I'm doing it! CT off alcohol

[Charlie's girl]

I have been drinking about a magnum of wine(red or white) plus a few vodka drinks a day.  Or, I have about a fifth of vodka a day.  It's the first thing I thnk about in the morning instead of coffee!!!!!!  Any suggestions?  I really need to do this privately.
Thanks.

Charlie

[Charlie's girl]

Anyone??????  No responses?????  

[JACEM5]

Your going to need benzos,cold turkey is a BAD idea because it won't be private very long if you seize and die.I just went through it myself and I had benzos and it was hell.Can you go to the ER,they will stabalize you when you start to withdraw.Even a 5 day detox is private and they make you very comfortable.

[Charlie's girl]

Thanks for your response.  This has been going on for about a year straight.  Any suggestions for out patient detox with privacy?  Also, is this all confidential or will my family doc or psych be notified??

[JACEM5]

well,if you go to an ER you don't normally go to and tell them you don't have a DR then your doc won't find out,but detox I think they will,I didn't tell my DR I went to detox,but he knew when I went to see him.Can you get Ativan or valium,from your psych,tell him you have panic attacks or trouble sleeping.I don't condone lying,but I'd rather you did that than quit drinking cold turkey.

[Charlie's girl]

What about Soma??  Will this work in place of Xanax?  I am worried about the physical withdrawl.  Do you think after a year my body would have a seizure?
Thanks for you help.

Charlieg

[JACEM5]

I don't think soma is a benzo.Benzos do to the brain the same thing alcohol does without the drunk,after a year of drinking everyday.....yes there is a good chance of seizure not to mention the WDs are horrible cold turkey.

[Charlie's girl]

I'm can't go to a doctor for benzos.  To embarrassed.  Plus, I have already been on Xanax on and off.  Once I told her that I wanted to increase my dose for anxiety from .5mg  twice a day to 1mg  twice a day, she cut me off.  That isn't even a high dose.  The doc told me I had to go to a psych for anxiety meds.  I did that and am on Effexor 75 mg. and Adderall30 mg  for depression and ADHD.The psych is against Benzos...  I have Soma and Ambien.  Would ambien work for sleep and I could cut down the alcohol slowly?  Does anyone have any suggestions on tapering from Alcohol?

Thanks,
Charlie

[Charlie's girl]

Anyone out there?????

[alexandra fox]

hello - I was an alcoholic for well over ten years, and now have been sober for over 8 years. I vividly remember waking up and the first thought being alcohol, the last thought being alcohol, and in between bleakness, depression, panic and anxiety, and total hopelessness.

I am not familiar with the meds you are on, or how long you have been drinking at these levels, and how generally healthy or not you are - all of these things would impact on your detox experience. I understand very much your reluctance to tell your doctor - however, alcohol and benzos are two withdrawals that can kill, and I have actually seen a person in alcohol w/d have a seizure and nearly die. In my mind, this puts these detoxes in a special category, and if you do go CT, I would definitely do it under medical supervision.

Taper suggestion (entirely a guess, I have no medical background at all, so this is just how I would do it. Go slowly): cut out your vodka drinks for a start, just drink your magnum per day until you get accustomed to that. Then cut it down by 1/10th a day - the point is to go gradually.

But I think the most important issue in stopping drinking is to look at the underlying issues, and for that counselling and/or support groups are required. Staying sober and having freedom from the obsessive cravings and the restlessness and discomfort requires a lot of effort and a lot of input. Regardless if you try tapering or detox, the after care has got to be put in place, and you have to ask yourself if you are willing to do whatever it takes to get free of this prison. For me, AA worked, though it took a bit of getting used to, and I had to overcome a lot of anxiety and judgmentalism to get through the doors. Once I was more comfortable there, I really began to work the program and have gained huge freedom from that.

I wish you all the best, and I would encourage you to seek medical help, don't let pride and reluctance and embarassment get in the way of a safe detox process. I tell you, watching that lady have a seizure all those years ago has never left my mind, it is terrifying. Give yourself the best chance of success.
Alex

[needsreaders]

Dear Charlie,

You're on the right track, girl.  And you can do it.  Nearly 18 years ago I also drank a lot of Vodka and some wine and some beer and whatever else I could find to take away the pain and make it through the day.  Until one day I knew I couldn't live like this anymore, I felt that I would die very soon.  My liver had failed once before and I had all the symptoms that it was going again, glowing yellow eyes, orange skin, swollen liver. I was 29 years old and had a two-year-old son at home who depended on me to take care of him while my husband was at work. Because, you see we were the perfect family -- I was a housewife and he worked and we went to church on Sunday and I got drunk every day all day, but I thought no one knew that.  I couldn't go to treatment, my family needed me at home. So I tried off and on to quit drinking by myself, but was never able to make it past a week. I never thought about what my family would do when I was dead!  

So on that one day when God gave me that one lucid moment I called someone to take me to the doctor and get me into treatment because I wanted to live more than I wanted to die and I wanted to be there for that little boy.  We can't quit drinking for someone else, but in the beginning maybe we just need to have something we'd like to just stay alive for. I thought I would just go to treatment, but I had to go to the medical hospital first because it took them five days to get my organs functioning and get me able to go across the street to treatment.  Apparently that shove from God on that day had saved my life.  We need to listen to that still small voice when it comes.  

I learned a lot while I was in treatment.  But one of the most important things I learned was that alcoholism is a physical disease.  It is not a moral failing.  A lot of people have trouble with that concept.  Maybe they just like to try to feel superior to other people and that's one of the ways they try to do it.  But I learned that it is sort of like if diabetes runs in your family. Alcoholism was passed down to me from both sides of my family and all I had to do to find that out was to ask my parents and have them grudgingly tell me about that aunt and this uncle and my grandfather's four (!) brothers.  (My family is all about secrets.)  If it was possible to go farther up on the family tree I can guarantee you that in each generation there would be some one or two who were unlucky enough to have carried the gene that caused them to be addicts -- to whatever it was they found they were addicted to.  My brother is not an addict.  

Doctors and psychiatrists are professional people who deal with addiction every day.  It's not a unique disease.  They will know what to do to best help you and are certainly not going to shame you.  Would they shame you if you had cancer or a cold?  They will help you with what they know is going to be the most important decision you'll ever make and the one that will change your life forever into what you never dreamed it could be.  Talk to your psyciatrist first and she/he will help you locate a good treatment center.  Many have free beds if that is your need.  Do not stop all at once on your own with the alcohol intake you've got going!  For sure, at least talk to your medical doctor.  But for me, treatment was the way to go.  It got me on the road to recovery in an situation where I was totally surrounded by other sober people all trying to do the same thing I was doing.  

And when I got out the first place I went to was an AA meeting that I made my home group -- another important thing you might look into.  Find a support group there and get some good sober friends to hang out with.  You can have fun in sobriety!  Go to 90 meetings in 90 days, get a book and read it, work the steps, most important--get a sponsor.  She'll help you through the hard times and be available to you whenever you need some guidance or a shoulder.  

But most of all give yourself a break.  You didn't get in this situation all in one day and you're not going to get out that quickly either.  It's going to take some time, but don't you think you're worth it?  Hold your head up and do whatever it takes to take care of you.  That's your job now, one day at a time!

Best Wishes
Needsreaders

[darkmeat]

Question:   Can a person successfully go through the AA --12 step program without God in their life and/or religious? I'm an atheist and always wondered about the policy.
Sounds like you're doing quite well with your sobriety.  Congratulations on your recovery and turning your life around.  Great inspirational story too.  Thanks for input.

[needsreaders]

I think that depending on a person's commitment to getting sober and working the program that anyone can make it work.  I don't need to believe in God, per se, but I do need to be willing to believe in something larger and more powerful than myself.  Some people choose to draw strength from the the group. No one there is going to tell you that you must believe in God. As far as I know the only requirement for AA membership is a desire to stop drinking. Keep an open mind and give it a try ;o)
needsreaders

[darkmeat]

Thanks for your comments.  If I were to attend a meeting, I just don't want religion of any kind crammed down my throat.  I understand surrendering oneself, commitment and admitting being powerless. I think drawing strength from the group and stop the 'desire' of drinking should be the bottom line.  I'm still not convinced I'll be successful as a AA member if I don't embrace Christianity which AA was based on, I believe.

[Charlie's girl]

Your stories have helped me.  Just having responses to my cry for help is great.  I hope more people will continue to check this board and reply as needed.  I'm not sure what my plan is yet but it's coming..  I have no option.  It's here.  Get sober or ruin my life.  I am aware..  It's sad.

Charlie

[darkmeat]

I hope your condition and health improves.  I seem to be more worried about my mental state of mind than physical lately.

needsreaders -- Alcoholism was passed down to me from both sides of my family too.  My one brother died very early ( age 32 ) from 'accidental' overdose of drugs (cocaine) and alcohol.  My one sister was an addict too, but got clean through AA, only to die later from cancer.  My father is a 'dry' drunk, but still alive; mom too.

I've never tried any help.  Maybe a psychiatrist is a good starting point.  Nobody really knows because I make it to work everyday and can function on the outside.  

Question: Can a person delete or edit on this forum?  I really have issues if you can't, because so many forums have that capability.

[Charlie's girl]

Which forums are you talking about.  I would like to join.

charlie

[needsreaders]

I don't know anything about forums of any kind.  This is the first time I've ever done this.  I sort of stumbled onto this while surfing around and thought it was very interesting. And since I have a little experience in this area, maybe I could help.
You seem to know somewhat what is called for in working a 12-step program so you must have been doing some investigating on your own, or maybe you had a chance to talk to your sister about it?  
I was a high functioning drunk for a long time, too.  I had two jobs.  Alcoholics are on the whole very intelligent, extremely capable people.  They are usually quite amazed by what they can produce without drinking, when all this time they thought they needed the booze to get anything done. Of course, you may not need to drink while you're at work yet.  I, unfortunately, kept a buzz on all day long just to feel normal.  I learned to drive while I was drinking at 15, and I had been drinking every day from the age of 12, so when I quit at 29, I was afraid I wouldn't know how anymore.
You seem to be seriously questioning your quality of life and that's a good place to start.  You don't have to live like this anymore.  Have you considered treatment?  And make an appointment to see a psychiatrist. They know all about dependency issues and mood disorders.  But as you already know, addiction will kill you -- or as we say, "Death, institutions, or jail."  Not a happy picture, I'm afraid.  
A good therapist is wonderful for putting things in perspective and learning how to live life on life's terms.  Somehow along the way, either my parents didn't teach me or I didn't learn, I was never able to figure out how to cope with life and when something came up, I'd just have a drink, and then the problem would solve itself, usually not in my favor, but at least I didn't have to make a decision.      

[needsreaders]

As for your comment about Christianity in AA, there's more of a spirituality going on, a sense of we're all one, pulling together as a group and drawing strength from each other, rather than any religion.  In 18 years, I've probably heard Jesus mentioned a handful of times.  For some reason that's just not done.  There are people of all religions and no religion, agnostics and atheists.  The main thing is we're all trying to stay sober one day at a time, and while there may be an oddball here and there, I don't care if you believe in God or not, as long as you stay sober and stay alive.  LIke I said before, keep an open mind, remember what you're there for, stick with the winners, find yourself someone you like to hear share in meetings and ask that guy to be your sponsor and call him every day. (or I don't really know if you're a man or a woman. The general rule is to only have for a sponsor someone that you could never be interested in having sex with.)  And then do all those other things I said before about the book, the meetings, etc.  You sound like you're ready to do something to change your life and I really commend you for that.  Get ready, you won't believe how great it can be!

[darkmeat]

needsreaders -  I'll try to respond to your productive comments a little later.  Oh, and thanks again for taking the time.  Do you accept email?  Send me a note if you do, I may need to talk more in depth.  Yes, I do need to change my life.  The time is now before my health fails.  I'm in good status, thank God (been checked out) fortunately.  Yes, I want a sponsor, but the right one and preferably a women who likes to email.  Im picky that way.

[needsreaders]

I've found that it's best to have a sponsor that you can meet with in person and go to meetings with, but you can have friends in AA all over. Sure, you can write me, but how do you go about that?  I mean, do I just write my e-mail address out here?  Like I said, I've never done forums before.  And I saw over somewhere else where you went to the doctor and got started with librium.  That's quite a step!  

[darkmeat]

No, I don't take librium; the other guy posting does.  And no, don't write your email out here, although a personal note through this forum would work.  Just highlight my name and send a message, if interested.

[dark69meat]

My other account got messed up was 'darkmeat'... now is dark69meat.  Oh, I refuse to take anything like librium as a side note.  Again, your above comments I'll address very soon.  Thanks

[sheltercrow]

I agree with needsreaders except for the AA thing. I was in the hospital for 10 days till I could relearn to simply walk. The problem I have with AA is that they are the same people who did the abuse thing on me when I was a minor so I get trust and flash back problems.

So with that said find a good substance abuse and psych therapist. Make sure the substance abuse person isn't an AA member and the psych person is a woman. AA members will concentrate too much on AA to the exclusion of real treatment and women seem to be more authentic.

Since Alcoholism is a disease see a psych and get the proper medication to see you through this condition. All that matters is your health and the therapist and psych are a good team to have on your side.

"I was a high functioning drunk for a long time". lol. So were we all. I got a 126 score on an IQ test when quite drunk (after quite a few years of being quite drunk). If you don't get control you will start getting toward the edge of dementia and permenant brain function impairment.

I am suffering from a schizoaffective disorder comorbid with borderline personality and PTSD. I can only observe the scenes going on in my head never mind control or understand them. It was time for me to stop before I became like the creepy zombie that was my old man.

[Charlie's girl]

Wow.  Your story is very informative.  Thank you.  How often did you see your psych. while detoxing?  This may be the way to go for me.  I'm scared to go to an AA meeting.  I'm curious about it though.  My husband said he would go with me.  Please keep posting.  

Charlie

[dark69meat]

sheltercrow and  needsreaders --

I'm really starting to get confused.  Ironically I've been looking into psych therapists too (depends on insurance tho).  Should I do both AA and therapy?  I believe you about the "dementia and permanent brain function impairment".  My mental state isn't good right now and very depressed and angry half the time, especially if I'm hangover and / or tired..

needsreaders  --  Yes, I'm really "questioning your quality of life"... and yes.."a good place to start."  But change is so hard for me and making new friends that don't drink will be challenging, but essential, I know.  Do you think AA is the ONLY way for treatment, or that just worked for you?

[needsreaders]

I did go into treatment for three weeks.  I needed that to get started and completely away from my regular life with its responsibilities and with time to spend on taking care of me.  I became completely willing during that time to do whatever it took to be sober.  And that's what I finally realized while I was in there.  I went to meetings for 12 miserable years without being willing to do much beyond the bare minimum.  I didn't work any steps or get a sponsor or read the book or form any type of relationships with these people or stay sober!.  I guess I thought by being in the room a magic wave would wash over me and I would be cured. But when I became willing to do the hard work that everybody else had done to get the results from the program, I could see what everybody had been so laughing about and happy and everything.  

AA did work for me, and as far as I know, it has the highest success rate of any program of its kind. But if you can find something that works better for you, then do that.  It's just about staying sane and alive.  You might try going to NA (Narcotics Anonymous).  After all, like they say in their preamble, Alcohol is a drug..  I went to AA for 13 years, but here for the last 5 or so I go to most of my meetings at NA because that's where my friends are and it's closer to my house.  It's a little different crowd, really fun, you might enjoy it.  

But regardless of all that, you will need to find yourself a sober support group somewhere, somebody you can call anytime when you need to talk.  And somebody else you can call when that first person is not available.  And so on, and so on, and so on.  You've got to have new habits and things in place to do now instead of getting a drink.  When I get that feeling that I need a drink, I call my sponsor, call someone in my support group, read something, go to a meeting, go hang out at an AA club, do something that I do now instead of getting drunk.  But I don't get that feeling too often now.  That desire has been generally gone for many years now.  Occasionally I would like to have a big bottle of Vodka, but I can't envision myself sitting around having cocktails with my friends at a restaurant or really romancing it like that.

And a psychiatrist and a good therapist are really important.  Because eventually you're going to get down to what causes you, drives you to keep drinking when all logic would tell you that it's enough.  The consequences are adding up and no sane person would continue in the face of what I could potentially lose and have already lost.  But everything is going to be great.  You'll see.  Just take baby steps.  Make a decision.

sheltercrow, I'm sorry to hear about the trauma you had to go through when you were younger.  It's not a coincidence that so many of us have similar backgrounds.  It's hard to come out able to function in the "normal" world with some of the things in our childhoods and lives.  Believe me, I know.  And I have the alphabet soup of diagnoses and medications to go with them, too.  As long as it's working for you with your psych and therapist, keep doing it!  Whatever works, I say.  I've been in therapy for ten years.  My last therapist retired after we were together weekly for six years.  I haven't been able to find another one for the past two years, but it's time to get back into it.  I'm getting a little off the beam in a lot of areas and need someone to bounce some things off of in a confidential way.

[dark69meat]

Three weeks seems essential in a lot of cases, and getting away from one's current environment makes perfect sense.  And "taking time for me" from the daily responsibilities too.  Working the steps and getting the correct sponsor seems compulsory. The work can and will pay off, but I understand the commitment, which I don't want to fail.  It's a matter of life or death.  Reading the book also seems important, but I feed off peoples energy (good or bad).  I need positive support from a group who like to interact with me, that's what I want, whether it's NA (Narcotics Anonymous) or AA, no matter.

I was rather shocked to read..."I went to meetings for 12 miserable years without being willing to do much beyond the bare minimum."  I have a feeling I may be roughly be in the same age bracket, but I'll tell you I seem to relate to younger folks better, but not always.  I have this vision AA will be a group of older folks in the 'classic' smoked filled room.  I know now they aren't suppose to smoke... or?  I want a fun crowd and not be all serious the whole meeting with too much emotion.

I'm still on the hunt for a psychiatrist and/or a good therapist.  I got a few leads today and contacted them with insurance questions and location, which is important.  I'm setting the ground work and doing a little homework before I act.  I'm mythical and prepared before I execute a plan.

I did like your comments... "But everything is going to be great.  You'll see.  Just take baby steps", and of course... bottom line..."Whatever works, I say"

[needsreaders]

I may have accidentally misled you a bit about my age in rereading my post.  I went to AA drinking for 12 miserable years, then I went to AA sober for 13 years and now to NA for five years.  Isn't that pathetic?  I've spent my whole life quitting drinking.  I'm 46 so I started young.  But I would say that I'm grateful to be an addict -- or grateful to know that I'm an addict.  I wouldn't have near the depth and quality of life I have now if I didn't do and continue to do the work necessary to keep me clean.  And I never would have met the vast array of unvelievable people that I've had the opportunity to meet.  .

[Charlie's girl]

[Charlie's girl]

Things aren't going well here.  My husband and I had a fight last night.  I was wasted.  I always seem fine but last night it hit me all at once.  He thinks I'm gross.  I can't sleep.  I've been up since 3.  I feel like such a loser.  Any advice???

[criminalpa]

[criminalpa]

I have had quite a bit of success with a drug called Topamax.  It helps with the cravings.  Actually a migraine medication, but works well on alcoholism.

[tigra]

Did you murder anyone? .. Dont beat yourself up tomorrows another day. .My librium are working for now.. but its early days. But dont be so hard on yourself.

[needsreaders]

That's the thing about drinking, it sort of unexpectedly turns on you at a certain point and where it used to be your friend, now it's in charge and doing some pretty horrendous things to your life.  There is lot's of great advice out here that I never even knew existed before I stumbled on this place.  But in the end the decision is yours.  You talked about children and a husband who loves you enough to go to meetings with you at first.  You have a lot to lose.  And from your writing you are a very intelligent, articulate person who just sounds frightened out of her mind and I have been there.  I would go for days in my flannel nightgown, only getting dressed to go to the liquor store.  My whole life revolved around that bottle.  How much did I have?  Was it enough?  How much will I drink today?  Well, that was a lie,  I'm sure I'll drink it all, I better get more.... What happens if I wake up in the middle of the night and I have drunk it all?  How will I get back to sleep?  That was the worst part.  Having to listen to the fear running around in my head all the time about the worst things that could happen in all areas of my life.  I had to drink to drown out the noise.  I didn't know that I really needed certain types of medication that would take all that away. You don't have to live like this anymore and detoxing won't be that bad.  Doctors know how to take care of you. But you don't have to quit until you're ready..... or ever.  You are a great person.  I'm sure you are doing all you can to be the best mom there is and to be a great wife.  Alcoholics are generally overachievers and perfectionists and I'm sure you're no different.  But you've got to take some time to take care of yourself now or there won't be anything left to give to them.  They need you to be whole and strong for them and really you'll be a better mom by taking time out for you.
Just be good to yourself...

[Charlie's girl]

Thankyou for the support.  This forum is great because I can express my true feelings and stop lying about my problem.  I truly feel like I have a monkey on my back and it's a shity feeling for sure.  
needsreaders,  I don't think I can do inpatient treatment.  I can't let it be known that I have this problem.  I'm not ready for that.  I want to try on my own first.  I would be mortified if everyone knew, my family, my husbands family.  I just can't, not now.
If I do it on my own.  What are your suggestions.  Should I try topamax?

Charlie

[needsreaders]

Well, if you're going to try it on your own, the first thing you've got to do is put in a large supply of Blue Bell ice cream. Alcohol converts directly into sugar in your body and if you've been used to getting a lot of alcohol you are going to be craving that sugar. That's what cravings are.  So replenish it with lots of fabulous Blue Bell.  And don't worry about calories, this is about saving your life and making sure you don't give in to cravings for alcohol.  Get rid of all the bottles from everywhere, don't leave one out. Tell your husband what you're doing because you'll need his support and help with the kids. If you can, try to avoid unnecessary stress.  My suggestion, and it's only a suggestion, is to find an AA club to go hang out in for as long as you can and talk to people that are also there to hang out between meetings.  Make some new friends.  And go to as many meetings as you can.  Find some women's meetings especially. And do not go to meetings only with your husband.  This disease is not your fault but it is your responsibilty.  I said find a club because there are a lot of meetings that are held at churches and that's all it is, they open the doors for the meeting hour and there is really no fellowship except for a brief period before and after.  At a club you can hang around from the time they open in the morning until they close, which at my home group is 7:00 a.m. to 11:00 or 12:00 at night.  Get on the internet and look up AA for your town. They should have a meeting schedule and locations.  In my city there are well over 1,000 meetings a week, so I don't have any excuse not to go to a meeting at any time of day. Get some phone numbers from women and use them.  Build up a support group of people to call -- even in the middle of the night.  Someone was there for them at the beginning.  They'll be glad to give that back to you.  

I do take topomax (topamax), and it's a wonderful drug for killing cravings I must say.  I said somewhere else on another post that it makes me forget to eat.  But I take it for its mood stabilizing effect, which it works very well for me.  I was taking something else that caused an unbelievable amount of weight gain and I found on the net that Topamax had the opposite effect and so I told my psych to change my prescription.  They were basically the same, both anti-seizure medications. They do prescribe Topamax to alcoholics, smokers, and obese people all for its effect at killing cravings.  You might mention it to your psychiatrist.  And I say psychiatrist because I really believe in matching the right doctor to the right ailment.  I feel that psychiatrists are more caught up on the latest drugs and treatments for diseases and disorders of the mind since that's their specialty and are more likely to give me the best treatment than a general practitioner who just put a bandage on a skinned knee right before he saw me. No offense to any GPs out there.  So ask the doctor what he thinks is the best way to go.  He may have something he wants to give you at first to help you get through detox, and then switch you over to something else for a while.  Who knows, he's the doctor ;o)  

I hope you're maintaining a little better tonight, sweetie.  I know how it gets and controlled drinking is hell on earth. Just hold on a little longer until you feel the time is right to make a decision.  Because that's what it's going to take is for you to step over that line and just make a decision.  I know you can do it.

needs readers

[dark69meat]

" I may have accidentally misled you a bit about my age in rereading my post.  I went to AA drinking for 12 miserable years, then I went to AA sober for 13 years and now to NA for five years.  Isn't that pathetic? "... no that's not pathetic, you were trying to do the right thing; weren't you?  I'm a little older at 53 and male (didn't realize your were female...hee ) not that matters.  It's good to hear your son turned out so nice.  Sounds like real success, if you ask me.

I selected a therapist today, but the appointment isn't until a few weeks.  I could only do evenings with job and traffic issues.  I did locate both AA and NA only 2.5 miles away.  Ironically they are in the same community building, but at different times.  I don't have anyone to go with and rather shy, so I don't know.  I know that sounds silly, although I have no problem talking with my corporate job.  Yes, I'm a overachiever too BTW and never miss a day of work, although my concentration can be affected.

I felt like having a bunch of beer today, but went to the gym instead.  Then I thought about having beer after the gym, but stopped myself.  It's only been 2 days without.  I felt great today and well rested; what's that tell me??

[dark69meat]

topomax -- I'm curious about that one and no, I don't want to gain weight.  I wasn't planning on taking anything and don't want to, but we'll see.

alexandra fox  --

You're right... counseling and/or support groups are required and know that's the only way for me.  I've got to be free of obsessive cravings (which are a total copout, especially when I'm alone).  My outpatient care is close to finalized or at least there's a plan.  I've gotta get out of this hell, which I've been a slave to for 30 years.  Yes, that f***ing long.  Now that's pathetic, but my body been damn durable.  Maybe because I eat healthy, dunno...

.

[needsreaders]

I didn't realize you made the decision to quit!  Fantastic!  Do the best you can.  And don't be nervous about going to a meeting.  Every one of those people there remembers their first meeting and newcomers are special people. They give us a chance to give back something of what we have been given.  And you don't have to share in the meeting, but do identify yourself as a newcomer, or first time ever to the program or however they work it where you are.  Different places in the country conduct meetings differently, I understand.  
And congratulations on resisting your cravings.  Like I told Charlie's girl, You ought to go get some BlueBell ice cream to replace the sugar you're used to getting from the alcohol.  That has a lot to do with cravings.  Treat yourself!  Get three kinds!  I do that anyway now, 18 years later.  Thanks to the Topamax it doesn't matter!

And for some reason I can remember needing a lot of naps, like my body was just completely worn out and I could sleep forever.  But after about a week, I started to feel really good and get some natural energy back.  What a feeling!
of course, I was in treatment, so they kept us busy like we were in kindergarten with some activity to do every minute and then snack time with ice cream sandwiches and then art therapy time.  But it was great really and I had never done group therapy before so I learned a lot about myself and about other people.  I mean, before I went in there I had no idea what made people do what they did AT ALL.  It was a mystery to me.  So all in all, it was a great experience, even though my husband was a giant jackass and didn't come to bring my son to see me once in three weeks or even come to visit me himself. But that's another story.  

[dark69meat]

Well, I would like to hear more of your story, maybe email.  I could learn a great deal from you.  Sounds like your husband was an jackass.  I do notice the sugar levels and how that effects my body.  Since I drink so much beer now, never so I desire sweets.  You're hot on 'BlueBell ice cream' I noticed... hee.

I am nervous about the whole thing, but once I'm there shouldn't have problems identifying myself as newcomer.  It's just getting there and out of my home; I haven't done that yet.

Yeah, booze drains one's energy, and effects sleep patterns negatively too  because I get dehydrated.  I hate alcohol, it's obviously a demon.  <--- I've heard that before

[dark69meat]

Day 3 -- no booze so far, but thought about it more today than yesterday.  That bothers me.... urr, umm a lot.  Feel good now tho; maybe ice cream later per your recommendation.  Not sure if I can get my hands on 'BlueBell' tonight.  Is another brand acceptable under this condition?  hee..

I've been talking to my soon-to-be- therapist via email the last few days, which has been positive.  It's like starting a whole new life journey.  I know I'm going to have a lot of work cut out, but I'm up for the challenge, me thinks.

Charlie's girl  - Any good news today?  You've been quiet.

[Charlie's girl]

Hi everyone.  Things are looking up.  I have been quiet.  It's really hard for me to get on the computer.  My 3 year old has Asperger's syndrome.  He is doing great with extreme early intervention.  He is always on the computer.  He is self taught reading and writing "hyperlexia".  He likes to google every word he reads.  We have to limit him.  I was totally sober through both of my pregnancys.  My younger boy is not even a year yet so it hasn't been that long since I was off the booze.  I'm motivated and not as afraid with all of your support.  Thank you all.  I don't know what I would do without this board.  please keep us posted on your progress.  Dark69:  Great, three days.  Your doing great....

Charlie

[dark69meat]

Now starting day 5 and doing great so far.  My mood is damn good too, not all hungover or anything.  Sounds like you have some challenges with kids and special needs.  My hat goes off to you as a decent mom.  That's real tough and why you need to stay sober for them, above all.  Don't be quiet too long and say hello asap.  Take care!

[Charlie's girl]

Hey It's me.  I hardly drank anything today.  Just two glasses of japanese sake...  I'm bored.  Now what?  Maybe I'll just go to bed early and pretend that I'm pregnant again.  That's what I did then.  Both boys are in bed and my husband got a movie.  It's Sat. night and weird that I'm not drinking at all.  I guess I'll eventually adjust.  I'm ready for change.  My husband put his foot down.  He knows all of my hiding spots.  I had no idea.  He has been keeping tabs on my alcohol intake.  Maybe not all of it but enough for major concern.  
Dark69, I hope you are doing well.  

Charlie

[dark69meat]

There's nothing wrong going to bed early 'alcohol free" and feel good the next day.  That's what I'm going to do.  I had chocolate cake in lieu of beer today, as I said in the other thread.  I know what you mean about not drinking on Sat. night, but I'm not going to because it would only make me depressed with the hangover in the morning.  I go to bed early sometimes too  because I've been so depressed lately, but not as bad without liquor which I think the culprit for my problems.  Your hubby sounds like my wife (the warden'), but I don't hide booze too much, but have drank it in the garage numerous times.  Guess I hide too and drink in the closet so to speak.  When you think about it, it's really a miserable way to exist.  

I'm doing well Charlie's girl without booze and ready for day 6.  Thanks for asking!  Can we make Sunday is the question?  Hope the same for you!

[Charlie's girl]

It's sunday.  I did go to bed early last night but still feel tired.  My eleven month old wakes up every three hours for a bottle and it's become exhausting for both my hubby and me.  Yeah, he is like the warden.  Sometimes it gets on my nerves because he has his own issues.  Well, they don't create problems because I don't get on his case about anything.  He likes to smoke pot, only the really good stuff.  He functions so well on it and is an extremely successful man with his own business.  We are lucky to be finacially in a great place.  He works so hard.  He isn't home most of the time.  That's when I tend to drink more.  I'm sure with most people they drink more when the spouse is gone.   Over the summer there were 70 days when he wasn't home for dinner or bedtime with the children.  I have a huge job with no family in the area.  Drinking is my way of dealing with all of these challenges. I know it sounds like a terrible excuse and it has esculated.  I know it's out of control.  I'm trying so hard to cut down.  I am to scared to go CT all the way because of seizures.  For quite some time my intake has been really bad.  To much in my opinion to go CT.
My goal today is to only have a few glasses of wine to take the edge off.  Go to bed early.  Maybe continue this for a week and then go down to two glasses, then one, and then none.  Only one a week would be ideal.  I'm setting little goals for the week.  I need to keep busy and out of the house.  Besides running my older son from therapy to therapy weekly I have completely isolated myself.  I use the babies nap as an excuse not to do more things.  I often wonder if people know I have a problem.  I wonder if it's obvious and I'm just oblivious to it...  I hope not.  
I'm so glad that you are doing well.  It's so nice to have somebody who I can talk to about this.  It's really important so I thank you:)

Charlie

[dark69meat]

I know how it is with a baby that wakes up and you're right, it's exhausting.  I  smoked pot -- "the good stuff" for 12 years straight almost everyday until our son was born.  One day I threw it all away (including the pipes) never returning.  I went CT and it worked and thought alcohol would be the same, but it's not for me.  Also it's a negative genetic thing with me.  I've always functioned well both getting through school and the corporate job I've had help for many years, but that's not the point.  Money no problem here either...

You're like me regarding drinking alone, which isn't a good sign.  See, the problem with me is I become rather unsociable under the influence and in my own little selfish world.  When I'm loaded I'm not making a connection with the ouside world or the people around me.  Same goes when I'm hungover, because I'm just more irritable and angry.  Booze makes me tired too -- the days that follow even after I'm clean again.  My intake hasn't escalated, it's just always the same over the yeears which bothers me too.  Like someone said, here… it's nice to be free and out of prison, but I can't feel that until I'm sober and for a  very long time.

I haven't drank today and kind of starting to forget about it.  I'm avoiding social situations that involve alcohol too.  I'm weak and don't want to be around that environment right now.  A few glasses of wine would only make me have a few more and then more after that.  I'm normally just not satisfied with 2 glasses like 'normal' people.  I don't drink like a normal person either, I'm a volume drinker.  It's not healthy either.  People haven't noticed except my wife I have a problem, I don't think.  She usaully doesn’t ***** at me and wonderful, but there have been comment…"have you been drinking?"  If people know now I just don't care because I want off the stuff and free.  Again, I feel great and almost happy today!

Charlie - Please be careful with the seizures and keep writing here and in our private messages too. You're welcome!  -D

[Charlie's girl]

I'm doing ok... I did get a bottle of wine and have had two glasses.  Now I want more.  It sucks.  I won't be able to get it though.  My husband is keeping a close watch.  He knows I need to get better.  Most days I would have woken up and had a few vodka drinks.  I'm feeling better physically and I've decided to stop with the hard liquor.  
He loves his weed.  I'm guilty of smoking it too.  Only late night and occasionally.  I get really baked when I smoke.  It makes me crazy.  I would never be able to socialize in public high on weed...  It's hard enough as it is.  I'm pretty introverted.  I've trained myself how to be more social but it's still very hard.  I go days without talking on the phone.  I hate shopping or hanging out with friends one on one.  If my husband is with me I feel more secure.  I actually like being alone and at home or just with my kids.  
The reason I mentioned seizures is because I heard that coming of alcohol CT can cause that and it scares the **** out of me.  So far so good though...
Keep me posted Dark69meat.  I like our connection.

Charlie

[dark69meat]

That's what's more frustrating  ... "I did get a bottle of wine and have had two glasses.  Now I want more"...... See, I'm a "all or nothing" personality, so it's better not even start.  Trust me, I'm just realizing this after years of abuse and never sayiong no thanks.  I don't like being monitored either.  Sometimes I'd just leave the house and drink somewhere else.  Hard liquor again would destroy me; a few vodka's would really get me going in the morning; I wouldn't be able to stop only to get blind later.

I'm also VERY introverted; weed and booze only make me even more anti-social.  Nope, I really need to get bad on track, it's been long enough, but I've been doing all of this a lot longer than you.  Again, I'm worried more about my metal state lately.  With your hubby doing weed and you booze; are you guys really making a connection?  <-- no answer is perfectly fine.

My wife has never been an addict, which is a good thing.

Yes our connection (you and me) is great too!  -D

[Charlie's girl]

I'm back....  Things aren't so happy right now.  I got vodka today.  I told myself no but the first place I went was to the liquor store. I couldn't control myself.  I have only had a couple.  That was hours ago.  Maybe it's time to to to AA....  Or fess up to the psych.
charlie

[dark69meat]

* mental....

It's hard Charlie -- real hard.  I don't know what the answer is at all; I'm new to this too….the thought of stopping madness, the vicious cycle of addiction.  When I was mid-30's as you, the thought of stopping never occurred to me at all.  I just wanted to party all day and all night, like the song.  It's great until you feel like **** the next day and realize you have to come down and face reality.  Reality sucks, especially when you're hung-over, but sober it's boring at times; then again it's not really that bad.  My body seems to be more at ease and not working as hard too.  I don't seem as irritable or bitchy either….  

[Charlie's girl]

Are you an artist ?

What do you do for a living?

I hear what you are saying....It's better on the other side...  It's time to take care of me.  

I'm proud of you for doing that for yourself.....

Charlie

[sheltercrow]

Needsreaders, Charlie, and everyone. Nice to hear from you. I am not lobbying for anything in particular other than the safety of our members.
If you haven’t the funds or insurance for fees there is a form you can fill out at your local social service agency that provides a sliding scale. Mine cost 5.25 dollars per visit when I started and that covered the entire 125 dollar fee.
The wonderful thing about therapy is you get to tell your story. The first lesson is to do justice to yourself and make sure you get the record straight. This means that you have to make it clear that you are the real patient and not their notion of what you are supposed to be.
I have seen 8 therapists so far. There is a tendency for the therapists to place their words about your illness in your mouth. They will even at times reinterpret what you have said to their liking. I’m sure it’s not personal and makes for a reduction in their case load but my life and mental health is quite important to me. There is another tendency that is quite remarkable and that is that the therapist may use simple, common, archetypical personality assessments which really don’t apply to mental disorders in the first place. These subconscious determinants of the therapist are used to evaluate your disorder according to how you look to how much you may not drool in therapy.
The first was a trainee and just didn’t have a clue. She was a very nice woman but I had to find another because I was literally giving her a lesson on how to be a therapist.
The second was an alcoholic/AA person and was into new wave god theology. He wanted me to tell him what he wanted to hear. He was a light-weight abuse/recovered person who had the illusion that he had the inside track on everything. Turned out he was nothing more than a parole officer masquerading as a therapist. I fired him.
The third/fourth was just out of school and was making text book assessments that had little to do with real life situations. Her and a fellow therapist finally got fed up and ganged up on me one session and I responded quite magnanimously to their cookie cutter ideology dealing with dialectical behavioral therapy. It tough dealing with a PTSD/Borderline like myself because we do not like to be bullied.
The fifth/sixth were dbt session therapists that thought it inappropriate to speak in session. Go figure.
I am on my seventh now.
The eighth has been with me the entire time but is with a different organization that has been treating nut cases like me for a long time. I trust her entirely.
But I digress. Their very good when their good.

[dark69meat]

I'm not going to knock therapy until I try it first hand. I used to laugh at the profession.  I'm obsessive compulsive about everything which doesn't help.  Mental health problems run in my family along with alcoholism on both sides.  I'm sure a lot of psychology is total hogwash, but I'm old enough to no better.  At least I've made it one week with no booze... heh.

I might try AA just to get a feel for it;  I just want to make friends with connections going through the same thing; maybe get a nice sponsor and leave the rest.  The 12 step formula might be too much of a commitment at this time.  Plus I don't truly believe in God.

[RD1angel]

I have been reading your posts, and I fully respect your thoughts on religion.  If you do go to an AA meeting, and are totally turned off, don't quit, try a different meeting. I know many people who don't believe in GOD, but as needsreader stated above, one has to believe in something larger and more powerful than we.  We do have a saying in AA:  "Religion is for people who don't want to go to hell, Spirituality is for those who have been there and don't want to go back"  Going one week without any booze..... I am applauding you !!!!!!!!!!  That is awesome, I can remember when I desperately wanted to quit drinking and within 24 hours the craving and compulsion were so overwhelming I would cave.  Keep trying and add another day to that week.  ^5

[dark69meat]

Well, I might not even know what I'm talking about.  Religion was crammed down my throat; my parents were/are the biggest hypocrites the world has ever known.  I understand ..."one has to believe in something larger and more powerful than we."... and the key is staying sober and to continue to be, the rest of my life.  I've never actually thought about quitting.  It's more of a mental health issue for me right now.  I never 'bottomed out", DUI or anything and fortunately don't have any physical effects for day 8, clean and sober.  In fact I feel great!  Friends would be the most powerful force for me right now, like the wonderful folks on this forum.  We're all in this together.  I don't want to be anti-social anymore, I want to become part of the human race again.  Addiction has made me a fraction of a man I once was, but I'm changing all of that and being proactive...I want to embrace life and people again.  I want to be happy and "out of jail", and free so to speak.

..."Religion is for people who don't want to go to hell, Spirituality is for those who have been there and don't want to go backBack pain - low Back strain treatment" ... yea, that makes perfect sense...^5  too!

[Charlie's girl]

Thank you for this.  I totally agree.  We can all do this together if we all support each other.  It's time to turn over a new leaf, everybody....  if I could only practice what I preach.  I wish I could.  That's all I want.
I'm happy for you 8 days...  I'm sure you are feeling good..  Keep it up.
I've never bottomed out either.  I've had my phases with many drugs..  I've never really bottomed out either. We can get past this challenge too..  
Keep me posted Dark
Charlie

[dark69meat]

I entered something in your journal today.  It took me a long time to realize how anti-social I've become with alcohol (my friend).  I could always depend on it when I was down and lonely.  Yes, I've drank in the parking lot at the grocery store.  Why not?  And the garage too.

I think 'tigra' up to day 10 and I'll be right behind her for 9.  Join us Charlie's girl, get the help you need.  Free yourself because you know the same ugly pattern will persist.  And just think how crappy you'll feel in the morning after drinking.  That what's making me ultimately quit I've decided.  I just want to feel good, like I do now.

You're a good person C, but you can be better.

[Charlie's girl]

I'll check my journal.  Thanks.  You are right.  I'm still young and I can get it together.....  I'm no dumby. I just love to have fun.  I want to party all the time party all the time party all the tiiiiimmeeeee.......Only all by myself.....  
I will come around soon.  You are a great support. Your words will bring me to sobrity in the end.  I'm sure of it.  It's so nice to be able to confide in someone and nobody knows.
I'm glad you are one week sober.  

Charlie

[ibizan]

I love your descriptions of the therapists!Crack me up and very true!I've worked in the counseling field since 1979 and in the addictions field since 1985.I am nothing more than a guide and a sounding board to my folks.I rely on them to tell me how they feel,think.etc.I don't live in their skins and feel what they feel but being thru this b4 I know some!I've worked and work with some counselors who are Towers of PsychoBabble and purveyors of mis-information.Glad u hung in there and found one you trust.

[ibizan]

I began to attend AA/NA in 1983.Was introduced to it in treatment.Had 12 years of Catholic schools.The Higher Power thing is stressed in 12 Step but it also says a God as u understand...which also implies if u choose not too.I'm not sure if there is a God.He or she hasn't emailed,faxed or phoned!I hope so but will never know for sure.I do wonder daily is there all this is?This is one helluva world we live in!My dad passed 2 years ago.At nite in the backyard with the dogs for last pottycall I look at the stars and say hey dad u out there?up there?damn I sure hope so!I'm digressing....anyway 12 Step was the first place i was allowed the freedom to ponder this.The most important thing about 12 Step is the sober socialization.There is a saying,an alcoholic alone is in bad company!As we all can see we cannot do this alone and need each others support!I knew i wasn't go to stay sober talking to my Siamese cat in my old apt. back in the day ,I used to look at her and asked should I go to the bar and drink tonic water?or go to AA/NA?She had crossed eyes and would look back at me as if to say u *** u know where u should go!Now get there.I'm glad I did and it helped me to look at my behaviors...and to adopt those principles in2 my life.To walk that talk,not just pay it lip service.And to stick with the winners.There is another saying...when u go to a meeting....take ur mental basket...fill i t with what u can use and LEAVE the rest!Found a cool definition under Spirituality in Websters...under spiritualize......."That which frees u from the corrupt influence of the world'!!!now THAT has nothing to do with the God thing.We must all find our purpose and what brings us sober/clean joy in this life!

[ibizan]

I've read some of your comments.Whoa u gotta lot on your plate!I am concerned for you with all that alcohol and u a mom with young kids.I know u r too!prayers for u that u can stop for ur healths sake and being a mother.Hub smoke a lotta weed...man i've seen that...u need to stop drinking but i function ok on weed big pot calling lil kettle black.......u concentrate on urself girl ONLY U CAN DO FOR U!.......where is your support system minus no family around?any sober moderately sane girlfriends?

[tigra]

I do believe we go somewhere else.. i had a near death experience.. an it was the whole thing .. the tunnel , the bright light.. an everyone that i knew... that was dead was there.. there was a small white pickett fence and the gate was open.. they were calling me an i so wanted to go an see them.. but i knew if i went thought that gate i was a goner... im not drunk honest! I woke up after the operation.. an the doc said we thought we'd lost you .. they could nt control my blood pressure...so you never no maybe this is hell we're in.. an heaven awaits

[ibizan]

I am with u on this and believe people encounter the other side if they almost leave here.I cannot imagine a place other than earth filled with the tumult and sadness that exists here....and the war we must wage to maintain our sanity here!I feel the wisdom/strength of my father all around me.I hear him urging me to semper diem as he did....get out there do ur best and seize the day!

[dark69meat]

In 1983 I was really have a good time partying non-stop.  Are folks worse off raised in Catholic schools?  A lot of my ex-G/F's were schooled there.  I understand the 'higher power' concept at AA, I think;... seeing and hearing is believing.  God I can't embrace, especially if he/she doesn't email.

I'm interested in 'sober socialization' regarding AA and think I can embrace the philosophy. Actually reading the books and getting through the 12 steps like mountaineering seems a little overwhelming at this time.  Not sure I can commit, but I'll take baby steps...."alcoholic alone is in bad company"... that is very true.  I can't do this alone and it well be a journey like anything else in life.  Drinking tonic water at a bar sounds awkward to me, but there might be times when I have to.  Social situations well be hard if everyone is drinking.  I well get so bored maybe; guess I could be the 'driver'.  "Mental basket"... can you elaborate please?  I'm all about taking what I need and forget the rest policy.  I need to free myself of the "corrupt influence of the world".  I just want to live clean and be a better person to mind, body and spirit....

[RD1angel]

I to believe in a life after death.....  I have faith, I have too.  But doesn't anyone ever think....  Just once, just a little real life sign that no one,can deny.  But, so far that hasn't happened.  I try to keep myself open that I will be able to "feel" the love and warmth of my sibling that pasted.  who knows?

[ibizan]

I know the Catholic schools gave me some sort of self discipline that i integrated along with strict ethnic Slovenian upbringing!But i never bought the dogma and all thefear/guilt stuff.Sounds like ur job/biz socializing takes u in2 bars?oh man that would be a toughie!I had no biz newly sober in a bar....no biz....and the phone stopped ringing when my partying stopped.I found out i had a ton of partying buds and no real friends.Have developed them thru the years!Found a few in 12 step.The others were cool EarthPeople.Imagine the mental basket as a small wicker basket lodged tween ur 2 ears.u hear stuff at AA u can use.....put it in basket.u hear nother thing u can't use...no go in2 basket!dig?

[ibizan]

how long ago did ur sibling pass?

[RD1angel]

10/1/2000   He was 24, my baby brother.

[Charlie's girl]

you are doing well?????  
Happy halloween....  It's been a long day.  My baby turned one.  We all dressed up and had fun....  I've been thinking about you.  I hope your fine.

Charlie

[dark69meat]

Happy Halloween to you too!  Good news about baby and one year.  You need to be around for them too!  I doing great.. thanks!

ibizan  -- My phone isn't ringing as much, but I can't hang w/party folks right now.  That would be a very bad move because I'm very weak in social situations.  I heard 'Catholic schools' have the crazy - fun girls.. or that was my experience...;-)   Need to think about the 'mental basket' a bit more....

I don't believe in a life after death... never have.  I think when you're dead; you're dead.  Nothing has convinced me otherwise.

[ibizan]

Very wise 4 u 2 realize that ur vulnerable in wet situations now.... and need to avoid.No need 2 xplain 2 anyone and if they can't respect that than fungu 2 them!Crazy/most likely but i never truly believed what they were trying to feed me.Inquisitive,mildly defiant...heheheh.....and non-conformist!ur entitled to ur beliefs on the hereafter. or nothing after..anything and nothing is possible.

[dark69meat]

I feel like drinking real bad all of a sudden by myself in the parking lot.  Serious.  The beast is in my rear view mirror... lurking around. I don't like it.  

[ibizan]

u need 2 haul ur carcass to an AA meeting....make urself go.U may change ur mind after its over.u don't hafta air ur dirty laundry.Just go in and listen.Tell the beast to go sodomize himself.

[Charlie's girl]

[Charlie's girl]

I agree about wanting to drink in the parking lot.  It's so hard to get through the day without your crutch.  Keep posting.  Even if we aren't there yet we can all talk and support and maybe we will get there soon.  
I've never been to aa.  Can you give more details about the meetings?  What are the people like?  Do I have to say anything.  How many people show up.  I'm nervous to go...  I'm so curious though.
Dark.  I think you are doing so well so far.  Are you going to a meeting.  Maybe I should go to and then we can talk about our experiences after.  
Charlie

[Charlie's girl]

I agree with ibizan about just going.  You want to be sober just make that last step.

God, I hate talking the talk but not walking the walk.

Nevermind me, I just want what's best for you and I know from our discussions that you truely want to get sober.  This seems like the right move at least for a start.  Maybe it will be better than you think.  Maybe it won't be super religious.  Maybe you can just take it as you want to take it and still benefit from the experience.   I'm sure that many people that go to AA aren't very religious. Maybe you will meet a new friend or hear a story that insires you.
Don't go drink in the parking lot after so many days sober.  You will be so disappointed in yourself.  

Remember, we are all only human.  I am hear for you.

Charlie

[ibizan]

u2 need to get urself to AA.Open leads are speaker meeting...one whose been sober a year and tells story.Discussions r for those who are in recovery and a topic is chosen or a problem for discussions.Just go and listen.Only requirement for memberships is a desire to stop drinking.U don't hafta tell anything to anyone.Just go and listen.When i felt like drinking or had a bag'o'**** in my head..I MADE myself go....sat..listenend...and was glad after i didn't drink.Nice to wake up in morn and feel ok bout what u see in the mirror!and remember how ya got home!

[dark69meat]

This long thread is my favorite.  *phew*, I made it, but had a rough time yesterday.  I almost broke down and drank a bunch of beer.  I think if I would have started it would have been even more what I normally drink (which is a lot). That's were the depression sets in.  I'm going to AA tonight and report back with my first night.  I want to meet others' like yourself going through the same thing..." a group" setting, not just one-on-one which I'm normally more comfortable with.  I don't think I could look at myself in the mirror IF I got wasted again.  It's too painful and depressing anymore.  I don't want to procrastinate, it's a matter of life or death at this point.

Charlie -- "God, I hate talking the talk but not walking the walk.''' ... you can change that; join me!

Yes, I'm sure there's others that don't embrace religion there, but that's the least of my worries now.  I want to be free -- nothing more, nothing less.

ibizan  -  "Only requirement for memberships is a desire to stop drinking"..... that's all I want really!

[ibizan]

it worked  4 me..i went did my best to keep open mind..filled my basket and stuck with the talkers who walked what they talked!Charlie...womens aa meeting good and support group for moms with kids who have Aspbergers.....girl ur plate is overflowing!

[Charlie's girl]

I know it is.  Thanks for the support.  I'll try the aa meeting.  I'll have to get the right time so I can get a sitter.  
It's nice to talk to you guys.  

Charlie

[ibizan]

i hope so!u on my mind a lot there with the kids....,u need a lot of help and a lot of support.......sounds like u love ur kids a lot!Now u gotta start lovin urself some!Alcohol is liquid self mutilation!

[dark69meat]

liquid self mutilation!... not good as ibizan stated for you Charlie or fam...
The sitter set up Charlie... for an hour or two... listen me like I even know;-)

[ibizan]

u b inchin towards that meetin dark like a caterpillar...thassright......this sobriety stuff is inchworm caterpillaring...and u Charliegirl have GOT 2 START TAKING ACTION for ur SANITY!

[Charlie's girl]

Ok.  You have me sold...  I will try the aa meeting.  
Hey Dark, did you go to yours?  I want to hear the details.  To bad we don't live in the same state.  We could go together.  I am going to feel so nervous....  I hate that anxious social feeling I get..  
Please keep me posted.
I have a sitter on tues. and thurs. so i can drive my older son to his therapies.  I can go after I drop him back off to the house.  I have a couple hours to kill after that.  ibizan, do you suggest all women's group for AA?  Smoking or non???  Should I look in one certain area over another?  

Charlie

[ibizan]

if u don't smoke the non-smokers meetings will be refreshing.its nice to have a variety of meetings to check out......all womens sprinkled in there is variety and at womens discusssion ur comfortable discussing things if  u choose that u wouldn't feel comfy with in mixed company.So try some different ones and see what clicks 4 u.i'm happy to see ur gonna give this a try and do realize your sons schedule.it is Saturday and tues isn't far away..if thats the best u can do then thats cool.I had a lady client who was crack addict.her son had Aspbergers.She did so well and got clean.stayed that way for awhile....then relapsed.i tried to contact her but no hear back.ur in my prayers Charlie girl......u go girl!

[dark69meat]

I was not that nervous after all; people are people regardless.  I've been to different parts of the world so maybe that helps.  They didn't know if I was visiting from another town or what.  I just walked in and sat down like I owned the place, only later offered the information it was my first time.  They did ask if this was any one's 1st,2nd or 3rd time.  We don't pay dues (2 dollars) until the 4th time if you want.   All nice folks and I was treated like royalty because it was my firt meeting.  The babes were all over me... will kind of...;-)

Yes, we certainly could have gone together Charlie... I like you're proactive with sitter and thinking about this.  And glad we're an influence, mainly ' ibizan '  *high five*.  All my meetings are non-smoking, but folks go outside of course.  I encourage anyone to go if they're struggling w/quitting like me.  I'm powerless, no doubt and surely want beer this afternoon, but it's one day at a time, as cliche as that is

I felt bad in some ways because my brief 10 min story at the meeting did not include 'bottoming out', DUI's, lost wife, job etc.  It seemed they were all there because they got in trouble and reacting to the situation or forced by court order.  Maybe that's my perception. The good news is they all said they were glad the program worked for them and turned their life around.  All ages were there.  One guy 65, drank a bottle of wine every night and 30 days sober and VERY proud.  Another, pretty girl, drank a box of wine every night since 17, then got DUI and she was GLAD to be pulled over so she could get sober.  She later said, she wouldn't go on her own, only if she got in trouble... thought that was interesting.

I might go to another meeting this weekend.  Their energy helps me and everyone is there for one reason -- to clean ones act and detox.  At the end of the meeting you get in a circle, hold hands and recite the lords payer.  The whole GOD thing I haven't brought up at the meeting yet.  I didn't want to bring a bunch of controversy to the table initially, which I have a tenancy to do, without even trying.  It's my way, I suppose......such is life.

C- get your *** there now!
    

[Charlie's girl]

I hear you and I'm listening.  I'll be going next week I promise.
I've been really good lately.  I have been feeling so guilty so I totally cut down on my intake.  It's a start.  I feel better already.  Yesterday I only had two drinks at dinner with my husband.  I felt really anxious all day though, kind of shaky and nauseous.  
Dark are you taking a benzo?  

Charlie

[dark69meat]

If I would have 2 drinks at dinner, I would want to have 10.  'benzo', no, I don't take anything -- nothing yet, might later tho.... dunno.

[ibizan]

Ya gotta get the dvd Drunks 1995 starring Richard Lewis.he is in real life sober/clean heroin addict.Great depiction of AA,his relapse and subsequent return.many times when saying the Lords prayer i would just bow my head and say nothing.the circle,the handholding emitted a sobering energy.Cutting down is good charlie,but we ALL know it won't last.Ur caterpillaring girl!Benzos are addictive for alcs/addicts not a good choice to calm down with.If used should be very short term for withdrawal...and monitored by a doc!

[dark69meat]

ibizan - personal question... did you ever relapse yourself?...."vd Drunks 1995 starring Richard Lewis"... wonder who has it for sale like cheap *** boss?  Molly sqeezed my hand at the meeting / circle, it felt good like she was trying to help, me thinks... I have no idea.  People were honest there which was beautiful, and the F word was permitted... bonus.

[ibizan]

haven't relapsed..many ask me why?i 2 damn afraid of the consequences!Getting sober once was enuf....don't wanna  go thru all the emotional caludron stuff again,,,,,guy at lead once said he felt like a seething cauldron of emotional turmoil!oh yeah!Drunks may be had at video store....Another one highly reccomended is Requiem for A Dream.Ended up buying it for none of the video stores had it..nominated for Oscar in 2000.very funny bout boss and Molly...no doubt she could relate 2 ur drinking!Honesty is at a premium these days....swearing?in abundance!some meetings get victorian about it...liked the ones who didn't!

[Charlie's girl]

Hi!  I will try to rent that movie.  I don't have much time for movies these days.  My schedule is so full.  
Question.  About how many people are in the group at an aa meeting?  Is there one specific person in charge?  
I'm going online now to find my meeting for Thurs.  I think I've been in complete denial about my intake.  I've been fooling myself to think it's no big deal.  
Dark,  I'm really proud of you.


Charlie

[ibizan]

I just got done watching Requiem for a Dream.it is not for the fainthearted...Ellen Burstyn addicted to diet pills.marlon wayans,jared leto and jen conelly as heroin addicts who bottom out.....very nauseatingly true.my stomach is still churning!Size of group just depends!r u in a metropolitan area?they run bigger in cities.Chairperson is in charge for the month,then they alternate.If a open lead meeting-speaker...chairperson asks one whose sober one year plus 2 speak.If a discussion meeting chair chooses topic and will ask/should if anyone is having particualr problem they want to discuss.U've taken first step girl.....admitted being powerless over alcohol and that it make u and ur life unmanageable!Ur not going tuesday as well?Yes....dark is hanging in there and telling the BEAST where 2 go!

[dark69meat]

Curious is all about the relapse, or not.  You might have mentioned before.  Not only was Molly at the 5pm meeting, she also mentioned attending the 7pm.  Maybe she goes to several meetings a day.  One older guy went on and on about God, but oh well.  I just don't want the format to be 'one way';...i.e. too rigid and/or fundamentalists point of view.  I'll hold judgment now and it didn't seem that way.  They only 'appeared' to be interested in getting me sober and helping; that's good enough!  

Charlie  -- There were about 20-25 in my meeting, but I've been told the 7-9pm meetings are full house of 50 -60+, standing room only.  I was OK with the smaller group the first time and 5 - 6:30 pm was a good time for me.  You are encouraged to participate a little, but there's no pressure.  The master of ceremony did call on people and everyone in the room remembered my name, pronto.  They do pay attention.  Again, I just walked in and didn't care; acted like I was out of town just hanging out, checking in.  No biggie really.... C - get your *** there, don't drink anymore, it's not worth messing your body up any longer.  Do it for your family!

[Charlie's girl]

I've been doing a lot of soul searching lately.  I'm not in denial I just can't stop.  I feel like such a loser.  Seriously, a complete loser.  I really need to start to mentally prepare for this.  I'm a pretty shy person.  I'm glad the group was bigger.  I don't like anyone to pay attention to me.  
Dark, are you going everyday? twice a day?

Charlie

[ibizan]

u can stop girl...u can.....u have good family doc?try Campral?google it and get the scoop.Back when i got sober......the docs wouldn't give meds to aid alcs thru uncomfortable withdrawals that can last awhile.PAWS-Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome..google this as well.Alcohol/heavy drinking really does a number on the cns......and the chemicals in the brain that are mood stabilizers.All of this is completely discombobulated...love that word.and dark...that saying...take what u can use and LEAVE the rest applies to the God stuff for u...what ur describing that was good/cool is what THOSE rooms r all about!

[dark69meat]

ibizan -
I meant to say.."I won't hold judgment ... they  'appeared' to be interested only getting me sober and helping; that's good enough! I really don't understand 'withdrawals', because I really don't have any expect mentally and the craving.

Charlie G - I'm the same as you basically.... not in denial, but can't stop on my own, and feel like a loser.  I too have always been shy and didn't want to interact at first, but they cater and really take and interest what you want to accomplish.  Another girl (not Molly) provided the weekly schedule and another a book for the whole state.  Everyone was nice; again no big dea, but they were focusedl!  I've only gone once so far, I'll probably shoot for twice a week.
  

[ibizan]

dark-i've encountered many who feel as u do bout the God stuff.....they let this turn them off and didn't return.....and u know what happened...so they returned.ur a computer geek so i know u can DELETE this stuff!:)))))))Charlie-many heavy liquor drinkers xperience the PAWS.if u google it u'll relate.ur NOT a loser.......ur grey matter is discombobulated from the booze.the wondrous thing bout grey matter is that it can re-generate if u stop soaking it!

[dark69meat]

The God thing is really a tough one for me because religion was crammed down my throat as a kid.  It's just hard to ignore; trying to be open mind, but still.  It was just one guy over-the-top God!!!  God almighty!!!

[Charlie's girl]

Ibizan,  Thanks for the words of encouragement.  I needed that.  I looked up PAWS and Campral.  I can relate to PAWS.  Who would I get the campral from?  Will they ask me any questions about why I want it?  I don't want them to know that I'm getting help.  I will feel branded.  Can I use another excuse why I need it besides detox?

Dark69, I'm not very religious or at all.  It would be nice if AA was neutral as far as I'm concerned.  Plus I think I'm going to be creeped out about holding some strangers hand to pray....  I have all these crazy things conjured up in my head .. I'm going alone and not telling anybody just you guys.  I need to get a few weeks sober behind me and then I might tell me husband.  It's all I think about now.  I feel like I'm going insane...  
I'm proud of you dark.  Keep up the good work.  you seem happier,right?

Charlie

Charlie

[ibizan]

yes girl u got the PAWS goin on!Campral can come from family doc.YES u need to tell them why u need it!r u epileptic as well?If ur taking other meds docs need to know.Campral is compatible with many!Do u think ur alone in asking for Campral?MANY have used it......and succeed..thats why its out there for u!NO u cannot make xcuses as 2 why u need it......ur getting honest about ur problem......so important to be honest with doctors.this is YOUR life and health here!yes u have crazy things conjurd up in ur head....its the alcohol...not the real u.Who is the REAL charlie girl?

[Charlie's girl]

Uggg....  I hate my primary care doc.  She is so annoying.  Maybe I will see a new person.  It's tough because she sees my husband and his family.  I'd rather go somewhere else anyway so maybe now is the time.  I'll keep you posted.  Today is my first day with out any alcohol.  Tomorrow is my first meeting.

Charlie

[dark69meat]

The AA thing is free, if there's one or two guys talking god, just let it go, it works for them.  I wasn't nervous; don't worry.  Just show up and grab a chair in back like I did.  They come to you and cater.  It could not have been better actually.  I told my wife I was going and explained why the first night.  She was ecstatic and delighted becuase there will be finally peace in the family.

You must be honest with hubby and doctor; commit yourself to them.  If you don't admit your powerless to everyone, it will never work.

ibizan - Is Campral the one and only one or other options you recommend?

[ibizan]

Charlie- by all means see anither doc.one ur comfortable with not so enmeshed with hubs family.yess..u go girl with the no drinking.dark-the Campral is the one i've seen with the best track record for the past 2 years...high % of consumer satisfaction and prescribed by docs i respect.

[Charlie's girl]

So far so good.  No alcohol in the house and I haven't had a drink at all today.  I'm motivated!!!!  I even started a healthy diet today.  I want to get healthy again.  I'm not a heavy person but i used to be very fit before my pregnancys.  Do most people loose weight once they stop drinking.  The caloric intake of alcohol I was drinking was a ton.  
I think I'm going to see if I need any meds before I get them.  I was drinking heavily in between my pregnancys and I was able to go CT without any withdrawl problems.  My husband knows that today was my start date.  He was thrilled!!!

Charlie

[ibizan]

many gain weight in sobriety...taste buds come back and that SWEET tooth emerges.better than staying loaded tho.many times the alcohol cravign will return shortly after stopping...or tad longer..u'll c...and u will know if u need something.don't bs urself with this dear.....ur on a good path now..wise to safeguard it!

[dark69meat]

I'm still losing weight and fast.  Charlie - the calorie intake for me was unbelievable, surprised my stomach didn't explode my gut didn't get too massive, but it was growing the last few years.  If I lose 10 -15 lbs, that should be fine and without booze, it's not problem and I'm eating less actually.

If you gain like ibizan, it's not that big of an issue, the main thing - no drinky!  Good you told your husband, didn't think you would... now that's commitment.  Good to read Charlie and nnice work!

[ibizan]

very funny u ol button pusher u!whose knoshing the carrot cake,cookies...hmmmm?took someone elses inventory......i have butterfinger crisps stored in my stash drawyer...gonna go to cardio 2 nite and kick off the calories.....eeeyyyyaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

[dark69meat]

*If you gain like ibizan said before" --- Okay I'm going to back pedal...heh  The carrot cake is all gone, plate licked.. gone!  What else is that HUGE stash?

[ibizan]

reeses mini pb cups,microwave lowfat butter popcorn-orville's,ghiardelli mint filled choc squares,vanilla creme filled choc squares,dubl-mocha creme filled squares.....and i share with people!i admit to my stash and people ask hey can i have......?wash it down with a cup of MY coffee......yum!sober buzz!

[tigrai]

im glad for you..no one can tell you when 2 stop... im sure you'll do it.  even when the little voice in your head says you cant..be strong..  An just keep thinking your never going 2 make an *** of your self again..

[dark69meat]

..."vanilla creme filled choc squares,dubl-mocha creme filled squares".. get out!

tigrai  - I never worried about making an *** out of myself, just wanted to have alittle fun, until the next day..

[ibizan]

oh no...4 real...i don't get out with em..they go in mouth and let em melt..oooohhhh what a rush!

[dark69meat]

ibizan -- Good clean living, the way it should be!

[ibizan]

it is a better life...11-22-07 will be 24 years.the first two drug but the rest have flown....the ageing (aging) process!

[dark69meat]

TOTAL congrad on 11-22-07!  the anniversary when Kennedy was shot!

[ibizan]

well its not the 22nd yet but i'm gonna make it!i was in teh 3rd grade when keenedy was shot...never 4get teh announcement over PA.....we were stunned.

[dark69meat]

A sad day indeed and remeber vividly; PA and all.  Are you actually that old?

[ibizan]

a very young 52!one year younger than u old grey haired man!i get mine religously covered every 4 weeks.

[dark69meat]

I'm glad you read that, just checking!  hee..

[Charlie's girl]

Hi Guys!  Day two sober.  I'm feeling ok.  Today I was in a great mood.  Now I'm so tired.  I looked up aa meetings online for today and decided to go to a 7pm meeting at a local church.  My husband is tied up in traffic so I won't make aa today.  I'm shooting for thurs.  
I don't really know what to do with myself right now.  I'm just taking care of the kids.  This is the hard time of night for me.  I'm bored and my patience is running thin with the kids.  They are a real handful.
I'm not giving in.  No liquor in the house.  I'm proud of myself for making day two.  
Hope you doing well.

Charlie

[ibizan]

dark-not much gets by me!charlie...good goin girl!do u like to read?got some good dvd's?when do kids go 2 bed?find something to occupy mind......warm baths,relaxing music.....c'mon brainstorm with me!

[dark69meat]

I was wondering, and good news about day 2 ; I was worried.  The kids are a handful, no doubt, but we all havel face reality and come down off the beast.  Besides, you don't want to feel gross tomorrow morning.  It's good you aren't giving in and knpw it's hard, especially the first few days....tigrai  = 16 days, dark = 15 days.  If you're bored write here, get a book, go to a meeting; occupy you mind somehow.  You'll make it, I know!  It's getting easier for me, I just don't want the depression anymore after the hang-over.  My body is more at ease, life in general isn't such a struggle and I'm not all hyped-out.

Good work Charie!

[Charlie's girl]

The boys are down.  Finally!!!  I'm doing ok.  I will most likely go to bed very early.  It doesn't help that I'm on a strict diet.  I'm trying to loose weight.  My stomach is so fat, only my stomach.  It's bloated out.  I look like I did in the early months of pregnancy.  I guess this is from the alcohol?
Is it true that alcohol turns into sugar when processed in the body?  Maybe my sugar is low.  
I just feel blaahhhh.....  Not social, not in a good mood, edgy, tense, anxious, remorseful and fat.  Yuck...  I'm hoping I'll wake tomorrow with a better attitude.  
Thanks for being here for me.

Charlie

[dark69meat]

Read this:
http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art29977.asp

Yes, lots of calories and sugar to process every time we drink.  I've actually lost weight and feel a whole lot better for that and mentally a lot happier.  My stomach was growing the last few years, I didn't like it!  Yes, go to bed early, this is a life style change!  Your blah attitude will change!

[ibizan]

what strict diet?are u starving urself?not eating right to lose weight?a bloated tummy could also mean liver damage...or pancreatic damage as well. u need to get to md asap get physical and have bloodwork done to check liver enzymes and such.this is not a good time to go on a strict diet.ur already trying to quit one thing and strictness with the food is not goodNot sayin go hogwild with it either!.u do need good nutrition and balanced meals ?u give this 2 ur boys right?u need to give this 2 urself as well.So when is docs appt?

[Charlie's girl]

Hi.  Day three feeling good.  The diet I'm not is very healthy.  It's good carbs and fresh fish, chicken, salad, oatmeal.  I've done it before and it's worked.  I have been putting it off because you can't drink on it or it's pointless.
I thought my belly was bloated because I stopped working out a couple of months ago and I do have a baby.  Plus it's fat right now.  How would you know if you have issues with liver or pancreas without blood work.  Any other symptoms.  I will make an appt just to be sure.


Charlie

[ibizan]

hey that sound like good diet!how old is youngest baby?babyfat belly is normal!only bloodwork can pick up the enzymes in liver/ pancreas problems.otherwise people get yellowed corneas-eyes and tender painful abdomen.day three-alcohol free..keep goin girl!yes make appt asap!still goin 2 AA morrow nite?

[dark69meat]

Blood work really shows about everything; I test at least 3X a years for reasons other than liver functioning.  Highly recommended.

C - Just get off the booze, the diet can be a gradual lif-long disipline.  You don't want to be overwhelmed.

[Charlie's girl]

Just got back from getting my older son from preschool.  He had a great day.  He has an OT shadow with him full time.  We are eating lunch.  Pizza for the boys and salad with chicken for me.  The diet is healthy but very strict.  It's hard.  I have a bit of a headache but still doing well.  Day three.  Yeaa......Yes, tomorrow is aa.
My baby just turned one.  The weight comes off much slower with the second baby.  I want to loose 15lbs.  That will bring me back down to a size 6.
I had blood work done in May and all was good.  
I will get it rechecked now that I'm alcohol free.  My lower belly is tender.  Not under my rib cage where the liver is.  Is this a sign?  

Charlie

[ibizan]

wow u got ur hands full..3 yr.old and 1 yr.old!re belly possible...but only bloodwork will show whats really going on.Drinking lots of water?15 lbs.is not a lot of weight...some women get real BIG...just go easy on self and keep sober.thats what really matters!if we stay as healthy as dark...we'll grow OLD and stay healthy like him!:)))))))

[dark69meat]

I - Yes, water multiple times daily.

C -  If your lower belly is tender, just wait a few days, you should be fine.  Any kind of liver problem usually doesn't have pain initially, according to what I have read.  OF course there can be and will be symptoms.  Read the articles left of this thread and get more education.  You're doing fine.  Quitting at your age never occurred to me, you're way a head of me; don't wanta go longer like myself.

[Charlie's girl]

It's 3pm.  This diet is driving me nuts.  Oh well.  When I set my mind to something I do it.  I'm trying to drink lots of water.  I'm really cold.  Maybe I'll make some hot tea.  I think the whole bread thing is giving me the chills.  I guess it could be WD too.  Plus I have a headache.  
D-it seems like you are really taking good care of yourself these days.  The gym is great.  When I didn't work out I drank more.  I haven't been for two months.  I start back with my trainer on Monday.  It keeps me on track, someone to answer to.  She says that everyone that comes in there that drinks has a big midsection and it's the last fat to go.  
I guess I'll become obsessed with health and kids.  This will keep me busy.

Charlie

[shomneg]

HI I have been sober for 4 months. I went to AA meetings. I think you should also find a new hobby or get into something else besides being only into recovery. I think this helps to take the edge off, because in meetings, you are dealing with sick people basically. There will be a person who pisses you off, someone called it judgementalism, which it is, but it is difficult for the newcomer to deal with nonthe less alot of the BS that does go on.

Also I reccomend only going to Big book meetings. For me anyway, some of the sharing is not that helpful, altho some is.

I feel that you need a lot of luck with AA, as with anything I guess.

For me, after about a month I knew that I had licked this thing. My harder problem is with MJ, this i do in a very small amount, one or 2 hits, but I have stopped MJ for 38 days now.

I do alot more reading than I used to, I try to do less TV, more exercise. TV I find feeds my resentments.

[shomneg]

about the religion thing, it stems from their belief that you can't quit and stay sober indefinetly without the help of your higher power, which is not dogmatic at all. it can be whatever you choose it to be.

The part of your world that smiles upon and bring you good times, nature, whatever. just to support the fact that our lives are unmanageable with respect to booze, that we cannot control the drinking.

For example, I thought I could have just one or 2 drinks, and I was able to until evey SUnday when I had a couple of bottles of wine, some whiskey and all the rest.

But I cannot go back and try to control the drinking, but on the other hand I agree that with the tools of AA and the help of my higher power, I can. And also, the idea is, to have  alife that is more than just not drinking, this means to unravel the issues and problems that support the uncontrolled drinking in the first place. The need for help from a higher power is obvious to me there as well.

But if you dont agree about this, you should def. go to AA anyway and get the real picture from them and see if it suits you.

[Charlie's girl]

Thanks for your post.  Congrats on sobriety.  I am trying aa tommorrow night, I'll look for the big book session.  
After your sober do you think that most people will attempt to have one or two glasses of wine on a special occasion like Thanksgiving.  Or, just one glass a week out to dinner?   For some reason I think I could do that.  Never have any in the house and only drink with hubby who is watching closely.  It's tempting.  
I'm on day three and feel good.  I've been reading a lot of posts here that say that after the first few days WD gets ugly.  Did this happen to you or anyone you know?  It's kind of scary.
I'm sure there are so many things that I could get involved with.  I was in hiding before and now I can free myself.  

Charlie

[dark69meat]

I've always worked out at the gym and ate a healthy diet all my life.  That's not my issue or point; I'm not drinking after almost 17 days and continuing on this path.  I feel great; the beer drinking was the culprit for my depression, no doubt.  I happier and not such a ******* at work and home.  The booze isn't working for me at this stage of my life.  I'm quitting while I'm ahead and not reacting to a situation.  It's taken me years to figure this whole thing out.  In fact I never about quitting.

On the other hand I'm not getting down on the folks here who have DUI's or major league health problems because of the drinking.  I'm here to support everyone.  This isn't easy for me 'mentally' and a BIG life style change.  It's just time to leave it alone.

I'm going to have to say a big NO regarding one or two glasses of wine for a special occasion.  That could be enough to get me drinking again.  Serious stuff.  There's plenty people out there that don't drink and remember that's perfectly acceptable more than ever!  Alcohol doesn't exactly have a good name for itself anymore.

Charlie -  you're doing fine for day 3, you can't give in and feel GROSS tomorrow hung-over.  Go to AA, I went tonight for the 2nd time, it helps!

[ibizan]

shomneg-AA-take what u can use and leave the rest..includes annoying folks u'll find at 12 Step...thats where the saying principles over personalities comes in!its being around folks that have same prob as us...and same goal....sobriety is key.Yes to rekindling /developing outside interests!Charlie- ur nuts!thinking u can have just ONE glass?get out ur baseball bat and clonk the BEAST upside the head!good ur gonna b-gin xercise again...that so helps with the **** resing tween our 2 ears.Dark- saying good things....can't agree with him more on his commnets!

[Charlie's girl]

Hey.  I'm on day four!!!!!  Thanks for the extra push.  I'm not giving in at all.  Tomorrow night I'm going out to dinner with my husband.   It's tempting to just get a glass of wine.  I'm not going to though.  It makes me feel like I've accomplished something being sober and I would feel guilty.  Not worth it.  Tonight I head to aa.  First time.

Charlie

[dark69meat]

Girl - I'm totally impressed!  Keep up the good work and don't want to feel gross; do you?

Your kid is so cute in profile, you need to be around for your children!  Let us know about the meeting.  Good news about the proactive you.  NO to the glass of wine.  **** that ****!

The God dude was at my meeting again last night, but I let it go.  It's a hard pill to swallow, but works for him.  Don't let that discourage you, but if you're religious or something that shouldn't be an issue.  Your friend dark.

[ibizan]

like i sed dude...take what u can use and leave the rest..leave the rest......delete that stuff u cannot use.ur using what u can and it shows!

[dark69meat]

Yes, and thanks...your friend dark.

Charlie  -  How's it??

[Charlie's girl]

Still hanging in there..  Day four looking forward to day five.  I already look more rested, no puffy eyes.  Yeah my little one is adorable.  They are my motivation.  I want to be a better mom and wife.  Off to AA.  I'll let you know how it is when I'm back.

Charlie

[dark69meat]

"Girl - I'm totally impressed! "... keep it going!  Of course your body is well rested.  It's a healthier life style and can see you already appreciate your family more.  Kids are a goodfor motivation!  Have fun!

[shomneg]

Charlie;s Girl. the thing is about controlling it, I don't beleive that I can. I know that if I have the one drink, I will progress it. Therefore, It is much easier to control it, by giving up. You win, booze.

Thinking you can have moderate booze will not work for me. I am not even going to try.

So all I know, is that it sounds to me like you were  a heavy drinker, out of control. It seems to me that you won't be able to moderate it. You can certainly try, if you want to, but my limited exp. tells me that you won't be able to, because it is a disease, an insidious disease.

At any rate, I would advise to have 30 or 90 days clean and then see how you feel about it.

I have found that it does get easier over time.

Keep coming back!

[dark69meat]

I concur 'shomneg' as I stated before.  Not many of us can handle 1 or 2 glasses of wine at dinner, because most here are volume drinkers and not satisfied until we're passed out on the floor.  Sometimes I can moderate and do, but I'm disappointed I can't have more if I'm restricted for reasons of driving etc.  I always prefer to have more and that's a problem' I seem to get lost once I start.

Yes, just give up and quit chasing it.  It's nice I don't have to buy the **** anymore too!

[ibizan]

if ya hafta go to gre8t lengths to prove 2 urself u can/will control...then ur outta control!i had to retire from the game.....was a miserable failure at social/controlled drinking and recreational drug use!!!!

[dark69meat]

ibizan  -  There's just no way I can realistically be a social drinker NOW; the thing is I've always been anti-social once I start.  Not always, but a good portion of the time... retired is the only thing to do.

Charlie - You still with us girl?

[Charlie's girl]

Sorry I didn't get back to you guys last night.  Grey's anatomy was on and I love that show.  I was watching with hubby.  I did go to aa.  It was good.  Coffee, nice people, stories, twelve step review.  I sat in the back.  I felt very weird at first but just tried to keep to myself.  I met some nice people and I think I will return.  Oh, one man was very religious but that's his thing.
You are all right about trying to have just one glass.  I was a heavy drinker and I'm not even going to try.  I'm on day five and I'm so proud of myself.  I feel better, my belly is going down, waking up in a good mood with more energy.  I haven't had any physical WD.  Maybe the first few days a little weak and bored but now I feel just fine.  Plus headaches.  This may be from giving up bread though.
I didn't tell my husband that I went to AA until I got back.  He was very impressed.  I don't think he realized how serious I was until I told him.  Alcohol runs in both sides of my family and I don't want to be like that.  Dark, you are right it's not cool to drink.  I will be proud to say I don't drink.  It's not necessary.  I feel just fine without it.  It had gotten to the point where it wasn't even doing anything for me anymore.  I would drink so much and not even feel the buzz, not at all.  SO, what's the point, right?
I'm going out to dinner tonight so this will be a challenge.  I'm determined.  I'm not even going to have one glass of red wine.  I know myself and I will feel guilty.  Staying sober is doing wonders for my self esteem and my health.  I already feel less depressed and more social.  My older son is at preschool right now and my baby is napping.  In the past I would be drinking by now.  Instead I'm going to the mall to get my son walking shoes.  Life is getting better.  
ibizan.  I thank you so much for pushing me to just do it.  The scare tactic works.  This forum is a huge support for me.  It's wonderful that we all have internet now so we can turn to someone at anytime.  
Keep me posted Dark, my friend.

Charlie

[dark69meat]

Good work and thanks for checking in!

I've heard good things about Grey's anatomy; have not watched; probably too late.  Yeah, the people at AA are nice, the stories OK, but I have to say they have fun and focused on the business at hand - to stay sober.  And whatever it takes!  Charlie, I'm proud of you!  

We're all heavy hardcore booze hounds that can't handle moderation or the meaning of, lets face it.  I'm very proud of you; for a while I didn't think you actually we're going to commit yourself.  Yep, no headaches and refreshed in the morning; the belly will get smaller - your brain will start coming out of a fog.  Me day 18 and no way turning back!

I'm sure your husband was very impressed with 'the new you; let's face it…. it's the right thing to do in our cases.  Your relationships will improve with family and friends.  "Proud to say you don't drink"… those are indeed powerful impressive words!

Yes, wonders fot improving self-esteem and health, no doubt!   In my case the depression is gone, which is incredible.  I'd be hung-over the first day, them depressed for 3 days after. And all for a few hours of buzz??

Good - keep it busy, go to the mall and stay on the right path with me!  Yes, the internet is a great tool for communication.  Have a good day Charlie grl!

Your friend, dark

[ibizan]

good goin girl..proud of u.....those weren't scare tactics i was using...just plain old reality of what this disease is like....been there hon.....was quite the liquor drinker like u!keep it goin....we're all b-hind u!

[Charlie's girl]

Hi.  I had dinner with my hubby tonight.  It was wonderful.  I have to admit that I did have one glass of red wine and sipped on it slowly throughout the meal.  It was perfect.  I still have no desire to get up tomorrow and get alcohol at all.  If I can do this only when I go out to dinner or on special holidays, I will be just fine.  I'm home, I'm not wanting more.  I'm content.  
My husband and I talked about it and he agrees that one glass is fine only when we are out to dinner.  Once a week.  This sounds normal to me.  I'm the type of person that if I know I need to change then I just do it.  We don't go to clubs or bars.  We just dine out once a week.  
I'm sorry if you are disappointed in me but I'm not the type of person to lie about things.  I would feel terrible posting here and saying that I didn't have one glass.  
I was never a drinker at all until I had my first child.  Then it was a crutch, I was lonely.  I left my job to stay at home with my children and alcohol was my new best friend.  I'm not scared of loosing this friend.  I'm over the drink, but one glass is enjoyable.  I didn't get buzzed, just enjoyed the flavor.  I love to taste different types and learn about where they came from.  
You have helped me come out of a deep depression.  In the past year we learned that my oldest was on the autism spectrum and I wanted to numb myself from the pain.  Now I am seeing clearly and I am done feeling sorry for myself.  
I hope that you respect my honestly and don't hold this against me.  Tomorrow is a new day and my next date out is next Sat. night.  I will be sober in between.  
I need your support for that.  I will be looking forward to hearing from you.

Charlie

[ibizan]

oh girl ur playing with fire!Sigh!i c many try to do what ur doing with the JUST ONE.........but it will set the BEAST on fire!well i am concerned about ur research project......but alcoholics just can't have just one!Guess u hafta find out for uself!I do respect honesty...and u know we r here 4 u!

[Charlie's girl]

Hi Guys.  Day six and day one all at once.  I guess today starts a new day.  I never thought it would be this hard to completly obstain.  I was not capable of doing it and it was only day five.  At least I only had one glass of wine.  Maybe by next Sat. night, my next dinner date, I will have more will power.
I am trying hard I want you to know that.  We are home for the rest of the weekend so it should make it easier for me.  
Keep me posted

[dark69meat]

Charlie - I love you candor and honesty and would feel guilty lying on the forum.. Me too!
I have to agree with 'ibizan' on this one; you're playing with fire knowing of your past.  And if I had one glass, then it would be 2,3 and so on; not always, but the potential is there.  Then I would lose all interest in the meal itself and get drunk perhaps.  To me, alcohol and food never made any sense.  I like one other the other.  We are alcoholics and total abstinence is probably the answer.  Don't worry about what you said, I rather have folks here honest and wouldn't look at it as failing.  You doing fine and AWARE of the situation; that's the main thing. -dark

[ibizan]

one glass of wine for me ended up in getting the magnum!this is what alcoholism is like to me and the many lessons we hafta learn in life.At end of Wizard of Oz dorothy sez snottily to good witch Glenda "u knew i knew how 2 get back 2 kansas whole time-why didn't u tell me?Glenda laffs and replies"Cuz u never woulda b-lieved me..u had 2 find out 4 urself"Bingo charlie...and bingo glenda....this is how we learn the hard lessons we hafta in life..i do think!

[dark69meat]

Wizard of Oz and that Dorothy (Judy garland) was the biggest boozer in real life; off topic or kind of...  later in life alcohol and medication abuse caught up with her apparently. She forgot the lyrics to songs with slurred her speech while performing.  Found dead at 47, in bathroom, "ten 1.5-grain Seconal capsules".  sad story..  

[ibizan]

oh yes tragic life and death by drowning in alcohol for Judy...good movie A Star is Born done by her with alleged story of actress just like her who dies of alcoholism...she was playing herself!Awesome flick done what year dark?help me here...Lee Remick and Jack Lemmon bout 2 married alcoholics...Days of Wine and Roses...landmark flick real progressive for its time....1958?

[Charlie's girl]

Just checkin in guys.  How is everyone?  I'm still doing great.  I've been out all day with the boys.  If you think of the name of that movie will rent it.  I could use a time killer.  Oh, you were right about the sweet cravings.  I went out last night at 9pm to get a sundae and I never eat sweets.  So much for my strict diet.  I've been good today though.  No sweets, all salad.  That ice cream with hot fudge was really really yummy....

Charlie

[dark69meat]

What's going on?  Still on the clean bandwagon; more AA meetings -- committed staying sober or?

[Charlie's girl]

Still doing well.  Staying sober and feeling pretty good.  I do feel anxious more now though.  I'm guessing this is WD symptoms.  That feeling of being on edge.  Kind of in a bad mood.  I'm hoping this will pass soon.  It's driving me nuts.  The cravings are unreal too...  
How are you?  

Charlie

[ibizan]

when is that doctors appt u made??????Campral?the capital C is for cravings!

[dark69meat]

I thought C stands for Comprehend, Charlie Cravings?

[ibizan]

right on dark,right on!!!!!

[Charlie's girl]

I hear you!!  I really don't want to go on any meds right now.  I'm just going to tough it out.  It's been rough but I'm doing great.  

Charlie

[ibizan]

sweets ur such a oxymoron girl....ur doin great but its rough?tough it out?ur fooling no one but urself and so unecessary 2 put urself thru all this...but its ur choice!SIGH!

[Charlie's girl]

I thank you for your support but I do wish you would be more emotionally supportive.  
Dark, hope you still hanging in there.  I know how hard it is and I've been thinking about you.  You are inspiring me.. Keep up the good work.

Charlie

[ibizan]

i have been very supportive to you girl,u know that...alcoholics don't get better by coddling them....and i don't feel guilty with what i say to u!No one coddled me..like my dad once said u have to do something or get off the commode!U don't like what i'm saying 2 u cuz its making u think!well thats the WHOLE point of this!if u keep doing what ur doing u'll get what u get!theres a saying in AA....a simple program for people who complicate it!