much to do with our addictions, and I'm not sure why people bring it up.  I never bring up my education unless I'm on an interview.  Someone once said to me that if you are 30+ years old and you continuously bring up which college you went to, how many degrees, etc; then you probably haven't accomplished much since then.  It's more important to hear about what people are doing now...addicts are addicts whether they are doctors, garbage collectors or unemployed.

[kornie]

Hi.  New to this forum.  I have fibromyalgia (is this the correct spelling) and chronic back pain from herniated discs....age...etc.

i've been taking 3 Vicodin a day for about 1 year and 1 Soma a day, sometimes 2.  I am in recovery and have kept very close to my support group, but I want to stop taking the meds now.

Today I took 1/2 Vicodin in the morning, 1/2 SOma about 3, and just now started feeling very dizzy so I took another 1/2 vicodin.  My goal was to take just 1 of each for 3 days. and then stop totally.

What do you think?  Is this a safe way to do it.

At this point I don't care about the pain....it's there whether I take the pills or not.  And I want to be clear of mind...

[kornie]

Can someone please tell me where I can get THomas Recipe.

Thanks

[twindad]

I don't believe that people should be scorned for sharing their station in life. I, myself, and damn proud of the Masters Degree I got. The reason that I choose to share, is because my degree in Counseling has led me to work with numerous people who have shattered lives, and many of them, due to drugs. Therefore, I should have known better than to allow myself to become out of control. Furthermore, I have done a great deal with my life since I finished my education. My education has taught me to continue to set goals and work towards achieveing those. If you don't want to share your education, that is up to you. However, if I can find kinship on this forum, then I may be better served talking with someone with a similar background.

[Sugarbeens]

YOu said it better than I guess I did.  All my childhood, I was the outcast in my family, so in a way I set out to prove I could do anything.  I did the degree thing, because it was the only way to be able to be a therapist and help others.  I certaintly don't make much money, as I have stuck to the same job for many years with low pay , because it is so rewarding. I used to come to this forum as Butterbean and had to change my name because for some reason I couldn't get onto it with that name anymore.  I rarely post , mainly, because this forum has so many people lashing out at others, when it is about helping each other. I really don't know what happened, but, many have left and I will only post when I see I can make a difference.  I wish you the best of luck and believe me, you will be in my prayers.  Just remember, you can do this if the right time is now.  You sound like you are much younger than I, so hang on to what you love with all you have.  I know you wouldn't have gone into the counseling field if you didn't want to truly help people.  It pays didly!! Right.  But, who cares, when you see that one little girl, or adult, become a better and happier person.  I think we love others a lot more than we love ourselves. As Skipper used to say when he came on this forum, keep an angel on your shoulders.  Love to all.

[DIRTBAG]

Its me dirtbag I've got a new name. How are you doing today? Out stories are similar and I'm feeling for you but once you know what the w/d symptoms feel like its a little easier to take but very hard when you are working or needing to meet responsibilities. I think most people on pills started getting them from the doctor and then took more and more.  You sound like a nice girl and its good you found the web site, wasn't it surprising to hear all the people talking about what you keep a secret everyday? Keep up the good work longhauler

[nena65]

I also am proud of my education, but everyone hasn't had the opportunities we've had in life.  I just noticed that I have read two posts by you so far mentioning your big house, cushy job and advanced degrees.  I just felt like that was your way of saying "I'm not like you people."  It is ironic-I also have worked for the state for almost 11 years, but I'm not sure of the relevance.

I'm sure there are forums where people would like to discuss their various degrees.  For here, I come for help getting off these damn pills.....

[nena65]

Hi.....I'm doing allright today.  It feels good to be able to focus better, like I said, whether it is focusing on the good or bad, at least I'm focusing on reality.  I thought you had changed your name to peagravel (or was that someone else)?  I'm still new, still learning names.  It is scary, thinking about facing all the problems in my life with a clear head, but I left myself no option.  I spent money, time and energy just to stay disoriented.  So, I ask, how are you doing today?

[hippy]

receipe
l-tyrosine 500mgm 8 a day week 1 4 a day weeks after.
b-6 100mgm  2 a day
a strong multi vitamine
vitamines  A  ,C  AND  E
manganese
phosphorus
zinc
calsium- magnisum
imodium (immodium) for the runs and shits
bannas for rest less leg
gatoraide for lost eletrolites

valium or xanax for sleep wek 1
lots of hot baths
post a lot here at the fourm for support.
the imodium (immodium) is very important the runs deplete our systems of all nutreints and this cause more pain then need be.

[DubeMechanic]

Hi Kornie

That sounds like a good plan. Maybe one change, take a whole vic in the morning, then 1/2 in the afternoon and the other half at night for a week. Then do the 1/2 bit morning noon amd night. If you can cut them suckers in 1/3s you might try that the 3rd week.

The somas are good they way youre taking them now.

Youre on a fairly low dose (compared so a lot of us here), so your WD shouldnt be that bad.


Here is the "recipe".. cutnpasted from another thread.
================================================================
Thomas Detox Recipe

PLEASE NOTE: I am not a doctor, simply a long-time Rx opiate junkie who has had many opportunities to develop a way to detox. This is a recipe for at-home self-detox from opiates based on my experience as well as that of many other addicts. It is not intended as professional medical advice. It is always wise to make sure none of the recipe ingredients or procedures conflict with medications you may be taking. Likewise, if you have any medical condition, disease, allergy or any other health issue, consult your doctor before using the recipe. Thanks, Thomas

This recipe is designed for cold turkey opiate detox. It assumes that you can get about 5 to 7 days away from your job or household responsibilities during which you can sleep, veg and act as miserable as you feel. Opiate WD mimics the symptoms of the common flu, so, if you need a smokescreen, hide behind a bad case of the flu.

NOTE: If you can't take time off to detox, I recommend you follow a taper regimen using your drug of choice or suitable alternate -- the slower the taper, the better.

You'll need:

1. Valium (or another benzodiazepine such as Klonopin, Librium, Ativan or Xanax). Of these, Valium and Klonopin are best suited for tapering since they come in tablet form. Librium is also an excellent detox benzo, but comes in capsules, making it hard to taper the dose. Ativan or Xanax should only be used if you can't get one of the others.

2. Imodium (immodium) (over the counter, any drug or grocery store).

3. L-Tyrosine (500 mg caps) from the health food store.

4. Strong wide-spectrum mineral supplement with at least 100% RDA of Zinc, Phosphorus, Copper and Magnesium.

5. Vitamin B6 caps.

6. Access to hot baths or a Jacuzzi (or hot showers if that's all that's available).

How to use the recipe:

Begin your detox with regular doses of Valium (or alternate benzo). Start with a dose high enough to produce sleep. Before you use any benzo, make sure you're aware of how often it can be safely taken. Different benzos have different dosing schedules. Taper your Valium dosage down after each day. The goal is to get through day 4, after which the worst WD symptoms will subside. You shouldn't need the Valium after day 4 or 5.

During detox, hit the hot bath or Jacuzzi as often as you need to for muscle aches. Don't underestimate the effectiveness of hot soaks. Spend the entire time, if necessary, in a hot bath. This simple method will alleviate what is for many the worst opiate WD symptom.

Use the Imodium (immodium) aggressively to stop the runs. Take as much as you need, as often as you need it. Don't take it, however, if you don't need it.

At the end of the fourth day, you should be waking up from the Valium and experiencing the beginnings of the opiate WD malaise. Upon rising (empty stomach), take the L-Tyrosine. Try 2000 mgs, and scale up or down, depending on how you feel. You can take up to 4,000 mgs. Take the L-Tyrosine with B6 to help absorption. Wait about one hour before eating breakfast. The L-Tyrosine will give you a surge of physical and mental energy that will help counteract the malaise. You may continue to take it each morning for as long as it helps. If you find it gives you the "coffee jitters," consider lowering the dosage or discontinuing it altogether. Occasionally, L-Tyrosine can cause the runs. Unlike the runs from opiate WD, however, this effect of L-Tyrosine is mild and normally does not return after the first hour. Lowering the dosage may help.

With breakfast, take the mineral supplement.

As soon as you can force yourself to, get some mild exercise such as walking, cycling, swimming, etc. This will be hard at first, but will make you feel considerably better.

PLEASE NOTE: If you have any medical complications, first check with your doctor before detoxing to verify that this regimen is safe for you.
=================================================================
Good Luck!

DM

[hippy]

education is a great thing, and people shoud be grateful to haver had the oppertunity.
i have 4 doctors in my imedete famly, along with
a bunch of social workers, and other degrees.
i myself grew up in the projects and turned down my baskeball scholarship, because my girlfreind got pregant. and i got a union card, i was in full blown drug addiction by the age of 18.
i paid for my youngest sisters collage.
in the end it's what we do in life that matters, how many people we help, how many live's we have a positive effect on.
my sister in law is a shrink and is in this book that is printed and has the best of the best through out the country.
of course she is in the book and gave me a copy.
she is one of the best in the country at her job.
but she live a lonly life, she sent her son to harvard and mit and hes a doctor and he got married and moved away.
she hardly ever hears from him. it's funny how life
works out som times,
when we are addicts it s best for us to sey aside our differences. it gives us a better oppertunity to
get along with others on the same path.
they have lawers only meetings in  aa and cops only, and
fireman ect, i always thought a meeting for anyone suffering
was my kind of place.
im a man and i have been a union painter, i have been a boss for twenty years, ivrun all kinds of giant jobs and im very good at it, but my grand mother is  a retired doctor age 97 she has out lived her money, she always wanted me to be a doctor, but life
is very strange, i raised my kids as a single parent for a few years untill i remarried,im 42 and a grand father and i see my grand son every week,  i gratefull for what i have.
and i will always be there for others.
peace!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[athena]

I am so sorry about your mom.What a sad and stressful time for you.I am so proud that you managed to stay clean even after going through that kind of loss.I hope you are proud of yourself.You are stronger than you ever gave yourself credit for.
I lost my dad 5 yrs ago and it was the hardest thing I have ever been through.Time was the only thing that helped me accept it.I will keep you in my thoughts and prayers.Your mom would really be proud of you.
I don't post as much,but I read the posts most every day.I will be here for you if you need encouragement.
Yeah,im still as crazy as ever.lol

pixi

[athena]

Hi
I just wanted to tell you that you do make a difference on this forum.You are always giving encouraging words to someone.I love to read your posts and you should be proud of your education.What we choose as a career can speak volumes about the type of person we are.Your personality obviously matches the career path you chose.You seem to love to help others.Don't worry about the ones lashing out,think about those you are helping.

pixi

[nena65]

I wanted to come to this forum to get help (and maybe provide some) to those going through what I was going through with my addiction.  Now I feel like an idiot for "announcing" my education, though it was in response to another post.  Now I feel like I'm at a posh dinner party with everyone trying to upstage each other with their career, etc.

Pixi, I never implied someone shouldn't be proud of what they have done with their life, I just didn't feel this was the place.

But obviously, it is, because then someone else posted an entire list of every career anyone in his family has, along with all of his own accomplishments.  Thanks to all of those who helped with my current detox, I will forever be grateful.  However, I am not interested in some people feeling they are better or deserve their clean time more because of the advantages they were given in life.  I'm out.........

[puma]

Twindad and all mentioning carreers,

I agree it should not matter if you mention education or social status, whatever. I did not take those comments as one-uppers at all. The first post by (Twindad) simply indicated to me that he was feeling that he imagined addiction as a person hitting complete bottom meaning losing everything.

That's what newbies often feel I discovered in A.A. I knew I was an alcoholic for years but thought I was a functional alcoholic, so it did not matter. Man, did I get that wrong. That's a part of the initial denial stages of addiction.

Once I quit the booze, my life took a major noze-dive, although I managed to pull it back up just before I lost my house, but now I am still addicted to the Klonopin the Docs used to get me off the booze due to the seizures and DT'S. I always prided myself on my education, but I was taught a quick lesson. I was astounded when my boss told me I did a better job when I was drinking! I was five months sober at the time. They really were just cutting back. They still wanted me to just come in for typhoon forecasting a few days a year and I told them to take a long walk off a short pier!

That's the feeling I portrayed that Twindad was trying to get across, that he can't believe how he could be an addict and not have lost everything, not that he is any better than anyone else. An addict is an addict and we all go through withdrawals and such. I personally had no ill feeling about hearing his background. It is good to know and realize he is finally out of denial and humbling himself to admit addiction. The real challange is to admit being an addict in front of an N.A. or A.A group, then you humble yourself and learn the 12 steps to remain in recovery and not to relapse back to your old habits which could ruin you forever.

I have noticed more one-uppings on the how many pills people take a day than I have seen on education or social status! Addicts get moody and over sensitive sometimes, so (Twindad) please forgive any unpleasant comments and return for support.

Good luck and God Bless,

Chatahan

[groovygirl]

I've found that many people here are very intelligent and each has varying degrees of education. We are all the same in that we are addicts no matter what our background.

A lot of people still assume that addicts are bums...SO not true.  That stereotype needs to be changed in order for more help to be available to addicts.  Many addicts these days are white-collar, above average income, home owners with an education.  Since we are such assets to society, we should be able to get help for our disease a lot easier than we can.

If we could all put our heads together, I bet we could really make a difference improving the healthcare options for addicts in this country.  Lets put our educations to good use to help fight this disease.

P.S.  I've received much better advice and counseling and empathy from my fellow addicts on this forum than the highly educated doctors and shrinks that I've seen.

[athena]

Hi nena
I didn't mean anything about your comment,I didn't even take it negatively.I could tell that sugarbeens felt like she had done something wrong and just wanted her to know that I in no way took her or twindads posts as bragging.I know that we all get a little touchy at times(especially me)but if you really think about it,here we are,people of all different ages,backrounds,religeous beliefs etc. coming together to encourage and help one another.There will be misunderstandings and fusses but we are all just people who want to help one another.I think it's wonderful.Glad your here nena.

pixi

[kornie]

Thanks for the response.  My sleep was ok last night - probably because I take 30mg. of trazadone at night.

I know I"m fortunate that I didn't let the vicodin get past 3 a day.  But the reason for me was that I still went to meetings every day.  I'm an addict who found recovery in AA.  It's been 12 years since I drank and 8 years since I drugged or did coke.  
Since my car accidents (twice I was rear-ended in my miata), I found that I was willing to be honest about the pills I was taking.  I believe that this time I was taking them for pain. By the grace of my higher power, I never took enough to feel really wacked..  But I also never took enough to totally get rid of the pain.  I'm under the impression that even if I did get to 8-10 a day my physical pain would still be there.  When I walked into the rooms of recovery in 1990, I was taking up to 20 percs a day, plus about 40 mil. of valium and 4 mg of ativan. That is a detox I never want to go through again.

I was reading the comments about education.  I too did not take them personally....though I'm new to this site,,,so why should I.  But I do know that I prided myself on being a well educated professional.  So well educated that my best thinking go me into the rooms of recovery!!!  I've always been amazed  how I identify with people whose lives are totally different from mine.  Because this is a disease that lives between our ears......I identify with the emotions........and the horror of our disease.  But I also identify with the hope.  

So here's my hope for today.....we can do this......but let's remember it's One Day at a Time.  So for today, if you choose, go to a meeting, talk to another person in recovery...and reach out to help a newcomer...even if you're one yourself.  ANd if you do believe in a higher power...reach out.  If you don't....that's okay to.....just believe that we believe!!!

I hope this doesn't sound like preaching.......I really believe in the fellowship of recovery.  IT's one addict helping another.

Thanks for being here for me today.

[athena]

Good morning to you.Im glad your doing so well.I loved your post about religeon and praying for those who ask.i don't feel as if were pushing it off on anyone,just stating an important part of our lives and recovery.
Speaking of careers....Im very jealous of yours.lol

pixi

[athena]

Good morning and welcome.I was also only taking 3 or ocassionally 4 5mg vicoden a day.i started out with real pain but realized to my horror that even at that dose I was seriously addicted.I really depended on them to give me that energy boost that I needed to get through the day.for me,it will always be a mental battle.This may not be so for you since you really want off of them.I hated to give them up.I only quit out of guilt.You seem to be good at tapering so maybe the withdrawls wont be so bad.I wish you the best.

pixi

[kornie]

Thanks.  WE'll see how good I am at tapering on day 4 or 5.  WHen, if I remember correctly, the obsession kicks in for me.  But you're right.  It is a mental thing.  Which to me is the disease of addiction.  But I do think that those of you who didn't have addiction problems prior to your pain, pose a different set of difficulty.  Maybe being called an addict isn't comfortable for you.  But hang in there.....once the detox is over and you get counseling, it'll be easier.  Just please don't do it alone.  And internet forums aren't the only way, though this one is amazing.)  Try and confide in a friend or loved one.  Face ot face with another person has always helped me.

For me, my life was plagued with problems from my addiciton.  I was one of those who could fake it on the outside (or so I thought).  I always worked, though in retrospect, I lost jobs due to my addiction.  My story includes passing out with a cigerate and burning part of a building in NY and spending two months in a burn center.  And what did I learn from that....not to take seconals anymore......Then in Florida I was arrested for a DWI in 1982.....and what did I learn from that......nothing.  And then in 1990 I had an unnecessary hystorectemy to get my drug of choice - percs and morphine.  But it was none of those experiences that brought me to the rooms of receovery.  It was cocaine.  That was one drug that I hated - yet when I started I could not stop.  I spent more money on that.....didn't know how close i was to losing my husband, friends etc.  

I first went ot AA in 1980 - just wanted to know how to become a social qualude taker.  Then in 1987 I was in enough pain...and went to NA - stayed clean for a year.  But then I was back to drugging again......I hit a physical and emotional bottom on July 5, 1990 and went back into recovery.  It's been a long slow recovery for me...Mostly because I thought that if I got straight, I  would feel great....all the time....no problems....no worrys......Some of us are thicker than others.......But my worst day sober and straight is still better than it was out there.

Damn - I really seem to be posting long messages on this board.  I don't even know how I got started on this particular thread.  But now you guys know my story.

Take care.

[twindad]

Good morning to all. It is mt second day without Percs, and I think I feel a little better today. I wan't everyone to know, that I don't think I am better than anyone else! I guess I was just stating that given the extra advantages of having an education in the field where I help others to overcome their demons, I should have known better than to let myself fall into the same trap! I guess I am beating myself up a little. Thanks you to those of you who understood what I was trying to say without lashing out. Possibly, there was some projection going on on the part of other individuals. If I have learned on thing, it is easier to lash out on others and feel angry, then to look within and find fault. As far as my background, I come from a broken home at the age of eight. My family moved from Tennessee to Hollywood where my mother left my father for an alcoholic who beat her, and us, for 7 years. Then, she met a guy who was a charming drug addict and I was doing black beauties by age 13. I did drugs until I was 32 until one day I decided that I wanted better for myself. I put myself through college by working and getting any kind of grants I could. Nobody gave me anything. Yes, I have had advantages that others didn't, but I busted my ass to get them. So, I think it boiles down to what a person wants for themselves, and how hard they are willing to work to get there.  Peace, Twindad!

[athena]

Good morning td
I did understand what you were saying.Don't worry about what some think.Good for you that you put yourself through college.You should be proud of that.Your doing great with the tapering,keep up the good work.
What part of Tenn are you from?I live just outside of pigeon forge.It's so beautiful this time of year.

pixi

[Sugarbeens]

Good morning to you and everyone!  I was concerned about you and was looking to see if you would post again.  I know it sounds sometimes if you talk about degrees, that maybe we don't think this could happen to us.  I had a similar background, dirt poor, father alcholic, died when I was 6 and mother in mental hospital for many years.  I don't feel I had advantages, I worked my butt off to get the degrees, so I could help others, and while I was doing this, I didn't take care of myself.  I am an addict just like everyone else here.  I too, feel that I should not have let this happen to me, working in this field.  Sometimes I feel like a hiprocrite, helping others, but, not taking care of myself. I truly have a bad back problem.  I fell when I was 24 and did not get any relief until age 40 and boy when I did, I felt on top of the world.  Now, I feel on the bottom.  I love my children and grandchildren and that is why I have to give up these little pills that help and kill!!!!!!!!  Why can one thing have so much power over us.  My body has awakened again after only 3 days now off the percoset. I go back to my doc next Wednesday and he will try to talk me into still taking them.  God, help me I hope I say "no".  I hope something else can help this pain.  I am going to start working out again, I used to be fanatic about that, but, when the pills came along, I pushed that away too.  It helps me to do aerobics and lift weights.  I want to feel like my old self again, even if I have social anxiety.  People , I know now will love me for who I am.  Twindad, don't give up.  You can do this.  You did it before. Remember how good you felt, drug free.  I am praying for you and everyone.  Love to all.  Thanks Pixi for your such kind thoughts.  It meant a lot to me.

[twindad]

Thanks you both for your support and kind words. I have made up my mind to not allow myself to go there again with the pain killers! My children are my higher power! Of all the accomplishments I have made in my life, becoming a daddy is by far the best!!! My children deserve to have a daddy who can be there for them. I made a vow when they were born to give them the life I didn't have when I was younger. If we are to accomplish nothing else in this existence, we should endeavor to help our children to grow in a nurturing, caring and drug free environment. I have responsibility as a role model to teach them that we don't have to have an artifical substance to "get by". Please, be strong and don't allow yourselves to continue family patterns!

[athena]

I too came from an abusive alcoholic home.I always felt less than others somehow.After I finished nursing school,my self esteem rose somewhat and life was pretty good.I had to stop work 5yrs ago when my liver got damaged from the hep c.Since then I have developed a terrible social phobia.I get asked out but havent accepted a date in 4yrs.I just feel so uncomfortable around others.I still feel not good enough or that coming from an abusive home makes me the BAD person!I feel like im wearing a sign that says,my family is trash,I am trash,STAY AWAY!I have a prescious 13yr old son that means everything to me.I want to be the kind of parent that every child deserves.I was hoping the hydro would help with the phobias but it just made it worse.fact is,I didn't realize it untill lately.
Well,I've written a novel.Sorry for rambling but thanks for listening.

pixi

[Sugarbeens]

Pixi, i know exactly how you feel about the social phobia.  It can be horrible, and it is just now after reading this site that I realized or excepted that others are just like me.  I too, loved the way the meds helped me to be able to socialize, however, I would not accept dates because I figure they will find out I am a phony, not social at all and need drugs to be able to talk, etc.  I know now, after 8 years of this that I will be myself, and maybe someone will come along. My children were grown when I got divorced, but, you sound like a good mother.
Twindad, you too sound like a wonderful father. Your children are lucky to have you.  Hang in there.  It is nice getting all your senses back.  I am sure your wife will notice!! Love to all.

[leighbee]

I have been trying (unsuccessfully) to self detox for several days now.  I first starting taking vicodin regularly about the middle of the summer (for back and neck pain) and for awhile I took them pretty much as prescribed.  However, it didn't take me long to start obtaining stronger, higher dosages via the internet.  Around the end of September/first of October I began havong what I thought were emotional problems and took a leave from work.  Of course, now I realize that I was experiencing withdrawal symptoms.  When I begain to realize that I had become physically dependent on the Lortab (10 mg/at least 10 a day), I began to try to self detox and have been unsuccessful everytime.  I have made until late in the afternoon several times, only to succumb to the power of the addiction to try to escape the agony.
I no longer get that high, either.  Now I have to take them just to function normally.  I have tried to taper off, and I just can't seem to do that very well either.  I have told my counselor (experienced with addictions), my MD (in AA and hardline) and mother, but I have not told my husband.  We are both in AA and I just don't know how he will react.  Also, to be very honest, I know that once I tell him that it will be harder to continue taking the pills.  He will be constantly looking over my shoulder and probably never really trust me again.
I am going to have to tell him today, though, because I have decided that the only chance I have at trying to self detox os to go to her house.  There are just too many excuses for me to take the pills while I am at home (to be able to physically take care of the children- 2 and 8- and the house, to deal with all the responsibilities of a house with 2 active children and a husband to care for).
I feel so stupid... I have been down this road before with alcohol and other drugs.  I have no idea that I was playing with fire and the highly addictive nature of these drugs.  I wish it was just a matter of putting them down.  And, as much as I want to be free from my physical adiction (addiction), I am not honestly sure that I am ready to face life on life's terms.  While I am taking them, I enjoy the feeling of not feeling pain and being able to do the things I don't normally feel like doing.
Anyway, this has gotten way too long. I have found comfort in knowing there are others that know exactly what I am going through.  It is hard to explain it to those that don't understand.  I plan for tomorrow to be my first day of detox- it's too late today, i gave in when the discomfort became too much.
Wish me luck and prayers to all that are, like me, trying to beat this thing and come out on the other side a better person for it.

leighbee

[twindad]

Thanks ladies for your comments. Leighbee, it will probably be the hardest thing you will have to do, but I feel that you probably should share your problems with you family and husband. I myself, and married to a lady that I thank god I have in my life. Not because she is a drone, but because she loves me enough to tell me what I need to hear, and that is not always what I want to hear. She also came from a dysfunctional home, and has her Masters in Counseling. She laid it on the line for me with tough love. She said that she loved me, but could not stay in a relationship with me if I did not get "clean". This may sound hard core, but she has stuck with me through times when I was pretty hard on her because it wasn't me. It was the drugs doing the talking. If someone really loves you, then telling them the truth is the right thing to do and the only way that I am able to be so strong. If someone chooses to leave because you are human and are struggling, then what is the relationship worth anyway? I am feeling real "funky" today, and if I had percs in my posession, I would probably take them. I am an addict and I know for me, that I can't have them in my life no matter the reason (chronic pain) that I started to take them. I also know, that the longer that I go without them, the better I will feel and to tell you the truth, I kind of miss me. I used to be a very fun loving and out going guy and turned into a guy that would like to come home and take a nap or sit my but in my recliner and watch the tube all day and night. Living life like that is not worth it for me.

[leighbee]

Thanks for your reply to my comment.  I did end up telling my husband when he came home for lunch.  Of course, he was shocked and somewhat angry at first, but, in the end, he said that he would support me and take care of me while I try to detox.  He said that I should stay at home (at one point, though, he mentioned me detoxing in the hospital- something I do not want to do) and that my mother could come over to help during the day and that he would take care of me and the children at night.  I really didn't want to burden him with all of that.

Anyway, he made me give him all of my pills except ten.  I told him that the only way I would give them to him is if he would let me keep 10 to get through the rest of today.  So, he flushed them.  I had to leave the room.

I am hoping that 1) I do actually get through this and 2) that our relationship will be better for it.  I am so ready to get on with my life and to take some positive steps to become the happy, spiritual person I once was.

By the way, my husband has an appt to meet with my counselor tomorrow and I am hoping that will help him deal with this.  I know this cannot be easy for him and I am glad that he, too, will have some support as WE try to get past this.

Thanks again for your comments and good luck on your road to recovery.  You do have (two) pretty strong motivators and I sincerely hope that you will be back with your family (where you belong).

Leighbee

[groovygirl]

Hi- I wasn't "scorning" anyone or saying they should be scorned for having an education.  Sometimes people come across as though they are bragging, and they are using their education (and cars, homes, etc.) as a way to show they are different from the rest of the druggies here - as if to say, look I'm really above all this.

I don't flaunt my background, although sometimes I feel like bragging.  When I do, I ask myself why do I want to bring it up?  The answer is usually because I am feeling insecure, and I feel like I need to prove something.  

Please let's not start a flame war or anything.  My comments weren't intended to make anyone upset...I've just seen a lot of people come here and brag.  Perhaps this time it wasn't the case.

[puma]

Mariposa,

When you are feeling insecure, remember one thing, cars, homes, educations are nothing as long as we are slaves to our addictions. We could all lose everything in a moments notice so don't think having things means much! I wish you well and know you did not mean any harm. Take care,

Chatahan

[groovygirl]

Hi - Believe me, I know what is important in my life, and the stuff isn't.  That is why I don't bring it up.  That is why when I do feel insecure, I recognize that bragging about my "stuff" isn't going to make me feel better.  

There was a person who always talked about his job and how much money he made that week.  Then he bought a nice car, and then that's all he talked about - money and cars...big deal right?  It got to the point where it was kind of funny.  I would read yet another post, and I'd think he was joking.  When I realized he wasn't, it made me really sad for him.  It seemed his reasons for getting clean were mainly about money...a good motivation, yet if that's the only reason it probably won't work right?

[leighbee]

Well, I guess today is the first day of the rest of my life and I feel like hell!! The stomach problems have already started and it will just be a matter of time before the lethargy and depression set in.  My MD told me it would take 3 days to detox, but I have read that it may take longer and longer still to feel "normal" again.  I read somewhere to take lots of vitamin C, a multivitamin, herbal tea (yuck- I don't feel like eating or drinking anything), immodium and dramamine.  I have taken 7 viamin c's this morning, the multivitamin and a Klonopin (I read here that would help and I just happen to have a small amount).
My husband is going to call the MD today to see if there is anything else he can prescribe to make the withdrawals not so bad.  I doubt the Dr. will prescribe anything, though, because he advice last week for me to flush the pills, take dramamine, pick up a white chip in AA (the LAST thing on my mind) and basically suck it up.  Gee, thanks!!
Anyway, at least there are no more pills in the house and hopefully I will be successful this time- I am ready to reclaim my life (as miserable as it was, it was better than this living hell).
Thanks to all for comments and responses!!

[OxyDout]

I don't think I've spoken to you in the past, just saw your post and boy, you couldn't be anymore right...... drugs can rip it all away without a thought in the world......

[CATUF]

WD is no fun, but I have found that's it was never as bad as what I feared it would be like when I started to run low.  Part of that fear was that I knew I would crash and have to stay home, etc., which was a problem.  That should not be an issue with you, since you're not having to hide the fact that your in WD.  Get on the recipe ASAP, take hot baths, drink Gatoraide, don't forget the imodium (immodium) and hang in there.  It's really no worse (maybe not as bad) than being stuck in bed with the flu.  Don't give up - it may be no fun now, but it will be easier now than if you continue for whatever period and the problems that make you want to quit now will only grow.  Take some comfort in the fact that you've faced up to a problem -- you should be proud that your doing something about it rather than ignoring it and allowing it to take you further into its grip.

CATUF

[athena]

Good afternoon cat.day 31 and your past the point that you gave in the last time. I just couldn't remember the name of that book you told me about untill I read your post yesterday.I will pick it up this week.I also love greek mythology,ancient egypt etc.I know you hear the whispers but you are doing a heck of a job ignoring them.keep it up.i hope your day is a good one.

pixi

[Witchywoman]

Hi leighbee, welcome to the begining of the road to freedom! This is such a huge step you are taking, and I just wanted to lend some support to you.  You can do it, you can get through it. Just take it in small chunks. Five minutes at a time, till you are through. The worst truly is over by 4 days, but then the weeks following will bring lethargy and fatigue. By 3 to 4 weeks you will most likely be feeling normal, but the first 3 to 4 days really are the worst. Once those are behind you, you'll be feeling much better.

Drink tons of fluids and remember to take those hot baths. When I detoxed, I lived in the tub. It was the only thing that really stopped the symptoms, so I spent the better part of my days immersed in hot water.  Acupunture helped me tons too.

I wondered if maybe your Doctor would prescribe you some clonodine? As far as I know it is non addictive and some people swear by it as a helpful medication for detox, though I didn't try it at the time.

Hang in there, we are here for you. Write all you need to! If you need or want to write emails for added support, my addy is ***@****

love,
WW

[bmac]

The clonidin will help,believe me.It's a bloodpressure med.
I couldn't believe your doctor wouldn't prescribe it unless he
doesn't know about detox.Also for a doctor to tell you to flush them and just deal with it is a disgrace.That's what doctors did
years ago not now.Well take the advice you receive here and it will make a hell of a difference.I used phenobarb and clonidine
to withdraw with but the famous 'Thomas recipe' listed throughout this forum was the best help I received.As a matter of fact I still used it today.Good luck and welcome to our world!
                          bmac

[GOD]

Happy Holidays to YOU my Wiccan friend!

I hope your feeling OK tonight.... I KNOW you're gonna' be busy tomorrow~!

~~~~Jess~~~~

[leighbee]

Well, on day two of living drug free and it sucks!!  My husband searched through all of my things and took all of my "stashes."  I had really kept some in case of an emergency.  I got a prescription refilled yesterday and he found it in my coat pocket and took that too.  I the main reason I got it was because I wanted to have something incase the pain got too bad.
I slept most of the day yesterday (I guess my body is physically exhausted from all that I have put it through lately).  I took one Klonopin in the AM and some dramamine in the PM.  My all knowing husband took it upon himself to throw away all but two of the Klonopin and I was counting on using those in getting through some of the detox.
I don't know if I feel physically as bad today as I did yesterday, but I do feel lethargic and depressed. Tonight is Halloween and I just don't know if I am going to be up to helping the children get ready and certaintly not up to going trick or treating.
I had 1 1/2 Klonopin left and I took that this morning.  The thing that my husband doesn't understand is that I can get the drugs if I want to and by him running around throwing everything away, it makes me more determined to get them.  That was one of the main reasons I didn't want to tell him because I knew he would be constantly looking over my shoulder.
Anyway, I have rambled too long.  I have a feeling that today might be worse than yesterday.  Thank you so much for all your support- you don't know how much it means to me in my hour of need!!

Leighbee

[athena]

Good morning leigh.I just wanted to let you know that your in my prayers.I know how hard w/d is but it will get better soon.Hang in there.I know your probably angry at your husband right now but he probably truly believes he is helping you.You will be glad later when you start feeling better.while I was going through w/d I was angry at the world for having to give up my best friend.This too shall pass,good luck and God bless you.

pixi

[groovygirl]

Hi - If I was on day 2, I wouldn't be able to drag my butt out tonight either...is your husband going to do it for you?

Do you tell him that his actions do not help you?  That would make me SO angry.  

Keep up the good work...a week from now, you'll feel better...each week after that will just keep getting better and better.

[twindad]

Leighbee, I am so proud of you!! I am now on day 4 of complete abstenance from Percoset, and I am starting to feel alot better. I had a close friend of mine who gave me an anology about my reservations to quit. She said, "do you remember the Disney movie Dumbo?" It seems that Dumbo was given a magic feather and told that it would help him fly. Dumbo used this feather and was able to fly. Then, one day Dumbo couldn't find the feather and the mouse that gave Dumbo the feather told him. It was never the feather that enabled you to fly! It was you all along that could fly. When I thought about living my life without my feather (my Percoset), I was afraid that I would not be able to fly. But, now I am day four and actually feel better than I have in a long time. I went out with my family to Costco last night to do some needless spending, and I made it through even though I was a little tired/fatigued. You can do this Leighbee! Use this support group as your feather until you have the strenght to fly on your own. From what I can see, there are some pretty good people here. Peace,  Twindad

[athena]

Good morning.Congrats on day 4.Give yourself a big pat on the back!I just loved the dumbo anology.

pixi

[Witchywoman]

Thanks Jess!  It's my New Year, and one of the sacredest holidays of my religion.  Very sweet of you to remember. Thank you.

love,
WW

[peaz]

Hey--Just wondering if you got my e-mail a couple of days ago.  I've been having some trouble w/ out-going mail.  Happy Halloween!                        Peaz

[Starraven]

Hi, I just wanted to congratulate both of you.  I know day 4 is difficult and day two is horrific. (at least it was for me) Twindad, good for you for going out with your family! On day three I had a birthday party for my four year old and it took EVERYTHING I could muster to get through that. Just going to the grocery store for the first two weeks was a job for me.  I was so weak and fatigued as I went cold turkey and found this site on day 18.  I have started the recipe since then and that helped alot.  Luckily I have the support of my family.  My husband, father and two older children.  Now I am on day 31 and I am feeling so much better.  I can laugh with the children now, my animation is returning and my family is loving it. MOM IS BACK!

Leighbee, your husband really should read up on physical dependence.  He should be supportive and not run around the house looking for your meds and disposing of them.  Doesn't he want to help you get through this as painlessly as possible?  That would make me feel real alone in my struggle to get clean.  Cold turkey is pure hell, I sure wouldn't want to be FORCED to go cold turkey if I didn't feel I could handle it.  That is a decision WE as addicts have to make on our own.  It shouldn't be forced upon us by our so called well meaning spouses.  
Just the thought of him doing this, makes me..a stranger very upset that he is putting you through this.  

Good luck to both of you!  Your doing great!  
Hugs,
Star

[bmac]

Day 31! I remember that day for me.It was a point where I realized things were going to OK.I am glad you made it this far.
I remember your day 18 when you came here for the first time and you were going thru the same exact thing as I did.Well congrats on being a human again.I am sure your husband and kids are glad to see you back,
                           Peace,
                           Bmac

[athena]

peaz!!!Im so glad to hear from you.I have missed you on here.I didn't get your email.peaz peaz try again.lol How are you?Still funny as ever I hope.

pixi

[Starraven]

Thanks so much for your encouraging words.  I've said it before and I'll say it again, this forum was really GOOD for me and still is!  I honestly never thought I would make it to day 31!

Yesterday was a real turning point for me.  It was like a calm came over me.  My husband and I have become closer and we have started enjoying eachother again, my kids are estatic to have thier "fun" mom back.  We all sat around and carved our pumpkins and as simple as it sounds, it was a most enjoyable time for all of us as a family!  :)

I know one day my deteriorating back will require more surgery and possibly more pain medication, I just hope when that day comes I will have learned my lesson and be able to control my addictive personality and take my meds responsibly as you do Bill.

Hugs to all,
Star/ Suzette

[bmac]

Once you go thru this hell we put ourselves thru I think some of us learn a great lesson.I have not once since being back on the meds have I taken anymore than prescribed.I feel much better and
don't even feel a bit high from it.I really think alot of this is mental.I know that for now I will be on meds and I have accepted it.I have a good pain doc and and good PCP doc.If I ever decide to stop the meds again I know now how to do it.
Good luck on being human again.It does feel wonderful to laugh with your children again,I know this feeling and the relationship with the spouse can be a normal one,if you get my drift and I know you do.Be happy
                           bmac

[puma]

Leighbee,

Sorry if I spelled it wrong but as soon as I read the post I felt
a chill run down me. I cannot believe your husband threw away your Klonopin. You should have him look at Klonopin withdrawal on the internet and see that it can kill you if not treated on a slow taper or in-patient basis. At one time I would have probably beat my ex-boyfriend if he flushed my Klonopin. He was an alcoholic who did not work, so I had nothing to worry about with him.

I have been through the worst of the c/t detox, Delirium Tremons, seizures, hallucinations and so on. Not to mention heaving my guts out and not eating for nearly three weeks. I lost 20 pounds.

Tell your hubby how dangerous detox can be and to help according to real knowledge of what you are taking and how much and go through a doctor and have your hubby hold the pills and divy them out. But to flush them was irresponsible and could have killed you!!!! I was so pissed when I read that.

I read from the bottom up, so maybe I am over re-acting, but  as far as Docs I speak from yesterday's experience. Docs do not like to give out extra class-2 drugs if they feel you may have used too many too soon. They look at flushing, stolen, dog eating them etc. all as excuses to get more. My Doc yesterday almost did not provide me my Klonopin because their own med clinic shorted me, and I never bothered to count the pills, but I told him there was no way they could fit the amount he prescribed for one month in the small bottle they gave me.

He prescribed enough only until I see him in two weeks, but he was very suspicious that I overused and I know I did not. He said he will keep track of their pharmicist and I agreed to write down the times I take the meds etc. It was very uncomfortable as I did not want to go through the DT'S yet again.

Please tell your husband you appreciate his help but he needs education on the subject of addiction and withdrawal and not to play God which may end up with you suffering greatly and maybe worse.

I am worried about you. Please keep us informed. I will be praying. Take care, and congradulations for coming clean with your husband but he has to also give his support in the correct manner. Take care and good luck,

Chatahan

[Starraven]

You are so right, ALOT of it is mental. I know I will eventually have to take the painkillers again.  I do believe I have truely learned my lesson this time around.  Something I did this time that I didn't do last time was keeping a daily journal of my hell. So I don't forget.  Today is a good day.  Tomorrow even better, thanks again for your encouragement.  Really means alot!
I'm happy!  Imagine that! I think I have grown up alot in the last month!
Hugs,
Suze

[puma]

Pixi,

Hi, good morning, or evening, your time I suppose. I love reading your posts as they are so encouraging and inspirational. If ever you tire of the weather their, feel free to come out here and join me in typhoon chasing, my song producing, plant nursery I am starting and so on.

It is all easy, The typhoon tracking I now only do as hobby for chasing purpases to enjoy the wind and rain. Video of typhoons can make alot of money however. Tornadoes too, but I have not been back to the States to chase in 10 years! I know most of the tornado chasers there. Since you are a person who seems to love t-storms and the wind, maybe we can get together for a chat some day in the future. I am working hard to get completely clean and take courses in drug and alcohol counseling which they really need here. If you have that experience or certification you would have it made as far as work goes.

Tell me more about your plans in life and how your situation is there back in the ole U.S.A.  We are U.S. here too but it is so quiet comparitively and laid back. A paradize for me. I want to stay sober to enjoy it and not sleep my way through it. Eesh, I am babbling today, anyway, have a great weekend and God Bless you.

Chatahan

[athena]

Hey lady Di....
I got your mail and Im so jealous of your getaway lol.It sounds like a lot of fun.My bags are packed and at the door.I didn't get to trick or treat,had to get that MRI.50 min.in that thing ugh!!I sure hope it tells the story.Yeah,we coul have gone as that but im afraid they wouldnt have given us the treats we wanted.lol Seriously though,I hope you have a fantastic time.It will be tough not hearing from ya for a while but i'll try to hang on.lol Stay warm and cozy and behave!!
The patches are rx but well worth getting for shingles.Talk to ya soon.

Deb

[groovygirl]

I'm sorry you were offended by my post about education.  It wasn't really just about education...I tried to explain it in another post.  What it boils down to is I guess I've seen too many people come here and brag about their "things" - these people have seemed to need us "addicts" to know that they are really above all of this...believe me, many of them weren't just saying how proud they were of themselves.  Anyway...let's just drop it shall we?

I want to know how you feel so good on day 4 of sobriety?  Maybe I'm just a total wimp, but I've never made it past a week of being totally clean.  At 7 days, I was still feeling VERY bad.  Are you using something to help with the symptoms?

[peaz]

It's funny that you called me Lady Di 'cause that's my radio name....Hope your MRI produces some good results.  I am SO claustrophobic; I would need a ton of Valium.  But for 50 minutes?? Faaaggedaboudit.
   I woke up at 4:415 AM, couldn't get back to sleep, so now I'm cranky.  It's been nearly a year since I've used--shouldn't things be getting back to normal soon?  Do you have insomnia?  It seems to be a lingering side effect of opiate abuse.  My moods are actually pretty good, and so is energy, but I can't sleep ever 4-5 hours at a time it seems.  I'll talk to you Monday.  Have a smashing weekend.  You can e-mail me, TOO, ya know... :-)  Didee-do

[twindad]

Yes, I am using 800mg Motrin, and truthfully, a tiny bit of weed once in a while. I really don't feel all that great physically, but I am sure starting to feel better cognitively and emotionally! It's like starting to wake from a 2 year bad dream. I just can't believe that I got as bad as I did with lying about losing perscriptions and acting like a demanding drug addict when my pills ran low. It feels like I have been released from a prison of my own design. Yesterday (day4) I started to think that a percoset sure would make me feel better, but then I started to think about the guilt I was feeling by thinking that. I guess I feel a little like thre Christian Zealots in that, it has to hurt a little to remind me just how easy things can spiral out of control. I meant you no harm as well and am sure that you are actually a very nice person going through a bad situation. Peace, TD

[misd]

Hi all Im not really new to the forum jsut lost my id and password, What happened was I got clean and then slid right back into evil web of drugs, well here I am again. I was clean and ended up having to have a complete hyeterectomy because my bladder was attached to my uterus and I knew once I had the surgery and was put back on the pain med's I would fall back into my old way's. I tried to hide it from my husband but I should have known he would find out. Everything I have ever done in my life always comes back on me. My mom always told me that and boy was she true. I had piled up a debt with my dealer for $1,300 . Yes i know this is alot, but it was over a few months period of time. I only took hydrocodone, lortab,lorcet, perk's. but mostly lortab and lorcet. well my husband has given me another chance this is my last and final chance to get my act together. I have hurt him so bad. But he has to love me to want to help me.
I have read the other posts on how long, my question is how long will it take me to feel normal again, I was taking 10 and 11 lortab's a day, I have no choice but to go cold turkey, can I do that without alot of withdraw? I am not sure I can.
Any advice you guy's can give me will be fantastic. thanks for listening,
Misd

[norki]

It's my 3rd day off coediene, and I feel like total ****. I took a look at the Thomas recipe, but what about the valium? As an addict, I get hooked on anything. Been hooked on sleeping pills before, so it is safe to take just to get some sleep, and deal with the aches and especially the restless legs? Anyways, I live in The Congo. (used to live in Canada, but had to move here because of my husband's businness.) Here everything is available, and nobody knows anything about addiction. No addiction docs, no AA. Nobody to talk to about my situation except my husband and the poor guy doesn't know how to help with the pain of detox. So, can someone suggest if it's safe to take Valium at night? I'm afraid of getting hooked on it too. Just want to feel healthy and strong again.

[misd]

I myself have never been addicted to sleeping meds but if you have I would be very careful with taking them, try taking tylonal pm, someone once told me it was the poor man's valum,lol I have been very lucky this time around with my detox, it has been day 6 for me and I actually feel normal well almost normal again. It is hard to get sleep when you are going through withdraw and the sweats was the worse for me. I tried to sleep last night without any sleep aid and ended up haveing to take half a muschle relaxer after 12 this morning. I wish you luck and just be careful taking the valum. Only you know your limit.
Take care and God Bless.
Mis

[puma]

Hi Norkie,

I am sorry to hear you have no resourses out there in the Congo.
I do have experience with Codiene withdrawal. I took 300 or more mg's a day for over one year.

When my Doc found out I was drinking again she cut me off on a Slash/Crash from the Codiene, 10 MG'S of Klonopin and I could'nt drink because I couldn't hold anything down for nearly three weeks. Only water the last five days before I saw my doc again and she saw my blood pressure was 165/113 and I could barely walk into her clinic and could barely drive I was so spaced out, felt violent, I am sure I was more of a danger on the road than a drunk driver at that time.

Most of my symptoms were the Klonopin withdrawal, Valium is similar to Klonopin so be careful not to take it too long so as not to become addicted to that. The withdrawal is worse than the Codiene.

The reason I know the withdrawal was mostly from the Klonopin and alcohol is because they have similar withdraw symptoms and I have withdrawn from Codiene by itself in the past and felt like **** from the return pain and some nausea but it wasn't that bad. I rememeber having some light shakes for several days, then it went away. The pain stayed with me however since I have Fribromyalgia so I was uncomfortable most of the time until turning to booze years later. A major mistake I might add.

The Klonopin shakes are like an earthquake and last for weeks. Not to mention the DT'S, hallucinations, nightmares when you can sleep at all, etc.

Hang in there, if you are on day-3 of Codiene you should be past most of the worst unless you really have a serious pain problem in which case you may truely need it. Keep posting and let us know how you are doing. Take care and good luck.

Chatahan........wildcat