How to tell when you have a problem - Darvocet

[JoeyR]

I would like some information please. I have been taking Darvocet for sometime now... about 8 months and take 12 pills a day...Usually 3 or 4 at a time. How do you know when you are addicted? I dont feel so good if I go without it for more than a day. I get nervous, sweat (god i hate that) and hurt. I am taking them for a sinus problem I have because I cannot afford the surgery to fix the problem. I really want to stop this, but am afraid to. I live in the Chicago area. My name is Joey.

I should also say that I have been living with clinical depression since I was 16... now 28 and I take wellbutrin twice a day. I also have Ativan which I use to sleep, but unlike the Darvocet, I do not find a "high" in taking the Ativan. I use that for what it helps me with. (Anxiety and sleeping).

After reading some of the warnings that go along with pain killers, it scares the hell out of me to think I am in that situation but just dont realize it I guess. I never in my life thought I would become addicted to "legal" drugs like this. This really sux

[OxyDout]

It sounds like your either dependant or addicted, either way your facing a withdrawal. The only difference between being dependant or addicted is the reason you take the meds, you either have a pain issue and need the meds, and or you take them to get high, but again, either way you will face withdrawal.  The withdrawal will vary with all people, however your not really taking an extremely high dosage. You should start to wein yourself off of them, start with 9 a day, then 6 and so on, but do it at a pace that works, take 9 for a few days then 6 for a few days........ I will tell you this, Withdrawal's get worse everytime you go through them, so get out now, don't get to the point where you just can't bare with it anymore.  But, to put your mind at ease, if you screw up and keep taking pills, or if you feel depressed, everyone in this forum will be here to lend a helping hand.  

GWH

[OxyDout]

Well I'm all over the place, I have been everything but clean, although I'm not taking 160mg of oxy a day, I'm still taking things here and there pretty much on a consistant basis, the last couple of days I have taken 6 hydros a day, which isn't a lot, but, we all know how hit is. Anyway, I was thinking, all we need is a pill, one that will make us normal again, like we were before drugs, right? I mean how hard can it be for someone to make a pill like that?? haha, the mind of an idiot I guess. But, seriously Ive ****** myself once again, I have 2 hydros on my but I am just going to let them sit there while I go through the shakes.  ACTUALLY I HAVE A SERIOUS QUESTION, i was thinking about what groovy said, "delaying the inevitable" we really will have to suffer for a few days of physical pain before we can really start the long term detox, right? so should I pick a date where I can take a 4 day weekend to "disappear"? or should I just shoot myself and get it over with? let me know what you think? (as you can tell I"m in a pissed off, sarcastic, and depressed mood)

GWH

[OxyDout]

sorry for all the posts, but my brother how I mentioned in the past is very much like "radioboy" in that he collects drugs when he finds them. I found a couple of pills in his drawer, they were pink and had 5 sides, with a W on the side, is that wellbutrin? just curious.

[mrmichael67]

You took six a day for a couple of days?  If so, you shouldn't get too much in the way of wd's.  I know that you would experience anxiety and would be uncomfortable, but you shouldn't have full blown wd's.  If you are, then are you sure there isn't more to the story?  I am not trying to get on your case, just being here for you.

[radioboy74]

Enough is enough.  GWH his comment is from Radioboy's wife.  I want to congratulate you, I have been hesitate from writing but now after this comment I thought you should know.  My husband read your comment prior, he only posted on here to have someone to talk too, he never actually took the medication, as a matter of fact the prescriptions still sit here unfilled written on paper as a daily reminder to me.  I truly want to thank you for your support on things, my husband commited Suicide on Sunday and left a note that no one would listen to him, not even the support group he had online - if you are a support group I wonder if it isn't you that shouldn't be banned, GWH, live with this on your shoulder, he was a great man - this is more than I can ever say for you.  Don't worry I used his screen name for the last time, you'll never see it again, and neither will I.  Think before you speak, Words Cause Harm !

[needhelp1]

I have a problem with Vicodin. I have been taking vicodin and norco for the last 8 months everyday. I have worked my way up to about 7-8 norco daily for the last few months. Every month i go through about a 2-3 day withdrawal preiod. This time i decided this will (hopefully) be my last. I have been clean since late friday night. Over the weekend i felt horribly. Nasuaes, Diarhea (diarrhea), Headache, Cold sweats, Couldnt eat.. the list goes on. Now i think i have pretty much outlasted all my physical symptoms except beening nasaues in the morning. If i let myself throw up it seems to make me feel a little better. even if its just dry heaves. Now i am having a lot of mental issues. I feel somewhat depressed. Like i have nothing to look foward to everyday now that i dont have the pills. Even though i do have a lot to be thankful for ie.. having a wonderful gf.. and a good job.. I know i did not feel this depressed before i started taking vicodin or even if i was depressed.. I have been taking saint john's wort and kava kava to help with this.. can anyone recommend anything else to help ease the pain? or give me an idea how long this will last ( weeks, months, years, never stop) I have also been having a problem with sleeping... I can get to sleep no problem.. but i wake up to the slighest noise and cant go back to sleep. i would normally sleep till my alarm goes off and now i wake up a hour or 2 before that and just cant seem to get back to restfull sleep or even sleep sometimes. Can anyone give me some advice on this or how long this may also last. Any adivce is greatly apprecitated.

[OxyDout]

My deepest sympathy goes out to you and I sincerely mean that, but you could not be anymore displaced with your anger, and furthermore have no right to say I should "live with this on my shoulders". So again I do sincerely send my condolences, however, you are misplacing your emotions.  Especially considering non of us knew him.  All we knew were the questions upon questions of what certain drugs were. That is all. good luck, god speed

[GOD]

Wow, I'm really sorry to hear that your husband committed suicide because of GHW's unkindness to him. It must be really sad to sit there reading the Suicide note, and knowing that if just a few more people had compassion in this group, that maybe he would still be alive. Damn! I don't think I want to come here anymore... It's too depressing.

[OxyDout]

and maybe you should look at his life and the people that were physically around him and consider that arena before you naively blame 1 COMMENT!!! that was said over a computer, from a remote area, not a physical being, not a picture of a face, not even a voice, not even sound, just letters typed on a forum.  The issues and the LACK OF BEING HEARD came from people who were in his life and I'm extremely offended that you would write such a comment.

HOWEVER, I realize this isn't the right time or place to be mad, but to try and help, so although i completely disagree with all that you have wrote, i will do my best to be here for you, if you decide you would like to talk.

gwh

[needhelp1]

I also had one more things to add. should i go see and DR. about my depression and insomnia? or should i try to wait this out awhile and see if it goes away. I dont wanna be put on meds and not need to be on them.. or be on them and stop takin them and get this same feeling again... and if i do go to the dr.. should i tell him about my pill problem?

[radioboy74]

You know one thing, out of all the post your's is the only one he printed - the ONLY one's.  And not once did any of the post say "Are you currently on these medications," but so be it - I'm the only one who cared, now I just feel careless and lost.  I guess in the future there will be another notch on the belt.
God Bless you All

[OxyDout]

do you realize you just said "im real sorry your husband committed suicide BECAUSE of GWH's comment" why don't you think about that

[OxyDout]

could you please take the time to read what he printed out?? and if so also take the time to realize you said "OUT OF ALL THE COMMENTS" meaning I was not the only one.

[radioboy74]

My sympathy goes with you as well.  I saw the post and found it very insensitive as well, and I can understand where you are coming from.  I could even read into his past post that he was just curious and he never took anything - sometimes I wish this room wasn't anonymous so you could go from Wrongful death.  Bless you - our thoughts are with you.

[Avs]

I don't know how that happened, my name show up as radioboy's wife.

My sympathy goes with you as well. I saw the post and found it very insensitive as well, and I can understand where you are coming from. I could even read into his past post that he was just curious and he never took anything - sometimes I wish this room wasn't anonymous so you could go from Wrongful death. Bless you - our thoughts are with you.
Avs

[OxyDout]

was that last comment to me? or someone else and did you mean you would like to accuse me for a wrongful death?

[OxyDout]

I don't know who you are and about the wrongful death, I won't even dignify that with a comment.

[OxyDout]

i'm still waiting for you to please post the comment of mine that killed your husband.

[Avs]

I think after seeing the IMPACT that GWH has on people with his words, maybe he should be booted from the room.  I think it was the Bible who said "An Eye for an Eye." Although I am not wishing anything harmful, I think he/she had the impact that pushed radioboy over the edge.  I hate to say it, but I don't think this room is appropirate anymore if you want to speak to peers, you need to find others.  People like GWH just didn't care enought to reach out.

[OxyDout]

I have never seen you post here, who are you to say anything, and I cannot believe you really think what I said would have put anyone over the edge, can you tell me what post your talking about and please post it on this thread now!!

[radioboy74]

I know this is cruel, however, I'll say it.  GWH you are dead to me, I have no comments to you, you took my husband - I hope you can sleep at night knowing something like that, maybe you can go back and play with your pill that has 5 sides and a W on it, sound familiar somone who asked information, someone who was a waling PDR whatever that is.  You make me sick.

[OxyDout]

You need to seek help, you need counseling, you really do and I hope you take that giant leap in realizing that neither you or your husband were and are ok, you really should seek the help you need.  And I"m still waiting for this post that put him over the edge

[OxyDout]

I find it kind of funny that you both make the same grammatical errors..................

[OxyDout]

I was never referred to as a "walking PDR" I don't know what that is either, and I'm still WAITING FOR THE POST THAT SUPPOSEDLY KILLED YOUR HUSBAND, SO POST IT.

[Avs]

Typical, now whoever this clown is he's looking for a reason to clear his conscience.  Radioboy's wife, don't answer him, you owe him no, and I mean no explanation.  I've seen his post in the past he's a user, he means no good in this room, I'm just sorry your husband ever met up with this room, he deserved better.  I've seen some of his post in the past, I normally stay in the background, but this time I had to speak up.  GWH I don't really know you, and I hope I never do.  Last post - ever.

[OxyDout]

so first your name "AVS" shows up as radioboy which is impossible by the way, and in the following post you so, I don't know how my name showed up as "radioboys wife" which was in the "optional comment to:" box, and you both have the same errors, besides I have never seen you post here, so what the hell is going on, and yes I'M STILL WAITING FOR THIS POST THAT KILLED YOUR HUSBAND

[OxyDout]

THANK GOD ITS YOUR " LAST POST-EVER"

[Avs]

It would give you pleasure to know you helped destroy another life wouldn't GHW?  You seem to have a fetish on this.  And as far as your post to his wife, you are the most insensitive SOB I have ever heard of - you my friend need help - take your medication, do us all a favor !

[OxyDout]

so was that your last post? or will there be another.

[OxyDout]

let me say this again , YOU POSTED AS RADIOBOY74, that is impossible unless you have his passsword, are you that dumb, not to realize that.  your post was posted by radioboy74, to radioboy74's wife, showing that you have radioboy74's password.

[GOD]

Man, I don't think you had anything to do with Radioboy's death... I was being Facetious. I work in the Information Systems Dept. of a Large Law Enforcement Agengy... I Did a check on the NCIC, and NO SUICIDES for Sunday... This **** is a big fat HOAX, and the Radioman is ******* with all of us.

[radioboy74]

Avs - don't waist your time, nothing can be said or done to turn back time, you are waisting your time, as much as I appreciate you - other people just don't and din't care.  They didn't care enough to where they had to use his screen name twice to insult him, leave him alone, he's a drug user and he will get his own.  All I can say is when my husbands autopsy was done the only thing they found was a bullet, not one trace of medication - he never used, never - that's why his comments hurt me so much.  And as far as me getting help, that comment, I consider the source.
Bless you All.

[OxyDout]

I'M So sorry, i really apologize and THANK GOD someone other then radioboy74 responded, you are my savior. THANK YOU !!!!!!!!!!!!

[GOD]

Don't even waste the time to **** with this fake-ass "Suicide"--

Radioboy, I think the little Yellow ones go really good with the round pink ones with the R-47 marking on the side. Thy those together, man, what a great buzz!

[GOD]

Don't worry... You do me a favor and have a great weekend. Don't let that little **** have any more of your time.

Hey, I don't know if you're familiar with Eminem (Marshall Mathers), Radioboy, but listen to the song "Stan" if you get a chance. Please stop ******* around in here. you will have a lot MORE fun at www.thehun.net____

Gotta Go, Folks-

__--JESS--___

[JoeyR]

I came here with a problem. I didnt come here to listen to you guys blame each other for something. It seems that a few people really need a life. Depending on this forum to live and bash one another? WTF is that? Ill find another site that pertains to the subject matter

[skipper]

hello people:
what a sad turn this thread has taken! mrs. radioboy (i don't
know what else to call you), please accept my sympathy for the
unfortuneate events that have happened this week. as much grief as i know you must be in, i hardly think that now (if ever) is the time for finger pointing and blame.

you will have to excuse me...i'm all over the place on this one!
see, i'm not a stranger to suicide. the most recent and serious
attempt found me on a lonely saturday, late in the afternoon of
january 2001. my dog gave me the strangest and most lonely look
i've ever seen come from any creature in my life! i was faced
with some really horid choices and cosequencese. this does not
excuse the fact that what i had set about to do was the most sel-
fish and desperate thing i could do! at very best, suicide (in
most cases) is a very permanent solution to what are usually very
temporary problems.

too many people, friends and drug shooting buddys, have made this
awful choice and stepped into infinity, leaving the rest of us to
wonder what the ****...is it really like this...all in vain? was
there no one left to talk to? are we ultimately alone? i'm sorry,
i'm having trouble making sense of what goes on in my head right
now.

gwh:
nothing more than your head is on your shoulders! if we can not
call each others actions and behaviors without fear of something
like this happening... well we certainly don't have a forum or a
support group or what ever. not for a second will i allow you or
anyone else to be blamed for this. i am deeply saddened by the
awful turn of events...

i'm sorry, i beter go for now...
keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[OxyDout]

I think this was the first time I ever realized how often I have posted here and how much we all know about each other. And all though I think this is all BS and I KNOW THAT AVS AND RADIOBOY74 ARE THE SAME PERSON!! I've made the decision to not post anymore, not today, not tomorrow and maybe not ever again.

[hellbent]

From where I am standing, your problem is manageable, if you take the steps to get out of it now. I started with Darvocet 4 years ago, 3 a night. Two months ago, I was taking 10 80mg Oxycontins a day (160 percs daily). The stuff has ruined my life, almost to the point of suicide. I wasn't able to get my medical group to pay for rehab (even though my health plan has a detox clause). I spent one month tapering down, got to 5-6 80's per day, then did 21 days in methadone treatment. Unfotunately for me, during this period, I began swallowing 2mg klonopins (valium family)like candy, not understanding the addictiveness of the substance. I was taking 20X therapeutic doses, not knowing it, believing that I wouldn't be on it long enough to get a habit. I only used it at night for sleep.

I stopped using klonopin 8 days after the methadone detox. I quickly gained a new suite of symptoms, to go on top of the ones I had. New, fun symtoms, like brain tremors, shakes, and after 3 weeks solid of no sleep, near insanity (which was a high in itself, though I don't reccommend it).

I am an addict, and procured drugs myself. Still, I started very innocently. I was an accomplished athlete, had a great job, a house on the beach, big savings account. I used Darvocets at night, after heavy excercise, and it slowly progressed from there. I barely got out before becoming homeless, and now have to try and rebuild my life from scratch.

You may not be as extreme as me, you may have a reason for taking those pink bastards. Did you know, however, that more than 6-8 darvocets can easily cause liver damage? Not from the Darvon, but from the acetominophen? Tylenol is death on the liver. Beyond that, I'll say that, if you have any obsession with the drugs, you are in trouble. You don't want to go through anything like I have. I am very lucky to be alive. You have a chance to stop this **** now, no matter how hard it seems. You might do a quick wean down, then just kick the ****. Then, get to AA/NA meetings. Perhaps your life is not completely unmanageble right now. It will likely become so, so swallow your pride and reclaim your life.

[needhelp1]

Can anyone out there give me some advice on my earlier postings? anything is appreciated.

[hellbent]

Needhelp:

In my experience, the depression and lethargy are lessened in direct proprtion to the amount of external activity you are involved in. You have spent alot of time on drugs, wrapped up in your own addictive mind, worrying about yourself. This way of thinking will depress anyone. Carrying on the same habits of behavior and thinking will almost invariably lead to using again.

The hardest thing in the world, after an opiate run especially, is to get active. I am tormented by it myself at the moment. I feel like ****, am disgusted by the rest of the world (or perhaps just myself). Still, it's the only way out. I don't want to preach about NA/AA, but it's the only thing that is helping me at the moment.

It's hard to seperate the psycological from the physical symptoms once the worst is over. Both the body and mind remain sick. Healing comes, almost always, from doing that which you do not want to do. Your patterns of thinking and behavior have gotten you to where you are. If they don't change, neither will your life. Good luck.

[hippy]

yo gwh, i really don' t beleive the rd boy story, even if it is true, don't take any blame , you have your own real problems to deal with.  this is a fourm filled with addicts and people with chronic pain ,along with other problems.
like i wrot to you yesterday, death and and addicts killing them selves is something that happen';s everyday., my brother and 3 cousins, and countless freinds have all killed them selves
with drugs  in one form or another  along with shooting them selves, and that's the way it is and will continue to be,
i must say my brother  and my cousins were insane to do the things they did and wind up dead,
for anyone who sticks around and live's a life dealind with addicts and helping addicts they are going to see a lot of people die.
but any one trying to blame it on someone else is just pure denile.
the only thing that matters to me in this situation is that gwh
takes care of himself and his own problems regarding staying clean.
gwh you have been nothing but kind on this fourm, sharing yiour experence ,strength and hope , ,don't let anyone knock you off that course.
radio boy , all he ever did was ask questions , about pill's
andif they got you high or not., i don't recall him ever reaching out and supporting anyone, he just was interested in radio boy.
I hope that it is all bull **** because if it's not my heart goes out to his famly , and the pain that they will suffer,

[hippy]

the receipe is vitamine mix that really helps a lot,
it worked wonder for me and took all the severe depression away.
the worst pat of withdrawls is the 1st week
the receipe
l-tyrosine 8 cap's 500mg  ady the 1st week  then cut down to 4 aday after that.
b-6 100mgs  2 a day
a strong multy vitimine. 1 a day
vit c
vit a
vit e
calsium -magnisum
copper
magnesee
phousphous

get imoudium for the ****'s - this is important
because the runs depleat your body of all nutreints.
banna's are vwry good for leg spasms and restless leg's
gatoraide is vwry good the replenish the lost electolites
it probly best to take the gator aid early in the day , because it could keep you up at night if you drink int at night.

plenty of water is a good idea.
hot baths is another good idea.

well good luck and keep posting, ive been off the vikes  for 9 weeks and the receipe is the reason why.
the l-tyrosine has been a life saver for me.
i have been very strict in taking the vitamins, for the first time in my life.

peace and i hope you fell better . keep posting and let me know how you are making  out.

[hellbent]

I've been taking 5htp and tyrosine. My question is, how do you know it's really doing anything? From previous dtx and not taking them?

[needhelp1]

Where is the best place to find l-tyrosine and 5htp. I have looked in riteaid. safeway. longs. with no luck?
Thanks

[hippy]

you can get the vitamins ant GNC a vitamine shop

as far as knowing if its working, first of all you have to take the recepe every day, as said.
the 5htp is is not part of the receipe but is a good vitamine.
when i tried to quit the vikes cold turkey, many time's i might add i sufferrd severe depression.and could not work at all and would just sit at home and go nuts.
when i took the receipe as suggested the depressin went away completly, and i had the energy to go to work, mind you that i did not feel great the 1st week it was a lot better, and the wthdrawls were something i was able to at least able to deal with. , in the 2nd week it got a lot better and i evrn was starting to have some feeling good hours.

[needhelp1]

once you had stopped the recipe did the depression return?

[Hinkster]

Try the Health Food Store in your area. Thats where I found them
They had the 5HTP in stock but had to order the l-Tyrosine it
took about a week to get it. Both about ten bucks a pop. Good luck.
Tom

[Francoise]

Blaming a suicide because of what someone said on a bulletin board is a guilt-tripping, bullshit excuse. Reminds me of my grandmother who, when anyone called her on her bad behavior, would say, "you're going to cause me to have a heart attack."

No, grandmother, your own emotional reactions to life are going to cause you a heart attack. YOU are responsible for your own emotional reactions, not me. And, by the way, save your guilt trips for someone willing to go on them. And that ain't me.

Francois

[hippy]

i am still taking the receipe and see no reason to stop,
i feel great and the best  is no depresion.
life is just getting better.
i like most addicts have always been a good starter but i last for a short time ,  like a week or 2. then i was on to the next thing.
well not this time the receipe is working greatand i have no depression at all and  feel really good.

i am 42 years old and i think a few vitimines are good for me.
i work real hard, so i need all the help i can get.

besides i have been clean before and i rember the depression lasting for almost a year.

[big_dave]

Wow - sorry to break into this thread, especially with all the **** going down about suicide (or not, as the case may be).  I posted yesterday, but it was to a message far down the list, so it may have been missed by the regulars.  Anyway, I'm a junkie, just my drug of choice was alchohol.  I'm clean for 4 months now (i use the occasional cannabis, and I take Paxil for depression, 2 a day, 20mg - on doctors orders and I don't abuse them). One of the main reasons I am posting is that a dear sweet friend of mine has got herself caught up big time on Percs, Valium (she gets these prescribed, but goes through her prescription in a week or 2), Lorezepam (Ativan) or anything morphine based she can get her hands on.  She says she wants to get off, and is weaning herself off, but I have a hard time beleiving it.  She is suffering from severe depression, anxiety and panic attacks, and heart palpitations (which are probably from the drugs).  She is afraid that if she goes cold turkey, she will have seizures or a heart attack.  Is this true?  What is Perc withdrawl like?  What can I do to help?  If anyone in the group can help me out, I'd really appreciate it because I know one thing - I DON'T WANT TO BURY ANOTHER FRIEND!!!  

God bless you all - you are a great group, from what I have read of the threads (and I have read most of them).  And remember - the light at the end of the tunnel may just be you!

[lifeisbetter]

If you don't want to bury another friend take her to detox. She is absolutely correct. If she stops Ativan or Valium cold turkey she is very likely to have a seizure or at the least extreme anxiety, especially if she is taking high doses. The symptoms you describe sound mostly like the opiate withdrawel. Opiate withdrawel is more painfull but benzodiazepine withdrawel can be deadly. Opiate withdrawel is pretty much immediate as you will feel the signs of withdrawel as early as 8 hours from the last dose, where with benzos it may take a few days to feel w/ds fully. Valium and Ativan are basically alchohol in pill form, they are drawn to the same receptors in the brain that alchohol is drawn too. Benzo's and alchohol are metabolized by the body almost identically. DO NOT LET YOUR FRIEND WITHDRAW FROM BENZOS COLD TURKEY.

[JoeyR]

I have been on and off Ativan for the last 4 years. 1mg twice a day and never had a major problem with withdrawl. I do however get headaches, anxiety (what i take it for), sweating and a few other mild symptoms. Guess I am just lucky. I have been without it weeks at a time and noticed the effects for up to 72 hours after i stop taking it.  Ativan is chemically different (although not much) than Valium (Diazepam)and Xanax (Alprazolam). Xanax is a ***** if you quite outright. The others are less harmful if you just stop. Of course eveyones body reacts differently

[lifeisbetter]

I sure hope you read this. Think about this one. If we could make someone commit suicide, or do anything for that matter, with a few "out of line" comments then we have alot more power than we realized. Its kind of like my five year olds thinking process. He really believes he is strong enough and big enough to kill "all bad guys and any monsters that have the nerve to hang around our house"! It's his own way of making himself feel safe. Don't you see its called magical thinking. We know he doesnt have "super powers" but he doesnt. Just like Radioboys wife believes right now that "words can kill"...they can't.
If the post truly came from Radioboys wife then we all absolutely have to understand her frame of mind. Her husband is dead..and by his own hand. How absolutely inconceivable that must be to her. So she used her "magical thinking" to cope with her loss,and like my son she will grow someday and realize it wasn't true but it helped at the time. If the post came from Radioboy himself he just feels hurt. Rejection sucks! and the truth hurts. He didn't know how else to get out of his own skin so he used his "magical thinking" and made up the suicide story. I've done that all my life, try to blame others and not take responsibility or be able to listen to constructive criticism. Its a growth process and hes a work in process just like we all are.

In any event, its too bad this "magical thinking" doesn't work. I still close my eyes, cross my arms and blink like Jeannie did, but dammit the house doesn't get clean! Wouldn't it be great to have that kind of control...the things we addicts could do! Sadly we don't,true power comes from only one source...God.

and you BETTER NOT LEAVE!!!! You have helped many of us at exactly the right time, you are not allowed to leave! I will blink my eyes, make myself really tiny and come through this computer and yell at you in person if you do!

[hellbent]

The benzo withdrawal I just went through nearly killed me. Still, I did live. My doses were ridiculously high, but I was only on them for 3-4 mos (my memory is really hosed right now). I also went through massive opiate w/d and benzo w/d at the same time, and did it on my own, at home. I never got the worst symptoms (migraines, convulsions), but what I got took me to the hilt of what my mind could handle.

I wouldn't wish the experience on anybody. That said, you don't want to string out a benzo taper for months, or years, as many people do. Being an addict makes a long benzo taper very risky. I didn't take them for anything but sleep, and I don't know if I could do it.

I would go take her to a rehab that would sedate her with meds from a family that she is not addicted to (barbs maybe). The best thing they could do would be to make sure she stays alive, not make her comfortable. It's not possible to be comfortable withdrawing from benzos. I would find away to get her out as soon as possible. I lost 25 pounds, am still terribly weak, but getting out the other side is all that matters.

[skipper]

hey there everyone:
just a few thoughts and then i'll shut up for awhile. first of all i would just like it to be known that kip's address in cyber is (and always has been) Med help's addiction medicine forum. everytime there is a "blowout" and people leave (or threaten to), my resolve becomes ever stronger to stay right here. now Cindy and Phil (who do an excelent job running this place) might have other ideas, might ban me, but unless that happens, i'm here to stay!

now about the suicide of radioboy74. i sure hope he was pulling one over on us! ya' know i'm not ashamed to let everyone know that many people have in the past got one over on old kip here. i'm sure that someone will get one over on me in the future. the point i'm trying to make is it's no big deal- i can be had! so even if the person who called themselves "radioboy74" did not really pull the plug...well they did "comit cyber suicide!" i don't know how the person who called it's self "radioboy" will be able to come back "radioboy." no doubt this person will comeback, but not as "radioboy."so we have had a "cyber suicide!" kind of wierd, but somewhat intresting. i can honestly say, i anxiously await the cyber reincarnation of this person who in his past cy-
ber life was know as "radioboy!"

well i seem to have stumbled off the deep end tonight! i'll shut-
up for awhile. we must pull our selves up closer tonight, for we
are one less (even if it is only in cyber). i can honestly say
that i am truely sad about the loss of radioboy. ya' know all we
ever really had or will have on this forum is each other. we are
all fragile and frail when we are alone. but as a group, we have
unlimited strength....

there will always be room for just one more addict, so please
come in out of the cold and join us...

and keep an angel on your shoulder!
kip

[Mace]

I cant believe this thread! Suicide... a newly widowed woman writing messages to a person who she claims caused her husband’s death by writing something on a web site....another man posting repeatedly defending himself against the accusation...then someone breaking the law by using the NCIC to check records for purposes other than an official investigation! Are we all fools? I don’t know what the truth is here but I do know that this site should be above this kind of juvenile behavior. Shame on those who trivialize drug addiction and suicide in this post. Ok now you can reply and tell me what an ass I am... but I wont see it because I refuse to read this **** ever again.

[Nod]

How about we get back to what this site is all about - Helping each other live.  I'm 2 months clean thanks to this site and I read as a ghost mostly now, once and addict always an addict. When this site gets off track, I fear I may as well.

Radioboy could be true or not.  (although have much doubt after the posting error)  But, in the real world this **** happens.
That's why its so easy to believe and understand.  If this is a hoax I find it repulsive.

In April 1999, 2 friends of mine committed suicide on the same day.  These were 2 friends that didn't know each other, I was just friends with both of them.  I had severe chest pains a few days after buying them, went to hospital, ended up having heart catherization - my heart ended up being fine.  Except they messed up my femoral artery in the procedure and I almost bleed to death.  I was left with severe permanent nerve damage throught my groin.  Long story short...pain meds to control perm damage and here I am.  

So (AVS / Radioboy), if your playing a mean game, please stop.  People care about people here.  If in truth, Godspeed.
Nod

[big_dave]

Thanks folks - I've almost got her talked into letting me take her to London (Ontario). They've got a great teaching/research hospital there, and good psych programs.  She hasn't quite hit bottom yet, but she's real close (been there, done that). I appreciate the feedback.

Hippy - do you think the recipe would help my friend while she is weaning herself down?  

Also, my friend has a computer at home, she's just not on-line.  I'll hook her up and show her this group - it would do her good to know that she is not alone out there (I know it does me good).

I'm new, so I may not have the right to enter into this, but as to the suicide thread:

"Lord, grant me the strength to change the things I can,
To accept the things I can't, and the wisdom to know the difference." If this situation is real, or cyber, there is nothing anyone here can do to change it, so be at peace.

[rowanshyne]

It's okay, hang on.  
I just came online and saw this.  Somebody is ******* with you.
*Don't* give them permission to mess with you.  Maybe someone's jealous that you're trying, maybe someone is simply too dumb to entertain themselves.
It's not you.  It's probably li'l ol Radioboy himself trying to make you feel badly.
You're getting scared and there's no reason to be.  Just remember how goofy all his other posts were.

Wren

[groovygirl]

wow - this thread has really gone right to hell.  this clown is messing with you big time.  you would have to have some serious problems to make up something as huge as suicide, but i think that's what we have here.  don't waste more time with this...hopefully they will just go away.  i'm sorry to hear you are struggling...it's so hard.  i find it harder and harder to post, because i just feel like i say the same things over and over...i guess i don't have anything positive to add right now. i must be the only person in the world addicted to buprenex...i should let scientists experiment on me...i'd really like to know why i seem to be the only one with this problem...boo-hoo!

[angst]

A darvocet habit of 8-12/day for 8 months is long enough for your body to become dependent.  Meaning you will most likely go
through withdrawals.  I hate to tell you that, but it works that
way.  If you do not need the darvocet, you can taper.  With the ativan for sleep, some immodium for stomach ills, and gatorade so as not to dehydrate.  Start with cutting the two's in one's when you dose.  That will put you at 4-6/day.  Some of the others
use the recipe listed above by Hippy.  Then continue to cut the dosage of Darvocet, until you are taking one a day, then none.  You will feel bad for a couple of weeks.  You will hurt at places you did not know you could hurt.  It is doable.  
Welcome to this forum.  You can always write me, I'll try to answer you questions.  If you find you cannot do it on your own,
contact a doctor who specializes in addiction medicine.  I hope you do well.  Write me and keep me posted.  Good luck and Blessings,  Ava

[angst]

Welcome to the forum.  i apologize that you got caught up in some melodramatic exchanges.  I do not know what else you can do
except to see a doctor or go to the ER.  Often they will give you a long acting benzodiazapine ( be careful, they are addictive) which can stop the shakes for a while.  they will probably only give you 3 to 5 days worth.  immodium works great for the stomach ills.  you will hurt in places you never knew existed.  when the pain starts, the w/d's are almost over.  try NA for support.  I needed them bad and still go, even though I am on methadone maintenance for the 2nd time.  they open their arms to me.  Good Luck.  I hope this will help.  Not too little , too late.   Ava

[angst]

Welcome to the forum-all of us.  The help the forum as a group is
greater than any one of us alone.
You can try to write down the questions or comments first, then
review to see if they are appropriate.  There are many ways to detox.  Let us know more of the problem, we will try to help. You
can always write to me - Angst.  I am usually here, maybe a day off now and then.  Keep me posted.  I care.

[vikequeen]

I come to this site to get info, to get **** off my back and to vent mostly, I was so disheartned to see all this suicide drama fpr which I do not believe for one moment. Let's steer this forum back into place. I am a RX drug addict struggling day to day with this. I want to get clean but the time is not right right now. I read all that everyone has to say and I learn a lot and people are people no one will agree with each other all the time. To Radio boys wife you should be ashamed of yourself and disgrace people who really have commited suicide. I will come back to this site when its back to what is supposed to be used for helping each other, not " As the drug addict's world turns"
Baddgirl

[needhelp1]

I really dont think i need to go get benzodiazapine as i do not have the shakes... Today is going on a week without the drugs. I still have loose stool.. is this normal for 7 days out? its not as bad as it was the 2nd day.. but im a little worried.. As far as my depression goes.. i think its the worst in the morning and starts to taper off during the day.. but it doenst taper off to the point where im excited about anything.. Im playing on going to gnc to get 5htp and possibly the other ingredinets to reciepe.. but does anyone think i should make a dr. appointment in the meantime for the depression? I would truly like to wait it out and see if i can start to feel more up about things without any meds as i did before the drug use.. but my relationship is starting to suffer as a result of me not really wanting to do anything after being at work all day.. and being at work all day. Im and 20 years old and really could use some more adive on these issues. Also.. where would i find info on n/a meetings in my area? like locations.. times.. etc? any help would be really useful at this point... thanks for all the advice thus far in my journey.

[OxyDout]

JoeyR - I apologize for the awful greeting you received by which you had to read all that had happened, I will be here if you ever need help.

Needhelp - the same goes for you, I really hope you get the help you deserve from this forum.  

Mace- I understand your point of view, however, you have to put yourself in my shoes, someone was blaming an "alleged" suicide on a comment I posted.  Please don't judge the people in this thread for what they had said and done.

Everyone else,  I don't know what to say, I first came to this forum to get help, which I did, although i'm not there yet, you have all helped in allowing me to see all that I need to change, and more importantly the road in which I need to take to get there.  I found myself becoming the helper as well as the one in search for it.  I thought, although some of us may have had some misunderstandings that I have given it my best, 110% effort to help others in this awful life we live.  I'm at a loss for words, except to say that if I have "seriously" ever offended anyone in this forum, please except my dearest apologies.  However, as far as Radioboy74 goes, I will not take back my comments.  If there was a suicide, I'm sincerely sorry and wouldn't wish that upon anyone, but I feel strongly in the anger that was shown through my posts.  

I hope you all are having a better day and can continue to do so over the weekend.  I especially want to thank jessesarpy, groovy and skipper for there thoughtful and helpful statements.  It would make me feel great if the 3 of you could tell me how you are doing because I need to hear that you are all doing better.  

Groovy, what can I say other then you ARE RIGHT, I should tell my girlfriend, I found myself miserable last night, so much so that I almost had a panic attack last night.  I have just spent my check this week on drugs and paying bills, I"m not better off, I still need something to taper, or just stop, so now I"m screwed, but either way, I can't express the quilt and depression I felt in speaking with my girlfriend last night.  Please post to me and help me get through this, I need to hear from you.  And DON'T EVER talk about yourself the way you did in that post, it doesn't make a difference what the drug is, we are all the same, we depend on a substance to feel normal, that is it, our fighting just as hard as anyone, so don't do that to yourself, stay strong, I have faith in you, ou will get through this.

I look forward to hearing from you all.

GWH

[skipper]

gwh:
i'm glad your back! this forum isn't done with you yet! what hap-
pened yesterday was awul! the sad part is, i'm too good at play-
ing games like this. i would have gladly jumped in and help you
stomp on the bad guys...trouble is all that will get you is mem-
bership and respect in the "bad guys club...and we both know that
there isn't enough junk to keep that movie rolling!

keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[OxyDout]

I appreciate it, yesterday was the first time on this forum that I felt like everyone was not only looking at me but judging all that was said............. it was tough to think about. But when I thought about it, I really don't want to stop posting, I just didn't know what to say, besides, both yourself and Groovy have especially helped me realize what I need to do, I would love for the both of you to stay with me.

GWH

[shane]

Ive been reading the sad state of afairs that is ocurring on our forum. I say OUR because I so recognize most of the names here I almost feel it is part of a family. Ive been reading and posting here for the better part of two years and have never seen such hostility!!! It's a shame and I hope it dosen't divert newcombers who need help. This is still the best place to get help and caring! Gwh Iv'e been reading your posts for some time and found them to be very insightful,very helpful  and very caring! You have done nothing wrong. Forget this situation. If this suicide was a hoax it is beyond sick! If not there was nothing anyone on this forum ccould have done! We will all go on with our Posts and reading and we will survive. Skip, WW and all
Ia'm Glad you were here to offer some vetern experiance. Thanks to all and keep up the good work.  Love  Shane

[OxyDout]

I can't thank you enough for your kind words, it really means a lot, thank you, really, I mean that. Unfortunately, I can't help but think it was a hoax since radioboy74/Avs has not posted............. but that doesn't matter anymore, I really feel bad as I see people posting about the "hostility", or the "dumb" comments, and asking why people are so immature.  I know all of it is referring to me and that bothers me.

[phear]

everyone puh-leeze forgive me to break into this thread but i can never post a question and right now i have to find out how long this restless leg syndrome will last i am right now 6 days yahoo ! off the hydro's from a 3 year problem i am on the recipe which has helped so much with the depression. Could someone tell me about how long to expect this RLS to last and when i will be able to sleep normal again... thanx to everyone here.. i read this everyday..

phear

[needhelp1]

I know i asked this earlier.. but how longs should my runs last? I took imdodium the 2nd day and it seemed to clear up for a few days but now im back to the runs... Not as bad as before.. but it has been close to seven days and im still not normal in going to the bathroom... any advice greatly apprecitated...

[lifeisbetter]

Hey you. So glad your back. I was kinda worried that you would feel like you were being "judged". The truth is I didn't see more than a couple of negative posts to you. One was from someone I haven't ever seen before. There were far more from those of us who know you. I feel pretty lucky to be involved in a group that is so supportive of one another. Thank God you didn't let anyone get you down for long. We need you! I did read someones quote from the Bible "an eye for an eye". I think that person should read it a little more and come to the section where Jesus talks about casting that first stone. He was talking to the Pharisees who were judging a woman for cheating on her husband. He told them not to judge that woman. He said "if anyone here has not sinned then cast the first stone". No body did. I just mean please don't feel judged. The people that have been here for a while are the ones who know you and the ones who need you.

Now, how did this glitch affect your progress? You started the post needing some help staying on track. You could easily use this as an excuse to pick up the oxy's again. How are you doing?

[lifeisbetter]

Hey! You doing ok? Haven't seen your post lately. Miss you.

[dive]

Hey everyone,

I just returned from a week and a half in Curacao, scuba diving, I was feeling pretty good, but when I saw this thread, and actually read it, I laughed my ass off.

WHAT A BUNCH OF BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

from RadioBoy that is.  First of all NCIC is pretty legit, so there was no suicide, second GWH is right, and there is now way you can post using someone else's name without either being on their computer, or having their password.  

Stop bickering, noone died.  Whoever Radioboy is, is screwing with everyone here.  All he ever did was ask us for info on how to get high, any good junkie knows when another is looking for a buzz, and it doesn't take a genious to figure out radioboys questions.  

GWH, email me, I finally have that pic I promised.

To everyone: have a great life.  This forum sucks **** when you've sobered up like I have.  I can't even bear to read it anymore, and I was using it as a relapse prevention tool, after I detoxed over two months ago.  

It's amazing how differently you begin to think after the drugs leave your system.

For those of you who are here for real reasons, and are trying to win this battle geniunley, I applaud you and wish you the best, and I wish I could help you.  For the rest of you whining, self pittying, no-job, buprenex shooting (or Methadone munching), lazy motherfuckers, you know who you are.  I hope you never get clean, you ******* don't deserve it.  Most people put in a real effort to get and stay clean.  And those that do it, get on this board to whine during Detox, and then get better.  The rest of you just keep doping up, and keep biching how terrible WD is.  Well guess what, nobody put a gun to your head and told you to blow 50 oxy 80's up your nose in one sitting did they, your doctor certainly didn't prescribe them that way.  So please realize that the ONLY way to get off drugs is to get off drugs, and stop lying to yourself, your not clean if you keep shooting Bub, your not clean if you keep taking Methadone, you're not clean if you eat 20 ultrams every 2 hours.  You're only clean when you're off all opiates ( and benzos for that matter)

So if you think I'm being insensitive, **** YOU, and you can blow me for all I care, because I too was addicted, and I suffered thru WD, and I'm clean now because of it, If that sounds impossible to you, than you don't deserve sobriety.  Anyone can do this, it just takes a little more willpower than your lazy ass is willing to give.  

Flame away..... everyone.  I hope it gives you something to do...

I used to like this forum, but the only true friend I've made here, who was an extraordinary example for me to follow, was GWH.  

For that GWH, I thank you, and my liver does too, so I will talk to you privatley from now on, since this bunch of babies, loosers, and self pity bunch of assholes is too much for me to deal with.  My life has mooved on and so am I.

Goodbye everyone.  I hope to all those that really want sobriety, that you will find it someday.  Because it won't find you....  You need to seek it out.

[tex3]

Life -- thanks for looking for me! I've been out of town all week, just got home last night. We are moving next week and I'm trying to get everything settled, so haven't been around and probably won't be until after it's done. But I miss you guys so had to stop by! I'm doing great and hope everyone else is too.

Phear -- First, congratulations, you've made it through the worst part! The restless leg should get better everyday now, and be gone soon, probably a day at most (I think). I had a similar habit and that's how it always worked for me. Hang in there. Eat bananas. I've heard that helps, but if I'm wrong someone please correct me! You might post on the most recent question at top so more people can see it.

GWH -- This was just radioboy up to his usual ****. Jesus, he must be on a trip. The "slip" with the posting gave it away, if the grammar alone didn't. He and AVS and "radioboy's wife" are all the same. I'd ignore it and not pay it a single thought; he needs help we can't give him and has something really wrong if he's wasting so much time playing mind games. Sorry if this offends anyone but when you read it close you will realize the error "radioboy's wife" made when posting under his old screen name and then breaking in under a new screen name. Crazy.

Have a great weekend everyone.

[hippy]

what s up, you seem like something really bothering you,
don't you think your being a little harsh.
i know some people a big babies sometimes, but geez
don't ya think ya over did with the put downs.
i am personaly grateful twards this fourm.
im no spring chicken my self, so i think i can say that
with all  my years in na , there is a saying----
cockiness is a red light indicater.
so what im trying to say in a respectful way we need to find some humilty once we get clean.
you could post back to me and rip me up , but  i am only trying to share my experence. getting clean is a lot easier than continueing to stay clean fo rlong periords of time , hopefully for the rest of your life.

but we do reap what we sow,
and arragonnce is a mask for low self esteem.
  sorry for the bad spelling

[angst]

Only you could find a civil way to respond to an egghead who probably does not know the meaning of humility.  I still say the
whole of the forum is stronger than any one person alone.  There is no greater way than one addict helping another.  That is enough foul language to start his own sex anonymous group in his home town.
Thanks hippy for being you.  You got a point across that many of us felt but did not know how to say.  Not only are you a poet, but you also showed your skill of vocabulary dealing with a neanderthal (sic).
Thanks again,  Ava

[Nod]

hello there.  Congrats on 6 days clean.  I'm 2 months a couple days ago!  Great feeling isn't it!  I'm not a doctor and only had small RLS problems which ended which didn't last but a few days.  I would suggest giving it a few more days and see how it goes.  If you don't feel a decline in the RLS, you might consider talking to your doc if you have a good relationship.  From what I understand, if addiction related it should slowly fade but I have read other cases where it is unrelated to the RLS.  Again, no doc here, just saying what I read.

Again, congrats on 6 days clean.  After 3 year habit (mine was 2yrs) that is one hell of an accomplishment.  You are just now starting to feel the "good side" and it will keep getting better!
Keep it up.
Nod

[vikequeen]

Go get laid it sounds like you need it, you have a serious bug up your ass

[hippy]

thanks, always good to hear from ya,
and read all your post they are filled with  a shining kindness.

thought  4 the day-----------------hate, anger,and lies are acids that destroy the jar that holds them.

peace-----------------------!!!!!!!!!!!!! michael

have great week end

[hippy]

HE WHO  SLINGS MUD LOSE'S GROUND

[rowanshyne]

You are both almost there.  
For RLS, keep warm, hot baths and chamomille tea are great, really.
The depression eases up gradually, you're not going to wake up one morning and feel tremendously better from the day before, but you *will* wake up one morning and realize how much better you feel than you did earlier in the week.
Just
keep on keepin' on
Wren

[phear]

rowanshyne, nod, tex3:     thanx so much for your response not sure if it wuz the depression but as i read the support regarding me, i got these proud tears in my eyes.. thanx so much, made me feel so good..  and as being this big tattooed guy i must of had an emotional over load you guys triggered, maybe i need one of my l-tyrosines... thanx

Dive:       Okay I cant hold back.. Sounds like you needed this forum at one time and you seem to of taken from it for your benefit.. My gawd, man have some compassion as others did for you of your time of need. I read that post and pictured you sitting in a pickup truck at a signal blowing your horn at some poor little old lady not able to make it completely across to the other side before the light changes.       OK i feel better, did i just flame someone lol...

JoeyR:     I feel that you getting onto the Internet finding info on this subject is the best thing for you to do is educate urself on addiction, your med's, and wut has helped me is knowing what I will have to look forward to as i WD. I am on 7 days and would not been able to do it if it wuz not for the knowing of wut to except and for how long.. Joey ignore the bullshit here print out all these post and put them next to the toilet, cuz I while wd spend lots of time in there.. Read only what you want. Put your head up, not high. Wow that sounds good.. This is my first day I feel this clarity about things more alert... educate first, then work on getting off... stay strong!

phear

[skipper]

dive:
perhaps you need some more dope....i think you missed enough les-
sons in despair to not be able to grasp the concepts of mercy, com-
passion, and hope. you probabaly won't answer this, or if you do,
it will be with some snide ****, that you see as tough love oe what
ever...that's OK though, 'cause i'm goin to love and care and pray
for you and there isn't a damm thing you can do about it.

oh yeah, it's real easy to be a tough guy ass-hole in cyber. are
you like that in your real life? see i kind of got you pictured as
a little nebbish who feels overlooked and ignored.

keep posting and i WILL PRAY for YOU
keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[ands2]

i just wanted to thank eveyone for yourhelpful advice.. I posted earlier this weeks and needhelp1.. I have to say that before i found this forum i was feeling pretty bad. Didnt have many people to talk to etc.. Since i have found this forum i realized that i am defiantely not alone. And there are many people out there going through the exact same things as me.. I started to feel a little better menatally lastnight.. was actually able to laugh and smile and bunch.. and i havent been able to do that all week.. i dont know if it was the st. johns wort or the kava kava talking.. but i hope it is just ME being able to slowly shine through again. Im still having my sleeping issues.. im only able to sleep around 6 hours max.. when im used to being able to do 8-9... i dont find myself thinking about the drugs nearly as much as i find myself thinking that i wanna be better mentally... Thanks again to all <hug> amd

[shane]

Hello all. I tried to post a Q and as usual there was no way. I do need some help though. I was clean for about six weeks when I recently ran into a Prescription for 30 norco 10/325. I used them in exatly one week. My question is, what can I expect in the way of withdrawl? It was such a stupid decision And was not at all worth it. I'am more than a little anxious about what's ahead/ any advise would be greatly apprciated. THank you. Shane

[angst]

You will have the blah's for a while.  You were abusing the natural endorphins in your brain, as well as seratonin.  Exercise is a good way of getting that boost back into you life
naturally.  You can make it.  The recipe circulated in the earlier posts can help.  I also heard kava kava helps.  Have you
gone to an NA meeting?  There is no greater help than one addict
helping another addict.  You can get a charge.  Get a sponsor, one person who has some clean time and you can relate to.  That
person will help you stay clean.  I hope something I've said will
help you.  You deserve a clean and happy life.  Good luck and
Blessings, Angst.

[angst]

You are right in suggesting a psychologists who talks you through
the issues of depression or a psyciatrist who will medicate your
depression.  the psychiatrist may help you most.  let him know you are taking the recipe.  from darvocet, i would imagine the runs lasting no longer than 2 weeks.  the immodium is good, but if you do not have to leave the house, let the stomach ills run their course, they are cleansing your body.  just drink plenty of gatorade.  you will make it.  go to the doctor.  i am a retired nurse so i can tell you to get the most help from a doctor.  i want you to make it, and if you want it very much, you
can achieve that goal.  NA helps a lot.  get your hand on a basic
text and later "it works : how and why".  they help any addict.
i went in withdrawals first and stayed for over 7 months.  i took
a high stress job at a poor private hospital.  it was too easy to
get the wastages to carry home.  i relapsed 2 times there. i got
caught in a random UDS.  i surrendered my license.  i had been
nursing for over 8 years.  i won nurse of the year for the oncology floor in 1995.  i was on Stadol NS at that time for intractable pain of vascular headaches with clusters.  that was
before it was scheduled.  that started my addition.  whether we are active or dormant addicts, our disease is progressive.  when
we pick up again, it will not be at the level when we stopped.  it will be worse.  go to the doctor, and write me and others back.  we care.  good luck and Blessings,  Ava

[Hinkster]

Ava...Has anyone ever told you you are one wonderful Lady? Well
I just did and you are.
Tom

[angst]

Thank you Tom.    As I've said before,  the whole of this forum is greater than any one person in the forum.  Glad to see you posting.  You might want to check your mail.  Angst

[lifeisbetter]

Hi just came online for a second. You'll probably be ok. Most likely the worst thing you'll feel is depression. Maybe a little flu-like not too bad though. The depression comes from both chemical and emotional changes your experiencing right now. It is so easy for addicts to get whats called "the **** it's". If we do it once we might as well do it again kind of mentality. Thats gonna be the hardest part for you,it was for me anyway. You did a great thing coming back and posting about it. That means you do still have the desire to stop. Maybe this happened so you can truly see that there is no such thing as "just one pill" for you anymore. Bless you sweety, keep fighting and don't forget to ask for a little help from the one who has the power to do anything.

[hippy]

hope everyone is fighting the good fight, aginst
this thing called addiction, it does get better,
it just take time, one of the little secrets is to help
another person in need, even if it's just a kind word,
or some encouragement,
on this fourm we share our experence, strength, and hope.
with the withdrawls, and how we are getting through another day
staying clean or dealing with severe pain,
there are so many people on this fourm who have been getting through this hell we all seem to go through for one reaon or another,
like so many so it is doable, with the help of each other and the help of professionals in some case's.

we have to be careful not to fall into the trap of thinking
we are different then everyone else, that our situation is unique
. we all al have to focous on our simalarties.
peace to all and our prayers go out to each other,
we need all the help we can get.

so take the time to do something good for somelse.
there in is the key to recovery, taking thr focous off our seves and getting away from our se\lf centeredness.
and finding a way twards god centeredness.

the 12 steps are a life based on the awakeaning of the spirt.
awaerness -awareness-awareness.

[shane]

Hello. Thank you so much for your Post to me. It really did take a lot of anxiety away!!! I really do want to end this insanity.I hope I dodged the bullet this time and I can get back on course. Thanks again. Hippy, that was a very exellent post with some very obvious but to often overlooked insights. Most addicts are self centered and sharing what we have learned is the only way to keep it. It is a healing prosess and being  good for others is the best way to start.  Thank you   SHane

[tex3]

Hi Shane. Here's hoping you feel okay tonight. After six weeks clean I think you physically got all the drugs out of your system, although I'm sure you still had the usual depression, lack of energy and other **** to deal with. The point is that I don't think one week's worth of using will make you feel full WDs. BUT, that's not to say you won't feel bad; probably muted symptoms. Again, I have no medical background. This is just my thoughts from experience and research. Get something for your stomach, even if it's OTC. Please let us know how you're doing. We really do care! We're all here to help each other.

Everyone, I feel really guilty for not being around to help the new people here, and will try to do better. Had an awful night myself and am having a pity party, so will write when I'm more positive and will try to give back. This week's been crazy as we prepare to move, but a lot of the packing we finished today. Good night and hope all are well.
tk

[shane]

Hello T, THanks so much for your post. So far you are right. After about 30 hrw I really don't feel to bad. Mabey I should really count this as a blessing and stop  playing with fire. Next time might well be all the way!!! Anyway thanks again and I really wish you the best of luck on your new begining. And please keep coming to the forum. You are truly so much light. Good luck    Shane

[rowanshyne]

Awww, and was it a nice party? lol!  I can say that, I'm whining to all my critters again today.  Damn beasts, they just wanna know when I'm going to give them treats! No compassion, whatsoever.
And OMG, I'm eating!  All of the best stuff, too - sour cream and onion potato chips, apple turnovers, Coke, frozen grapes.  I can avoid feeling guilty about it, because I know that later this week, when I finally finish the taper and am off of everything, I won't have *any* appetite for weeks.
You're moving now?  I know one should try to stay busy when coming off this nasty stuff, but girl, you've just been running since day one!  You and Angst are inspirations to us hermits.

Blessings on you all,
Wren

[hippy]

good to see ya posting, how ya been hven't seen ya for a week.
i hope you and the kids are well. always nice to see tour post.
so how are things going for you.
my life is going real good, just re-uped on the vitamins.
me and my wife just bought a house out side of phillyy in warrington .pa. i must say it's very exciting, at first i was
a little down on moving from the house we live in now, since
i have been here for 17 years, the longest place i ever lived.
but since we found such a nice house in this super high housing market we are now in , around this area. everything around tis area has gone up 50,000 in the last year and a half,
well good news is always nice , just like any positive steps in the recovery process no matter how small are alway's  welcome.

agian hope your weeek end  is going well,always nice to see your post, we all nee each other to make this fourm work for the newcomer as well as those of us who have been here a while.

[confused.grl]

I was reading about your husbands suicide, I'm so sorry I came to this site hoping to get someone to talk to about my struggles, but every time i posted i would be lucky if mor than one person responded. Although nobody had anything bad to sy it seemed like people only respond to certain other poeple on thei site. After a very bad time i posted begging for somebody to talk to me all i got was somebody else breakin the thread and talking about how her house was broken into, strangely enough about 10 different poeple responded to her, it is very depressing.   If you need to talk my e-mail is ***@****.
                        good luck
                         debra.

[tex3]

Hi guys, thanks for writing, and damn Row you just made me really hungry! Have to break out those chips I bought yesterday...
Saturday night sucked, hence the self-pity. Went out to dinner with the family and as we were leaving my youngest said, "Look, there's Kelsey's mommy! And Regan's mommy!" Well I'll be damned if it wasn't my three best buds, or I should say former. We used to all go out for "girls' night" and have a few drinks, gossip. Been that way for almost 15 years. Then when all my **** went down and my husband and I seperated, they dropped me like sh**. I went over and said hi, chatted for a sec. Then realized how awkward it was for them, since I had so obviously not been invited. We never had a falling out and still talk occasionally, but there's a huge distance. I went home and cried like a baby; stupid, really, but it was the culmination of everything that's happened the past year.
This was actually a good thing because I realized, finally, that there's nothing holding me here and I'm ready for the move on Friday. Can't wait. I'll have my family nearby and am sure will make new friends. It's just that I would never, ever dump a buddy like that, especially when they're in need. I'm as loyal as a damn dog. And I expected the same. They weren't just my friends; we'd been pregnant together and our kids are even best friends. Our husbands are best friends. But life moves on.
Physically and mentally, I'm great. I feel totally normal, finally! But better, because things are so much more clear. I still have "issues" but I feel confident I can deal with them. Haven't been around here much as we've been so busy packing and I was out of town for a week, but I plan to stick around and want to give back, as I don't think I could have made it without you guys. Thank you for that; this place has been so good to me.

[groovygirl]

hi - that suicide thing was a  bunch of b.s., so don't feel too sorry.

i wish you didn't feel so left out, but i know what you mean.  it has become rather high school-like in that certain people seem to "hang" with only other certain people.  don't let it bother you...don't take it personally. it didn't used to be like this. now this board seems to be like a chat room...less addiction information...more chit-chat....sorry.

did you have a particular topic you needed help with?  i don't read or post here that often anymore, so i may have missed it. i hope you post again.

[OxyDout]

I'm sure some of your comments were pertaining to me as well as others, but I want you to know I'm here to help, well, to the best of my knowledge anyway.  confused.grl, I'm not sure what your question or addiction is, but ask some questions, I promise I will respond.  

Groovy, enough of the chit-chat, how are you doing? seriously, i haven't heard from you in a long time, how is the family, are you cutting back on the bup? I hope your feeling ok.

GWH

[mrmichael67]

Dive....got it licked in two months?  You're barely out of the gate.  What an ass you're going to feel like when you pick up again....if you haven't already.

[lifeisbetter]

Your right sometimes people do get overlooked here and I know I am guilty of it also. This board has all kinds of people and personalities,and sometimes we are just mentally somewhere else. I post as often as possible but I can only post while at work. I think alot of times if there is only one or two responses to a question its usually because nothing else can be added, at least that is how it is for me. I don't know, maybe we should do something similar to the 12 step meetings and have a greeter for the day. Like, maybe every Wed. skip can respond to newcomers or questions, every Tues you can, Jessearpy, Tex3, Angst, GWH, Shane, Ash, Irishrose, hippy etc., all of us who feel we should give back can commit to a few days a month, that no matter what a new person will get an answer. Just a suggestion. I really think everyone here has the desire to help.

[lifeisbetter]

Shane how are you holding up today? Don't let the depression get to you. I get up now and don't feel that twinge anymore that I have nothing to look forward to. I just get up.

Tex, again so much in common with you. My best friend since childhood won't even respond to my phone calls. I am so hurt and so resentful at the same time. I have no advice on this one either, except to say I would have come to your pity party if you asked me! Screw our old friends right? We have much more to be grateful for than stressing over people we thought we could count on. People will always let you down thats the nature of being human I guess. But it still sucks!!! I think its really great that you saw something positive from the situation, your right you don't have a thing to hold you there. Just try to make peace with them somehow because they say resentments take us back to our addictions. Uh Oh, I'm in trouble again! How the heck I am staying clean is a true mystery! Its a miracle really.

[tex3]

Parallels, huh? Maybe it's the patterns we followed while using that got in similar places; whatever, it's strange but I appreciate having you with me and all the kind words you've given me. I don't know that I'm a big enough person to not let it hurt me, but I am smart enough, I think, to let it go and not ruin what peace I've found. What happened with your friend?
By the way, I like your idea about structuring things and would be in for that. I want to answer as many questions as I have the ability to, as I got a lot of help here. One part of that was persistence; the more I posted, the more people responded. I will write more later, but thanks again and have a great night! Back to packing for me.

[groovygirl]

please...no structure!  isn't life structured enough?  we didn't have structure before, and it seemed to work well enough.  my point was that people should maybe read the first post in a thread and decide then whether it would be appropriate to post about their new job or whatever.  i was only trying to make the point that there seems to be less sensitivity here than there used to be.  there are a few people here that i now know WAY more about than i would like, and there are others that always seem to have their questions ignored.

[oh please already]

STAND UP TALL NOW     CLAP CLAP CLAP ---------------------------------------MAN YOU DIDNT EVEN MAKE IT OUT THE GATE BEFORE YOU ****** UP**RULE #1   YOU CANT DO IT ALONE.                       AND SO DONT LET THE DOOR HIT YOUR ASSE ON THE WAY OUT,   OH YEAH,YOU BETTER PRY A LITTLE TWIG IN IT SO IT DOENST SLAM SHUT.,U CANT EXPECT LOSER ADDICTS? LIKE ONE OF US TO LET YOU BACK IN-WE MIGHT GET CONFUSED ON HOW THE DOOR WORKS.BUT HEY,WERE IN TOGETHET AND YOUR OUT THERE-ALONE AGAIN,OR IS IT STILL?YOUR TOO SAD FOR WORDS- YOUR A SELL OUT-DIDNT YOUR MOTHER EVER LOVE YOU?IS THAT WHY YOU DONT HUMAN BOND?OR DID SHE KNOW FROM THE START?SOME PEOPLE,YOU CAN JUST LOOK OUT AND KNOW    SELL OUT

[groovygirl]

why do you guys bother commenting to dive?  this thread started with a post from joey who was looking for help, then it turned in to a battle between gwh and radioboy.

we (myself included) need to refocus on what is important here - dive isn't...joey is.

[confused.grl]

I'm in a bad place again, i have chronic pain and am perscribed methadone for it (can't take oxycotin because it controls my lif and cant stop taking it) but i just can't take it as perscribed. I can't function without it (too much pain to move) but can't take the way I'm supposed to. I will be out of medicine soon i don't know what to do. I need to go to work and take care of 3 small children, and a house. I can't ask my boyfreind to shoulder all the responsibility again because i'm a weak person. I feel like  can't even look at my children anymore because i hate myself for not being stronger. I don't abuse my medicine because i want to get high, it is sttrictly for pain control, but my dosage just isn't enough to get me through the day,I'm even tired of hearing myself say " I cant do it i'm too sore" i cant imagine how my family hates hearing it. This injury is killing me inside.

[groovygirl]

hi - have you told your dr. that your dosage isn't enough?  maybe if you tell him how you are feeling, you can get on some kind of program? i too suffer from chronic pain - migraines, and there isn't any easy answers.  unless they come up with a "cure" for headaches, i am going to be caught up in this cycle.  i finally decided, i would rather live with the pain than to continue my life the way it was going...lying to drs and family, stressing about my next prescription, etc.  the bup really helps with the headaches, and i feel like if i stop i will get a bad one and then i will look for something to take and this will start all over again.  people with chronic pain plus addiction are really in a tough place...i can sympathize with you.  

did you go into detox before?  is that why you don't want to tell your bf?  most people relapse, so don't feel alone in that.  if you haven't been totally straight with your dr., i would suggest doing that first.  if he gives you a hassle, i would find someone else quick...maybe a pain specialist.  if your dr. was to prescribe a higher dose, do you think you'd be able to stick with that, or do you think you would need to keep increasing?

[lifeisbetter]

Hi. I am so happy to see you haven't given up on us. I can't imagine the kind of pain your in, but I can admire you for not abusing the Oxycontin. If I had legitimate pain I would have taken everything the Dr. would give me. I do know about having three small kids though. That my friend is rough even for a supermom. I mean even Carol Brady had Alice to help her. So please don't compare yourself to any other mom. You said you can't bear to look at your children anymore because your ashamed. I know that feeling too, but you need to be able to look at yourself first and say "I am doing the best that I can". Thats all. You don't have to be perfect. You don't even have to be great for that matter. You just have to be Debra. And you have to be their "mom". Its hard for me to understand this myself but in spite of all my negative feelings, and all the self doubt, no matter how bad I think I screw up, at the end of the day my kids still call me mommy. This is one role God gave me that I have to accept. My kids love me...no matter what. As hard as that is for me to believe it is true. After all the whining and temper tantrums, they love me unconditionally.
I am their mom. They know that they are and will always be loved by me. Nothing can ever change that. You may have pain, addiction, low self esteem, whatever it is you beat yourself up with...it doesn't matter, your kids are gonna love you. Your stuck with it. So, accept it and give yourself a break, go look in the mirror and say "it could be worse, I'm doing the best that I can, and my kids will always love me!" I am blessed after all.

[tex3]

Hi confused. I too (as several of us here are) the mom of three young children. I was in chronic pain for years. That's what got me started on the road to addiction, although admittedly it was a short drive. I used my pain - which was legit - and welcomed it as it gave me a way to keep getting what I wanted: not attention, but pills. I could barely function and was always stressed out. I felt like I couldn't manage my kids, could barely see to their needs. I didn't admit for a long time that it was the pills that was causing the grief, not so much the pain.
Don't get me wrong. Chronic pain sucks everything out of you. But I could at least get up and function and think like a normal person when I wasn't so doped up. I was always increasing my dose and being irresponsible with my pills, and told myself it was because my pain was so bad, but I was lying to myself. Truth was, I just took too many on a regular basis. The pain wasn't getting better no matter how much I took, so that wasn't it. I just liked the pills.
Once I admitted these truths I was able to quit using and start living. And I feel wonderful. I'm not saying at all that you're in the same situation, as I don't know what your pain is from and how bad it is. Mine got terrible at the end, but I had surgery that took most of it away, which allowed me to address the addiction. But by that point I was ready to live with the pain if I had to. I don't think you should have to live with pain; no one should. But being addicted, I had little choice.
If I got into a bad situation again (pain-wise) I would take the pills, but only if I could do so without losing control. I would have to be brutally honest with myself about it. I've done so once, when my migraines got out of control, and I did fine. But I did it with my eyes wide open.
I apologize for rambling, just wanted you to know you're not alone; many of us feel tremendous guilt for not being the mothers we think we should be. We can't change the past but we can work toward a better present and future. Best of luck and know we are here for you. tracy

[confused.grl]

groovy, I am seing a pain specialist my problem is that when yoou first go to a pain clinic they start you on medicine, for me it was oxycotin, i quickly learned that wasn't for me. I went back to him and discussed the options with him and we decided that we would try methadone, at first is was a life saver, i could go on with my life almost pain free, i still had some pain but i could tolerate it. After i got a stable dose i signed a contract saying that my medicine would never be increased. A month later my medical case manager started pressuring my surgeon about going back to work. Thats when i started having my problem, i talked to my surgeon about limitimg my work hours but he wants to give it 6 months before he makes the final decision whether or not htis is something that is not going to heal. At my last appointment my pain doctor told me that out of all his patients, i am one of only three patients that dont try to make up stories about how they lost their medicine, and ask for early refills all the time, so i dont feel comfortable even asking.

  lifisbetter-tex3.
       thank you for all your kind wourds they do mean alot. I was in a really down mood last night, but after getting up and seing all your kind words, maybe my day won't be as bad as yesterday. I am going to give my medicine to my mom for 2 weeks and only take 1 a day until my next appointment. I will take this time off of work also.

[Avs]

Greetings to all.  I am a first time poster, and bad enough I had to break a Thread but you can't post otherwise.  Before I begin I've seen post in the past couple of days and I want to get this off my shoulder, GWH, no matter what happened, hold your head up - you did nothing wrong my friend, I'm not sure about what happened in the past and don't want to bring it up, but hold your head up, and like I always say, "Smile, It's the Only thing that don't cost and it's contagous."  Now, on to my question.  I've been on Xanax for over 2 years, well a generic version, 2 mg name brand can be expensive.  I recently went to a new pharmacy and they carry the "Geneva" generic, is it possible for this to be a little stronger?  As well as all of us know on benzo's after a while you become prone to the side effects of them, however this seems stronger than the "Mylan or any other, even name brand."  Yes I do know my medication, I can't say I abuse them, however it appears this group will give you real answers.  I thank you in advance.

[ladysopranoinjersey]

GWH - I am relatively new to this forum and was shocked by the obvious prank pulled on you.   Don't worry though, you have real friends out there, especially me, that enjoy coming to the forum and listening to what you have to say.   As for me, my usage has been kept to a minimum, T3's and occasional vic's.  Luckily I am able to wean myself off to only taking 1 vic a day or 1-2 T3's. but, I always seem to relapse thinking it'll be alright to just take a few pills to get me through the day and end up taking 15 vics a day, all they end up doing is giving me a 5 minute high and then sleep!  I wish I could finally be strong enough to say no more, but I get anxious if I only have a few pills left and start looking for ways to get more.    I guess all I can do is to hang in there...thanks for listening, and GWH as they say "keep coming back".

[PINKY8]

Darvocets are truly the most beneficial medication in the world!!!! It's not just for breakfast,lunch and supper anymore.Take 6-7 for breakfast: Guaranteed to cure depession allergies sinus problems,p.m.s, it just is a miracal drug for me anyways. Thats why my screenname is Pinky!!!!Anyone who wants me to recyclle thy're DARVOCETS please e-mail me at ***@****  Does this mean I have a problem??? Hell no I just am dying of Chirrosis of the liver,sinusitus,bhronchitus,bad allergies and arthritis. So I'd like to live the rest of my life to be as pleasant as possible! Thanx for listening!!!!

[boxersorbriefs?]

Hi. I hope someone can give me good info here. I have had migraines since my teens and been taking vicodin w/doctors prescription once a day for almost 15 years. I never take more, and I can quit, have for a week or two, but as soon as I lose sight in my right eye (a sign the migraine is coming.SOON) I cave and take it. I have a lot of kids, and can't just lay down in a dark room, like when I was younger. (5 kids) My husband knows all about it, but, this worries the hell out of me because I see how fast and deep some of you have fallen with this drug. Should I stop? Is there a reasonable alternative for the pain? I don't "work" anymore, but, also don't get "time off" anymore. Am I addicted/dependent/ or should I continue with the program of one a day. Many thanks in advance.

[GOD]

After reading your story, I would have to say that you are NOT addicted. You are using your medication responsibly AS PRESCRIBED for a painful condition. The medication is NEEDED to alleviate your pain, and you are not abusing it. I see no reason for you to stop using the vicodin if you are just using one per day, and have been for the last 15 years. If you find yourself popping a couple extra vicodin because your day was "Stressful" or you think you needed to improve your "Mood"..... THEN you'd have a problem! But, from what I read in your post, you seem to be a responsible person with a pain issue who needs this low dose to help with migraines. I see absolutely nothing wrong with what you are doing. Just MY opinion.....
Jess

[Meka1983]

Please stop that immediately and get some help. It may feel like the pills are not stopping your pain but just take them as prescribed and do not abuse them. My mother took a few darvocet and mixed them with valium a muscle relaxer. She did not wake up on June 19, 2008. Darvocet causes death. Please get some help. Your family and friends love you and will miss you when your gone.