Ocycontin Addiction... Day 20 help!!!!

[JohnnyDanger]

First of all, I want to thank ahead of time anyone who reads my post or replys to it.   I have been dealing with an opiate addition for over 5 years.  I run a successful local business and have kept my addiction under wraps from nearly everyone.  Being that money really isnt an issue... I would buy or pick up whatever opiates I could. And as of twenty  days ago, I retired on OC 40mg a day.  A dealer of mine found Suboxone for me and I took that up for the following 5 days  after stopping. I found that it really helped with my withdrawls BUT. During this process, I took a trip to Ireland with a friend. WHICH is part of the reason I decided to stop. The problem is that we were detained in the UK for improper paper work and  DEPORTED back to the US. Long story... anyways.... Overnight they stuck us in a international imigration prison. I didnt do well in there. Started getting panic attacks and anxiety.  Came home and followed up with my doc who perscribed me lorazepam. 3x day 1mg. Felt the axienty gone in about 10 days and stopped taking the lorazepam 4 days ago....keep in mind, during the last 15 days I havent taken OC or Subox.  I AM NOW HAVEING TERRIBLE withdrawls at night. restless arms/legs, and insomnia.  So my question is, am I having Lorazepam withdrawls or STILL withdrawls from the OC???? Im so lost. I finally broke down and took a lorazepam last night and it DID seem to help me sleep. HELP!!!!!

[Kevin_Bacon]

Wow. I just thought I'd check in for a moment, and I get your story ... quite the adventure, my friend ...

So, correct me if I got the facts wrong (Please calm down and give the details, chronologically):

1./ You stopped Oxycontin, down to 40mg, 20 days ago, but we don't know what your maximum intake was.

2./ You took ?mg Suboxone for 5 days after "jumping" from Oxy 40mg


3./ Arithmetic: You haven't taken opioids for 15 days


4./ You were in panic mode -- sounds like anyone would be, and when you got back to the U.S., you were prescribed 3mg lorazepam (Ativan), which you took for 10 days, then, 4 days ago, stopped. Arithmetic: 14 days; 10 on lorazepam, 4 on nothing. This is where the calendar gets a little confusing: All this happenened over the last 15 days? Please advise.


Did you have immediate w/ds from sub/oxy? This is where it gets really strange ...

Why did you stop the lorazepam? That's a hefy dose for a benzo-shy person (= 30mg Valium/Klonopin, but out of your system fast -- something like 10 hr half-life. You can't just stop.

What have you taken today? Do you have lorazepam? More information, please ... I'll come back over the next hour or so to try to help.

[Kevin_Bacon]

Typos in last post: should be "happened"; should be "hefty". I'm not illiterate. Honestly.

Find another one and win a, a, let's see ... a cowboy hat! A real, rootin' tootin' cowboy hat!

Thank you for your patience.

[JohnnyDanger]

yah.....that math didnt add up looked it up... lemme see from 9th to the 13th i took the formula of 1/4 of a 8mg subutex a day. that was until I couldnt feel the effects of the subutex.  then from 14th-23rd lorazepam. then the following 4 days nothing.

and  No imidiate withdrawl from OC which I took up to 60mgs a day for 2 months down to 40mgs when I stopped. Before that I messed with 30mg perks or "blues" for over a year. after recently stoppin oc and subox I was feeling pretty great for the next few days other than anxiety. Normally I would be tossing and turning for hours along with insomnia. the real problem has been the last four days or restless legs and insomnia after i stopped the loraz.

[JohnnyDanger]

I took lorazepam last night and I was hoping it would magically help the restlessness and insomnia. Layed down at 10pm restless, took 2mg loraz and fell asleep around 3am.  Slept well afterwards.  Soooooo.... are these residual withdrawl symptoms from the OC or Subutex???? Or am I fighting another evil... The Lorazepam??? aRG....

[Kevin_Bacon]

Well, that's a tough call. It kind of looks like you escaped most of the oc/sub w/d's (stranger things have happened ... but you wern't really pounding the oxy at 60mg), but stopping the lorazepam cold after 3mg for ten days was a bad choice -- if 2mg last night did the trick, I'd say stick with the lorazepam 2mg for the next few days, and then try 1.5mg (if they're not "scored" -- easily halved, you can buy a pill cutter cheap -- someone posted about Wal-Mart (or somewhere like it) selling them for < $5.00, but any pharmacy should have them for under ten bucks) four 4-5 days, then 1mg and so on ...

Have you taken any benzos before this wild adventure? Some folks build up a huge resistance really fast, and they're near the top (Xanax is #1) of the benzo addiction scale. If you explain this to the doctor who prescribed them -- that they're very helpful, but you don't want to depend on the things -- and ask for a Valium taper (the drug of choice, medically, for getting off benzos, because it's way longer-acting than the others (except Klonopin, which is about the same) and "self-tapers" due to that long half-life, I'm sure you'll get it. You're currently taking the equivalent of 20mg Valium-- considered a high dose by the medical people -- 1mg lorazepam (Ativan) = 10mg diazepam (Valium), so it should be at least a three-week taper.

How much lorazepam do you have left? If you've got a shitload of them, you could taper with them by drpping, say 0.5mg weekly, but the Valium is smooth sailing. If your doctor was okay with 3mg loazepam for anxiety (I've never met a dr. who would prescribe anything NEAR that.) I've forgotten what they look like -- the peachy-colored jobs are less than a milligram, the two's are a seductive lavender oval, the 0.5's are white ovals, I think, the four's -- if they still make them  -- are rectangular white "sticks" which can be broken into 1mg hits ... plug "pill  identifier" into a search engine, and you'll get pics of the various strengths. My memory's starting to go ...

Oh. If your doctor gave you 3mg a day, she/he will give you Valium -- just don't leave it to the last minute -- in a flash. Then you can taper away from these drugs, which are monstrously habit-forming, leading to dependendence, leading to addiction, leading to years of taking them when your in your 'jammies, leading to (probably) medically-assisted detox followed by maybe a year or two of screwed-up sleep. Did I scare ya'? It's true, but if you can taper away, a month on them shouldn't mess you up.

Looking forward to your update. Maybe we'll get the U.K. story, maybe not ... but it sounds like a good one.

[Kevin_Bacon]

Again with the typos ... disturbing ...

[Kevin_Bacon]

Thanks for that ... it's just that I'm fussy about this, and appear to be getting a bit sloppy. Occasionally, I'll use the "Spell Check" thing, and usually it's clean (but the checkers have their limitations, too, as you've probably discovered -- if it's a word, even if you missed a letter from the original word, it gets through. And it can't handle, for example, "its" vs. "it's". Hardly anyone gets it right these days -- granted, it's confusing, but "it's" can be used only as the contaction for "it is." The possessive case for this one is simply "its". Is this a grammar site? Where am I?).

Was a time when I made a living proofing stuff ... am I ... getting ... older?

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!

[JohnnyDanger]

A friend and I just made it back to the United States after being Deported from the UK 48 hours after our original flight from Seattle. We left from Seatac Airport on Wednesday 6/03/09. Catching a flight Six hours after our canceled flight to Chicago and then Dublin, Ireland. Instead our detoured flight took us straight to London where we would catch another flight to Dublin. Well... we never made it to Dublin. We were Detained, interrogated and harassed by a UK Border Agent for an unknown amount of time. Note that BOTH my friend Brandon and I have clean records and have never been in trouble with the law. Anyways...Our Passports were taken, and we were helpless in this "Holding Cell". After many hours the Border Agent told us that we were not welcome in Ireland nor England and we would be deported without delay back to Seattle. At that point we were handed a report which included the reasons why we were dinied entry. Nearly all of the reasons were false and were obviously made up by the Officer. After confronting the Officer about the accusations, I asked numerous times to speak to the Chief Border Officer that signed the report. My order was ignored and the officer said "When we go to the US... We get turned around for having one bit of paperwork out of order". Then once again we were placed back into the holding cell. The next flight to Seattle was the following day. we were then told that we would be transferred to a much nicer place overnight with a shower and bed... Much like a hotel. The link below is where we were transferred.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3084/2627739419_b2c3b6ba8e.jpg?v=0
This is a picture of Colnbrook IRC. A High Security Detention Center or as we would call a PRISON. This is where we were locked in a 12ft/6ft cell with barred windows and a 6" Solid metal door. Oh yah... I wont forget the camera in the bathroom that overlooked our shower. The next day we were escorted to our 9hr flight home to Seattle where we were given our passports as we exited the aircraft into Seatac. Relieved to be back in our homeland of the United States, the trip left us confused, upset, and ultimately violated by the way we were treated in the UK. Currently we are working with US Department of State in resolving this issue along with contesting the officers decision.
So let International Travelers Beware... It is at the Discretion of the UK Border Officer whither you are suited to enter/exit Heathrow London Airport into another country. In our case, This Officer's personal experience with the US Border Patrol had left a bad taste in her mouth making each US citizen a possible target for revenge. And if you cross this officers path on your trip like we did, A week and a half... a once in a lifetime trip... could turn into the worst 48 hours of your life.

[JohnnyDanger]

Anyways.  Thanks guys for helpin. I'm kinda pissed about my doc given me such a script.  But I'll have to deal with it.  I'll keep everyone up to date on how well I sleep tonight after 2 mgs

[JohnnyDanger]

took 2.5 mgs before I could sleep.    Feel rested.   So I need to talk to the doc about a valium taper????

[Kevin_Bacon]

How much loraz do you have? In either case, I think it's your best bet -- tell him/her you need to do it slowly -- say, three weeks -- because of all the pressures, blah blah, and the lorazepams work great, but you keep waking up.

You don't have to come up with a grand story, either -- you're on the lorazepam legitimately, and they work, but you don't want to be "hooked" on sleeping pills. Maybe you'll get 30x10mg -- then it's clear sailing.

Let us know.

[Kevin_Bacon]

Oh. Tell him you're taking 3mg lorazepam, and it's working -- don't let on that you can get by with less. Better to have a decent supply of Vs ...

[JohnnyDanger]

I can't believe I have taken this stuff for such a short time but have a problem with it.  I had an easier time off opiates!  So again.   What should I ask for??

[Kevin_Bacon]

I don't think you're addicted -- yet -- but if you haven't taken benzos before, you probably get quite a buzz on that much lorazepam ... 20 or 30 Valium (most doctors don't like to be told how many pills to prescribe, so best to leave it up to him)-- say you want to taper, which you do, and ask for a schedule to follow.

Just tell him (before you run out -- you never said how much you got; I'm assuming you were prescribed 3mg, but that seems a little high ... please confirm the details of your prescription: how much, how many to take, any repeats, how long you've been taking them, when you would've run out at the prescribed dose) you found them very effective, but you can't sleep without them, and could you switch over to a Valium taper and get off them for good.

Have you tried melatonin? You can take, say, 6mg with maybe a bit less lorazepam, and after your taper, you might find it's enough to get you to sleep.

[JohnnyDanger]

Script was 1x 1mg three times daily as needed.  Qt 30 x 1 rf.    On average I prob. Took 2.5 mg a day for that 10 days.  Got a appt with my real doc tomorrow to discuss this mess.

[Kevin_Bacon]

Good. Let us know that the appointment goes.

[JohnnyDanger]

Argggggg. Another restless night.   This time I took 3 mgs.     One thing I reallly forgot to add through this whole thing was that I have been on fluoxetine 20 mg  for the last month.  I know I know.   That's an important part of the equation.
  

[JohnnyDanger]

So the doc decide to give me 10 more 1mgs... told me to taper off...good luck.....????????????   Thats less than 5 days supply! what do I do?!  I took 2mgs last night and melatonin. WOW. that really helped. I feel rested today. Im still scared about this script though.10x isnt gonna get me off.

[JohnnyDanger]

i am so f***ed..... I only have 9 of these left. I actually had to leave at 1:30am to refill because 2mg  wasnt enough. WTF DO I DO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!    This is helpless.... I cant taper down this quick!!!! The withdrawls are worst then OXY!

[saphire1]

Don't beat yourself up.  Your actually doing well dispite of all the stress you had.  I've been slowly detoxing one med at a time for the past 7months an it sux.  i have had insomnia as well. My doctor actually gave me 30 Ativan 2mg.  I was supprised but I didnt  want an addiction to another med. I cut them in half with a pill splitter.  Then I told myself I would only use them when I absolutely had to.  my doctor also gave me ambien. so I would not build up a tolerence i would rotate benedryl 2 tabs one night,
the next night ambien, then thenext night 1 mg ativan(loraz)  With all these meds tolerance can build up.  some nights I am so tired I don"t need anything.  I go to the gym at least 5x a week and do 1 hr of cardio(Istarted out with 10min daily and increased daily to what I could tolerate).  this helps me sweat to get the toxins out of my system, decreases anxiety, and muscle spasms.