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how many days to detox off 20-35 tramadol per day?
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how many days to detox off 20-35 tramadol per day?

I've been on Tramadol for 2 or more years.  I went up to 15 recently, and am surprised by how many I've taken recently.  I am checking into a detox.  They will only keep me 6 days.  How many days will it take?  Please help.  
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By the end of the 6 days you should be feeling better. You may still have a little of the withdrawls but as long as you want to quit you will be able to fight those!! Good luck to you and just remember all the wonderful things your future has to hold without pills!
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ty, they offer catapress and soboxone for 5 days.  They only give 4 subs the 2nd day and taper you off through the 6th day then you're let go.  Will I be able to catch a bus for about a 2-3 hr. venture?  Scared.  I'm thinking to try to wean down now, good idea?
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NO no no...

Alnite~ I'm not sure what they'll give you in detox. They're all different. Tramadol detox should be tapered;not cold turkey.  It takes at least a month to feel better and longer to feel really well.  What did they tell you would be done there?

Vicki
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Is Tramadol stronger than Hydrocodone?
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Okay...I'm not sure about this really. I know I wouldn't do this and get on a bus. You are not going to feel very well. I know that. Just being realistic...
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Shiningstar~  If you have to ask that question then maybe it would be better if you looked up this med,understood it,before you offered advice about it. I don't mean to be rude here...not at all.  But,be careful.
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I appreciate the feedback Vicki, I have taken Tramadol before and It made me sick. Probably because I wasn't used to it or something. Thanks!
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Star~  It's not that it's stronger than than hydrocodone,it's very different chemically.It should be tapered off slowly,especially at that high of a dose.
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With the amount you are taking I would slowly taper off There are very few doctors that prescribe sub from tram wd .Do they specifically know what you are coming off of? I will say this if you are up to 35 DO NOT CT that's prime for seizures .Tapering at your level would take a long time but I would try it until you get on a far lower dose .

BTW tram was my DOC
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Are you being forced in to detox or are you doing this on your own? I am wondering if you would have the time to taper as you mentioned if you are forced to go. Good luck to you!
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Tramadol is the devil in disguise. In 2007 I came to this forum for the first time and there weren't many tramadol stories. Now it seems like almost every other post is about tramadol. When are dr's gonna get it?
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OH MY GOSH!  Do not do cold turkey!  I went CT from 15 a day, and I can tell you that it was horrible!  Start tapering now.  The dose you are on is toxic....you could EASILY have a seizure on that amount.  I had several seizures, and I didn't ever take that many in one day.  Please be very careful!  Taper slowly, ok?:  This medicine is poison!  I'm not even kidding!!!  

Please let us know what and how you are doing, ok?
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yes another thing here is that tramadol works in two different ways one as a pain reliever and as a ssri  antidepressant .so it raising your serotonin level sky high which could send you into serotonin syndrome it can be fatal.

Serotonin syndrome most often occurs when two drugs that affect the body's level of serotonin are taken together at the same time. The drugs cause too much serotonin to be released or to remain in the brain area.

For example, you can develop this syndrome if you take migraine medicines called triptans together with antidepressants called selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) and selective serotonin/norepinephrine reuptake inhibitors (SSNRIs). Popular SSRI's include Celexa, Zoloft, Prozac, Zoloft, Paxil, and Lexapro. SNRI's include Cymbalta and Effexor. Brand names of triptans include Imitrex, Zomig, Frova, Maxalt, Axert, Amerge, and Relpax.

The FDA recently asked the manufacturers of these types of drugs to include warning labels on their products that tell you about the potential risk of serotonin syndrome. Talk to your doctor before stopping any medication.

Serotonin syndrome is more likely to occur when you first start or increase the medicine.

Older antidepressants called monoamine oxidase inhibitors (MAOIs) can also cause serotonin syndrome with the medicines describe above, as well as meperidine (Demerol, a painkiller) or dextromethorphan (cough medicine).

Drugs of abuse, such as ecstasy and LSD have also been associated with serotonin syndrome.
Symptoms
Symptoms

Symptoms occur within minutes to hours, and may include:

    * Agitation or restlessness
    * Diarrhea
    * Fast heart beat
    * Hallucinations
    * Increased body temperature
    * Loss of coordination
    * Nausea
    * Overactive reflexes
    * Rapid changes in blood pressure
    * Vomiting

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I appreciate the comments and concerns.  Has anyone ever tried suboxone to get off tramadol?  I have tried to taper and could only make it to 10.  I'm going to try to get down to 15 or less before I go in.  It wasn't that long ago it was only 15, it was only last week I took 35 per day and I can't believe I did that, I wasn't stoned all the time.  the detox said they have had a few tramadol patients withdraw.  Will the suboxone help me?  Will I be able to get airride home which is like a small car that takes you at least double the time to get home because they stop for others?  Its the only alternative I have.  I'm going far away to detox because no one tapers here or even gives you medication except this far away detox in the big city.  I'm pretty sure I can get down to 15 no problem.  Will the suboxone help me?
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To be honest,I personally have not seen anyone on the forum who has done this. But,I know who I can contact.  

Hang tight...I'll try to reach him.

Vicki
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I go into the hospital Monday morning, so I have Wed, thurs, Fri. Sat, Sun and Monday to taper.  I thought I'd start at 15 which might be a more realistic average and cut one pill out per day.  I am not forced but I have run out of medication.  My daughter can watch my dogs for 4 days and I have to be home at the end of 6.  I won't have a ride home unless I must desperately beg my daughter to come pick me up.  I would have to come home in 5 to get air ride home and catch a bus on sat which is unresonable too.  It's going to be tough but my tapering hasn't been successful.  I've tried to give my meds to someone but it always falls through somehow, my will power is not strong enough or they don't want to stick with it.   I've got to be strong.  I'm getting more scared.  The detox said I should be fine that they've seen this before..  Yes they do not what I'm coming off of.  I've read that suboxone also helps with tramadol as well.  Think of heroin addicts that must be awful.  I have also heard the tramadol withdrawal was very mild compared to methadone.  I will have all the medications.  catapress and suboxone for 5 days - 6.  any hope for my situation?
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Normally no doctors will not put you on sub to go off tram .Every once and a while we will get a member that says there doctors are going to put them on it for tram but not often .I dont know anyone that has taken it to get all way off tram maybe someone will pop in
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Hi!  I have detoxed off of everything you can imagine....literally.  I'm ashamed to say that I have abused a lot of stuff, but I'm over it for the most part....as far as the shame.  Anyway, methadone is rough.  Suboxone is rough.  Tramadol is rough.  They are all bad.  Tramadol's problem is double because of it's anti depressant effects.  Your seratonin will bottom out, and it makes you feel like crap.  THEN....there's the opiate withdrawal feeling!  NASTY!  It's just icky!  YUCK.

Do what you have to do to get off of it.  That is about all I can say.  I would rather take arsenic than ever take another one of those.....for real!  The WDs are just too awful!  Be sure you let them know at the facility how many you have been taking, so they can treat you properly.  

Good luck to you!  I'm glad you are doing this!!! : )
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I just sent a message to Henry.  He's who I turn to when I'm unsure. He's very smart and has a lot of experience with sub.

Yes,I think there's hope. Definitely.  You're doing a wise thing to try to get yourself off the tram now that it's unmanageable.  You really took a large dose for a while!!

It's just that I am not sure how you will feel. I'd like to say you'll be fine but I don't know.
I'm thinking,logically,this will work. You're just not going to feel very good...but you have to do something.

Obviously,the folks at the detox know more so...Did they say anything about being narcotic free for a period of time prior to coming in?
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I copied this article, part of it and it discusses the seretonin probablem.  Will zoloft take care of my seretonin problem?  I will not get addicted to suboxone.  Will I get addicted after 5 days? at only 11 pills?

…. I would suggest approaching the withdrawals from two perspectives.  To cover the serotonin withdrawal, replace the Ultram with a different serotonin reuptake blocker, specifically Prozac (fluoxetine).  Replacing the serotonin effect of Ultram will be tricky—if you just add Prozac you will risk causing serotonin syndrome, a not-uncommon result of combining an SSRI and Ultram.  I would add the Prozac a day or two before stopping the Ultram.  Somewhere down the line she can just stop the Prozac—which then tapers itself over weeks.  This is, by the way, a common technique to get a person off Paxil, which has a very short half-life.

I must add here that I am assuming that all of these things will be done under close medical supervision. Serotonin syndrome, or Ultram alone, can sometimes cause seizures; there are risks to seizures alone, but they become much more dangerous when they occur suddenly while a person is driving on a highway. These are just general ideas that may or may not be appropriate depending on your sister’s specific history and health status.

The prior considerations were concerned with the serotonin effects of Ultram. As for the opiate effects, a big decision must be made.  Suboxone puts addiction into remission, but doesn’t cure addiction.  There is a lot of silliness on the internet about Suboxone, mostly because of confusion on this issue.  The people who complain that they are ‘stuck on Suboxone’ miss the point of what Suboxone does.   Opiate addiction is a life-long condition that eventually destroys a person; Suboxone prevents that destruction by removing the obsession to use.  But there is no cure for addiction; if people stop Suboxone, they tend to relapse—unless they go through 12-step based treatment or get involved with meetings.   So to handle the opiate half of the withdrawals your sister would have a choice; she could take immodium and clonidine to reduce the opiate withdrawal symptoms, planning on becoming completely clean… or she could go on Suboxone to handle the opiate withdrawal symptoms—- and plan to be on Suboxone for a long time....
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It will be up to the doctor what they put you on .That is not the AD that I would think would be the best choice but I am not a doctor so hopefully they are very knowledgeable of tramdol I also hope the the sub doesn't not just put off the tram wd until you are off the sub.
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Okay...Where is this article/letter from?  Is this in reference to you? Are you taking zoloft now??

You know what?  If this were ME,I would go into detox in-patient,not take suboxone,get
myself to NA,find a sponsor and devote my life to being sober. But,that's just me. With Tramadol there are some tricky issues with the serotonin component.  You'll be far from home,alone,depending on some kind of transportation,I just don't like it.

Have you exhausted ALL other options??
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Ok, I have been clean since March, avisg has been clean for an eternity and vicki is a nurse.  I don't think any of us think that sub is the answer to this!  What is going to happen to you when the 6 days are up and you are home alone?  Is there any way at all that you could try tapering one more time and maybe get the doctor to help you with the taper and some clonidine or something?  That is what I took to detox, and it really helps.

Think about it!
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Avatar_f_tn
I can taper down in the next few days.  I am going in patient.  The suboxone is suppose to reduce the intensity and the length of the wd.  I think I can get down to maybe 12, should that be enough?  Also, I won't have anymore pills to taper with.  My daughter has taken 3 days off work, so can cover me from Mon - Fri, its almost perfect.  When I am home alone?  They said I'd be ok in 6 days???  I live alone with 2 dogs.  I do go to AA.  I was at 10 per day just a few weeks ago maybe even two, I don't think its as bad as I've made it.  I will take as few as possible tomorrow and let you know.  Its the best I can get down to, no one will help me taper and left to my own devices it is much worse.  I need hope.  I am on the zoloft, 125 mgs.  I know about the serotonin wd it is terrible.  Without my zoloft I get very emotional and anxious, almost out of my mind, crying spells.  I stopped my zoloft before and it was a bad idea.  I took it the whole week I was taking the 30+ pills, oops, ....................I'm so fearful right now, the next few days I'm going to be so scared, I want to start now (tapering) but afraid of the withdrawals this week and how messy my house will look when anyone comes in to take care of my dogs.  The only other detox is no taper and only catapress which is like clonidine.  I'm going to talk to my dr. tomorrow and ask her all that I will need.  I have requip for restless leg syndrome, and willl have a muscle relaxer., zoloft will help me with the serotonin wd.  I can buy immodium.  I can hopefully get my dd to pick me up Sat from hospital.  Tramahater, if I get down to 12 should I be okay?
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Okay...I don't like any of this.  You already take zoloft??    Geez!!

You are already scared. That's no way to go into this. But,no one here can reassure you. I certainly can't anyway.   I really don't like the seratonin component in this mix.And you take zoloft now,too. I'm not sure that's going to cover you and you're not sure either. See what I'm getting at?? You have a lot of questions and they should have been answered. Are you being forced to do this??  How much is this costing you?

It's not so much the amount of tramadol you take. It's the type of drug that it is. I know I wouldn't want to get my brain stipped of all those chemicals in less than a week. I would be afraid as well.

What did they tell you would happen the first day?  I know they said they'd start the sub on day 2 but what about day 1 ?   I'm thinking no tramadol at all. Yuk!!
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I detoxed C/T off 20 - 30 tramadol per day with my doctors knowledge and support. I would firmly like to point out though I'm not saying you should do this - and DEFENITELY should not do this withouut a good doctor knowing about it.

I'll tell you right now - it was BAD. My doctor prescribed me a limited amount of valium so I wouldn't have a seizure. She also put me on epilim for a while before for same reason. I have mixed feelings about it - I mean it was hell - but after 7 days it was mostly over - when I read of people tapering it it's almost like it prolongs the misery? I took 2 weeks off work (I'm a nurse).

That first 7 days - I had about 8 hours sleep IN TOTAL. The restless legs were an absolute torment. Apart from those two things (they were the worst for me) it was like I had a bad flu. Oh yeah - I had to keep showering and changing my linen and clothes because I sweated alot (sorry if TMI) - it was literally like my body was expelling all the tramadol chemicals that had built up.
After 7 days I felt better and better every day - then 3 weeks post detox I felt AMAZING!! Energy and a new lease of life without all those chemicals in my system.

Just wanted to write my experience - but pls realise I am not giving medical advise or saying anyone should do this - I firmly believe you should only do this with a good doctor supporting you (mine rang or home visited me daily - and she gave me a blood test just before I did this to ensure my benzodiazapine and epilim level was high enough so that I was unlikely to have a seizure.)

I live in Australia - would doctors in the US do home visits and support you in this way? I would have thought yes...

Good luck to all out there batteling their addictions!
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Hey there!

Well after reading this, one thing is for sure...  the docs certainly have a tricky situation to deal with here, but I assure you it can be done. Its not going to be easy nor painless, but its possible!

I know its late back in the states. I just woke up, and want to look through some of my notes as I have my coffee and get outta my "Morning fog" before posting as I dont want to give any misinformation.

To Vicki-  Thanks for being my "Scout" :-)  With my crazy schedule sometimes I miss important posts such as this (All posts are important, but better advice given from other members in that area) I appreciate your messages! :-)

Henry
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Its 9:30am in the States now.  Looking for answers.  I'm going to see my dr. now, PCP and look into getting other medicines to help me and ask her about clonidin for home use.  Perch you were extrememly helpful.  I will be at a hospital for the first 6 days, and they willl know all the details.  I am going to take as least amount of pills today to see how fee I can get down to.  Took three to get out the door for 2 appointments.  Getting all plans ready to go through with this.  I look at this this way.  Do you want a little electricution or a lot!  Either way it has to be done.  I'm going to try to stay positive as I get my numbers down.  Thank you for everyones concern.  Back after drs.
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Hi Alnite.  You have me deepest sympathy/empathy for what is happening to you.  I have been having an extremely dffficult time coming off this medication, and I never too more than prescribed and was not even on it a full 2 months.

You can read my story if you want.

The constant anxiety and insomnia has been really hard for me, and for everyone else who has had to come off this awful medication.

I wish you all the best and will keep you in my prayers/thoughts.

This can be conquered as evidenced by all the great people here who have.  I am off of it, just struggling to get back to where I can sleep and don't have this constant anxiety.

Which according to the others that have recovered just take patience and time.

It's only been 10 days for me so far, but things are getting a little better.

Try to think of it as you have a "Tough Challenge" ahead, but you can make it through and when you do you will be so much stronger.

Hugs
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Oh, BTW, my Psychiatrist referred me to Kaiser's Chemical Dependency because they do use the Suboxone for Detox, but since I've already been off it 10 days, even though I am still having Withdrawal Symptoms, they wouldn't take me.
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Good luck with your appt. Be sure to ask all the right questions.

Henry did reply back to you but his post was deleted by the moderators of the forum.

This is a very complicated endeavor so get as much info as you can!

V.
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Avatar_f_tn
The bottom line is you do what your Dr says and we will be here to cheer you on. If they do give you sub I wouldnt try to take it once you are through with your detox. I am on sub now. When I started it I was only supossed to take It for a month ans Here I am almost two years later. I tried to stop it several times but could not. I am doing a slow taper now. I have alot of things going on with me though. I just wanted to tell you my story. A small portion of it anyways.
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Hi, I have been on Tramadol.  It was not until I joined this site that I found out why the doctors (on a first visit) always asked me why I was on Tramadol and Prozac.  They indicated that I could have a seizure but never went into too much detail so I merrily continued both since I was having no untoward symptoms. When my pain worsened I went on Percocet and stopped the Tramadol. I'm wondering if I'd continued on Tramadol long term along with the Prozac what could have happened. My concern was that I needed the Percocet which clearly an addictive narcotic.  I don't understand all the hoopla so many people have posted about Tramadol.  It is not a narcotic so where does the addiction come from?  Could somebody please explain why it is so dangerous to take it long term.  I already understand the danger of Prozac and Tramadol together, but I fail to understand why Tramadol alone is a bad drug other than the fact that it raises the brain's serotonin level.  Why are so many MH members treating it as if it were Morphine?
DeeDee
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Avatar_f_tn
DeeDee~  It is most definitely a narcotic.  Although much milder than the morphine it is derived from,with decreased chances of addiction,it is nonetheless addictive. Many people increase their doses over time to reach a level of pain relief or because they merely want to increase the narcotic level.  It's dangerous in that people are not informed of the withdrawal that WILL occur once the medicine is stopped.

You had no symptoms when you stopped the Tramadol because you began Percocet which covered your opiate receptors and were taking Prozac which prevented reuptake of serotonin levels.
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Avatar_f_tn
It does bind to those recepters in the brain that give that pleasure feeling. Tramadol is deffinatly an addictive bad narcotic. So many people have proved that it can take over lives.
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There is a dr. in town who treats tramadol addiction with Naltrxone, ever heard of it?  He will be calling me this evening before I go into detox.  I'm pretty sure I have to detox first then go to him.  He also prescribes Suboxone but I think he's leaning towards this other in my case.  If this helps us what a wonderful break through.  I will do my research on this medication.  It is an opiate blocker in the same family as suboxone, I discussed with my PCP.  My PCP gave me catapress and a muscle relaxer for when I get home.  I hope I'm not talking about medication too much, apologies to the moderators, alnite
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No,it's okay to talk about these meds.

I'm very familiar with this drug.  It's different from suboxone. You will need to be free of all opiates and without symptoms of withdrawals before you begin.  It will be helpful to you in that it will keep you away from narcotics. You'd get sick if you took anything.

But,you need to know that all of this treatment can only go so far. It's not a panacea. It's
very important that you work a recovery program as well.  You need to get to the reasons WHY you use,WHY you took 35 pills in one day. The medicine doesn't fix that.

The forum can help you a great deal. You can come on here and talk,vent,ask questions etc...  In addition to addiction therapy,counseling,groups,NA or AA,it will be a good adjunct.

How are you doing on your taper so far?

Keep in touch!!
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Hey there,

Im not sure what happened to my post, I dont think the mods had anything to do with it, I think it was a computer glitch (Or just user error) :-)

Re: Naltrexone.  

I too tried this route at one point during my endeauvors to get clean.  My take on it is... its useless. Please bear in mind that this is my opinion only!  Naltrexone is an opiate antagonist, its very similair to naloxone which we use via IV when working opiate overdoses on the ambulance and in Emergency rooms.

Naltrexone is basically the oral version.  Its given to addicts after they have completely detoxified from their drug of choice. If given too early it will cause serious withdrawals that will have you feeling like you are in a living hell....

Its given to addicts after the wd process as a safety net. It blocks the opiate receptors, so that if you do use... you will get no benefit from using. You will feel nothing at all. ITs like that portion of your brain is turned off.  If you take an opiate while on naltrexone, you wont get sick, you just get no euphoria.  If you take naltrexone while on an opiate, you are in for a world of pain.  Kind of like the whole "Liquor before beer" motto.

Its an oral med that must be taken daily. So, if someone really wants to use, they just dont take it.  It also doesnt help with the concept of not having to take a pill every day. This in itself can be a bad mindset to be in.

Naltrexone can potentially cause liver issues, which for us pill addicts could already be an issue. So naltrexone therapy requires a liver panel before treatment and at regular intervals during treatment.  

Naltrexone does nothing for cravings, or post acute withdrawals. At least it didnt for me.

Now if the doc you are referring to is using something known as LDN or Low dose Naltrexone therapy. Then that is a different story, and a whole nother talk show.  LDN is an off lable use for naltrexone and must be privately compounded in a compounding pharmacy.  Its effectiveness is still up in the air.

Hope this helps a bit.

Henry
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Avatar_f_tn
My taper, only took 3 so far all day and no wd symptoms accept tiredness, very tired.  slept the last two hrs.  To Henry, should I do the in house suboxone detox of tramadol for 5 days OR just go CT in another detox center?  Only two choices for me, detox is inevitable.  Go where they give you suboxone and catapress or just catapress.  I'm only allowd to stay about 5 and a half days at the suboxone one, thye said I'd be doing fine.  The CT one I'm pretty afraid of.  Does the suboxone actually shorten your detox and make it less painful?  In that case perhaps in 5-6 days I'll be fairly through the hard stuff.  Then when I get home the dr. is giving me catapress, neutrontin and zanaflex.  the reason I took the pills is for fibrolyalgia.  Have you ever heard of nalterone in small does 5mg as opposed to 50-100mg for addicts.  I do not think I'll have cravings.  First, there isn't that much of a buzz off the tramadol anyway, 2nd I'm already in recovery and clean for 2 1/2 years from cocaine, I never drink.  This was suppose to be safe but it stopped working.  I just want to be free.  I already talked to dr. about alternative medication.  She wants to put me on cymbalta as well as the other's I mentioned.  I also have requip for RLS.  Many of the detox symptoms are simalar to Fibro anyway.  And did I mention I'm going to try neurontin again.

So Henry the Naltrexone is a waist?  what about the 5 days of suboxone in patient?  Will it ease the wd symptoms?  Bottom line?
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Avatar_f_tn
To Henry, I hope you will come back and answer my last question.  I had only 3 tramadol in the morning.  I'm so tired I can barely take care of my dogs.  I am not withdrawing yet, is it because of so much that was in me?  I do have a headache.  I hope people will keep writing I need support.  Should I start a new thread?
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Avatar_m_tn
Hi iv been on tramadol for two years and today went to see my doctor he was very very helpfull towards my addiction. At my worst which is just recently i was taking 20-30 a day.  I had been cold turkey for two days which was hard enough but your time must have been alot worse. My doctor has prescribed me tramadol which my partner is giving me at the moment at the prescribed dose. I dont know if this will help you in any way. I hope u get through it.
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Avatar_f_tn
I am on day 2 of my home detox off 30+ tramdol a day. I am not doing so hot but I did take half a hydro before I went to bed. It didn't help much but it felt better in my head. I don't think cold turkey is best for tram withdrawl (withdrawal). I am still hella sick and not feeling good I can get some trams and have my wife dose me but I think 1 tram would do it now that im on day two. I feel like tapering is so much better for relapse u know.
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