lethargy 3 weeks later?

I have been about three weeks now without vicoprofen.  I am doing very well overall; and the best part for me is that I even have few cravings (which is what I thought was going to be the worst).  I was only taking about 4-6 a day (only b/c I had a limited supply), but what I am really having trouble with now is the lethary and some depression, the lethary especially.  How long is this part going to last?  I am so close to getting some more "for just a few days" to just not feel this persistent lethargy for just a couple of days.  My life is so full and so busy and it has just been incredibly hard.  Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[OxyDout]

I don't know what to tell you, I would say do not do it!! everyone here is still an addict because they wanted one more pill!! including myself, i'm a complete dumbass, i think i have will power, but I don't.......anyway, struggle through it!!! it will only get worse as you delay it.  Anyway, I can't say much, I'm going to NY for the weekend, and I'm in the hunt for anything right now, i don't want to go through withdrawal while on the road with friends, they have no idea about my issues........ does anyone know where I can get my hands on Buprenex?? or whatever it is........

GWH

[Witchywoman]

Hi lanas,
First of all, congratulations on being clean this long!
Ah the lethargy...it is really  nasty, isn't it?  I have a few questions for ya about it. First, are you taking any nutritional supplements? when I withdrew from a 200mg a day habit (last august I was up to somewhere around 25-30 vicoprofens a day, I can't do math in my head but I think that was around 200mgs a day, lol) I had lethargy that lasted about a week, maybe two, after the initial wd week.

I was taking the L-tyrosine, 5 htp, a strong multimineral and multivitamin capsule, and excercising.  Also, was trying to be sure to eat well, ie, plenty of protein and moderate carbs.  All these things help to restore the body to it's normal energetic state, but it does take a while. I think it also is different for different people, depending on your body chemistry.

But if you are not taking supplements, try them, they may make all the difference for you.  If you are not excercising, try adding it in, even if it is just a ten minute walk. Every little bit helps.
The hardest part really is not the detox, it is the daily decision to stay clean, especially right in the phase where you are, when the lethargy has not yet lifted.  If you hang in there, you will soon feel normal again.  I had forgotten how good it feels to just feel normal energy. It really is better. We just have to pay the energy deficit for all that false energy we got from the hydro for so long.  But you will feel better.
Hang in there and be proud of yourself for making it this long!

love,
WW

[lanas]

Thanks for the response--actually, when I started, I did take the L-Tyrosine and a multi-vitamin.  I didn't really think it was making much difference and stopped it after the first week.  It seems the lethargy has gotten worse in the past week (the third).  I will start up the L-Tyrosine and multi again and see if it helps  You are right; the hydro gives a "false" energy and I know I was needing more to get the same level--that scared me--reading the posts on this forum are what gave me the strength to quit when I did.  But I am definitely feeling the pull to having the "false" energy beating no energy right now.

[JR.]

Hey Lanas,

I, we are proud of your stance in being clean. Think of all of the work and determination that has gotten you there so far. I know about that lethargy. Mine lasted about 1 month. Like Witchy Woman, I too had been dropping major amounts as you have read in my posts. Nutrition, exercise, DETERMINATION(you know, that daily decision to fight the easy way out and we know that this is very strong)and much time on my knees in prayer.

Also to echo WW, the lethargy will pass. We all had to pay the piper but the end result was well worth it. I will stand on that fact. There is nothing like a daily norm of energy as opposed to that "speed effect" I got from the hydro. You will make it. You've done it for 3 weeks now. Energy is just around the corner. Set goals for each day. Remember, taking the easy way out only prolongs the inevitable. You're tired of the vic's and the only way to get away is to GET AWAY.

Remember your career. We have talked about that too. I have soo much energy now and to feel a legitimate TIRED at the end of the day and to sleep like a baby and not wake up with the funk of the world on me far outweighs the pain I(we) suffered in getting off of the meds. If you would like to talk about careers in the future. let me know and we can get together. Just let me know. You hang in there my friend. IT WILL BE WORTH IT. Plenty here can attest to this. I will continue to pray for your continued recovery.

In His Love, JR.~

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

The lethargic state is a pain in the ass.  For me it's like depression and an inability to care for myself, mentally.  Take some "baby steps" and come out into the sunshine again if only for an hour.  We need some human exchange to feel better after all.  There were days when the television was my best friend for hours on end.  I would dread the ring of the phone or the knock on the door...know what I mean?  When you are that sick, it's a very lonely time.  How long this state lasts is up to you and the condition of your mind and body.  Some come out of it in several days and others may take much longer to feel "good" again.  Even with me, it can vary a greatly with a hundred withdrawals under my belt.

The things that you can count on with detox are misery and depression followed by lethargy and downright insanity.  Much the same way we feel when we lose a lover.  How long does it take to get over a long time love affair that ends and we are on the one dumped?  It's a moot question!

Be kind to yourself and try to get into some kind of group where you can share your pain with people who give a damn.  There's AA, NA and many religious approaches for starters.  It does take some effort on your part to find your solutions and lethargy isn't a big help!

J.B.

[lanas]

Thank you for the support--all of you--it really helps to be reminded that others care and are with you.  JB--the hard part about getting involved in AA/NA is that I would have to admit my problem to my family and I simply cannot do that at this point.  I go back and forth about whether or not my husband will support me.  We have a rather turbulent past and it is a bridge I'm not prepared to cross yet.
JR--thank you for your continued prayers; I am a very strong believer in the power of prayer and say many, many times a day.  Funny though, while I have struggled so much with this, I have not thought to pray much about it; now why would that be?  That I don't understand... yes I would like to talk further.  As I have mentioned, mine is a similar line of work--let's just say our paths would have crossed a lot!

Thank you all. I can honestly say that 6 weeks ago this would not even have been an issue for me; first, I would not have been "clean" for 3 weeks, and second, I certainly wouldn't be debating over whether to take anything.  So there is definite progress...

[JR.]

Lanas my friend,

I know that feeling of not being able to tell anyone. I thought that I had hidden my addiction from my family and friends most of whom were doctors and nurses that I frequently came into contact with (?) but I was sorely fooled.

It is a lonely feeling. To repeat something I said in a much earlier post, my fear of discovery and shame of the addiction probably kept me addicted 4 years longer than should have been. Here is something that I have nevr mentioned. November 1998, I had just come back from being off for 2 weeks with a stint in my right kidney due to uric acid stones. I think that all of the vic's were screwing up the ph in my blood and urine and I started to produce the uric acid stones whereas others just get gout. Well, here I am sitting aat my desk, running on vic's and my Sgt. comes to me and asks me to step into his office. He then hands me a piece of paper and asks me what I think about it. The paper was a dictated conversation from my secretary from a phone call that she had received from an anonymous doctor refusing to identify himself.

This doctor was calling for my SGT. to tell him that He, They, at the E.R. of our big hospital around here were afraid of me being a police officer and that I was very addicted to vicodin as dictated by my many visits to the E.R. on duty asking for vics, which they would write me scripts for. I would go in and complain of knee pain, (13 surgeries) and a script with a refill for vic's was written. This anonymous doctor refused 3 times to identify himself but also stated that "they" feared repercussions from me if I found out that "they" had complained about my addiction. My jaw hit the floor and my SGT. asked me "Do you have a problem because if you do then we can get you some help." I looked straight in his eyes and said that I did not and that every visit that I made to the E.R. was for legitimate purposes, all documented and I was also examined each time by the doc's. If they thought that it was a problem then why did they continue to prescribe the pain meds. He replied that he had gone to the E.R. and spoken to the E.R. chief. The E.R. chief stated that this officer is a friend to us and he does not have a problem. Sgt. was satisfied, or at least I thought. I then later went to one of my friend's, an E.R. doc and asked him if my name had been brought up in any of the E.R. staff meetings in a manner consistent with the anonymous phone call and he said that it had. That told me that one of the E.R. doc's had made this call. I still did not believe that I had a problem at that time. I truly believed that if the doc's were writing the scripts then it must be legitimate. Well my whole point of this is that there was a chance to get help but because I did not believe it, even though that little voice came into my head after the phone call, telling me that there may be something to this, I was too afraid to admit anything. The shame that I felt after talking to my SGT. certainly shut down any possibility of my coming forward. Well, you know how it ended. Blessing or curse? Now, I think blessing. At first, I believed curse. Just food for thought in living with this "secret".

When I went to rehab, I met many other professionals like myself, some of whom I had worked with, like NURSES, lawyers etc... It did not matter at that point. We were all in it for the same reason. To get help and find some normalcy to our lives. I DO UNDERSTAND as we all do. Let me know how we can communicate on the profession issue. Again, I do understand. I may be way off base.

In His Love, JR.~

[skipper]

lanas:
hey wey, way to go getting along this far! you've come far enough
along that you should start to notice some changes in your world
(actually the changes are in you)!
so in light of the distance you've come, can you really sanely go
back to the hydro-c? get back on the B6 and l-tyrosine! look into
zink,magnesium,calcium, & manganese. also lots of water (8-12
glasses a day). all of this will help you to feel beter and getting
back to your old (pre-dope) self. the only thing to keep in mind is
this will not happen when you think it should. it will happen at
it's own pace and time table. it will happen though. i honestly be-
lieve things will get beter. maybe somethig good will happen today. if i didn't believe this, and recieve support from my friends on the forum i probably would have had the gun in my mouth and been finished by now! at least give it on more day and keep posting to
us. there is a whole forum of addicts pulling and praying for you!

keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[lanas]

Kip--I KNOW you're right... I have come this far, why would I want to go back?  Why?  WHY????  In your post, your mention numerous supplements; I have Thomas' detox recipe and I should probably look at it again.  Though that in and of itself is a story... copied and pasted it into a word document only to have my computer crash.  Thought it was lost... several weeks went by, suddenly when my husband was using my computer one morning, lo and behold the thing suddenly appears as a "recovered document."  Blew me away--I lied my way through that one.  

JR--I can truly feel the pain of your story.  I have a similar story, though not as direct or as difficult. I have had several "close calls" that have made me think "This is enough! Quit embarrassing and humiliating yourself!"  Then I rationalize it away eventually... I suppose that is the nature of addiction.  If you would like, email me at ***@****.  Thanks.

Again, thanks to all--I have not gotten the script yet--I did call my dr this morning but have not checked with the pharmacy.  Actually, as I am writing this, his office just called--they called it in.  Sheesh...  I do not know what to do.  I mean I know WHAT to do I just don't know if I CAN do it. I am sorry to be rambling... I guess I just need it.

[CATUF]

Boom -- CATUF fell off the wagon on day 31.  I didn't go looking, but a "friend" who owed me money paid me back with an unexpected delivery of 10/500's.  That's the bad news - my wagon was in the ditch Friday, Saturday and Sunday.  I should have just tossed them and written off the debt, but...

The good news is that by Saturday morning I hated the way I felt compared to the feeling of a month-plus with pleanty of sleep, a good diet and at least 3 times a week at the gym. It wasn't that much that was dropped off, and I streatched it through Saturday & Sunday so there wouldn't be a big let down.  There wasn't.

Monday I felt only a bit tired, not even slightly sick.  By Tuesday I was back at the gym and feeling good again.  Now, on Friday, I seem to be back to where I was after 30 days.

On the one hand, I hate the fact that I broke a 30+ day record.  However, I no longer have this nagging feeling that each day added to my record is at the expense of the good time or good feeling I might otherwise have i.e. that I was giving up something of value.  After comparing how I felt Friday night and Saturday morning to how I had felt for the 3 weeks prior, I now don't feel like I'm giving up anything by not using.  Somehow I went over a subtle bump in the road and now seem to grasp emotionally what I have intelluctually known for a long time -- that there are no "pros" on my list of "pros & cons," only "cons."  

One question:  I frequently see in here the comment "keep an angel on your shoulder."  What exactly does that refer to?  

CATUF

[Sadgirl]

Dear All:

Please send me your prayers, strength and love.  It is 4:00 pm on a Friday afternoon, I have been weaning myself off of vicoprofen 7.5 for the past week (I did it the hard way, from 4 pills to 1) No, I haven't been taking large amounts of pills, but believe me the way my ankles and shoulders feel and the stomach cramps the chills...my withdrawal is BIG time!  I have everything in Thomas receipe also took Monday off.  I feel so scared because I know what is coming.  I don't even have the energy to drive home or type these words.  My mind is fogging, yet my heart is racing.  Please send me your light...there are some beautiful people here.  Yes, I am sad girl...because of what I've done to myself.  The worst part is that I am in pain (back problems)and my doctor was only trying to help me.  I called my EAP (Employee Assistant Program) because I feel suicidal..they told me to tell my doctor, so that she can wean me off the correct way...but I feel too embarrassed...So I'll do it myself..the head doctor wants to see how I'm doing on Monday..he gave me something for the anixety.  Sorry I'm rambling...but my mind and body are not here.  Thank you for listening and wish me luck.  Sad girl

[lanas]

CATUF--you give me hope where I am failing right now.  The thing is , I know I will have none for awhile after the 15 given me now.  I will be okay; I've done this many times before.  I just wish I could break the cycle completely which I seem unable to do.  However, it has been a long time since I have gone 3 weeks, so I do think I am making real progress.

Sad girl--you and are alike; I was only taking 4, had gotten up to an occasional 6 a day.  But the wds are still very bad.  Read through the many posts on here; there are many wonderful incredibly supportive people and they really will help you through--REALLY.  And you will be okay; you truly will be.  My daughter and I will say special prayers for you tonight.  Hang in there and keep posting; you will get the support you need.

[Nod]

Cheer up kid, your part of the way home now.  Why not go to your doc and tell him what's going on?  Nothing to lose, everything to gain.  Right?  Your either embarrassed or could it be you don't want your source to dry up.  This is how I was (both).. until this week when I fessed up to the doc and he is helping me ween off.  Guess it was mental but I have felt so much better ever since - mentally and physically.  I was doing 15-20 pills a day (150mg) for over a year (tapperred and relapsed sveral times in between) and now I'm down to just 3/day.  Still feel run down physically and mentally feels like I just had a best freind die. In a way that friend (hydro..aka Morpheus) is our worst enemy, a liar.  When I'm done tapperring I have a battle again but one I'm gonna win.  

Your suicidal feelings are a part of it all, most here have been thru that. You need to let it pass, its not all really you, its the drug.  Please, go fess up to your doc, he/she, if has any compassion at all (which most good ones do,) will help you thru this.  There is also anti depressants to help you as well.  GET RID OF THE SECRETS, that's what gets us and keeps us locked up in our addiction.  

Take care sad girl, keep posting.    Nod

[lanas]

Good for you, Nod.  Good for you.  You are so right about the secret part yet I can't face it.  How did you do it with family?  I just don't know how to do it with family?

Sad Girl--How are you?  Hang in there--post and let us know how you are.  We will be here for you.

[CATUF]

What seems to beat the lethargy for me is eating, sleeping, drinking water (not coffe by the pot) and exercise all on a regular basis.  If I do all I feel so much better (and happier) than I did at the best of times with the 10/500's.  But with the 10/500's I was sure not get enough of any. It's a scary thing when you stop and think about how you get a norm of abusing your body on a regular basis.  If anyone let a child exist with the lack of the MOST BASIC essentials (forget about the drugs), they'd get locked up for child abuse..........

[Nod]

How did I tell my family?  Well I have wife and two childeren who are 1 and 3.  I tried to tell my wife for oever 6 months but chickened out. Why?  because I wasn't ready to say I'm ready to quit.  Once you let the "secret" out there is no turning back. But you know what, its such a good feeling.  The people that love you, love you for you, trust in that (is that a lot of you's or what!)  They will understand and believe in you enough to help.  If not right away they will come around.  

I told my wife as we were laying in the dark in bed about 3 weeks ago.  I fessed up completely.  She knew in a way but not the extremes of my addiction.  I cried. She understood and is still understanding.  She knows I am tapperring down and that I feel crappy.  She also knows that my pain (the reason I started in the first place) is coming back.  But she also knows I'm scared and is helping me.  

If you truely want to get on the road to recovery, you have to get rid of the secrets. Until then your NOT winning the battle.

JR - thank's my friend.  I have often read and gotten much out of your posts in the past.  
NOD

[lanas]

Catuf--what an incredibly simple but profound point. My, my... food for thought for sure.  (thank you).  JR--hope to hear from you very soon; I have so much to share and so much I know you have to give.  I'm off to Neverland (oh if it were only that easy)--but that's what my daughter says.
Sad Girl--I will check on you FIRST THING in the morning.  Take lots of hot baths.  Heck! Spend the night there if you need to!  Be good to yourself, becuse you are doing such great things to yourself that are going to pay off in spades!  My love and prayers are with you.  Remember, it goes slowly, but what you are producing--that is the "you" free of drugs--will only take several weeks to be in near perfect order-----yet it took years to get you in the shape you are currently in.  SO YOU ARE SO FAR AHEAD OF THE "GAME"!!!!!!   You'll be okay... hot baths... lots of water... read... watch movies/tv... post here as much as you can.  We'll be here for you.

[lanas]

I do very much hope to hear from you.  I have much I want to share with you--you and I have more similarities than you are aware.  But the most important are the ones that are the reasons I need to discuss with you.  I do hope to hear from you.  You are incredibly wise and I know I could develop greatly from that wisdom.  I wish I could directly communicate with you right now, actually!  Please be in touch when you can.  And continue you to keep me in your prayers. (somehow I know you will...)

[JR.]

Great advice my friend.

"We are only as sick as our secrets." That was some great advice I learned from my counselor in Rehab. No more secrets. I am as free as free can be. I do not have to hide my eyes any longer for fear that someone may see my pupils. I do not have to fear if someone is going to find me out. I don't have to worry how I can scam another friend out of his/her vic's or another trip to the doctor to complain of "pain". I don't have to worry what impact the discovery of my secret will have on my family or career. The career is gone as a result of that. I don't have to worry if I am going to keep taking enough until it finally kills me either by Over dose or liver failure. I don't have to worry anylonger about my very first thoughts after my eyes opened each day after minimal sleep where I was going to get some more of the vic's. IT'S OVER. Now that's freedom. Thank You my friend for your wisdom. Stand firm and run the race that is set before us. It's called life. There are peaks and valleys. Each day is a training day to prep us for the next challenge in this race. If you remember the movie of Chariots of Fire, Eric Liddles rival, I can't recall his name, was sitting in the bleachers with his girlfriend complaining about just having lost a race to Liddle. He said that he can't run any more. His girlfriend, Sybil, tells him that he can't win if he does'nt run. Man that is as profound as it gets. The way I see it, if your not in the race daily, training and getting into shape, then you're dying and you certainly can't win if you don't run. It's called resolve.

In Christ's Love, JR.~

[Nod]

Schlub,  How are things?  Good I hope.  Curious how the Bup is working, or not working at this point, and how WD's are?
NOD

[Schlub]

Thanks for asking about me, Nod. Because I just had one helluva scary day -- my 19th day off dope, and 5th full day since my last Buprenex. I'm too exhausted to write it all out again, so if it's okay, let me just repost what I wrote to other friends:

This morning I started having tremors. Bad ones. My addiction doctor, who I saw this morning, thought it might be a side effect of the Paxil that I started on so he told me to stop taking it. In addition, I had also taken my first 1/4 dose of Naltrexone, but (as I soon learned) I apparently did it too soon because I was so eager to "get on with my recovery."

Which only added to the problem, of course. By early afternoon I started having convulsive whole body tremors. If I didn't know better, I'd say I was having seizures. My wife wanted to take me to an ER, but I called my doc back and he agreed that's the last place I'd want to go because they wouldn't know what to do. So first we tried a beta blocker (Inderal). No effect. Then Clonidine. No effect. Nuerontin, no effect. Valium, no effect.

The convulsive tremors kept getting worse and worse as the day wore on -- I was flopping around on the bed, literally, like a fish out of water, my whole body convulsing. Meanwhile, my wife is crying in fear of my life and to tell you the truth I was kind of scared shitless myself. I've experienced the shakes of cold turkey withdrawal before, but this was easily 5-10 times more intense. Convulsions is the only word that comes to mind to describe it. I was almost delerious.

So my addiction doc consulted with his partners, and told me the situation was just too dangerous -- I have a blood pressure device at home and my readings were all over the map, as high as 175/110 when I could hold still long enough to get a reading.

So the docs decided to put me back on the Buprenex. Stabilize, taper down, and next time we'll stay away from Paxil and the Naltrexone (until I have at least two weeks with no Bup in my system instead of only 5 days). They insisted this was the safest and wisest course.

My wife went and got the Bup, and in 20 minutes the convulsions subsided. But then, once I could breathe again, my despair rose up -- all this work, and now I'm back at Square One again! You know, I've never been suicidal because that's what my Dad did to me, and ordinarily I'd never even consider doing that to my boy.

But I asked my wife, "Is this how you want to live your life? Look at me, I'm not a proper husband, not a father, I'm just a burden. Be objective," I asked her, "Wouldn't you objectively be better off with a beautiful home and half-a-million dollars?"

She took my hands and told me to be quiet. Then she bent her head and asked God to give me the clarity to see that I am her anchor and that she needs me and that she has zero doubt -- ZERO! -- that I will recover in time. Ups and downs, mostly downs now, and hard times ahead. But in the end, she said she knows who I am. Who I really am. And she said she has absolute faith in me. No doubt at all. We're in it together, and it's my turn to lean on her now. But don't worry, she said, there'll come a time when she needs to lean on me, maybe for months, maybe years. But right now I need her, and she's here for me.

So that's my story for today. It was without a doubt the worst day of my life -- even worse than that day 15 years ago when some Muslim militants kidnapped me and staged a mock execution on me -- but it was also in some ways the best day of my life.

I'm exhausted. I'm not sure going back on the Bup was right. It seems wrong, but then again, I was truly frightened that I was going into seizures and so were the docs.

So what does it mean? To steps forward, one step back, then hopefully two steps forward again?

I hope so, dear God. I'm so overwhelmingly tired of this. But thank God at least that I don't have to hide anymore. I've said it before; I'll say it again: IT'S OUR SECRETS THAT KILL US!

If I wasn't open with my wife and doc, I might have died today.

So you see, Nod, I am so happy you told your wife and doctor. I guarantee you that when the difficult depressive days and weeks come, you will see how unbelievably awful it would be to have to try to hide your suffering from your wife. Now you don't have to. You can lean on her, and be loved and cared for.

Thank God for my wife, and for all of you.

That's all I really know for sure right now.

[stars]

LANAS....  HEY!!! THREE WEEKS FOR MYSELF ALSO!  I AM SO HAPPY!  EVERYDAY I FEEL BETTER AND BETTER!!  I AM ALLOWING GOD TO LEAD THE WAY AND NOT THE VICODIN!  FEELS SO GOOD TO SLEEP AGAIN, AND I HAVE MORE ENERGY WITH EACH DAY...  I THINK WHAT HELPED ME THE MOST WAS I WAS ALREADY ON ANTI-DEPRESSANTS BEFORE I STOPPED MY 20+ A DAY HABIT...  I HAVENT HIT ANY REAL LOWS...  I HAVE NO CRAVINGS AT ALL...  I HAVE BEEN DRINKING TONS OF WATER AND STARTED EXCERCISING EVERYDAY...  MOSTLY THREADMILL AND LIGHT WEIGHTS.  IT WAS WEIRD TODAY WHILE I WAS WORKING OUT MY SWEAT STARTED TO BREAK AFTER ABOUT 20 MINUTES AND I COULD SMELL THE VICODIN STILL LEAVING MY PORES...  MADE ME WORK OUT EVEN ALITTLE BIT HARDER...  I AM VERY PROUD OF YOU LANAS...  WE HAVE DONE THE RIGHT THING!  I FEEL LIKE I'VE MISSED SO MUCH...  PLEASE DONT LOOK BACK... KEEP ONE FOOT IN FRONT OF THE OTHER...  I WILL PRAY FOR YOUR STRENGHT TO CONTINUE TO CARRY THROUGH THIS TIME IN YOUR LIFE...

SADGIRL!!!!!  YOU HANG IN THERE KIDDO!!!  NOTHING IN LIFE IS WORTH MAKING IT YOUR DECISION TO REMOVE YOURSELF FROM IT!  JUST YOU COMING HERE THIS EVENING IN DESPERATION MEANS THAT YOUR NOT WILLING TO GIVE UP!  I WISH I COULD HUG YOU AND HOLD YOU...  TO TELL YOU THAT YOU WILL BE OKAY...  I REMEMBER MY FIRST DAY WITHOUT AND I FELT JUST LIKE YOU HAVE DESCRIBED...  PLEASE KNOW YOU ARE NOT ALONE... WE ARE ALL HERE FOR YOU..  WE WANT TO HELP YOU...  WE WANT TO HELP EACH OTHER!  THE MOST IMPORTANT THING YOU NEED TO DO IS START LOVING YOURSELF!  CONTACT YOUR DOCTORS...  I DID THAT THE 3RD DAY AFTER I QUIT...  CALLED MY DR.  CALLED MY PHARMACY... CALLED MY DENTIST...  AND I JUST TOLD MY REGULAR G.P. DOCTOR THIS PAST WEEK, ONLY TO FIND OUT THAT HE HAD GOTTEN STRUNG ON VICODIN ALSO....  OUT OF ALL THE DOCTORS I HAVE I GOT ONLY ONE SEMI NEGITIVE RESPONSE...  BUT THAT IS FROM THE DOCTOR WHO PRESCRIBES MY ANTIDEPRESSANTS...  I UNDERSTOOD HER THOUGH!  COMING CLEAN IS IMPORTANT... IT IS AWAY OF TOTALLY CLEANSING YOURSELF...  YOUR FREEING YOUR MIND...  TURN YOUR MIND AND EYES TO GOD...  LET HIM BE YOUR GUIDE...  IF YOU FULLY GIVE YOURSELF TO HIM HE WILL LIGHT YOUR PATH TO RECOVERY...  I COULD NOT HAVE MADE IT THIS FAR WITHOUT HIM....  HE IS SO AWESOME!  SWEETGIRL (I'M GONNA CALL YOU SWEETGIRL)....  PLEASE HANG TIGHT!  WE ARE STRONGER THAN OUR ADDICTIONS!  THERE IS PROOF OF THAT HERE...  I AM GOING TO HAVE YOU ON MY MIND ALL THE TIME..  I WILL DELIVER YOU UP IN PRAYER...  LOVE YOURSELF SWEETGIRL...  YOUR WORTH LOVING...  CONSIDER YOURSELF HUGGED...  I WILL BE CHECKING ON YOU...  

J.R.  ALWAYS A JOY TO SEE YOU HERE...  YOUR STORY NEVER CEASES TO AMAZE ME!  I ADMIRE YOU SO MUCH...  THREE WEEKS MY FRIEND!!!  I FEEL SO GOOD...  THANK YOU J.R. FOR ALL YOU OFFER HERE... YOUR TESTIMONY IS AN INSPIRATION TO US ALL...  I KNOW YOUR DOING WELL BECAUSE "HE" LIVES INSIDE YOU!  

PEACE, PRAYERS AND LOVE TO ALL....  STARS

[Seamstress]

If the Buprenex stopped the siezures I'd say you're doing the right thing.  It's always two steps forward, one step back with recovery, but remember the progress is forward.

Your wife sounds wonderful and supportive and with her behind you and with your motivation, I have no doubt you will make it. So it will take a little longer than you thought.  You should try a taper off of benzos.  That takes months and you think it will never end.  The goal is to detox safely with no physical damage and it sounds like that's what you're doing.  The smart thing.

This too shall pass.

[Schlub]

Thank you Seamstress. As always, as ever, you are very kind. Yes, it's a disappointing setback, but the main thing is I'm still not using dope or getting high. And besides, since when does everything happen the way we addicts want it, too?

Stars, I don't know you but your brief story is very encouraging even in the small little details you talk about. For example, I'd never really thought about drinking lots of water -- but it makes sense that it could really help flush out toxins and bring an end to the lethargy sooner.

And by the way, 20 years ago when I got clean for the first time (and stayed quite happily clean for the next 18 years), I distinctly remember about a month later I finished a five mile run and was cooling off when I went "Whoa ... I can smell the dope coming out of my pores!"

At the time I thought I was imagining it -- sort of like how we have dope dreams of still using after we quit, as a way of putting that part of our lives behind us.

But now, 20 long years later, you have convinced me that I really did smell it, coming out of the pores of my reinvigorated body. Imnagine that!

[cindi]

i remember thinking I was crazy to when i smeedl the stuff oozing out of my pores along time ago,,,i took massive amounts so it only stands to reason they ave to be excreted from somewhere...demerol is very nasty in the sniffer department.........love cin

[skipper]

Catuf:
your question, "what does "keep an angel on yor shoulder""mean?
is a good one. last summer i started signing off on my posts with
this expession. i think other people use it occasionall, which is ok by me, cause i stole it any way. the line comes from a song written by Tom Russell called "Box of Visions." here's the whole thing:

I'll give to you a box of visions
i'll give to you a jar of hearts
I'll lemdend to you the gypsy's ear
To hear the Sacred Harp

I'll give to you a house of mirrors
A thousand eyes, they belong to you
A labyrinth of wild roses
I know you'll find your own way through
Wait a while and you'll grow older
Never mind what the old folks say
just keep an angel on your shoulder
Never throw your dreams away
They might save your lif one day

A song is just a box of visions
You can't unlock it with a key
A message rolled up inside a bottle
And dropped into the salty sea

A song is just a box of vision
A jar of hearts, a gypsy's ear
A labyrinth of wild roses
A journey through the house of mirrors
Wait awhile and you'll grow stronger
Never mind what the sad folks say
Just keep an angel on your shoulder
Never throw your dreams away
They might save your life one day
-Tom Russell-
from: "box of Vision"

the best version is on "the long way around" on hightone records.
(he does in a duet witj Iris Dement.


hope that clears it up for you and
keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[lanas]

Schlub--You should NOT feel like you failed anything at all; be happy you are alive! That is a very scary story and you are still well on your way to recovery so be happy you can see the sun shine today (at least it is here).

Nod--your story is so incredible; how I wish I knew what my husband's reaction would be... I am just not ready.  You have me wondering; I've got to think about it--is it that I am truly worried about his reaction or is it that I'm not ready to have to truly give it up?  Hadn't thought about it that way before.

CATUF--I am happy to say that I have had a similar experience (thank God).  Took 3 pills over the later afternoon and early evening yesterday) and had several glasses of wine.  Felt great! It felt so good to feel so great!  Did so many things... woke up this morning feeling like absolute ****.  I mean I can hradly move.  So perhaps this regression will have proven to be a very positive step on this long road to ultimate recovery.  I really think God had to be watching over me because when I read your post about what happened to you, I literally thought "oh how I wish that would happen to me!"  But it never ever had in the past.  So I guess I'll see how well my body lets me remember.  But I have felt far worse this morning than I was yesterday when I first started complaining on here.  I was actually thinking "If I could only go back to where I was yesterday morning.... please..."

[lanas]

STARS!!!!  I meant to add (and hit posted before I did!)--that I am still with you... I regressed one night, but I am back with you; keep letting me know how you are and I am going to try to stay with you from now on, okay?  You give me hope...

[Nod]

Schlub, hang in there my friend.  Its not like you failed anything or anyone.  This setback was not from you failing but you succeeding.  Its just a part of the process on the long road to recovery.  Hell, your just about there. Don't get down on yourself.  Sounds like you just went thru one heck of an experience, but that will make you that much stronger when you make it all the way thru.  You have a great wife, caring doctor, and us here who all care about you.  Your gonna make it, the secrets out.   Keep us posted,  NOD

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

God yes! Don't try to hide anything because it will likely be your end.  Remember that you cannot do anything on your own.  If you were able, you wouldn't be posting here. Realize that everything, every effort, every good intention, every sworn promise, every, every, every, every has gotten us all here one way or another.  We just don't operate on our own energy that amounts to a hill of beans. That's simply put enough for most of us. In spite of my best efforts, I'm here!

J.B.

[Schlub]

Bronzeback -- just stop. Now. Don't commit to stopping for good. Just stop taking any more today or tomorrow. Let your head clear. Figure out what you really want to do -- whether you're ready to stop being a slave or need more time. But it's not an all or nothing thing here. You took some; it doesn't mean that therefore you've got to go back to your addiction whole hog.

Just stop. Now. For one day. You've got the whole rest of your life to start taking oxys again. Just don't do it today, and give your future some thought.

Nod, as always, you're a good friend to me. There's something very encouraging about your words to me, even though we don't know each other at all. I actually do believe I'm going to make it. With a wife like mine, who wouldn't?

Oh man, what if I was still trying to keep it secret? I'd be dead for sure.

And for Lanas, let me just say that I don't recall anyone on this forum saying that they wished they hadn't told their spouse. Just the opposite. Every story I've heard goes like this: "I couldn't believe his (her) reaction. He (or she) was totally with me and a huge weight was lifted from me."

[bronzeback75]

Guys i need your help 23 days off oxycontin And i screwed it up taken 80 mg already need to stay strong help me please i feel so weak please pray f or me

[jennyfla]

Hi Schlub,
I just woke up, it's about 2:15 am here sunday morning and i walked over the computer that i kept on after falling asleep on the couch.
Now i'm up with my 2-year old, she seems to have rader always knowing when i'm awake.
I just read your story and all i can say is (((HUGS)))!!!
I'm thankful that you do have your wife, and understand that even when you can't understand why they would want to still be by your side after everything, understand that it is the love that your wife has for you that will help bring out the love you have for yourself!!!  I know you are appreciating her love big time right now, but know that you are worth it too!
I will say a prayer asking that you make your way to the other side with alittle less pain now, and i think everything is going to be ok for you!!!
You're gonna make it, and this isn't back to square one, you are on your way!!!!!
Lv Jenny

[jennyfla]

well i'm still up and so is my 2-year old sigh!
I need to go to sleep.
I feel my body getting weaker and weaker from all these drugs, i barely eat lately, just can't keep food down even when i do eat.
I start envisioning what i'm doing to my body then i feel like i am dieing, my heart aches sometimes (which might be real, might not, i don't know anymore).
I'm afraid of dieing and this only brings on anxiety.
Yesterday, i had such a bad anxiety attack i thought i was on my way out, i didn't know what it was.  I got up from the couch and started walking, i could hardly feel the ground, i had chest pains, etc.  My husband told me it was anxiety and quick gave me 1/2 of valium.  I usually take 1/4, so i has very very tired and could hardly stay awake the rest of the night, but i felt better, so i knew he was right, it was only anxiety.
It started out by talking about money.  We're low on meds and we are needing to 'buy' some at higher prices, if you know what i mean.  That's when i started to feel strange.  I didn't even recognize it as anxiety, but my husband knew exactly what it was, but it was still scarey!
I still know i'm killing myself, and i have three children to care for, i have a responsibility! I'm a fool for doing what i'm doing with this responsibility of caring for my children, which is very important to me!  I can't go anywhere yet, i have so much more to do.
Better get my butt to bed before i bring on another episode.  Anxiety and fear suck!!!!
(((HUGS))) and sweet dreams to all our there.
To all detoxing, know that you are on your way to a better life, if you can make it through the rough days, you will be rewarded with the gift of being able to live on the other side, away from the world of darkness!!!!
Lv Jenny

[Monti]

12 yrs ago I started using Vicodin ES for migraine headaches, that happened about once a month.  My husband at the time had a herniated disc and was freely given the Vicoden.  That was the way I was able to get them so easily.  I remember the first time I took one, my headache went away.  Unfortunately, I began to have alot of migraines, or did I really?  Over the past 12 years I have struggled with this addiction.  However, I have discovered, I am an Addict.  This is truly a disease.  My drug of choice was Vicoden, always, but I tried many others before I hit my first bottom in 1998.  I can only guess at the amount I was using.  I know that 30 Vicoden ES did not last over 12 hours. I continued to work in my profession during all this time.  I don't know how I did the job, but I did.  I must correct that.  I did the job buy keeping at least 30 a day in my system, I could not function without them.  I tried many times to detox at home.  I would usually make it through the worst.  But within a day or so, I thought I could handle Just ONE. Every single time I put ONE in my body, at least SIX would follow, and I was right back where I left off.  This is a progressive disease.  Finally, I realized, I needed help and called my EAP at work.  I was assessed and put into a 28 detox center.  I did that 6 times that year.  I kept changing jobs, so I could use the insurance.  The last one was not a detox, it was the psyc ward.  I tried to committ suicide but taking about 30 xanax.  My sister found me and I remember waking up in the hospital.  I did not know why I was there.  I called for a nurse and was told what happened.  I said I want to leave now, but was informed that I could not leave until the JUDGE let me.  I was involuntary committed. Finally, I got out and went back to my lover, vicoden.  I was in a 12 step program, that helped, but I always relapsed.  I thought moving would help, so I moved 19 times between 1989 and 1993.  Everywhere I went there I was doctor shopping again.  This was my life, going to at least 3 different doctors a day.  Finally in 93 I ended up in FL. I had hit yet another bottom.  I took my Dad's pain meds, he has cancer and I just did not even care.  The addiction had control of my whole life.  My Dad called me about 3am and asked if I took his pills, of course I denied this.  After hanging up the phone, something came over me and I drove about 2 hrs to his home in FL, walked in the house, put the pills on the table.  My Dad was sitting in his recliner awake in alot of pain.  I felt so bad, all I could say is I am sorry and walked out.  The next day I checked into yet another detox for 10 days this time.  I got off the Vicoden for awhile, to only relapse again.  I was taking at least 40 a day by now, which is a fulltime job.  I never bought from the streets.  I hit the Emergency Rooms to get demoral alot, when I had trouble getting the Vic.  Finally, I went back to a twelve step program and managed to get 2 yrs clean.  I recently relapsed and was worse than any other relapse.  I had not been drug free in two yrs, but the disease had progressed over that period so fast, that I picked up again where I left off, within 2 weeks I was up to 20 a day.  I should have overdosed because my body had been free of this drug for two years.  I started doing things I never did before.  I could not work like I did before, I am on the verge of being fired.  I altered an RX and got caught.  My 22 yr old daughter found my pills and called the pharmacy.  The pharmacy called the doctor and you know the story, however, by God's grace, they did not press charges.  This really scared me but I continued to use. I would go to other drugs (street drugs like crack), when I could not get the Vic.  All this time I continued to go to my 12 step meetings even though I was using.  I finally decided to go back into another detox just last week.  I went in on Thurs and was out on Sunday.  I was given a detox drug called Buprinex.  It was a miracle drug for me, because I did not have the withdrawals that I had in past detox centers.  I have been clean 8 days now but I have wanted to use every day.  Like I said, I am in a 12 step progam and it is the only thing I have found to help me stay clean.  I managed to stay clean 2 yrs with the program, but I slacked up on meetings, calling my sponsor, and other recovering addicts, and my disease became my higher power once again.  I struggle as I write this because my body still craves, but I am calling my sponsor, my recovering friends and going to meetings everyday.  I know I cannot take one of Vic or any other drug for that matter.  I did this once, and I know I can do it again, ONE day at a time, with the help of God and the 12 step program.  Abstinence does not equal recovery.  For me, I need to change my whole life, thinking, behaviors and ask for help to stay clean.  Most importantly, I have to have my God in my life.  This only scratches the surface of the life I have lived thus far, because of the disease of addiction.  I truly hope this will help someone.  If it only helps one person, this is truly a blessing.
Give yourself a break, get off the drugs however you can.  It helped me to get in the program of recovery while I was detoxing.  My belief is I only have a daily reprive from the disease of addiction.  I have to take it sometimes 5 minutes at a time since the relapse.  Each relapse gets worse due to the progressive nature of the disease of addiction.  I know that if I do not put the drug in my body, JUST FOR TODAY, I have a chance at recovery.  For me, I have accepted this is a lifelong, progressive, incurable disease, but with a twelve step progam in my life, I get a daily reprive.  As addicts, we can recover and stop using drugs, but as I said for me, I know that this disease will be with me until I die.  However, I would like to die CLEAN.
To anyone reading this, you too can have recovery, but you have to want it more than you need it.  Try a Twelve Step Program.  I never mentioned the one I go to but you can figure it out.  I did not drink than much, so I found the other program and it works for me.  However, keep this in mind, ALCOHOL is a DRUG. The program I am a member of states any mood, mind altering substance is a drug, including alcohol and marijanna.  One is too many and a thousand is never enough.  When I put one drug in my body, I release my addiction all over again.  That's where I am right now.  But I have hope because I know things will get better each day as long as I don't use.

I know this is a long message.  You can do this.  Try it for 90 days and see if it works for you.

[Schlub]

Wow, what a story!

Buprenex saved my life, too.

But the main thing I get from your story is this: as long as there's breath in you, you have a chance.

Human beings are never static, never doomed. We get up, we fall down. Some of us do this dozens of times -- so often, in fact, that we begin to think we're destined to always fail at recovery.

But it's not true. For almost all of us who stay alive, there comes a day when we really do find our freedom. Often it requires some sort of awakening -- via 12 step or not -- that shows us recovery is not just about abstinence. It's about rediscovering life.

Did you know that addicts have almost exactly the same recovery rate as diabetics and high blood pressure sufferers? Just as many fail to stick to their diets and treatment regimens each year as the percentage of addicts who relapse. But most eventually get there.

Never give up hope, not while you have breath in you.

[Seamstress]

I really related to your story.  I, too, went a significant period of time in AA recovering from alcoholism.  I got away from the program and started to abuse Xanax.  You are so right about the disease progressing even though we're not using.  It truly amazed me.  Not that I cared.  Finally, I got off the Xanax and was off about 3 months.  I didn't go to meetings or do anything to hold onto my sobriety.  Again, I relapsed.  Again, the progression was incredible.  In three months my tolerance had tripled without me taking a single pill.  Figure that one out.  So here I am, third attempt but this time I am very serious. I'm back in AA.  I'm seeing a psychiatrist and I have learned my lesson that there can be no more just one pill. Just one pill always leads me back to full blown addiction.  I can't even guess what my tolerance would be if I started again.  I'd probably have to take an entire prescription at one time :)

[Ketta]

Llans, I agree, you sound like you have a virus not withdrawls. Ultram or vic.s wouldn't do the things you're describing with what you took. See your doc. coughing up blood is no good. allergies, and flu/virus can make you dizzy and achey (achy)...walking pneumonia(sp?) is the other thing that has those symptoms. Get it checked out.

Monti, wow., You are in my prayers. Thanks for sharing. Ketta.

[Seamstress]

I think you should go see a doctor.  Coughing up blood sounds very scary to me. The only time I ever coughed up blood, I had pneumonia and I was also a heavy smoker. I wouldn't fool around with something like that. You could have some kind of virus or infection going on.  Let us know what happens.

[Monti]

Thanks for the comments.  This is day eight since the detox.  It has been a hard week.  I am still having some slight withdrawals, but I choose not to use that first drug, one day at a time.  We all have a common bond.  ADDICTION.  Keep talking about it.  It's time to attempt working today.  Please keep me in your prayers, as I will keep all addicts in mine. I will keep in touch.  I am so grateful to have found this sight.

[lanas]

I'd like to a dd a question here--I have had some really bizarre things happening the past few days.  I fell off and took 3 vicoprofen on Friday.  Right before I did, I was extremely anxious; jittery inside, tremors--shakes; very weird stuff for me.  I'd walk across the room and be out of breath.  Sat morning, I woke up sick as a dog--thought what a great thing! Pills made me sick! HOOray!  I won't want to go back so readily.... well I was sick as a dog all day Sat and Sun.  Spent most of Sat in hot baths.  Very nauseas, and pain in my stomach.  Still very very achey (achy) all over.  Sun had progressed to very little nausea, stomach just felt sore; but extreme fatigue and tiredness.  Very light-headed and dizzy (almost passed out several times); trmors and jitters comtinued.  Then chest started hurting and now I'm coughing up a littl blood.  Now, can somebody explain what in the hell all of this is?  Or should I be on on eof those other forums... BUt the bottom line of all of this is that I really feel awful.  I am not in wds because I am still taking ultram... someone let me know if they have any thoughts.  Thanks.

[cindi]

you said you are taking ultram so you don't feel you are in withdrawals,,,the coughing up bleed is definately not a good sign..you say you are short of breath?  this may sound a little gross but are you coughing up blood that is pink tinged sort of foamy or grothy?  have you ever been diagnosed befroe as having Cpngestive heart failure? are you retaining water?  this really is nothing to pay around with,,,i would certainly get it checked out as soon as possible     ~~~cindi~~~

[lanas]

Thanks for the comments--it was the middle of the night when this happened (the blood part) and I was really freaking out.  I feel better this morning and have stopped the coughing up stuff part, though my chest is achey (achy) still and the rest of me still feels bad.  I still have the migraine too (LOL).  Cindi--(the stuff I was coughing up (sorry to be so descriptive) was phlegm and then some just blood but it was much smaller quantities--all very very thick); no I've never had congestive heart failure; only thing at all is I have mitral valve prolapse that was diagnosed as an infant and that is very minor (just have to have antibiotics prior to any surgeries, etc.).  I've also always had very low blood pressure (good low blood pressure).  I don't know what is going on--I'm thinking some virus (I already had the flu this winter).  Walking pneumonia did cross my mind too. Thanks for the comments; I really was just freaking out last night!  It has also been about four days of feeling really lousy too.

[stars]

Hey you guys......  Has anyone seen sadgirl?  I am outta my body with worry!!!!

[stars]

schlub...  thank you for addressing my message and i appreciate your input.  and yeah the water is doing wonders!  i think just the fact that its helping my liver and kidneys...  i wish you peace...  :)

lanas.....  you need to get to the doctor!  don't mess around...  i believe when we are quitting it does havoc on our bodies.  i just remember my first week, week and a half i felt like i had been hit by a truck.  wasnt an easy process but i feel so much better...  going on my 4th week this thursday.  still zero cravings...  its awesome to be clean!!!  no looking back..  God is at my side..  please know that i'm thinking of you and want badly for you to be free, as i do with everyone on here who is struggling..  this life is short..  blink of an eye.  look deep within, you are a gift!  love to you...

bronzeback...  how are you?  thinking of you alot also..  please be strong, we need you here.  the things you say are very important...  i am concerned about you and i am praying very hard for you.  self love and overcoming your addiction IS possible...  look to God..  open yourself to Him completely, and He will help you.  only way i could get through the last 4 weeks...  you are loved...  wish i could hug you...  pray to be free!  

monti.... you also are in strong prayer.  keep your chin up.  try to understand and realize what in life really makes you happy?  remember that feeling before you became addicted.  even if you have to go back to when you were a child.  right before i quit i took out my old family pictures and concentrated on pictures of myself when i was very young...  that really helped me see more of who i am.  reflect my friend, pull from within, even if you think you are weak.  you are not.  as i have said before on here..  WE are stronger than our addictions!!!  just really want to need to be free.  my source was God.  He has been amazing for me through this process..  if God is not your source of strenght, then look to a High Power..  God to me is far to huge to not be recognized.  know you also are with me...  i will hold you close in prayer...  let us know how you are doing...  love and inner peace...

as always i am holding everyone on here in prayer..  this is our reality.  i am grateful for this forum...  it helped save me.  for those who are still struggling, keep coming back, cuz i'm praying this will save you also...

love to all....
stars

[Schlub]

Hi Everyone,

Here's how to find a private addiction medicine doctor in your area.

First, go to the American Society of Addiction Medicine at www.asam.org/. Hit the "Enter" button. Then on the left side of the page, click on "membership directory". Leave all the spaces empty except for the state you live in, and it'll give you a list of all addiction physicians in your state, along with their phone numbers and in some cases email addresses.

If someone could post this info where everyone could see it, I'm sure it'd be a great resource for people.

[stars]

hope you don't mind me chime'n in...  but i want to congradulate you and your progress...  i am in my 4th week of sobriety (20+ vics a day) and i suffered one day of depression and that was my first day..  could you contact your doctor regarding an anti-depressant?  that helped me so much...  i've been reading your posts and i truly want you to overcome this...  only because i know you can...  my prayers are with you...  just a note of encourgement....  i can't even remember the last time i felt as good as i do now...  its awesome....  

love and blessings... stars

[Nod]

How are you?  Things getting a little back to normal, I hope.  Been thinking about how your doing.  Your going to make it and so am I.  

I'm down to three 7.5's a day and the depression and emotional roller coaster ride is really getting to me. I do fine at home, but work really gets me down but that's another issue I'm dealing with.  My brain is screaming for some hydro when the stress level rises.  I know know the job stress helped fuel the hydro use since gave me a false relief from it.  But 20 a day did more then give me a relief!  Not making excuses for my addiction just saying what I now know.  

Anyway, here's to you and I well on the road to being clean.  We're winning the fight!   Stay in touch.   Nod

[stars]

awesome job!!!!!  that is priceless information...  i am sure many will be happy to get that!  wow schlub think of how many you will help!!!!  thank you!!

[CATUF]

Thanks, Skipper. that leaves me with a better image than the cartoon of an angel on one shoulder and a little devil on the other.

Here I am on what should be day 42, but which is day 8/39/3 -- 8 being the number of days totally clean since my fall of 3/15, 16 & 17/02; 39 being the clean days since what I consider my real quit date back on 2/13/02; and 3 being my days off the wagon during the 39.  It may be nothing but one of the mental games that we've all played, but I think it's on the positive side --

I've decided to treat this whole deal as a journey that started on 2/13/02.  Had I been on an actual, on-the-road, journey from Point A to Point B and fell in the ditch on day 31, I wouldn't have gone back to Point A to resume.  I would have gotten up, dusted myself off and continued.   Likewise,the 30 full days of walking down the road wouldn't have ceased to exist.  So, I'm still going to count the total days of "active travel," and keep up with the days of my resumed journey until they equal the number of days before the fall.  Then, I'm going to think of it as 60/3; i.e., 60 days on the road with a 3 day break that seemed like a good idea at the time, which I plan not to repeat as I now see that it was a) actually harder than the active travel and b) could easily have streached into many more days in the ditch, each of which left me less able to get up and resume my travel.

Eating, sleeping and working out seem to be working wonders. I've gained back the 15 pounds that I've been looking for for a number of years, 10 of which were lost due to the loss of appetite and inability to keep my dinner down after a day of too many 10/500's.

Well, my angel and I are off to the races..............

[Schlub]

I am really impressed at how rigorously you're taperting down, Nod. I would have thought that most of us couldn't taper that well. I mean, if we could, we wouldn't be addicts, right?

So I'm really pleased and impressed.

As for me, I'm stabilized on Bup and again and off to see relatives this week with my awesome wife and child. We'll try to go drug free in aweek or two -- this time hopefully without the convulsions, right?

And Stars ... just ONE day of depression?

You are my God!

Or is it Goddess?

[Sadgirl]

Hi dear friends...sorry I haven't kept in touch, but I can only go on the computer at work.  I took yesterday off...since I could not even get myself dressed and ready for work.  Okay, with the Grace of God, I made pass 72 hours.  But, I cannot tell you how low I feel.  I feel like I'm walking around with a head and body that are not connected. I am so damn tired I want to scream!  I do not care about work, home, kids, hubby, how selfish of me!!! I just want some energy...and for my head to clear.  This haze is killing me...and to top it off I have back pain and a migrane (migraine) that won't let up.  BUT, you all did touch me...all these great stories of hope and recovery.  All the prayers and love I was receiving...I will hold on and get better.  I read with such pain how other people have gone through so much more...and here I am complaining.  I look like s--t!! Everyone at work thinks I have a bad cold...I cannot stop sneezing and the nasal congestion is so annoying...like I have an allergy attack from not having the drugs.  Thank you so much for your thoughts, love and prayers.  I hope tomorrow is better..dear Lord, please give me the strength to see another day sober...and give me hope!  Bless you all...Sadgirl.

[stars]

Hey sweetgirl....  praise God your okay and continuing your journey towards freedom!!!  i am so relieved and proud of you.  remember....  doing what you are doing isnt supposed to be easy.  there is a lesson to be learned here..  we are only selfish when we are in our addiction, not when we are being true to ourselves.  very soon your priority will be all the things that are truly important in this life...  don't stop sweetie...  keep goin....  everyday i feel better...  but when i was in the first few weeks it seemed like the days would never end...  i dont ever want to go back.  you are making all the right decisions..  don't loose hope...  take a deep look into your childrens eyes... that helped me tons during my first week...  hazy and all...  just look in their eyes...  they love you...  love yourself as much as they love you...  get strong... educate yourself about addiction and then we can help teach our children about addiction...  i would dread any of my kids to be like me!  i am continuing pray heavily your way...  i know your struggle and i feel your pain...  you are not alone...  He will deliver you from this, just keep yourself open to Him... don't stop praying...  please... please stay in touch...  don't give up!  by the way....  i'm still sneezing, and i'm going into my 4th week...  i am with you in thought and prayer....  love and strenght to you....  stars...

schlub....  you cracked me up...  take your pick!  lol... peace to you and your family....  love.... stars....

[dunit]

hey you guys,
it's been over a week since I had a chance to post, but I read all of your posts everyday in between working, kids, husband home etc... Soooo many new people and storys, I feel like it's me writing from my past or present!
Some of you like SAD GIR: make me cry, I wish I could help you or had all the answers, but it's not anywhere near that simple. Like the others have said plzzz you just keep in touch and let us know how you are.
I discovered this wonderful group a little more thana month ago and have found it to be the most supportive group of people who all speak from their hearts! here are somehere who are rock bottom and some flying through the stars everyday. We have all been where you are and know the pain.

I spent over 20 years on every drug imaginable.When I
found Perc's and then Oxy's(great at first)I went crazy -like 200 mg's  a day! In the last few years, and only after a short while it became unbearable. Even when I had pleanty of pills I felt horrible a lot of the time. I had day/night sweats-changes in energy and moods constantly. I became short tempered and angry  (at myself but took it out on my husband and family --that's big time GUILT) didn't want to even be in this world many a day.
Finally with my husbands help went clean in Sept. a relapse in Dec. and now on Bupernex. I am hoping this will be the final time I go thru withdrawal.  
Nod one thing I found was,I could cut down to the smallest amount of pills (1-2) a day,but when I took that last pill, the Hell began-I rarly made it a day or two b4 I started taking them agian. I wish you the very very best!The last time I was clean for 30 days I was so depressed the entire time. Anyway I am sorry for rambling on , but I want to say hello to all of you, and plz keep posting/ NOd sounds like your back on track! GREAT! replase is part of recovery (I believe) JR you are a tuff hero to me,ou. Good night and Bless you all

[lanas]

Okay--I know I posted the original question on this threaad (don't know how I got that lucky) and there have been some great posts here and others have gotten in too--which I'm thrilled about--but I've got to step back in if I could please and ask another question.  I tried to post a question--but we all know how that goes.

So, here it is.  Finally found out the really bizarre symtpoms, (yes, did see my doc) the blood was minor and limited and he really thinks just chest congestion (I agree).  However, the rest is acute anxiety.  Go figure! So I am now on paxil and xanax.  Never been on either before, but I am sooooo relieved to have the constant tremors muted somewhat because they were driving me insane.  My pulse rate has also been racing and that has gone down a little as well and my breathing is returning to normal too.  But, everyone talks about benzos helping with sleep.  I slept lousy last night.  I was constantly waking up and my dreams were odd (I won't say bizarre, I have bizarre dreams a lot--and quite like them--these were just "odd").  I also have a phone call into a psychologist that my doctor recommended (and I really trust my doctor--I'm fortunate that I have a really good one).  So I'm well on my way to doing what's right, I think, to dealing with the vicoprofen addiction.  I haven't had any vics since last weekend (when I got so sick) and have not had ONE DESIRE for any either (that's how sick I truly was--my God were my angels watching over me...).  THe last vic before that was 3 weeks before.  So I'm making slow progress.  But any thoughts on the xanax--and no sleep--and odd dreams--and any thoughts on paxil, too, would be really appreciated.  I figure why not get it from those that know best?  And everyone is always so incredibly helpful and caring....

[dunit]

So sorry to hear bout the horrible reaction to the meds you had, it must have been such a SCARY time for you and your wife.
I am down to 3 amps Bup per day, it's so easy it's scary--started 3/8 and will continue for another 5 wks more or less,
slowly cutting down helps with the depression, per my Dr. I also have Been working out and taking Tomas's recipe. My Dr is so understinding and experienced in this, The ER probobly wouldnt have known what to do with you , Bup hasnt been approved by the DEA for rehab/withdrawal yet, so who know 's what would have happened. I've been reading up on Bup and will share with you any info I get. Maybe the 2 or 3 week withdraw was more than you could handle?? the SRI could have been a big factor also!
I Would like to talk to you --one on one-- about this Bup, and keep in touch. Hopefully we can help each other with support and knowledge through this time, since we are both at a similar point in time-- recovery wise. We can do it by post if you prefer, but I believe the two of us would get more out of it thru personal E-mail( ony the Bup isue)let me know, what yout think , you have a very suportive wife and I have the same in my husband. It makes a big difference. Hope all is gong well, I pray for you and the rest of the group everyday. Bless you and good night!
Dunit,but hope to never do it again

[CATUF]

Hello All,
     Day 12 here (or 46/12/3).  Still feeling good.

     I had a question: when using, I noticed that it became VERY hard to pee.  I mean I just couldn't go (even though it felt like I needed to) unless it had been a LONG time and my bladder was really full.  As soon as I got off the meds (i.e. even for a day or two), that stopped and I haven't had that problem during these extended stops of 30 and 12 days.  Does anyone know a) what causes this and b) if it indicates some sort of damage?

KAAOYS

CATUF

[1fortheroad]

hi - i'm also on the bup taper program.  i'd love to hear what you have to say about it as well as share my experience with it.  we could swap emails if you'd like.  let me know, and i hope you are doing well....

[dunit]

Still on the Bup, went from 5 to 3 apms a day, in 3 wks. I had never heard of this med untill I was stitting in the Dr. office
a few months ago and finially asked about it( I OVERHEARD SOME GUYS TALKING ABOUT IT). Anyway--it's an amazing drug to help you go thru the withdraws. I'm somewhat scared of the 1st day without, especially with Schlub's post(howare you doing Schlub??). Well, I've gotta do it and am hoping this will be it! plz e-mail me we'll go thru it 2gether-fllady@aol-it is hard for me to find the time to read all the posts and keep up with everyone. Although it is so amazing to find a group who share so much in common and are so suppportive and understanding--so honest and open and share their deepest secrets --If you have been there you know,if you havn't you can only guess how it feels. My thoughts and prayers are with all of you.

[dunit]

sorry my e-mail is flordalady@aol---any way--take care and keep posting! JB u are so rite, if we could do it alone we would not be posting. I am just realizing now that I need others to help
me win this battle. Nite to all and thanks JB for your wisdom.