oxycotin detox and methadone maitnance

[hippy]

i have a neice who is 19 and has been hooked on oxycotin
for about 2 years,in the philadelphia area the neww solution
for young people to get off it is methadone maitnance for
a one year program, that cost 100 dollas a week.
with all my experence with drugs , useing them and getting clean
she asked me what i thought,it was drastic but probley safer.
my question is , im i crazy but woulden't a 30 day detox/rehab
be smarter then getting locked into a year long metadone program.i would think as a society we could offer young people
a better solution,my neice has told me she has more then a few
friends who are now involved with the methadone program due
to oxy addiction, all being under 21. due they have shorter
methadone programs, she also said they want cash and you can try to get your ins to reinburse you.
i have no experence with these programs.
any input  would help.
thanks --------------hippy

[pammy0690]

I have several young friends who entered a methadone clinic for oxy addiction three years ago.  They are still there!  She would be better off going inpatient or do a suboxone detox at home or an outpatient program.  She need not be embarassed oxy addiction is so common.  Please try to steer her away from methadone.  Even if you could team up with family members to help her detox would be better.  I would hate to see her wind up like my friends.  As a fellow PA resident I can tell you our clinic here in the Northwest side of PA are money grubbing pimps.  THat is the best thing I can say about them.  Please tell her to be careful.  Pamela

[pax]

SOUNDS LIKE A HELL OF A LONG TIME TO DETOX AS I AM NOW 3 WEEKS OFF OF 4 1/2 80MG PILLS(CHEWING THEM) TWICE A DAY PLUS 18NORCO AT ONCE AND I FEEL PRETTY GOOD GOING ON THE COLD TURKEY USING A CLONODINE PATCH AND SOME ATIVAN. GOING FROM ONE ADDICTIVE DRUG TO ANOTHER DOESN'T SOUND LIKE THE CLINIC HAS THE PATIENT'S BEST INTERESTS IN MIND @ $100 A WEEK TO BOOT! CASH! MY ADVISE WOULD BE TELL HER TO SEEK ANOTHER OPINION OR BETTER YET DO WHAT I DID UNDER DOC SUPERVISION AND COULD WASH HER HANDS OF THE WHOLE DRUG SCENE IN A FEW WEEKS. 2 OF WHICH DO SUCK! THE FIRST TWO OF COURSE. TELL HER GOOD LUCK-

[hippy]

thanks pam,
i was thinking the same thing about them
but i did not want to rush to such a judgement
without 1st getting some input.
the people i know who have been on methadone maitnance
were buying other peoples dose's
my only concern was ,my neice and her friends drink
and i read that drinking and oxy   can be a deadly mix.
i have already lost a younger brother to an accidental
overdose, he was drinking and taking xanax but his friends
spiked his beer with heroin,when he fell out they took his
money and went to cop , when they came back later the next morning he was dead. these were all people he went to grade school and high school with, one of them was a friend of mine and he told me what really happened 6 months after the fact,
because the guilt was eating him up.
my brother had been clean for 14 years , a few months previous to this. so i have to be carefull what i say to my neice.
my neices mother , my sister and i do not talk as it is, due to
her being an active alcoholic.
thanks agian

[RobynBanks]

Methadone works well for some situations. I am on a low dose of methadone but I am not 'locked' into anything. I can decrease in dose anytime I want and do not feel like I am a hostage. Many abuse the methadone program-I suppose its like anything-If you want it to work for you, you have to do the work. There is discomfort while tapering down. If you DON'T really want to get off of all drugs-you will end up on methadone for perhaps the rest of your life. Its not a cure. There are short term detox programs available-perhaps that's better. She certainly has to be serious though. Yes, If she does oxys with meth-she could die. I guess it all depends on the person-if she has only been on oxys a short while and sh'e so young...maybe its not the best thing OR maybe she will end up in jail detoxing one day (might be a good thing). I think you need to be tough on the young ones...maybe you need to scare the **** out of her?....take her to a morgue or something. Its a tough call.
Good luck

[RobynBanks]

on the other hand...I went on methadone at the age of 26/27 (sorry can't remember exact) and stayed on for 1.2 yrs, It stabalized me and it was much safer than the heroin that I was on. I kicked the meth and stayed clean for 7.5yrs.  I was going to school at the time, stayed on a low dose and took it very seriously  ...I didn't mess with any other drugs. I think it saved my life but I see some people just  accepting that they will be on meth for the rest of their lives and this to me is kind of sad.
Hope she gets the help she needs.

[hippy]

thank you for your input, your experence is very helpful.
peace!!!!!!!!!hippy

[Anhedonio]

How would you feel if you had just celebrated your 1st anniversary of switching to Methadone instead of what you have accomplished? 19 is too young to be jumping from the frying pan into the fire.

I'm assuming your niece is not using oxy for chronic pain, but simply abusing it. Is it worth $5000+ to put your addiction on hold for a year? Then what?

JMHO,
James

(congratulations on your year BTW. I'd love to be able to look back on a year clean)

[RobynBanks]

on the other hand...I went on methadone at the age of 26/27 (sorry can't remember exact) and stayed on for 1.2 yrs, It stabalized me and it was much safer than the heroin that I was on. I kicked the meth and stayed clean for 7.5yrs.  I was going to school at the time, stayed on a low dose and took it very seriously  ...I didn't mess with any other drugs. I think it saved my life but I see some people just  accepting that they will be on meth for the rest of their lives and this to me is kind of sad.
Hope she gets the help she needs.

[AKA Fool]

I've been a lurker for years, however, this post has prompted me to speak up.  I am a 30 yr old ex -  x-treme knuclehead..meaning I've done many stupid dangerous things in the last 15 years that have hurt my body probably beyond repair.  In any case, I have been battling chronic back pain for over 4 years now.  During this time, I've tried pain meds, steroids, and pt.  The pain meds have been the only thing that has allowed me to sit 8 hrs a day to make a living.  Without them, I can't last 15 minutes.

Eventually, the 6 Norco/day wasn't cutting it and I began uping my dose.  My doc thought methadone (30mg daily) was the next logical step as it would give me a more constant pain reduction throughout the day to elleviate the ups and downs I was trying to deal with (you know, being a clock-watcher for the next available dose according to your script).  Supposedly, this was to be only for 8 weeks.  

A year and 1/2 later, the 30mg isn't enough and my doc says its time to take a break from the methadone to reduce my tolorence--- at least a 3 month break.  I tried tapering for the last 3 months, but it was too much.  However, I knew what was coming (doc walking in and saying, NOW is the time).  So, last Saturday, I c/t on my own.  

I am now on Day 8.  The first 5 days I had all symptoms (constant cramping, willies (RLS), no sleep, shits, towering emotions, helplessness, etc..) and thought I was going to die and/or kill myself just to get away from it.  On the 6th day, went to the Doc and told him where I was at.  He gave me some clonipin, ctepress (blood pressure cause I was at 146/100), and some ambien.  He was shocked; which made me feel good because I accomplished what I set out to do, which was take that monkey down on my own terms; on my time (we all know my back was against the wall).  But the reality is, methadone is a gorilla.

I'm depressed, I don't have any energy, patience, or desires-  for anything.  My back hurts like hell and I feel there's no hope that I won't be thinking every day about taking those pills that seem to numb the pain and everything else away.

Doc says this withdrawal phase with methadone can last up to 5 to 6 weeks. Frying pan indeed.Anybody have any ideas on how you beat the methadone gorilla when you have a back pain gorilla too.

Please think long and hard about methadone maintenance for anything.  When it's time for me to decide whether to go back on, its going to come down to whether or not I'll be garunteed to be on it for the rest of my life (which I know he can't); Because I know I couldn't do this again.  

Fool

[theGolden1]

You sound like you have been through alot. You didn't say what the chronic back pain was coming from. I have fibromyalgia and after 2 years of ultram, I am using other methods to control the pain. My condition comes and goes and I can do things to help myself. I do a whole routine in the morning to feel better and get moving. I have cut down the ultram to a small dose only in the morning and I quit taking ambien 2 nights ago (after 2 years)
I am using sonata instead ... but my goal is to be drug free. I know I can do it. Long lasting drugs are very hard to get off of. I would never go back to methadone. That is the Nazi drug. So what if you need to use pain meds again ... at least you will be able to get off ..... good luck, Goldie

[ceriedwen5]

hello i am berta,
i found a way to get off the narcotics,maybe this will help someon out there,,,maybe not ,but here it goes. A JUICER ,,,juice your way through the withdrawls,you will feel so good you wont believe it,also there is a vitamins called ULTRA ENERGY NOW,they sell the packets in the jiffy markets,all herbs no jun.et me know if it helps anyone ,,,t took me 4 years to do this and it is the only thing they did it for me and i was bad,,,,love berta

[ceriedwen5]

The JUICER is the answer and the ultra energy vitamins please gie it try,and let me know how you feel.
berta

[hippy]

thanks for your response,
cognitive-behavior approach, i am not up to date  on such
an approach, i shall talk to my sister in law about it
,she is a doctor like yourself.
when i see the word cognitive , i think of awareness of self,
i am one of the 12 step people you have mentioned,
but unlike my father who is aa, and his step work is very
simple,
i have searched hi and low to find people who understood the 12 steps,working the 12 steps is a lot of writenig of inventory
about one self and what was the cercumstance and the consequence
of any situation.
comein to grip that i am the problem.
along with the principles.

how does your approch work.i am sure some people here
would be interested.

[RobynBanks]

I think you had such a hard time because you did CT at 30mg....I did that too- Its brutal, I wished I was dead too....swore a would bever go through it again. Now here I am- on 25mg meth/day....ACK! I plan on yapering VERY slowly this time. Excersise helps get your body back to narmal faster-If you can MAKE yourself do it.
Good luck

[vettezr1]

Welcome, I fully understand. Does your back pain radiate down into your legs?
My lower legs and feet feel like ants are eating my flesh off. The only thing I can add is that having suffered several broken back episodes from testosterone induced stupidity.
I went through the high does pain med route it worked for a while but when I stopped I got really sick. So it’s only a temporary fix at best.  After the WD’s were over the back and leg pain came back with a vengeance, I work out ever day except weekends got my weight back down and take a drug called Tizanidine, its non Narcotic and not addictive and you can stop taking it whenever you want. It does not work very well at all but it does help take the edge off a little. I think I am getting a bit better as time goes on I think I building up a tolerance to the pain again. The best advice anyone can give to a fellow bad back sufferer is to MOVE as much as you can walk stretch bend it takes time but its all we got. I have read a lot of the posts here about a drug called Nurontin not sure if I spelled it right, but be careful with that one it really only helps with phantom pain not pain from known or mechanical damage like we have it also has a very nasty side effect of causing marked weight gain.   Good luck.

[AKA Fool]

Thanks for the feedback guys.  It really does help hearing from others.  At this point, I will try anything "natural" that I can.

Hippee, I re-read my post and realized I didn't really address your question for your niece (or whomever).  IMO, its hard to compare the long, drawn out w/d of methadone to coming off of high dose oxy. My caution is, you're trading a longer wd period that may or may not be helpful in getting through recovery.  1 yr on methadone and the drug has imbedded so far into my tissues that I'm not able to comprehend life without it. Coming off may end in a tailspin back to the beginning.  Not saying this is inevitable, just my opinion.  Oxy w/d is supposedly 10 days, but may have more violent symptoms.  I don't think its suppose to imbed into your system as much as the methadone, however.  Think long and hard about what path to take.

As for alternatives for my back pain.  I'm doing what I can.  I have a 3 month ridgeback puppy that went on a 2 hr walk with me last night; what a trooper.  Over the course of this last year, I've been going to the gym at least 4x weekly to get stronger and hopefully build enough support muscles that I can kick the back pain gorilla too.  We'll see though, as I was on the meth the whole time I was in training.  Haven't been able to make it back in since D-day.

For me, I find myself contemplating alot of things.  Whether being numb (pain and emotion) is better than being awake and aware of my pain with all that comes with it.  

Now its time for me to get to the bottom of things instead of using the bandaid.  Hopefully, I'll find an answer.  I wish the same for all of you.

[babyboomer]

I have been on methadone for chronic pain for a year now. (prescribed by a pain specialist) This is what his sales pitch was(since I had tried and been on everything else) He said that it doesn't break down through your liver, but goes directly into your bloodstream. He said it one dose stays in your system 24hrs.(instead of the take every four hrs.,like oxys. ect.)He said it isn't as hard on your body.YOU SHOULD HAVE SEEN ME WHEN I WENT THROUGH WITHDRWL, CAUSE I HAD RUN OUT!!!NOT HARD ON THE BODY?? I hate hospitals-but I knew I either go or the dehydration from vomiting,the horrible pain, the hallucinations, the hot and cold sweats, the rapid and high blood pressure, the shallow breathing, and no sleep for 72 hrs, were going to kill me!!!(THEY GAVE ME A STRONG SHOT OF VALIUM AT THE HOSPITAL, AND THAT didn't phase me )It took four shots of valium,five shots of vomiting medicine(within 6 hrs) to just ease the symptoms. I lost ten lbs. in 48 hrs.I am an addict because of major surguries done 10 yrs. ago. And I developed fibromyalgia.I just know if you want off- you better find a way without methadone. I was really naive about it.Trouble is, my pain is real. So I still take it.My regular Dr.,who live in the town I do(my pain specialist is 200 mi. from here) wouldn't believe me when she saw me in the ER ROOM, THAT IT WAS WITHDRAWL.She wanted to do gallbladder tests and everything else.I don't know, but I think she did not want to talk about it. Anyone know why she would be this way? I need lots of suppoert to stay on the right dose, so this does't happen again.
           THANKS FOR LISTENING! BOOMER

[RobynBanks]

What was/is your dosage?....Its important to taper off methadone VERY slowly. Its also important to be on the correct dose-don't take more than you need-you know how hard it is to come off of it. Methadone stays in your system OVER 24hrs. I believe after the first 12-24hrs- it has a half life (half strength) that lasts up to 36 or 48hrs hence the detox is slower=takes a long time to get out of your system. I would never ever consider coming off of it cold turkey; I have done that from 15mg but it was a horrible experience. This time, I plan on decreasing by 1 mg/week (I'm at 24mg) until completely off. After that I will have some valium or prescription sleep aid as well as an anti-depressant on hand. It takes a good 4 months to  feel normal again.  I am aware that I am fortunate in that my insurance covers methadone 100%, so finances are not an issue. If this is an issue for you-go down faster (by 5mg/week) until you get to 15-20mg and then take it down slower (2 mg/week). Though its still going to be expensive, it will make the detox MUCH less painfull therfore chances of relapse will be reduced.
Good luck, Robyn.

[AKA Fool]

Boomer-
I'm sorry to hear of your suffering.  I am currently on day 14.  I had a similar pitch, "This drug is good for chronic pain because of the long half-life.  You won't have to bare the ups and downs of intense pain as you're waiting for the next dose of (Perc, Norco) to kick in.  We'll just give you a break from that cycle for a few months and see if that helps cool down your back pain/spasms.   Then the wd of coming off will be much more milder than any other drugs.  You'll just feel tired for about a month. "  I was also told its easy on the liver, however, it does imbed itself in your fatty tissues.  Takes forever to purge it completely out.

This is still kicking my ass.  I've been going on (2) two hour walks a day.  Have had 2 massages and 3 acupuncture treatments.  Am taking Klonipin, Catapress, and Ambien for withdrawal/ sleep aids.  Also, since my back pain has come back with a vengence, I've resigned to taking Darvon-N 100 during the work day just to get by.  I had a really hard time doing this because I beleived the goal we set was to give the pain meds a break for at least 3 months to see if we could reduce my tolerance.  So, now what, Darvon?  They suck anyways, but do help take the edge off a bit.

I don't know what I'm going to do.  The wd is getting easier, but my back pain is getting worse.

Banks-
I did try the taper a few months back.  Of course, I tried 5mg drops per week.  I was sick as **** and couldn't hang with it.  Went back up to the full dose.  Guess trying smaller cutbacks may have helped.  But, WTF, why extend the misery longer than its going to be anyways?  

C/T off methadone was the hardest thing I've ever done in my life.  I'm just now able to work a full day with the help of the other meds.  Then its straight home to walk the dog.

Best of luck to you both.

[babyboomer]

Hi Robyn-it's Boomer.
      I am suppose to be taking 30 mgs. of Methadone a day. Problem is-if I am having a particularily hard day(pain wise),I always slip up and take extra, thinking I will cut back later.(cause they won't fill it too soon)And I USUALLY END UP SHORT AT THE END OF THE MONTH.I am a complete knothead!!But I did not know that ,(until you told me)taking a higher dose makes the withdrawl worse.Twice I ended up in the hospital from running out too soon.(so bad!!) Sometimes I got the scrupt filled before the hard core withdrawl set in. And then I about dumped the bottle down to sraighten myself out. I truley need help-don't I??This is the first time I have talked to someone about this. Like I said- my Drs.,either really don't know what's going on,they don't care, or they are afraid to talk about it.(??)Part of me wants to to get off of the meds-but what if the pain gets so bad , and the Drs. won't put me back on them.At least finding this sight has given me some hope. (AND KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THE DRUG)
I didn't know Methadone hides in your tissue.(EMBEDS ITSELF)I truley need support to control this dragon!!Just listening has meant the world to me. "THANK YOU" SO MUCH!  P.S. (DOES ANYONE HAVE SKIN PROBLEMS BECAUSE OF THE DRUGS?I get terrible cysts.)
   BOOMER

[HydroMan]

PLEASE CHECK THIS OUT!!!  I quit cold-turkey 3 years ago (from hydrocodone, oxy.,...whatever the opiate du jour...massive doses).  As many of you know, cold-turkey detox is "hell on earth" I was curled in a fetal position for about four weeks, when I wasn't sitting on the toilet.  "When is this feeling gonna go away?!!"..."Will it EVER go away?!!"  Most of you know the feeling where simple things/functions are impossibly hard.             Anyway, I got through it....for two years, until.............a year ago I strained my back, got some pills from a "friend" and through some internet savvy found myself up to 8 norco a day.

Last Thursday I went to my doc and came clean. Hoping to be "weaned", I was disappointed (actually devastated) that my Doc wouldn't take that approach.  After consulting with the resident detox specialist, here's what I was given:

Valium -- 5mg (1-2, three times a day)
Catapres Patch (Clonidine)
Darvocet -- 3 times/day (for pain)
Bentyl -- as needed for stomach cramps
OTC Immodium (for reasons known to most here)

I left the office with major anxiety, being very skeptical that ANYTHING could stave off my impending withdrawals.

I took my new meds, got up the next morning AND PLAYED 18 HOLES OF GOLF!!!!....a business thing I was certain that I would have to cancel.  

I'm just past that 1st critical week, and the worst I've felt is being a little "drag-ass" tired as the day wears on. No diarrhea,cramps, and VERY LITTLE edgyness and dysphoria.

Doc told me that this particular "cocktail" has recently become recognized as an effective detox treatment.  I can wholeheartedly attest to it.

Do yourself a huge favor, and bring it up with your Doctor.  Also recognize the downside in that because this detox has been "easier", the deterrent factor of painful withdrawal isn't there, so the temptation for later relapse is a concern.  

Good luck, I really hope that I've helped.  

[Thomas050]

Hi all,
Reading here is wonderful, I wish I would have seen this before my gilfriend went to a Methadone clinic to end her addiction to Vicodin.
The methadone clinic was explained as a "detox program". However once she went on it, and then could not taper off, I did research and found that most people end up staying on it for life (maintenance) hence the term MMT (methadone maintenance treatment). There is a site (orgainzation) about, and most of the regulars in the forum there promote it as MMT and liken Methadone to insulin.

Be VERY WARY of going on Methadone to get free of addiction. It is prob one of the top 3 addictive drugs in the world. People on it have refferred to it as "handcuffs" and "trading a monkey for a gorilla". The only good thing is that it is doctor regulated (safe) and usually requires counseling. So for some I guess it is a better choice. But just know the ball and chain that it is and consider that heavely. Personally, I would try anything and everything else first.

Part 2 to the story. I dabble in the pain meds abuse myself. I have a love hate relationship with them. I am nowhere near the physical addiction as some here explain, I take them here and there and can go weeks without them. But I do love the feeling from them, heck who doesn't like to fee great?? But once on on them for a few days I start to HATE being on them. I end up going to sleep vowing not to take any the next day, then all throughout the next day that feeling starts to change. And by the the end of the ride home from work I have decided to take some. I see how they work, so I stop for weeks at a time to avoid getting into trouble with them. During that time I focus on the Hate part :) This could be how it starts for everyone, I may be playing with fire. But for now I am using them to get thru the rough spots in life. Plus, I don't drink when I use them, so my body gets a break from the alcohol :)

Best
T

[RobynBanks]

Thomas-please read my post below to you. You cannot advise on something you do not understand. Dabbling in narcotics to get through the 'rough spots' WILL catch up to you. Its the psychological dependance that is holding you and that's the toughest part to break. Since you're not on the fence (not physically dependant and aware of the psychological dependancy). NOW would be a good time to CUT THE CORD. Find another means of coping with the 'downs' of life. Best of luck & be strong.
AKA Fool-You're past the worse part!!!! I applaud you. Keep it up because the detoxing will continue to get easier I SWEAR. Yes it takes a LONG time to get out of your system. The leg aches were the worst lingering symptom for me. Its wears on you because it takes so long but if you do things to speed up the process (excersize & sauna=sweating it out , drinking water ALL day), they will make a difference. Give it another 2 weeks and things will be get easier. I'm routing for you, Robyn.
babyboomer- Go slow slow slow...its the only way to go. A slower detox will make the symptoms less severe and therefore managable. I couldn't tolerate it if I didn't detox slowly- it would push me off the edge and perhaps I would 'slip'. Make it easier on yourself so that you don't panic and end up messing up your taper. I havn't heard of the cysts you mention. Maybe do a search on 'methadone side effects', its possible that it has nothing to do with the meth or are they realted to sweating caused by meth.
All the best Robyn.

[MethMan]

With all due respect, I feel compelled to disagree with parts of your comments regarding methadone.
When in the throws of opiate use, a common sense approach; researching before getting on Methadone simply didn't come to mind with me.  Instead, one usually listens to the good doctor.  After all, we're in his/her office for help and the doc knows best, right?
Methadone may be a good choice for those suffering from chronic pain.  No doubt it's stable characteristics provide a better lifestyle than that of other opiates.
For the remainder of the world, I can (with experience) tell you that methadone is without a doubt, a legal nightmare regardless of whether or not one receives their dose at the top of the hill in their neighborhood or next to the park where the stuff is sold outside the confines of the clinic.
I pray that the new drugs recently available will help those unfortunate souls suffering from CP and allow others a more dignified means of helping themselves through this quagmire called addiction.

[pammy0690]

I have to agree with Methman and Thomas.  I think Thomas has had enough experience to give his personal opinion.  Methman has been in recovery for a great number of months after a ten year stint on methadone.   I do not think there is a better person on this forum to discuss Methadone.  Again this is only my two cents worth but I have seen many poeple struggle to get off of methadone and it ain't pretty. But for some CP suffers it is viable option when they are in massive amoutns of pain and need a stable med.  Respectfully, Pamela

[RobynBanks]

Well I can't speak for anyone but myself (and I do not suffer from CP), but I have had a lot of first had experience with methadone maintenance and detox. It literally saved my life once and for that, I am grateful it is available as an alternative. Unfortunately-no, there are not many options for the opiate addicted. I am open to any out there but there just aren't there! (Bup is not avail in Canada). I am neither PRO or ANTI methadone. Its effectiveness is dependant on many variables in your life and on the person. I have had a successful experience with detoxing off of meth and no it was not pretty but I did do it without being hospitalized and remained clean for 7.5yrs I agree, when in the midst of a crazed addiction- you just want help. However, if anyone is inquiring about it on this board-they are doing the research. I think all sides should be put forth in order to help the person make the best decision for themselves. Methadone is not the ideal solution but for some it is the best solution currently out there. Lifestyle plays an important role of course...if you can drop out of your for a week or so to do a CT -why bother with the meth? Personally I have 2 small children to care for- so it is something I can handle...and am able to decrease slowly at times when my life permits.
There is nothing wrong with disagreeing with a person on the board if it helps someone else.....they get to see multiple points of view on the issue at hand. Anyone with FIRST HAND knowledge of being on or detoxing off methadone, has a point of view to share-this is not a competition. I have experience on meth maintenance, meth detox and 7.5 yrs of sobriety post-methadone. I share this in hopes of helping others rather than misleading.
respectfull & real, Robyn.

[AKA Fool]

I think I'm going to make it.  Of course, am somewhat worried about what happens with no Darvon (which seems to help with the breakthrough pain) and Clonipin (which just makes me feel tired w/o the ability to fall asleep). These will most likely be removed this week.  

But, so far, no more willies to deal with.  Back is still hurting, but I'm managing with a reduced schedule and lots of walking.  I'm starting to feel better about life; not in such a fuzz so to speak.  I went out with some friends that flew in from out of state last night.  At closing time, my buddy made an off-color comment to a girl.  She went off.  My friend walked off.  I was looking around at the night sky...then the girl's boyfriend came up and popped me square in the mouth as .  Mob scene insued. I am truly too old for this **** and have never been the fighting type anyways.

But, you know what?  All I could think was this is still better than days 2-8 of my detox off the methadone.  I'm sitting here with fat lips and a torn gum line actually feeling better than I did last week.  Might actually make it through a full day of work.  This is day 17 for me.  Thank you all for your support...I will return the favor if I can.

Peace

[Thomas050]

RobynBanks
Thanks, I appreciate your feedback. The only thing is without them I was having a very difficult time getting thru some days. I saught therapy and was put on several antidepressants, it was all a joke. The pain pills actually really help. Basically I am taking charge of my own mental well being for the moment. Before I had them my depression was so bad I contemplated suicide several times. Since I have them I have not thought about that once. So it is a good thing in my life right now. I understand the addiction factor and I am really glad I found this website, there are so many nice people here, and there is alot of insite from the school of hard knox. That's actually more helpful than the theripists I have been to who got A's in gradschool ;)
I basically need to just bide some time while my emotions heal and I am being very careful with them. I know there will be a time when I won't need them, but right now I do. I haven't had probelms qutiing other addictions (cigarettes, 4 year/ $50k cocain habit).
I do see the bad side of them and how they can cause a problem though. 1) The tollerence factor. I prob don't even need to explain that to ya'll.
And 2) When i stop for a few days my depression is magnified horribly. It's amazing. But  just knowing I can ease it by taking the meds, helps.
I'm being VERY warry.

Kind regards,
Thomas050

[RobynBanks]

Hi Thomas,
I understand your situation 100%, I have self-medicated for most of my life. As long as you can keep it in check (physically, emotionally, financially)...maybe its  a good method of 'damage control'. I hope you find a better way of coping (I hope I do as well) but in the meantime...we all deserve to be as happy as possible. Feel no guilt and keep your eyes open at all times. I really appreciate you honesty, its very refreshing.
Sincerely, Robyn.

[MethMan]

Apparently, you've come face to face with an addiction that no man has successfully detoxed from.  Women.
All one can do is try and maintain one's dignity in the face of such a strong adversary.
I wish you luck, my friend.  To date, I've been unable to shake that particular addiction.
Peace,
Mike

[AKA Fool]

I'm amazed at your ability to see right through me.  

Even though the punch shouldn't have come my way given any direct reason, I'm sure it had something to do with karma.  We (that is my buddies and I), were attempting the "swoop and scoop" afterall...at closing, no less... at a bar that we should've known better.  In hindsight, I guess I had it coming giving the years of the addiction you speak of.  Especially, considering what I've got.

I'm still taking Clonipin 2x daily (probably 8 more days of these and that's it), but can proudly say I have beat that methadone gorilla for 24 days now.  I have also hiked 3 mountains with my dog and am feeling okay. Don't know why I did it.  Perhaps I thought the extreme excurtion would put me back in the pain zone where the meds would appeal again.  But strangely enough, it just made me feel better about me.

Next step is to get my mind straight....something more to get me that inner peace I just started searching for.  I know drugs aren't the answer.  Either are women, for that matter.

Thanks for listening.

[MethMan]

WOW!  Excuse my delay in responding. But by now, you will have massed over 30 days from methadone.  What an accomplishment!  Congradulations on a FANTASTIC job.
Have you done anything more spectacular in your life?  I know I haven't.
Step back, look in the mirror and feel nothing but pride.

[chick33npa]

My fiance, (getting married in June) has been on Oxy for approx. 2 months, started out 10, then 20, the 40, and then 80mg. Chewing 3 at a time,  just couldn't live without them. Couldn't face everyday occurances with out them.  It was terrible for me and our daughter to watch.  Today, finally, the doctor didn't give him anymore, a week before surgery on his back and now he is on Methadose,  don't completely understand why,  but hopefully it helps and after the surgery hopefully he can get away from all.  This is his second surgery in 3 years for a herniated disc.  All advice is welcome, this has been one tough road,  and I am sure it gets worse before it gets better.

[sassy020]

thanks for all your help!!! (this is casey) the numbness has stoppped so i dont know what the is all about..its day 2 of no pills an im in complete hell!!! i cant sleep and i have the worst back ache!! monday night i had the worst leg pains, but i took an asprin, and they were gone...my back hurts so bac, i can never get comfortable and it sucks!!! do you have any advice on getting throught this easier, drug free!! no xanax( i threw them out) no valium....i know hot baths and stuff like that...do you know of anything to make me sleepy???? this sucks!!! this is the worst pain i have ever felt!! but i was told to look at the pain as a good thing!!! like my body is winning!! you have been here for me and i want to thank you!!!

so any advice on how to get me through this would be a big help!!
im not on medhelp alot so if you would email me...or if anyone wants to email me!!!
caseywerd_311***@****

thanks again thomas!!!! you are a huge supporter!!!

casey

[NoTriplicates]

Writer's first posting to this forum. Have had a long protracted history suffering from the ravages of acute meningoencephalitis or "Mollaret's Meningitis" of viral etiology and for which there is no known cure. Treatment consists of saline drip and IM injections of meperidine HCL (Demerol), morphine sulfate, or equivalent. Accumulation of two dozen plus lumbar puncture procedures (spinal taps) since first diagnosis approx 23+ yrs ago has left the dura mater severely compromised and the L3/4/5
discs in the lower vertebrae have become herniated to the point where writer is now all but forced to take oxycontin otherwise
same will become terminally bedridden. MD now suggesting we try dolophine (Methadone) as I've lost 35+ pounds in a little more than three months. Anyone out there on methadone maintainence please advise. Thanks.

[MethMan]

Hello!
I wish I could provide what you are looking for.  I do have a few suggestions for you though.

Please try to post higher up in the threads here. You'll get more feedback.  Also, address your post to "MrMichael".  On almost every single point you made, he has commented on it in the past.  He's a wealth of information and you'd be well served by asking for some of it.

I wish you the best.
Methman

[mrmichael67]

Please email me at ***@****.  I am a chronic pain patient from two spinal fusions.  I am fused from L4-S1.  I am on methadone maintenance for pain and will be the rest of my life.  Methadone can be a touchy subject around here and I would feel more comfortable helping you on the side.  I have also been on almost every pain med under the sun at one point or another.  Please, do contact me.

[Debbie33]

Hi everyone, i am new here and this is my first time posting anything although i have been doing a lot of reading on this site.  I do have a commment to post but first i wanted to say thank you to all of you because although you dont realize it, you all saved my life.  I have been addicted to oxycontin, percocet, vicodin, fent. patches etc... for over 3 years and had a pretty hefty habit.  I had NO IDEA there was any help out there for someone addicted to oxy's!  ( oxy's were the "main" problem or D.O.C. )  i was sitting here balling my eyes out one morning saying to myself "how the hell am i going to get myself out of this mess??"  i came online and put in "oxycontin withdrawel" and found this message board.  I began reading and could not believe there were other people that were going threw the same thing as me and that there was help!!!!  I may be niave but honestly, id heard of "detox's" for heroin etc... but was unaware of how closely related oxy's were to heroin and that you could recieve the same rehab treatment.  So THANK YOU!! each and every one of you for being here and for saving my life, i have 3 children whom im sure are very grateful to you all as well :)  Okay, now for my comment....I agree with some of you how you say it depends on the persons state of mind to determine which route is best for them.  For me personally, methadone is the only thing that helps me.  I took the 9 day Detox route, the detox i chose used methadone to help with the withdrawel symptoms.  While i was at the detox i did not have any cravings for drugs AT ALL!  first time in a long time for that!!  The problem with this was since your only there for 9 days the methadone taper is rather rapid and when i left the detox i went right back to using, :(   i lasted only 2 hours.  I was so depressed and disappointed in myself but i remembered how i felt on the methadone.  You do not feel "high" but at the same time you do not feel sick.....no leg cramps, hand cramps, stomach pains, headaches,and most important ( to me anyways ) NO CRAVINGS!  I got a referal from the detox center for the methadone clinic here in my town.  I couldnt get in for a week and "used" the entire week :(  But i started the methadone dosing on wednesday, today is friday.....i havent touched a thing for the past 3 days and have no desire to what so ever!!!  Personally i think methadone gets a bad rap.  To me its like a miracle drug.  Its giving me my life back.  I do not understand exactly how it works although im learning more and more each day as ive collected much literature on it, but i do know it blocks something in your brain and keeps the cravings away and since it is a pain killing medicine i suffer no physical painful withdrawel symptoms and NO DEPRESSION!!!!    My depression when i would try to quit C.T. was a really big problem for me, i would get it really really bad and contemplate suicide as my only means "out".....i have no depression, no cravings and no body pains.....i love it.  I realize methadone is a touchy subject and views differ strongly, almost as strongly as the abortion issue, but for me personally, i think it is wonderful and would recommend it highly to anyone who would like to have the easiest possible withdrawel process.  Im unsure if im going to stay on methadone for the rest of my life or if i will begin a taper in 6 months.  Personally, ill probably stay on it for life because i have zero willpower.  I know people refer to it as "liquid handcuffs" but when i think of all i went threw on a daily basis to get the oxy's i can deal with a trip to the clinic every morning, plus you can earn "take homes" and recive a weeks worth at a time so you dont have to go every single day.  If anyone would like to talk to me about any of this or anything at all please feel free to email me at ***@**** in the subject line "message board" so i will know who you are and not delete you by mistake lol.  I wish everyone the best of luck in their journy for their sobriety!!!!!  God Bless you all!  and again, thank you for saving my life!!!!!   :)

[Debbie33]

hi guys.......im having trouble here, i cant find the message i posted yesturday and i cant see if anyone responded to it  : (  is there anyway one of you could email me at ***@**** and explain to me how i can find my post and how to check if there are any responses?  thank you so much!  im not sure if it even posted or if this one will either  :(     thanks in advance to anyone who can help me    :)
Debbie

[Expillman]

Debbie, congratulations on your success!  Please be aware that Methadone (Dolophine) is an opiod just like heroin or Oxycontin.  One of the properties of Methadone is that it has a long half-life and can accumulate in your system.  You CAN'T stay on it for a long period of time safely.  Make your goals incremental, but please consider the goal of becoming opiate free.  Please write me if you have questions, I worked in pain management for 20 years.

[jack daniels]

would someone please post the thomas resipe...i need the help...jack

[jack daniels]

the sooner you detox the better....don't put it off....5 day clean now.....life is aready better...you my feel like **** but on th e other hand you will be VERY prod of your self....GOOD LUCK....

[jack daniels]

get off asap...the only way to stop is to stop..... i will pray for you......but man get off the stuff...now!!!!

[doner]

OH MY GOD How could I have missed your post. METHADONE IS THE DEVIL. If it just takes away the wds and keeps away the depression and cravings as you mentioned then it's too good to be true. Trust me. I too was an opiate addict and thought using methadone was the best thing. Now I am in for the fight of my life. I used it for 6-7 mos and it worked, then what. Time to come off the methadone. It has been the longest most painful of all the opiate withdrawls. I am not kidding or over exaggerating it is a nightmare. I dont know what else to say to get my point across. No addict walks away with no pain. Trust me if methadone was a good idea for long term narcotic abusers everyone would do it. If you are as weak as you mentioned in your post you'll never be able to get off the meth. You will drag this ball and chain with you for the rest of your life. Please trust me. I as we speak am going through hell of my life. I wouldn't wish this on anyone. Would someone on this board who has more time in get to her. Methman, Where are you?  Truly yours,Melissa

[jack daniels]

just quit!!!!!just do!!!!!flush the **** ...and give it ALL up.....go through the w/d and be done with it....god bless..jack

[jack daniels]

may the good lord help everyone here..amen

[MethMan]

Debbie,
To use methadone for an extended period of time is a MAJOR mistake, unless it is being used for chronic pain.  All withdrawals are hell, to be sure.  But talk about a ride to hell, try meth W/Ds.  Right now, I am 7 months away from Day 1 and STILL feel the effects.  Someone with a lot more knowledge than I said that I could feel this for TWO YEARS.  Think about that one.  It's tough going through any withdrawal, but if you take on the meth monkey, she's got a little something for you, BELIEVE ME.
Meth can be used on a VERY SHORT timeframe to help get off a major oxy habit (or the like) but if you (and I do mean YOU) don't watch it, you'll wake up like I did 16 years later in line at a meth clinic.
You need to stop and really think this one over.  I mean REALLY think it over.
Peace,
Methman

[doner]

thank you for posting to Debbie about meth. I read a post in here somewhere (forget who it was from)that was talking about addiction being like a scary movie and wanting to yell"DONT GO IN THAT DOOR" and thats exactly how I feel for her. In her post she claimed it to be the WONDER DRUG which tells me she has no idea. At this point you are my HERO. You are where I want to be.I hoped that someone with more experience would get to her.Again, you are an inspiration to me and I think of you often. Take care,Melissa

[doner]

Hello all, I would like to post a formal appology,firstly to Debbie for giving such strong advice on her questions about Methadone. Stating that it was "THE DEVIL" was out of line and I also apologized at her personal website. Every individual choses their own path and decides what is right for them. I chose to use meth to w/d from opiates and made a bad decision. I walked into methadone  blindfolded. I am paying the consequences for my ignorance. My intention was never to offend but to protect people from making the same mistakes I made. I feel that methadone should be used for recovering heroin addicts or for those with chronic pain. However just because I feel that way doesnt mean everyone else should have to read about it.People come to this forum for help and advice and I should not be standing at the top of the mountain screaming that methadone is the anti-christ. At any rate I apolgize for voicing my opinion too loudly and please believe my intentions were good and were not meant to offend anyone as I appreciate everyone who has helped me here. I will make a true effort to only ask questions rather than respond to them due to my lack of knowledge on such things and amount of clean time. My deepest regets to those I have offended I will learn to behave in a more professional manner. Yours truely,Melissa

[handcuffed]

sorry about that first one :) im new on here and im in hell!! about to the point of suicide... im taking about 100mg or more of methadone a day (by needle) i was on oxy for fibro but the dude im living with takes all my meds. I dont have any one so I cant do anything. what do i do??
\

[handcuffed]

i want to quit but its hard for a 24 year old chik to go thru that bad of detox, hell its bad for anybody i just need help!!!

[Joanne19792001]

Hi,
You are on a 2003 post so you will probably better off posting a new question on forum. Sorry i'm not any help but just thought i'd let you know in case you were wondering why not many replies.