ANYBODY WANT TO VENT???

[mercygracious]

Anybody out there mad as hell like I am .  I am sick and tired of being sick and tired.  Guess what.....that is when things start changing.  You will realize at that point that he has been a thorn in your side all along and all the wasted time you spent caring about someone who didn't give you the same in return.  Alcoholics are the most cold hearted, selfish, self centered, egotistical, CONTROLLING people that I know.  They don't deserve good people in their life.  Oh by the way I don't care what you say Alcoholism is not a disease and I am sick and tired of people saying it is!!!!  It is a choice  just like anything else.  It is an additiction .....NOT A DISEASE!!!!!!!!  As long as they believe it is considered to be a disease they will continue on the same path because they use this as an excuse!!!!!  I am sick and tired of excuses and believe me I made plenty for my man but not anymore!!!!!!  Those days are over.   From now on it is about me and that is all I have to say!!!!!  WOMEN ROCK!!!!!!  But, only when we look out for ourselves and don't let losers take advantage of us!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[mercygracious]

Any comments, thoughts or ......

[boogieman]

hi. first off, sorry you've had these troubles. i hope you can someday find some peace. it would be to your benefit to educate yourself a little more as to the nature of alcoholism and chemical dependency in general. you are obviously (and understandably so) in a lot of pain, and resources like al-anon would help you to repair the damage done and begin to heal. best of luck,   gm

[mercygracious]

Hey boogie,

I appreciate your input but you know what I don't care anymore about the nature of alcoholism or chemical dependency!!!  It is not my concern at all.  I am sorry I wasted so much time being concerned before and I believe that every woman that stays with an alcoholic will end up feeling the way that I do!!!  I had a choice to be an alcoholic myself when I was younger.  I could see myself heading down the wrong path and I said to myself "self" you had better get control of this because if you don't it is only going to cause you more problems than you think you already have in the future.  We all have the opportunity to make choices for ourselves and the alcoholic just chooses the wrong choice.  I will NEVER feel sorry for them.  They made the choice and we have to live with it or NOT and I choose NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[chemist3_6_16]

alcoholism & drug addiction are indeed disease's, progressive one's at that!
My suggestion to women that get hooked up with alcoholic's is only go out with non-drinkers, remember in the end it is your decision who you go out with, sometimes it's better to be patient & lonely than the alternative,.
The other thing I would like to say is, there is always TWO SIDE'S to a story & we only hear one here, to be fair the drunken men have a story to tell too, no one is perfect.....
and sometimes women can get very dramatic & tend to overreact even when sober!

[mercygracious]

My ex quit driinking once for 30 days only to come to me after the 30th day and say "I think I'm going to have a drink, life is boring without a buzz".  This comment like many others prove that alcoholism is NOT A DISEASE BUT A MINDSET just like anything else.  It is done by people with low self esteems that do not know how to function without a drink, pill, snort, injection or other crutch to lean on.  They simply do not want to deal with everyday problems like the rest of us.  Well, guess what I don't want to deal with problems either but I know that one problem or wrong choice just creates another.  All of us who CHOOSE not to do alcohol or drugs understand this simple concept.  

[chemist3_6_16]

Why are you so bitter? Can you not find a man that will treat you with the respect you deserve? Alanon might be beneficial for you, there are meetings in most cities.
Unfortuantly  for some the "choice" to drink or use is NOT a simple concept , but a very complex one, the NEUROSCIENCE OF PSYCHOACTIVE SUBSTANCE USE AND DEPENDENCE can spell it out for you , if you can open your mind to science.
If it make's any difference I too have lived with an alcoholic , and I can inform you the "disease" is not prejudice as I am a man, and have been through extreme abuse also.

[heatherlynn22]

it's their choice to pick up that drink. nobody forces them. it's NOT a disease. saying it's a disease is an excuse for the pathetic losers to keep picking up that bottle. and when my mother married her husband he wasn't drinking as much as he is now. which he started again. he blames everyone in the world on his drinking problems but himself. alcoholics HIDE behind the "oh it's a disease, i'll get help i promise" do most of them? no they don't. they keep drowning whatever they feel into that bottle, can or whatever.

why do people make excuses for alcholics? how can you compare alcoholism to a real disease like...cancer?

[April2]

I have to say, I agree. I don't think alcoholism is a disease. It's a choice. I do think it's possible for certain people to have more of a tendency towards alcoholism, though. My husband's mom and dad were both alcoholics and smoked. Well, guess how he turned out?
Yes, it's a rough ride being married to an alcoholic. I've been married for 21 years and most of those years were very lonely. I felt stuck too. I had little kids to take care of. I've felt a lot of these emotions (see my journal on here about what to do with the anger). I think I buried my head in the sand for the longest time, though. I made excuses, looked the other way, etc.
It finally got to the point when he came home drunk when I threatened to leave him and take the kids and that scared him. Then shortly after that his dad suddenly died at a fairly young age. I think that shook him up. He came back from the funeral changed. He quit drinking and started going to AA. That was 10 years ago. 3 years ago he fell off the wagon again but kept it hidden from me. He finally confessed and we've been going to counseling but there's still some anger and hurt there. He has broken my trust so many times I think it will take time to rebuild that.

The thing that bothers me the most is I still see some of the addict behavior. He still acts selfish to me. For instance, not putting his kids first like I'd like. He also tends to withdraw into himself and it's hard to pull anything out. I still feel like he's not giving me the support I'd like to see.
But he is a good father, especially to our 4 year old. He seems better with the little ones. He'll take him to the park, etc. He has a harder time with the teens, I think, and tends to leave the disciplining up to me, which is frustrating because he always wants to be the fun dad while I have to be the bad guy.
We still have work, obviously. But we are trying to turn to God and take one day at a time.

[MlovesD]

Obviously there is a lot of anger here for the alcoholics we have dealt with. Dealing with that anger and finding happiness in yourself is a step in the right direction for your own healing, and Alanon will help you. Or just pick up a book, like Courage to Change, which will help you turn your feelings away from the alcoholic and onto yourself. I mean that in a positive way!

That being said, I was with an alcoholic for a year and a half. It was extremely trying dealing with his attitude, implications, manipulations, what have you! I was naive and optimistic, hopeful and as patient as I knew how. I grew up, learned my own enabling behaviors, stopped them until I realized I was still enabling him in other ways. It was a long process, but I overcame it all, and sadly...or not, we're no longer together. As much as he loved me, his chemical dependence ruled his life and destroyed ours. I also happened to be taking Abnormal Psych for part of that time, which helped educate me on the subject. I've taken Biological Psychology, and I'm currently taking Drug Abuse and Drugs and Behavior. I'm a psych student, and I welcome anyone to read my journal, which chronicles a good portion of my relationship. Finally I ended it, and I do feel better, though I'm sad that I never quite got through to him the way I hoped...granted, we made progress, and I still hold hope for him.

Anyway, the 12-step programs, like AA, are the most successful treatment programs out there for alcoholics. It's a lot more successful than Cognitive/Behavioral Therapy, which helps you think and behave differently (going into the whole "choice" line of thinking). The 12-step programs teach you that alcoholism is a disease. Studies have shown that sons of alcoholics have a higher tolerance and are more likely to become alcoholics. This is one study that supports the "disease model." Chemical dependence also gets in the way of thinking logically when a person wants a drink. Yes, it's a choice to drink...to a point. The will and desire to stop drinking has to be greater than the desire to drink, but when an alcoholic is faced with making a choice, often times the chemical dependence is stronger. Boogieman? Would you agree that I've somewhat captured an understanding of this???

I think that it's important to take care of yourself first. ALWAYS! Alanon focuses on you, not the alcoholic. They don't help you take care of him. They don't tell you what to do to help him stop. They teach you how to take the focus off of him and be happy with yourself, whether that be to leave him or to deal with it in a less conflicted way. I truly hope that you can get over your anger and bitterness, because you'll never truly get closure until you reach that point.

[boogieman]

ok. i understand that many have been hurt by chemical dependency. i have had the experience of being on both sides of the equation and neither is pleasant. in the last century there has been an unprecedented advance in technology that has provided long needed revisions in the diagnosis and treatment of all types of conditions. just as depression and schizophrenia were once blamed on fear and ignorance based beliefs in moral decay and demonic possession, chemical dependency has been one of the most poorly understood human conditions. as far as the initiation of addictive behavior, it is true that at some point all sufferers took that first drink, pill, or hit. but for some the biochemical reaction is different from most. there is an actual change in the mechanisms that control our most basic neurological functions. once a person has crossed into this area, they set in motion a physical allergy and mental obsession that become more destructive with each additional dose. as long as such an individual maintains abstinence, they have a choice. however once they take the first drink or fix, the use of willpower and threat of negative consequence are ineffective. the most effective treatment for those who want it is usually behavior modification and use of medications to re-normalize the neurotransmitter functions to relatively normal parameters. without some examination of these mechanisms it can be difficult to understand chemical dependency as a disease, but the research findings of organizations and facilities such as the mayo clinic, the u.s. department of health and human services, the national council on alcoholism and drug addiction, the american psychiatric association and others have resolved the debate in the medical and scientific communities. i will post links to some of these on my profile for anyone who would like to see the documentation. as a doctor who spent most of his life on the front lines once told me, "you are not responsible for your addiction, but once you have been offered the solution, you are responsible for your recovery." i hope this adds clarity and understanding for all and take care,            gm

[LORDINEEDHELP]

im glad to see some action on this site i was begining to think i was alone Mlovesd thanks for everything i  have to say im also married to an alacholic and im going through all the same as above i wont say i believe it is a disease or a choice sometime i feel it both ways i came from a family of problem drinkers on my side and now married to a mad who suffers with it as well as well as his whole family all but one sister has issues with alachol and the one who never drank just past with lung cancer in sep and our family went through so much i dont blame the cancer or the drama or the meanness on anything except the abuse of alachol but i married this man 20 years ago and i watched and felt every ounce of pain alachol has caused my entire family me my kids my husbands well being my parents a mother who had issues with drugs and alachol all her life who walked out on me and my sister when i was two it all ties into how i chose to put up with things in my life maybe fear regection abandoment alacholic behavior i have been through so much yet there is something in me the part of me who knew the man befor the problem that got out of control its hard to say it will work out for us time will tell but through sickness and in health for richer or poorer till death do us part was something i took very seriously 20 years ago does not mean i deserved any of what o got the past three years i did not ask for any of what has happened and yes im angry and mad and tired of the excuesses but i see it from both sides i dont know if it is a desease or a choice i view it as a real problem and im glad im not alone i do have days where im so pissed i want to leacve and i have days where there is more hope alanon has been a good thing for me just went back after trying it my husband just started aa over two weeks ago and i have to say i see a huge change but that does not mean i forgive and forgot everything and its only a small step maybe it will work maybe not my choice my pain my not knowing im just glad i can come here for support and knowing im not alone here is nice even know we all wont agree on every thought or feeling im glad i have somewhere to vent

[MlovesD]

It's great to have a place to vent! And I'm a big advocate on being angry at times. It's an emotion that we usually must go through in order to heal. I understand that this thread was started so we could vent about the alcoholics in our lives, but I think there's a point when we must not overgeneralize our own experiences with ALL alcoholics. Also, with this being an open forum, it's not quite right (in my opinion) to attack anyone who comes in here to help you see a different side to the story. Isn't this supposed to be about support and understanding? There ARE two sides to a story, and I know that it's hard to understand that or even care when you've been hurt so badly by someone in your life, but it IS a way towards healing if you understand the whole story. Also, I'm sure Boogieman and Chemist don't want to be thought of as "pathetic excuses for humans," as I will never think of my ex in that way. I feel sad for him, because I know that HE knows alcohol is destroying his life. He knows that it's the reason he lost me. He knows that I was the best thing to ever walk into his life. But the need for alcohol and the fear he holds to overcome the addiction is stronger right now. But I don't think any of this really matters to some of you, as you're not here to listen but to vent. So I apologize if I'm stepping on any toes. Like Theresa (LordINeedHelp) said, it is refreshing to have different ideas and thoughts on the subject. I will be here for anyone if they want to talk.

[maxfield2294]

I agree  I think it's a game alcoholics like to play so they don't have to deal with reality. But let me tell you when my husband knows he has to see his lawyer in 3 days He sure can sobber up so he can make that meeting.  Also he acts as if nothing else matters but his vodka. I can't stand the look on his face I can't stand his smell, laugher, voice, the way he walks I can say he makes me sick. You know you can't afford a place on your own trying to raise the kids and the next thing you know your getting older and afraid to venture out. I feel so stuck I can't wait till one day I can tell him to get lost.

[mercygracious]

Well, yes it is true that I am the one who started this post and it is also true that I see a difference in my way of thinking compared to the way that most others who have replied to this post think.  I believe that I am able to say what I have said because I am truly finally over this part of my life and am proud of it.  It sounds as if the alcoholic still has control over most of your thoughts and opinions whereas with me that is no longer the case.  I have moved past all of that and therefore that allows me to see alchoholism (alcoholism) clearer and more consisely than I ever have.  I feel sorry for the ones who just can't seem to let the alcoholic go.  When you finally get sick and tired of being sick and tired I am sure you may very well see things differently than you do now.

[MlovesD]

That's not fair to presume you know me! I can love D because I'm a caring human being that understands that he still loves me and will always love me but is sick in the way that he made the wrong choice. I can still love him and hope that one day he does get better. But I can also love myself enough to leave him and move on because he'd never make me happy as long as he's drinking.

Good for you for leaving him! Good for you for doing what's best for you! What I was trying to say, and maybe not so eloquently, is that closure comes when you no longer care...and that includes not caring to be angry. It's a long process, and completely dependent on how long you've invested in the relationship.

I just hate seeing you let him get the best of your emotions. You're allowing yourself to generalize all alcoholics into one lump group. Every recovered alcoholic on here has probably been in that place and situation you're so upset about, and they've struggled, or are still struggling to overcome their desires to drink. I, personally, can only hope and pray that my ex joins the ranks with the other recovering alcoholics so he can one day be happy...because through all the bad, I know he's a good person who doesn't deserve to be unhappy. Nor does he deserve to be judged by me or anyone else.

[LORDINEEDHELP]

i agree with every one here to a degree first off not only do woman suffer from the pain of someone having issues with alachol its for the men as well i believe we have one here my brother in law is a recovering alacholic for 7 years now and is now dealing with his wife of 20 years my husbands sis who is an alacholic and to here him someone else i turned to when i was hurting to the point of wanting to end everything about my own life not to long ago he has suffered greatly i wont get into the details some things are just to sad and priviat but i will say in the male defence it does go both ways also my husbands father was a recovering alacholic for many many years so i can relate to both sides just as i can relate to the recovering alacholics who have voiced there sides i respect the fact that we all have are stories thats what i think trully helps me the most to see and here both sides iv gotton support from boogie as well as the others here i cant get angry at those here who are so angry and are dealing with things in a different way then me yes im hurting im depressed and angry as hell alot of times but im human we all have are issues im not an alacholic but im not perfect im a honest big hearted person who is suffering more with my life now then ever befor maybe i have a different view maybe its the 20 years that was not all bad maybe my past my horrible past with the abandonment i felt when my drug and alacholic mother chose to leave her kids over me maybe the loss of my first child who would have been part of my life today but now will never be due to my first hubby who also did horrible things to me on drugs and alachol and i never trusted with my son ever and had to hire a babysitter for him and on that one day i left him to go to work and i pay for that daily he is not here today for a reason i cant prove but i know in my heart is there a nightmare i live with everyday of my life that to is so personal i wont give out details but the pain i have is life long and i have overcome so much and i feel i have had enough at times and yet when i married this man  my husband 20 years ago he did not have this problem and he was my lifeline who got me through all of it made me want more kids made me forget the abuse the life i hated so many years ago we have 3 beautiful smart strong and loving kids my husband is not a mean person he loves his kids and that goes both ways they are very close and open but yes i will admit they have seen alot of suffering in our home to much and i have my own guilt for having let them witness to that as well but i also was very open with my kids to how alachol will and can effect you maybe i will pay for it latr in life i just pray i did something right i will answer to my mistakes one way or another i have demons and hurt and anger and i trully have felt like all of you above i wont judge any of you here i came here for support and for otheres i can relate to but on both sides not just one i chose to try and get through this maybe it will work i have heard of susccess stories there in my own family  it can work god help me  i have to have hope or believe in something right and if we fail or should i say if he fails then we all fail and i will pull myself up and keep going as i have all my life i guess thats why im here and thats why i am who i am and who i have become just becaous i have suffered and have an alacholic for my husband does not make me a bad person for trying and does not mean i just forgot what my husban was there for me for about all our marriage maybe i feel i at least owe him a chance to try befor i walk away from the life i shared with him for twenty years and the chirldren  we share its just not me i have to get through this its my chirldren and my life its harder to explain we are all different i guess i want to say i dont judge or pick side but i will say i have felt it all  and i mean from both sides and i respect all of you for reaching out and speaking your mind we are all on this earth none of us better then the next just walking parelle to each other on our own seprate roads in life thanks for letting me vent hoping today brings everyone some peace  i know  we all want that  right?

[April2]

mercygracious, the reason I have stayed with my husband is because he has admitted to me his drinking and is making an effort to get and stay clean. Also, I feel like as long as he's not abusive to me or my kids then God would want us to stay together. It's not easy but I know "I can do all things through Christ who gives me strength".

[livelaghlove582]

i am 18 yrs old and i grew up with my dad for my whole life as him being a single parent. i was extremely angry like most people in here. i know people can say they know what your going through, but i dont believe that becuase everybody has different feelings and emotions and have been through different things. nobody knows how you feel. anyways back to the point. i have no experiednce with being in a relationship with an alcoholic, but i did get raised by one my whole life. we all deal with almost every single kind of abuse. my dad was my best friend and my worst enemy, my hero but someone i never want to be. idk if that makes any scense. I AM SO SORRY FOR EVERYTHING YOU ALL HAVE GONE THROUGH. i havew no advise for the people that are in a relationship with an alcoholic, but if this is a family member i say stick with them till the end. i "couldnt take it anymore" and i left my daddy and moved with my mother after 18 yrs. and a yr later my father developed liver cancer and died. ((one yr ago)). no i feel as if a deserted the person that took care of me my entire life and left him to die. i feel i should have pushed him more to get help. i had no idea this would happen.  if this is someone you truly care about DO EVERYTHING IN YOUR POWER TO HELP THEM. wether it be something that is going to hurt them at the time. such as interventions or admitting them to a rehab. im so sorry to all of you. this is just the opinion of someone that waited to long...i did try, but i could have done more. I TRULY HOPE I DIDNT OFFEND ANYONE FOR I KNOW THIS IS A VERY TOUCHY SUBJECT. MY INTENTIONS ARE GOOD AND ONLY AN OPINION. I DONT KNOW ALL OF YOUR ENTIRE SITUATIONS. GOOD LUCK TO ALL OF YOU.

[driftersgal]

The problem is, the alcoholic HAS to want to get the help; they cannot be forced into it.  My boyfriend is WILLING to go to AA; however, will he make the call to find out when, where and how to get to them?  NO!!!!  I won't do it for him, simply because if I do, then he can simply refuse to go.  

don't feel bad about what happened to your dad.  He knew he had a drinking problem, and he chose not to do anything about it.  That was not your fault.  At times, the more you push, the more the alcoholic will resist getting help.  Now is the time to concentrate on you--getting into college, or whatever you choose to do with your life.  Make smart choices.......................  I wish you the very best of luck!

[driftersgal]

As I'm sure you're very well aware, addicts are extremely manipulative!  His comment that "life is boring without a buzz" was intended to set you off--and most likely succeeded.  

I'm sorry that you've had your problems with an alcoholic, and don't realise or understand that it is truly a disease.  You are right in one statement, that the alcoholic cannot function without alcohol.  It is to them like water is to fish--the only difference is that the alcoholic CAN learn to live life WITHOUT alcohol while fish cannot live without water!

As to the alcoholic having control over our thoughts, it is grossly unfair for you to say something like that without even knowing our sides of the story.  As someone else responded to your post, I CARE about my boyfriend even though he is an alcoholic, and I KNOW what type of person he is when he's sober.  Just because I'm not living with him presently doesn't mean that I have to give up hope that he'll seek help for his problem.  He is also a very caring person.  He just has a disease that has control over him, and un til he finds the will to fight that control (once he realises alcohol is controlling him, not him controlling the alcohol), he will continue down the same path he has always traveled.  

You've stated that you've put the past behind you.  It doesn't sound like that to me--it sounds as if you still have a lot of anger and bitterness to deal with.  May I suggest writing in a journal whenever a thought of something that your ex said or did comes to mind, and how you feel about it?  As well as how it made you feel at the time?  It's a great way to vent--being able to scream, kick, hit, throw things, call him names--and the best part?  No one will ever know!! Journaling has helped me out a lot!  I wish you the best!  driftersgal

[LORDINEEDHELP]

hello, im not sure this will help how you feel right now but someday i hope it will what you did was make a choice for you and in order to deal with an alacholic you need to heal you first you cant fix or heal them i know i have been married to one for 20 years but every story is different i had hate anger and abuse never physical but emotionaly im a complete wreck at times but im helping myself first and when i chose to get myself help first thats when he chose to get help he is not perfect and he may even slip he has been in aa now for thirty days goes to meetings 3 to 4 times a week so at the moment hes doing better but time will tell if this will work for him please dont feel guilty for making choices for you your father new all along he was hurting himself as well as you they know im sure deep down he did not want to but with drinking weather you believe its a disease or not some people say its a disease some will argue its not its a choice sometime i even go both ways in how i think im very honest im really not sure all i can say is that to be a part of this pain has been hell and never blame yourself for putting yourself first it takes alot from you to walk away from some one you love reguardless of the love you feel im sure you still love your father your just in pain and are looking to blame yourself but its has never been you that was to blame and you did not ask to be in this position right now and you will never be the reason it ended up the way it did, it was his choices not yours  understand how you feel as far as staying with someone you love i have chose that road i married this guy and stuck to my vows but i can honestly say it has not been all bad just the past4 years i myself have suffered with this for a long time and i had to finally get to a palce where i was more important to help me first befor i could realize i cant change him or fix him its all his choice if you need to vent or feel you could not get what you need here i will suggest alanon i went a few times it does help out with feeling like this was our fault i come here and i get both sides of the views and it does help me alot you wil se both sides here each of us are different  in our lives and views read carefully im sure you will see it all also i go into alacholisim forum to get that side of it it has done wonders for me and writing in my journal you will see all the ups and downs people go through your not alone please be strong be tough but also be aware you may not be able to change the outcome but you can change how you view your self and how you blame yourself stay strong i will be here if you need a friend
Theresa

[LORDINEEDHELP]

hello, well it very clear your upset angry and just plain tired of what apparently has been going on in your situation you apear very hurt and resentful i have been meaning to write i believe we all have delt with what has been handed us to the best of our own abality and our views thats why we are all so different i thought it was important to say i do respect your anger and your thoughts just becaous you have your views does not mean your wrong for having them it just shows you just how different we all are i respect everyone here we are all here cause we have all been effected emotionaly by problem drinkers we are all different in how we make our decisions and all our outcomes are different as well  im sorry you feel your pain i understand that all to well i feel it when i read your story  i feel my own i feel every one aboves hurt we can all see the differences it does not make us wrong it makes us different and thats okay i can say my road has had alot of emotional issues never physical hurt full very much so do i love my husband  YES i have for over 20 years befor all the pain there was a different man he is still loving and a great dad this man got me through the loss of a son and changed my whole life and has raised 3 great kids yes i have two left at home and yes the past 3 years have been my hell but to walk away from someone who i love and care about more then my own life has been a heartache for 3 years i understand your feelings and i respect you for how you are but thats becaous i have felt it im just choosing to deal with this problem in my way in hopes i dont loose the man i married fell in love with and had kids with and i know this man for who he was as well as who he is now and i have seen the effort your right its his choice his problem or disease  but my realiety my life and my hell at times we are all human just all very different just wanted you to know i respect your views even know they are different venting in my journals will show you just what it ahs done to me its great therpy if your intrested in them there posted and if your intrested in a friendship or some one to vent to i will be around i wish you well and i hope you can find some peace i know how hard that can be i have my days trust me we all do here have a good day and i hope you can find some peace
theresa

[boogieman]

hi. a few years ago, my dad was admitted to the icu as a result of his drinking. within 2 weeks i was faced with having to decide whether or not to use heroic measures to keep him alive when the next inevitable cardiac arrest occurred. when given the facts about what that would involve and what his life would be reduced to if he survived, i signed the dnr order. then i went to his side and held his hand for the next few hours until the monitors and his physical reactions announced his departure. what made this even more painful was the fact that i had been trying to stay sober myself for a few years before his drinking became a problem and had seen him decline in the same ways i had. standing in that hospital room i had a horrible realization---i had been exposed to the solution long ago, and maybe if i'd only tried harder, or done things differently, his fate could have been changed. it is still very difficult for me to discuss this stuff sometimes but i had to come to a point at which i could begin to let go of the guilt from the "what if" questions. an instrumental part of this process was a dream i had a few months after (and a few weeks after i almost succeeded in killing myself with a pill od). in it, i was back in that hospital room but this time my dad was able to talk and conscious. i asked him if he wanted to stay or go, and he said he wanted to go "home". as time has passed, i still miss him and wonder about what could have been, but i'm getting better at making the most out of what time i have left, and i like to think he's watching until we meet again.   take care,  gm

[Natta1980]

Alcoholics are indeed the most selfish kind of humans....My husband has been sober for a while, however, he tends to use his alcoholism and mood disorder as excuses to get away with many different things.. When I've met him, he was sober, and he has been sober ever since, I've never seen him drunk....Sometimes he likes to remind me how lucky I am that I've never seen him drunk. I am certainly very glad that he is sober, however, do not think he should use a possibility of him getting drunk as means to get something out of me.
He always has a benefit of a doubt because he is a drunk (sober now) and because he is older than me. Hence, I need less sleep, less time for myself, I can work all the time, according to him. He also likes to make example of some recently sober people who go to meetings with him and are out of jobs and are not intending to get employed any time soon.

I only wish he could understand that I married a sober person who was finishing up his PhD and was anticipating a tenure in the university. His career is just not happening (hopefully one day it will), he is bitter, and he threatens me with "I gonna go and get drunk" all the time. He is just so lifeless. He is a good person, has a good sense of humor, but life is such a chore to him. He does not like living, and he does not like people. I have a feeling that he hates my guts. He often comments that "I wish you lost your job and than you would know how I feel". Never mind that my job pays bills. Note that I never, ever, ever, nag him about his job/lack of thereof, or even discuss employment, as it is such a sore spot. I cook. I clean. I work full time. I take care of my son. I look very decent. I am 13 years younger than him.

What is his deal?

Is there anything I am doing wrong?

He blames me for his problems, but, clearly, he has improved greatly since we got married (per his mother and other family members). I cannot make him happy or even inspire him to be a little bit more energetic about life.

I love him, but I feel that he ***** life out of me, he brings me down, he kills my spirit. The other day he said to me when I came home from work "I hate you - what are you so happy about?" He was very irritated. The most important thing is that I feel that his negativity affects our little son. I can defenitely see temper, inability to wait, desire for instant gratification at all times, in my son. Some of it may be genetic, but most is probably learned as DH does not really try to curb his behaviors in my son's presense.

Interesting, but both of my sisters-in-law feel similar about their spouses (his brothers) - they are all on a depressive side and are extremely self-centered. One of his brothers is going trough separation, initiated by his wife who feels that he brings her down; she wants to have children but feels that he is not the right person. She told me that it always has been like that, and over years, his lack of "life", inability to tolerate other people, and constant depression got her to the point where she could not stay. They love each other and they do not fight. But I know exactly how she feels.

Am I wasting my time on him? Should I think long term rather than short term? Because it is not getting better, it is getting worse. He is a demanding stranger, living in my house.

I am staying in it for my son too, he loves his dad and always worries about him. He is very anxious and has problems separating from him.

Any thoughts?

I am mostly venting really.....

[driftersgal]

Natta, NO!! You're not doing anything wrong at all.  This is your husband's problem that he has to deal with.  You didn't say if he's on any medications for his mood disorders, but if he isn't, it may help to get him on some?  It isn't fair to you for him to be using his mood disorders or his alcoholism as excuses for his behaviors, nor is it a good thing for your son to see.  Your son is very impressionable right now, and what he sees he will copy!  

I wish you the very best of luck in dealing with this situation............... keep me posted on how things go!  driftersgal

[mercy546]

I just pray and wish my H will face reality and comes to his sense of goin to a rehab and see a doc. who can diagnose him. I have been educating myself of this mood disorder and abuse of alcohol and marijuana. I see all the symptoms from hims. I've been with him for almost 22 years. We got 4 kids all are grwon up. Am just trying to be strong and not be affected by his behaviour for the sake of my kids. Eversince we married he is a drinker and smoker of this pot.He even did coc.and pills also. He will not show up for a week . He has change when I left him 5 years ago. Those times he left his job,He neve had any stable job.We were just getting support from my past father in law. I was tortured by him with his wrong acussations that I was cheating him. I was just working that time and I 've been faithful to him and never cross into my mind of having an affair.
He took me back change for quite sometime. But before 2 years his father pass away,this has started to become worse,everynight in the bar until he disaapear for a week until we found out that he is having affair with a *****(mamsan) who enable him to all his vices. Everybody say why I tolerate all this things. I just cant confront him. I left this time again only to follow me again but no promises that he will give up this *****. He said he will not leave the kids and me. I know he never spend a dime to this *****.This only I appreciate for him bcoz his inheritance was invested all in my name. The problem is he not having motivation to work,How we gonna live everyday.He made promises,plans,he wants to quit have a new life leave the past behind but once he is outthere everything is forgotten. he is just a liar,cheat,manipulator.One thing he did good is he entrust me his inheritance but that is investment and not for daily living.I just have to move and not to be stuck here.Alcohol and drugs is more his rpiority especially he is comfortable getting it for free. I guess he has major depressive disorder. coz this is not normal.Your husbands are alcoholic did they reach to this point of being numb and comes home anytime they want,can not be confronted and they are getting angry.
I love him and wish he will change and get treatment and I hope we will be a happy family.But it has to come from him that he has a problem. I can accept if he feels he is in love with this *****,but I just cant make him talk .I got a chance to talk to him one time without him getting irrational,he just nod his head and agreed,but when he went out evrything is forgotten.I wish I dont believe him,I'm stupid enough to always believe him. Now he is worse more coz he will not care to call us if everything is ok in the house.. If we call him he wont answer or for sure he has another number. I feel that of being a heavy drinker he already feels some pain due to alcohol. I wish sometimes I;ll just hear that they catch him and he is in jail together with this *****.
Is there anybody there alcoholics or having mood disorder behaving like this?
Is there any solution or way to let them face reality and stop denying?

[boogieman]

hello. sorry to hear you're having a rough time. nowadays most people admitted to rehabs have a co-existing psychiatric disorder resulting in a "dual diagnosis." for some, this condition is due to a preexisting illness made worse by drinking, while others seem to develop such issues as a result. it will require a professional evaluation to properly assess his  status, however the psychiatric part will likely be unresponsive to treatment until the chemical dependency is addressed. your best resource is al-anon. i'm going to send you a link to their site, and there are also others here who have been, or are currently in a similar situation who can help as well. take care,   gm

[mercy546]

Thanks I'm not living in USA or  other European countries. I'm living in the Middle East.And there's no Al Anon support group on this area. Although I search on the web, I think I can participate by Email.
Thanks again, I just wish that he will wake up one day and come to his senses. Our home,our family is upside down bcoz of this.

[loiloi]

It starts off as a choice, then becomes an addiction. My partner says his alcoholism is a disease, but I think that doesn't remove his personal responsibilty to get better. Both his parents died young because of alcohol and he thinks he is destined to follow them. This makes me so sad.
Eloise.

[teeshenley]

At this point I am angry, confused, scared and fearful for me and my children.  My husband is mixing large amount of alcohol with pain pills.  He was on Hydrocodone for about 5 years and has just recently been "upgraded" to percocets.  They are turning him into a monster and when mixed with alcohol it is MUCH WORSE.  I have never been afraid of him before until last Sunday when he got in my face in front of the children.  They were also afraid for me.  I am not sure what to do as he says the problem is mine - ok we all know that is NOT true.  Getting a divorce is a last resort that I want to take as then my boys would be with him unsupervised and scared.  He is having an injection in his back tomorrow and has agreed to talk with the Dr. about the pills making him angry and uncontrolling.  He said that if he wasn't willing to talk to the Dr. about it then he would have a problem.  Should I take out a larger life insurance policy....I am afraid he is killing himself.

[boogieman]

hi. if there is a perceived threat of violence, you most definitely need to be taking action. also, mixing alcohol with opiates is dangerous to the one using them, and will often precipitate the type of situation you are describing. it's also likely he isn't being honest with his doctor, as a medical professional would not condone the use of alcohol with these meds. i'm pretty sure the bottles the pills come in have warning labels that say 'do not drink alcohol with this medication." keep posting and hang in there. take care,  gm

[LORDINEEDHELP]

being married to an alacholic is tough enough but to mix meds with alachol is not only dangerous it very much will make someone angry and unpredictable when my husband would drink and then take meds priscribed (prescribed) by his dr for depression and anaxiety he turned into someone i hated and to this day i cant get pased it please be carefull and maybe sharing it with your hubby dr may help hopefully hubby does it but i understand your fear i watching my hubby do nasty hatefull things to me when he was mixing things not to mention no remembering putting me up gainist the wall slaming my hands in doors and falling off the deck onto his back to get up and walk away for a few hours all things i still fear today please let me know if i can help you in anyway keep your self safe and your kids are watching as were mine and when we spend more time hiding things from the kids we tend to forget our own needs please if i can help in any way feel free to contact me

[heatherlynn22]

well i have to vent again. and it is about my moms husband. he was doing good for a few weeks. "quit" drinking, went through the whole withdrawal and detox...up until 4 days ago. started drinking again. heavily. VERY heavily. i'm talking 3-4 cases a NIGHT. well....2 nights ago he got into it with my mom. this fight was bad. the worst so far. he actually spit his chew in her face, started to go after her like he was going to hit her (my mom is NOT a small woman. she's 5'8 and built like a brick sh!t house) but of course she can hold her own. she knocked him on his a$$. then he started in on my brother (who is also NOT a small boy...he's 6'2 and 200 lbs) he went into his bedroom broke his new stereo our mom bought him for his birthday in february. grabbed his blue tooth (which was on his ear) and stomped on it. so my mom...being the hot headed red head she is...went into their bedroom and knocked ralph's (her husband) tv onto the floor breaking it. so he grabbed her cell phone (which she needs for work, she's the head administrator at a nursing home) and snapped it in half so she took the guitar his mother gave him and smashed it. he then proceeded to insult me. i don't even live there. i haven't for a while now. but he said while i lived with them i was lazy (which is utter bull. since i was a bartender and was home during the day i cleaned when i wasn't sleeping. and i mean EVERYTHING was spotless. the carpets were scrubbed everything. i'm ocd about dirty stuff) and that i was a loser and that greg (my husband) isn't really the father of our twin sons because i'm nothing but a *****. (and again my hubby is the father of our children. we've been together for almost 4 years married for a year next saturday and i have NEVER cheated on him. yes i have male friends i'd go out with..to shoot pool or for a drink but they are FRIENDS) i guess more happened but i wasn't there this was what was relayed to me from my step brother and his fiance (who were there). so the next day ralph and his oldest son and a few of their friends headed to the family cabin in potter county...on the way up they drank 52 CANS OF BEER!!! and 3 bottles of liquor!!! ON THE DRIVE!!!

i'm just so damn frustrated over this and how my mom is STILL there!!!!

[iam1butterfly]

Alcohol is a drug of "choice'' because of it's immediate availability and social acceptance... and, Alcoholism is an addiction to that drug.
If it is, indeed, a disease... then, it is a disease of a broken spirit and a lost soul
that is out-of-control. The Alcoholic has my pity; not my hate.

[heatherlynn22]

i have a new vent. same alcoholic though. well about 4 weeks ago mom and her alcoholic got into a fight. of course he was drunk. 10-11 years ago mom had dislocated her shoulder while working and had to have surgery on it. it never healed 100% and she's always had to be careful with it. well during the fight the stupid a$$hole slammed a door on her shoulder and broke it. yeah he broke her arm. the shoulder and part of the upper arm (i don't remember the technical medical term for it) are broken. he then slammed her into a wall (my mother was caught off guard b/c NOBODY ever does stuff like that to her....EVER) she then grabbed him up by his collar (even through the pain) jacked him up and started screaming at him (this is as relayed by her, step brother and step brothers fiance) and threw him onto the ground. she called me the following afternoon and said she was finally filing for divorce. i was so happy. i guess the jerk called her the next day and did the whole "oh i'm so sorry i'll go get help..blah blah blah." and she took him back....again. 2 weeks ago he decided he was going to take over paying the bills. (he's always so damn drunk he doesn't know what he's doing) he never did and spent all their money on booze. so everything got shut off. water, electric, phones, sewage, garbage isn't being picked up, their cable, gas, EVERYTHING. he then procedes to call my mom and scream at her for not paying the bills. she reminded him that he was taking over the bill paying since he insisted he was more capable. he screamed at her some more about there being no money. mom went back to their house pulled out all the receipts she had the bank print out and pointed that HE spent all the money. *sigh* i wish she'd either leave him or quit dragging me into this mess. even though I DON'T LIVE THERE he STILL talks **** on me! we don't ask them for ANYTHING! not eve to babysit. i did that once and NEVER AGAIN. my mom babysat for 3 hours for greg and i one night just so we could go out. we hadn't in almost 3 months. he whined and complained the whole time about how irresponsible we were and if we wanted to go out "we should never have had the stupid brats". his kids borrow thousands of dollars and never pay them back. he let his son and his wife move into their other house (that my mom wanted to move into) and was going to let them pay them back over time. they haven't paid a penny in 2 years. i asked to borrow $20 one day because i forgot my mac card at home. i got hell from him for a week ( i didn't see my mom for that week) until i paid her back.

i'm just so sick of this. i'm ready to just have hubby help pack us all up so we can move to freakin siberia to get away from all of this bs!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[boogieman]

hi. sorry about your troubles. i'd say your mom's situation has degraded to damage control now. did she press charges? threats don't do very much where action sometimes will. if she were to press dom violence charges, he would go to jail at least long enough to sober up and go into withdrawal, and he would likely think twice about pulling something like that again. i can tell you that if it was my mom, i would be in jail right now and he would be in the icu eating through a straw. i have a major problem with men beating women or children and absolutely zero tolerance. for that matter, any of you could have called 911 and they would have taken him to jail, irregardless of charges. your mom will keep getting hurt until she's decided she's had enough and is ready to get out of the ring. and he will continue the behavior until something or someone stops him. people die this way all the time. would your mom consider a protective order? the power is in her hands, and if no one acts, i'm afraid the worst is yet to come. take care,   gm

[OldFatChick]

My husband is an alcoholic.  He denies it most of the time, until he pulls a bender and does something stupid.  Then it's "I'm sorry.  I couldn't help myself because I am an alcoholic".  I am flat running out of patience with this scam.  When he isn't drinking he is very non-confrontational and will not speak up if he has a complaint about something.  Then he'll go on a binge and I am the sorriest human alive until he sobers up and remembers that if it weren't for me he wouldn't have a pot to **** in, nor a window to throw it out of. I manage our finances because my husband doesn't want the responsibility.  If something breaks, I have to be the one to take care of getting it fixed.  He is a hard worker and makes good money, but he also has very expensive tastes.  He has a $30000.00 Harley that he HAD to have, he bought a six thousand dollar 4-wheeler for hunting, he pays over 2000.00 a year for his hunting lease, add to that the cost of the feed for the feeders, the new arrows every season, the gas and food for every trip to the lease (about a 7 hour drive) and he has to have 1 1/2" T-bones to feed himself and his hunting buddies.  He just had me spend 220.00 on a portable DVD player so he can watch movies in his hunting stand.  He likes to make knives and so has invested hundred of dollars into knife making equipment, but hardly ever makes knives any more.  

We have both needed dental work for several years, the house needs new flooring, we need a new garage door, but the only things he seems willing to spend money on are his toys.  We lived in a piece of **** mobile home until we bought this house, I didn't want this house because it needed a lot of updating (kitchen, baths, flooring, etc), and the house was already at the upper limit of our budget, but he fell  in love with it and wouldn't even look at anything after he found this one.

He has never laid a hand on me but there have been a couple of occasions when I thought he might.

I love him dearly, and his drinking has slowed considerably, but it needs to stop.  He has already got liver issues (they thought he had hep C, but he doesn't).  Just yesterday he refused to take two Tylenol because he said they cause liver damage.  You can imagine the speed at which my jaw hit the floor.  I guess that means he is trying to save what is left of his liver for drinking.  His children from a previous marriage have both told me they don't know why I have stayed with him for so long.  And his daughter didn't even want me to marry him at the beginning.  She now says I am the best thing that ever happened to him.

[straggler821]

I'm new to this site, and this group but this thread caught my attention right off the bat.  I have a bit of a unique situation in that I worked in the mental health field for years and years helping addicts with dual diagnosis.  I recognize that addicts have a physical dependancy that has an effect on them.  I also recognize that unlike cancer or diabetes, drinking is a disease of choice.  Just because it's a disease doesn't mean they have no responsibility for having it. They chose to take their chances, and choose to remain addicted every time they pick up a drink.  
I also live with my father who is a life long alcoholic.  He knows he's got a problem and says he doesn't care.  As long as he goes to work, and isn't abusive he thinks we should just deal with it.  He literally sleeps, drinks and goes to work.  (He's just as addicted to sleeping as he is to drinking)  I have gotten to the point that I can't even stand to be in the same room with him.  I'm tired of hearing about how rough life is for him.  He had a good childhood, and a good life.  Nothing out of the ordinary.  But he would rather sleep and drink his life away then spend time with his only child or his wife.  He was my best friend and he might as well be dead.  I'm heart broken by this.  But I have gotten to a point where I refuse to be taken in any more.  
I'm bipolar.  I have my own issues.  Seeing him give in and give up to his depression and drinking, while I struggle to live my life, disgusts me.  He likes being a drunk, and will gladly tell anybody who listens that he is a proud drunk.  He'll never get help.  I'm sad that if I have children they will never know the man who raised me.  
I have a right to be angry.  I have a right to quit caring.  I have a right to turn my back.  I have a right to not care if you call it a disease or a choice.  
I applaud everyone who chooses to remain with an addict.  Good for you.  But I have a right to not keep an addict in my life.  I think that's the point many are missing.  

[Feline62]

I just joined the community because I have been involved with my ex alcoholic fiance for 3 years now and am trying to end the relationship once and for all after several attempts.

When not drinking, this man is the most wonderful, caring, sweet, loving man I have ever met in my life.  He is extremely intelligent, sensitive, funny, also an attorney. He is 38 yrs old and I think he has had a problem since he was 19.

We both came from dysfunctional families and I think that was the major attraction because I could relate to his suffering as a child.  I thought that he just needed someone to really love him, relate to him etc. and he could be the wonderful person that he is when not drinking.

This man has almost destroyed me.  I have not worked in over 1 1/2 years after having a very successful career as a CPA for over 24 years.  I have given everything to him, and received nothing but abuse and selfishness.  Even his mother and his entire family agrees with me.

I have been through countless withdrawals with him, he has been in hospital and doctors tell him he will die if he doesn't stop.  NOTHING WORKS.

I have tried everything, have almost destroyed myself physically, emotionally, financially, etc. and he just wants to know when I am going to come help him again.

He has a very loving mother, and the two of us have tried to help him together for 3 years. The kicker is that his mother has a lot of money and can support him indefinately.  I have no financial support and am totally on my own.  She has manipulated me for 3 yrs to try and help her save him..

I am  co-dependent.  There is a good book by Melody Beattie called "Co Dependent No MOre"

You did not cause this, and no amount of love, support, caring can fix it.  You will only be Destroyed Yourself.

The problem is that a lot of alcoholics are very sweet, sensitive, nice people and they know how to use people this way.  You CANNOT WIN AGANIST THE BOTTLE.

I am trying to AVOID ALL CONTACT with him because he only ***** me back in again, and cares nothing about my problems.  Alcoholics are VERY SELFISH people and usually destroy the people that love them most and they love the most because WE LET THEM.

The experience only gets worse over time.  The more I allow the more he does.  During the last incident he made very insulting comments about my physical appearance.  He says he doesn't remember doing this.  I wrote him an e-mail detailing his physical shortcomings, and he acts like I have committed murder.

According to him, he is always the victim, and no one has ever tried to help him despite the fact that he has had numerous advantages that I never had including financial support from his mother, a college education paid for by his family, promises of trips to europe for both of us if he sobers up, and someone like me to support him emotionally for 3 years to the point that it has almost destroyed me.

While he is supported by his mom, I had to contribute $3K just so my mother could get hearing aids.

He has taken away every ounce of self esteem that I have.

I know your pain, and feel it everyday.  PLEASE TRY TO SAVE YOURSELF, because they will Destroy you and they will still be the same.  Also watch out for "loving family members" that will sacrifice you to help save the unsaveable alcoholic.

[tschock]

I love venting!!
All of the alcoholics in my life are driving me crazy! I love them all but they need to be stopped. Seeing on how there is no magic pill or device that can be used as of yet...there is no conceivable hope for any of them.
We should all just build a bunch of cities for us and them!!
Or better yet let's send them over to some other country of their very own. All of the drug addicts and alcoholics can live in one big happy town of their own.
They all claim that we don't understand them, so let's get them all together in a place where they all have each other...their own kind...that understands them.
They all blame us for everything...we are the reason that they drink and do dope. We are not interesting enough for them...so let them have THEM!
When and if they quit drinking or are ready to stop we could move them to a halfway island...full of wonderful medical staff. From there they can be shipped back to wherever they need to be.
The end!
Thank you for listening and have a nice day...if you can...

[allmymarbles]

From your vantage point it doesn't matter if alcoholism is a disease or not. You don't like  it and don't want to be around it. Fair enough. Take the next train out of town.