Question for Dr. Steve

[kstuebin]

Dr. Steve, I am curious about your reaction to some of the posts.  I accept that you didn't like our responses to Danielcc.  I don't agree but I can see it became very negative.  But as someone pointed out, it was a defensive posture and he was without a doubt engaging in a personal attack against a very well liked and respected member.   I also see you deleted my thread on combining codeine with valium which I admit was getting a little frivilous toward the end.  But it was a legitimate question and I got a useful answer and it turned out, the pain moderated and I didn't need to do it anyway.  But if by "tone" you're referring to the way we "glorify" our addiction, I don't get it.  I attended AA meetings several times a week for years and I heard these same kinds of stories and comments and people laughing at themselves and most were people with significant sobriety.  Joking about addiction seems to me to be part of the recovery process.  I remember back in the day,  I went to an Elton John concert.  We were all enjoying ourselves until he sang "Pretty Ballerina."  Halfway through the song, a tall thin pretty girl felt compelled by whatever chemicals were coursing through her bloodstream to go into the aisle of the auditorium and perform perfect pirouettes to everyone's delight.  Until the Rent A Cops converged on her and clubbed her to the floor. That's what this is feeling like. I would respectfully ask that you clarify to the board what it is you're objecting to.  Most boards have guidelines as to what can and can't be posted.  Maybe, that's all that's needed.

[Shea]

Dr. Steve,

I agree that maybe posting some guidelines would be of benefit. But being able to be open and honest is what helps heal us. People here have a correlation between them. We count on the directness and candidness when we ask for advise. The support we receive from our fellow addicts is what keeps us up and able to keep a positive outlook that will we find sobriety. If we relapse, it is here, on this forum that we can find others who will encourage us into making another attempt. They cheer us on and raise our spirits when we are down and feeling like failures. They inspire us with their stories. They educate us with their knowledge. When we are at our wits ends there are people here, not just people but survivors who are loving, compassionate people that help us make sense of it all. And when they don't have the answers, they don't pretend to. But they are still there in our corner, sticking by our side until the answer or possible solution comes alone.

As I have written in a post before, it is the type of persons on this forum that I wish I had in my everyday life. I wish they were my neighbors, my coworkers, my brothers and sisters.  They are so giving. Giving of their time, of their praises, of their advise. And they don't sugar coat everything, they say what needs to be said. They say what we need to hear.
To take this away Dr. Steve would serve what purpose? If you felt that some of the posts to Danielcc/Doc Dan were inappropriate then maybe you should look at the unbefitting posts that Doc Dan has initiated. Numerous Times! No one hit the "ground running" towards Danielcc when he starting posting his spiteful comments. He was asked politely to ease up, to leave, to stop attacking etc. He was even ignored. But continued until people responded and started to show they were fed up. If you read through the posts, all of them, you would see the pattern.

I don't believe anyone on this forum was looking to be malicious towards Danielcc or anyone else on this forum. Many have tried to offer help and make some peace with him. However the attempts were vain and ineffective. So does everyone on this forum have to suffer because of the obstinate and opposing ways of one, being Danielcc?

Dr. Steve, we are just looking for a little corner of the world where we can come together. Where we can share and heal and hurt and laugh and cry. All without being judge. Where we can take the advise, aid and compassion from those offering it. And in return we can hopefully facilitate the road for others who need a helping hand.  

Dr. Steve, if you and/or the board who monitors this forum where to take that away from us, what purpose would that serve? I know for certain how detrimental it would be! Read the posts here. This forum is a life line to so many.

In closing may I ask that is you were offended by anything I have said here I would hope you do not hold it against anyone else on this forum. My ID is Shea. And if you feel anything I have said here is a cause of action I would hope you take it against me by suspending my privilege to post and do not penalize this forum for my comments. I truly hope you would not desist this forum in which such charitable and benevolent people can come together and unify.

With all sincerity,

Shea

[skipper]

With all due respect...




















































thakyou

[Witchywoman]

Dr. Steve,
This forum gave me my life back.  I read it for months and months thinking I was not an addict, and after reading my story through the words of others countless times, I came out of denial and admitted I was an addict. I began to post. I was embraced and accepted and mentored by the posters here. When I was ready to stop taking my pain medication, the people here held my virtual hand while I endured the discomfort of withdrawals.  This place and the people on it are angels.

I ask you to please post guidelines for what is acceptable to post and what is not, so people can have that knowledge, rather than be surprised when posts are removed.

respectfully,
WW

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

Yep, here we go again! Every other Sunday, posts disappear.

[Thomas]

Not that either Dr Steve or "Dr" Dan is going to read this, but if I have to sound like another doctrinaire "just say no" robot and parrot the worthless **** both of these people put out, then let Dr ******* shut the forum down. He is a hypocrite and frankly, has done a **** job as the "professional moderator" of the forum.

Like them or not, my posts have always been honest. Is that what these guys can't take? Are they living in a fantasy world where every addict crawls to them in tears and says, "Tell me how to live my life. After all, you're SO wise and I'm just another dumbshit with a computer."

I say we all exchange e-mail addresses soon and then, perhaps, they can have an addiction forum consisting of Doc Dan and Doc Steve doing hi-fives in print. Good riddance to both of them.

And they call it "Med Help!" Just who have these two ever helped on this forum?

[Thomas]

by the way, as I've posted before, my e-mail address is

***@****

and if Dr. Pointless wants to ban me from posting here because of my last post, I'd consider it an honor. I take none of it back and only wish I could have told them what I really think.

Love to all my FRIENDS (just in case this is my final post),

Thomas

[kstuebin]

Thomas, you have absolutely helped me more than any doctor ever has.  I can never thank you or the other wonderful people on here enough. You're real. I put up a web page with email addresses on it: http://www.mdo.net/users/kstuebin/aemail.html.  I will add yours to it.  Maybe we can find a new home.

[cindi]

I'm not even sure why I am even posting this as you will not deem it important enough to read and delete it as well as the others,,thinking that it is just another uneducated, frivilous post...so be it...but it will make me feel better to say what I feel I need to say....I came to this forum a year ago in December, beaten and ready to curl up and die...and ready to start to find the first drug that came along to numb my pain...I was able to keep my head above water for a few reasons and this forum being one of them...through all of my pain and grief never once did anyone here suggest that I "use" to numb myself and as much as I have searched the archives and I have found maybe 2 , 3 posts from "unknown" people glorifying or trying to sell drugs and these people were never heard from again.....Have you ever had an addiction problem? If you did then you would know that the reason most of us started using was the fact that we like the way the drugs made us feel....this we cannot deny...or we would have never wound up in the position we were in.....to go back to where I was many years ago is what keeps me going now,,,,and to be able to share the experiences, strengths and the hopes of the other struggling people is what keeps this forum going,, these people including the member that Doc Dan for some reason seems to be so determined to bash is one of the main reasons that alot of us keep coming back,,his honesty, his compassion and every other asset he displays on and off this board are so genuine...as with severl other key people on this board...So both doc's  please, enlighten me,,what is meant my the Tone of the forum?  On this board,,right today I have read nothing but comments to people regarding many things and all of them are written with the best of intentions,,,and yes,,,we do get carried away at times,,,,ummmmmmmmm   it's called fun,,,something we are taught to do in recovery,,laugh, have fun, live life clean and sober not SOMBER  several months back when there was alot of trouble with threats etc. on this board,,,posting and lying, people pretending to be someone they were not the only thing that was said or done was that particular poster was banned....no threats to shut down the board...if you feel the need to shut down this forum then so be it,,,because of one man who feels that we are not doing thing the right way because they are not his way, with the attitudes of the people that consider themselves the professionals that run this board..you won't have to shut this forum down..no one will want to even be a part of it......

[Duke Roul]

Well, I havent been comeing to this board for very long,
but clearly there are a lot of interesting people who know a lot more about drugs, and addiction than I do.

After comeing here, and reading about various subjects, I have learnt alot about drugs,I have always recieved good answers from my post's and am learning much ! and as they say..."knowledge is power"


Everyone keep up the good work !!!!




- Peace Out !
   -MATT-

[skipper]

Thomas:
live every day as if it your last, post every post as the same!
my hat's off to you and many others at this cyber-place

need an angel on my shoulder!

[cindi]

Tried to get some mail to you but it kept coming back   How is the other half of you    did she get back?  Here is your angel:  /0\   and a hug to go with the angel  ((((hug))))   love cin

[katie r]

Steve.....I don't really feel like calling you dr. today. The people in the forum are alot like the US. On 9-11 terrorist's tried to knock the United States down. Instead the country is stronger than ever. The same theory applies here. You might try to knock us down, but we will stand strong. If you really moniter the forum like you say you do (instead of those generic answers you give) then you would have to be blind to not see the close knit group we have become. With the exception of danielcc who only posted that question so he could stir up trouble. Again..if you monitered the forum, you would know that also. As far as him saying that some of us "glorify drug use" that's pure manure. SOme of us are clean, some are still using and some are trying to get clean....but we all have one thing in common. The thing that brought us to this forum. Our fondness for opiates,alcohol,pot or whatever. We all realize we have an addiction.....and we may joke about it. Haven't you ever heard a group of overweight women wishing they could have a cheese cake?
Heaven forbid! They should be hung by their toes! I have an addiction to hydrocodone. I'm not proud of it and there is no one in my life I can talk to about it except for the people here.
If I didn't have my forum friends I would be in tears most of the day...that's how I spent my time before I found friends like Thomas, WW,jbear Cindi,JB, Skipper, kstuebin,milo...the list goes on and on. Too many to name. So if you want to close the forum just because danielcc knew how to push your buttons and get a reaction,you'll be turning your back on several wonderful people in order to keep one jerk happy. So, I hope you and danilecc have several warm fuzzy conversations......every 3 weeks when you decide to show up.
As for me.....forum or no forum....I still have my friends.

[skipper]

katie:
i'm proud to be listed among anyone who had made a difference to
you or anyone in this cyber-place

need ever angel on this forum
kip

[cindi]

of all the different ways i have wanted to really lay it on Dr. Steve and dan  (he has not earned the right to be called doc at all  not even an MD or DO behind his name to back him up) you have summed it up really well....straight and to the point....this forum is a group of angels,,,look at who we have here...the men,,,,,,WIZ, Thomas, JB, Skipper, and the rest..,these guys have been around the block a few good times...they are busy people with jobs and lives etc. and yet still have it in them to be here for us..not at all what you would expect from a bunch of hardcore dope feind junkies huh  DR. Steve....?  and the women here on this forum....in the middle of their hectic lives,,kids jobs, etc,,they still take the time and come here to post and be here for us to cry with, share with and even laugh with  GOD FORBID WE SHOULD LAUGH...let's face it...alot of women DO NOT GET ALONG WITH EACH OTHER>> we even have our very own little witch running around here and a wizard and skipper as well,,, LOL  this group of females is an exceptional group...it has been since I started here...no catty comments...no cat fights..it seems as though we all know each other like neighbors all know each other....we are always here for each other  and it will go on without the forum,,,,I can't let it upset me....you said it all when you said we have friends here..and that is what's important......love ya   cin

[Witchywoman]

I love you guys. Each and every one of you.

that's all i needed to say.

lots of love,
WW (Tara)

[Wizard]

WOW, how can anyone follow these posts.......I'm with WW....I LOVE all of you here and am honored to be included with all of the above "Special Angels".
For once the Wiz is speechless.........
Power & Magick 2 U ALL and Know this my friends.....No matter what happens, we shall each other ALWAYS,
Love,
Wiz

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

I'm speachless, too!  In the 18 months I've been coming here, I've never experienced what is happening now.  I love all of you as dear friends.

J.B.

[IrishRose]

I just came back from a hideous business trip and caught up on all the controversy! I have been shy and hesitant about posting in the past, but should this site be shut down I must let you all know how dear you are all to me. Last fall my life looked pretty grim. I was staying clean but my sweetie had been through hell, one surgery that failed and no answers forthcoming from the medical community. He was on a lot pain medication and clearly still miserable. We met in AA many years ago and subequently got involved in NA. Both of us had been clean for quite some time when all this pain and medical drama occured in his life. Yeah I'm truly a codependent but it tore me up to see him in so much pain and feeling alienated from people in NA due to his use of narcotics for pain management. I too felt uncomfortable there with all the well meaning ( I guess) advice given about how to deal with him and his narcotic use. Anyway, feeling miserable and alone one night, I surfed the web in an idle sort of way for addiction sites and stumbled across this one. Soon, I was reading every day, and amazed by the grace, honesty, compassion and humor I found here. This summer, he had his second surgery, ( successful so far) but the pain unfortunately is still there along with the narcotics. At this point I was talking to him ( Skipper) daily about the forum, talking about the people on it, urging him to at least log on and look! He just looked at me the way you look at people who talk about the people on "All My Children" like they are real. It was like, it's the internet babe, get a life. Well, hell, who do I have to fight for computer time now.....? Anyway I am so grateful that you all have been there.

[Beth]

I love you all, too. I include your struggles in my prayers and I celebrate your triumphs with you. Steve can say what he likes about tone and ignore the majority here- the fact is that I and many others would still be junkies were it not for the PEOPLE here at this forum...NOT the forum itself- the people here.

I would write more, but I am hard at work on our new net home, which, if I do say so myself, kicks this forum's tushie! We'll be able to keep our forum safe because (any volunteers?) a team of moderators (can we think of a better term than that? sounds sooo authoritative) will have the ability to ban trouble makers or people like Dan who do nothing but pick fights, and the forum also has several different categories- general discussion (which is where most of us will hang out most, I'm sure), withdrawal help, dealing with chronic pain, success stories, plus a few others. If Thomas is game for it I'd like for one section to be his to moderate and can be about the famous recipe and its patrons, plus all the other great advice he has to dispense. I hope to finish the programming by wednesday night...hopefully by then my ANGEL GIRL ksteubin will have a number of email addresses and we'll be able to start with a bang!
Every last one of you stand tall and proud...to quote a bubblegummy pop song I heard in college- "I get knocked down, but I get up again...you're never gonna keep ME down.."

Again, I love you guys...I am so proud to know all of you.

[SHOTSY]

I really at a loss for the right words. I've become so fond of all of you and I don't want to lose you. I like Beth's idea but what will happen to others that come  here and need you. I think Dr. Steve has just performed an act of terrorism on us. And now we're waiting for the other shoe to fall. As if we haven't had enough of that **** since 9-11-01. Just when you think it's safe.....Doc Dan....As you can see there's more than one way to skin a catfish....There's more than one way to get clean...there's more than one way to keep a family together..I know my sayings can be corny but they have a basis in truth.And I don't beleive the truth resides in you.

[Witchywoman]

Count me in..even if this forum doesn't close, I'd love to participate in one you create for us as well. I'd even be willing to help "moderate" or contribute somehow..heck, I'm a mental health professional.

My main concern though, is for those out there who read, and rely on us for help, but never post.  

So, this is a message to those of you out there who, like I used to be, are silent members. Those of you who choose not to post but take inspiration and growth from the family here.  I don't want you guys left out in the cold. If this forum doesn't close, I'll still post here as well, but...I'd like for there to be a way for our silent members to remain part of our family.

Send kstuebin your email, even if you'd rather ask for it to remain private, and not posted on the web. Or send me your email and I promise to keep it private and send you a private email telling you the url. Or something. I just don't want our silent members to loose the magickal forum we have here.

There is a lot of good done here among us, and we've got no idea how many people participate from afar.
I will tell you though, I think it is more than we imagine. The day that I posted my url, I got 250 hits on my web site! LOL The most I tend to get on an average day is 10. So clearly a lot of people read this site.

So...to those of you who never post, please know that though I don't know your names, I love you anyway, and don't want to loose you guys either.

love,
WW

[Wizard]

I was so speechless I left out a word in my parting thoughts above......What I tried to say was this: "No matter what happens, we shall FIND each other ALWAYS"..........
Power & Magick 2 US.....Peace & Light on US ALL,
Love Wiz

[cindi]

You guys know exactly how I feel,,,,I have said it loud and clear and many times....you are all the best...and we will always be together...how does that song go,,we go together like Rama lama lama ka dingity ding da ****....oopss I forgot  no fun.............you all get the hint,,,and to my Wiz,,,,you have never been speechless.. LOL ....are you ok?   LOL   each and everyone of you have touched me...deeply  and gave me back my life  literally........I love you all and we WILL meet back here tomorrow.....love cin

[Thomas]

I'm game, to be sure. Anything to get rid of Dr.Sanctimony and his pet homunculus, Dan the Hateful. Can you imagine being him? He's the kind of personality that would have gleefully helped Hitler exterminate the Jews with a total sense of self-righteousness. He is a disgrace as a drug councelor. He proves that every times he posts. To hate your fellow addicts and want to exact a sort of revenge by proxy for your own miserable life would be worthy of compassion if it weren't so clearly malevolent in intent.

I also think Dan is a truly petty human being, since his attacks on me are obviously motivated by the fact that he sees I have friends on the forum who ask me for advice and he has none. Apparently recovery doesn't include becoming an adult.

[Beth]

People will be able to read the new forums- they will just have to register in order to post. And when it's ready, I'll post the link here, so even the lurkers will find us! I am going to use the exact same content key words as this forum, that way when people search, they'll find our new forum BEFORE they find this one. And I'm sure some people will post the link to the new forum here every now and then, and some people will find it by searching the archives...they'll all find their way "home". :-)

[Thomas]

Now that's more like it! Don't beg this jerk to keep the forum open! Don't give him that power over you. Dr Steve's performance on this forum is simply disgraceful. I've never seen a so-called professional so indifferent to a responsibility he has taken on (voluntarilly, I'm sure). Just look at his answers. Look at the fact that he can't be bothered to contribute to the forum but once every three weeks. The unmitigated gaul of hanging us out to dry for three weeks, only to put in an appearance just so he can threaten us! He's no doctor. He's just a fraud with a medical degree (assuming it's real).

[Milo]

It's a cold day in hell indeed when free speech among people who care for and help each other is held over our heads as a threat to close this forum down. I care about you all and don't want to lose touch. So just in case the "tone" here is ever deemed too unacceptable, please make a note of my address: ***@****
and feel free to use it! God bless each one of you who has helped me and so many others with your caring, compassion, and HONESTY! -- Sincerely, Milo

[Thomas]

What do you want to bet that this thread gets deleted quite soon? It will be interesting to watch what happens.

[Milo]

Hi, I tried going to your website but couldn't get to it. Could you please send me the address or your e-mail address? Anyway, please feel free to post my address on your site:
***@****
You and so many others here have meant so much to me over the past year(s)...even the thought of losing contact is -- well, unthinkable. -- Thanks, my friend -- Milo

[katie r]

Beth.....Anything I can do to help....please let me. My email is posted on kstuebin's site and plus I emailed you today....did you get it? I think you are an angel for doing this. I would just curl up and die if I didn't have a chance to talk to my forum friends. So if you need help...let me know.
WW???Did you get my emails? Have you checked your email in the last few days? I'd like to talk to you about the evaluation thing that is done before the surgery.......and about...well....how honest do I have to be...ahem... :) You know....what I mean. Email me when you get the chance. Oh...and those hits on your site....one was my ex hubby....his eyes just about popped out. :) I'll tell you about that in an email.
Cindi and I exhanged pics.....it's so neat to put a face with the name! Glad to see you posting again...I've missed you!

[jule1]

Hello my friends!!   I have had a terrible day I have been beating myself up all day because I have had some setbacks in my recovery and I am so mad at myself and just hating myself right now.  I do not know what I would do without you all. It is the most comforting thing to know how much I can count on you all to make me feel better.  Every time I see someone mention my name I smile.  You all mean so much to me I was at such a low point when I came here and I truly love you all just for listening, understanding and not judging me ok the tears are rolling down my face.  (could be a little pms too)  I have told people in my life very personal things only to have them betray me by telling others.  When I told you all about my date rape and pregnancy and giving my baby up for adoption it was the only time in my life I had told people and knew I would not be judged or betrayed.  Even if you were people in my physical day to day life I would trust you all with so much of my heart and my feelings!!! OK I can't keep crying its definetely the PMS You are all my cyber angels and I love you dearly!!!

[jule1]

I just wrote you a long e-mai and attached picture I tried the address you gave me and is said it was and unknown address so will you write me again with your address so I can send this damn thing ha ha!!!  OK you're the best you always make me laugh and smile  I better go to be I am cranky and full of PMS  I went to the store today to get parmesan cheese and walked out with 4 boxes of ice cream bars 2 bags of mint milanos and some sort of drakes cake I have no idea why I bought that OK really I am going to bed GOODNIGHT!!!

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

For what it's worth, Med Help says that there are 200 lurkers for everyone that posts here.  That's a hell of a lot of people!  Beth's new website should be a big hit.  J.B.

[kstuebin]

Beth, I'm posting the addresses as they come in.  Here is the url: http://www.mdo.net/users/kstuebin/aemail.html.  I can't wait for your new forum and a room for Thomas to moderate would be wonderful!  He's the real guru of this board.  I am still laughing over his last post...dr. dan as Hitler's Youth. I've only gotten one lurker's response so far.  Lurkers: email me or someone your address so we can contact you.  I can post it or not, just let me know your preference. There's 200 of you out there apparently.  Jbear, I used to have terrible PMS. If I wasn't crying, I was ripping someone's eyeballs out (in my head). I bloated, I ate, I ranted and raved. I did have a clean house then though because I had all this hyper energy. I can sympathize compeletely. Menopause is actually an improvement, believe it or not and it's no picnic.
Everyone, you've helped me so much I can never thank you enough. Two days now (knock on wood). Because of this board and because of honest people like Thomas and despite all the Dr. Dans out there trying to bring me down.

[Shea]

jbear....

All that ice cream and cookies and you didn't invite me. **** that is the good part of depression, the sweet treats that you consume even if you wash it down with guilt. STOP being so hard on yourself. Setbacks...I believe come with the territory. You and everyone else. Please don't be too hard on yourself. Concentrate on the strength you have shown with the effort and will power you have put forth so far. Focus on how you have touched peoples lives on this forum, and know how well respected and loved you are here. I see it in so many posts.

I hope today you are feeling a little better and more positive. Please post and let us know.

May you find peace

Shea

[jule1]

Beth - I am a stay at home mom and am able to get on the computer for quite awhile when Cole takes his nap so if I can give of my time I would love to.  

Hi everyone - Wow I can't believe how I was feeling last night I actually took ring dings into bed with me in cse I wanted them in the night - What the hell is up with that?  I have been taking vicoprofen after my little car accident last week and I never want to eat when I take them just sugary **** food.  OK off to mommy and me Lots of love to you all Julie

[littleguy]

I just wanted to let you know that I replied to you in the thread that got deleted.  Thanks for asking about me.... I'm still here.... hanging in / on / around :)

littleguy

[cindi]

Jbear..when I get PMS and depressed I will eat anything sugary...I have been known to even dip into the brown sugar for various things..And littleguy,,you have been kinda quiet...would love to hear from you    love to all  cin

[jennyfla]

I seem to be going into withdrawals quicker and quicker lately.  I try to stay at the same dose, but it is latest less and less time, and i hardly feel the same dose anymore!  This is adding to my already high anxiety level.  I can't take more because i'll run out too soon.  It's bad enough that my husband can't control himself, leaving him short about 7-days this time around.  Next week's gonna be a real 'fun' week let me tell you!!!  He already begs me constantly for more more more than his regular dose.  Even at his regular dose, he's gonna run out this time.  I'm sitting here in withdrawal already, but have to make it til 5 pm tonight.  This sucks!!!!
The part that hurts the worse is waking up in the morning.  I just wake up so out of it and in withdrawal.  I used to look at the day upon waking in such a different way.  I can't even enjoy my kids to the fullest anymore.
Plus, my husband is so very very very miserable at his job, he absoluately HATES it with a passion.  Plus, it is very very hard on him physically.  We have about 5 resumes out there floating around right now.  He had one call yesterday and needs to meet with the guy, but it's still not management, and that's where he wants to be now.  We have one resume out there to a service manager open position, but haven't heard yet.  Sent the resume out monday.  Please please please call!!!!
About me, I just don't see myself changing.  I don't see an easy way out (because there isn't one of course), but i don't want to live like this for the rest of my life (which will be shorted because of all this abuse).  I want to live for a long long time to see my children grow up, and all of life's accomplishments for them.  My oldest daughter looks at me sometimes and cries and says she never wants me to die.  It tears me up because i know i need to take better care of myself, i don't want to die either.
Sigh, too much on my mind!  :(
Lv Jenny

[cindi]

Jen,   God I feel for you,,,,I don't even know what to say to you...I have no words of wisdom,  but I am here to listen sometimes that helps even more...if you need to call me I'm here,,,I do know what you mean about your daughter,,mine tells me that all the time,,,,it is on her mind alot since my mom died,,,reality has hit her....i just try to comfort her and tell her I'll be here for her no matter what....she is afraid of teh war,, the anthrax everything,,,,and there is no shielding her from that sometimes as hard as I try she hears the news,,she is almost 8 and can read the newspaper now,,,she is past dr. seuss...oh the joys of motherhood, wifehood and life huh?  hang in there and have a safe halloween    love cin

[IrishRose]

Hi jenny,
     Jeez, as usual I have no words of wisdom, but after reading your post, ( I always read your posts) my heart goes out to you dear. You remind me a great deal of myself in some ways. As I said no words of wisdom, but I am chock full of sappy sayings, one of which is every failure is half of a success. No idea who said that, Eleanor Roosevelt or JFK probably someone like that but it's true! I know what it is like to be in financial terror and to struggle with trying to clean up. I'm sitting here tonight at the computer because I can see my front door from here, I'm waiting for some trick or treaters, so far not a single kid. I'll have to eat all this chocolate myself. I am also praying for my son, who is 23 that he will come home safe and sound after whatever party he will no doubt stay out all night at. He was my primary reason for cleaning up. I had a hell of a time, I was working in a hospital pharmacy of all places when I decided to. Well, it was kind of decided for me actually. But I knew if I went to prison or died, he possibly could have been sent to be raised by his father. I left his dad when he was 18 months old when I could no longer stand being around the drugs, alcohol and guns. It was mostly the guns that did it as obviously I continued to use on my own when I was outta there. Everyone kept telling me that staying clean wouldn't mean a thing and that it wouldn't work if I didn't do it for myself. I beg to differ,it did come in time. I couldn't do it for myself to begin with. I felt so unworthy and incredibly blessed at the same time to be the mom of this boy. His father died six years ago as a direct result of his using, T. was 16 at the time so my worst fear did not come true but it was still awful for him to lose his dad that way.  Whoever you do it for Jenny, your darlings or yourself, keep trying. I admire your tenacity for keeping at it and sharing your life, the good, the bad, the messy with us. Hang in there. IR.

[cindi]

Wow,, That post is worth gold....you certainly have a way with words..and everything you said is so true,,,,i eventuaally was looking at prison or being with my daughter,,,now i have 2 babies...prison didn't appeal to me......gotta run   late for work again   talk to ya later.......love cin

[Danielincc]

A bit of information by Dan the hateful...  Jenny, please consider an option to your life at this time. I am refering to opiate agonist therapy. Consider it if not for your self but for your children. This therapy is a recovery program that stops withdrawals and cravings and gives you your life back. This option is the use of methadone to treat you addiction and pain issues. Methadone is better for chronic pain and does not wreak havoc to your receptors the way short acting opiates do. A good pain/addiction specialist can offer methadone as an aternative. But many obtain their life saving medicine through their local methadone clinic. Just a thought because I can relate to the life you are living. Best of Luck.. Dan

[skipper]

dannyboy:
i think it's great to see how far along you have come, with the
use of the most addictive opiate methadone. but come on, your not
advocateing the use of methadone by everyone.

keep an angle on your shoulder
kip

[jennyfla]

The only way i could get methadone would be to buy it on the street, or drive 90 miles roundtrip each morning and pay $10 a day to do it.
This isn't an option.  I know a lot about methadone, and it has it's pluses and it's minuses.
Just need to find another way.

[jennyfla]

Thank you both of you from the bottom of by broken little heart!!!
Your posts really cheered me up this morning, and I really do appreciate having you both, plus so many others on my side; i never feel so alone anymore.  You all are such treasures!!!!
:)
Lv Jenny

[littleguy]

I am getting a little braver each day.  All of this interaction can be overwhelming for a little guy :)  So I am taking baby steps.

[Frank Lee]

Sorry for being late guys, I've been out of the loop. Thanks to Shotsy who sent me the post by Dr. Steve on Sunday, October 28, 2001 to Danny Boy - to wit "You are absolutely right. If the tone of this forum doesn't change, we may have to close it down."

I don't think you can come closer to a threat. While this forum helps many, Dr. Steve's deletions and brief, obiviously not labor intensive peals of wisdom clearly have a diferent objective than many of us who come here willing to call an idiot an idiot ( Danny Boy ) and to explore addictions honestly. This objective will not be commensurate with Dr. Steve's philosophy.

My suggestion is that one or a group of us consider an alternate forum. There are many ways to do this. One is to start a group on the following web site which boasts thousands of free sites:

http://www.ezboard.com/create_express.html

The problem would be one of management - you would eventually need to develop a member's site and an open site and moderators ( believe me I know, have done it and am too busy and burned out to do so again, at least at this time). However, the point being is there are alternatives and this format is far more user friendly and conducive to the kind of discusions many of us desire, IMHO.  

Perhaps one of our fellow substance abusers/ recoverers who is open to a frank discussion of these matters as well as the ability to ban a negative intruder like Danny boy - (the EZ board can do this)would be willing to start up such an endeavor.

In the meantime, I've never taken well to threats, Doc.- your board or not. Anyone who wants to contact me can do so at any time at memphisblue64@hotmail.

Regards to all my board pals,

Frankie Lee

[Thomas]

I wholeheartedly agree with Frank's proposal for another site. I'd be happy to participate. I'm so disgusted with Steve (I refuse to call him "Dr") plus the frequent deletion of posts (which the admins are obviously lying to us about), that I've decided to limit my participation on this forum to occassionally posting my personal e-mail address for anyone who wants to talk to me. The lying, the threats made by a disgace to the medical profession ... are all simply too much for me.

***@****

PS. Doc Dan, you win. Spew your hate on the forum all you want. My honest opinion of you is that you are a pathetic, sub-human piece of **** and I never want to see your posts or be reminded of your existence again. Burn in hell, *******. And have fun talking to yourself.

Thomas

[Danielincc]

I will not respond to YOUR absolute poor attempts at insulting me! You serve a purpose! But lose your petty attempts at discrediting me and Dr. Steves worthwhile advice to addicts who need help. Like I said before. You are about one failed attempt at staying clean after another. You continue drug abuse . That is proof that you are a chronic relapser who cares nothing of working a legit program. I have been at this sight as long as   you! I know your poor excuses for succeeding. But you have a right to your addiction. But your insanity will one day harm you or someone very close to you. That is unacceptable!
Be Careful,
Dan..

[Beth]

Slander and Harassment? Come on, Dan. They don't give methadone in the county jail, pal. Your jealousy of Thomas is a teensy bit out of control, don't you think?

[katie r]

You have a hell of alot of nerve. I am stunned at your stupid comments. First of all YOU said "I will not respond to YOUR absolute poor attempts at insulting me"! So what is this if it isn't a response?DUH. As far as discrediting you...you did that to yourself. I too, am one failed attempt after another at trying to stay clean. Why don't you post an insult aimed at me? I'll tell you why. You are soooo very jealous of our respect for Thomas. You make it so obvious! As far as insanity......I think you are the one that is insane. Who else would show up on a board where no one wants him around? All you do is show up in here and make a big donkey out of yourself. I don't know why you post...we don't want your advice, or your input or your insults to Thomas. Is it that hard for you to understand when you are not wanted?
One more thing....you said, and I quote "But lose your petty attempts at discrediting me and Dr. Steves worthwhile advice to addicts who need help." What worthwile advice would that be?? Did I miss it? Dr Steve gives the same canned answer to everyone....and your advice is even more worthless. I don't think much of Dr steve..but I find it amusing that you put yourself in the same catagory as him. Daniel...you are a NOBODY.
So why don't YOU lose your petty attempts at trying to make the people in this forum feel like we're something that should be wiped off the bottom of a shoe...and that you are a walking mircle. Because the truth is.....we are a close knit group of caring people and we keep trying to wipe you off the bottom of our shoe and you won't go away. I've dealt with addiction for years and years....I haven't even tried to get clean yet. I'm not "glorifying"that...just stating the truth. So why don't you respond to me......throw an insult my way. You always aim them to Thomas...that says alot about your mental facilities. Jealously can be a bad thing...perhaps there is a forum somewhere out there where you can go so you can get a grip on the jealous feelings you have toward the respect we have for Thomas. I don't think you give a rat's ass about helping us..you just come here to put down Thomas. Frankly....I'm sick of it. I'd like to see you respond to MY post. So come on Danny Boy....throw some of that so called "worthwhile advice" my way.
And if the only thing you can come up with is methadone....don't bother. Isn't that what you are addicted to now?????

[katie r]

About your last comment "That is unacceptable"!  Who are you to judge what is acceptable or unacceptable in Thomas's life or anyone else's for that matter?
You may succeed at getting this forum shut down....that's fine. You should be so proud that your ignorance is going to take away a place that so many people turn to for help...and by help I mean from each other. We already know dr steve's answer "see an addiction specialist in your area."  We rely on each other here in this forum. So if you get it shut down...give yourself a big pat on the back.....but you won't keep us down...the rest of us will stick together.We support each other....we don't judge or criticize. It's to bad that is the only way you know how to interact with people.

[kstuebin]

Hasn't anyone every told you the only person you can change is yourself?  And you ain't changing.  Get a freaking life.  Preferably away from here.

[kstuebin]

I agree it's time to move. I checked out the site you mentioned and I would be willing to take it on but Ruth has said she's developing a site.  Does anyone know where she is re this project? There's no need for two forums. I would need lots of help...read input...from members as I'm not going to do this unless it's done right and is the way everyone wants it. Do we want rules? And moderators...Thomas???  Witchywoman??? Let's do it guys.  I got lots of energy right now thanks to WD and we don't need this sh*t.

[cindi]

I don't know how to begin to set up a forum but I am a moderator on another board...but I have only been mod for a few months...They asked me,,I had not been there from the beginning  I would be willing to help just tell me what to do,,,I woul also be willing to moderate ...it takes alot to start a new board and the guy that owns the other board I go to has put tons of time and energy in the board and he does check out the peole that sign up for the forum...anyone,,let me know and I'm here...as for the reason,,,,well,,,,I was going to try and stick it out but after reading that last comment from Daniel to Thomas,,,my blood is boiling at a level right now that If I say anything I may be kicked off AOL...It's called an Italian temper....and Thomas is my friend..a very dear friend at that...for so long I have tried to be tactful on this board...I fear that now I will make myself look like a bigger ass than Dan...I am off to the docs for a recheck on my pneumonia  I need some time to think ..anger doesn't really say it all right now,,,all I know is it's time..............Love to all  cin

[skipper]

danny boy:
congreatulations, you've manage to turn up the heat and and alienate your self from the very people that could help you to love and accept yourself. not me. i will love and care about you and there is not one dam thing you can do about it. so go ahead and turn up the heat....get it out of your system...maybe then you will be able to walk hand in hand with the rest of us, despite our differences.

keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[kstuebin]

Check it out, join and post:  http://pub37.ezboard.com/bthenewaddictionmedicineforum

Feel free to offer suggestions as to changes. You won't hurt my feelings.

If it's a go, I'll pay the $5 to get rid of those annoying popups.

[ssfr]

hello everyone- i joined the new site that several members of this forum have started-  i think we owe them our thanks for all the work and effort they have put into this- the site has a nice look and feel to it.  the only reservation i have are expressed below- this is a copy of a posting i just entered there:

i think the new site looks fine and no doubt will offer  a viable alternative to some other addiction sites- it will take a little time to build it up of course- but assuming that much of the "family" follows here- then oldtimers and newcomers alike will be able to find support and much needed information- i for one would like to thank you for the work and effort you are putting in this- i posted occasionally at the other addiction web site- (i refuse to use the word "lurking", as it has negative connotations) by in part i have only been a part time contributor is due to lack of access to a computer full time- that problem has now been solved- but i should say that i have been ghosting off and on for over the last year- and have grown quite fond of many participants- both past and present- my only suggestion and request at this point in time is to NOT ban anyone at the inception of this new site- sure there have been those that we have found annoying- or hurtful-  but i for one will not feel comfortable banning someone because i did not like what they say- we all cannot nor will ever agree with each other 100% of the time- nor should we- diversity is of paramount importance- otherwise we will end up with the same type of canned reponses we learned to expect from dr steve-
now that being said- later, if members use inappropriate language, excessive profanity- of course there should be rules that need to be followed and banning may become appropriate- for gosh sakes- lets give everyone a chance to express themselves.

in the above posting, please understand i have no desire to alienate anyone- this is just my honest opinion-  i intend to continue to learn from everyone who has helped me so much in the past- i also intend to return to this site from time to time- in hopes of learning something new.
vic

[pjsbabygirl]

Please help!!!!!!!! My husband is down to 1mg xanax........in one week he might have to take a drug test for custody issues........these are prescribed to him but his dad will literally disown us and kick us out of our home and foreclose on us.............i need to know how long it takes for xanax not to show up on a drug test and any information about this..........is there anything we can do to help this or cover it up or whatever!!!!!!!! please respond quickly...............

[ssfr]

first let me suggest that when you wish to post- especially when you are in need of a more quickly response- let me suggest posting much much   more closely to the top of the page- unfortuntaly, posts towards towards the bottom tend to get lost and thus overlooked-  honestly, i would bet that probably  at least 50%, if not not of the bottom post never ever get seen. since audience attentiton span tend to be geared toward the first few posts on a page
secondly- experience tells me that you are likelly to get a relatively rapid response to questions you might have from another another web site- that is   "http://pub37.ez.board.com/bthenewaddictionmedicineforum
this site is replete with many invaluably medical source like practicing nurses, theraphists, and  scads of  docs of life- who have been there and done that- in addition to med help- i would honestly recommend taking a look at it.
if i had the knowlege about your question xanax specifically- i would be more than glad to help- but that is not something i know too much about- but i guarantee there are several folks there who are very   knowlegebale about xanax who will be more than happy to answer any quesions you have- you will need to register first- no  biggee tough-
good luck!!