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Percocet recovery.....day 2
by Hellcat, Nov 05, 2002 12:00AM
Hi all, I am a new member here. I am addicted to percocet. It has been almost 2 years since I have even been a single day without one. This is day 2 of trying to get off of them and I am desperate. I need to know how long the physical withdrawl lasts, and will I always feel like I cant be happy without one?
I am 25, I have a wonderful husband and a beatiful daughter. I dont know anyone else that is addicted to pain pills, or even knows what they are capable of. I called an addiction counselor and tried to get some help yesterday, but all she preached to me about was quitting smoking...which is not my top priority right now. Right now, I just feel like my skin is screaming and my heart and stomache is going to jump out of my throat. I would really like to talk to a recovering pain pill addict, particularly someone who has been recovering from percocet, but I would appreciate ANY responses I get. I dont want to break down and get some more, but I dont know how I will get through another day and night like yesterday. Someone talk to me and tell me that it is eventually possible to live life and feel happiness without a pill.....if it is possible at all.
-Hellcat
I am 25, I have a wonderful husband and a beatiful daughter. I dont know anyone else that is addicted to pain pills, or even knows what they are capable of. I called an addiction counselor and tried to get some help yesterday, but all she preached to me about was quitting smoking...which is not my top priority right now. Right now, I just feel like my skin is screaming and my heart and stomache is going to jump out of my throat. I would really like to talk to a recovering pain pill addict, particularly someone who has been recovering from percocet, but I would appreciate ANY responses I get. I dont want to break down and get some more, but I dont know how I will get through another day and night like yesterday. Someone talk to me and tell me that it is eventually possible to live life and feel happiness without a pill.....if it is possible at all.
-Hellcat
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Everyone here is either going thru or have just gone thru this hell you are in right now.Hang tight,take a lot of hot baths and get the recipe.Keep posting and asking questions,Good Luck!!!!
bmac
In my opinion the Thomas recipt is ok for withdrawing but a much better option is a cocktail of clonidine, darvocet, deprenly, immodium and valium at night. Obviously do not stay on the valium or davocet for more than a week. By that time you will be beyond all of the symptoms except fatigue and depression. Deprenly will help with fatigue and depression much better the tyrosine alone. All of these ingredients are available over the internet with the exception of darvocet (a critical ingredient) without a prescription.
If you are taking the percocet because it is the only thing that ever made you feel "normal" read the tread Getting through the weekend.
I am attaching a very important link that everyone here should read.
http://www.biopsychiatry.com/
Peace
-Hellcat
I've been off percocet for >2.5 months; 12-18/day for 3-4 years.
How much were you taking?
Do as bmac suggested: Thomas Recipe and tons of hot baths...
You are in the hardest physical w/d's right now, but the good news is, you will start to feel better real soon(~day 4).
Your body needs to start "firing" again, by producing it's own pain killers(ie. dopamine)...the L-Tyrosine and Vit B-6, that is a part of the recipe, will dramatically help with that.
There are lots of knowledgeable people here, that have been/or going through what you are...YOU ARE NOT ALONE.
Post more about your story and hang in there!!
Peace
It's a lit'l early here, but i read that 75 percs(5mg) would normally last only 2.5 days, but then you said usually 8 or 10+ per day normally??? Just wanting some clarification, were you doing 30/day(which obviously has significantly more tylenol) or 10ish??
I do have some legit probs for painkillers I just hada total hip replacement in may. anyhow I am all out of everything but in a better position than most I have clonidine, klonopin and about 12 valium 10 mg my question is My clonidine is 0.1mg how many do I need to take for withdrwal? I have been in detox a few times and they gave me clonidine and I even have bentyl for stomach pains but how do I take the clonidine like they do in detox places I have only 24 of them so if anyone can help me I will be forever grateful love to ya'll baddgirl
Take care,
Lizzy
Hellcat -- What you're going through sounds like me in early September. I did an extended taper, with my brother being "the keeper of the stash," an have been 100% clean since 9/30/02. Even with the taper it was a while before I felt anywhere near "normal," let alone good, but here 37 days out I feel better than I have in YEARS.
In August I would have told you that I had never felt as good as I do now, but of course that wasn't true. Likewise, I would have told you that I was sure I would never feel happy or enthusastic about life w/o my hydro -- not only was that false too, but the opposite was true and had been true for some time. The hydro (or occasional oxycodone) was sapping all my physical, mental and spiritual energy -- I was literally a walking zombie hanging on to the notion that those little pills were still making me feel the way they did way back when. In fact, I got very little boost from them anymore.
Gotta run . . . listen to the fine people in here, they know what they are talking about
CATUF
pixi
pixi
Peace
And the mother in law got out of detox today, and is at home with my wife and kids....with a very good attitude(so far so good).
Pretty soon i'll have my first quarter(as in year) under my belt; and it feels awesome.
How are you, and refresh my memory, where you're at...
Once I get over this ****- NOTHING ever AGAIN. It's not worth it. So jumpy I can't type right either. My husband thinks I'm this freaked out because of
quitting smoking. Gotta go!
Thanks!
You can do it hellcat!
bmac
b-6 100 mg 2 a day
multi vitamine
calsium -magnisum
vitamins A, C, AND E
zinc
copper
phosphorus
manganese
IMODIUM (immodium) for the runs and shits.
GOTORAIDE FOR LOST ELECTOLITES.
BANNAS FOR RESTLESS LEG
When i detoxed off percs, i had somewhere around 25 hot-tubs in the first 3 days. Hardly had energy to get out, but it really helped the "just run over with an 18 wheeler feeling".
As far as the Clonidine, i can't help you there(about amounts); but I do know my mother in law just got out of detox this morning, from cocaine, vicoden(15/day), xanax and booze, and said the Clonidine was her life saver.
Bmac: My friend, how are you?? Every day i get on here and expect an update that you're getting your knee done....wassup with the pending "cancellation"?
How has the morphine handled your pain, and what doseage did you settle with? Notice i didn't try to spell the morphine type...i never remember if it ends in the letter m or n.
Tell me whats going on brother...
(Hellcat),
I read you mentioning alcohol a couple of times. Are you on the booze too. That will definately complicate your withdrawal and will call for medical intervention for detox if you are heavy on the booze along with all that Tylenol in the opiates. Your liver will be gone soon.
Please read my response to (Tuxwan) farther up the thread about alcohol withdrawal if you drink more than a six pack of beer or pint of the hard stuff everyday or almost everyday, wine included. Alcohol withdrawal can kill you, opiate withdrawal will make you feel like you're gonna die. You can read up on (alcohol withdrawal syndrome) simply by plugging those three words into your search engine.
I wish you luck, keep posting and see an addiction doctor if you have the mix of alcohol and opiates. They should be able to get you through without too much pain and suffering. Take care,
Chatahan........wildcat
I feel your pain. I got over an addiction to Ultram myself and it was hell. I was only taking 4 then two a day for about 6 months straight. That withdrawal was worse than what I am going through now coming off of Vicoprofren or "hydro" as we call it here. I myself live a public life so i heavily rely on the internet as well. This forum is really great and has helped me through some of my cravings. But I can tell you once the withdrawal is over you are going to feel great again. I took me about a week and a half to feel almost normal again and I used Darvon to get through it as well as Vistaril.(antihistamine that helps you get through the day, not addictive)
Now to everyone about those Darvon, I agree they can help withdrawal but you must be very careful not to abuse them as well. I took only 100 mg for about 4 days, then 50mg 2 days, then 25 mg for two and then I stopped. This is just how I did it but if you are going to use this starting at 100 the tapering off is the best way to go, for this is addictive as well. The reason Darvon can help is because it is a chemical derivative of methadone and a pain reliever weaker than codiene. Now what I am talking about is propoxyphene hydrochloride, which can be confused with propoxyphene napsylate,the weaker version. I prefer Darvon Compound 65 because it has asparin and caffiene as well. I would not reccommend trying this however unles you are coming off of a heavy dose and have severe withdrawal.This method is not a traditonal detox method but it worked for me and some others, but you must taper off and start as low as possible 100- 150mg daily, and remember it's not suppose to make you feel completely normal because no matter what you are gonna have some pain that you are just gonna have to bear.Just don't take for more than a week please.
Thanks
Gia
http://www.biopsychiatry.com/
you will find a lot of info, like tapering down off the vikes.
try to get to a lower amount. when the time comes he should
take thomas's receipe , it is posted by me withen the last
thread or 2.
you take the receipe asap with lot of hot baths, the 1st
5 days are the toughest like a flu. then it starts to get easier
.
More info can be found athe international ati-aging website. They got tons of original research articles on it as well as other nutriceuticls. Their url is: http://www.antiaging-systems.com/home1.htm
I hope that helps!
love,
WW
Lizzy, It wasn't until about day thirty that I started feeling normal. After the physical withdrawal pain was over I still felt really blah and the whispers were really really bad. It will get better. I know someone asked for the Thomas recipe, and someone posted the supplement part, but I have the entire thing saved in word incase I need it. So here goes to any that need it. Good luck to all. All I can say is, it does get better.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Thomas Detox Recipe
PLEASE NOTE: I am not a doctor, simply a long-time Rx opiate junkie who has had many opportunities to develop a way to detox. This is a recipe for at-home self-detox from opiates based on my experience as well as that of many other addicts. It is not intended as professional medical advice. It is always wise to make sure none of the recipe ingredients or procedures conflict with medications you may be taking. Likewise, if you have any medical condition, disease, allergy or any other health issue, consult your doctor before using the recipe. Thanks, Thomas
This recipe is designed for cold turkey opiate detox. It assumes that you can get about 5 to 7 days away from your job or household responsibilities during which you can sleep, veg and act as miserable as you feel. Opiate WD mimics the symptoms of the common flu, so, if you need a smokescreen, hide behind a bad case of the flu.
If you can't take time off to detox, I recommend you follow a taper regimen using your drug of choice or suitable alternate -- the slower the taper, the better.
For the Recipe, You'll need:
1. Valium (or another benzodiazepine such as Klonopin, Librium, Ativan or Xanax). Of these, Valium and Klonopin are best suited for tapering since they come in tablet form. Librium is also an excellent detox benzo, but comes in capsules, making it hard to taper the dose. Ativan or Xanax should only be used if you can't get one of the others.
2. Imodium (immodium) (over the counter, any drug or grocery store).
3. L-Tyrosine (500 mg caps) from the health food store & 5http from the health store as an antidepressant/relaxant.
4. Strong wide-spectrum mineral supplement with at least 100% RDA of Zinc, Phosphorus, Copper and Magnesium.
5. Vitamin B6 caps.
6. Access to hot baths or a Jacuzzi (or hot showers if that's all that's available).
How to use the recipe:
Begin your detox with regular doses of Valium (or alternate benzo). Start with a dose high enough to produce sleep. Before you use any benzo, make sure you're aware of how often it can be safely taken. Different benzos have different dosing schedules. Taper your Valium dosage down after each day. The goal is to get through day 4, after which the worst WD symptoms will subside. You shouldn't need the Valium after day 4 or 5.
During detox, hit the hot bath or Jacuzzi as often as you need to for muscle aches. Don't underestimate the effectiveness of hot soaks. Spend the entire time, if necessary, in a hot bath. This simple method will alleviate what is for many the worst opiate WD symptom.
Use the Imodium (immodium) aggressively to stop the runs. Take as much as you need, as often as you need it. Don't take it, however, if you don't need it.
At the end of the fourth day, you should be waking up from the Valium and experiencing the beginnings of the opiate WD malaise. Upon rising (empty stomach), take the L-Tyrosine. Try 2000 mgs, and scale up or down, depending on how you feel. You can take up to 4,000 mgs. Take the L-Tyrosine with B6 to help absorption. Wait about one hour before eating breakfast. The L-Tyrosine will give you a surge of physical and mental energy that will help counteract the malaise. You may continue to take it each morning for as long as it helps. If you find it gives you the "coffee jitters," consider lowering the dosage or discontinuing it altogether. Occasionally, L-Tyrosine can cause the runs. Unlike the runs from opiate WD, however, this effect of L-Tyrosine is mild and normally does not return after the first hour. Lowering the dosage may help.
With breakfast, take the mineral supplement.
As soon as you can force yourself to, get some mild exercise such as walking, cycling, swimming, etc. This will be hard at first, but will make you feel considerably better.
PLEASE NOTE: If you have any medical complications, first check with your doctor before detoxing to verify that this regimen is safe for you.
I have been doing alot of research on opiate addiction, however I am not a doctor, only a pre-med student, but i heard about this recipe that has worked for many and I am in the process of obtaining all of the ingredients for myself. I have estimated the cost of everything to be a little under 200.00. I know this can be expensive for some but when it came to obtaining drugs we spared no expense. Well here it is, and this was formulated by a doctor who recently died at the ripe old age of 106. I will try to find the website i got this from and post it as well.
1.Vitamin B-5 500mg to 1 gram per day - vitamin B-5 is the vitamin that is needed to metabolize and breakdown substances in the brain. In other words you need enough vitamin B-5 for the brain to work optimally. According to Dr. Bob, usually vitamin B-5 in brain metabolism needs about a 1-3 ratio to other brain substances such as choline, L-phenylalanine, and others to properly effect the necessary chemical reactions in the brain. This is why Dr. Bob recommended one-half to one gram per day.
2. L-phenylalanine 250mg per day – L-phenylalanine is an essential amino acid that is a precursor to two key neurotransmitters (chemical messengers of the brain) that promote alertness: dopamine and norepinephrine. The effects of improving dopamine and norepinephrine can lead to elevated mood, aid in memory and learning, and decrease pain. It is often used in orthomolecular medicine to treat depression. Supplemental L-phenylalanine should not be taken by pregnant women or by people who suffer from anxiety attacks, diabetes, high blood pressure, phenylketonuria (PKU), or preexisting pigmented melanoma, a type of skin cancer and multiple sclerosis.
3. Tyrosine 500mg per day - tyrosine is another precursor of the neurotransmitters norepinephrine and dopamine, which regulate mood, among other things. A deficiency of norepinephrine in the brain can result in depression. It also is involved in the metabolism of L-phenylalanine. Supplements of L-tyrosine should be taken at bedtime or with a high carbohydrate meal so that it does not have to compete for absorption with other amino acids. Persons taking monoamine oxidase (MAO) inhibitors often prescribed for depression should not take any supplements containing L-tyrosine, as it may lead to a sudden and dangerous rise in blood pressure. Persons with multiple sclerosis should not use supplemental tyrosine.
4. Citicholine 250mg per day, also called CDP-Choline - citicholine is metabolized in the brain to produce the neurotransmitter acetylcholine. Acetylcholine is involved with memory, thought, sexual function and many other vital aspects of functioning. Improving acetylcholine levels is an aid in regenerating a heroin user's brain. Citicholine also has been shown to be involved in producing other neurotransmitters of the brain. Take it in conjunction with vitamin B-5 supplementation.
5. L-pyroglutamate 800-1000mg per day - enhances acetylcholine function because it boosts the metabolism of the neurons that manufacture acetylcholine. It also improves acetylcholine by increasing the number of cholinergic receptors in the brain. The cholinergic system is the primary conduit of thought and memory that mainly employs the neurotransmitter acetylcholine.
6. Acetyl-L-carnitine 1 gram per day - is an important antioxidant of the brain and is involved in many aspects of neuronal metabolism. Antioxidants neutralize free radicals and damage from heroin use to brain tissue results in the accumulation of free radicals. Heroin use also makes it vital to stimulate neuronal metabolism, the ability to produce energy for the chemical reactions necessary for the brain to work.
7. Deprenyl - is a prescription substance that is capable of protecting the important neurotransmitter dopamine. Low levels of dopamine can impair cognitive function. Inform the doctor of any other supplements you are taking in conjunction with deprenyl, since all of the substances mentioned in this protocol create synergy and make each more potent. In other words all of these substances in this protocol help each other work better and therefore the doctor will need to determine your deprenyl dose, which may be more or less the usual dose recommended.
8. Melatonin 1-3 grams at bedtime - the main antioxidant of the brain, it helps to repair and protect the brain from damage. We mentioned that heroin use leads to accumulation of free radicals from prior damage and ongoing damage. Melatonin helps to neutralize and repair this damage.
9. Hydergine Sandoz - this is a prescription substance that increases oxygen in the brain tissue. Increasing oxygen in brain tissue can greatly improve the brain of a heroin user. We mentioned that damage to the brain can lead to decreased circulation. The decreased circulation reduces the levels of oxygen that can get to brain tissue. Hydergine can improve this condition. Hydergine acts in synergy with most of the nutritional supplements in this article. You therefore need a doctor who is familiar with hydergine and will know what dose to start you off at and what dose to build you up to. Inform your doctor of the other supplements you are taking when you ask about Hydergine.
Dr. Bob's protocol, is designed to improve mood and cognition, as well as repair and protect the brain. Opiate use has created many problems in the brain. You must jump-start the brain in order to get it back to normal functioning. This will usually not happen on its own when the damage that has occurred as depleted the brain and suppressed many other of its aspects. This idea is similar to a car battery that is low and can no longer start. Once it is recharged it may be able to start the car again, but until the battery is recharged the entire automobile cannot function. The brain is electrical, and it is recharged by the neurotransmitters. If the neurotransmitters are low or depleted they need to get a jump-start. Furthermore, many cravings of addiction that are triggered by the depleted brain, may be reduced in a brain that has been improved and rejuvenated. Dr. Bob said often, "good luck and may heaven's blessing be yours."
SPECIAL NOTE: Dr. Bob suggested taking the substances in his "Brain Regeneration Protocol" at the same time, except melatonin and tyrosine. The substances become more potent when taken at the same time. Dr. Bob also suggested taking most of them before 3:00 P.M. so they would not interfere with sleep. Additionally sometimes it was not possible to do the entire protocol, often expenses being a reason. On these occasions Dr. Bob recommended starting the brain regeneration with vitamin B-5, citicholine, L-pyroglutamate, and melatonin.
I hope this will help someone out there.
Goodluck and thanks to everyones encouraging words, I love you all sincerely. By the way is anyone from Hotlanta, Thats where I am.
Hugs
Suze
Starraven: ARe you Suzanne too? Just curious...
Peace to all!
Suzie
Thanks,
itsadogslife
PS I know we're not supposed to post email addys but this is a yahoo account so I figured that was okay.
Nice to meet you, I love reading your inspiring posts to everyone.
Hugs
Suze
Nice to met ya too. Peace to your life!
Suzie
"I was wondering if anyone has had withdrawals after being completed off of pills for over 12 days?"
I went through Detox at a hospital and part of my ongoing education was about a condition called Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome or PAWS. It covers this exact feeling, as well as confusion etc.
~Kristin
http://www.interventionctr.com/paws.htm
Kuz, I think you will find some of the most caring and supportive people here that you will ever have the privilege to meet. Read, post, and participate, and you will find love and help far beyond what I ever expected.
Sundown
-Marie81
-Marie81
-Marie81
-Marie81