Over prescribed percocet for osteoporosis

[womanbrat]

My mother in laws doctor has prescribed that she take TWELVE percocet a day for the pain associated with osteoporosis.  She is obviously addicted to the stuff as she runs out before the time to get more.  During these times she in unconscious on the couch for litterally days.  She says she has no problem how ever anytime a family member needs pain medication she will try to get a hold of it.  She feels that since her doctor prescribes it everything is fine.  We feel the doctor is being totally unprofessional and is doing more harm than good.  Are there any suggestions for us to help her???

[Witchywoman]

It sounds to me like it may be time to tell her Dr. what is going on, if you haven't already.  From what you describe, it sure sounds like she is deep into the addiction process, but is not ready to admit it.  A good Dr. can talk with her about it, and come up with a contract to help her use the meds she needs for pain without abusing them. Sometimes people need someone else to give them their meds to prevent them overusing.

Just a few stray thoughts..I'm sorry this is happening with her, it sounds like a really difficult but oh so familiar situation.

love,

WW

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

That story is pretty intersting.  I think that Percoset is usually prescribed at 1 every 6 hours.  But the dose can be adjusted up to eight per day maximum(don't quote me on this). So if she is running out way early, she's taking more than the prescibed amount of twelve.  Plus you say she is stealing meds from family members.  She is clearly, severly addicted to these meds and must be helped now.  I would suggest detox in the hospital and a rehab program.

I have a niece that is in similar circumstances that supposedly has RSD. She's going to have a morphine pump installed shortly in lieu of all the pills she was taking.

I've had my share of Percosets and find them to be very sedating. That's bad for a person that needs to be up and going most of the time!

Good luck!

J.B.

[IrishRose]

Hi,
     What about a second opinion? Would she be open to that? Osteoporosis in itself is usually not painful unless the patient experiences compression fractures or other broken bones. The compression fractures usually occur in the spine from the vertebrae collasping on top of one another or something as simple as a sneeze or rolling over in bed can cause a fracture.
It takes a long time for a osteoporotic pt to heal and it can be hideously painful but it sounds like your mom in law is oversedated which if she is not moving around much and really out of it when she does she could be a great risk for a fall or reinjuring herself. What kind of communication do you have with her doctor? Witchywoman had some good advice about letting him/her know about the situation. Sometimes elderly people don't metabolize these medications very well and she may be able to be on another med with less sedated results, but again, the doctor needs to be consulted. If he or she is unreceptive and your mother in law is willing, try to seek out a second or even a third opinion until you can find a practioner who is a good communicator. Take care.

[katie r]

I have a cousin....she get a script for 360 percodans a month...plus she wears 2 patches on her hips. I'm not sure what the patches are....I would assume they are the ones I've heard discussed here before. Anyway, when she told me about the 12 percodans  day, I was amazed! But she said that she takes them as prescribed and usually has some left over at the end of the month. I'm not sure about the extent of her injuries...I do know that she has had several surgeries and has metal rods in her body and she can't raise her arms above her head. Like I said, I was dumfounded when she told me how much she takes but I've been around her and she is always "normal." By that I mean she doesn't act sedated or overly drugged.  So.....maybe since she has been on them for years...and does seem to take them as prescribed, she is able to handle them....but in the case of your mother in law...it seems like she must really be overdoing her dosage. If she is supposed to take 12 a day, she must be getting 360 a month...like my cousin. Do you know how early she runs out? In other words, any idea how many she may be taking in a day? Seems like someone needs to be put in charge of giving her meds to her at the prescribed times....but I have a feeling she would fight that. Being an addict myself, I know I would.
But who knows....maybe she would allow it. Keep us posted...let us know how it all turns out.
Katie

[katie r]

Hey there JB.....just a quick question. What is RSD?

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

Just a quick answer. It is reflexive something or another dystrophy.  She explained it to me but I don't remember exactly the terminology.  To me it sounded like "phantom pain". The brain sends out a signal to the affected part of the body(her knee) but does not get a return signal due to a neurological problem.  The brain keeps increasing the signal strength to the point of intractible pain. Apparently, a lot of physicians believe this condition is "all in the head". Know what I mean?

J.B.

[katie r]

Hey, JB.....Another question....hope you don't mind. :)
With your celluitis and liver problems, has anyone in the medical field mentioned that the liver problems could cause the celluitis. I think you told me once that your celluitis started when you stepped on a nail or something??? My memory sucks so if I have that wrong, feel free to slap me upside the head and correct me. :) The reason I ask is I have had problems with celluitis and also take way too much vicadin. Sometimes I  worried that I'm screwing my liver up....the last few blood tests I've had, on some of them the liver enzyemes were high and some weren't. I don't drink.....well not much...just an occasional drink like at Christmas parties and sometimes a beer while we bar-b que but for the most part, I don't drink. As far as I know I had not stepped on a nail or anything the first time my legs swelled and turned red. Gosh....I think if mine had turned a deep purple like yours did, that would have scared me to death! But I don't remember even stepping on a piece of glass  or anything when my legs swelled for the first time. My doctor was just as baffled as I was. I could have probably talked to my dog about it and got more answers than the doctor came up with. So...is it possible that the celluitis could be coming from liver problems because of the vicadin?

[MoonSista]

RSD is:
Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy Syndrome
It caused by a trauma to your arm, your leg, or where ever. It causes nerve damage which is why people that have RSD are in so much pain. There is no cure for it either, the doctor told me RSD is not well understood yet. It also can travel to other limbs, and eventually you can see how your bones change through an x-ray.
I know all of this because my mother has RSD, Hers is in her left are and now starting to travel to the right arm.

[katie r]

So it starts with a trauma to the effected area? For example, if someone falls and injures themselves, that could lead to RSD? My mother fell and broke her shoulder last year...she had a shoulder replacement surgery. Her arm has never been the same. Could something like that cause RSD? Why does it travel, I wonder? I may type it into a search engine and do some research.Sounds like a painful thing...sorry to hear your mother has to suffer with this.

[MoonSista]

Hi Katie,
You asked:
So it starts with a trauma to the effected area? For example, if someone falls and injures themselves, that could lead to RSD?

Yes, falling down and breaking your wrist, ankle, etc., could cause RSD.


My mother fell and broke her shoulder last year...she had a shoulder replacement surgery. Her arm has never been the same. Could something like that cause RSD?


I really can't say, but I would look into it. Maybe you can go with her to the doctor and ask him questions. My mom has said it causes her to have a burning pain in her arm. Her RSD started from a torn rotator (spelling?) cuff, it is in her shoulder. Her left arm is always hot, and her right arm is normal.

Why does it travel, I wonder? I may type it into a search engine and do some research.

I don't know why it travels, I did read online that if it is caught before it goes in the second or third stage it could be stopped. (Don't quote me on that) I truly hope your mom doesn't have it, it breaks my heart to hear my mom cry from the pain.
Jackie

[MoonSista]

I looked this up:
What is Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy Syndrome?
Reflex sympathetic dystrophy syndrome (RSDS) is a chronic condition characterized by severe burning pain, pathological changes in bone and skin, excessive sweating, tissue swelling, and extreme sensitivity to touch. The syndrome is a nerve disorder that occurs at the site of an injury (most often to the arms or legs). It occurs especially after injuries from high-velocity impacts such as those from bullets or shrapnel. However, it may occur without apparent injury. One visible sign of RSDS near the site of injury is warm, shiny red skin that later becomes cool and bluish.The pain that patients report is out of proportion to the severity of the injury and gets worse, rather than better, over time. Eventually the joints become stiff from disuse, and the skin, muscles, and bone atrophy. The symptoms of RSDS vary in severity and duration. The cause of RSDS is unknown. The disorder is unique in that it simultaneously affects the nerves, skin, muscles, blood vessels, and bones. RSDS can strike at any age but is more common between the ages of 40 and 60, although the number of RSDS cases among adolescents and young adults is increasing. RSDS is diagnosed primarily through observation of the symptoms. Some physicians use thermography to detect changes in body temperature that are common in RSDS. X-rays may also show changes in the bone.

You can find more info on this by typing: Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy Syndrome
on this website, go to the search.
Hope this helped,
Jackie

[MoonSista]

Oops, sorry I forgot to let mention this, I changed my nickname from
GypsyStevi
to
MoonSista

Peace to all,
Jackie

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

My niece injured her knee about eight years ago and is now completely disabled due to RSD.  She actually dropped out of med school due to it and was abandoned by her husband.  Pretty serious stuff, indeed!

To answer your other question about cellulitis, yes chronic liver disease can weaken your immune system.  My first bout with cellulitis was in 1997 after stepping on a nail that went all the way through my foot, jogging shoes and all.  I also developed osteomylitis which became quite serious.  I was out of work and on crutches for several weeks.  This was all before I was diagnosed with Hep C.

My latest bout with cellulitis was probably caused by some scratches on my legs from rose bushes.  Liver disease and diabetes compounded the problem to the point that I also developed the life threatening condition called sepsis.  

In spite of all my precautions, I now have ringworm on both legs. What a *****! It's actually a fungal infection that causes severe itching.  What's next?  Poison ivy?

Hope you are in better shape than me!

J.B.

[cindi]

Hey there,,what's new  haven't heard from you in awhile  i have not sent  any e-mail out either,,,LOL  RINGWORM   JB,,,what the heck?  on top of everything,,,well it could be worse,,,we had an outbreak Of HEADLICE at the school where i work,,,being the school nurse I get the honor of doing headchecks,,,,,,yippee    there are antifungals you can get for the ringworm,,,,does it itch real bad?  there is lotrisone or Lotrimin etc,,,the anti fungals should work for you,,,now I'm going to do some headchecks,,,,,,later all    love cin

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

Yeah, ringworm. We live out in the country and have four dogs. I probably got it from them when they rub up against me. It's in their fur according to the veteranrian here. He sold me a bottle of Tolnaftate and it works wonders!  I also get these cracks at the corners of my lips(Marty does too)that never seem to go away. This stuff got rid of it in two days.  Hell, our old vet here might just be the best doctor in the county. And he also makes house calls. Have you ever tried to bring a 1000lb. steer to the doctor's office?  Then there's Bag Balm ointment which is meant for cow's utters...it cures everything! Hell, a few days ago we were driving past his office and saw a woman coming out of the door on crutches and a cast on her leg. Makes me wonder...?

J.B.

[cindi]

yes,,animals do carry ringworm,,,,in the winter I get those annoying cracks at the corners of my moutn  (hm  very attractive)  and that stuff heals them?  i usually use Udder cream  Have you ever heard of that?  It is manufactured here in i think Salem Ohio   I'm sure it is ditributed to the surrounding states..it is for udders also...I love bag balm for dry hands,,,these Ohio winters are more than my tender skin can handle  LOL  hmmm  maybe old vet doc joes is treating people to   does he make house calls for lie the bigger animals like steers etc?   otherwise,,how have you been feeling?  have you heard anything else from anyone?  send me some mail and catch me up  love cin

[Witchywoman]

I used to get those annoying cracks at the edges of my lips, and since I've been off hydro, I haven't gotten them. A nurse where I work told me opiates can cause them, and the best way to prevent them is to take extra B vitamins and C.  I would bombard myself with b, and it would usually help.

Not sure if this is what it was from, but figured I'd throw in my two cents.

love,
WW

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

I know you are a nurse and all but I'm going to stick with my Veteranarian's opinions.  I've kind of lost faith in the medical profession lately.  I do have a high regard for nurses though.  They can usually tell you a lot more than the physician. My Mom always said "ask the nurse if you really want to know"...she's a retired RN.

All I know is that $7.00 worth of dog medicine cured my ringworm and cracked lips in about three days time!  I can only wonder what a dermatologist's treatment would have cost me.

Love ya,

J.B.

[cindi]

I have been getting those cracks forever  pre-opiates,,I did hear though that they are caued from a lck of vit B's...eh  the uder cream usually works or blistex....and BTW JB  a few hundred bucks is the going rate for a dermatologist..............love ya  cin

[Witchywoman]

Actually I'm a psychiatric Social Worker, not a nurse...but I guess the lack of b vitamins is what was causing mine.

My mother in law gave me some bag balm once as a christmass stocking stuffer, and I love it! I 've bought more each time I ran out. It works great.

And I can sympathize with the ringworm.  When my four cats were kittens they all had it..which means, me and my hubbie both had it too. Before we knew what it was, the kittens slept with us, and I um, sleep in my birthday suit, so...the ringworm got everywhere. Not a pretty picture. LOL

Antifungals worked fast, praise the Cat Goddess!

love,
WW

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

Oh, you are a psychiatric person?  Is it true that there is more than one way to skin a cat?  That saying kind of describes our fight for recovery, doesn't it?  J.B.

[MoonSista]

Hi J.B.
I was rereading these posts and replies and I just wanted to apologize to you if I sounded rude when I interrupted this thread with my RSD info. I am kind of new here and don't want to step on anyone's toes. My first post on this website (about 8 months ago) was about doctors not being educated, you replied to my post (I don't know if you remember) and said something positive.
I just wanted to thank you,
Bye for now,
Jackie,
was, GypsyStevi
Now, MoonSista

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

No problema! I don't remember that post about doctors either but I'm glad I said something positive.  Maybe it was something to do with the fact that doctors don't actually "cure" anything and simply treat the symptoms. Only we individuals can cure ourselves if we are willing to do so...something like that?

I tried to post a retraction to WW a few days ago, apologizing for my stupid post above.  It seems to have been lost or deleted. Anyway, I did not mean to hurt you in any way. I blamed it on the new pain med that I'm on now.

J.B.

[MoonSista]

Glad you were not insulted by my post, and I was not hurt by whatever you said either. In my post (about 8 months ago) I was making a comment like this:
'doctors are not educated on addiction'
I had just returned home from rehab.
Have a great day!
Jackie

[MoonSista]

Hello,
I wanted to let you know that my husband has Hep-C and had a liver transplant in 1999.
Being on the other side of Hep-C I want to learn all I could and communicate with people that have been there.
Are you on a waiting list? If so, how
long have you been waiting? My husband had his transplant at UCLA We live in California. What state are you in?
My fear is that I could catch the Hep. I get tested every year, so far I don't have it. I was told by his liver doc that I only have a 3% chance of catching it. His doc also told me that the chances of contacting
it through sex is 3%. So now my husband doesn't feel that we should use protection (condom) during sex. What are your thought on this? Am I a fool for not enforcing him to use a condom? How does your wife view this? I apologize if this is not appropriate or too personal to talk about.
Jackie:)

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

At this time I'm not on the waiting list for a liver transplant.  Because I'm am now a VA patient, I'm on a waiting list just to get all the necessary tests and treatment.  Red tape! The VA says I have to start all over again because all my records were two and three years old.

My wife isn't too concerned about getting Hep C from me. It's mainly gotten through blood transfusions and tattoos.  The only time her oncologist was concerned was when she was going through chemotherapy and her immune system was compromised. She was too run down to think about marital relations, anyway, and I shied away from it myself out of respect for her.

We did have one major scare though. Two years ago our grandson found my shaver and cut the hell out of his face trying to shave like grandpa. He's been tested every six months since that time and has come up negetive. Whew!

J.B.

[Witchywoman]

Hi JB,
I was not insulted at all by your post.  I was a little confused, not quite sure what you meant, but didn't take it personally as negative, at all.

lots of love,
WW

[RowdyLILCowGirl4Life]

RSD is also known as reflex sympathic dystrophy , this is not something that is  just in someones head . i have it  and i got it after having shoulder surgery .  i have read some of the things  yall said about this . but its kinda hard for someone to make an assumtion about something they know nothing about .  this is a very painful thing to have and deal with on a daily bases .  i do understand that some people mis use there meds . but that is not the case in alot of people .  this attacks something called the sympathic nerve system , it is uncurable .  the sympathic nerve system misfires sending out pain signals in the body .  where you have been injured , or surgery etc .  this is one of the most painful things i have ever been through in my life . and like i said it is not curable , this will be a life time of hell for me .  and 65 % of those who get rsd ends up in a wheel chair .  we have to take pain meds on a daily bases and we have no other choice  but to try and find relive somewhere .  tho i do not mis use my meds .  we do become addicted  , BUT addicted to function as normal as possible , NOT addict to so called get high .  some signs are  swelling , red shiney skin or sometimes turning blue , temp changes  hotter or sometimes colder , loss of moblity , pain , tremors , sleepless nights due to pain , stiffness , atrophy , and over sweating  .the list goes on . this is rare  but it does happen and when it does it changes your whole life . you will never be the same again . some people  can be cured if it is diag. early which is hard to do when drs dont fully understand it .  so alot of people go undiag. due to errors of drs who dont have a clue as to what to do . but the one who pays the high price is the one who has rsd .  thanks for reading this  and taking the time to try and understand what rsd is  , you can visit our web site for more information anytime  we would welcome it . for anyone out there that does have rsd  we are a support group , were here any time you need us , we are people who understand what you are going through because we are going through it also  and we are here to help with what ever we can do                                    Thanks again  Rowdy ...........           www.rsdsupport.com