I'm nevous and afraid of what I am going thru with these withdrawals.

[cetiya]

I am getting off the Duragesic Patch, that I have been on for about 5 months. Took it off Monday morning.  My doc was great and game me a million Oxys to get off the Fentanyl.
  One of my main fears is this strange violent "twitch" , it just lasts a second, but it's scaring me, maybe I have something wrong with my brain?
  Also, I have a weird rash on my face and hand, a low grade fever and a sore throat. I did go to a walk-in clinic and they gave me a creme to put on my face and hands.

[needhelpnow]

The twitxhing and jerking spasms are completely normal. I have been in w/d and had them almost knock me off the bed! Don't worry. Also, you tend to be filled with anxiety during W/d so each small thing scares you. Stay clean!

[cetiya]

I just had another one and it's feels like I'm being electrocuted.  I hope it is normal, it never happed before all this.

[Expillman]

A million Oxys?  Even one Oxy frightens me.  If you take Oxycontin for any period of time, you will be PHYSICALLY DEPENDANT [not necessarily addicted] and will have to go through withdrawal.  Your brain doesn't know or care if you are using them for legitimate pain or not.  It will become dependant on the Oxycontin and put you in agony when withdrawn.

Please be careful.

[suzieneedshelp]

I agree those jolts of electricity-like scared me the most!  I was told it is your brain seeking the drug!  It says....where is it?  I can't find it...And your brain chemistry may be changed like mine was and so... it will keep seeking it til it gets it by deceiving your mind (my thinking was/ is controlled by the disease) into using... or those jolts will eventaully wear off..as you stay the course with help and support.  Using another narcotic is dangerous but wil relieve some withdrawal from the other.  Of course narcotics are all the culprit...so it figures taking another just replaces the first, thus your brain is happy receiving any narc drug again.
Peace.. Suzie

[cetiya]

I know how bad Oxy's are, I just needed something to make the wds a bit more painless.  I am aready tapering off and I should be able to do so depending how bad these get and for how long.  I started with 20mg every 4 hours and then after a couple days; just took 3-4 more, towards the end I'm taking two, but I am anxious right now, paranoid about a lot of things, body aches.  The only good thing is I have been able to sleep. That was what I was really worried about.
  I have every intention to be off the hard core narcotics for my pain by the end of the month  (June, that is)

[cetiya]

I hope that didn't sound bitchy, Pillman?  Now I'm not thinking straight and last message didn't read right to me!

[Expillman]

Not at all.  It would take a lot more than that to get under this hide.

[Expillman]

I just donned my Monterry Breeze FIFTY DOLLAR sun hat and mowed my back yard!  I am in HOUR 120 of OXYCONTIN FREEDOM!

I am regaining control of my life.

I am as strong as a horse, have all my hair and have genes of iron [My father is living, 97 and on no meds].  I am not religious, but I have danced with THE DEVIL and subsequently tossed him out of my life.  He has made attempts to regain control, but has been repelled and is now on the run NEVER TO RETURN.

I refuse to go into depression!  I am not afraid of death and was ready to face it if necessary.  Not that I relish the thought of dying and missing out on precious life, my grandchild growing up or new scientific discoveries, but I was ready to go to the mat with this thing, whatever it took.

Hey, I also believe in the power of positive thinking!

Seriously, I have always been a rapid recoverer from the flu or surgery or whatever.  I have convinced myself that this will also be the case with this unfortunate malady.

[Susie B]

Your comments are so great! It's wonderful to see someone doing so well. I've been showing them to my husband as he's struggling a bit through his 3rd week.  I think seeing such positive progress is really helping him. Thanks and good luck. Please keep posting. Its the first time I've smiled in a while.

[suummerrwwinnd]

Someone please help!!  Those nasty anxiety attacks are returning.  I don't know how to deal with them w/o chemical help.  This is week 6 of no pills.

[lovelyneurotic]

the funny thing about anxiety meds is that they help during the time you're on them, but once you get off it seems like your previous anxiety is worse than ever.  Are you getting additional therapy to cope? I hope so. Also, alot of doctors are now prescribing buspar for anxiety because it is _not_ addictive with less side effects. The only thing is you have to wait a few weeks for the drug to build up in your system and start working at its fullest potential.

[AmberHunter]

hang in there sweetie, it will get better most likely. have you considered trying an herbal supplement like valerian? you can find natural treatment for anxiety from a good health food store...

if that doesn't help then you would be looking at short term use of benzo's... klonopin is long acting and in my opinion a good choice... just don't let yourself get too used to them. i use them for anxiety and they have helped tremendously and i have not abused them once... nor do i take them everyday...

good luck to you,

amber

[terter]

My friend is an ex addict who needs back surgery and will be on some type of pain pills, My question is will she go through withdrawls if she takes pills for an extended amount of time?? I asked my mom and she said if you go back to the amount you were taking when you were an addict it wont take long (a few days)before your faced with w/d. She says she'll take them as perscribed but for back surgery she'll probly be on high doses of something. She was taking about 25 norco 10s and a butt load of soma a day. She says the doc will have her take 2 10's (norco) every 4 hours thats 12 a day (yikes) if she takes that for 2 weeks will she suffer w/d I know this is general but any help would be great. Thanks TER

[eyeswideopen]

Due to insurance change I started seeing new doc who knew right away I was addicted (even though I denied until the cows came home). It really woke me up though and know that I'm sober enough from the latest binge I really need some help.  Can anyone tell me what the next step would be to get off Norco 10's 5-6 per day for 3 yrs? Some other message boards I checked out really terrified me and made me rethink quitting. I'll check back this evening. Thanks so much for any help given, it is really appreciated.

[Expillman]

Thanks, Susie.  I, for one, will be happy to see this month of May 2003 roll off into infinity.  I lost my wife earlier this month and now getting off of pain meds has given me DOUBLE TROUBLE.  

I'm simply NOT going to allow this to drag me down for weeks and weeks.  I've decided I'm through with it and that's that.

[snowbunny1]

Hey, hows it goin? In reference to your question and all of the comments from everyone, I would have to say that I dont think it is a good idea to trade in one drug for another, I believe that this just causes more and more problems for someone that already has or had an addiction. There are probably many side affects that will come along with your twitches but in time will get better. Its always a scary thought about coming off of any kind of drug and I believe that you will be ok. Hang in there! snowbunny1

[Susie B]

My deepest sympathy for your loss, and even bigger kudos for your brave fight at this time. Maybe there's some magic in that $50 Menterry Breeze Sun Hat!

[Chezz2]

Terter,

Yes it is VERY possible your friend who is an addict will become addicted relatively quickly taking 12 norco's a day after surgery. Just part of how our brains work. It doens't take much, nor a long time.

Snowbunny- You can not come straight off the patch without tapering down to another med and then tapering again from there. It would be a living hell to just pull the patch off and call it quits. Fentynl is VERY strong.

Regards,
Chezz

[willowgirl]

YOUR POSITIVE OUTLOOK  IS SOOO UPLIFTING.  I THINK WE GET SO CAUGHT UP IN THE BAD THAT WE FORGET THERE IS AN END SOMEWHERE IN SIGHT BUT WE DO HAVE TO SEEK IT OUT . NO OFFENSE TO ANYONE ON THIS BOARD BUT SO MANY OF THE COMMENTS ARE ABOUT HOW  NEGATIVE  THINGS ARE AND HOW HARD THIS IS, I UNDERSTAND THAT CONSIDERING WHAT WE ARE ALL GOING THROUGH. BUT TO HEAR SOMEONE TAKE A POSITIVE ATTITUDE TOWARDS RECOVERY IS ALMOST A BREATH OF FRESH AIR. I WISH , HOPE AND PRAY I CAN FEEL THE SAME SOMEDAY. I DO BELIEVE WE CAN ACHIEVE OUR GOALS.  I JUST THINK SO MANY OF US DONT KNOW HOW TO GET THERE. YOU ARE VERY INSPIRATIONAL. AND I WISH YOU ALL THE LUCK.  I HOPE YOU KEEP MOVING FORWARD AND KEEP THE DEMONS AWAY. AND AS FAR AS YOUR WORDS ABOUT THE DEVIL.  I DONT THINK I KNOW ONE ADDICT THAT HASNT DANCED OR DEALT WITH THE DEVIL, UNFORTUNATELY WE SOMETIMES DO THINGS IN OUR WEAKEST MOMENTS THAT WE REGRET. JUST REMEMBER THE DEVIL CANT GET YOU WHEN YOUR RUNNING THE OTHER WAY AND NOT SEEKING HIM OUT.  GOOD LUCK ON YOUR RECOVERY. AND KEEP UP THE POSITIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SarpyJesse]

Positive posts and people are always the BEST way towards sobriety and/or becoming free of dependence/addiction -- That's what helped me the most!

Oh and one more thing... MY EARS ARE HURTING FROM YOU'RE YELLING YOUR POST OUT ON THE BOARD!~ Just making funny with you, Willow... I understand that some keyboards cannot type the lowercase, so I'm not going to assume that you actually MEANT to yell at us..... Hehehe

Jess

[Expillman]

I am in Hour 126 of OXYCONTIN FREEDOM.  After a busy morning and a short nap I decided to visit one of my favorite drawers of my big oak desk.  One week ago this might have read the drawer where the pills are, but they are gone now.  A few days ago this would have been unthinkable, I would have looked even more ridiculous crawling around  my house in severe drug withdrawal with one of these, but I digress.  Yes, only last Tuesday or Wednesday the prospect of doing what I have done today would be enough to make me burst into tears, but I have come a long way [baby].

I lifted the lid of my trusty humidor and selected one of my tasty Punch Rare Corojo Reds and headed outside.  I was not prepared for the absolutely exquisite rebirth of my taste buds after three years of  chemical dependency had apparently ravaged my senses.  I have never enjoyed a cigar more as I set on the patio under the azure canopy of the Cosmos and contemplated my progress, time and the universe.

Not being a dualist, it is my firm conclusion that this life is the only chance we have in this universe.  Compared to the great vastness of the cosmos, the ocean of deep time, my individual existence is a blip, a bubble in the foam on the surface of a flowing river. I am a momentary arrangement of atoms and molecules - an arrangement that lives and moves, to be sure, an arrangement that thinks, laughs, appreciates beauty, dreams, and loves - but a mere arrangement nonetheless, a transient state, an ephemeral gathering. Soon the blip will go out, the bubble will pop, the arrangement will dissolve, molecular bonds released by entropy. My consciousness will cease. But the molecules that once were me will still exist. The atoms that made up my body - iron, carbon, oxygen, and nitrogen, all the heavy elements forged in the crucibles of dying stars - will remain. Liberated from their temporary homes, they will rejoin the rest of the planet, taking new shapes, finding new arrangements, becoming part of other life. I will, in a sense, become merged with everything.

I will be the momentary sparkle of sunlight on the surface of a flowing mountain stream. I will be high in the stratosphere, near that ineffable boundary where life-giving blue fades to violet and black. I will be subducted into the planet's core and join the three hundred million-year cycles of the continental plates. I will be the intense red and yellow of a tree's leaves in autumn, the flash and swoop of a dragonfly's glittering wings, the sleek white bolt of a deer's tail, the brown feathers of a soaring hawk, the silver scales of a leaping fish. I will be in each drop of rain in a storm, each wave in the ocean, each breath of a newborn child. And billions of years from now, when our sun swells and blasts the Earth's atmosphere away, I will be there, streaming away from the charred remnant of the planet into space, to rejoin the stars that gave my atoms birth. In the fullness of time, I will become distributed throughout the entire cosmos.


Isn’t life wonderful and precious?

Be well,
EXPillman

[Thomas03]

that's a very lonely picture you paint of that empty drawer. Depressing. I hate drawers that don't contain Rx bottles. 'Don't believe in em.

Thomas

[Expillman]

Well, young man, tell me what you THINK, not what you BELIEVE, that is if your neurons are not to fried from abuse.  A crack across your knuckles for having the reading comprehension of a cherry clam and tact of a churlish troll.

[cetiya]

I'm so sorry about your wife. I admire your strength, that you havent given up on your desire to be sober.
I spent the morning at the ER cos my legs, arms and face all have this reddish rash on them, and my legs, from the knees down are extrememly swollen  The ER doc said I think you are having some reaction to the Oxy's and thought I should go back on the patch until I can see my pain specialist. Screw that!  Anyway he got a hold of my doc on call, who said "no way" so I'm on prednisone.
  Has anyone ever gotten a rash or swollen face or feet during wd's??
  so it's been 6 days since I had the patch.(of course I cheated, but still, at least I'm not at my doc's office begging and crying for my Fentanyl, or saying my dog ate it.)  I hope I can work this next week, I'm very spacy on these drugs, still being electrocuted on and off during the day, paranoid and anxious.  but I don't feel so alone after reading all these posts.

[Thomas03]

Well, old man, forgive the **** out of me for not realizing that humor is not permitted here. I somehow missed that during my 3.5 years on this forum.

As for reading comprehension, I comprehended that part of your post that meant anything to me and left the rest to others.

Ya know, you’ve done a great thing in stopping the oxy. I wish you all success in staying stopped. But if you relapse, and you surely know that that is more than a distinct possibility, you’re going to need all the humor you can find to climb out of that pit. It is my experience that if you don’t make friends with your addict self, it will forever dominate your life.

Besides, yours was the first post in a long while I got a jolt from. And for us 4-month clean recovering opiate addicts, literary jolts are precious things.

Now, common, when you first opened that drawer, didn’t you feel a delicious thrill? And when you surveyed that forlorn expanse, didn’t you feel a tinge of sadness?

And before you speculate on the health of someone’s neurons, you better be damn sure of your own. As you stated in your post, you’re only 126 hours from your last oxy stupor. When you have 4 months clean time, we’ll compare neurons. How’s that, old timer?

Thomas

[Expillman]

Dear Thomas:

I may come as quite a shock to you, but not everyone who has a problem with PHYSICAL DEPENDENCE from an opiate is an addict. There is quite a difference between physical dependence and addiction, BUT the brain does not know the difference and you will suffer the agony of withdrawal.

As far as humor goes, I will applaud it only when I see it.

So far I haven't seen any from you, but nonetheless, I'll keep an eye peeled.

As far as my chance of relapse?  It is ZERO and you can take that to the bank.  If you want to cross swords with me, fine, but I lectured on pain managment for 20 years in my other lifetime and am quite knowledgable.  I am a living testament to the fact that drug dependence can happen to ANYONE and we have a serious problem managing pain without this inevitable dependence.

Good day

[Diss]

I have been off of the duragesic 50mg patch now for 3 weeks. I went off of it cold turkey which was awful. I ended up going to the emergency for help and they turned me away with nothing. I shook for over a week and still cannot get my legs to stop twitching. I have adivan and some percs but this twitching in my legs doesn't allow me to lay still to go to sleep. I haven't had more than 3-4 hours sleep in over 3 weeks. Does anyone else have the twitchy legs that keep them awake all night and if so what do you do for them? Good luck to everyone coming off the patch and PLEASE DON"T TRY AND DO IT COLD TURKEY!!!!

[motox4fun01]

Pops!
You had better sharpen your sword!!!!!
Thomas is getting FIRED UP!
Be gentle Thomas :]
   James

[Thomas03]

A thousand pardons, I didn't realize I was talking to a living testament! What's it like up there in the clouds?

Thomas

[twiceain'tnice]

Wow! You guys are at it... I have been free for three weeks and had my first real craving.  I thought I could take a couple but instead came here and read.  The craving went away immediately.  So no matter , this forum rules and still helps me every day.  What the hell was I thinking???? Time to go burn that bridge.I think I should call my pharmacist, something I have been putting off. Anybody have experience with that?  What to say?  Best of luck.  Another day opiate free!  Thanks!

[hippy]

i think it is great that you are off the oxy.
i hope your withdrawls  are not to severe.
your clever humanistic diatribe on death is
not my cup of tea, but it was very creative.
your mention of cracking someones knuckles
reminded me of my childhood and getting wacked on the
knuckels because i was left handed, the nuns did it untill
i became right handed
i can not wait to read some of your upcoming  post
if they are as interesting  as the last one.

peace!!!!!!!!!!!!!hippy

[mrmichael67]

If you want, email me at ***@****.  Maybe we could go over some options for you.  Did your doc just cut you off?  You wouldn't be the first one to go through that.  Anyway, get in touch.  I hate when I read something like what you just posted.  I have been there and it seems so futile.  But, it isn't.

[Expillman]

O.K., here goes.  What is the difference between ADDICTION and PHYSICAL DEPENCENCE?

A pain patient is physically dependent on their pain medicine to control their pain just as a diabetic is dependent on their insulin to control blood sugar.  

Addiction is psychological dependence and is defined as a compulsive drug use characterized by a continued craving for an opiond and the need to use the opiod for effects other than pain relief.  

Important- Often legitimate pain patients MIMIC addictive behaviour because of poor management of their pain, NOT because they are drug addicts.  This phenomena is known as iatrogenic pseudoaddiction and such patients understandibly try to manipulate the system in order to get ADEQUATE pain relief.

This is a tragic situation and exists because of poor knowledge of pain control and the lack of a genuine drug group to treat moderate to severe, non terminal pain, without drug physical dependency.

That's the thought for the day, folks.  Questions are welcome.


EXPillman

[Expillman]

Hey, I'm just so thrilled to be through the physical withdrawal symptoms that I could kiss a pig's ass.

[mrmichael67]

Thank you.  We just had a big debate on this issue and you are completely right.  Physical dependence is just the nature of the beast.  If anyone takes opioids for long enough, they will become dependent.  They don't differentiate.  The rate of addiction for people taking pain meds for legitimate pain is actually very, very low.  Many don't understand the difference between physical dependence and addiction.  And, pseudo addiction is a big factor for pain patients.  Who hasn't been called a drug seeker?  I know I have.  I mean, I am an addict and a pain patient.  But, just because a person is looking for percocet, the doc can't just assume they are an addict.  They could be just looking for what works.  Why would they ask for Motrin if it isn't going to work and the patient knows that?  Slowly but surely, pain management is making ground.  Like I posted earlier today, pain is one of the vitals at the hospital now.  They finally made pain an important issue instead of taking the stance that you won't die from it or something to that effect.  Thank you again.  Many people needlessly suffer because of this very issue.

[Expillman]

Thank you.  Here is a hypothetical 2-part question and I will go ahead and give my opinion.  I would be interested in yours.  

I do not consider myself an addict, but was physically dependent on Oxycodone.  Others may have differing opinions.  I am a strong person and was strongly motivated to quit cold turkey off of  a dose that ranged up to 240-300 mg per day over a period of 3 years.

  My question #1 to myself is:  If there had been oxy in the house during day 2-3 of withdrawl, would I have broken down and used it to stop the awful sensations of withdrawal?

Question #2, does tapering work?

Here is my opinion.  To question #1, the answer is an unqualified YES.  I think that the urge to end the agony would have been irrestible.  It if for this reason that I "cleaned house" before I started.  

To question #2, I would say yes in theory and no in practice.  Maybe I'm old fashioned about quitting, but I think cold turkey is the only way to go.  It is painful, but makes a clean break.  I tried to taper down and quit several times, but failed.  It was totally a MENTAL breakdown in motivation and compliance since the cold turkey option was still there.  Once you "clean house" and get rid of your pills, you are committed and there is no turning back.  

I welcome any and all opinions on this matter.

[theGolden1]

I have a painful condition called fibromyalgia and started out on vicodin 3 years ago, but my rheumatologist switched me to Ultram. It was effective and I was able to live my life pain free. After finding out that ultram was an addictive drug and very hard to get off of .... I began to taper down. I now find that this pain  condition has all but disappeared and I want to quit drugs altogether. I have been tapering since January .... very, very slowly. Two days ago I stopped the ultram and substituted vicodin. After reading this board I am terrified of getting hooked ... but I want out!! I figure I have 2 more days before addiction sets in. I'm not sure what I will do ... but I know one thing ..... I shall be released. I appreciate your perception as far as pain vs getting high. I have a few theories on the management of pain, or should I say the mismanagement of pain. I believe we are made to feel ashamed of being in pain. We are treated as though we are "weak" or something. Maybe we should try a little harder. I also believe that this is what is behind assisted suicide. The shame that people feel when they have to bear extreme pain or even be on pain medication. They don't want anyone to see them like this. Pain patients are stigmatized and looked down on. MrMichael had some very good  coments regarding pain medication. I will say one thing .... although we start out trying to wipe out the chronic pain and get a life .... an obsessive mental disorder can occur with the continued use of addictive medications. That's a given. I just don't think people should be judged for something that is not their fault. Just be aware that opiates target the brain. The brain will invent pain to get that drug. When I took vikes .... the first brain change was obsessive thoughts .... I couldn't forget about this fear I had .... that rapidly changed into cravings for the pills. I'm on guard this time ... what will you do if you ever need to use pain medication again??

[Thomas03]

I asked myself similar questions. "If oxycontins were embedded in the concrete foundation of my house, would I jackhammer them out and stuff them in my face?"

"If the Russians used hydrocodone control rods at Chernobyl, would I go snorkeling in their reactor?"

"Would I cut out my own liver and use it to distract a pit bull guarding a hospital narcotics strong box?"

Abso-fuckin-lutely!

And, does tapering work?

Sure, as long as it aint me doin it!

Seriously, I am like you in that I can't abstain when there are any narcs in the house, whether to detox or taper.

I generally advise people to do a cold turkey detox, but some people can't get the down time away from work or family to weather it. In those cases, I urge people to find a tapering partner they can trust, draw up a precise tapering schedule, and, along with their tapering partner, sign it like a performance contract. Still, easier said than done.

Thomas

[Expillman]

Good morning, Thomas!  First, I'm happy that we buried the hatchet and not into each other's skulls.  You are a worthy adversary, will you join my quest?   Oh, sorry, that's another movie that is playing in my brain.  Apologies to the Monty Python crowd, and yes, the Full Monty crowd also.  Now, on to the regularly scheduled programing.

I am in hour 136 of OXYCONTIN FREEDOM.  Reality visited me this morning as I awoke and fully expected to see Dorothy, that ankle-biting Toto and the Straw Man with the Oil Can.  All the pain I have is still here, I had shunted it into the recesses of my brain as I dealt with more pressing issues, i.e., detoxing myself from Oxycodone.

The contracts are a great idea, we did that all the time back when I was in Pain Management.  It was especially important with abusers, the ONE DOCTOR ONE PHARMACY contract, it sealed a bond of trust between the doctor and the patient.  The doctor agreed to provide adequate pain relief and the patient agreed not to doctor or pharmacy shop.  Health care professionals were instructed to keep good records of pain assessment to adequately treat the patient and to COVER THEIR ASS.

One of the big roadblocks was fear.  Fear of addiction.  Fear of regulatory agencies.  And for the patient, fear of running out of much needed medications and/or being denied or cut off.  Many, many physicans simply refused to deal with pain patients at all, a very tragic situation.  People were turned away as if they had some sort of self-inflicted leprosy.  PAIN??  UNCLEAN! UNCLEAN!  GO AWAY, GO AWAY.

This was 10 years ago, but I would imagine that not much has changed.

EXPillman

[mrmichael67]

If I had oxy in the house, I would have taken them as well.  Even if a non addict did, that is just self preservation as well all wouldn't want to feel like that.  Many people can taper, but most can't....well, most addicts can't.  If the taper is going at the proper rate, then discomfort should be at a very minimum and the non-addict would be able to handle that and not help themselves to more.  In the non-addict, they get on opioids and take them for the duration of their pain.  When the pain is over, they taper, get off, and don't look back.  They won't be craving the meds to get high because they weren't getting high in the first place.  I know when I crave, I crave that wonderful feeling I get when I am high.  That is from taking way more than needed.  The non-addict, through their therapy, were taking their meds as prescribed.  Except in the beginning, they don't feel their meds as the body quickly becomes tolerant to any side effects, except constipation.  There really isn't any feeling for them to crave.  People in pain management have been getting on and getting off of meds for quite a while now.  This has been accomplished through their docs and tapering their dose.  Just look at what caused them to realize a small number actually become addicted to their meds.  During the many studies, those patients were tapered down quite regularly.  And, it was done quite successfully.  In the addict, that is all another story.  Most addicts, that I have encountered, can't taper if their lives depended on it.  Some can.

[Nod]

Hey Hippy, how are you.  I've been away from board for awhile. You comment on the nuns and left hand made me laugh.  I remember those days well.  I've been up and down since last we talked but still not clean.  Made it one full day tho and really have cut back.  Just still haven't faced up to things yet or at least again like I did last year when went 8mos clean.  Pain sucks, but it ain't livin on the pills.  What a mess.  
Hope you are well- Nod

[willowgirl]

I am happy to see you both stop the back and forth nonsense. I watch this site every day and I find certain people to be very very helpful, insightful and inspiring.  Both of you fall into that catagory. Although I feel you both have a different outlook on things and totally different ways of expressing yourselves, you are both very inspiring.
I am personally going with the tapering and I am starting to think I am just kidding myself because eventually when the pills are really all gone for good for ever I am scared ****, but then I read expillmans posts and feel that maybe I can do it. Today is just a bad day . It is raining out and I feel very blah and I would love to just eat pills all day and watch TV. But I am not going to do that for I want to beat this and I cant control the weather and I will not use the weather as an excuse " oh its raining so I need to get higH"  I swear I wont. I am going out for the day and I am going to keep on trucking. Again both of you are so helpful. Get your **** together and you two could be a powerful force against this BS addiction we all live with. People like you two are what we all need. I know not everyone will agree with me but I find both of your posts helpful- except when it is bullshit bickering about who is stronger or who is the correct one or who knows more. Who cares??? Your both great

[hippy]

i must say over the past year and a half. when i see
the words (I'LL BE TAKING QUESTIONS) , i do find it
hard to swallow, im sure the people who have posted this
phrase mean well, but it show's thier arrogance, and arrogance
is just a mask for low self esteem.
we are all in this together, it is best to set aside  our
differences and come together as equals.
there are more then a few people here at the fourm
who are very well informed, i have learned a lot from them.
one thing addicts really have a hard time with is being contradicted, or spoken down to.
this is a fourm where we share our experence of getting
off the pills  and going through the withdrawls.
there is also the part of the fourm where there are those
that have to take pain meds for pain management.
willow i agree with you , we all need to be kind to
each other , and treat each other with respect ,
and not speak down to anyone.
we can leave our resume;s at the door.
peace!!!!!!!!!!!!!!hippy

[hippy]

yo nod , how ya been doing , it is good to here from ya,
i was thinking about you the other day.
i know your busy with work and all, but
don't give up on trying to get clean,
you have so much to offer, and a lot to lose.
keep in touch.

peace!!!!!!!!!!hippy

[Expillman]

OK, since you are the second one, maybe this is not so good an idea.  This is time consuming and I do have other things to do.  I have not intended to offend anyone, only help.

Good luck to everyone and find your peace.


EXPillman

[Chezz2]

"One of the properties of Methadone is that it has a long half-life and can accumulate in your system. You CAN'T stay on it for a long period of time safely. Make your goals incremental, but please consider the goal of becoming opiate free. Please write me if you have questions, I worked in pain management for 20 years."

This is a post to Debbie33.

You can't stay on Methadone for a long period of time safely???????????

There are people that have been on it 20 years, some more.

MrMichael would have more info on this. I just thought this misinformation should be brought to your attention so you don't continue to pass it along.

Regards,
Chezz

[mrmichael67]

I agree.  That absolutely not true.  Methadone is one of the most studied drugs ever and it has been proven to be safe over the long haul as long as it is taken responsibly and not abused.

[Chezz2]

Thanks Michael for the affirmation. You are the one that tought me that info, as well as NUMEROUS other people out there that are too many to count.
Thanks for your endless contribution to the education of medications...
You are well respected here for that...
Chezz

[Thomas03]

Hey, Ex, relax. They're just testing you. And you know you're really making an impact when you **** someone off -- always my words to live by ...

Kip and Hippee are both my good friends. They care passionately for the addict who still suffers. You couldn't find two finer gentlemen. If they stick you, stick em back. Hey, I'm Irish/German so you know I'm always game for a good dustup!

Stick with us. You have a lot to offer. You’re obviously knowledgeable and experienced, you have a disciplined mind and your prose is irritatingly precise. In any event, you can do a lot of good here.

Besides, don’t you want Kip to tell us how he knocked over all those juicy pharmacies? Inquiring minds want to know!

Thomas