Planning a new withdrawal strategy - ADVICE please

[Ann2497]

I am going to try and make this as concise as possible while hitting the major points.

Background:  I was taking an average of 5 - 6 5mg Vicodins per day for the past several weeks (for shingles and a badly strained muscle).  I detoxed exactly two years ago by tapering from about the same dose down to 2.5 mgs per day and then went completely off the pills.  I have taken them off and on over the two years for very valid medical reasons (surgery, severe back strain).   No lectures on that please as I already know that I should not have taken them regardless of the pain (or I should have been more careful).

Recent detox:  Last Friday, Aug. 30 I took one 7.5 mg. pill at 10:30 am, none on Saturday, zero on Sunday, zero on Monday.  Side note on Monday, I had SEVERE anxiety.  The only other symptoms I have had were some sneezing.  Other than that, no real symptoms except mental cravings.  No other physical symptoms until Monday (day 3 or day 4?).  On Monday, I severely abused alcohol because I cannot handle anxiety (drinking about 6 shots of straight vodka).  I have anxiety issues as it is and I have been hospitalized for it twice.  We get to Tuesday and I abuse alcohol again starting at 3:00 pm.  I know that I will abuse alcohol again as soon as the anxiety kicks in today (usually around 3:00pm).  Since I know that I will be abusing alcohol until I can get thru this, I think that going cold turkey was a bad move for me.  I can't keep doing this with the drinking.  If my husband catches me, I am done.  He will kick me out as he warned me before.  I think that I should start a taper beginning at 12.5 mg a day (I picked this because I have 7.5 and 5 mg pills) and go down to 3.75 over the next 8 days or so.  I do not have anyone to hold the pills but I know I can do it because I have before.  What are your thoughts on this?  THANKS SO MUCH FOR YOUR HELP!!!

[Molytex]

I'm rooting too :o)

I had anxiety and depression before the use of tramadol and have been on antidepressants for many years with very good effect - sorry to hear that is not something that works for you..

[kyle505]

I'm here for you too. From what I've read from you thus far, you're a brave person with a strong backbone and kind heart. Great combination.
K

[ROSYouralright]

I am really rooting for you girl! If you need to talk, you know where to find me!!

[Ann2497]

Unfortunately I had the anxiety and depression before I ever took opiates.  The depression was worse than the anxiety but after taking pills, it seems my anxiety is worse.  The anxiety gets really bad during withdrawals but I won't take benzos because they are so addictive that when I stopped taking them before, I had two severe panic attacks and ended up in the ER.  I don't ever want to go thru that again and so I won't take them.  I do know something that really helps me with w/d's and the first is food, the second is Epsom baths.  I am going to try hard to stay away from the food as much as possible.  Looks like Sunday or Monday will be day 1 on nothing.  Since I took the Trams, I am going to consider whatever day I start as day 1 again.

Thanks nursegirl.  I like the 3 S's idea.  Source I have covered.  Secrets:  I have two people I can confide in.  Support:  I have that from my two very good friends, my therapist, MedHelp and a Pastor.   Thank you for your kind words and for taking the time to comment.  :)

[nursegirl6572]

People on here are taking Xanax like crazy to get thru w/d's so I didn't see how taking 3 Trams would be any different.  

I definitely wouldn't recommend that either!!  I know we usually try to caution people about using another habit forming med to combat w/d symptoms.  It can lead to even bigger problems.

I'm glad to hear you won't have access to anything more.  I don't know if anyone has told you about the 3 S's....which are crucial to being successful in recovery?  I forget which member coined the "3 S's", but it was brilliant (and I wish I could remember so I could name them!)

SOURCES...eliminate them.  When an addict has easy access to addictive drugs, especially their DOC, it makes sobriety VERY hard, as the addicted mind will speak to you.  The more roadblocks you can put up between you and the pills, the better.  Sources can be dealers, doctors, pharmacies, friends, family., etc.

SECRETS...tell them.  You don't have to shout your secret from the rooftops to the world, but it's so important to find one or two people you feel comfortable confiding in.  This adds accountability too!  If you keep your secret, it's much easier to use behind it.

SUPPORT....get it, lots of it.  You cannot have enough.  You need varying kinds of support...that can be in the form of meetings, therapy, friends/family, MedHelp, etc.  You can never have TOO much support, but you can NOT have enough.  People who are successful in recovery hardly ever do it alone.

Hope that helps!!  :0)

[Ann2497]

Thank you - I have heard horror stories about Tramadol.  Many say it is harder to kick than opiates (percs, vics, etc).  Sorry you had such a bad experience with them. They don't do much for me which is good.

[FourJays]

I don't really know about Xanax, just wanted to warn you about the tramadol.  I would hate to see anyone go through what I did with this med; wish someone would have warned me :)   Hopefully your doctor can come up with some options for handling the anxiety when you see her on Monday.  Wishing you the best of luck :))

[Ann2497]

I am not going to take the Tram tomorrow if the Doxepin works.  My doctor knows I have anxiety and she has given me the Doxepin for sleep and an anti-depressant which I do not take.  I had a bad experience taking anti-depressants a couple years ago.  I have an apt to see her on Monday morning.  

I only had 3 Tramadol pills and don't have access to any more.  The person who gave them to me lives too far for me to just go get some plus they don't do anything for me and I am not going to drive to her house to get them.  People on here are taking Xanax like crazy to get thru w/d's so I didn't see how taking 3 Trams would be any different.  

[FourJays]

Hello Ann, sorry you are having so much trouble with the anxiety.  Have you tried any natural supplements or talked to your doctor about what options there may be for you?  I read through your post and just wanted to comment on the Tramadol.  This med is VERY addictive, and unfortunately, it happens before you even realize it.  It builds tolerance very quickly and before you know it, your body becomes dependent on it.  I battled addiction to this med for 15 years and it all started with a legit script for back pain.  It is a synthetic opiate and has anti-depressant properties as well.  It is really, really tough to get off of once dependent.  If you are going to use it, please proceed with extreme caution.  I'd hate to see you work so hard to get clean and then have to deal with dependence on this med.  Hang in there....you can do this :))

[nursegirl6572]

All I'm, reading is that you continue to replace one substance with another.  You need to get off that merry go round hon!  Have you ever addressed the anxiety with a professional?  You need to address that if you haven't.  Alcohol is THE worst thing for anxiety.  It will make anxiety SO much worse in the days following.

What will it be after the trams?  Have you read the horror stories here about people trying to detox off tramadol?  AWFUL!  

You need to stop self medicating.  That's really as simply as I can say it.  You can do it!!

[Ann2497]

I have not taken any opiates since last Friday at 10:30am, I did however take half a Tramadol the last three days (got it from a friend who is prescribed them)  they do not get me high at all.  They just help with the anxiety.  These are not opiates so I don't know if this counts as being clean or not.  My friend said they are a synthetic.  I don't know how anyone would get addicted to them.  They just don't do it for me (which is a good thing).  I have one pill left and I might take 1/2 tomorrow and 1/2 on Sunday.  I haven't had the desire to drink any alcohol which is why I wanted to try the Tramadol.  My friend knows I quit opiates and that I don't want to get addicted to alcohol or Tramadol.  I can trust her not to tell anyone else.    I got a lower dose of Doxepin today (25 mg sleep med) that I thought I might take for anxiety.  I may not even need the Tramadol tomorrow.  It is worth a try as I don't want the Tramadol to count against my clean time.

[Butterfly1503]

You got this girl! Don't go back to the pills! 5 days clean.. Awesome! Try taking a little melatonin if you have some! Especially at night! Also a good walk and your favorite music= peace of mind and a great way to lose those 15lbs! You can do this.. You can!!!!!!

[Wildewoman]

Good for you!! Hang in there!!

[HappyDays2Come]

Are you still clean from the pills since last Friday? I know you were toying with the idea of going back and tapering. Just wondering what you decided to do :).

[ROSYouralright]

Just checking in on you!!!! Glad to see you still hanging in there my friend!

[Ann2497]

I had some anxiety last night when I tried to sleep so I took a Doxepin which I have for sleep that I only take as needed.  A little hyper but not bad other than that.  Thanks for asking.

[Wildewoman]

Ann ~

How are you doing??

[fightinghrd72]

  You got this, now is all the hard steps...reality...life...reality...and then sunshine somewhere will smile down on you...then SMILE, some how some way just SMILE

[HappyDays2Come]

He will come around so just remember that right now you need to focus on you and your recovery. Don't let anything else stress you out right now...going through the w/ds will be enough to handle. You can do this!

[Ann2497]

You made me laugh.   "cry about the anxiety to us"  That is what I need.  Someone to listen to me since my husband doesn't want to hear it.

[HappyDays2Come]

Remember that each time you relapse and w/d your symptoms may not be the same (or run parallel). I honestly think that since you've made it this far you should stick it out and you'll begin to see some relief. The alcohol is not going to help with the anxiety and is most likely making it worse. Heck, I couldn't even drink coffee for a month because it would make my anxiety go through the roof!! You can do this. No going back to the pills, okay? We're here for you so you can cry about the anxiety to us:). *big hugs*

[Ann2497]

Thank you Happy Days.  This is terrible but one of the biggest reasons I will be able to resist the urge to drink is because it is fattening.  I have just gained 15 pounds and I am miserable.  Some people lose weight when drinking but I am not one of them.

I just think going cold turkey was a bad move, it made the anxiety really bad.  When I tapered, I didn't have this problem.

[HappyDays2Come]

Hi Ann, I really hope you can resist the urge to drink or to go back to the pills. It's not going to be easy, especially without any support. The bar is going to be really difficult for you to resist and I really hope and pray that you can do it. If you have the strength and motivation to succeed then it's possible.