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8 year old temper tantrums

We have a 8 year old boy who, within the past 3 or so months has begun having extreme mood problems. Throwing things when he doesn't get his way. Refuses to do anything outside of the house. FOr example we wanted to go to Monster Trucks in a few weeks, but he refuses to go. If we do go, he will ahve his head down the entire time and will not even give it a chance. HE would rather play XBox etc than talk to anyone. If he doesn't do as well on a game as the adults do, he will throw the controller and say he is stupid and can't do anything. We have taken Xbox computers away from him, but the problem doesn't end. If he plays a board game with his sister (11) the same thing happens. We had a recent incident with one of the kids at school when the boy didn't stop throwing snowballs at him (even though my son never told him to stop) my son pushed the boy down to the ground. He said, I could tell he wouldn't stop if I asked him to...

He is an honours student at school (Straight A's on his last report card) very attenative etc there. I have talked to the teacher and she says he is a well adjusted respectful boy all the time. The flip side of this is that he will have extreme happy (to the point of being giddy) as well. I have only noticed this behaviour recently, but it has be concerned. Both my his dad and I try talking to him, trying to figure out what is going on, but all I get is the evil eye (when he is upset) or he completely ignores us if he is in a happy state. Any ideas here, we have tried just about every dicispline that we can think of.  HELP anyone have a similar sit.
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Avatar universal
Hi, I am thankful to fall upon such an amazing post! My son just turned 7. He is such an amazing boy. He loves to play outside with his friends, watching YouTube is his thing. He is not too interested in the old Xbox we have anymore. Occasionally he likes cartoons. One thing he does love is his mama! He is a mamas boy all day. I have a 9 year old daughter as well. I would say I am a good mom. I take time at the end of the night to talk to my kids. Ask them how are they feeling or talking about their behavior and what I expect. I answer random questions. I try to make a point after school to do something with them whether it's go to the beach or do a project. But once school ends everything begins. My son will get annoyed with his sister and then it escalated to hitting, punching, kicking, throwing things. He gets spurts of hyperness/fidgets.  When my son hears NO he immediately starts to bang his head and throw things and yell and try to manipulate the conversation. When outside with his friends I notice that he doesn't get along with girls so much. He will throw sticks or hurt them. He will yell at me when I am reprimanding him for something. He will say I just want to die right now. Homework is the devil. Something that could take 5 minutes will take an hour of fighting and whining when can I be done. If I am correcting him he will throw a tantrum. In the store or at a restaurant he will throw a tantrum. He has broken many things due to throwing them. He has hit and kicked me. Called me names and lastly says I will just kill myself then. The last time I found him in the bathroom with a shoe string around his neck. Finally I have made a counseling appointment.

    My 9 year old is very sassy and she mimics some of the same behavior as far as hitting kicking tattling and concentration issues (I think she has ADD) but she is bright and funny. Loud and a social butterfly. In the past 3 years we have been through hell. 3 moves. Both of my parents died. We lived over seas for 3 years. My husband just deployed 2 months ago and this is when the worst of his attitude and anger comes out. I'm not sure if it's just more emotional then adhd but I am at my whits end and doing something to help the situation. I just want other parents who are going through a lot to know you are not alone and there are plenty of people on the same boat. As I start the process of seeing how to help my son I will continue to keep updates. Also someone posted about Lyme disease and now I will be getting tested as o have "fibromyalgia". So thank you so very much!
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Avatar universal
I went through some of what you are describing with my son when I was younger.  It was a tough time and it seemed to me the problems got particularly bad about the time he turned eight.  There is no magic bullet or solution in my opinion.  Dealing with these issues as a single mother was particularly stressful.

What does work is a lot of structure and pre-set consequences for these kids.  When they aren't in school, you should try to enroll them in activities that consume energy.  Baseball for boys in the Spring.  Basketball for boys in the winter.  If these sports don't appeal to them, consider martial arts.  I would take a good look at diet.  Are too many foods with sugar or carbohydrates being served at meals?  Are the kids allowed to play outside enough and burn off energy?  Counseling and medication are reasonable options in extreme situations.  However, I would exhaust other avenues first.

With my son, I felt the fact that there were pre-set consequences (that meant something) was very important.  In his case, I felt spankings were useful.  It was something he wanted to avoid and once he knew that was on the table, he did alter his behavior.  Spankings were a big deal in our house.  When he got one, he would get a lecture why he was receiving it and than I would pull down his pants and make him bend over my knee in his underwear. He would get enough swats that there would be some tears. I used my hand most of the time, but I do admit I used a belt once when he put himself in serious danger.

Its all part of a process and some kids are just more difficult to raise than others.  All of you who are going through this have my sympathy.  I hope I have been of some help.
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Avatar universal
jj
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189897 tn?1441126518
COMMUNITY LEADER
   The age of your child is significant in dealing with these problems.  So how old is he?  
    School can be very stressful for even a honor student if it is a new school or a new grade level.  So, what grade is he in?
    Two concussions is kind of unusual?  What sport is he involved in?
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Avatar universal
I am going through the same thing right now. Honor student, no issues at school... He has had two concussions in the past year, we moved from our home to an apartment and back to our home all within a six month span. He was in a new school for about a month before we moved back.
I kept thinking it was the very emotional summer we had, but the anger is getting more significant even now that our lives have stabilized.
I wish I had some words of wisdom or even things we have tried that seem to work, but I am in the same situation and would welcome any advice!
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189897 tn?1441126518
COMMUNITY LEADER
    What a heartfelt post.  Thank you.   And, yes, most of the parents who have posted here really wished they had a manual telling them what to do.  This  topic has been off my radar for a while and I was amazed to see that I had been posting here for close to 4 years!  And in looking back over the many posts, not a lot has changed in those times.
    It sounds like you have a great support system.  Just in case they haven't thought of it - let me add one or two things.
    Many of the posts here are from parents whose kids have been driving them batty for several years and they are finally at the  breaking period.  If I read your post correctly, It sounds like this has been really only going on for about 6 months?  If you read some of the other posts on this forum, you will find that Specialmom and I talk a lot about "triggers".  The thing that sets off the child.  Usually if something has been going on with the child and it was not a problem or much of a problem a year earlier - then looking for that trigger is really important.
   Sometimes it is as simple as the mother is either expecting or a new born is now at the age where they need constant attention.  In other words the child is competing for attention and usually what he has found to be effective through trial and error.  Smart kids are very good at this.
   Sometimes it could be a medical problem.  Thyroid issues for example.  But usually it is more sleep related.  Enlarged tonsils or adenoids which cause lack of sleep and make the child really, really, really cranky.  I can think of several parents who had this checked out and it was the cause.  They had no idea that their child had this problem.
   The other thing is something like ADHDjor ADD.  You will notice several posts in this thread where that turned out to be what the problem was.  Granted I see more of this happening over on the ADHD forum where I am also the CL, but it does happen here to.
     Many times it is with a child who is not hyper and is intelligent.  They have been getting by in school with their basic intelligence, but are slowly losing ground.  The trouble is they know that something is not right.  The older they get, the more frustrated they get.  In fact, as a 5th grade teacher, the child's frustration was one of my best clues that something was going on.   The reason I mention this is that around 4th grade the child really begins to react to what this is doing to him.   I guess it was the throwing of the air hockey puck that made me think of this.  Kids do get mad (they need to be taught how to deal with anger too) and throw things.  Its just that kids with ADHD do a lot more things without taking the time to think about it.
    And, finally he may just be using his intelligence to kind of take control through a trial and error process of finding out what works for him.  If you haven't had it recommended to you.  One book we recommend a lot is
        Love and Logic by Fey and Cline.  It is a great system.
    So a few more things to think about (that you may have already thought about).  If you need more information about any of these things, please post.   Best wishes!!!!
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Avatar universal
Wow, I did a Google Search for 8 year old tantrums and came upon this forum. Although I have not read all, I feel that I have read enough to know that I am not alone here. I have cried, yelled, whispered, practiced breathing (his magic square and my own therapy tool box) I have stood "seemingly unfazed by the behavior" I have rationalized, taken toys away, read books (together and apart) on and on and on, in less than a two year period.
I am a 36 year old Woman, who spent the majority of her "adulthood" in the Army. From 1997 to 2011 I was SSG Marr. Then after a third deployment, comes home broken in spirit and body. I was rescued by a stray dog's pups (My now three year old dog.) and a Young single Father.

I look back over the last two years and how I became WE. A strange concept because I do not have biological children, I have a Dog who is very much my child however he is becoming the best friend of a young boy who stole my heart.       AND THEN.....WHAM-MO

In the last 6 months I have exhausted every avenue I can think of and the Counselor we see constantly chuckles and has reading material for me because I always ask, "where is the manual". "What book do I need to read, how can I study for this test that is a child?"

Today I was reassured at his weekly counseling session when I learned that sometimes "in children it can get worse before it gets better", I laugh because we all have the potential to be like that.
This weeks lessons have been, why it is dangerous to Huck an air hockey puck, even though you didn't mean to hit anyone because you were only throwing the puck because you were frustrated at the game. but ended up hitting someone in the face ......sound familiar anyone?
Then after his father talks to him, he apologizes to me and for the next few days, hours, minutes, he clings to me telling me how much he loves me.
I really don't know. In my stations I know there are extenuating circumstances that any child may have difficulty adjusting to, however (the medic in me) says that if a child poses a risk to harm himself or someone else, we have a responsibility and in my case, coming into a ready made family, the only experience I have is being the oldest of 5. I'm flabbergasted and maybe old fashion.
If I can offer any encouragement! I am holding strong (with the help of a wonderful father/fiance) and a great support group within the family and within the team of counselors, therapist, psychiatrists and pediatricians. Our Son is a very well mannered, smart, witty, funny and sweet young boy. The "jeckle" that has come out in the last 6 months is frightening. I don't have an answer yet, only empathy, understanding, and a bond with people seeking the same answers.
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973741 tn?1342342773
My son's issues aren't food related.  I went the route of determining that.  my son has sensory integration disorder.  Looks a lot like add/adhd.  you do occupational therapy to treat this along with behavior modification.  Worked very well for my son who is now 9 and doing very well.  He's never needed medication but the answer wasn't so simple as changing his diet.  It did take a good amount of effort and work that my husband and I and my son (who had to do a lot of the things we asked of him) to conquer his challenges.  Every child is different though.  I imagine that most people are doing the best they can for their child.  Some may needlessly being medicated and I certainly wouldn't enter into that without a ton of knowledge and skepticism.  however, there are some kids that do better on medication and they themselves are significantly happier.  

the 99% number is inaccurate (proof?) and yes, what you'd expect from a naturopath (a group that does like to make a lot of promises and take a ton of money for them).  But agree that I'm sure some behavior issues are related to multiple things and aren't all just add/adhd.  My son is case in point.  

luck to all parents trying to help their children.  
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Avatar universal
Oh how I cringe when reading all the drugs we are cramming down our babies. I wish more people would listen to what you are saying!!! My 8 yr old is exactly like these others on this thread. I have had hair samples and saliva testing.... Tons of over the top toxins, heavy metals I. Body and food allergies. Our naturopath said 99% of behavior issues come from food allergies and toxin build up in body results in the irrational behavior , short circuiting so to speak in our children
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Avatar universal
Hi everyone.  I have a 7 year old boy who is doing the same thing. He is such a smart kid, very social, does great in school. But when at home, if he does not get what he wants, a switch goes off in his head and he becomes unbearable. He punches, kicks, pinches,bites. It's really hard on the rest of the family. I just made an appointment with his Dr. as we need some help! I thought he would get better but he is getting worse. He now will act out like this in front of my in laws. Something he never would have done in the past. But like many others have said, he definitely can control when and where he will act out. Spanking does NOT work. I am so frustrated.
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Avatar universal
We do spank!! doesn't phase the kid!!  I think you need to re-read some of the comments. The parents are saying they have spanked and that it really isn't working. There is something else wrong!!
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189897 tn?1441126518
COMMUNITY LEADER
   This sounds a lot like post traumatic stress as a result of the bullying.  The school needs to be much more involved.  They need to let your son know that he is safe.  They need to protect him!   ( I assume these things happened at school).  A child psychologist will help.  By the way, if this did happen at school, they also should be paying for the psyc.
  Hope your son gets better soon.
   You might want to consider buying some of Aldof Moser's books like "Don't pop your cork on Mondays".  And reading it with your child.
          http://www.amazon.com/Dont-Pop-Your-Cork-Mondays/dp/0933849184/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_t
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Avatar universal
This is crazy the same thing has just happened to my son almost word for word in the past few months but he has now progressed to spitting in my face and as of last night urinated himself and then threw is wet clothes at me,He has also started leaving bruises and punching me in the head and face.I have just contacted his school and they have referred me to a child psychologist in the area,it seemed to stem from an incident where a teenage buoy shot him with a paintball gun and then he was bullied by 2 older boys who held him down and fed him grass.I have gone on for nearly 2 months now but can no longer cope as I am now afraid of my 8 year old son,I will let you know if this helps but I really feel for you as I truely understand.
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4429622 tn?1354466650
in lieu of the trajedy that has made us all so sensitive to the sickness in this world:

dear sick world that suppresses our souls, institutionalizes us, programs us into machines for profit, causes us all so much suffering & pain, and as of late is now causing our kids to commit mass murders.. i would rather my precious, sensitive, divine angelic daughter pass & return to the realm of everlasting peace & love that she came from than to become infected by your pain & sickness.. as i now see so much clearer how we're all absorbing & playing out the conditioning, programming, and pain of the past.. we're operating from viruses passed onto us based on ideas of control, and we are inflicting pain on our kids.. we're "forcing" them to "grow up" into this world of pain.. we're causing them and ourselves so much pain & misery by enforcing discipline, enforcing bed times, telling them what they can & cannot eat, and robbing them of the very freedom they came here to experience.. we send them to miltary school to "break them down" and make them conform.. we as parents are in fear.. we've become victims of the fear based failed concepts passed down to us.. we fear that our kids will not "make it" in this world, we fear that they'll suffer, we fear that they won't be able to handle this "real" world so we train them.. we prepare them, we structure them, discipline them, give them consequences, instill fear & demand respect.. we rob their souls of it's natural authentic free flowing expression.. we shame them, we guilt them, we put expectations on them, and we shame them more when they fail.. we tell them to stop acting like babies.. we tell them to respect & honor us.. guess what? these kids know MORE THAN US.. they came to us from a realm of pure light, divine love, and freedom.. their souls are kicking & screaming, not because you told them NO, but because they KNOW what doesn't feel RIGHT

we're infected, we're perpetuating the cycles of suffering & guilt and shame, pain & blame.. we're using our kids to fulfill our own voids, our own brokenness and pain from the karma & programming instilled into us, from the loss our own souls

stop the madness.. break the cycle.. be the change.. evolve.. heal

www.bigbeautifulbuddha.com
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189897 tn?1441126518
COMMUNITY LEADER
    Ya, you may have hit the nail on the head in part 3 of your post.   Smart kids learn how to manipulate.  They don't really do it on purpose, its just a way to get what they want.  If they learn early that screaming gets them what they want - they just keep screaming.  And along the way, they don't learn how to self regulate.
   If you look through some of the more recent posts on temper tantrums, you will find that what your daughter is doing is pretty similar to other kids.  I tend to doubt that bipolar is the reason, but I would need to know more about her.
   I suggest you get the book  called "Raising Lions", by Joe Newman.  If you go to his web site and subscribe to his newsletter you can get $3.00 off the book.  The site is http://raisinglions.com/.    I think the methods he describe will really help you (no meds are involved).   Hope this helps.!
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4429622 tn?1354466650
Part 4

- this age range of 8-10 is a really tough transitional stage where they are shedding their early childhood comforts & securities and stepping into a new realm of having to be responsible for their actions & feelings.. in early childhood it's always playtime, and feel good time, and children are not expected to be held accountable.. they're now developing cognitive functions that allow them to see their faults and are facing a new challenge of being made aware of them & being asked to be more responsible for them.. i believe this is a main cause.. our daughter still ***** her thumb, still wants to cuddle and sleep with us every night.. she often will talk like a 4 year old and watch videos i took of her in her first 5 years to remember the joyful times when there was no scolding, no accountability, just pure happiness love & joy.. i believe it's our responsibility to be sensitive & aware of this difficult transition that they are facing

- if you really stop and think, we live in a pretty sh)tty world where we're indoctrinated into a school system, and enslaved as adults as cogs in a machine.. all of the discipline we're trying to instill, as well as the medical labels such as adhd etc. are all based on being able to survive and thrive in this sick world.. any condition that doesn't enable you to robotically fall into line and perform as a brick in the wall is labeled as a disease or ilness.. if you really think about it isn't it quite natural for a child who comes from joy & purity to rebel against this conformity? against this tarnishing of the soul?... all of us on this thread have intelligent kids and are made to believe something is "wrong" with them when it could very well be that this defiance and rebellion to being asked to "grow up" into THIS society is maybe what's "right" with them
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4429622 tn?1354466650
part 3

we've allowed her incredible freedom to be herself & express herself freely.. we chose this for her having reflected on mistakes we made with my wife's older kids who i'm the stepfather of - they are now adults and this is our 3rd child raising together.. now that we're having these increasing episodes we're wondering if it's backfiring & if we've done the wrong thing by giving her TOO MUCH freedom, spoiling her, always saying yes and choosing our battles.. but i feel better about that now seeing how so many others are having these challenges

so with all of that being said, i'd like to offer some opinions & perspective:

- first, it may benefit you to google "indigo children" ... there is a lot of information out there about this, and resources for parenting them.. it's passed off by critics, but for us it feels right, all things considered.. we feel our daughter is a very unique soul, and is here for a reason.. indigos are independent, strong-willed, highly intelligent & resistent to control

- the main issue here is in fact "control".. our daughter's meltdowns all start when she hears "no", when we she doesn't get what she wants - (same as you all have mentioned), or when we are forcibly demanding.. NO human being wants to be controlled! we all naturally want to be free, and it doesn't feel good to be told "NO".. from a philosophical standpoint i think all of our kids with these behaviors are simply telling us that they want to be free spirits & don't want to be controlled.. believe me, i believe firmly in consequences, and accountability in the best interest of the child's growth, but do not believe in an authoritarian approach of controlling our children
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4429622 tn?1354466650
i also am seeing the *jekyll & hyde* comparison mentioned quite a bit & this is exactly what we're experiencing.. she goes into an unconscious state where she has absolutely no ability to reason, no control whatsoever over her emotions - uncontrollable crying, uncontrollable anger.. threats of consequences, taking away privileges etc. only enrage her more & she's immune to them in this "state".. she says nasty things to us such as "you're the worst mother ever", "i hate you" etc., that i can't even take seriously because i know it's not "her".. just the last few days she's been saying things like "i wish i was never born", "i hate myself", "i'm not beautiful", "i'm an embarassment", "i'm the worst daughter ever", and the most alarming thing she's said is "please god take me from this world back to where i came from".. she even starting speaking her own language during one incident that she calls "angelic".. she hits, kicks, and bites - she's even kicked me in the face

she has literally passed out and lost consciousness (scary stuff) - only to awaken and not even remember what happened.. when she acts like this, she is a different person, as if possessed.. once she snaps back she feels incredibly terrible & shameful.. she cries uncontrollably and feels terrible remorse for what she's done.. she has no control over it, and she's devastated when she realizes what she's done.. she tries her hardest to deflect blame & make it all our fault, but she eventually caves in and it's heartbreaking to see her breakdown, at this point she just wants to be cuddled and loved, and it's exactly what we do

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4429622 tn?1354466650
this is part 1 of my comment - above is part 2 - this whole post got messed up b/c it's too long, and i'm having strange issues with it

wow.. it's simultaneously disheartening and enlightening to see so many others having these challenges with their children.. my heart truly goes out to you all.. we are exhausted & also in shock with her behavior.. our 9 year old daughter perfectly fits most of the descriptions here.. however our parenting style and lifestyle we've provided for her is drastically different than the "norm" - so i'd like to offer a different viewpoint for everybody.. i don't necessarily have any answers as i'm seeking answers myself, but hope that my perspective sheds light for some

our sweet, beautiful angelic daughter has always been perfect in our eyes, and everybody loves her to death.. she has been given an immense amount of love, affection & support.. she is home-schooled and has been fortunate enough to spend virtually every day with mommy & daddy for the last 4 years, and every day with mommy since birth.. we've taken her out of the "system" due to the pressures to conform & psychological impact of the schooling system.. she is most definitely gifted, highly intelligent, creative beyond belief, has always easily engaged adults in conversations, and is absolutely joyful & full of light.. she is intuitive and as most others have mentioned, INCREDIBLY *sensitive* ...

for the first 5-6 or so years of her life it was smooth sailing with no issues or concerns.. it's been slowly building for the last probably 2 years and now it's almost a daily meltdown.. with the love she's been given, if this can happen to her/us, i feel it can happen to anyone, so you're definitely not alone!!!

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4429622 tn?1354466650
test
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4429622 tn?1354466650
- lastly, i am considering the possibility of bi-polar for my daughter.. although i am heavily against any medication and very much against this clinical labeling of children, i am open to this possibility, and offer this as something to look into for others.. reason is that my father was a severe bi-polar with psychosis.. i witnessed him exhibit every single trait to the extreme.. i have some traces of this myself, although it's moderate and i'm highly aware of my own ups & downs.. really, for me i'm just pretty much ecstatically happy more often than not and i have a love affair with life, coupled with short lived downturns.. if they could bottle up my brain chemistry & sell it, it'd be preferable to any anti-depressants out there ;) .. my daughter is ecstatically joyful & happy most of the time, coupled with (lately) these tantrums.. it is possible that my daughter may have inherited this, and it is a factor

- i mention bi-polar because it may help some get some peace of mind or some needed help, but i think more importantly we need to be able to see through these clinical labels, and challenge the paradigms set by society.. we need to believe in the inherent beauty, divinity & greatness of our children, and not buy into this ********.. our children are special & gifted, and it's up to us to find more & better ways to support & LOVE them (not control & devastate) and i really think medication should be the absolute last resort.. and spanking should never be resorted to under any circumstances

i'm also dropping a link to my personal blog for those who are interested - www.bigbeautifulbuddha.com
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Avatar universal
What is Udo's DHA oil? I am so worried about my child. I think she might be bipolar. Got to try something besides drugs.
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189897 tn?1441126518
COMMUNITY LEADER
   How do his school teachers say he interacts with the kids at lunch time or during recess?
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973741 tn?1342342773
Are these social difficulties new?  
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