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i need help!!!! how do you stop after so long??
by pillhead, Mar 14, 2003 12:00AM
i have been taking lorcets for about 5 years now everyday.i know this is killing my liver but how do i stop?? i have tried so many times and can't stop. its got to the point that i don't feel like going anywhere or doing anything. i'm married. i have a 10 yo son that i have to take care of an i feel i can't do it with out the pills. my hubby is on workmanscomp an i have no insurence. i feel like i have no where to turn for help. i wont to stop so bad its killing me!!!! what can i do to stop?? how can i get help with no insurence??
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Call 911, go to an Emergency Room, call a loved one or a friend. Everything and I mean everything in life can be fixed, including this. You are to valuable to consider harming yourself.
Relapse is normal, it's part of what we go through. Don't harm yourself. Call someone, please.
Kilo
Normally I would not recommend methadone, but you sound like you're at the last resort for sure, so I will, as it is definitely only for absolute last resort IMO. It is a wonderful alternative to jail, which it sounds like you will be going. Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. Methadone will quickly end the present problem, although it really really sucks waiting in line every frickin day and not being able to leave town. You will feel better though, and not need to continue your path to jail or suicide. You are protected by FRC 42 part B, as far as confidentiality from all (with the exception of a court order). Do you have any kids? If so, they need their mommy. Parents? Let us know. Actually, better alternative might be trying Suboxone if you kind find a certified doc. Well wishes, and stay out of jail, nothings worse, even CT w/d's are better than jail.
So many people think if they can just get through withdrawal they will have licked the problem.
"Suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem."
Unfortunately addiction isn't a temporary problem. If only it were so simple. The real problem is what to do with the rest of your life. You really sound like you need to remove yourself from your current situation so an in-patient rehab place might just be the best thing for you right now. If you can find a good one they will help set you up with support systems for when you go back to your life.
A few weeks in a place like that would be a much better alternative than jail I would think. If you check yourself into one BEFORE the court catches up with you, you might avoid jail time altogether. Although if this is your first offense you probably won't do any time but you never know. Make sure you have a lawyer when you do go - NEVER go with the court-appointed attorneys. They suck.
I hope you get this figured out. Remember suicide is never a good option. It is a selfish act and leaves total misery in its wake. Those left behind never get over it.
You have many people here to talk to who understand... get with Hippy at his email post above. He has helped me over the past couple years with his posts. Slooooow down, the drugs will not have you thinking the way the real you should be. Post as much as you can. Praying for you. Nod
***@****
you had said last month or so
you want to email me.
peace brother
hope all is well
hippy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
My motivation was first me. I had to change. I'm blessed with a beautiful wife and daughter. I'm I willing to go through 5 tough days of physical withdrawal, 30-60 additional days of uncertainty, decreased energy and malise (which really isn't all that bad) and about 6 months to a year of combating cravings.
For ME and my family. My answer was yes.
Each failure, each relapse made me stronger. Finally I said enough.
Yeah, I think about shoving a handful pills down my throat everyday. Then I get my ass up and start thinking about something else. That first month I had those thoughts every 2 minutes, then every 5 minutes, then 3 times an hour and so on. The intensity and the number of cravings get smaller each day.
It does get better. I'm teaching myself how to live,laugh and love all over again. Believe it or not, it's sometimes real fun along the way.
Sooner or later a choice will have to be made...you find away to live without them or you don't really live at all.
It can be done. There are 10's of thousands if not a few million people in this country who have beat this addiction and lead "normal" lifes. Good Luck and Peace to you.
Kilo
SABIAN
A simple virus knocked him down(common cold virus) a week ago last Wednesday, and his kidneys and liver HAVE NOT functioned since. He has taken all kinds of oxycodone(etc) for years, and continually bombarded his organs with tylenol; and was also marvelled how his liver enzymes always came back okay.....till now.
I guess i will think twice about citing how resilient the liver is(which i've been saying here for 8 months), now that i've seen my friend just lying there, hoping......
Take Care All(please)
percs
withdrawals...There are alot of great peoople here that can help.
It is never too late and there is always help.You are not alone.Believe me there were some low times and I wondered if I could make it. But I'm here and don't feel too bad.I can finally see the light at the end of the tunnel.If you want to email me, it is ***@****'ll try to help all I can..And keep coming here..Don't ever give up..Sherry
As Trickker said, takes some deep deep breaths. You are here; We know what you're going thru; and many of us have been right where you are.....so just try to be calm(yes i know easy to say).
I came off a pretty hefty percocet habit myself last summer, after many years, so i can relate to that hopeless and afraid feeling!! Seeing that you went thru such a nasty w/d last time; can you get enough meds to taper yourself off.
If you want help with a tapering regime, i can help you lay one out. Tapering is difficult(will power-wise, But not impossible); and will accomodate letting you down easier!!!
Please don't be so hard on yourself, OPIATES do all of things you mentioned, and leave a person in isolation......
I'm going to post a detox recipe, which has a bunch of great info during and after your detox:
Thomas Detox Recipe
PLEASE NOTE: I am not a doctor, simply a long-time Rx opiate junkie who has had many opportunities to develop a way to detox. This is a recipe for at-home self-detox from opiates based on my experience as well as that of many other addicts. It is not intended as professional medical advice. It is always wise to make sure none of the recipe ingredients or procedures conflict with medications you may be taking. Likewise, if you have any medical condition, disease, allergy or any other health issue, consult your doctor before using the recipe. Thanks, Thomas
This recipe is designed for cold turkey opiate detox. It assumes that you can get about 5 to 7 days away from your job or household responsibilities during which you can sleep, veg and act as miserable as you feel. Opiate WD mimics the symptoms of the common flu, so, if you need a smokescreen, hide behind a bad case of the flu.
If you can't take time off to detox, I recommend you follow a taper regimen using your drug of choice or suitable alternate -- the slower the taper, the better.
For the Recipe, You'll need:
1. Valium (or another benzodiazepine such as Klonopin, Librium, Ativan or Xanax). Of these, Valium and Klonopin are best suited for tapering since they come in tablet form. Librium is also an excellent detox benzo, but comes in capsules, making it hard to taper the dose. Ativan or Xanax should only be used if you can't get one of the others.
2. Imodium (immodium) (over the counter, any drug or grocery store).
3. L-Tyrosine (500 mg caps) from the health food store.
4. Strong wide-spectrum mineral supplement with at least 100% RDA of Zinc, Phosphorus, Copper and Magnesium.
5. Vitamin B6 caps.
6. Access to hot baths or a Jacuzzi (or hot showers if that's all that's available).
How to use the recipe:
Begin your detox with regular doses of Valium (or alternate benzo). Start with a dose high enough to produce sleep. Before you use any benzo, make sure you're aware of how often it can be safely taken. Different benzos have different dosing schedules. Taper your Valium dosage down after each day. The goal is to get through day 4, after which the worst WD symptoms will subside. You shouldn't need the Valium after day 4 or 5.
During detox, hit the hot bath or Jacuzzi as often as you need to for muscle aches. Don't underestimate the effectiveness of hot soaks. Spend the entire time, if necessary, in a hot bath. This simple method will alleviate what is for many the worst opiate WD symptom.
Use the Imodium (immodium) aggressively to stop the runs. Take as much as you need, as often as you need it. Don't take it, however, if you don't need it.
At the end of the fourth day, you should be waking up from the Valium and experiencing the beginnings of the opiate WD malaise. Upon rising (empty stomach), take the L-Tyrosine. Try 2000 mgs, and scale up or down, depending on how you feel. You can take up to 4,000 mgs. Take the L-Tyrosine with B6 to help absorption. Wait about one hour before eating breakfast. The L-Tyrosine will give you a surge of physical and mental energy that will help counteract the malaise. You may continue to take it each morning for as long as it helps. If you find it gives you the "coffee jitters," consider lowering the dosage or discontinuing it altogether. Occasionally, L-Tyrosine can cause the runs. Unlike the runs from opiate WD, however, this effect of L-Tyrosine is mild and normally does not return after the first hour. Lowering the dosage may help.
With breakfast, take the mineral supplement.
As soon as you can force yourself to, get some mild exercise such as walking, cycling, swimming, etc. This will be hard at first, but will make you feel considerably better.
PLEASE NOTE: If you have any medical complications, first check with your doctor before detoxing to verify that this regimen is safe for you.
Green Eyes, just keep posting.......you will receive some terrific support and info, from a bunch of truly caring people.
percs
There probably is a place for tough love, but perhaps some people require a lit'l bit of kid-glove handling......isn't it dangerous to pigeon hole everyone into the same category, of whiners?
"....I'll tell you to go kill yourself......???" seems a lit'l extreme to get the point of sucking it up a lit'l, don't you think?
SABIAN
Believe me, i was the same(lucky), bashing back anywhere from 4 to 8 grams of tylenol per day with the percs.
I assume 80 mgs are the greenies??? ....only got up to the 40's(orange) a couple times.
Continued Strength to you Friend!!!!!
percs
thanks for the kind words
I have to make the comment about 'whiners'. When you have children and responsibilities like careers, it's hardly 'whining' to come to a board that is based upon helping ohters succeed in their sobriety and tell you story and pour your heart out. I certainly hope that anyone reading Olin's post hasn't made any lurkers leary of posting their own stories to get help. Suicide is NOT a matter to be taken lightly. I've been fighting with these own demons for almost 2 years and we are all SO different in how we can handle this situation, so pigeonholing cannot be done here.
Greeneyedgirl, if there is any way you can take just a couple of days off to either c/t or taper, these would be my suggestions. Do you have any close family members who can help you out, or perhaps and in/out patient clinic that can administer Clonidine and other non-addictive meds to help you through it.
I want to ensure you that I'm not advocating a painless withdrawal. I don't see how in the hell a painless w/d can happen regardless of WHAT you do. We all still have the aftermath of what we've done to ourselves to contend with. Detoxing off of Methadone and almost killing yourself - well, I'm positive you want others to say that you are a very strong and valiant man for doing it the 'hard way'. But you very well could have died, and you wouldn't be here today. If there are tools at our disposal, we should utilize them, in addition to intense emotional counseling (AA/NA, etc.).
So if you do cold turkey, you won't die, but it will be uncomfortable at best. I still think, and it's my opinion that there is enough to deal with later that the w/d should be made as comfortable as possible without drugs if one can do so.
I just really cringe when I hear that someone who comes here for help and is at their wit's end is called a whiner - we've all been through various stages of opiate/benzo, etc. withdrawal I believe, and we all know how horrible it is, especially after you have a couple of relapses under your belt. If it were that easy, there would be no relapses.
There are addictionologists that can help as well - perhaps you could make arrangements to see one? I just want to see you get better. I'm in the same predicament as you are. I'm on such a low dose of buph that I could quit - but there are some incredibly stressful family problems I've gone through (whiner!) like 2 deaths in the family, my Mother's illness, loss of career, etc. Trying to overcome all of these obstacles is incredibly hard, and I'm not going to say that I should just suck it up and go on, because when I did that before, I ended up using those hydros even more. It's the nature of the beast, so I realize that although some may feel that people 'coddle' other's here because they relate their own experience to other people's, you have to look at all angles and realize we are all different people with different lives.
Please keep posting - I know where you're at and have contemplated what you have as well. It's getting worse, not better and I will not go down that road. Take good care of yourself and let us know how you're doing please.
Alexis
I am a professional drummer with a couple of decades of constant touring and recording under my belt. (Sabian, I wonder if your in music as well?) I have been using various pain killers for a very long time. When I broke my right hand while on tour five years ago, getting the drugs of my choice became too easy. although being a hard hitting drummer for so long and having this new "lagitament" problem, I knew I was in trouble. My habbit grew out of control and I couldn't keep enough in stock, creating constant feelings of terror. went through a detox, was ok for a week after, went back on the pills, went back to the doctor I had while in detox. At this time I'm quit freaked out because of being this hooked and am really looking for help. He put me on 80 mgs. of oxycotten for two months , then tapered them at 20 mgs. per month there after. After taking 80 mgs for two months, my first month at 60 was a bit tough and I started doubleing up on my doses.. When I went in for my scritp of 20 mgs. they handed me a letter stating that the office no longer prescribed narcotics and refered me to another. I was on my way to the airport for a show in New York and it was after 5pm. I completely freaked! I used every source possible to try to not be so sick but my tolerance was so high that even 5 10mg, percosets wouldn't take the sickness away.This was after going 3 days without anything. Try flying around the country while going through withdrawls..Very bad! My daily use was just incredible so the next time I had 10 days off, I went to another detox.Since I couldn't go to a regular methadone maintance program and I had records of my hand problems, I was welcomed at a pain magement doctors office. I told him honestly about my past and he put me on methadone. they made me sick and he thought I wasn't getting enough. I was very sick from day one of this. I ended up quiting the very well known group I was with because of being sick all the time. My last visit with him, I told him I was weening off. I cut my dosage in less than a quarter of what I was taking. I thought since I was sick all the time anyway, how much worse can it be? When I inquired about my next script, the office informed me that the doctor had left (he had given his notice before my last visit and didn't tell me)they also told me that the new doctor would not see me and to not call again! I said f- them and was going to do it on my own. I thought I had it beat after 3 days. I had been sick as what all but thought it was going to be fine. Then it hit me!! In all the withdrawls I had experienced before, this was so much worse!
That docter had prescribed me 3,800 10 milligram tabs in 6 months. I couldn't sleep at all for weeks, everything hurt so damn bad. Felt like my bones were being pulled through the skin .
I couldnt get to feeling better and had used any and all money saved. Had borrowed to the stopping point. After months of this I had to work, I can't believe it but I went back on the pain killers...Just can't "find my old self".I've been going to another pain managment doctor getting narcon. Here's my delima, I have stopped using them twice in the last 3 months only to go through withdrawl hell. it feels like i never start feeling better when I've stopped. its as if I can't live with them or without them. My intake is so much that I just can't believe I'm still breathing. The guilt is just killing me from using and now I have a great oppertunity to get my career started again. I have a doctors appt. in 5 days.
Should I get enough to ween off? Should I get other drugs to help with the pain of the withdrawls because I'll be in L.A. playing music? Even though I've gone through withdrawls upteen times, obviously I'm not doing it the right way. Oxic, could you help with the tapering? Or anyone for that matter. By reading your recepe, you obviously know. I would love to talk to everybody here. I'm very sorry for taking up so much room with my post. There are so many experiences that have been left out. My goal is to beat this and help others in any way possible. I'm very happy to have found this place and feel with no doubt that help can be given as well as received here.
Thanks for your time.
Kevin
I hope you're doing O.K. I've been a little out of the loop lately & just caught your post today. Everybody pretty much covered you though. Just wanted to send some well wishes. A question though. You said the doc's office called & said they notified the cops that you've been calling in your own scripts. How could they possibly know? I doubt you used your real name...did you? I would think that it'd be too time consuming & costly to actually pursue a case against you without actual proof. So if you used a phony name, I don't think there'd be much to worry about. Could be wrong though. I HOPE that things work out for you Lady...I know we've had our differences in the past but I'd never wish the pain you feel on anybody.
FINISHED!!
Not everyone can smash bricks on there head.
I like to think I am pretty tough and can be a real ***** at times. But why rage on some poor soul?
I don't get the people who go back to this **** after being turned inside out, but what the **** do I know.
She seems scared and in pain, have some compasion.
So, where are you at for meds right now(please clarify) OC's/meth/?? and how much???
I think reading your goal of beating this, will ultimately get you there. It all starts with the desire to!!!
FINISHED!!
SABIAN
Percsnomas- I've been taking narcon (hydrocodone 10 mg.)and 10 mg. percs as of lately. The methadone was cut 8 months ago although i swear i can still feel it. Before i started writing this, i took 5 hydro's...Then looked in my "last resort" stash and found only 25 narcon's so, i'm screwed...another round of withdrawls coming up! Man, mentally and phsyicaly i'm just spent.
Sabian- you can see where i'm at once again. The never ending story..On a better note, glad to hear your a Tommy bolin fan! One of the bands i was with knew his family and i met them at a show we did in Canada.His brother is the drummer for Black Oak.
Any words of wisdom would be appreciated.
Green eyed girl, sure hope you are ok. I know first hand where your at. Most of us here do.For starters, this forum is a great place to be!
As Sabian told me, try and ween down if possible. Hey, do you have 25?? we can ween down together. With the help of these kind people (not Olin!! he's`in need of a coke and a smile!)it just might work. You may be in the woods right now but you can still cut your self a path to get out. Be strong!
Olin- I for one could sure use some advise from someone as experienced as you. Not only did you quit cold turkey, you stayed off. That's incredible! Alot of us could really use your strength and wisdome. No one here is week. Looking for help and trying to help is a sure sign of strength!
All the very best to everyone here,
Kevin
You have a copy of the Recipe above(developed by a a very good friend & veteran poster here), which i used when i detoxed off percs. I think a very important part of the whole deal is what to do after you get thru the hardest physical w/d's . Yes pick up a long acting benzo, like Valium or Klonipin, to help you through the first few days, IF YOU DESIRE(Being careful not to extend its' useage past 4-5 days). Another very good drug for detoxing is Clonidine, a blood pressure medication; which has very good w/d masking and anxiety reducing properties. You have to be careful not to bottom out your BP however, so it is to be used carefully. Once thru, those first hellacious days, that is where the L-Tyrosine/B-6 comes into play.....it gets your body going again by stimulating adrenaline production, and in turn your bodys' own pain killer dopamine. My mother in law, who detoxed off vikes/coke/xanax/booze some 4 1/2 months ago, is still taking L-Tyrosine(an amino acid), and claims she has all but eliminated her usual post detox depression!!!
Obviously, there is not a magic formula to make it a painless ride(as you know already), but some steps to at least baffle some of the worst symptoms.
I wish you strength to accomplish your goal Kevin!!!
keep us posted...
Since it's my background I relate it to going to combat.
What's the mission?
What's the goals of your mission?
What tools are needed to complete the mission?
What's needed to combat the unknown aspects (relapse, cravings,etc.)
How to avoid defeat and injury.
Everyone who sets out to fight for THEIR soberity must have a plan. It should include as many allies and partners as possible. It's an old adage...Failure to plan is like planning to fail!
Addiction is our enemy. This forum is one of our allies.
Hey oxyblues, let me know how your tapering is going. Once you get down to a manageable dose of the OC's you should consider switching over to a short-acting opiate. It would make to final part of your taper more manageable. Good Luck
Esmith28, I'm a fellow Southern...Where you from son?
Take care
Peace
Kilo
I can go to a pain managment doctor in 5 days, should i level with him? I think he's in it just for the money and if he thinks i won't be back, why should he help? This doctor i'm talking about is cash only, plus, they have the med.s right there and don't take insurance. That must work well for their bank account..Getting some of their rather large scripts filled can really be a hassle. Anyone who has been to one of these type doctors knows filling two or three hundred of anything narcotic can be tough. They have it right there, for a hefty sum..
As far as your question about telling all at your upcoming Dr.'s appt.; i think you answered your own question with " why would he help?". I've always been real careful about who i tell "all" to, especially in the medical community. I know, I know, some people have had tremendous success working with a doctor/addiction specialist; but volumes of others have had this practice blow up in their face.
Good Luck Friend!!
percs
To the rest of you, Good Luck, and remember Let Go and Let God, I'm proud of you and wish you the best recovery