27 days off Norco

[Skyhook]

I recently quit taking Norcos, 27 days ago. I was taking 4-6 10/325's per day for 3 years. Since quitting cold turkey I am still having problems, depression, fatigue, sadness and anxiety. How long may these symptoms last? What can I do to allieviate them?

Thank you in advance.

[J T Junig, MD PhD]

I recently posted a youtube video in reply to the people who believe that Suboxone withdrawal is 'the worst thing ever', in spite of 30 years of experience with the drug that shows otherwise when the people are 'blinded' to what they are taking.  As I say to them, and as I said in my video, opiate withdrawal takes a long time!  Methadone withdrawal is known to take months-- up to 6 months in some cases.  My own withdrawal 8 years ago from fentanyl took about three months before I felt like I was about 'normal'.  People withdrawing from Suboxone go to work and complain about feeling miserable;  people coming off agonists don't complain-- because they are laying in bed at home or in detox, without the ability to sit at a computer!

I have seen many people go through many kinds of withdrawal.  The body aches tend to start to subside at a week or two;  then the fatigue starts to go away after about 3-4 weeks-- STARTS to go away.  Expect some measure of fatigue for a couple months, at least.  Then there is 'PAWS', or post acute withdrawal syndrome, which is fatigue, depression, and general malaise that can go on for several months after the acute phase ends.  SSRIs can help;  studies show frontal lobe dysfunction lasting months after opiate cessation, and the treatment for this dysfunction is... gasp... stimulants.  For some reason that 'made waves' in the past;  I am not saying anything that you can't read in the scientific literature.  You won't find someone to prescribe them, and that's just as well;  but we use stimulants to treat frontal lobe dysfunction in millions of young children across the US in a condition called 'ADD'.  We see the same thing in opiate addicts in post-acute withdrawal;  decreased glucose uptake and metabolism in the frontal lobes of the brain.  Cognitive testing shows 'ADD-like' effects;  reduced insight and increased impulsivity.  One reason for relapse is thought to be hypoactive frontal lobes, and the associated loss of insight and associated impulsivity-- two traits that are bad for addicts in early recovery!

You can help yourself along by exercising if possible, as that will increase your metabolism and will also have profound psychological effects.

As for Suboxone, if you can stay clean without it, that's great.  If you become a chronic relapser, my recommendation is that you get, and stay, treated.

Finally, step-based recovery includes a number of things that can provide a sense of optimism and purpose, and those will in turn increase the odds of remaining clean.

[Skyhook]

Thank you so much, this is the absolute best information I've ever recieved and I really understand your explanantion completely. Today is day 30 with no opiates of any kind, no Soboxin or anything else. My wife and I do drink fresh pressed vegetable juice every morning and I've finally found enough energy to walk my dog 3 times a day. At nearly 51 years of age I've learned that I am an addictive type personnality. I have been addicted to most everything from speed, marijuana, alcohol, nicotine and for the last 5 years opiates and I can say with all honesty that the apparent long term withdrawal from opiates is the most difficult by far. I am learning also that the good news is that they can be overcome, there is a light at the end of the tunnel. My only true regret at the moment is that I did not make the decision sooner to remove them from my system. Thank you again Doctor Junig for this intelligent information and thanks for this website also.

Mike

[Skyhook]

Thank you for the info. Yes I have an appoinment with my doc on Tuesday but he's gonna be dissapointed in me as he was weening me off Norcos but after five months it was'nt fast enough for me so I went to a rehab place, only lasted a week because they wanted to give me Soboxin and I wanted cold turkey. I came home but have stayed completely off the Norco's, dat 28 now, kinda funny because today would have been my release date. I did take low dose valiums for 3 days when in rehab and that did help some with restless legs and some sleep. But yea I just can't seem to get my attitude fixed, I'm just depressed, tired as all heck and still have a dose of the poops. I'll mention the tramadol and ativan to my doc. Yes thanks, if you have any more information for me I will greatly appreciate any help and advise.

[sadjt]

well i take the same thing as u and the onlt thing i find that helps is tramadol or go to a psych doc and see if bu can b prescribed valium or ativan it seems to help me feel free to write me back if u wanna no more i also may have more onfo for uif u decide to write back keep goin on strong though good for u on almost a month clean congrats