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Please help 12 year old with Hashimotos/Hypothyroidism
I am desperately trying to help my 12 year old son. He was diagnosed with Hashimoto's/Hypothyroidism when he was 10 years old. The past two years have been a nightmare. He has been to 3 doctors. Levothyroxine has been increased 5 times. He is currently taking 100. His hypo symptoms are still present. It breaks my heart to see what this is doing to him. He has trouble focusing and concentrating on school work. He will forget the oral instructions for an assignment. He will take a U before he will ask for repeated instructions. The slow thought process is also noticeable when he plays sports. I honesty think he is worse then when he first got diagnosed. We see an improvement when they increase his medication. He wakes up refreshed. Little things like making sure his shirt is tucked in before he leaves for school. He will get a burst of energy and you can tell he even walks faster. Then he returns to having a hard time waking up in the morning. Seems like a struggle to even half way tuck in his shirt. He will get in trouble at school if it isn't tucked in all the way. Teachers will tell me he is lazy and doesn't care, but then they see a difference when his medicine is increased. His TSH is normal, but I have read not to go by this. I demanded FREE T3 & FREE T4. The doctor didn't want to do this, but I insisted! They both came back on the very bottom of LOW/NORMAL. I think this could be the problem, but what do they need to do? His lipid studies are so bad. See results and please give advise.
TSH 1.58 0.34-4.82 uiu/ml
Free T4 0.60 0.59-1.17 ng/dl
Free T3 4.4 4.3-8.3 pg/ml
Triglycerides 285 30-150
HDL cholesterol 29 40-60
TSH 1.58 0.34-4.82 uiu/ml
Free T4 0.60 0.59-1.17 ng/dl
Free T3 4.4 4.3-8.3 pg/ml
Triglycerides 285 30-150
HDL cholesterol 29 40-60
Saw the new doctor last week and results came in today. They are changing him to Armour 90. They are still waiting on the ultrasound. The new doctor is changing his medicine to Armour 90.
TSH 0.370 0.300-5.000
Free T3 3.7 2.5-3.9
Free T4 6.5 4.0-12.0
RT3 34 H 11-32
TG ABS <20 <20 1st time to be tested
TPO 12 <35 down from when he was first dx Hashi/Hypo (TPO 36 0-6 TSH was 38)
Ferritin 29.4 He said this needs to come up. Will start iron pill
Vit D 25.4 32-100 Will start extra Vit D
BIG improvement in the Free's since his last doctor added the Cytomel last month. The new doctor likes Armour better. I do wonder about the RT3.
TSH 0.370 0.300-5.000
Free T3 3.7 2.5-3.9
Free T4 6.5 4.0-12.0
RT3 34 H 11-32
TG ABS <20 <20 1st time to be tested
TPO 12 <35 down from when he was first dx Hashi/Hypo (TPO 36 0-6 TSH was 38)
Ferritin 29.4 He said this needs to come up. Will start iron pill
Vit D 25.4 32-100 Will start extra Vit D
BIG improvement in the Free's since his last doctor added the Cytomel last month. The new doctor likes Armour better. I do wonder about the RT3.
1 Comments
His RT3 is indeed very high, indicative of iron storage deficiency and perhaps an adrenal issue, if his FT3/RT3 does not improve enough with the iron pills.
Note: It would take some time to correct this deficiency and it is notoriously difficult for most patients to tolerate well the iron pills.
An alternative method would be iron injections.
" Iron injections are significantly more effective (both in time and degree of increase) in improving ferritin levels over 30 d than oral tablets."
Ref, PMID: 16779924
Conversion is definitely an issue and I think as much as I favor Armour being a natural thyroid hormone,
Cytomel would be a preferred choice
even if it is synthetic, in this case.
Taking Armour, while the underlying issue (low iron or adrenal imbalances) is still not corrected,
allows for the majority of the T4 content of Armour to be converted to RT3, thus still lowering f the FT3
RT3 can only come from T4, while Cytomel is only T3.
Please discuss this with the new Endo. My opinion is to gradually increase the Armour, while reducing the Cytomel, only as the underlying issue is being corrected.
Also look into Biohealth Labs in the US for a Functional Adrenal Stress Profile, a saliva test.
BTW it was incorrectly stated earlier that T3 converts to T4. It's the other way around!
Grains/carbs/gluten intolerance
Look into Gliadin test (urine), by Cyrex labs. They test 12 forms-not just the alpha ordered by most doctors- of gliadins regarding gluten intolerance (not necessarily digestive).
Now they can also test which part of the body is affected.
Most hypothyroid/hashimoto's sufferers have gluten intolerance and don't even know it!
The gluten molecules-mainly from gmo grains- resemble the TPO(Thyroid Peroxidase - an enzyme necessary for the signalling Thyroid hormone production) molecules and thus the immune system in its response against gluten, attacks the TPO in the Thyroid also!
Addressing his thyroid issues properly, lowering his wheat/gluten
and carb intake (avoid all sugar including artificial as much as possible) and supplementing with
quality omega-3 should also help his cholesterol profile.
Best wishes,
Niko
Note: It would take some time to correct this deficiency and it is notoriously difficult for most patients to tolerate well the iron pills.
An alternative method would be iron injections.
" Iron injections are significantly more effective (both in time and degree of increase) in improving ferritin levels over 30 d than oral tablets."
Ref, PMID: 16779924
Conversion is definitely an issue and I think as much as I favor Armour being a natural thyroid hormone,
Cytomel would be a preferred choice
even if it is synthetic, in this case.
Taking Armour, while the underlying issue (low iron or adrenal imbalances) is still not corrected,
allows for the majority of the T4 content of Armour to be converted to RT3, thus still lowering f the FT3
RT3 can only come from T4, while Cytomel is only T3.
Please discuss this with the new Endo. My opinion is to gradually increase the Armour, while reducing the Cytomel, only as the underlying issue is being corrected.
Also look into Biohealth Labs in the US for a Functional Adrenal Stress Profile, a saliva test.
BTW it was incorrectly stated earlier that T3 converts to T4. It's the other way around!
Grains/carbs/gluten intolerance
Look into Gliadin test (urine), by Cyrex labs. They test 12 forms-not just the alpha ordered by most doctors- of gliadins regarding gluten intolerance (not necessarily digestive).
Now they can also test which part of the body is affected.
Most hypothyroid/hashimoto's sufferers have gluten intolerance and don't even know it!
The gluten molecules-mainly from gmo grains- resemble the TPO(Thyroid Peroxidase - an enzyme necessary for the signalling Thyroid hormone production) molecules and thus the immune system in its response against gluten, attacks the TPO in the Thyroid also!
Addressing his thyroid issues properly, lowering his wheat/gluten
and carb intake (avoid all sugar including artificial as much as possible) and supplementing with
quality omega-3 should also help his cholesterol profile.
Best wishes,
Niko
Hi .
The T3, and T4 given together will increase his thyroid levels, well they should , but this may take a few weeks before you see a difference.
I have never taken T3, and here in the UK we are never really offered it, we just get given thyroxine, and thats it.
I have heard some good results about it though, and the people who need it should be offered it and not denied it.
I know you should take thyroid treatment first thing in the morning, with water on a empty stomach, at least half an hour before food.
I have heard of people splitting there doses though of T3, but with never taking T3 i cant comment.
I would definately post this in the thyroid forum, as there are some real thyroid specialists on there, which use T3 on a daily basis, and know more about the hormone than me.
I hope it works for your little boy.
I have had my adrenals checked on a 24 hour adrenal saliva test, which showed i had adrenal fatigue, and thyroid and adrenals have a close connection.
If the adrenals are tired, or fatigued, this can cause sluggishness problems too.
Im glad to speak to a mum, who is looking at the whole picture, thyroid , adrenals, vitaminD.
Please keep me posted.
Nicola
The T3, and T4 given together will increase his thyroid levels, well they should , but this may take a few weeks before you see a difference.
I have never taken T3, and here in the UK we are never really offered it, we just get given thyroxine, and thats it.
I have heard some good results about it though, and the people who need it should be offered it and not denied it.
I know you should take thyroid treatment first thing in the morning, with water on a empty stomach, at least half an hour before food.
I have heard of people splitting there doses though of T3, but with never taking T3 i cant comment.
I would definately post this in the thyroid forum, as there are some real thyroid specialists on there, which use T3 on a daily basis, and know more about the hormone than me.
I hope it works for your little boy.
I have had my adrenals checked on a 24 hour adrenal saliva test, which showed i had adrenal fatigue, and thyroid and adrenals have a close connection.
If the adrenals are tired, or fatigued, this can cause sluggishness problems too.
Im glad to speak to a mum, who is looking at the whole picture, thyroid , adrenals, vitaminD.
Please keep me posted.
Nicola
So free t3 will convert to free t4? I am new to all of this. I just know both are at rock bottom of low normal. I plan to get adrenal, vit d and some more things checked out. I want him to get better. He really had a hard time in school with oral instructions, not rememering what I helped him study for when he had a test, but them some days his teacher would let him retake the test in the morning. We would study again and he would make an A. Do you think he had more hormone in the morning? Seems his worst class of the year was his last hour class. The teacher told me he just didn't care. The times he would ask a question because he didn't understand or forgot what she said she would tell him he wasn't listening. He could just be tired. She was the first to say she could tell he was a dif child when he had the dosage increase, but this doesn't last. The doctor wants him to take the t3 once a day, but I thought this had to be taken more than once a day.
I hate the endos who just go of the TSH, how silly off them , when this is the pituarity gland hormone, most endos are actually diabetes specialists, and think by taking a pill you will be alright.
I wish i could just give them a dose of thyroid problems for just a week and they would soon change there tune.
At least you have an endo who is prepared to give T3, that is a great bonus.
You need the T3 to convert to T4, so he will be feeling better all round. His symptoms of the sluggishness, and brainfog, will lift, and he should be much more his self, fingers crossed i hope for you and your son.
You can get 24hr adrenal saliva tests, done privately they are about 70 dollars, and will tell you if his adrenals are fatigued, or struggling a bit. Which can cause chronic fatigue, with a host off other problems.
I have had the adrenal saliva test done, and i found it very useful.
Also have you had his Vitamin D checked too?
This can be low in thyroid patients , and can cause great tiredness. maybe have this checked too.
Hope all goes good for you and your boy, its sad to see youngsters so poorly, im wishing him well, and hope the T3 goes good for him,
Please let me know,
Nicola
I wish i could just give them a dose of thyroid problems for just a week and they would soon change there tune.
At least you have an endo who is prepared to give T3, that is a great bonus.
You need the T3 to convert to T4, so he will be feeling better all round. His symptoms of the sluggishness, and brainfog, will lift, and he should be much more his self, fingers crossed i hope for you and your son.
You can get 24hr adrenal saliva tests, done privately they are about 70 dollars, and will tell you if his adrenals are fatigued, or struggling a bit. Which can cause chronic fatigue, with a host off other problems.
I have had the adrenal saliva test done, and i found it very useful.
Also have you had his Vitamin D checked too?
This can be low in thyroid patients , and can cause great tiredness. maybe have this checked too.
Hope all goes good for you and your boy, its sad to see youngsters so poorly, im wishing him well, and hope the T3 goes good for him,
Please let me know,
Nicola
If you want something to try get the book "Prescription for Nutritional Healing" by by Phyllis A. Balch , CNC. I bought mine at GNC but think you can get it on line if you are interested. It will give you a list of the supplements you can take to help with this problem. It will also tell you the foods you son should be eating. Hippocrates the father of westen medicine said long ago "let your food be your medicine and you medicine be your food".
They have never talked about checking his adrenals. I am going to have this done. I had to demand the Free T4 & Free T3 test. He has been having some night sweats. Not sure if this is from the thyroid. He had strep a few months ago and this cause eye tics. We are dealing with that also. Will his Free T4 come up with the Free T3 adding the T3 med?
Hi.
I have graves disease, which is hyperthyroidism. In the last 12 years, my thyroid as been up and down, I have also had to have two thyroid surgeries, now i am only left with a little piece.
Im glad the endo is giving T3. Starting of with a small dose and increasing gradually would be best. T3 is very powerful.
Yes i have adrenal problems too. I have a very low DHEA, plus i have had an high cortisol reading too.
The adrenals cause fatigue in a big way and it can be really debilitating.
How are they going to test his adrenals , is it with bloodtests, and a stim test.
The thyroid and adrenals are connected, and both work together.
Hope this helps, if you need anymore help just give us a nudge, i am in the UK, but im very pleased that your sons endo is going to give some T3, his T3 levels were very low of being normal.
He will feel a big difference with the T3. I hope you see the difference in him too.
Fingers crossed.
Best wishes to you both
Nicola
I have graves disease, which is hyperthyroidism. In the last 12 years, my thyroid as been up and down, I have also had to have two thyroid surgeries, now i am only left with a little piece.
Im glad the endo is giving T3. Starting of with a small dose and increasing gradually would be best. T3 is very powerful.
Yes i have adrenal problems too. I have a very low DHEA, plus i have had an high cortisol reading too.
The adrenals cause fatigue in a big way and it can be really debilitating.
How are they going to test his adrenals , is it with bloodtests, and a stim test.
The thyroid and adrenals are connected, and both work together.
Hope this helps, if you need anymore help just give us a nudge, i am in the UK, but im very pleased that your sons endo is going to give some T3, his T3 levels were very low of being normal.
He will feel a big difference with the T3. I hope you see the difference in him too.
Fingers crossed.
Best wishes to you both
Nicola
I am in the USA. The doctor called today and wants to add a t3. I asked about increasing his t4 medicine and he said not at this time. I think I need to also have a adrenaline test. Have you been able to control your thyroid in the last 12 years? Have you had adrenaline problems?
Hi.
Well being a thyroid sufferer, for over 12 years myself, no wonder your little boy is suffering the way he his,
His FreeT3 and his FreeT4 are very low end, it looks to me like your little boy needs a meds increase and he also may need some T3 also.
He may have a conversion problem, but he definately needs an increase and some additional T3.
It looks like you have found an endo like i have, who only looks at the TSH results, and thinks he can work wonders, well these endos dont know what they are talking about, and leave the sufferers still suffering, like your little boy his.
Are you in the UK?
Being on the lower end of both the free T3 and T4 will leave your little boy tired and sluggish, and also forgetful along with other symptoms.
Find yourself an Endo who treats the Frees and not just goes off the TSH.
Please keep me posted
Nicola
Well being a thyroid sufferer, for over 12 years myself, no wonder your little boy is suffering the way he his,
His FreeT3 and his FreeT4 are very low end, it looks to me like your little boy needs a meds increase and he also may need some T3 also.
He may have a conversion problem, but he definately needs an increase and some additional T3.
It looks like you have found an endo like i have, who only looks at the TSH results, and thinks he can work wonders, well these endos dont know what they are talking about, and leave the sufferers still suffering, like your little boy his.
Are you in the UK?
Being on the lower end of both the free T3 and T4 will leave your little boy tired and sluggish, and also forgetful along with other symptoms.
Find yourself an Endo who treats the Frees and not just goes off the TSH.
Please keep me posted
Nicola
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