what drug has the worst withdrawel?

[DubeMechanic]

This may seem like a stupid question, but which drug has the worst w/d?

I hear methadone and ultram are the worst from what Ive read here.

Currently Im addicted to morphine and Fentanyl. I have a taper schedule ready, now I just need to get _me_ ready..

Also I hear Soma is addicting.. well thats another favorite of mine.. but Ive never had w/d from it, and Ive been up to 12-20 a day (4 at a time). When I run out, thats it.  It does have a tolerance though, used to be 1 or 2 would get me messed, now I take 4 and not really feel a thing.

Also, my worst experiences were with Soma.. woke up twice in jail because of it.

Every day I read this forum and every day I get closer to quiting. Keep posting everyone! It really helps.

DM

[konrado]

Opiates have the worst withdrawal everything from heroin to vicodin to oxycontin and anything else in that catagory. I know I have tried to quit vicodin 3 times in the last 4 months I had to get an ambulatory detox and still wished I were dead. I have a post in this forum check out title day 6. I posted on there again today.
You will **** your brains out and get tremors and cravings and hope to die. My emotional energy was gone. I cried and was close to tears most of the time. Had no energy. Legs felt like lead. If  you decide to quit get a medical detox or ask you doc for some clonopin to control some of the above symptoms. If not be ready for a week of pure hell.
You won't be able to pull it off yourself without some support. AA sounds corny but find a group near you and go. Enough for now.
Konrado recovering drug addict day 8

[hellbent]

For me, benzo w/d is the worst. I have never w/d from barbituates, but that is supposed to be bad too.

Everyone seems to w/d differently from different drugs. Opiates are the worst as far as depression, for me, but I w/drew from a big habit, and never had some of the worst symptoms: leg cramps, stomach cramps, etc...

Benzos have been the worst as far as physical symptoms. The **** that was happening to my body and mind was beyond anything I have ever experienced. Almost indescribable. For what it's worth, benzo w/d can cause seizures and death, like barbs and alcohohol w/d. The symptoms also last a long long time.

[winter68]

If your on morph and Fentanyl, sweetie your on the strongest of the strong, fentanyl is basicly pharmicutical herion, it was 1 of my favorites.I was a herion addict for 5 years and did every opiate I could find. I was on methadone for 2 1/2 years and today is my 1st day w/o it, I was on 120mgs and decreased 6mgs a week and stopped at 4, so far my w/d's haven't been too bad, if you taper slow enough you won't have any problems, you only get severe w/d's when you abruptly stop. if you taper slowly it gives you body a chance to start producing the natural opiate in your body called dopamine. when you take opiates your body stops producing these chemicals cause the drugs does it instead, when you just stop you get w/d's cause the right chemicals aren't there and it takes a while for your body to start producing it again, so going slowly gives your brain a chance to wake up and work right so you don't get so sick. that l-tysorine also helps your brain produce more dopamine, so does exercise, or doing something that consists of a pattern. I take that clonidine and somas, I've never heard they were addicting, my regular dr gives them to and he won't give me any good pain meds since he found out I was on herion. I cracked a disc in my back a year ago and thats all he'll give me is soma, so I don't think thay're too bad. Good luck, its hard, but with enough determination you can do it and if done the right way its not too bad, and its definatly worth it.

[konrado]

Makes sense to me. I stopped cold twice this month. Could only make it with medical ambulatory detox the 2nd time. So far I am on day 8.

[skipper]

hey people:
i've been an addict for +30 years and the worst w/d i've been thru
were from  sodium pentabarb (neumbutal <yellow jackets>). i spent
10 weeks in a mental hospital detoxing with the brekley barb. detox
method. this is the cruelest and slowest method out there. opiate
w/d will make you feel like **** and hope to die.... barbiturate &
benzo w/d will either kill you or cause permanent brain damage, if
not handeled properly. i've been thru w/d from just about every o-
piate out there and nothing comes close to barb and benzo's. my
standard advice to most junky's (opiate abuser) faced with w/d is
to just get on with them. OPIATE W/D WILL NOT KILL YOU or BRAIN
DAMAGE YOU!!
now barb's and benzo's are a different animal...so if that's your
problem watch out! and get some medical help

keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[DubeMechanic]

Hmmm.. sounds wonderful..

However like Skipper said, I wont die. I plan to taper down to about 50 mg oral morphine/2xday and then see what happens. Hopefully I will be able to find percs etc to taper from there.. Mr Michael posted a link that has an opiate conversion chart (thanks!).

So now I have another question :)

Do different drugs have different combos of physical and mental w/ds? IOW how long does the physical part last, and how long does the mental bit last?

Depression is no bag of fun (Ive done the Major Depression bit). Would Wellbutrin help?

DM

[a549056]

well friend, my last dose of oxycodone was wednesday, sept 11. i took 30 mg at 8:30 that morning. my 4th day started this morning. i started hurtin bout 4pm wed. i've quit 2 times before. its the same this time. 4th day, the worst. by 6 days i will be ok. oh i will hurt for bout 30 days but its bareable. i went this morning to see "the conection", drove right by the house but didnt stop. came home and cried. im 46, male, and cryin, aint that awful? if i can just get to monday mornin, ill be ok. every withdrawl is the worst my friend. it hurts bad. this is why all the re-lapses. right now, its 1:19pm, saturday. i feel like fu--ing road-kill. just plum hurt. by the way, certain conditions require me to do this on my own, cold turkey. all i have is you guys. please feel free to email me--anyone ***@****
thanks folks---

tom

[alexandra_r]

In my experience with opiates, methadone was the worst withdrawal because it is long-acting.  So, it stays in your system longer, and thus takes longer to leave your system.  I have never done oxycontin, but I would imagine it is harder to w/d from than vicodin because it is time-released--also taking longer to leave your system.

Withdrawal is highly individual.  I believe some people have just as hard a time getting through addiction to 5 - 6 pills per day as some do with 20+ pills per day.    Almost everyone experiences runs, shakes, sweats, skin-crawling (heebie-jeebies), nausea, and the physical part of withdrawal, but not everyone experiences the depression that some do.  My advice is to take it one day at a time--try not to expect the worst because often when you do that, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Exercise builds endorphins back up in your body.  Endorphins are your body's own natural pain killers.  This is why it hurts so much to go through withdrawal.  When you do opiates, your body stops producing endorphins at the rate needed--it figures, "hey--these synthetic endorphins are more efficient than these organic ones, so I'll just stop producing because they aren't needed."  So, exercise--even walking every day a little bit helps these endorphins start cooking.  Also, water is invaluable--drink as much as you can.  It  really helps to flush the **** out of your system.  Plus, be gentle with yourself.  

One thing I do that helps me enormously--I learned it over ten years ago in treatment.  I say my "gratefuls" every night.  Even if I can think of only one thing to be grateful for, I think about it.  Most nights I can think of things I have to be grateful for until I fall asleep.  If you remember how lucky you are, then you might not experience depression the way some people do.  At least that's my experience, strength and hope.

Good luck to you--I will send a couple up for you.

[skipper]

hey guys:
i used to have all the answers...last monday i lost a job (one i
really kinda' loved for 18 years) and i'm scared. now facing down
old opium jones is real bad news... and there is nothing more i'ld
love to do than offer help and encouragement to 'ya. in the the
words of an old Hoyt Axton song ...."it's the strength that you
share when your growing, that give me what i need most of all.

i'm just another junky, who wants to let you know- we're not pieces
of dirt **** that society tells us we are...

and get an angel on your shoulder
kip

[bmac]

Tom, I started wellbutrin about day 12 I think.I had been w/d ing
for hydro,oxy then Methadone.After I detoxed I began wellbutrin.
I stopped it after day 8,It gave me the shakes.Like bad speed.If your are depressed it can help,if it's just the w/ding thing,
Thomas's recipe will help that.It is listed throughout these boards.It will help the mental part of all this.
I started it last Sunday and I feel great again after 28 years of abuse.If I can do this believe me anyone can.B6,Magnesium
and zinc helps alot too.If your head aches and won't go away try calcium and Vitamain A.It works!As for the L-tyrosine I had
to not use this.It also gave me the shakes like bad speed.
Keep it up and you will get there.
                            bmac

[alexandra_r]

I'm so sorry to hear that you lost your job.  That's scary--especially with the economy what it is.   It sounds trite--but perhaps this will lead to something better?  You know . . . one door closes and another opens?  Probably doesn't help too much hearing it but know that you are in my prayers.  I hope you find a job that is 10 times better!~

Alex

[a549056]

tell me this feelin WILL eventually go away partner. your feelin great? no dope for how long? thanks

[a549056]

hahaha  you made me laff my friend--sayin "jonesin" aint heard that since the old days. sorry bout your job--drug screen??

jonesin in arizona

[bmac]

I started feeling better went I got some vitamins and days
between my nightmare.It hurt for 15 days then the mental **** took over.Thats when I began the vitamins.I felt better on day
21.I have been using since I was 16.I am 44 now.Last 12 years
on hydro,oxy then tapered with methadone.It was harder than anything I have ever done but I can promise it gets better.
Once your body gets something that helps the way you feel,it allows you and your brain to heal also.The main key to this **** is this.DON'T USE!
                              Find the Recipe!
                                  bmac

[never to far from fiorinal]

Has anyone heard of having your blood exchanged
to advoid the W/D ? I hear it's very expensive.

[DubeMechanic]

Ive heard this term several times here:  medical ambulatory detox

What exactly is that?

Thanks for all your posts folks :)

[skipper]

alexandra:
thanks for the prayers part...i think with the economy downturn i
will need them. i did data-comm for a small midwestern university
for 18 years...put in some 10,000 ether-net connections, etc.
some genius thinks they'll get the work done faster,beter, and
cheaper. ******* bunch of lame brain academicis.

the work group i was in lost 2 people and made 2 other go half time(they both said **** it and walked). by monday nite my boss's hands were so "bloody" that he stoped at my house on his way home. i think he was worried about me. when he heard my wife was trying to get me a airline tickeet to mpls where she was working for the week he told me he was taking a couple days of vacation and would drive me there. it just so happens the halfway point was his cottage on lake okiboji (a huge beautiful blue water lake. i was born 20 miles south of there) we stopped and went for a boat cruise and lunch and then continued to Mpls. when my boss delivered me to my wife he told her "yeah not only do i fire "em, i run out of town too!" ireally doubt i'll ever have the kind of job where we are all family again.......

a549056:
no urine screen...hell that would eliminate 75% of the work force. and besides all the dope in me is Rxed now! i'm 100%
legal now for years now

keep an angel on your shoulder (i'm going to take a bath, cause
old jones hates the feel of water on my skin)

kip

[winter68]

right before I got on methadone I tried to do a hospital detox, 3 days being given shot of bupernex, clonidine, catapress, and klonidine, as soon as they released me from the hospiatl, I went right to the dope mans house, the only thing that made me stop shooting up was methadone. There is a rapid detox process where they put you under for hours and they induce the w/d's while your knocked out, once you wake up you don't have any w/d's, I just couldn't afford it.

[Paige]

How or where can you ge l-Tysorine, Clonidine, and Somas?  Do I have to go to my doctor and tell him I am detoxing, rather not do that, but really need help with the energy level.

PAIGE

[winter68]

l-tysorine you can buy in a health food store its like a vitamin, as sore clonidine its a blood pressure meds which can only be prescribed, and somas a muscle relaxor which too can only be obtained by a dr, you can get somas if you complain about your back hurting, but its hard to get clonidine w/o telling them your detoxing unless you have really high blood pressure. its hard to tell you dr your detoxing alot of the don't understand and will look down on you, but there are some who understand. when I tried to get help from my dr on coming off herion, he said there was nothing he could do for me,and his whole addtitude changed towards,me so I went and got on methadone when he found that out he told me it was just as bad as dope, he totally treated me different after that, so I went and found a new dr and told him I was detoxing off methadone and he gave me clonidine, somas, phenergan which is for upset stomachs, naproxen for pain and klonipine for anxiety. so there are dr's that will help you and understand. If you need help w/ just energy those l-tysorine will help w/ that they make me speed up a bit, but I'm up too much right now myself so I stopped taking them till I get through these 1st few days. the clonidine makes me feel faint cause I already have low bp, and the somas relax your muscles. good luck

[Paige]

Thanks, I am on my way to the drug store tomorrow.   The last time I tried to detox, I actually fell asleep while talking to someone. That person happened to be my boss, not a good idea.  I also fell asleep driving and just about anywhere and every where else.  I have ambien, to help me sleep which I assume will act as a muscle relaxer at night anyway.  I think I can really do this this time.  I never had high blood pressure, but I do thing the Darvon is giving me high blood pressure.  Hot flashes, sweating, red face, never had that before.  Does any type of high blood pressure work.  Here I am killing my self, 4 kids, and I will wake up tomorrow and take 4 or 5 of the damn things, I know I will!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for your Post, I will try the l-Tysorine.

Paige

[Ronsin]

I am 51 years old. I first got addicted to barb's (Tuial, seconal) but I was always able to get off of it by cutting down. The I was addicted to percodan (oxycodone) & Tussionex (hydrocoden)for 10 years. I got off of it by taking codiene (Ty 3)& slowly cut down.It took about 6 months. I swore to myselfe I would never take anything stronger than DARVON. BOY WAS I WRONG! Iv'e been on it for 12 years & now am trying to stop. It is a lot harder than I ever thought. While doing reserch on Darvon, I found out that it is chemically simular to Methadone. In fact, the medical journal of Clinical Pharmacology say's that darvon's most prominent effect is it's addictive quality.
         The only way I can see gettig off of it is by using the Rapid - Detox Method...........

[puma]

I believe hellbent and skipper hit the nail on the head about the benzos being the worst or at least most dangerous W/D's.

I almost died in the seizures, hallucinations and DT's on a forced cut off of Klonopin last February. My Doc cut me off because I relapsed on drinking and began having blackout seizures that would last for up to two hours at a time. I guess she was afraid I would accidently kill myself mixing the two but instead she almost killed me. Threee weeks later while still in the DT's, she put me back on the 8 milligrams of Klonopin.

chatahan

[Ronsin]

Barb's & Benzo's may be the worst physiologically & mentaly but opiats are the most PAINFULL. I was addicded to barbs for years but was always able to get off by cutting down. It also may be the most dangerous,(I had 1 seizure comming off of barbs)I was stuck at an airport for a day & ran out of them. Also my wife just stopped taking furinals (barbs). She said it was the hardist thing she ever did. But she gets percosets from her doctor for PMS.(She hides them from me) I don't understand how how she can control them without getting addicted. 50 will last her 2 moths, & she just takes them when she's in pain.  So I guess the worst withdrall  depends on the person .
             Also last night I took clonidene, vitamins,xanax,& flexerol(musle relaxer).(The leg part is one of the worst simptoms. It helped a lot. Thanks...........

[puma]

Ronsin,

You are right. Each person has their own biologicaL makeup that makes withdrawal or addiction to different drugs different.

Percs were prescribed to me at one time after a hisorectomy and they did not even work. On then other hand, Ultram works excellantly and I need it for bad pain.

Yes, the DT's do give you severe pain like you would not believe. The muscles literally cramp all over and nothing stops it.

[puma]

Ronsin,

You are right. Each person has their own biologicaL makeup that makes withdrawal or addiction to different drugs different.

Percs were prescribed to me at one time after a historectomy and they did not even work. On then other hand, Ultram works excellantly and I need it for bad pain.

Yes, the DT's do give you severe pain like you would not believe. The muscles literally cramp all over and nothing stops it. The constant shaking like an earthquake is also extremely painfull. It's like doing isometric exercize for days on end and you can't stop it.

I have gone through Codiene withdrawal and was very uncomfortable, the pain returned worse than before taking them due to addiction but it was controlled fairly well with Motrin and Clonodine for 5 days.

[feels like bugs are in my brain!]

hey, i read your paragraph.......... dont get on klonopin. it is one of the hardest rxs to get off of, trust me ive tried 3 times. by the second or third day it litrerally feels like bugs are eating your scull from the inside out............ive been on them for 3 years , for migraines along with ambiens to sleep and amyatryptaline for anxiety, and enderol every day for the headaches, all this thanx to my wonderful neuro dr. ive kicked the amytrip. and the klonopin is in the process of going now. had to reduce the dosage very slowly(its been months) because you can get seizures from withdrawel of this rx...........i am 40 years old and an rn, please dont do the klonopin, my e-mail is open to you, linda   ***@****

[lavender blue]

Hi folks, I just gotta put in a word for the horribleness of getting off alcohol. I'm doing a medical detox with valium and its very good compared to the times I ran out of booze and was stuck with shaking, twitching, vomiting, panicking, add in hallucinations, seizures, etc. I've got a quart a day habit and if I didn't get a drink by 4, was asking for all the above....
and felt like **** the rest of the time anyhow though managed to function...
well blessings to all you brave people

[Patrice]

To those who have only been addicted to one or two drugs in your life.....I can tell you by experience that oiates are nothing compared to barbituates......There are several drugs that are dangerous to kick cold turkey.......Barbituate (seconal, nembutal, amytal, tuinal, fiorocet, quualudes, etc) benzos, (xanax, valium, restoril, dalmane, ativan, serax, etc) Alcohol is a killer......Soma is NOT addicting.....I had to take them for a long period of time, when I quit, nothing happened.....Miltown, a close cousin of soma is addicting (simalar to barbituates)  Now, opiates can be dangerous to kick, sepending on your age and health.....Someone like me in my 50's shouldnt kick cold turkey IMHO, no one should ever have to kick Cold turkey.....There are medications to help with the WD'd......Also to the person who said that methadone is the worst  WRONG   Yeah, maybe years ago, but what addicts are given now is called methadose....Instead of kicking for 6 months, it is over (except for the sleep and RLS, in 45 days)  Methadone has a bad rap..Today it is not only for opiate addicts, it is a pain medication that is used more and more, partly because you dont build a tolerance like with most other narcotics, and aalso because (If usedd as directed) you will have no euphoria at all..Ask anyone on methadone...........I suggest that before slamming a medication, read up on it first........You could be scaring someone who may need it ofe whatever reason....Methman, why do you hate methadone so much??Did it not save your life when you used it??? I know that it has been a Godsend for me.....Just remember the good it did for you when you were using............You must be going to 12 step meetings

[MethMan]

Did Methadone help me when I needed it?  No.  I was on pain killers for years.  The doc told me that due to my chronic pain, that I had to get on Methadone.  Two new problems entered at this point:
1.  I did not know what methadone or a methadone clinic was.
2.  The doctor did not take into consideration that I may
     have been addicted to pain killers and that the
     "Possibility" of my back injury was no longer a factor
     in deciding my path for "chronic pain".

Fact is, my back was in good enough shape, but my addiction was not.  Instead of looking at weening me off easier stuff to kick, he tossed me to the wolf.  I am not saying it is his fault.  It was my ignorance and filtered life from years of opiate use.

When I posted what I did about methadone clinics, someone was saying that THEIR doc said that they should get on methadone because of a Hydro habit of 10 per day.  Does that sound reasonable to you?  A habit of 10 Hydrocodones per day and some doctor is going to put someone in Methadone.  That is insanity.  You've experienced more withdrawals than I have, so I am sure your base of knowledge of the subject matter is greater than mine.  But what I can speak on is something that I walked.  To take anyone from a habit of 10 pills a day to methadone makes no sense any way you look at it.  That is... unless the person is not ready to quit OR has aquired a bigger injury and several doctor opinions suggest that the injury would deter a quality of life that would render the individual incapable of attaining.  MAYBE in that case it would be warranted.

Please allow me to reitterate the fact that I am not a doctor nor do I know everything.  I am an addict and can only speak of my personal opinions on methadone, how it affected my life, how I used a "chronic injury" to sustain my drug use and finally becoming sane enough to realize that I was not living, only dying a slow, meaningless, unrelenting death.

Respectfully,
Mike

[Patrice]

Any doctor who would suggest that a patient get on methadone because of a 10 a day vicodin habit should be arrested!!!! There are only 2 reasons a patient should ever be on methadone...One an addict (and not an addict who has been using for a year) a full blown addict who has tried everything else first, and their only way to live a normal live is through methadone....Second reason, a person, in SEVERE CHRONIC PAIN....Methadone is not a drug that should be given for a toothache, surgery, a broken foot, etc..methadone is for people in pain that have no quality of life without it......It is a wonderful drug, when used for the right reasons.........But for a 10 vicodin a day habit....There are drugs to make a person like that more comfortable, clonodin (SP) a sleeping pill at night, something for the runs, aspirin, tylenol, motrin, etc for aches and pains, not methadone

[MethMan]

Sorry bud... I asked the same question earlier in a thread and you answered it here.  I agree with you on your previous post.  I think the problem I'm having with the clinic thing is that when I went through the "intake" process, they never asked what I was on that caused me to come in.  What they did do, was pop my arm with a little bit of Narcan and see how bad a felt.  Isn't that test a little broad spectrum?  A user could only be on 5 vikes a day and feel crappy after that little trial and error deal.
But, I concede the point that instead of shooting or like you said a chronic situation that has no end, maybe methadone would be a possibility for some.
So, if it's helped you from shooting then maybe that is good at this point in your life.
I do feel I owe an appology to you in a sense.  This is only Day 15 for me, so my anger about the clinic is still pretty fresh.  In my case, it was a true clusterfk. So, forgive me if I came off too harsh on the clinic thing.  For me, it was dignity sucking event to have to go in (at first every day, then I worked up to once a month), stand in line, get a **** test, a yearly TB test, then stand there in the dose window delivering my soul to the med dude..
Peace,
Mike

[Patrice]

Are you telling me that at your intake all they did was put narcan in you and that was it???? I would turn their ass in!!!!! At my clinic they do a very broad intake..We have to have a drug history of at least 5 years, if we have never been on maintenance, we have to start with detox....Your story is a horror story, and I dont blame you for being upset...Methadone isnt for people with a litle vicodin problem.......It is for people like me, who had to sell my body, who had to steal, cheat, lie, sleep in the park, have nowhere to live.....That is why methadone has saved me......Methadone has messed you uppp, just be greatful you only did a detox.......BTW, I am a woman....I accept your apology and I apologize too......


MoNAForMe

[MethMan]

I don't know what to say. After reading your story, I find myself in a situation where I feel I've been pretty narrow minded.  Looking back at my hard line on methadone, I find myself stepping back a bit.  Thank you for that.  
I can not conjure the horror that you had to endure on a daily basis.  And if methadone has helped you get out of that miserable existence, then who am I to argue when I haven't seen that hell?  
I guess all I can say is that if you ever come to a point in your life where you decide to ween off the methadone, you'll need support of those that have been there and can help.  And I'd be happy to be first in line to help some way.  Forgive my ignorance..

God Bless,
Mike

[hermum]

I've been trying to find any info. about methadone withdrawal.  During this past year, my daughter was using OC's, snorting heroin and then even started injecting.  She almost died once of an overdose; benzo.'s and heroin.  I thought that would scare her, but she did try it again and found that she couldn't stop.  She is now going to a meth. clinic; she is at 75 mg., but I am so afraid of her not being able to get off.  She has changed her life around almost completely; got a job, does not hang with the same people (actually likes being home with her family), her attitude is changed for the positive.  It bothers me that she is at 75 (she was at 80, this is week 3, but she had them drop her 5 and is looking to drop another 5 next week).  Is she doing the right thing?

[MethMan]

Just after I finished getting of Methadone, I posted inappropriate comments about my issues of methadone clinics.  I was in error as one person showed me why it was not always as evil as I was making it out to be.  And it seems to me that the same may work in this instance.

Using other opiates instead of methadone has a bad side effect.  Opiate users (like I was before getting on methadone) have a problem with sustaining their habit.  The doses go up and down, up and down causing real chaos in their lives and those that love them.  Adversely, methadone for someone that has had this occur MAY BE a viable option.  One of it's main features is that it balances out the levels required by an opiate addict allowing them to not focus on where their next bottle will come from, but on what they can do to better themselves.  This seems to be the thing that has actually occurred in your family.  You made mention that she has changed an enormous amount in her life.  New friends, working and now, she engages family with some enthusiasm.  
What you should do:
Is your family member WANTING to get off methadone?  If so, then he or she will need support.  Dropping 5mg from where she is dosing won't be that tough.  I was on 40mg for over 10 years.  I got off it because I felt that it was time to reclaim my quality of life.  Has she gotten to that point?  Only she can answer that. IF she has, then maybe it is time to get off this drug.  It is definately a hard kick.  If an inpatient facility is an option for you via insurance, I would suggest talking about that.  I would NOT force it on her as this will only cause resentment.  If she is ready to get off it, there are places that will get her off the methadone using well rounded approaches including medication to subdue the effects of Methadone leaving her system, councelling to get to the root of the issue and support from those that are in the SAME situation she is.
If you have any specific questions you would like me to answer, if I know, I would be happy to share them with you.
It is important for you to know that I am NOT a doctor.  I am an addict that has been there and done that, just like so many others.  If she is ready to talk about it, suggest she visit this forum.  There are several great people here that would jump at the opportunity to discuss her situation in comparison to theirs, including myself.

God Bless,
Mike

[hermum]

Thank you for your answer, I appreciate your insight.  I do realize that you are not a Dr., but sometimes I feel someone that has actually been there ... has a lot of knowledge.  She does want to get off of methadone..., but she wants to gradually taper down...., I think that she is afraid (and rightfully so) that if she comes off too quick, she just might go and use again and she does not ever want to do that again.  She says that she is done with that **** and wants to move on in her life.  Job, school, vacations, etc...  She has set a goal for herself to be away from all of this by spring/summer of 2003.  I think that this seems reasonable ... She is signed up for the 6 month program, but she is wondering if she should switch to the maintenance.  I wish that she was clean now, but I realize that is not to be.  Thank you once again.

[MethMan]

Are you in the US?  If so, there are excellent facilities to help her.  When you said that she is "worried" about getting off this stuff and that she is through with it and wants to move on, that is a very profound statement that she may be ready to do it!  Try the following link and look around.  Ask questions.  The staff is ready willing and VERY able to help her, ESPECIALLY with the underlying issue of why she started in the first place.  You will find that it is based on a thing called "Spiritual Mality" and "12 steps".  They also have a program to involve the family too.  That way, the entire family can start the healing process together.  Pretty cool.  I am sure you have many questions and feelings that have not been answered.  THAT is exactly what they can help you with too.

Here is the link;

http://www.lahacienda.com

There are two that I know of.  One in Hunt, Texas (This is the one I went to), the other in Mexico.  Both are VERY nice facilities and have a multi-pronged approach to her getting well.  I can tell you the staff there includes two doctors that are addictionologist, 3 RN's, several nurses, 8 councellors and a LOT of people that are in the same boat she is in.  This is called a "community".  People band together to get through the hard times.  Plus, every Sunday, the Alumni (which includes me) go there to support the patients checked in and show them that it is absolutely possible to come out the other side of this pure hell.   Maybe someday society will catch on to this togetherness.  It's a strong bond to be sure.

Let me know if you need any more assistance.  If you need actual names to call, I will supply those along with direct phone numbers.  You will be surprised how willing they are to help.

I am not trying to steer you to one specific facility.  I can only speak of what I know of.  And La Hacienda, I know is a good place.  "Been there, done that."  I'm 18 days clean now from a 40mg a day methadone habit.  And for me, I will NOT be going back.

God Bless,
Mike

[icky]

I too was smoking/snorting & shooting herion aswell as taking anything i could get my hands on. Methadone helped me regain a balance as instead of trying to find my next hit, i took my daily prescription of methadone and got a job. It helped me kick herion because i was READY to turn my back on it. Some would say its easier to kick herion than methadone because the cold turkey withdrawal is longer lasting with methadone but in my situation since i was shooting up & a mess just kicking the herion wasnt an option. I will say though in the past id kicked H and got thru it but when i tried to kick the M, i cut myself down to 30mg a day, tried to do a cold turkey and it was a Mother-F***er, pardon the french. I then pleaded with my doctor who gave me 8mg of buprenorphine. It has helped me no end. I dont feel 'gouched' as i would on M or H and its an agonist-antagonist so its an unusual one for the docs as it works for and against other opiates. Its stopped me using H because if i do i feel withdrawal and nothing more (unlike Methadone where i used the two together occasionly). So for someone like your daughter my advice is dont stay on the methadone too long, be tapered down gradually so the w/d aint felt bad and if there is any underlying issue that got her into the whole drug thing then get it dealt with so she can rebuild her life. I myself found out while on the methadone that i had clinical depression as a result of my childhood and long-term ecstacy use, (thats another story) probably why i turned to drugs. So at present im day 16 (yipee) of cold turkey off buprenorphine and compared to the other things ive w/d off it is a walk in the park. Because depression/low self esteem etc(believe me the list could go on) is a factor in my case im on 150mg Venlafaxine and ive never felt more normal in all my life. As we all know everyones different but i like NoNaforme have been to the lowest pitfalls that someone like your daughter who has such a caring family around her need not go. I wish you the very best of luck and feel free to write to me. I look at this forum every day and so many people have helped me while i was 'lurking' that i hope i can return the favour. Good Luck all & God Bless
icky

[Patrice]

I feel bad for you and your dauther....If she really wants to get off of methadone, the best way to do it is 1mg a week...My Ex had a 25 year heroin habit....He was on methadone for many years....The way he did it was he tapered 1mg a week, if he felt bad one week, he would stop for a week or two........It took him awhile to detox, but his success story is he has been free from all drugs since January of 1997.....If she detoxes too fast, she will go back to using again.....I.wish you and your daughter the best of luck, and if she does it right, she can make it.

[hermum]

thank you for the LaHacienda info.  I did look them up, but at this point it is not possible for her to go there.  She is actually doing good now, has not used any drugs in 3 1/2 weeks, (except the daily methadone dose).  She is now working full time, she had not been able to hold a steady job in a few years due to drug use: pills (first), then progressed to H.  She is actually looking forward to being free of drugs.

[hermum]

thank you for your response also.
I do wonder if the methadone treatment was the best way for her to go; should she have tried other methods first?  Her friend helped her decide that this was the only way to go, he has been in this program before as he has been using for 4 or 5 years.  I did not have a choice in her treatment options, she was dead set on this because of him.  She now can not stand him, doesn't want anything to do with him.  She is only 20, used pills for a couple years, this year is when the H use started, used for a month or so (sniffed) in Jan-Feb., injected 3 times around March, April, didn't touch it again till the middle of Aug. then some friends were using, so she went along with them and used for about 1 month, then a  6 day detox and back out there..for about 3 weeks. (with the above mentioned)
But now after 3 1/3 weeks of  meth. clinic the changes that I have seen have been incredible; she actually likes being home; with family, tv, dog, napping, would rather do this than to go out most of the time.  So I guess that this program was a life saver for her and us.  It sure beats not knowing where she is, who she was with, and if she would be alive the next day.

[hermum]

that makes me feel pretty optimistic that your husband who had been using for 25 years and has been clean since 1997.  thanks.
my daughter has not been using that long, so I'm hoping and praying for the best.  She has signed up for a 6 month methadone program, but her doctor and a few others have told her to go onto the methadone maintenance program (no set time to get off), this really scares me, but I don't want her to push too fast and go back to using either.  She went from 35 - 80 mg. in less than one week and they did offer her two more times to increase, which she refused.  She also about 2 weeks ago, had them drop her dose to 75 mg.  (we noticed that she was falling asleep-mid sentence, was messed up looking) this has helped.  This week she wants to drop another 5 mg. and try this for a week or two.  The clinic says that they will drop you 5 mg. every week till you are at 30 mg. then they drop by 1 mg.  Does this sound like a good way?  She is afraid of the wd.

[groovygirl]

The program mentioned above is a 12-step program, so she has to be willing to want to work within those parameters.  Good luck...it sounds like she is on the right path to sobriety.

[drodone420]

i havent gone thru any withdrawl yet,im still trying to lower my dosage of vicodin

[Rex1]

Put it down on paper, so you won't change the schedule.

I created a spreadsheet with a declining schedule and, although I did not adhere to it exactly, day after day, my daily amount went down.

Then, when you look back over a two week period, you see that it's going down and you realize you can do it, you are doing it.

When you get down to 3 or less per day, clearer thinking should return, which is when you say to yourself "What in the hell have I been doing to myself?".

You will then be more comitted than ever to get to the final number per day.

ZERO.

Good luck - Rex

[karloff]

So ........the topic of the day is "What Drug has the Worst Withdrawl" Simple.....XANAX!! Try kicking it alone in the nice warm privacy of your Apt.or Home and 8 hours after your last dose you may fall into a deep coma and die!! XANAX is one tough mother! Opiates are a piece of cake!! VICODIN....PERCOSET...MSCONTIN...MSIR...DILAUDID...all chlid's play compared with Xanax!! After 4 days in your nice,warm bedroom with Imodium (immodium) AD for your Diareah....Clonidine(a high blood pressure medication)for your hot and cold flashes and night sweats.....Flexeril(A muscle relaxant)for your stomach and leg spasms (the leg spasms is where they get the term "kicking the habit")milk of magnesia for vomiting and St. John's Wort(can be found in any health food store or supermarket)for anxeiety(the shakes) you can beat the Opiates and opioids!! Nothing will help you to kick Xanax.....NEVER START!

[jeandrsn]

Can anyone refer me to an opiate conversion chart?

[cat_]

HI..new to this..I am wonderig about any success with a crack addition?

[madeline]

Hey I heard the term drug screen.  Will people not
hire you if you have drugs in your system like percocet
even if you have a prescip for them.  Do they consider
that failing the drug test.  I am presently tapering off
of percocet from a knee surgery, then got hooked, and I
am trying so hard to get this job, and they just did
a drug test.  I havent heard nothing yet.

anyone know......

Darn I was addicted to alcohol, replaced if with these
lousy percocets I cant get off of and now I am burning
myself again.

Thanks Madeline

[sharonver]

Hi Madeline,

I think that if you have a perscription for the med it will  be OK.  How could they do that to someone?  You need pain med some of the time! It wouldn't be fair. I wish you luck.

[Rex1]

As long as you are honest, it shouldn't be a problem.

It is almost certain that they are looking for MArijuana, Coke and the like.

Good luck...

Rex

ps. on the percs, you are no different than the rest of us. Look around here for a while - you will find lots of solutions...

[socalgirl]

I have never had any withdrawal or even heard of any from xanax.  But anyway I guess I need a "recipe" ( have seen a little of this Thomas recipe or basically any pointers or secrets anyone knows of to avoid the physical w/d from cheva/black tar.  I have been using about 3 month now...different doses.  Weening doesn't seem to work for me either..so I do anywhere froma $20 to well over a gram a day.  

Can anyone out there HELP ME!!!????
thanks

[ErinOlivia]

My daughter is being sent to a rehab via the court system in NY state. She is on the Methadone clinic, at 40 mgs. She is so scared about just being forced to get off methadone "cold turkey." She asked to placed some where that she could go off slowly, but they won't hear of it. They told her she shouldn't have went on Methadone. She will now begin to withdraw by herself. What will happen to her? What will her symtoms be? Is that even legal do you think, to force someone to do that without any medical assistance?
Thanks for any advice...
Erin

[sharonver]

How long as she been on 40 mg?  That will make a difference.  The longer the worse it is.  Most places that I know should give her something to help with the withdrawals, clonodine, etc.
Tell me more about this. As her mother you may have some influence in this.  After all it is a medical isssue.

Sharon

[ErinOlivia]

Sharon,
She has been on 40 mgs. for 3 months. I can not help her because she is 23 years old. So, they will not talk with me. I did write a letter to the judge at the court where she is appearing. He did take my letter into a lot of consideration, which I couldn't believe! Even the prosecuter agreed with me. How strange is that? But her probation officer will not hear of it. She said my daughter is going away and that's it. I always thought the judge was the decider, but I guess not. She actually told my daughter, it's her problem, and she shouldn't have gone on methadone. How ridiculous! I would think that there would be some sort of law, protecting people from this type of thing? It's kind of inhumane. But where my daughter is being sent,(rehab) they do not offer methadone, or anything else. My daughter was even going to ask to be sent to jail instead, so she could get methadone therapy. But they won't give it to her either.
She's so scared. What do you think will happen to her?
Thanks for your time also....
~Erin

[sharonver]

Erin,

I can't imagine anyplace letting her suffer too much. Especially if it is a rehab hospital.  They will probably try to make her as comfortable as possible.  One thing in her favor though is that she is on a low dose and for a short period of time, that in itself is a godsend!!! Email me if you want to talk more about it.

***@****

[Roxy30mg]

Hello, I have a question about withdrawals and how long I can expect to have them. I started doing some Percocets at night to help me get to sleep and I won't lie I also enjoyed the high. Eventually I didn't get the same effect and the dosage had to go up.Then it got to the point where it wasn't fun anymore I just had to take more. As my tolerance grew, so did my need. A so called friend of mine stared selling me his script for 30mg Roxicodone. They were nice and a lot stronger than the 5 or 10 mg Percocets. At first it was just a nightly thing but now has become every 4 to 6 hours. The dose I take is not the full 30 mgs each time though. I do realize if I continue taking them my tolerance with grow even more. I've started taking Oxycontins at low levels just to be able to sleep the night through without having to wake up in pain to take more of the shorter lasting Roxy's. The problem I'm facing know may be the best thing to happen to me. I can no longer get the supply of pills I once could. Now I have to get what's available on the street level. I don't like this feeling of unsurety. I do know that I will experience withdrawals if I stop cold turkey now. What I need to know how long they will last. I have just gotten some 40 mg Metadose tablets. I've tried breaking them into eighths and they seem to last longer and relieve any withdrawals from the other pills. How long can I take the Methadose and not get hooked on them? I'm taking only 5mgs at a time now. Would  doing this for a short time help me beat the Roxy and Oxy withdrawals? Any information you can tell me would greatly help!

[Roxy30mg]

Hello, I have a question about withdrawals and how long I can expect to have them. I started doing some Percocets at night to help me get to sleep and I won't lie I also enjoyed the high. Eventually I didn't get the same effect and the dosage had to go up.Then it got to the point where it wasn't fun anymore I just had to take more. As my tolerance grew, so did my need. A so called friend of mine stared selling me his script for 30mg Roxicodone. They were nice and a lot stronger than the 5 or 10 mg Percocets. At first it was just a nightly thing but now has become every 4 to 6 hours. The dose I take is not the full 30 mgs each time though. I do realize if I continue taking them my tolerance with grow even more. I've started taking Oxycontins at low levels just to be able to sleep the night through without having to wake up in pain to take more of the shorter lasting Roxy's. The problem I'm facing know may be the best thing to happen to me. I can no longer get the supply of pills I once could. Now I have to get what's available on the street level. I don't like this feeling of unsurety. I do know that I will experience withdrawals if I stop cold turkey now. What I need to know how long they will last. I have just gotten some 40 mg Metadose tablets. I've tried breaking them into eighths and they seem to last longer and relieve any withdrawals from the other pills. How long can I take the Methadose and not get hooked on them? I'm taking only 5mgs at a time now. Would  doing this for a short time help me beat the Roxy and Oxy withdrawals? Any information you can tell me would greatly help!

[Roxy30mg]

Hello, I have a question about withdrawals and how long I can expect to have them. I started doing some Percocets at night to help me get to sleep and I won't lie I also enjoyed the high. Eventually I didn't get the same effect and the dosage had to go up.Then it got to the point where it wasn't fun anymore I just had to take more. As my tolerance grew, so did my need. A so called friend of mine stared selling me his script for 30mg Roxicodone. They were nice and a lot stronger than the 5 or 10 mg Percocets. At first it was just a nightly thing but now has become every 4 to 6 hours. The dose I take is not the full 30 mgs each time though. I do realize if I continue taking them my tolerance with grow even more. I've started taking Oxycontins at low levels just to be able to sleep the night through without having to wake up in pain to take more of the shorter lasting Roxy's. The problem I'm facing know may be the best thing to happen to me. I can no longer get the supply of pills I once could. Now I have to get what's available on the street level. I don't like this feeling of unsurety. I do know that I will experience withdrawals if I stop cold turkey now. What I need to know how long they will last. I have just gotten some 40 mg Metadose tablets. I've tried breaking them into eighths and they seem to last longer and relieve any withdrawals from the other pills. How long can I take the Methadose and not get hooked on them? I'm taking only 5mgs at a time now. Would  doing this for a short time help me beat the Roxy and Oxy withdrawals? Any information you can tell me would greatly help!

[scared to be sick]

hi ive been injecting dilaudid 8mg x4-6 times aday, i want to stop, but i know i cant go cold turkey ended up in the hospital last year start from 3 days only in a detox center my kindenys started to fail, shut down and i was badly dehidrated and everything was out of wack, potasium and salt lever everthing stared to shut down even my liver and my memory started to go before i even mad  it to the detox ,anway ended up in hosptal after 3 days in detox pucking up my bile and al the crapy things that go along with it. i just wanted to start eating my pills the way im supposed to do 2 -8mg four times a day for my cronic neck and back  pain, i want to know can i go from injecting to eating them and getting away with 4 a day , i just dont want to get sick, and if you could also tell me what i can also take over the counter vitamins to help i f ill have w/d so after and almost dieing last summer im scared but i got to stop this craziness. signed SCARED TO DEATH

[concernedwifeandmom]

Im very worried about my husband he is on norco and morphine and yesterday while we were driveing he had a very bad spell we had to take our kids and him to the nearest gas station i called 911 and well he is home now im scared yesterday i thought i might loose my best friend all because of those harsh drugs . i learned he has been having severe anxity at night thoughts of death and sweats can anyone help me help him ? Thanks a concerned Wife and Mother

[mo2000]

Hi there!

I'm so sorry about what you are going through :(

No One has answered you because this thread is from half a decade ago!! Try going to the top of this page and hitting the green button that says "post a ques
tion" and start your own thread.  You will get many more responses that way, as people tend to look over old threads.  There are a ton of nice people here willing to help you!

[Mudd5150]

My vote goes to Methadone for the pain factor and the how long it takes before you feel better factor.  My 2nd vote goes to the other big boy on the block nowadays BARS. Xanax w/d ***** just as much but for diffrent reasons. You get the shakes, convulsions in the worst cases. you dont sleep for at least ten days and your heart beats so hard it actually makes your whole body move along with the beats. I know this because I got thrown in jail for ten days while on a meth program at 135mg/day plus taking 5 xanax bars daily. So i went cold turkey from that. Didnt sleep a wink for the ten days. I could tell the meth was bad because I didnt even start withdrawing bad till day 3. The xanax had me dyin the first 3 days. Then they mixed sort of. I actually became quite mentally f-ed up after about 8 days. I started having these waking dreams that they were letting me go to starbucks to get coffee. :) So I was delusional to the fullest. Don't recomend it.