mid back /abdominal pain

[wombmate]

I have been having back/stomach pain that starts very early morning, I have read others on this website who have had the same thing, it only comes after laying down for a few hours, it wakes me every morning before I've had a full nights sleep. I have had an endoscopy,MRI, several blood tests, had my liver, spleen and kidneys checked, been on GI meds, and have been told I have IBS, I understand that I do have IBS but I do not feel this back pain that radiates to the front has anything to do with IBS. It hurts when I take a deep breath and it hurts more when I lay on my right side. I have been to 4 different drs, mostly gastroenterologist but none of them seem to hear me say that I feel it is in my back, so I've not seen a dr specifically for back or arthritis type pain. I do also have fibromyalgia so when this pain began, I was afraid I was having a flare up. I have bought a new mattress because I thought maybe that was the problem but it did not help. Years ago I had x-rays on my back and was told I had arthritis. Could it be some form of rthritis? I am also wondering if anyone else has found the answer to their very similar pain.
I am 47 years old but most mornings I feel like I am 95, the pain does go away once I am up. Can anyone Please help.

[Dharsha]

I don't have anything you have, but I have had similar back pain, I found out I was sleeping wrong, and upsetting my core muscles. It's just a suggestion, try and see if you wake up in the same position you fall asleep?

[wombmate]

I usually do fall asleep on my left side, often wake up on my left side but when I turn to lay on my right side, the pain seems worse so I lay on my back for a little while. I usually can't get back to sleep after that because the pain is to bad. I have a new mattress because I thought that was the problem when this all started 2 years ago. The new mattress has not helped. Thanks for your suggestion though.

[veelen]

Wombate I have been experiencing something very similar to what you describe, for about 6 months no and the pain seems to get progressively worse.
My pain also wakes me up in the early morning (around 4am) but is based in my left side. It is basically impossible to sleep on my left side but sleeping on my right side it  is a lot less painful. I feel the pain only in my left side and it increases when breathing in (even during normal breathing but the pain disappears when I get up. I have had similar test i.e. blood test CT scans, abdominal sonar tests,  colonoscopy, gastroscopy and although I was diagnosed with  diagnose IBS two years ago they cannot find anything else abnormal. My next step is a MR spinal scan.
I will let you know if I find a explantion for this strange condition and will appreciate if you can do the same.

[wombmate]

I had a thought the other day after talking with a friend/classmate. Have you ever heard of saliva testing? They test I think 5 different hormones, one of them is your cortisol level, this has something to do with your adrenal glands, if you have to much cortisol, you may have adrenal fatigue, our adrenals are right above our kidneys. I am going to the dr tomorrow to get a kit to have my saliva tested, I send it in and they call me with the results. I am very hopeful about this since I am so exhausted and have had an increase in belly fat which is another symptom of to much cortisol. I'll let you know when I get the results back. I have a glimmer of hope, I just don't want to get to excited about it and set myself up for disappointment again. But it is so very frustrating....

[Squirmshanks]

I too experience exactly what you describe, and have for several years.
Every morning at around 4am I am woken by hideous pain that seems to radiate from my lower back (kidney area) through to my whole abdomen stopping at the base of my rib cage. I find the only relief to be curling up in a foetal position or holding a pillow tightly against my stomach. Its the same story every morning until I get up when the pain subsides within about an hour, often after opening my bowels.
I am a coeliac and my Doctor has told me that "You have to expect some discomfort  at times"! He also says I may have IBS.
Have you had a coeliac screening? I am inclined to think this pain is in fact a bowel condition rather than a back problem, as certainly in my case, the worse the pain in the morning is seems to be related to a need to use the toilet about an hour after rising.
Strange you mention an increase in belly fat, as over the last years I too have this, though am slim otherwise.

[weezo]

I have been experiencing low, right side abdominal pain which radiates to the back, since March, 2007. It is not always present. Comes on strong after falling asleep and waking up on my right side. I have had a CT, Ultrasound and am going back to my gastro specialist August 6. The interesting thing about my pain is that it comes and goes and about the same time I started with the abdominal pain, I started having soreness in my right foot. The foot discomfort is on the outer edge of my foot and sometimes when I've been sleeping on my right side, I wake up with pain in my right side and pain of my right foot. Sounds crazy but it is true. Good luck in finding out what your problem is.
Weezo

[wombmate]

I am still awaiting the results of my saliva test. That is my last and final hope for finding out what my pain could be. I have noticed the last few days, being under some added stress, seems to make me feel worse. If there isn't much stress at the time, or if I'm on vacation, I tend to feel much better, almost completely pain free. I'll keep you posted about the results. I hope that is the answer to my mystery.
Wombmate

[seymour84]

Have you received your saliva test yet? I have the same problem you do. I wake up at 4 every morning with stomach pains. They go away as soon as a wake.

[mike1105]

i think dharshas is right on. this sounds muscular and is probably related to sleeing. your core muscles wrap around from the back to the front in the absomeen. if they are weak, you'll have pain somewhere as other muscles try to compensate. look at the skeleton. the upper body has ribs, the lower body has the pelvis. inbetween is where you have pain (in the core) and what bony structures are there for support?? None. just the musculature. I'd suggest you work on your core, thoroughly check your posture and the tilt of your pelvis......do you really think this has anything to do with saliva?? come on now. see a good PT and fix yourself. loose weight if you are overweight. stop slouching. build up that core and the mid back muscles.

[hellzbellz]

OMG! After 6 months of increasing lower right abdominal pain which wakes me up earlier and earlier each morning and only goes away after I have been up and been to the loo, I do this search and find you all talking about what I am experiencing!
I've had catscan, MRI, Ultrasounds (both internal and external), colonoscopy, blood tests  etc etc etc and NOTHING has shown up!
I have been unable to sleep on my left side for nearly 2 years and thought that it was a back/muscle/nerve pinch thing, but for the past month have slept on my left side and there is no difference.
I have tried removing food groups from my diet for weeks at a time to see if it is a food allergy thing - no good.
I'm ditching coffee for the next month to see if that works.
I have - wait for it - IBS, Fibromyalgia, Clinical Depression.
Sound familiar?
And mike1105 - I do weight lifting & toning regularly to maintain muscle strength & condition and walk 30-45 mins every other day (except when the fibro flares!)
I'm 46 years old and I feel like my grandfather did at 95 when he kept begging me to put him out of his misery.
The thought of living like this for another 50 years is almost unbearable.
The doctor has decided to put me in hospital for exploratory surgery if nothing changes. (I have 3 months to go - public health waiting list).
I am so glad to find you and know that I am not alone, that I am not imagining this pain. Lets see if between us we can find out what it is...

[seymour84]

My Dr. said it is acid reflux.  He gave me a choice of meds or change my eating habits.  I chose to change my eating habits. Especially at night. He also recommended probiotics, cleansing my digestive system.  And cutting back on carbs.  I noticed that when I eat carbs especially at dinner time that I wake up at 4am with stomach pains. What has worked for me is eating smaller portions through out the day. Cutting back on carbs, not eating too much late at night. I have my last meal between 5 and 6pm.  Usually it's a salad (chicken, beef, tuna, salmon). Lots of veggies.   I drink lots of water for the rest of the evening. Before I go to bed I enjoy a glass of  red wine and strawberries as my treat. sugerfee popsicles and or healty choice chocolate bar.  I just started experimenting and this works for me.  And yes, I too work out MWF and walk for an hour uphills T and TH.  This pain does not muscular.

[helier]

I have had the exact same pain that you have described for about 2 years now! I can only sleep on my left side as the right is too uncomfortable. Early in the morning I am awoken by what begins as a dull yet strong pain in my lower abdomen and back, which grows with my consciousness. It grows into a painful abdominal cramp in my front, but the pain still stays dull in my back. In my front it hurts if I stretch or breath in deep, instead I have to curl up.
I always want to try to keep sleeping through it, but the pain just gets worse the longer I stay in bed! not fair cos I love my lie-ins!! I often get up after having turned onto my front for a while, but by then I am in agony. I am not sure what the cause is but I do have IBS and I have suffered from stress and depression. I also have dairy intolerance (not lactose-intolerant but similar). I believe I may be intolerant of wheat as well (I have cut wheat out of my diet a few times and always felt better for it) but not sure if these have anything to do with it.
I find that after I get up the pain subsides within about an hour, especially after going to the loo. I find that a cup of tea helps too, it is a really good diuretic. (A cigarette used to do it as well, but I have given up smoking now and by all means am not advising anyone to start!)
I have also found that coupled with this condition, periods and hangovers are completely unbearable!!!
I am going to keep watch of what I eat for a while and see if it helps. Please let us know how your saliva test went!

[candigirl]

Hi I am having the same problem.  My back and sides are hurting so bad and the pain medicine is not even touching it. If I am not better by tomorrow I am going to the emergency room.  I usually just wait the pain out and it goes away so I figure it is just fibro. But this time it has been two weeks.  I have IBS too but it has gotten worse.  Everything I eat goes staright thru me.  I have lost  20 lbs and I don''t need to lose anymore. I have no idea what the answer is and I just give up.  My body stays so out of wack from head to toe that there is no one this will not do damage to our bodies.  I don't have anything that works right.  Good luck with yours and I hope it gets better.
Candigirl

[drmad]

Hello,
I am a Veterinarian, so I have some medical insite.
Waking up this morning I found myself in an all too familiar situation; my abdomen and mid-back were in enough pain to rise me from my sleep around 4am. I got up to urinate, which seems to relieve the problem, at least temporarily.  This is the 4th night in a row with these problems and it's really interferring with my sleep.  I have had repeated bouts of these episodes for nearly 10 years.  I too have been diagnosed with IBD and Spondylosis in my back, however the most unique finding was about 7 years ago when I came up positive for a unique auto-immune condition known as HLA-B27 (Human Leukocyte Antigen B27 Complex).  This auto-immune disorder is related to numerous conditions including IBD, spondylosis, Crohns', Uveitis and even Lymphoma.  Like most auto-immune conditions, it can come-and-go.  Although speculative, there is lots of anecdotal evidence to suggest that stress may play a role in the rhythms of clinical symptoms.  Now, I'm not saying that everyone here has HLA-B27 complex, nor am I insinuating that this condition is responsible for all of our symptoms.  But, it is very interesting that everyone here suffers from similar problems, and this may be another avenue for investigation.  Testing for HLA-B27 is performed by a simple blood test; ask your Doctor.
Let's keep in touch.
DRMAD

[Gold32]

I have wondered for so long about why i wake early every morning with this awful dull lower back pain, as though my kidneys ache and weight a tonne!  Today i decided to have a really good look into my symptoms and if my kidneys were going to expode.  I cant believe there are actually people out there with the exact same symtoms as me. I have been to many doctors whom have brushed it off, changed the subject or just dont hear what i'm saying! For the past 4 year every single day I have pain in my lower back (kidney area) that wakes me early in the morning and usually i need to go to the toilet which releives the pain for a while.  When i go back to bed and fall asleep i will wake again with pain which will only finally go away after i have been up for about 1/2hr. I never get it at any other time only when i have been lying down for a number of hours (sleeping). I have tried exersice, weights and stretching and it works to relieve the pain at the time but not prevent it. I too find myself curling into faetal position to stretch out the pain, it always retruns after a few minutes.
So far i ahvent had any tests and from reading what you all have to say i tink i should save my money as no one seems to have returned any results that may look like they help.  I might trying changing my diet and times i eat and see what happens. I will continue to check in to see if anyone has found a solution to our delema!  Hang in there.........we will figure this out soon.  There is probably a very simple solution!  

[Lmnardo]

Did anyone get any relief any way?  I've been dealing with this problem for 1 1/2 years and it seems to be getting worse everyday.  My doctor says its because I'm overweight and he won't go any further from there.  My pain is in the morning while sleeping in the lower ab and lower to halfway up my back.  It seems to ease up a bit when I get upright and moving but it does not fully go away.  I'm 5'3"  170lbs.  I've been at this weight for 3 years so I don't think that its my weight alone.

L

[choosytuesday]

I am just glad to know I am not alone...I have been dealing with this, now, I call a "problem"
(coz @ first, I felt a 'lil pain, I can still bear and i ignore it...but annoying) My pain is in lower back
that somehow I feel the pain has something to do with the pain in my abdominal area connected through the muscles above my knees like having a menstrual cramps but not exactly as that painful.
And they are not happening @ the same time just like you, lower back pain wakes me up early in the morning and it is gone after  half/hr. I get up. My abdominal pain happens I think several hrs. after a meal but not each meal. I told my doctor but I just got an answer that is not satisfying. When
you mentioned about the saliva testing..Excuse me first, to Mike 1105, You did not get the point of what Wombmate is saying, the cortisol level when its too much it can cause adrenal fatigue and our  adrenal glands is above the kidneys, cortisol levels can also cause belly fat...which I believe the culprit and maybe the reason why I am having this lower back/abdominal pain problem now 'coz I admit since I became lazy for one year I gain the belly fat ...Early morning I got up with lower back pain and I go to the bathroom to pee, if I drink a  glass of water, the less pain I get. So, there is somehow a connection with the cortisol/adrenal hormone as our organs response to what we do in our body. It is indeed healthy habits/exercise is the answer to our problem (aside from chiropractors, expensive prescribed pain killers & surgery) With that saliva testing maybe Wombmate would
realize just like me that it is time to change our ways because without researching and looking for clues we gonna keep wondering what the hell is our prob. As you see, We have different type of lower back pain problems & We just have to do what we really have to deal with. Pls. share to the public what is the result of your saliva testing and maybe I will go to see my doctor too.  Or to anyone who have else good things to say. Appreciate it. Good luck.

[DakotaDog]

[DakotaDog]

I've been experiencing a lot of the same systoms everyone is describing - pain on my right side (front and back).  I just went through two trips to the ER, CAT scans, X-rays, blood work, and urinalysis (+ for blood).  I've been referred to a gastroenterologist and a nephrologist.  I've had problems with constipation off and on for over a year.  My symptoms start with pain (rt side), bloating, indigestion, and then it gets to the point of feeling like there's a blockage in my upper intestine.  Once this happens, there's nothing I can take to find relief.  The ER doc gives me a shot of pain killer and that's relaxes my muscles in my abdomen for a while and then it starts all over again.  The only reflief I've been able to find was from a 14-day regimen of XIFAXAN after being diagnosed with small intestine bacterial overgrowth.  Seemed to ease my syptoms (symptoms) for about six months, but now I'm right back where I was.  I've had a postive ANA and Fibromyalgia symptoms since 1999.

[wombmate]

I did get the results of my saliva test. My cortisol levels are not where they are supposed to be. The confusing part to me is that when I wake in the morning, my test was within normal limits, it did drop tremendously around noon and then spike again around 4pm. I am on licorice right now (pill form), I just started taking it Aug 7th so I need to give it some time. I can honestly say that the pain seems to be not as severe the past few mornings. I'll post a message again when I feel more sure this is helping, my PA and Pharmacist said it could take a month or so before I am where I am supposed to be.

Wombmate

[Gold32]

Just wanted to quickly let you all know my progress.
A little before visiting this site my husband and i have been talking about starting to try for baby number three.  I stopped taking my womens everyday multi vitamins and began taking a pregnancy formula that contains folate,multi vitamin and Iodine.  I had only been taking it for a week before i began to realise that the pain i had been getting in the mornings has gone!!!!  I have no idea if it is something in this Blackmores pregnancy formula or if its due to something else.  There has to be some connection to the strenght or ingredients of these tablets.  I have not had pain in the morning for just over two weeks now! If anyone want to give it a go let me know if you retun the same results. I was a huge tea drinker and have cut down to decaf tea, not sure whether this has too helped.  Also managing my IBS better.
I have experience the same symptoms as all of you for the last three years and i no longer wake with any pain. Goodluck to you all.

[hellzbellz]

OK. Update here -
Have tried going without coffee - no effect. Have tried modifying/altering diet. No difference. Spent $2K (AUD) on viscose elastic memory foam mattress. Nope. Am still waiting hospital appointment with surgeon general to discuss symptoms. Have tried stretching and exercising (well, I do everyday for the FMS and the IBS and the depression LOL) - no difference. Have woken almost every morning with this pain. Am getting very very cranky.
Just a thought, everyone. It is interesting about the time factor with many of us. It appears that:

1. The pain starts early in the morning and gets progressively worse.
2. We get out of bed and go to the loo and it eases off.
3. If we go back to bed, or if we try to sleep in it escalates to sheer agony.
4. It is only relieved by getting up and moving around or remaining upright or in an                        upright seated position for about half an hour or a little longer.
5. It ONLY occurs in the morning and not at any other time of the day.
6. It begins in the right lower abdomen over the bowel/appendix and radiates through the back and into the hip with time.

I dunno - I am really bewildered by this. At least I know I am not alone with this malady - keep posting everyone and maybe we will get to the bottom of it.  

Gold32 - could you print a list of what ingredients & quantities are in the pregnancy pills? It would be interesting to know. Hope you are still pain free:)

[Tress]

Hi.  Are you still 'pain free'?   I looked up the website:  http://www.blackmores.com.au/pregnancy/.  Are you taking the pills for getting pregnant or the ones for pregnancy/breasfeeding.  I was going to give the pills a try!!
Thanks :-)

[manymoosh]

Hi,

I'm a male 25, and I'm having the same problem as everyone here.  Early in the morning I get pain in my lower right back, around the kidney area.  If I get up and go to the bathroom, the pain goes away after a couple of hours. The doctors can't seem to find out anything.  I'll be doing some ultra sounds and colonoscopy soon (although I've done it numerous times before). However, I found an intersting book, on a specific diet that people swear have helped them out with their IBS, IBD, cramping, gas, bloating and on and on.  People on the forms swear by it.  Its called the "The Specific Carbohydrate Diet" If any one has tried it, can you please let me know if it works? I already bought the book and gone to the website.  I know its not a gimmick, but the diet is one of the strictest diets I have ever seen.  I just don't think I can do it.  If anyone has experince with the diet I would be glad to hear about it.  

Please, lets find a solution to this problem!

[Tress]

I ended up at the doctor last night...103 fever, etc.   They are treating me for a UTI and given me some sort of pill to cleanse my liver?  Can't take the pill, made me SO sick last night and even worse this morning.  I'll take the antibiotic and follow up with my OB/GYN and see what those tests say.....  oh, but I had NO pain in my back this morning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[wombmate]

I bought 'The Specific Carbohydrate Diet' book, I thought it would be the answer to my morning pain because the Dr thought it was all IBS, needless to say, I found it to hard to follow, I don't have a health food store close enough for me to buy alot of the items in the book, so I read it and decided it wasn't for me. I do feel it works for the right people, it just wasn't an answer to my problem. I have been feeling almost pain free all week, I have been doing a combination of two things, I have been taking some pills to help with Adrenal fatigue, I did a saliva test and found my Adrenals aren't working up to par (adrenals lay right on top of your kidneys) so it made sense to me, to give them a boost, maybe they have been working to hard that when I sleep, they stress and cause me pain. I have also been going to a massage therapist once a week and she is working on me for myofascial pain, so , one or the other is giving me some relief. I also work at a computer all day long so have been watching my posture as well.
Good luck.

[hellzbellz]

OMG OMG OMG OMG - Second morning with no pain!

After exhausting all medical options and having all scans and tests to show that my insides are perfectly good and healthy (thank you very much), I decided to play my last card. I had decided that if all else failed I would go to the chiropractor who had been recommended to me.

2 hours and a lot of pain later, I had my answer. Instead of my spine being straight and my hips being in alignment, my back has an S curve and my right hip is almost 2 inches lower than my left. According to the chiro, this has been the case for a very long time, resulting in the nerves that run around my right hip into my groin area being pinched by spinal and hip compression resulting in: YOU GUESSED IT! - groin pain after lying down for approx 7 hrs. All the other symptoms I have are directly related - the increase in urination, the tingling and numbness in right arm and leg, the sciatica in right leg, the headaches, the sensitivities, the IBS - possibly even the fibromyalgia!

Anyway - he has begun work on trying to realign my spine, starting with the incredibly out of whack lower lumbar region. He is really shocked at how bad it is! And the most amazing thing is - it works!!! I have had one treatment and altho it hurts and I am still adjusting to it, for the first two mornings in over ten months, I have had - NO PAIN!!!

Stay tuned - I will let you all know how this progresses...

CHEERS:):):):):):D

[angie1977]

I have all the symptoms you have mentioned and I was diagnosed with fibromyalgia. Good Luck!

[Rainypm]

Hi all,

I've been suffering from this type of morning back pain for close to 20 years.  Sometimes it's worse than other times (right now it's really bad), but I can't remember not having it.  I decided to start a message board on Yahoo groups so maybe we can have more of a discussion between people and come up with our own solution.  Please stop by if you want to help solve this!

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/morningpain/

[VictoriaMeldrew]

Hi Tress.
Would you be able to tell me the name of the Liver cleanse pills you were given?
Thanks xx

[VictoriaMeldrew]

My first post seems to have disappeared, so forgive me if it reappears and there's two!!I

I have been trawling the internet for info on these exact symptoms for my poor husband. GPs and ER have been worse than useless and you just get so fed up. But I just found this page which I thought was quite interesting about the kidneys. Please post if anyone tries these out and finds relief, so as to help the rest:):)

http://www.crawfordnaturalhealthcenter.com/the-kidneys-and-low-back-pain/

Thanks and all the best x

[Beck52ln]

I am having this morning  lower abdominal pain also and I am glad to know that  I am not all alone. I have been to 4 doctors and have blood tests, colonoscopy, defecography,and ultrasound but they could not find the problem. My symptoms started last year from September to March but disappeared during summer (April to October of this year). Again starting the first week of November, the pain has come back. It started as a tingling pain right in the middle of my lower abdomen but sometimes it radiiates to both sides but most often to the right. If I lie on my left side, the pain sometimes disappear. If I urinate or .... . the pain is minimized or disappears.  It is troubling me because once the pain starts early in the morning (maybe 3 or 4PM), I cannot go back to my deep sleep. But once I get up , the pain is gone.
One of my doctors diagnosed me as having IBS. But none of these doctors told me why the problem in the morning occurs. I have been researching on IBS in the internet but there's nothing that says what happens in the early morning. Now that there are many of us having similarities in symptoms especially the morning pain which disappears upon getting up, I think they should include this  medical findings in the literatures of IBS.
I went back to my doctor again this November and I was given some medications to stop the pain and medicine that's suppose to normalize movement of my intestines but it seems the medicines are not working.There's still pain in the morning. Knowing that I am not alone alleviates my fear about this illness. It was nice to read your  comments and suggestions. Thank you all!