What a Joke!

Real great forum, what are we scared of that our addiction is a choice?

[LIZZIE LOU]

"addiction" is not a choice...but doing something about it is...and this is coming from a "non addict" ! ! !

[toxictome]

That's right on the $$$!!!

[Chi_Chi_Lover]

I don't know about anyone but myself. I made the choice to abuse my medication and shop doctors. I also made the choice to quit the pills, seek counseling and I make the choice every day not to repeat that behavior. I knew when I started abusing the pills and I knew when it was getting out of control. I realize that some of us have the genetic background to become addicts or alcoholics or both. That doesn't excuse our behavior nor should we use this as a excuse.  In fact this should make us more aware of what could happen to us. I can only speak for myself and I know that I made the decissions to abuse and to stop.

[Shotrock]

They do seem to sometimes enable, but no-one except maybe me (lol) is an arshole.. Just wish they wouldn't delete posts out of fear.....

[LIZZIE LOU]

i can assure you and anyone else who thinks so...that medhelp is not "afraid" of anyone's words here.

posts are deleted when they originate drama and are not in the best interest of the members of this forum as a whole.  it's not about a particular post...it is about the members! !

[10356]

I use to be an addict to street drugs, Heroin and then crank have not done street drugs in decades except bud. I do take pain med for legit pain it is my choice when I abuse them!!! I will always be an addict I choose to slam junk then found I had to not to get sick I choose to slam crank, although there is no physical withdraw to speak of when you quit, the mental is pure hell. So yes it is a choice. I'm torn on pain med I started to take it as recommended for pain found I was chasing a high that was my choice. Now I take as prescribed thanks to this forum, if it was not for this forum I do not think I would be able to do this and my life and physical activities would be greatly diminished, What are we afraid of? as for me my-self. self destruction, so I say thank-you to this forum to the wonderful insightful people who use this forum. So yes it is a choice, one you may not be conscious of making at the time but a choice none the less Limbo

[Shotrock]

It just seems that when you talk about personal responsibilty and being held accountable for our actions,when you talk about the Choices we make to become addicts, the powers that be here feel that certain addicts can't deal with thier personal failures and therefore should not be exposed to somebody saying we choose to be addicts and we choose to lie and cheat because of it....  Delete away......

[LIZZIE LOU]

well...since i was not here last night to see the post in question...i cant comment on it.  but being here over a year...i can tell you this has been "debated" many times over.  like i said...it is not so much the original post...but the tone and content of the replies.  i have seen this discussed responsibly as adults...and i have seen it turn into a cat fight that needed to be deleted.

[cathy5841]

so right lizzie lou

[Shotrock]

K

[Rose703]

I'm a newbie here, today is 9 days clean, but I have to say that this forum is saving my life.....thanks to all of you!!
I believe that talking about our feelings and thoughts can be difficult at times when only words are typed and there are no expressions to see on a persons face.

I just want to thank all of you for helping me and I will continue to be a part of this community and I truly enjoy all of you!!

[chef4u]

EVERYTHING in life is a CHOICE!!! everything that is the way the Good Lord made us and why are Lord had to die for our sins because we can never come close to his Glory because of our CHOICE yes i abused drugs by choice no one made me to it but me!

[Shotrock]

Thanks

[wait2long]

we ALL made that first initial CHOICE to take those first few pills, hits or whatever.  but after a while the choice is no longer just a choice...the choice to use initially manifests itself into what they call a disease.  forever changing brain chemistry, UNTIL you make the choice to stop and give your brain some time to heal, get therapy, fix what you can in your life...
addiction is not JUST a choice, but a choice that when left untreated IS classified as a disease.
it is a fact that physical and chemical changes take place in an addicts brain. effecting ones ability to make rational decisions and the right choices nearly impossible to do because the grips of addiction are or were at one time stronger than you or i, even when one may be fully aware of the consequences that "hey, this could kill me!"

i chose to use and abuse, i did not decide one day that "hey, i think i want to grow up as an addict...?"   is it because i decided that i wanted this?   who in their right mind would ever choose addiction?  who in their right mind would ever CHOOSE to let it get to a point that they lose EVERYTHING?, families , children, homes, excellent jobs, and a lot even lose their lives...did they willingly say hey, i hate my family, kids, jobs, and lives?  no, they didnt, this is the disease called addiction, that MOST will suffer from (maybe on and off) for the rest of their lives....as there is no cure.

i didnt see the original post on this either, but here are my thoughts, most backed up by scientific evidence, on the matter.

regardless...we are all looking for the same thing...to get and stay clean.

[chef4u]

I do believe that once we are addicted its hard to make good CHOICES theres that word again I know I have a disease but when i stoled,lied , I made that choice why do i think it was a choice because eveytime i did something bad i suffered guilt from my CHOICE which in turn lead to more drug use its a terriable by cycle but all lead  choice how as addicts when we do bad we say its the diease but when we decided to get clean we say it was a choice if we have no control as addicts then why are we here by choice rember the 12 steps one of which is making amends for the choice we made that hurt ppl addicts are selfish ppl as a whole when we use

[marcatj]

we can all choose to get help.

i believe there's a point where we say "oh sh**, i'm addicted and this is bigger than me...." and while it may take a bit to figure it out, there's apoint it very much becomes a choice to continue using.

there is too much information and too much help out there now to help addicts end their addiction and/or keep it at bay.

i too agree often times, there's alot of enabling here, and not enough "tough love."  while i think love and compassion come first, i've seen too many times people come on and say "oh crud - i used again!" and alot of people say.. "ah, that's ok."  it's not ok.  we're not ok when we use, except in very very limited instances (chronic pain. and even that should be looked at, when the addict has been clean for a little while, and their relapse sounds "suspect.") at the very least - let's question each other..

and i hope if God forbid if I ever get back on here and tell you guys I used again, I hope you kick the c r a p out of me.... because i know better now.

xox
love to all-
mj
(btw - this is not to discount that this forum is the best thing ever.  i know it helped me get clean...)

[10356]

If we were to kick butt every-time some-one slipped there would be know one here and as for cronic (chronic) pain if they admit to abusing then get it under control and use as prescribed the guilt we feel is bad enough with-out it becoming suspect to every-one. I would not be able to go over a bump in a car or walk a block with-out prescribed med should I be held suspect even thou I had admitted to abuse then spent 2 months tapering and sick to get to prescribed amount? Limbo

[poetrygirl1960]

We make the initial choice to use, but not everyone becomes addicted.  I believe there is a biological factor in there that causes some to be addicts and others not.  Why is it we all have relatives with the same problem?  I think whatever gene it is, kicks in after we make that first choice, yes CHOICE.  We are the lab rats that go crazy in the experience and that's okay because we also made a conscious decision, a CHOICE to correct the behavior.

[newmanagment]

i had just posted on nicks post when it went poof! i agree with ya shot, we as accicts make our own choices, and not just our "evil addiction".... but sometimes you have to remember this is a support forum , and word things a lil different. while the person in the original post did get the support he needed to NOT steal the pills, as well as great advice gettomg over it , he still choose to do the wrong thing. but we have to support him in his fight to keep working and staying clean. but i do agree that we ALL are accountable, if only to ourselves. all in all this is a great forum, and i value your input on every subject. i noticed in your second comment on that post, ya kinda rethought wut you said,and were a lil more eloquent with your phrasing, i saw no harm in it. nither did i see any harm in nicks post this morning, but i dont make the decisions onwut stays and goes. dont let a few deleted post setcha back, stick wit the forum and keep puttin it out there,,,,, wait your a politician, i dont need to tell ya that!!! much love..

[toxictome]

Marcatj...ah..you hit the nail on the head..i agree 100%

[confused456]

Marcatj....I also agree!!! Great response to this post!!

[newgirl2708]

My personal style is to hopefully help. Which I think is encouragement with a little 'reality' peppered in to keep it real. The dope has keeped us in the unreal mode long engough. But being "real" doesn't have to be mean or sharp tongued. My favorite part about this site is, this is the first time post after post I can say: Mee Too!!!! For me this is the single most important part of my recovery. Mee too. Someone who has done or is going through verbatim what I am or had. I couldn't do it withouth the shotrocks and naughtys the gtmi's and newmanagements, the confuseds and flmagis. Their styles are different, but my sobriety is important to each of them and that's the bottom line. They say it differently, but the goal is the same. Us getting and staying clean.
My two cents too toxic :)
Newgirl
My style is to spell words incorrectly too. :)  

[confused456]

Newgirl!!

You go girl!!!
There are also different people that need different approaches I think.

[newgirl2708]

Thanks!!

[corey411]

I'm also glad you toned it down a bit...None of us choose to become addicts. We made a choice to take some pills to make ourselves feel better...cop out on something we couldn't deal with or just out of curiosity. An addict never takes some pills and thinks I'm gonna start doing this, become an addict and let it overpower me...ruin my life and everyone elses and just plain forget about my morals and values ...I'llthrow them out the window when I need drugs and steal from my family...It is a PROGRESSIVE DISEASE it overpowers your will. Relapse is part of recovery...it happens to almost everyone who finally begins to deal with there addictions. Part of recovery is taking a look at who you've become and it can be horrifying to think about the things you've done for your addiction when the pills aren't nunbing you. Most people would never have done most of the things and did so bc thier addictions were too strong. Telling a person they are Evil and a no good thief and that they shouldn't seek help here could cause a person easily to end their life. Just bc of the words you used. That person could be my son who has been in recovery for 3 years Tuesday from a big time heroin addiction so yes my reaction is a strong one.

Enabeling a drug user is the worst thing you can do and I don't think anyone here is saying that you should. I don't think what you're seeing as enabeling is the same. Turning someone away who is attempting to get clean and honestly admitting he has a problem that he can't fix himself and is asking for our help needs to know that this happens and is part of addiction and not to give up. He freely admitted he messed up and could not control his urges and believe me I PM 'd him many times lastnite...he feels like **** as I do for stealing from someone. He attends NA meetings bc he wants recovery.
Sorry for those who have read this before but when my son was addicted I did some tough love...made him take urine tests to live here that I got off the internet...I was still enabeling when he first started using again and I was  kinda in denial of that at first. Here is the difference. He wouldn't even admit he was using anymore let alone he had a problem. He was not doing a thing about recovery(why would he if he didn't have a problem.) He was stealing, lying going to absurd lengths to justify everything he did. His general attitude was poor me. Everything in the world that happened was somehow happening to him or being done to him. Everyone owed him something. It was there fault. This is typical addictive behavior of a person in active addiction. This was also my son who for 25 years before and 3 years since had been a terrific, honest great guy, son and dad. For 4 years he was not. He was not allowed at my home, he did not get any money from me for rent when he'd tell me he got thrown out of his room and had nowhere to stay..I did not pick him up for Christmas(only time I ever spent any holiday wo my boys) I always let him know that I loved him more than life itself but that I knew he was using and until he could admit that and set up a plan for rehab he was on his own. He slept outside in the winter. He called once a week and I picked him up so my grandchildren could be with him and took them to a restaraunt and bought him a good meal. He would tell me about his sponcer and things that happened at meetings but I knew he wasn't going and told him that. If I would have done things for him or even let him lie to keep the peace instesd of confronting him that would have been enabeling. Calling him names and withholding love would have probably killed him. Once your an addict you are always an addict..just in recovery. Part of recovery in any 12 step program is admitting and making a mends to the people you decieved and wronged. This guy admitted what he did which is a big step. I don't mean this to be rude to you but do you plan on ever telling the peoplle who elected you your an addict. Sorry for this but to be honest I don't think that you see yourself as someone who is the same as the addict you pass by on the street or see coming into prison for stealing for their drugs bc the rehabs are too full and there on a 3 month waiting list. It sounds to me like you think that you are better than the  average addict and just took some pills..got addicted..trying to stop and are no longer an addict. I hope not bc alot of other things in our heads need worked on and if you think abstinence for a few weeks is all there is your in for a biggy. Best luck, These are only my opinions and not meant to critisize or judge you.....It was real hard not to write those parts though. Good luck and please even if you can't be good to someone try to pass along NO HARM. Corey

[LIZZIE LOU]

yikes!!!!!!!

you speak of tact...but then you call someone out.  your post could have read the same WITHOUT mentioning someone's name.

[cathy5841]

powerful post

[Shotrock]

Thank You, great Post.. Read it twice...

[Shotrock]

Agree Lizzie, but I'm not here to Hide!

[confused456]

Corey.....very, very powerful post.

[sadinmichigan]

I'm sorry you feel that i am prejudice against methadone...but..I am beacuse of the hell i went through  because of the inaccurate info i had of it. But i have also taken many other things than that and I try to give info on other things as well..methadone  is a drug all unto itsef...unless you have been there don't tell me...WTF..

[LIZZIE LOU]

my reply was directed to sael...you dont have two screen names do you?  lololol

[sadinmichigan]

thanks for the backup...

[mr.lucky66]

When we are not hooked on drugs and we take them, it is a choice we make and a bad one. If we don't accept this then we are copping out or trying to make excuses. When we are hooked and need a fix, that's a different rhing and less of a choice.

[sadinmichigan]

whom are you directing that comment too????

[Shotrock]

see you there....................

[mr.lucky66]

no one in particular and everyone. Using is a choice. We have free will unless we are sick and need a fix, that's a little different..

[flmagi]

Excellant post Corey.
Yes, we all make the choice to start useing, but there are different reasons for that choice. Some made the initial choice with their doctor because of legitimate pain issues and went on from there and others made the choice for recreational purposes. But we all ended up in the same place and thats what we're dealing with.
Hugs to all,
Magi

[Sael]

If you kept up with the threads you post in you would remember your comment about nasty needle users. THAT'S prejudicial. Not your feelings about methadone.

To Lizzie Lou:

Why try to make someone guess when they're on a forum and make a highly prejudicial remark about other people who have had various experiences on opiates. She needs to understand that what she said was indeed prejudicial.

Jeez, it's not like I called her names. You didn't have to get involved but you did when it had NOTHING whatsoever to do with you. Maybe you're the one that wants a little drama?

[sadinmichigan]

ok...wrong choice of words but i meant well...sorry..I don't want anyone to have to go through what I had to  for a pill addiction...no more..

[sadinmichigan]

The above was to you..I went to every post..I did not say "nasty needle users" if you can find it..Send it to me.....and to ME not on this post..all done here

Shotrock...so sorry...I'll be back to helping to..again really sorry.