Was trying to stop taking unprescibed meds, now it's prescribed

[Roxy30mg]

I was trying to stop using unprescribed Roxycodone30mg pills. Then I made an appointment to see a doctoer and he gave me Vicodin 7.5 ES. He prescribed it for chronic back pain. I feel like I can function much better at work with these pills. My job has me doing a lot of bending and lifting. Just the thing my back aches from. With the pills I feel a surge of energy and I can function much better at work. I may get a little hyper but I can perform my duties much better. So far my doctor has me taking a 7.5 every 6 hours as needed. He gives me 120 pills a month so far. I don't know what to do. Without the pills I feel I can't function at all but with them I feel scared that I may run out of the before my refill comes around. Should I try to live with the pain or continue with what the doctor has given me?
  I also feel guilty about taking other pills to fall asleep faster. I take a prescibed Amytryptolyne, anot prescribed Clonazepam 1mg and sometimes even a unprescibed Ambien. I do fall asleep faster but I worried if there will be any danger in taking these pills together. So far I feel fine when I wake up besides having bloodshot eyes. A little eyedrops and I'm ususually ready to function normally. Can anyone tell what possible long term dangers may occur if I continue this pattern?

[mrmichael67]

You may end up with a benzo dependence.  They are a very difficult detox.  I am sure that is an understatement.  I have used benzos, but I luckily walked away before a dependence could set in.  So, I haven't personally experienced benzo withdrawal, but I hear it is miserable.  That would be your big problem with taking those meds.  One thing that I would question is you taking Vicodin ES for chronic pain.  You would fare much better taking a longer acting med such as Oxycontin or something along those lines.  If you need to have pain relief around the clock, keeping an even level of drug in your system around the clock is much easier accomplished through the use of a longer acting opioid.  Otherwise, your levels will go up and down and up and down.  Many people complain of always waking up in withdrawal and the pain isn't controlled as well.  It is much easier to keep the pain controlled than it is to get rid of it when it is bad.  Also, the tylenol in Vicodin is not a very good thing to be taking chronically....especially if you drink alcohol.  Remember, the maximum adult dose of acetaminophen is 4 grams.  That is 4,000mg.  Of course, it is recommended to stay well below that.

[rodewc]

I know I have heard this.. but does Vike ES have acetometophin (sp) or Tylenol? How much? And what is the ceiling level, and how long is that ceiling applicable (as far as no damage)? Thx.
/rwc

[cosmicstargoat]

Same thing as far as the acetaminophen and the Tylenol.  Roxy, have you told you doctor about taking meds without a prescription?  It is important to level with your doctor so that there are no embarassing surprises down the line if you get into trouble.

Mr. Michael is right about the Acetaminophen, but I would not necessarily agree on going on to Oxycontin unless/until you have disclosed ALL to your doctor.

Good luck

[Kurt Cobain]

Vicodin ES has 7.5 mg hydrocodone and 750 mg acetaminophen (Tylenol) per capsule.  The Vikes I used to take with 10 mg hydro only contained 500 mg acetaminophen (the blue bombers), so go figure.  I think that all generic or brand-name Vicodin contains at least *some* Tylenol. . .it's once you get to the good old OxyContin that they realized that damn, junkies' LIVERS are at stake here, better just take out that nasty Tylenol and give the paying customer more of what they came here for!

Sorry for the sarcasm. . .and before anyone creams me, I know that Oxy is like a godsend for legitimate pain patients who take it legitimately. . .but has anyone else here ever wondered how the drug companies could be naive enough to not have considered the abuse potential of Oxy before putting it out there?  More likely, they DID consider it, and decided the benefits (enhanced profit margin -- whoops, I meant PAIN RELIEF) outweighed the risks (some dead junkies).  We are, after all, a renewable resource.

Peace (and sorry for the bitterness this morning),

Kurt

[mrmichael67]

If oxy wasn't around, everyone would be doing something else.

[cosmicstargoat]

Kurt, I understand your frustration, but I don't think that it is appropriate to demonize a pharmaceutical company for developing breakthrough modalities for treating cancer pain.

M.S. Contin, and then Oxycontin were and are godsends for those cancer patients who must take large doses of narcotics to keep them out of agony.  The significance of the Contin drugs is that they allow the patient to dose q12, allowing a good nights sleep, and because the are single-entity drugs, they allow the patient to avoid acetaminophen, which can be toxic at even therapeutic doses.

Purdue Pharma is a privately owned company and does have one of the highest profit profiles of any drug company in history.  I think, however, that this fact is not really relevant to the problem, i.e. abuse of prescription drugs.

[Kurt Cobain]

*sighs*  Yeah, you're right. . .and if Oxy were available *only* to cancer (or other terminal) patients with chronic pain, it would be a very good thing.  And yeah, if it wasn't Oxy, it would be something else. . .we'd freebase week-old **** if it would get us off.  There's just so many things wrong with the "control system" (LOL) for ALL prescription pain medicine that it's enough to just make you want to shrug your shoulders and give up. . .it's just hard to do that when so many people are dying and it seems like no one really gives much of a ****.

Peace,

Kurt

[cosmicstargoat]

As far as profits go, almost everyone gets emotional about Corporate America and big profits, especially drug companies.  

This, however, is the American way and I wouldn't HAVE IT ANY OTHER WAY.  Just think, if drug companies were not allowed to strive for a profit, how many would be willing to invest in ANY sort of drug to fight heart disease, AIDS, or anything else?

The American free enterprise system is not perfect, but it is the best the world now has to offer.

[bmac]

Finally, you say something that makes sense! See you don't have to be an ******* all the time, I guess when you get bored huh?
Goodbye and Thanks! Big Mac

[suzieneedshelp]

Hey!  You sound like you are searching for answers.  I commend you for coming here and whereever u go to seek answers to your situation.  I wonder if you are wondering if you will become an addict or if you already have traits of an addict.  The disease concept says some of us are very susceptable to becoming addicts due to our physical difference in our brains.  It is about 80% true that addicts/ alcoholics have it in their families.  I was taught that anyone could become addicted...that once the switch is turned on, it cannot be turned off in our brains.  If one takes more than prescribed then watch out.  That is a clear behavioral warning.  I am not saying you are addicted or have the tendancy.  Certain behavioral tendancies indicate that one may have addictive behaviors/ personalities.  An addict can become addicted to many things depending on them, i.e., drugs, alcohol, work, sex, internet, being right, helping others, etc.
Whatever stimulates the pleasure centers in our brain.  Then our brain says " i want more now!"  about 600 - 1200 times per second they say this loop goes on in our brains once activated by any really individually  pleasureable activity or thought.
WEll enough of my ramblin about wut i was told by my M D  addictionalogist in inpatient treatment.
Keep postin and askin...
Peace...
Suzie

[bmac]

You messin' with me?, gurl!
You better watch yourself, you remember I only live around the block! LOL
Did you say you would bite me or was that to MethMan? LOL
Bill

[cosmicstargoat]

"See you don't have to be an ******* all the time"

No, I'm just like everyone else when I'm asleep.

[bmac]

Now that was funny. You do have a sense of something in there.
I won't say humor but close! LOL Well whatsup Doc? Peace Bugs!  Bmac

[MrsRat]

Bmac, I'm the one that bites, not Suz. She's the one who gives the sweet hugs. :)

If you get confused ever again, you'll know it .. cause you will be getting a big *BITE* from me.  LOL.

[Chezz2]

I am afraid you already know you are going to run out early. How many Roxycodone 3omg were you taking a day before?
Right now you are allowed 3 7.5mg hydro. Which is a total of 22.5mg hydrocodone per day. If you were taking more than 1 Roxy, and know that you are going to want/need more than what is Rxed, then you already know you are going to have a problem and should htink about that now so it doesn't become a problem.
As to the amytrytaline(elavil) it is an anti-depressant usually Rxed in 25mg tabs to help with pain relief, and as an anti-depressant. You should have no problem stopping this medication or taking it for an extended period of time.
Ambien is technically not a benzodiazapine, although it does have some characteristics. Stopping this med after an extended amount of time, can cause the same problems as the reason you take it in the first place, insomnia.
Clonazepam is a benzodiazapine with a relatively long half-life which is good since stopping it doens't cause as many problems as something like Zanax would. It is still recommended to try and taper down off this med so you don't have any complications.

NOW THE BOTTOM LINE - taking the Clonazepam/Ambien wihtout a legal prescription is NOT a good idea. Especially if you run into a problem when you have to stop them and have to explain to medical personnel what you were taking and how you were obtaining it.

Now that you have a doctor that is Rxing the pain meds, have you thought about explaining your sleeping issues, what you have tired that works and see if he will Rx something for you so you don't run into trouble?

Roxy, you have some decisions to make, and SOON. That being, are you going to be able to stick to 3 Vics a day, and whether or not you are going to get legal scripts for sleeping aids so you don't run into trouble in the long run.

Best of luck and I hope you work things out NOW, instead of when it is too late,

Chezz

[bmac]

OK you bite she hugs! Now that we got that straight I love to be nibbled on while I am getting hugged, so thanks Nancy & Suz!
Right back at cha..........Bmac

[Expillman]

OK, Thomas, let's dance.

[rodewc]

As I interpret it, Smart Recovery is a resurrection (re-inventing) of the dead Rational Recovery. If I am correct: the difference in the two groups (now known only as Smart Recovery) is that Rational Recovery did not accept that the person getting clean might avail himself of outside groups, such as NA/AA, who helped the person get sober. Smart Recovery accepts the power the individual exercises in getting straight, ignoring reliance (but not forbidding it) on a "God as I understand Him, " etc.

/rwc

[mrmichael67]

My mom works at a hospital in the OR and has for 30 years.  She knows a pain doctor from doing procedures with him and he is going to be taking over my care.  That means I will not be going to the clinic anymore.  I will be prescribed the methadone from him.  It will be nice to be a patient again.  All I have to do is get my records and get them to him and he will start my care.  When she asked, he didn't even flinch.  He said yes without hesitation.  He is from England and they have excellent pain docs and I hear he has been doing wonderful things for his patients.  Who knows?  Maybe he will get to the root of it all.  Maybe I can have a life without the level of pain I currently "enjoy".

[Expillman]

I have been off of Oxycontin for EIGHT days, and unlike most of the individuals in this morass, I am not a drug addict.  

I have never been arrested and have never stuck a needle in my arm.  My experience with pain medications were at the prescription of and under the direction of my personal physican.  The lengthy stay on Oxycontin was a mistake in judgment on my part, I should have known better.  This is the one and only time that I have ever had a problem with a medication and I have never used illegal drugs.  The withdrawal from the Oxy was terrible, but I have not had a single craving to get back on the medication [as opposed to drug].  The pain that initiated the therapy is still there, but it will have to be managed without opioids, at my own choice.  

Those addicts in here that came to the conclusion that I was an addict because of my failure to taper myself off [note the difference between failure to and INABILITY to], are only exposing their own ignorance.  I know well what psychology of addiction is and now I am learning about some of you.  I have a pretty good idea about what is going on now and I am intimidated by no one.  

I also have a pretty good idea about who can be trusted in here and who will backstab if their space is invaded.  So be it.  

One request.  My wife is dead, please leave her alone, she cannot defend herself.  I am speaking to one individual in particular.  You can throw anything at me you wish, I can and will defend myself.  In return, I promise to leave my goat tied to the post.

EXPillman

[Marc1031]

sorry to but in,but its my 1st time here and i can relate to this,having a similar problem.

basicaly i am an x heroin addict,went on methadone,started at 70mg,got to 10 and quit.was on it for 3 years and detoxed within the last year.
  anyway,i came into a rather large supply of pain pills,been trying to detox myself with morphine sulfate 15mg and tylenol-3.
its been 10 days and i am hoping that the worst is over.despite the fact i could take alot of pills i didnt exced 4 a day [morphine] and am starting to be able to go without anything for up to 24 hrs.

question is,is the worst over?how long does it take to get addicted to morphine in this situation?i also have a very awful preexisting back condition,actualy a few which are quite painfull,despite it all,i think i am doing alright,still going to work [took a few days off though]..and i belive i am able to do this as i do not feel mental cravings for drugs.
  am i stupid?is this false hope?am i destined to return to old man H and give up?dont know,just wondering what you all thought

any ideas are well appreciated...i will never go on methadone again,i know it takes a long time to get off due to the extensive half life

[mrmichael67]

I have never been arrested.  I have never stuck a needle in my arm.  My experience with pain meds (besides the clinic) is under the prescription of my personal physician as well.  Just thought you should know that.

To the last poster:

One thing you should know is when heroin is metabolized, it turns into morphine.  Actually, heroin is dectable for only six hours after taking it in a drug screen.  After that, you will only test positive for morphine.  So, using morphine is just about the same thing.  The difference is heroin is about six times as strong.  But, once it is metabolized, the body doesn't know the difference.  When heroin is made, it is made from morphine base.

[mrmichael67]

I would like to post this link for those considering using naltrexone and also hoping for their endorphins to kick in:  http://www.uoregon.edu/~iishp/MillerS.html

[Thomas03]

Gosh, Mike, you sure you want to do this? Without all that pain you might turn into a sweet guy, and no one wants that ... LOL

Seriously, that's great news. At the very least, you can get split doses and not have to guts it out til morning all the time. Good luck with the new doc.

Thomas

[Expillman]

Despite our disagreements, you are one individual in here that I respect, believe it or not.  You have confronted me directly and unambiously.

regards,

EXPillman

[mrmichael67]

I know I wouldn't want that.  Thanks.

[mrmichael67]

That last comment was to thomas.

[oxic]

Just something i've observed over the almost year that i've been here; that several people have kind of "hit the wall" around 7-10 days clean from oxycontin.  Seems the worst of the withdrawals are done, and bamm......a second wave(not necessarily PAWS).  Pax and Saveyourself are two members that come to mind almost immediately after reading that you've reached day 7 or 8.


No matter what has transpired here, i wouldn't wish an addiction/dependancy/pill problem/opiate chain/etcetc on anyone; and any person who works their way out of such a situation, certainly should be proud of themselves.  Reclaiming ones life is the proverbial pot-of-gold at the end of a rainbow.

percs

[Expillman]

Thanks for the encouragement, percs.  As a matter of fact, today was one of the worst days that I have had since last Thursday.  For some unknown reason, the gut started rumbling again and since G.I. distress was my most prominent symptom during the initial phases of withdrawal, I was not thrilled.  

I feel much better tonight and my energy is returning slowly but surely.  I have heard horror stories about being incapacitated for A MONTH and I just can't accept that. I know that I'd better remember these two week because there is no way in hell that I'm going to give these days back.  No way.

[Chezz2]

Expillman,

Sorry to hear about your Mom. My Mom passed away 6 days prior to Xmas, in a fire. I am 29. So it has hit me extremely hard. My Uncle couldn't handle it then took his life by lighting himself on fire a couple weeks later. My Grandparents are still so overwhelmed they can't have the funeral for him yet. I know the pain.

Out of curiosity and honesty, have you ever used another suedonym on this forum before, besides CSG?

BTW - I too have heard of secondary w/ds from oxycontin if you were takin git properly, where it hits you about a week after your last dose. I of courssssse hope you are done with the acute phase. Althouhg I figured I would pass along the info since I too am on oxycontin.

Regards,
Chezz

[mrmichael67]

That secondary phase is common with all opioids.  Just when you think you are out of the woods.......

[Sturgil]

I have never been arrested, stuck a needle in my arm, never done powder or crack and I do consider myself an addict. The first 3 years of lortab usage was only at night for lower back pain. Then, one day, I took my medication in the morning... that is when it all started. December 4th last year I checked into a rehab for a 20 a day 10/500 and 15 a day Soma addiction.

You see I took the meds to kill the L4 / L5 pain in the lower back. Last year on May 23rd I had successful surgery and now the pain is gone. However, I was left with a drug habit. The drugs very slowly got to me over a long period of time. Since December 4th I HAVE NOT had any cravings or wanted to go back to the hydro train. But, I am an addict. Plain and simple.

Today, I stay away from all drugs as well as beer and wine. Heck I do not take anything that alters my mood. (yes, heck is a southern word.)

At first I did not think I was an addict, until the drugs started causing pain in my life. They touched my family, health, money, job and my walk with God. December was painful, the WD's were hell. But today I am feeling so much better. My life is coming back into view. I do know it will take years to get back to where I was before I started using.

I did quit several time before December. But I always turned back to the drugs. I guess you could say I was not ready to quit. When I tried to quit on my own I always worked and talked a good program for the first month. Then I found myself putting own my superman cape and trying to save the world. It was at this point I thought I was cured. Now long after this I found myself ordering hydro's on-line once again.

I share this with you for one simple reason. The people here do care and do not want to see anyone go back out. We all have the same problem with drugs not matter what we call it... it will always kick your ass. (okay several reasons)

Good job on the clean time, keep it up.

God's Speed

Sturgil Flockin

[bmac]

So if you haven't been arrested and you haven't stuck a needle in your arm that's makes you better than me. Is this where you are going with this conversation? It is so sad that many in the medical profession feel this way! It is ridiculas and only makes things worse on us the paying pain patients. In the docs office and in the pharmacy. Also if you take Oxycontin and take it for a long period of time you become an addict. Don't give me that headdoc **** about it's dependence and addiction is different than dependence, that's gargage to make you feel better about yourself. Whether you are a street junkie or a legit pain patient we should all respect each other. And to ask you a question Goat Sir, what about people like me that are both, do I get your respect and your compassion or is it that I am an addict and you can't have compassion for me because of it. My drug problem started in a doctors office in 1989 as I told you today so which is it since everything is so cut and dry with you, how about telling me what is wrong with me? Please everyones opinion matters to me. Where soes everyone stand on this ****?  Bmac

[bmac]

If everyone wants to laugh really hard at someone,ask MrGoatfarts to post his link to his website, I mean it is so friggin funny I almost pee'd my pants! You think e seems like an idiot here, ask him about the link and sit down because you will be on the floor dying in pain. Oh I guess that voodoo doll has my name on it now, right. I canseeitnowaethist has voodoo doll remove from anus after big Christian redneck has his way with his fellow bretheren. Turn the other cheek remember?
Anyway the site is unbelievable andreally really STUPID!
Duh? I am an aethist and it makes me stupid! Duh? Man what a joke guys ,really! Bmac

[suzieneedshelp]

I don't remember who i said i might bite..but i did give Nancy credit for the idea!  Me bite?  You or Meth mike?........hmmmmmm...Its for me to know and ya'll to find out!  Ha!
Suz

[suzieneedshelp]

I don't remember who i said i might bite..but i did give Nancy credit for the idea!  Me bite?  You or Meth mike?........hmmmmmm...Its for me to know and ya'll to find out!  Ha!
Suz

[mrmichael67]

You know where I stand.

[Expillman]

No, Bill, it is a fact.  Have you ever considered thinkng before you post?

[Expillman]

No, the CSG was the only one.  Just a word of advice.  You guys need to throw a rope around Bill.  I know that it is probably just bluster, but there are a lot of sicko-s around and you never know.  He had just better not threaten physical harm again or I will do something about it.

[Expillman]

Bill, I have
1.  Stopped being a jerk
2.  Admitted my responsibility for the goat debacle
3.  Moved on

Why don't you do the same?  If you continue with your diatribe against your imagined foe, you only consume valuable space that you could use to help others.

Think!  If you want to blast me out, email me at ***@****.  I will give you my name and address and you can even come to see me if you wish.  I will meet you at the airport, buy you a beer and you can kill me if you wish, but TAKE IT OUT OF HERE.

EXPillman

[percsnomas]

Hey Suzie, I emailed you yesterday......not sure u received it???

[bmac]

OK I am thru with you period. Dish it out but can't take it,right? I thought so, aethist! But hey Goat you can bet cha I won't say another word to you about it and no I don't wanna kill you,  I'll pray for you though!  It is finished...................Bmac

[Expillman]

O.K., Bill, you leave me no choice.  I will now bring out the heavy artillery.  

Auburn 17 - Alabama 7.

There.

[Kurt Cobain]

Damn it, now you've gone too far.  If you're not careful, we may be able to just put all this behind us and start having fun again.

Peace,

Kurt

[Expillman]

OK, and I promise not to reveal that Bear Bryant was a secret admirer of Shrug Jordan.  Punt, Bama, punt......

[Expillman]

Hey Kurt!  Did you hear the joke about the Tennessee Football fan?

He had this affliction that mimiced Tourettes's Syndrome in that he could not stop yelling "GO VOLS".  It did not matter where he was, in church, in the dentist chair, he would spontaneously yell "GO VOLS"!

Well....long joke short, they treated him with everything they cold think of [including methadone] to no avail.  Surgery was the only option.  They removed half of his brain.  When he woke up from the surgery, he immediately sat up and yelled......









......"ROLL TIDE".

[da da dum]

[Kurt Cobain]

Please, don't inflict any more pain. . .you'll have me craving again.  And I don't even really follow college football. . .more of a gung-ho NHL fan (and ex-psycho-goaltender) here.

Peace,

Kurt

[bmac]

Now we have something to talk about. I do have over a 100 Bear Bryant posters in my house. My walls are lined with all the Sugar bowl victories and of course all the national championships. OK Expillman this is peace! I was wrong in pushing your buttons so from now on I will call you my friend and let this die slowly. And I was there for the punt bama punt game but I was also in New Orleans when we kicked Miami's butt and won the national championship once again, so Please accept this Olive Branch! Aeihtists and Christians can get along on the forum can we just all get along! lol BILL

[Expillman]

I knew you had to be a Bama Bubba Football Crazy.  You might as well have had it tatooed on your forehead.

I'll tell you the teams that I despise.  I have nothing against Bama.

Most Hated

1.  Tennessee
2.  MissiSISSY State

[Kurt Cobain]

Now THIS is what this aging hippie likes to see!  Remember, can't say it often enough. . .no matter how we got here, we all have one thing in common -- we've had our lives screwed up, over, and sideways by DRUGS!  This might be the only place in the world we can all be equals. . .thanks, both of you guys, for burying the hatchet (and not in each other's skulls!)

PEACE.

Kurt

[bmac]

Why do you say I need to be roped. I am not a mean person and I have had only two fights in my life. I lost one won one! I would never threaten anyone much less over the internet. I wish you would drop all this threatening ****. I said IA WOULD DUST YOU OFF, THAT MEANS A ASS WHIPPING. I was joking yesterday and why is it you can dish this **** out but can't take a little humor and I mean with me it's just a little humor. You said if I did it again you would take action. What as in the law enforcement. OK I get your point but be put on notice I am a brother of a secret service agaent so this **** is all too funny. and about hacking this place or my PC don't think about it because a phone call would end all this in one second. I do not have anything against you except the aethist ****. Or Satnaist **** whichever. So Expillman, peace brother and I would never threaten anyone seriously so drop that conversation please.  Bill
BTW know we can talk about addiction please, I am having a problem with mr meds and I need to get some advice here and stop the kiddy play! Thanks Goat sir, we are buds now!

[Expillman]

Now, in all fairness, I'll give you something to work with.  I PLAYED four years for Southern Miss under Thad Vann and P.W. Underwood.  After that I played 3 years in the NFL until Harry Schuh wrecked my knee with a crackback block.  I never was a star or made the big bucks, but I have a few memories and stories.  Fortunately, I got out before I was permanently crippled. I got to see the meanest sonofabith in the world in his last year.  No, not Nitsche, Johnny Unitas.  As far as the Madman was concerned, I was just thankful that I played defense and did not have to face him.

[AmberHunter]

damn, i don't know which is worse, following this little pissing contest that has been going on or reading about SPORTS! *grabbing neck and making stangling sounds*

but if this is what it takes to get things back to "normal" around here then so be it, i will read about sports if i must! j/k!!!

amber