oxycontin and other opiates HELP!

[Ken]

I have been taking opiates for over two years now. I cant seem to stay clean! I have tried several times to get off of them to no avail.I have no insurance so inpatient is not an opption. I go to na and aa meetings but most of the time I lie and say how good I am doing. I am doing good at staying off of the crack cocaine but I have subsutited it with the opiates.Now I want to come clean and tell them what I've been doing, but I dont want to feel like a fool for lying to them all these months.I am tired of chasing pills to keep myself functioning. I have been taking everything from oxycondin to tylenol 3-4 to vicodin to lortab, or whatever I can get my hands on.I am tired.I want to stop but the withdrawels are hard. I make it past the initial detoxing but then I have no enegery to go on with everyday living. What can I take or do to function like a normal person.I need help! Please anyone with any input would be greatly appreciated. thank you KEN

[Dr. Bob]

The physical part is the easy part. The psychological part is the most difficult. I don't know what area you are in, but in many cities there are a few state run inpatient programs for people with no insurance. If you detox, don't blow it again! You will just have to go through it again the next time. I went to a treament facility which specializes in treating physicians, But later relapsed. When I did get sober (after treatment), I did it cold turkey and got a sponser (AA) and went to alot of meetings. I would highly recommend however, that you try to find an inpatient facility. It will increase your odds of staying sober, and help you understand the disease of addiction.

[tom to Ken]

are you taking opiates for any pain condition or just as a sub for cocaine? if the latter:

look at the good side first: Cocaine is the deadliest, most addictive and most physiologically and psychologically destructive drug in the history of the world. Be so, so glad you're not on that. Opiates addict and addiction tends to result in poor nutrucian and not enough sleep, etc., but when you finally do quit for good, your brain won't be destroyed. Believe it or not, that's progress. Just don't go back. If you want convincing, go to some CA meetings and look at the damage. Beyond belief. On second thought, don't go, because someone will try to sell you coke right outside the door.

It's harder when you're broke with no insurance but you can do it. You need to get an experienced sponsor in an AA or NA meeting (don't be afraid to go to AA, it's all the same in the end). Ask for a sponsor right away and DO WHAT HE SAYS. Money helps initially with detox, but money can't buy recovery. It's the same work whether you have money or not. In some ways, having money makes it worse.

Why don't you come clean in a meeting? What have you got to lose? You don't go there for their approval anyway. You're there to help yourself. **** them if they don't like what you have to say. If you want, go to new meetings in new places in order to get a clean start. Anyway, lying about sobriety is done all the time. And fessing up to the group is also done all the time. Don't you realize that most of them have done the same thing? Addiction is all about lying -- you already know that. Actually, you'll be surprised and somewhat overwhelmed by the acceptance you will get if you fess up. They probably already know you're lying! Get honest. If they don't like it, go to new meetings. But you have to get a sponsor. Good luck.

[Ken , day two]

I cant do this .I feel like ****. I dont know how long I can hold on. My ex- wife is on me about school clothes . I need to go to work.I'm gonna try to work without pills.Or rather on different pills . I do have some Ultram. I guess I am weak.

[Joe]

quitting pills is the hardest thing i've ever tried to do. I got injured on the job and 1 yr. later i'm hooked on opiates!! i' don't have insurance either, and I already blew my chance for a state funded detox...twice!! My desire to quit is truly real, but the withdrawal is TOO damn much!! I found some relief from smoking pot during withdrawals, but to no avail. I wish I knew how long they(withdrawals) last, but I can't make it more than 3 days!! I feel suicidal to extremes, and I have severe mood swings. I have only slept about 4 hours in 3 days, and I have no energy at all...I have been in AA for two years, and have stayed sober uuntil recently. I would rather put up with the extreme pain I'm in all day every daay, then have to "chase" pills annnd put my family through the hell I am. I hope I can eventually beat this disease and get back with my life.....or I'm afraid of what will happen to me.;l

[Ken , day two]

Hi Joe , I know how you feel. Nothing is so bad that you have to kill yourself over it.But I can empathize with you .Its so hard! I feel so weak when I go back to using after just one or two days.But I have so much going on that I need to take care of,I just cant take the 1 or 2 weeks off to detox. I know it is gonna kill me if I dont do something soon. But I continue to use.If only it was easier we would all be clean.I couldnt even get through today again.I had to use to get a job done so I can get my kids some school clothes.And I have so many other good reasons to not quit just yet.But I am going to have to soon or I will lose my girlfriend.She is on the edge of leavin me, I can feel it. And she is all I have left .Isn't it funny how many excuses we can make to continue to use.And the one good reason to quit just isnt good enough.Damn I feel like killin myself now (just kiddin). But I hope you can be stronger than i have been.I will check back later to se if you or anyone else responds or feels as we do.good luck, KEN

[Kimberly to Bob K]

Quitting is very hard, I have been struggling for 2 months.  I have been through the ups and downs with it, I keep relapsing, but every relapse I get a grip on it a little quicker.  I first went 2 days without, then used for 10, then I went 4 days without and used for 5 and so on.  Now I go 3 weeks and use for 2 or 3 days.  Everytime I relapse I realize why I quit, and I realize my life is getting better without the drugs.  I had a 20-30 Norco a day habit (10mg Hydrocodone, 325 Tylenol) or any opiod I could get my hands on.  The depression and anxiety is what gets me to relapse, the first 2 weeks are aweful, but it gets better.  I understand the fear of physical withdraw, and it sucks, but it does get better and it is short lived.  I don't know if this is good advice, but I would take a pill now and then during the physical part, just to get a break from the agony and it gave me the stregnth to go on.  My only reason for quitting when I started was I couldn't supply my habbit, now I have found so many more reasons.  My doctor would not give me any tranquilizers, because he said that would just be another addiction, but he did give me Wellbutrin, and it helped a lot with anxiety.  I also have gone through trying to get drugs from Mexican Pharmacy's during this quitting period, but even that need is starting to go away.  I guess for me it is a slow process, but there is finally a light at the end of the tunnell, I am starting to find things interesting again without drugs, that adds to the detox depression is nothing is interesting without the drugs, I never thought I would get it back.  I will pray for you, and please pray for me, we need all the help we can get, but hang in there, your suffering is worth it and it wont last forever, even though it feels like it will.  Also, I was a crack addict, and I got over that and feel no need for it, and I suspect this will be the same in a few years.  If you would like to email me - ***@****

[Ken , day two]

Kimberly, Thank you for your concern. It is very hard for me. I have not really had enough time clean to experience what its like. Two years straight I’ve been using. I want to talk more to you but in a different forum, maybe I will e-mail you. Thanks, Ken

[Angie to Ken]

Your posting could have easily been written by me. I am glad you are finding things that interest you while you are straight.That was the hardest thing for me. I was interested in anything and everything while under the influence. So I found it extremely difficult to get into things that used to be of interest. I would always compare it to the "other times" thinking "this could be so much better if only" I believe that alone will help you maintain your sobriety. I, too, would go for a few weeks at a time without and then resume taking the vicodin when the opportunity presented itself. The problem with me doing that was it would restart my obsessive thinking about how to obtain more. All that wasted time and energy. So this is my second go round with staying clean. It has been since March and there are still days when I want some so bad. I want to stop wanting them! I met a girl through outpatient detox who said she gave up heroin years ago but the pills have more of a hold on her. She doubted her ability to be able to stay off of them. That kinda of scared me. You wrote something about trying to obtain narcs from mexico. What's that all about? I'm only asking out of curiosity I would be too scared to try it. Good luck on your sobriety.

[Ken , day two]

I cant stand myself anymore. I continue to use . I use, to be able to work ,so I could buy school clothes for my kids. But all I can think about is, getting more drugs. Now I am gonna need them to be able to take the kids shopping.Then I will find another reason. I cant stand this ****. Why cant I just say enough is enough? I feel so controled.Am I the only one who has such a hard time with quitting ? I know I'm not, but i guess I'm just feeling sorry for myself. Its time to **** or get off the pot.(or pills) Someone please write back so I dont feel so alone.Thanks  KEN

[simone]

I am so grateful to have found this forum.  Ken, not too long ago I was in the same boat as you are.   Believe me, I know how you feel and my heart goes out to you and everyone who comes here for answers.  I have only recently (finally) gotten clean after several thousand attempts.  It is SO hard.  All of it, physical, mental, and emotional.  But you sound to me as if this is something you really want to do.  But it is also sounding to me as if you are looking for someone to tell you that yes, its hard, but your feelings are justified because life is too hard without drugs.  I thought that too for a very long time.  It just aint true!  Life is much more, lets say, CHALLENGING, without the crutch of drugs to numb all feelings.  Don't kid yourself and don't make excuses to use.  The best way to get off this evil **** is to get professional help.  I believe this is the only way.  I've tried to "ween" off  the stuff a million times.  It doesn't work, at least not for me.  It sounds like that doesn't work for you either.  Do not consider it a weakness to seek help.  Consider it a strength.  A weak person is one who wont seek help or use valuable resources available to them.  Ken, you sound like you want it so badly.  Just do it! If I can do it anyone can.   Because if this drug takes your life away from you, you wont have to worry about buying any school clothes for your kids cuz they wont have a dad.  I know about this, too.  I am clean and sober and watching everyone around me die because of drugs.  You can do it!!  I am praying for you and everyone at this message board.  Peace.

[From Aunt Lindy to Mariah]

I know how you feel.  It is very difficult.  You plan your life around those pills.  You plan vacations, day trips, "shopping for kids clothes" everything.  The problem is, is that the pills help you feel so much better.  I take mine for FIBROMYALGIA.  These pills work for me like insulin does for the diabetic.  Like pills someone takes for depression these pills work for me, like the insulin and the antidepressants.  I am not high from these pills I just have quality of life! My kids have their mom. My husband has his wife.  It is what keeps me going.  I know just where you are coming from.

[Al to Michael]

I have been reading posts mentioning oxycontin
taking your life. Is it toxic to your body? If
you take 80mg day, will it kill you?

[Angie to Ken]

There's alot going on in your mind. You have to learn to seperate some of these issues. Why are you taking pills in the first place? Is it for a legitimate reason or should I say WAS it for real pain and then it turned into something more recreational? I can so totally relate. While taking those wonderful pills I could accomplish so much. I could go all day at work, come home and make dinner, clean house and throw some wash in too. All of this stuff was actually enjoyable as long as I had pills. I always had them lined up for any social event and yes, even shopping for school. You obviously want to stop but what's the reason YOU want to stop? You are going to feel real bad physically for several days depending on how much you've taken. After that comes the hardest part-- the mental anguish!!! You really have to learn how to live all over again without the helpers. You will crave and probably think obsessively about the pills. I don't know if this is your first time but you need help. You can't succeed by trying to white knuckle it all by yourself. We all have alot of the same thoughts and you need to express those thougts to others in other words you need to vent. You will need the support of others. I have been recovering since March and it hasn't been fun ride.  But I am FREE!!!!!! I don't have to schedule my life around the refills and drs. appts. That alone is worth it. My family is thrilled to have the "real me" back. I thought I was a better wife, mother, daughter and friend because of the way I felt after taking the pills. Everything seemed to be so WONDERFUL. I remember thinking what's so bad about taking something that makes me feel so great. Someone pointed out that although I was numbed from some unpleasantries I was also not experiencing real joy. Yes, life without pills can be done but its a lot of hard work. I won't even get into the amount I was taking but if I can do it so can you!!!!!!  Please take the necessary steps towards living a clean life, your family deserves it.

[Dee]

I read and read these post's and know I have to start somewhere trying to stop this merry-go-round...but I don't have the strength or the energy to try...on the days that I mess up with my script and have to withdraw is terrible...I understand so well the feeling of having no pleasure in anything without the pills...how long does it take to get any back...I know the physical part takes about a week...but..how long before you start to feel good mentally...I have so much stress in my life as I know I'm not the only one who does....when I don't have pills I don't even want to talk to my kids...thank god they are older..if I had little ones it would be horrible not to be able to cope with them..even now..I'm starting to get a little down because I know that I have to cut down on my pills from 9-10 oxy's a day to 3 a day so I don't run out completely untill the next script..and the next one is not for another 10 days, every month I say I'm not going to do this, I have enough for 6-7 a day to last the whole month, every dam month I say I'm not going over what I need to last the whole month, and every dam month I do and end up having to try to spread them out, it's so hard! when I'm on the pills it doesn't bother me that I don't have enough money or I don't have a decent car, ect ect ect...the pills make life so much easier to handle...I truly don't think I could handle life without them..and then there's the legit Pain I know I couldn't handle the physical pain I have....why is it so hard to learn control....thanks for listening...

[Ken , day two]

Thank you all for your replies. I have come to a crossroad again. I let my girlfriend read what I have written and your replies. As I have said before she also, at one time, was addicted to opiates. So she is understanding, and willing, to help me. But the addict in me says, not until my kids leave, and the drugs run out. So I am going to white knuckle it again. I have gotten some Kava, Valerian Root and Melatonin to help ease the withdrawals. But I need you all to help keep me motivated to do this. So I will continue to check in here for any input anyone has to help me through this very trying time in my life. I have used these pills as a substitute  for alcohol and cocaine over the past two years ,so I hope I don’t fall back into that part of my life once the pills are gone. I   know myself all to well , and always substitute one drug for another. So pray for me and continue to write , I need all the support I can get. Thank you again. Ken

[to Ken from an addict]

Can you get to a meeting?  I know you feel like **** right now but if you can, do it.  I don't know if you are alone or not but being alone isn't always good for an addict trying to talk to himself into stay clean.  The addict part of the brain starts to talk a little louder (mine screams!).  Just the fact that you are admitting you are a trying again is a great thing.  I tried to tell everyone I could.  The more people who knew, the harder it was for me to screw up.  This is the only time my guilty conscience is my friend. I feel worse when I know I've let other people down.  But hey whatever works.  I came here today because I've had a lot of BAD days (weeks) and felt like using.  I'm glad I did - I am remembering the hell of the withdraws reading about everyone going through it.  I have relapsed many times trying to substitute one drug for another.  Never worked!  Can you imagine?  Good luck to you and hang tough. Gotta get through the pain to experience the rewards.  I'll check back later with ya.

[Angie to Ken]

I am glad you are willing to give the "clean" life a chance. Admitting it is really the first step, not trying to sound corny! The whole time I used pills I would never admit it was a problem because then you either 1. Know that something must change because you realize your an addict or 2.Go on living life as an active addict. Neither choice appealed to me but when my family members figured it out and I lost my job due to being an addict I realized something was terribly wrong. I was even arrested for taking meds at work. Yes I hit rock bottom! The only problem was that was even more of a reason to take pills. After the initial physical withdraw there somethin called acute post-withdrawl symptoms. It was described to me: "all your nerve endings are screaming for the opiates." You go through depression maybe some short term memory loss (which does come back)and a general feeling of nothing making you feel good and / or not feeling happy. This can go on for up to 90 days but everyone is different. Good luck with the herbs you purchased they did nothing for me. Also the thing you have to do is get to a meeting. I remember thinking "I'm not going to any meeting , it's embarrassing and how about if I see somebody I know" after I got over that and attended, it was the best thng that I did for myself. It's amazing how many people got sucked up into the exact same thing as we did. I wish you well.

[Suzi Q]

Hi Ken...I'm at work and can't really say much right now but I just wanted to tell you that you will be in my prayers my friend...

[Mariah]

Ken,
    Hi!  I really sympathize with you, I know exactly what you are going through!  I was looking for information on this when I found you.  I started taking oxycontin(20) about 2 years ago as a party drug, I got up to 2-3 a week.  My boyfriend & I had about 100, they lasted for about 6 months.  I had never taken any kind of drug or pill before & I had no idea how habit forming they could be.  So, after they ran out & I started looking for other pills that would make me feel the same way, I realized I was addicted.  Then I got introduced to lorocet 10/650.  I was taking at least 1 a day, everyday.  I thought that was bad at the time, but little did I know it could get a lot worse!  Now I have been taking lorocet for a little over a year & I'm up to about 7-8 a day!  I was really worried about this before, but not enough to make me want to quit!  They just made me feel so good!  And now like you, I need them to even get my day started.  The only thing that makes me happy or excited is when I think of the pills waiting on me!  I feel so horrible writing this, because I just found out I'm pregnant.  Well, I've known now for awhile, but the reason I say just is because I haven't went to the doctor yet.  I'm scared to go to the doctor.  I'm actually horrified!!!  What will he say?  Is my baby OK?  What will they do?  Will they take my baby away & put me in a hospital?  What will people say when they find out I'm an addict?  Will everyone hate me & call my baby a crack baby?  Will they think I'm a bad mother?  There are so many questions & I can't find anyone to help me!  When I think of an addict, I think of a mother not taking care of her kids, doing horrible things to get it, not involved with her children's lives & so on.  I guess that's why it never hit me that hard that I was an addict.  I pride myself on being a good mother & thinking of everyone else first.  Now I realize an addict can be anyone.  Whether or not it's glamorous or clean makes no difference.  When you think of pills, it really doesn't seem "that bad".  But, it definately is!  I'm about 14 weeks pregnant, as far as I can tell & I need to go to the doctor.  I'm just so scared.  I read on here a doctor said they usually keep a mother on the drugs until delivery & then they detox the baby for 5-10 days.  I know this letter has mostly been about me, but I do care about you & your situation.  I definately know what you're going through & I hope we all can help eachother.  I guess I'm looking for the same thing you are.  I know that you won't be able to just quit taking!  I can't & I'm pregnant, believe me I've tried.  I'm still trying.  Everytime I try to quit, I only last about 5 hours after I get up & then I brake down.  I feel like pulling my hair out & I'm horrible to be around.  I'm really not a bad person & I've never been grouchy, but I have to take pills to feel like myself.  Without them, I feel like someone completely different.  I've taken ultrams before & they helped alot, but I had to take 4-5 at a time.  You can't quit by yourself, but I think the support in these letters helps a lot.  Just to know there are other people like me, has helped me so much!  When I found this discussion I got so happy I cried.  I have felt so isolated, nobody else knows about my addiction besides my boyfriend.  I am very close with my family & they have no idea & are all wondering why I haven't been to the doctor yet.  I have a 3 year old little girl & took great care of myself when I was pregnant with her, so they are getting suspicious.  I'm so scared to tell anyone about this.  Not my family & definately not a doctor.  I'll keep checking to see if anyone has responded & I'll write another letter to you as soon as I get a chance!  I'm sorry I can't be more encouraging.  I can tell you that you're NOT alone!  Thank-you for listening.  This has helped me a lot just to tell someone about this for the first time.  I needed to get this out, so thanks!  Please someone write, I'll be waiting right here...

[tom to Mariah and Ken]

This is to Mariah and Ken …

First of all, Mariah, I noticed you used an exclamation point after stating you were up to 7 - 8 lortab (vicodin, alias hydrocodone) per day. Put the exclamation point away. Imagine using 50 to 75 lortabs per day! (I don't have to imagine - I lived it for years. But I overcame it, and so shall you.)

Ken, I know exactly what you mean about being faced with the need to function to earn money for your family, and yet having to deal with addiction at the same time. It's overwhelming, isn't it? But it seems overwhelming because you're trying to solve the whole situation at once - kind of like an Egyptian trying to make the Great Pyramid using a single stone. Overwhelming to be sure! But so is any problem when we try to tackle it all at once.

You have both done the one essential thing necessary for recovery: you've accepted the fact that you have a problem and you've made contact with some people who understand and have been through it all themselves.

You may not think so right now, but, in a sense, you both have already won half the battle by overcoming the states of denial and secrecy. You're halfway home. Give yourselves a pat on the back. You have actually accomplished the hardest part of recovery and you didn't even know it!

Back to the pyramid … the Egyptians worked their seeming miracle because they broke the problem of building a pyramid down into small, manageable pieces. This is what you need to do now with your situations. Set your emotions aside and engage your minds.

Both of you are in a situation where you need to function and make good decisions despite your drug predicament. I can't solve your problems for you, but I can give you a place to start, something you can start doing right now.

You need to stabilize your physical and, hopefully, emotional states before you can do anything. Here's how:

First, eliminate these desperate substitute or masking drugs. They'll just complicate everything. Now, you'll find that you can function fairly well without withdrawal on half the dosage you're used to taking - as long as you take it on a schedule. Don't wait until you're in withdrawal to react. Take the half dose on a schedule, say every 3 hours or so, whether you feel sick or not. It won't get you high but it should leave you well enough to function. The trick is to maintain that schedule and dosage. It may take a day or so, but you will find that your mental and physical states will stabilize.

Read my advice to Charlie on the thread "Oxycontin withdrawal" somewhere near this thread. There are tips on how to weather withdrawal there.

Now, you know you're going to have to get some kind of help. And Mariah, you're going to have to tell your doctor. Make whatever calls you need to make, go to work when you need to - but do it in a rational state of mind. Stabilizing your dosages will enable you to make rational decisions instead of the impulsive, desperate ones you were both about to make. My advice may seem simplistic. It may not seem like this technique will work at first, but it will.

I know this doesn't solve things, but it is the first critical step you need to take.

[Ken]

It is Saturday morning I didn’t sleep to well. My girlfriend is having trouble with pills in the house I know it. But they are almost gone. I have a couple for today, then a couple for tomorrow morning. Then the kids go home and I start over. I can’t write too much, the kids are asking what I’m doing. And I don’t want them to know. I will check back later when they are outside.

[Ken]

It is Saturday morning I didn’t sleep to well. My girlfriend is having trouble with pills in the house I know it. But they are almost gone. I have a couple for today, then a couple for tomorrow morning. Then the kids go home and I start over. I can’t write too much, the kids are asking what I’m doing. And I don’t want them to know. I will check back later when they are outside.

[Ken , day two]

Thank you for writing back.I have been in other sites about addiction.I cant believe how many of us there are. And every storie sounds the same.My life feels so out of control.I need you guys to keep me focused. Thanks, Ill write more later.

[Mariah]

Tom,
    Hey!  Thank you for those kind & caring words, I appreciate it more than you'll ever know.  That did make me feel better when you said, put the exclamation point away!  I'm crazy though, because when I read 50-75, it made me feel better, but it also made me think you were cool!  Pills are like a way of life for me & my boyfriend.  We still have all of our old friends, but our friends we talk to more often are all on pills & everything else.  That's how we accept people into our lives now.  We like everyone (as long as we're taking), but as soon as we find out they take pills too they seem like better friends & we like them better.  I can't really explain it that well.  Well, I guess it's kinda like on here, I feel more comfortable talking on here because I know everyone knows what I'm talking about.  My friends don't know the truth, they think I take a pill every once in awhile.  I don't like lying to everyone, but I'm so embarrassed.  I want to try to quit taking & then go to the doctor, I'm afraid of what he might do or say if I tell him.  If I can't quit, I'll have to tell the doctor to save my baby.  The baby could die if it's addicted & I don't tell them.  So, I know I have to do that if it comes down to it!  I know it seems selfish, but I'm just so scared!  I think about this night & day.  I try to quit, then I go crazy, then I end up taking at least 3, next when I start to feel good & feel like myself, the guilt hits me.  I think about what a horrible person I am.  How could I do this to my baby?  I used to say how mothers on drugs should put them down, no matter how it makes them feel!  Now I know, I had no idea what I was talking about!!!  I know 7-8 doesn't sound bad when talking to a person that used to take 50-75 a day.  And let me tell you how proud I am of you!  You are superman in my book!  You are a strong man & very inspirational!  I give you much respect & I trust anything you tell me will be right.  But, 7-8 is bad for a pregnant woman, you have to admit!  I think I must've been waiting for someone to dog me out & it didn't happen.  So, you say set up a schedule?  OK, let me tell you about my day.  I wake up at 7am to get my daughter to preschool & I usually take 2.  Then about 3pm I take 2 more.  Then about 6pm or 7pm I take 3.  Then sometimes if I've had a stressful day I take 2 more to sleep good.  I feel like I'm rewarding myself when I take pills.  They are like gold to me.  So you think I should take 1 every 3 hours, like that?  It's 11am & I'm gonna try to take just 1.  Well, thank you for all your help & just being here for me, it means a lot!  I'll be here...

[Beckey]

Maria,
      Hi.  You sound like a very good mother to me!  At least you realize what you have to do & I know you can do it.  Those mothers you are talking about don't care how they make their kids feel or if they're hurting their baby inside them, you do.  You have a conscience, that makes you a good person.  It will be hard to quit.  If you can't quit, at least try to cut down.  Maybe you can call a clinic & act like you're calling for a friend & see what they do in those situations.  Good luck.  I'll write more later...

[Mariah]

Hey!  It's me again!  Thank you Becky, you are sweet!  I've been on here all morning looking for information on narcotics & pregnancy.  I can't find anything that gives me hope.  Everything is telling me my baby is in bad trouble.  Some doctors say narcotics are time honored & not harmful at all & most doctors say taking any narcotic is horrible!  I just feel so terrible when I read these things because I feel like they are trying to make me feel bad!  Like they think by writing all these horrible things it will make someone want to quit!  I don't know, but I can't find anything.  If anyone finds anything they think I ought to read, please let me know!  I need the help!  I'm just so happy I find this & all of you.  Ken, I know what you're talking about when you say you look for reasons to take.  I use everything as an excuse, from just getting up in the morning to going to preschool to volunteer.  I always say, I'll quit when the pills run out.  Then, my b/f gets more & then I say it again.  It's so hard & you're not alone!  Are you the only one that takes them or do you hang out with someone that does?  I know that's my biggest problem, everyone around me takes them.  Well, I'm gonna go look some more.  I'll be back.

[Mariah]

Tom,
    Hey!  I don't think you're understanding what pill I'm talking about.  I read your letter again & you called them lorotab & vicodin.  It is hydrocodone, but these have more in them than those others do.  I've taken lorotab 7.5, vicodin & percocet(10), they were all like eating candy to me.  They did nothing.  I have to take at least 4 lorotab 7.5 to equal to 2 lorocet.  I take lorocet 10/650 or lorocet plus.  Well, I'll write more tonight.  Thanks everyone!

[tom to Mariah]

I was talking about hydrocodone in general, whether lortab, vic-es or whatever. Dosage is relative. I was addressing your need to make good decisions with a clear head right now. You can't think straight in withdrawal, but you also won't think well at the dosage you'd use to really get off. Usually, you must compromise by taking a lower dose that keeps you out of withdrawal but doesn't stone you. Don't take my dosages literally. Only you know what will work. Being either strung out or buzzed won't enable you to address your pregnancy issue very effectively. It's a practical measure until you sort out what you're going to do.

[Mariah to Tom]

Well, I took your advise & I feel better about myself today than I have in a long time.  I took 1 every 3 hours & as of right now I've only taken 3 ALL DAY!  I know I still have a long way to go because I have quit completely, but for the first time I feel determined!  To tell you the truth I do feel bad, but nothing like I usually do.  I think I would feel worse & it would be harder if I wasn't pregnant.  I know it'll just get better, I'm praying.  I told my b/f today that once I quit I'll never start back up again.  I'll just take Alieve even if I'm dying of pain.  This isn't worth getting high.  It feels good, but this is the worst thing I've ever went through in my life!  Of course he didn't believe me, but that just makes me want to prove him wrong.  I've been trying to get him to quit with me, but he's not ready.  I know you can't make someone, they have to want to & do it themselves.  He'll have to hit rock bottom first.  This has helped me a lot & I think I just needed a little push & it helps to hear from people that understand.  I'm so excited at how well I'm doing.  I think once I feel good doing this that it will be easier to stop completely.  So, thanks!  I appreciate everyone here & you are all in my prayers.

[tom to Mariah]

Glad to hear something hopeful from you, Mariah. I hope the maintenance dose works for you. By giving yourself a steady but reasonable dosage you'll be able to think more clearly and you hopefully won't be on such an emotional rollercoaster. Pregnancy itself will do that to you. If you get the sweats or cramps than you can always take one a little sooner than the 3 hour period. The idea is to stay out of withdrawal without getting loaded. The happy medium is what you should strive for right now. I think you mentioned the runs (or someone did on this thread). That is a very common withdrawal symptom and certainly one of the worst. Over the counter Imodium (immodium), taken two at a time whenever the runs return, will do a surprisingly good job of keeping them away. (Get the brand name of Imodium (immodium), it's more potent.) Just have them in your pocket and take them at the very first hint of the runs. Don't wait until you're having them full-fledged. If you can get in a jacuzzi or at least a hot bath every few hours, that will make you feel MUCH better. Also make sure you drink something like low-acidity fruit juices, anything that will keep you from getting dehydrated and keep your sugar level at a reasonable place. Sometimes you stop eating and drinking during these situations and the lack of food and drink alone makes you feel bad.
Actually, with the steady low doses of hydrocodone, some Imodium (immodium) and those hot baths, you may actually feel pretty good. Try to stay away from any big emotional scenes with anyone. (And absolutely no other drugs, Mariah - especially alcohol!!) Just mellow out, watch a good movie, have some pop corn, be kind to yourself - you deserve it! You will be surprised how well you can do as long as you keep up that 2.5 to 3 hour dosing schedule. (observe the 3-hour dosing even through the night). You know you have to get some counseling, don't you? But I'm very proud of you for making such a good start. The fact that you tried it at all is a VERY significant sign. And don't worry right now about the baby. Narcotics like hydrocodone will, I can't deny, create a need for detox when the baby is born, but an important point to remember about these type of drugs is that, by themselves, they really don't harm the body or brain in any significant way. Thank god you're not drinking or taking coke, drugs that really do harm the baby. Hang in there, you're doing great. I'll look for your posts tonight. Take care, Mariah.

[Mariah to Tom]

Hey!  Thanks for all the good advise & support.  I did great yesterday & I was so proud of myself.  I took 4 all day & all night!  I just had to keep myself occupied.  With a 3 year old, that isn't hard to do!  I can't believe I went the whole day without getting high!  I never thought that to be possible!  I have you, will power & love for my baby to thank for that!  I don't use any other kind of drug & I never drink, not even when I'm not pregnant.  Thank God is right!  That was so encouraging to hear someone else say that my baby is OK & at least I'm not taking something that would hurt the baby.  I thank you for that.  My heart is telling me my baby is going to be fine, but I read all the things about drugs & pregnancy on here & I start worrying again.  I'm up all night sometimes, just worrying.  (especially when I would take a couple)  I pray everyday, sometimes all day.  I want to thank you for helping me, it's really working.  I hope I can go all the way.  I get on here & read when I start wanting to get high.  Some people think just because your pregnant that "feeling" goes away.  It's so hard.  If I thought that I was just going to hurt myself during labor & that my baby would not be effected at all, I wouldn't care.  I hope if something does happen, it happens to me!  But, I'm gonna stay on track & hopefully everything will be OK!  I put a question on here today.  (the same one)  Will a doctor answer me?  You are so sweet getting on here & trying to help all of us druggies!  So, I just wanted to say, thank you!  Mariah  :)

[tom to Mariah]

You're welcome. It's my pleasure and my priviledge to do what I can. Somebody should benefit from my 27 years of rx narcotic addiction. I hope an MD finally responds to you. I don't understand why the Harvard people hosting this site haven't posted some kind of statement. It would certainly make everyone here feel better if they at least knew what was going on. Take care.

[Ken ,trying again!]

Well its that time again,time to quit. Tomorrow is gonna be day one for me again. I've said it before, but at least I'm gonna try.The kids went home and the school shopping is done.So I'm gonna try one more time.I've only had 2 pills today and I dont feel to bad,so maybe it wont be too bad.Tomorrow I am supposed to work but I own the company so I guess I can miss a few days.I am planning to take a vacation anyways.It just wont be a very fun one.I just hope it will be different this time.So I will check back in tomorrow and let you all know how its going.I detoxed last weekend, so maybe it wont be as hard this week. Damn I hate this ****.Looking forward to any replies from anyone who can help. Thanks, KEN

[Al to Michael]

Ken, What is the longest clean time you have had from oxy since gtting hooked? Just wandering how you felt after a streatch of clean time.

[Mariah to Tom]

Hey!  27 years?!!  How did you ever do it???  I've only been going through this heavy for about 11 months & it's horrible!  You are the man!!!  I noticed that a question hasn't been answered in awhile, after I asked mine & I got to wondering.  This is crazy!!!  WHERE'S THE DOC?!!!  he-he  You think they can hear me?  Talk to you later, thank you for everything.  
Mariah  :)

[Ken , day two]

Hi Al, I haven't had much clean time.Acouple of times I have had 3 or 4 days, but I have had a hard time.It's not easy for me. I cant stand to feel so helpless for days on end.I own a drrwall business and its hard to just stop running a business so you can detox. But if I dont soon I will not have a business anymore.People dont want a junkie in their houses going through their medicine cabinets. And that is what it comes down to when you run low on drugs. I have never been a thief before in my life, and I cant stand them myself, but when you have no drugs for your habit thats what you become. And I am ashamed to admit,I have takin other peoples pain meds out of their house.So its getting bad ,and its time for me to quit. Even if it means that I lose business. I will check back later.

[Angie to Ken]

I can so totally relate to going into other peoples cabinets for their meds. My job is such that I was required to make home visits and to inquire about the meds they were on. I am so ASHAMED to say that this worked quite well for a while especially since I was so trusted and I used to get such a rush when left the premises after copping. Then I would be good for another few days. I remember rationalizing that I needed them more since I would get sick if I didn't have them. Besides I was helping them not to get hooked. Can you imagine I used to buy this line of ****. Anyway that's been around 5 months ago, since I got clean. My mind will still wander whenever I am in someones house. In case your wondering I did get caught but not because of the people I had to visit, but my boss figured out I had a problem with pain pills and put that together with my home visits. When she sent the nurse out to check the meds where I had been they all came up short. Getting into trouble legally was my bottom!!! Now I do not work around narcotics. Probation mandated!!! I am so glad cause I'm not sure I could come face to face with those great little pills and say no. Good Luck, Ken.

[loanne]

man, it feels so good to read these posts and know that i am not alone.  my husband just got a script for vicodan from his dentist, and i'm fiending!!!  i have exactly enuf percs to accomplish my tapering schedule, and i haven't touched his script....yet.  i truly believe that i won't, because i want my sobriety back very badly.  can anyone tell me, (cuz my dr. if iffy about answering this), i'm down to 1 and 1/4 percs per day.  when i finally get down to 1/2 i'm supposed to quit totaly.  is kicking 1/2 perc a day gonna be hard?  i expect it to be ok, but am i just kidding myself?  so i have to go thru hell again?  please someone, answer this question honestly. thanks.

[Ryan]

Hi
I have been on hydrocodine for around two years now.  All of you seem to be eating the pills.  I snort them into my nose.  At first it was only to get tore up but now I cant seem to stop.  If I do my nose hurts and so does my throat.  I haven't been w/out pills for a day in two years.  I heard methadone can help you stop a pill habit is there any truth in it. I cant seem to go more than about 2 hours before my throat begins to hurt.  I really want to stop.  I have been trying to cut down from 10 a day one week to 9 next week 8 next week.....Is this a good way or not?  I am begging for help.  My parents do not know so can I get help w/out them knowing?

Ryan

[Carrie]

HAVE YOU TRIED METHADONE MAITNENCE? I AM GOING TO START THAT SOON. THE SICKNESS IS AWFUL, I HERE THAT THIS METHADONE REALLY HELPS AND THEY GIVE YOU YOUR DAILY DOSE. SO YOU CAN NOT OVER USE IT. (WE HAVE PROVEN OURSELVES IRRESPONSIBLE) AFTER 30 DAYS THEY GIVE YOU A COUPLE OF DAYS WORTH AT A TIME AND THEN THEY CAN HELP YOU GET OFF THAT. THIS IS THE ONLY WAY THAT I CAN SEE MYSELF OUT OF THIS MESS. LET YOU KNOW IF IT WORKS...... I AM PRAYING THAT IT WILL.

[louis]

I came across this website for research for a paper I am doing on physican drug abuse and I thought I would write something. Pills at one time ruled my life. Whether it was Percocet(my fav), vicodin,darvocet, talwin, demerol, or morphine I had to have a narcotic and I had to have it every day. It got to the point that my life was so unmanageable after 3 rehabs(which is soon for some) loss of touch with family, almost loss of job--the list goes on ad infinitum. I finally came to the point where I knew I wanted to stop but I couldn't and I thought I was crazy! My third reham introduced me to AA and at that point I would do anythinh so I got a sponsor and went to some meetings. Keeping in mind I had tried this before to no avail because I was not ready. Well, fortunately, I got a sponsor who was so intop the BIG BOOK of AA and the steps which are in the BB in clear cut directions. I went through the steps and my life was never the same . Just my expierence.

[Deez Nuts]

You snort your ****????  What the **** is wrong with you??  You should ALWAYS smoke them.  :-)  Yeah HOE!

[steve]

wow,this is sort of my first step.  I have not really admitted
that these pills have an effect on my life until recently.  I do
not have the usage many of you have (2-3oxy 20s and a 750vic is
my usual dosage)but I am very scared.  I don't have nearly as much fun in my life as I use to.  It seems I would rather take
an oxy and sit around the house with my buzz than be around other
people including my friends.  Will I truly feel better when I kick the habit?  Maybe that is what scares me the most.  Also, I have had several shoulder operations and am a nationally ranked
amateur golfer.  What do I do on those cool mornings when my shoulder feels like it has been shot?  Sorry I am asking questions.  Not my intentions.  I want everyone to know that
I am praying for you and you are strong enough.  Remember, the Lord only gives you what you are capable of handling.  Apparently
he has a lot of faith in all of you.Good Luck.  Steve

[Brian to Sick and Scared § ALL you guys]

You are asking some good questions and should be proud of yourself.  You have taken the first step by looking inward and asking yourself and others what to do.  First, you admit the opiates are having a negative effect on your social life.  But, you also say you have some real pain issues.  You need to ask yourself, do I really NEED the opiates for the pain, or is there a better way to control the pain.  Have you tried other treatments (such as accupuncture, massage, yoga, etc.), these often provide great pain relief.  Also, can you cut back your dosage and only take it when you truly need it?  If not, do you have someone you trust who can administer them to you when needed (the "J.B." approach).  This can work well.  It is really a balancing test.  Balance the positives of the opiate (pain relief and "buzz") vs. negatives (social problems, tolerance...).  Then decide what is best for you.  No easy answer because you do have real pain.  BUT, when the meds are causing more problems than they are helping, I think you may have your answer.  Good luck and please post and let us know what you decide. Brian

[opi]

i am 48 hours clean........3-6   80's a day (oxy's)....i thought i had it together and people fooled but my wife said a bunch of things and ended it with "and this is why i know"..everything she said was true...i was blown away....yesyerday was a living hell...i have an oxy with my cofffee everyday and this starts my engine....i could barely get up the stairs to barf....today was(is) bad...when my brain wanders into oxyland i start to gag...anyway i've been reading your posts and it has helped.i don't know anyone that knows what it's like....i think i can win the battle(i fought myself for hours this eve to not go and score) but i am worried about the war...i think to to the future and it scares me..i am trying to see the future without any opiates as a great thing but the ox in my head is messing with me bad....anyway thanks,,,,it's nice to know i'm not the only freaker around....peace

[No name22]

WOW that many and you're clean...GOOD FOR YOU!!!! I tappered down to 30 mg's a day and today I traded my 80 oc for 8 8mg suboxone and now it's just me getting off 100% You have to do it for yourself and just to be normal again, because you don't know what you look like on drugs **** I barely remember this yr...


Oh and you're posting to a post from 2000

[opi]

lol...noticed the date,,,,i just needed to type sumtin man,,,,,,i'm cracking up.....this sucks....as soon i stop doi sumtin the brain sends me to a bad place and the battle is to fierce to do 24 hrs a day//////stay pre occupied....i broke my last 3 days into 1    80 and then stopped,,,just don't know if i'm guna make it....if i have a hickup i will try again until i'm well again...it's been a few years with oxy's but many years with perks and stuff...it's just to good...i fuckin hate it

[No name22]

BELIEVE ME!!! I was doing 120mg's a day...It's honestly not worth it I make alot of money and since my addiction i've been broke spent THOUSANDS of dollars so no more vaca's gucci, louie, dior ect.. no nothing, but debt which i'm going to file BR and misery.

[No name22]

Since you're quiting why don't you try to contact some suboxone clincs, because it's going to be hell w/out anything i was wiggen out.

[opi]

i don't want to put myself out there,,,,have been a closet junkie for a long time and do not want peeps to know...i am a 40 ear old father of one and know  a lot of peeps and  would like to remain closeted...if things get horrible i will drive to next city for this kind of help...the wife has no mercy...she think you just stop.....i've been trying this for a long time but now i have everything to lose and feel that i deserve what is here and comming...if all goes bad,i will go to my fam doc and fess up and see what he thinks.....that alone would be a major step for me...i don't like to admit stuff
to anyone(i did to wife though)

[No name22]

Honestly I understand you 100% I was going to tell my dr. today and then didn't, because I needed my clonipins filled early, because someone stole them and I didn't think he'd believe me so I bought sub.'s off a friend...There are soooooo many clinics just type in suboxone clinics and you can put in a zip code.

[opi]

i did not make it........fook!..........trying again...i'm fighting the self loathing feeling...almost feel like a loser...thx for your input.....i did some thinking and i have been abusing something or another for 25 years......had a couple sober years....not even herb...<---that is amazing....i hate online **** but have found this helpfull and i am very private(only my junky buds know the real deal)....keep an eye out for my post cuz as i said it helps to talk about it(type)....thinking about finding na meet to go to....hear some real bad *** stories and see where i don't want to be.....it would be different if i did not have 10 plus serious injuries/surgeries.....i don't know anymore....i've quit all drugs in past but the opiates have got me bad.....well...at least i am still employed   :) peace man....thx

[ImDrugFree]

For everyone reading this forum, and is trying to quit opiates. I feel you trust me, but I am going to supply you with some information you are probably don't want to hear, meetings(been there done that ********, they made me want to do drugs more, after seeing how pathetic there speeches were). I haven't used any opiates since 2001, it's hard but you just have to step up, be a man quit, say your going to quit, look at yourself in the mirror and "Say look it, you ******* junkie, your are quitting whether you like it or not." I had relapses where I would want to go buy more, and I would start running as fast as I can until I couldnt run anymore, and pass out, by the time I woke up, the anxiety was usually gone. After about six months the relapses stopped, then I realized there was only one problem left, that would stop me from quitting, and the worst part of all, most of my friends were also junkies, I approached them one day and said, I am going this way, you can either follow or stay behind, but don't bother calling me or comming around me if you are high, and if you ever offer me this **** again, I will break your face. Too sum it up, withdrawl symptoms, anxiety, and all the other things that come with it, were not the hardest part, it was losing like half a dozen of my freinds who I had grown up with, I ran into one about a year ago, and he really looked like ****, I said WOW I am so god damn glad I quit, or I would look like him, I can now look at them and see how pathetic they are, I have moved on, I still enjoying many things sober, I have a job where I get random tested and its not a problem, I have gained so much confidence in myself, lost all suicidal tendencies and learned more about self control, destroying your inner beast, I am so confident that I go out and have a few drinks once or twice a month on the weekends, and I really enjoy that but once the nights over I rest sunday and I get back to work, you see part of the feeling was also that you think "man I am never going to be able to alter reality again?" "feel good?" and that was too much some people its all or nothing, but if you can learn to control yourself then down the road, I wouldnt recommend in the beginning go have a few drinks, take a few hits off a joint occassionally, find a good job, you will be able to get a better one most likely, since all the good ones these days to random testing, I use to see that drug waiver and quit on the spot, once you have some money, buy yourself things, keep yourself clean, get dressed up, try to pick up woman, or even get a girlfriend, travel, see the world, theres alot more out there than you can imagine in a dark room, dark life, where you never see the sunshine, I am living proof of there being light at the end of the tunnel!!!!!!! Believe in yourself, become skitzo talk to yourself in third person, yell at yourself until you discipline yourself. PS Martial Arts are better than AA meetings!!!!

[aliceof3]

I appreciate all the info ,I am dealing with vicodin addiction and I want to stop so bad. I need guidance with coping with the mental and physical withdrawals,if anyone can give me some advice on tapering , I would greatly appreciate it