Tough decision ... need opinions

[mellie4]

I've wrote about this a few times in the past but I'm facing it again.  My boyfriend (or ex at the moment) has called me and asked me for some oxycodone.  I take it for pain management and am not an addict.  He has a very serious neck condition that they want him to have surgery on and he's afraid.  For the past 3 months he has run out of his prescription early.  He's prescribed 10 mg. Percocet 3 x a day.  I am not sure if he's an addict or if he is being undertreated for his pain.  I know he's truthful about his injury as I go to every appointment with him and even go into the exam room and meet with the doctor and I talk with the doctor as well.  (This happened as most recently as last week.)

He's afraid to have the surgery but he also doesn't want an increase in his medication, even though he's gone through withdrawals the last 3 months.  I don't know how he can go through this again and again.  THe first time I did give him some to hold him over as it was just a few days.  Last month I brought him to my house and took care of him, though I did not give him oxycodone.  I did give him some vitamins, Ativan and Clonidine I had to help with the withdrawals and made sure he was drinking plenty of fluids and ate a bit.

I am so torn.  I saw what he was like in withdrawals the last time, and I've experienced the start of withdrawals myself when my prescription came a couple of days late in the mail.

I know I shouldn't give anyone any medication.  But I also know somewhat what he's going through and have learned more from being on this forum.  I do love him and want what's best for him, but I just don't know.  If I don't give him any, I know he won't be able to work through the w/d and he's already missed a lot of work due to his injury.  On the other hand, I don't want to run out  myself, and he has about 10 days to go until his next prescription.  On top of that, I feel like he's either addicted or I don't know what.  I know if my pain wasn't being covered appropriately, I would talk to my doctor about it.  I certainly wouldn't go through withdrawals three times in three months.

What would you do as someone that cares for someone?  What do you think I should do from the perspective of a recovering addict?  I do know that he will get his prescription filled when he can.

Thanks for any suggestions or comments.

[mellie4]

Vicki, and maybe that other thing you mentioned along with the chocolate :)  (I'll go with the tonic water.  I think I have it here anyway.  My dad uses it for leg cramps and it works great.)

Thanks.

[vicki595]

If I had to choose:  Nyquil and Hylands Restfull Legs for the RLS. However,tonic water has quinine in it,also,and it's a lot cheaper. So,tonic water (not club soda) with a lemon
slice.  And some chocolate.  :)

V. xo

[mellie4]

Well, I'm leaving for his house in about an hour.  I'm bringing things that will help him feel better and some food and drinks but NO PERCOCET.  It's up to him if he wants to call the doctor.  I'll spend time with him and talk and watch movies and keep him company, but I am not going to give him any narcotics.  He has to get off this crazy train and decide if he wants to up his pain meds legitimately or get off them entirely and look into other treatments for his neck.

I have a few things here that will help and I'll pick up some things, like NyQuil.  I asked him if he wanted to do the protocol or the Thomas recipe and he doesn't believe it will help.  I don't want to waste my money buying everything on the list, but what do you think are THE MOST HELPFUL out of everything??  He has ALL the symptoms right now, restless legs, vomiting, diarrhea, trouble breathing due to anxiety, shaking, muscle aches, and more.  My finances are tight; so if he's not going to commit to it, I won't buy everything, but I'd like to bring anything that really is useful.  So, guys, what do you suggest??  What worked best for you?

[mellie4]

Oh, I wouldn't ignore his calls.  Only if he starts getting relentless about it after I tell him no.  I have told him (as late as last week) that I thought he was teetering on the edge of addiction if he wasn't already there, and I told him I was worried about him.  He didn't like what I said at all.  But I will always be supportive of him; I just won't allow him to wreak havoc in my life.  If he wants, I'll do whatever I can to help.  I'll pick up the stuff for the Thomas recipe.  I'll sit with him and watch movies while he detoxes, whatever.

Vicki, I wish I read your comment earlier and I would have called him.  Though our doctor leaves every day at 3:30 and is off Wednesdays.  But he can always see her tomorrow.  (I know she won't increase his dose without seeing him; unless she has already seen the report from the neurosurgeon he saw last week.  Since the neurosurgeon did say his condition has worsened, she may do it over the phone.  She's a doctor who isn't afraid to write pain med scripts if you need it, but she's not careless and she's aware of addiction.)  But I imagine by now he's feeling pretty miserable.  But I would drive him to see her tomorrow if he needs to see her.  I haven't heard from him yet, which means he's made it through work.  (He's not allowed to use his cellphone on the job.)

Laurel, to tell the truth, if it was me, I don't know if I'd have the surgery.  I've looked into it.  Improvement chances aren't great.  But I would be more forthcoming with my doctor and I would be at a pain clinic, and I'd look at alternative medicine as well.  He's not open to any of that.  He went to one pain clinic a year ago and hated it.  But they're not all good.   The one I go to is fantastic.

Thanks, everyone, for all the support and comments.  It really made a difference and helped a lot.

[laurel453]

mellie, i really wouldn't think that not taking his calls is the way to do it. He doesn't need you enabling him, sure, but he still needs you. As you say, he is drepressed and heading to disaster and into full blown addiction. He needs someone to face him and tell him the truth and then luckily you could help him if he takes the right steps....

[Dav125]

This is very similar to the same game I was playing. Yeah, sure, there's a legit medical reason in this but if I had been aware of what was in store for me now,,meaning wd's,,I would have had the surgery done 2 years ago. Now, I get to fight the battle after the surgery.

Wish I knew then what I know now. It would have saved me from the bunch of nonsense I find myself now :) I call it nonsense because it was truely avoidable looking back..

[vicki595]

Mellie~  This IS easy.  Pre empt his phone calls and call him first!!   Don't sit there fretting about his pain etc...It's 4:30 there. He has time to call his doctor who will happily give him meds. Tell him to do it,please.

xo

[dominosarah]

Yes this is always easier said than done and it blows to be in this situation.  So many things going against him and i am sure his mothers passing is at the root of it, then add all the pain and it just wears you down.  Hopefully he will do something about it and get to feeling better........sara

[mellie4]

Right, sara.  That's always easier said than done.  Luckily my cell phone is totally dead.  Needs a new charger and I haven't gone to get it.  The house phone ringer is in another part of the house that I can't hear it.  So, even if he starts relentlessly calling, it won't disturb anyone.  I just feel bad thinking of him in all that pain ... and not just the withdrawal pain.  Obviously his depression is getting the better of him.  

[dominosarah]

Good for you!!  Now keep standing your ground........sara

[mellie4]

Right.  It's escalating.  The first month he was out it was just a few days.  Last month it was about a week.  I am an enabler; I have been in the past.  It's something I'm working on and it's why I asked the question here.

I really don't know if he's an addict, though if he's not, he's well on his way.  He's going to have to do this himself.  Either he calls the doctor (who I know and is absolutely wonderful) or he goes c/t and when he can get the refill makes the decision on whether to refill it or not.  And he needs help for the depression.  I know what it's like to lose your mom (lost mine 4 years ago.)  You do get depressed and it can last along time.  But he's getting worse with it.  He won't talk to anyone but me about it.  I think he needs an antidepressant (but he doesn't want to do that either.)

I'll be supportive but I'm not going to do everything anymore.  And I'm not going to give him any oxycodone.  

[sway1]

it seems to me that you are more like his mommy, and are enabling him in many aspects aside from the pills. not trying to be mean. i have 2 grown daughters and have seen this behavior in action up close. i don't think it's good for anyone.

[dominosarah]

He is out of his meds and his refill is 10 days away???  Uhh ohhhhh......

[Dav125]

Quote "His refill is at least 10 days away I think.)" End quote

Why does this sound so familar? dum de dum de dum..

Three guesses and first two don't count :) Might have something to do with "How long can you tread water".. (not exactly, but its the silent message that counts) :)

[vicki595]

Hey girl~  How about this?  Call him first! Tell him to call the doctor. Then tell him to get on the computer and order some groceries on line. Stop and Shop delivers ...

He's graduated from boyfriend,to ex-boyfriend,to patient.  Please stop this wicked "transference" and "enabling" and just don't go there.  You have you to take care of you,plus the kids.  :)

xo

[mellie4]

Thanks.  I really do want opinions.  I don't want to be clouded by either the fact that I do love him or the fact that I have a suspicious mind when it comes to addictions because of my ex-husband.  The way I figure it is, I helped him the first month by giving him a few.  The second month I took him to my house and nursed him through it and helped him with a little Ativan and Clonidine.  Here we are at the third month doing the same thing.

He has lots of options here as I see it.  Call the doctor and have his meds increased.  Call the doctor and say he's an addict (if he is) and have her taper him and give him stuff to help.  Get the stuff for the Thomas recipe and Amino Acid Protocol to ease his withdrawals.

I know addicts are good at manipulation.  And I know the fact that he has no history of addiction doesn't mean he couldn't have gone from dependence to addiction.

I'm dreading his call tonight, but I'm just going to stick to my guns.  The most I'll do is go to the store and pick up the things he needs to feel better AND leave my medication at home when I go to bring it to him so I won't be guilted into giving him any.  (And we're not talking a few for a couple of days.  His refill is at least 10 days away I think.)

[Dav125]

He needs to quit screwing around, get the surgery done, and dump the meds. Or, in a few months time he will be on this forum asking for help as to why he feels like crap, is depressed, yet is unable to realize its what the pain meds are doing to him, not to mention the fact he will be so far in, he will be facing hardcore wd's as well once he decides he wants to stop....Thats my opinion..

[vicki595]

Hey~   First,I'm with avis 100% on this one.  Of course,I don't know him,but it's sounding like he has an agenda. He plays dumb,uses you as back up,and won't let the doctor change his meds. It's the "manipulating patient syndrome".  I could be way off
here but you asked...LOL.    Also,about that surgery:  There is ALWAYS a risk. You've signed consent forms.  One complication of surgery and anesthesia is death!!  But,we sign our lives away because we want that baby born,gallbladder out,malignant brain tumor out,valves replaced etc...   So,my friend,leave him on his own to deal. He'll call the doctor...he's a big boy.   And anyway,those are YOUR meds.
V.  xo

[avisg]

Its up to his doctor and this is my opinion I know you love him but it really sounds like your and enabler and if he has a chance of getting clean people have to stop enabling him.

[dominosarah]

I understand you wanting the best for him and your worries are justified but you seem to be totally taking care of him.  You said he got worse after his mother passed away and it seems you have stepped into that position.  He needs to get to the doctor and tell her what is going on.......sara

[laurel453]

yeah, mellie....as you say he is fooling himself not wanting to increase his dose when he is doing it in fact by running short of them and asking for more from you.

as you wouldn't want to enable him and you could also risk yourself being on pain because you were giving  some of your pain medication to him, maybe you could have a very serious talk with him where you tell him that there is no way that you both could go on with things this way and that you are going together to his doctor and tell her to increase his dose once for all.

good luck , mellie.. it is indeed a tough situation you are in,,,,

[mellie4]

Truly, I really think he just needs an increase in his pain meds.  Either 10 mg. 4 x a day instead of 3 or 15 mg. 3 times a day.  Getting it from me is definitely not the right option for a number of reasons.  And you're right, if I keep giving in, he won't go to the doctor.  He has a real abnormal fear of doctors, made significantly worse since his mother's death last year from lung cancer.

When I go to the doctor with him, it's like being with a different person.  He is very, very bright, probably genius level on some things.  Yet, when we are in the exam room, he stumbles over what he says, has trouble processing what she says, forgets to tell her things, and I end up bringing up the things he forgets and asking her questions about what she thinks.

I've made a notebook for him with all his information:  his MRI reports, doctor reports/opinions, all his medication information, dosage, etc., emergency contact, etc.  I've asked him to see a counselor about this, but you can imagine, hasn't happened, as it's yet another doctor.  I understand about unreasonable fears as I have a couple myself, but he's 45; he needs to take responsibility.

I am in agony thinking of him going through withdrawals yet doesn't do anything to help himself feel better.  (Like making sure to drink plenty of fluids, or doing the Thomas recipe, etc.  He could at least do that if he doesn't want to see the doctor.)

He doesn't really like medication.  He gave up drinking 16 years ago when his daughter was born.  He wasn't an alcoholic but he ended up with sole custody of her and felt his money and time would be better spent on her.

This is so hard.

[jstntime]

It sounds to me like he needs more pain relief.  I can't however say that getting it from you is the right option.

If you keep giving in, he will NEVER seek an increased dosage.  Only you know the true situation.

He cannot keep going through wd every month, it is heII on the body and with him being in pain it makes it tougher.  Hopefully he makes the connection soon between running out early and feeling horrible and that he makes the right call on the surgery.

Goodluck with this tough situation,

bob

[mellie4]

This is the thing, he keeps saying he does not want to up the number of times a day he takes it or increase the dose.  I know his doctor (we have the same one, and I have a little more than professional relationship with her.)  I know she would increase it.  She actually said at one of his visits, "We'll try the 10 mg. but you may need more, but I'd prefer to start on the 10."

He's afraid of the surgery because he's been told (and I was present) that they're not sure what the outcome will be and there's a chance he could be worse or paralyzed.  Thing is, remaining with this injury, he's been told almost the same thing.  He is now paralyzed by the fear of it.  The surgery itself is very extensive ... I think 3 days in ICU followed by 10 days in the hospital.

I know he hasn't asked anyone but me.  He's a huge loner.  He goes to work; goes home.  He's in pain a lot.  In truth, he shouldn't be at work (he has a very physical job.)  He is on light duty but it doesn't help much.

And I do know exactly what he takes and what he has.  I take everything to be filled for him.  I've tried to get him to see the doctor so she can increase his medication legally.  I don't know if he just doesn't want it in his work records (he's on worker's comp) that he's on a higher dose or what.  He doesn't really explain it; just that "I don't want to increase it."  Even though I tell him he IS increasing it by not using it as directed; so why not increase it legally and avoid the withdrawals?  

I had a really bad history with my ex-husband and addiction.  I tend to be overly sensitive to people that consume alcohol and do drugs.  (My sister always says, "You think everyone that drinks is an alcoholic." )  I know that about myself and know I see things through clouded lenses, which is why I'm asking here.

The bottom line is:  I do love him (even though I can't be with him right now).  I don't want to enable him.  I don't want to hurt him.  And I don't want to see him go through withdrawal if he's not an addict.  I feel like this is such a dilemma.

He doesn't even believe the withdrawals are withdrawals.  Last time he was telling me how it had to be something else; he was too sick; he was having trouble breathing. I gave him this site and told him to look it up; that it was very clear he was in withdrawal.  

I also told him about the Thomas recipe and Amino Acid Protocol and told him I'd be happy to go get it for him.  I thought that plus a little Ativan and CLonipine would help a lot with the withdrawals if he didn't want to go to the doctor.

Thanks for the input; it's appreciated.