Boyfriend and daughter have innappropriate reletionship
I have a boyfriend with an overly clingy daughter(who is 10), and it's hard to cope with. She is always hanging all over him and interupting when he is talking to me or other people. I feel like I am constantly monitoring their activities for fear that something innappropriate is going on between them. Part of me feels a little nuts for that, but they way they act towards each other is just weird to me. She practically lives in his lap, and she doesn't just sit there calmly. She bounces up and down, stradling him while putting her hands all over, almost like she is mimiking sex. They also are constantly "wrestling" with each other, but then spring apart like two teenagers when I walk in the room. He spends hours every night in her room even though she has school in the morning, sometimes til 10 or later. Most of the time the door is closed, and the lights off. He says he's on the computer but when I decide to walk in, they are snuggled up in bed together or he looks as if he has just sprung out of bed. He gets overly defensive right away and has a plainly guilty look. They are constantly touching each other in public and at home. She seems to have little interest in friends or relationships of her own, when she is with her father(she spends 5 days a week with him). I have even arrainged for more play dates with other kids and she just clings to her father the whole time and asks to leave. She has 6 siblings and from what I understand does plenty of socializing with them, kids in her mom's neighboorhood and at school. She even plays dumb around him while doing homework. I have observed here filling in her work just fine but as soon as dad walks in she acts out (ie-hissy fits, crying, or even being flirtatious like giggling and twirling her hair) until he gives her the answers. She acts in ways I have seen immature adult women act in order to get a man's sexual attention. In fact she has made comments referencing she and her dad are "married" and things of that nature. All being said, even if I'm blowing my suspicion out of proportion, she takes up all his time. The worst part of that is he and I are expecting a son very soon and I am afraid he will not pay attention to him because his daughter won't allow it. He already acts purposefully rude to me and other people while she's around; he is literally a different person on the weekend. He even admits to overcompensating around her, but why? He and her mother were never married and broke up before she was born. She spends more time with dad then mom and he is obviously attentive and affectionate but she still acts as if it is not enough. I live with them now at his parents home(for several months now), so it's not like they have ever lived alone together but I'm treated as if I am interupting their routine. Maybe I do but I deserve time with my boyfriend, would even be fine with hanging all together. That never happens though because she throws fits and makes up lies(ie I was being mean, etc) to the point where I don't even want to be around eiether. He knows she's lying but never punishes her for it, or any of her other bad behavior. The lack of attention I'm feeling is doubled by the fact he seems to have little interest in being intimate with me on any level(ie-infrequent intercourse, no affection or snuggling unless I intiate). He says he's just tired or not an affectionate person, but he gives her endless affection( i.e-running fingers through her hair, hugging and kissing her, talking sweet to her); yet he is short with me and often avoids my touch or even engaging in conversation with me. I've been told I'm paranoid, like why would he bother with me if they are having inappropriate relations, but I feel that can be explained. All of his friends have been getting married and having kids and he felt left out because it's not like his daughter could publically fill that role without scorn. Some days I have so sure he does love me and want me around, but more often then not I feel as if I'm just some kind of facade for him. My hormones are out of control because of my pregnancy but I felt this way before as well, and we have been together for almost 2 years. It's getting to the point where I can't even stand to be around either of them, even when he and I are alone. He talks about her constantly now, even when she's not around. He turns her day to day activities and actions(ie-doing her homework, how she plays) into amazing accomplishments in his head, even her plainly bad behavior(ie- hissy fits, bullying other kids). We are under a lot of stress with new baby coming(money, space issues,etc) but instead of outletting his concerns with me, he goes to her for comfort. He treats her like a wife and me like a servent, even asking me to clean up after her even though that shouldn't be my responsibility. How do I change this behavior, or should I just leave him and file for full custody when our son is born? I really feel alone and am usually very private but I have never handled a situation like this before. Any insight would be appreciated to help make a decision. I just want to do good for my son no matter what.
Welp, here's the deal. What are you dating him for? If I had to watch my boyfriend to make sure nothing inappropriate was going on with his daughter, I'd be out fo there. And I'd call CPS on the way out as that certainly isn't HER fault as he is the adult.
He treats her like a wife and me a servent. How is that HER fault?
Ugh, and now you are pregnant with his child.
Well, you should leave him and allow him to have access to his son you are carrying unless you believe he is a pedaphile and molesting children. Otherwise, he's got a young daughter (is this your first child you are having as a lot of kids from divorce are a bit clingy with parents especially when a girlfriend/boyfriend is in the picture) that he's close with. He is supposed to be close to her. If it seems inappropriate to you then you should be able to discuss it but you should make sure it isn't you with your own emotions playing a role here rather than it just being a sweet, close father daughter relationship. Then if he doesn't change the dynamics, that's it. He's letting t=you know what is number one priority is, his child (as yours will probably be when you have your son).
So, no. I am doubtful this relationship will work but he does need to be part of his child's life as you chose him to make a baby wtih. That is unless you do believe he is dangerous to kids and then you need to call cps as I mentioned. good luck
I agree with SpecialMom, and have to say that if you spend time on this forum, and the relationships and stepparenting forums, you will find this is almost epidemic. It almost feels like the norm, this exact post appears so often.
I don't think you are imagining much. Maybe the relationship has not crossed the line into overt sexuality but it is certainly emotionally exclusive in terms of you being left out. I would be tempted to call in a complaint but if you do and it's true, obviously everything will blow up (including her life), and especially, you would do better with evidence. You could consider getting one of those clocks that actually is a webcam and setting it up in an unobtrusive spot so you can see what really goes on in her room at night. (Don't know if they come in night-vision versions or not.) I can't believe that seeing all of this behavior, you got pregnant with this guy, but there is no changing that now. For your own child's sake, it matters to know what the deal is with him and sex with kids. We live in a very sexualized society and lots of "men" out there don't know how to be mature (like so many irresponsible and self-centered high-school boys) -- nobody ever taught them any moral absolutes. Even if he is not actually having sex with her he is behaving inappropriately, and that is really a shame for her and bodes poorly for her life.
I think that a woman's intuition about things is very strong. If you feel that way then there quite possibly could be something going on.
I agree with the hidden camera idea....for as much as you don't want to really see anything like that, it makes sense to do it for everyones sake.
Especially your unborn son, as much as it's nice for your child to have a father in their lives, a child molester shouldn't be one of them. It's better off if he's not around.
I'm sorry you are going through this. Have you ever talked to him or her about it?
I have talked to him about it and he says I'm blowing things out of proportion or I'm being high maintenence. I have thought about the camera thing but isn't it illegal to film someone(especially a child) without permission? I suppose in any case I would keep the information to myself. And as for it not being her fault, I doubt my boyfriend would be doing anything against her will. I remember having very sexual feelings when I was her age and acting on them, in fact I was only 11 when I lost my virginity. If anything, I'd beleive she seduced him before I'd beleive it was the other way around. I'd be glad they are close,considering I didn't have a good reletionship with my dad, but he says all the time he misses having his own life. Literally every aspect of his life revolves around her, and I can see how it stresses him out. I guess I'm looking for advice on how he can better parent her as well instead of him giving in to her every whim.
Don't be blind to the fact that HE is the adult here and is her father, and has absolutely no business doing any of this. Don't cast the girl as a scheming little Lolita, it makes you look like a jealous girlfriend who would blame anyone besides the man who should most be blamed. The truth is probably very complex, involving deep insecurities on her part and him saying yes (in his actions) to a whole string of activities, and maybe even trying a few out. Please be careful when you blame a child in a situation with an adult. There are a lot of subtle ways a kid can be groomed, and there is a lot of sadness, pain and desperation in the child, in what you are describing.
I'm not casting her as anything, she is plainly manipulative as was I at her age, which is why I'm able to recognize it. I played my parents and grandparents against each other to get what I wanted, even though I knew it was wrong. I got plenty of boys in trouble when I was her age too. Parents would catch us and I would scream "rape" when I was the seductress. I did these things because I was selfish and spoiled, nobody "groomed" me for anything. Not saying he wouldn't also be to blame, but just because she is a child doesn't make her innocent. I know in my heart that nothing sexual is probably happening, I'm just having a hard time figuring out why he doesn't see the problem. I'm doing this for her benefit as well, the real world is harsh and doesn't care you've been treated like a princess your whole life. I don't want to be stuck taking care of her when she grows up because she can't fend for herself.
Now that you have said what you were like as a child, I am having trouble telling whether what you are describing between your boyfriend and his daughter is normal affection made somewhat self-conscious on his part by your scrutiny and suspicion, or if there is really anything going on. If you were willing to seduce boys at age 11 and scream rape if caught, and were selfish and spoiled, I would say being involved with a guy who has a child is a bad idea, since a child has a stronger moral claim to her parent than does a girlfriend. I'm sorry you're pregnant by this guy, like specialmom, I'd say it sounds like the relationship is going nowhere that you want it to, and maybe you'd better be planning to leave it.
Yeah I did seek therapy to undo all the stuff from my childhood and get over my sefishness. That being said I know how to recognize the behavior in others, I'm not projecting any insecurity onto anyone. Also, I started becoming suspicious when I noticed their behavior seemed to go a little past the normal line, combined with her overly self involved actions. The main issue for me is the affection seems to be more lover-lover than father-daughter, and he unquestionly does everything she asks. He will even leave work and and take her out of school for the day just because she says so. I'm just wondering what the root of all this overcompensation is about. Yes, I'm willing to admit I might be blowing things out of proportion because I do have a skewed view of what is or isn't an appropriate relationship. What I do know is that it can't possibly be healthy for eiether party for a daughter to have that kind of control, especially over her father. I
I am fearful you may still hang onto your past in that I'm trying to picture who says that "at 10, I did things with guys and claimed rape". That is way way over the top. Perhaps sexuality rules your own life and you then absolutely do project it onto everyone else.
Regardless, doubtful this relationship will work out as he is attached to his daughter and that is probably the right thing considering her age that she takes priority over his dating life. good luck
I have several issues here, first you have a duty to the girl, your son, and any child he may have access to. You must find out if there is any validity to your feelings, you should get a nanny cam. If you do not see anything after a few weeks then you know your just being extra sensitive. However if you see anything that shows an inappropriate relationship then you must report it immediately. To do other wise makes you a molester as well, or as the law calls it fail to protect when you know a child is being abuse aka accessory to the abuse. It disturbed me that you said it wouldn't matter what the camera showed since it would just be for you, would you not report the rape of a child? It also disturbed me that you would somehow blame her. It is not normal for a man to be sexually attracted to a 10 year old girl!!!! Even if she was some sort of temptress as you said, a normal male would not be sexually attracted to a little girl, he would get his daughter help if she was making advances at him not sleep with her. If he is sexually attracted to her he will also be sexually attracted to other little girls and maybe boys and pose a threat to all of them. If you know this information and withhold it then you are helping him molest and rape children!!!
First off, if there is something going on its not molestation. If the girl wants it(child or not) thats called consent in my book. And furthermore, its illegal in my state to videotape someone without their knowledge, so I would be held liable if I did reveal the tape. No one would even consider it evidence and I would probably be the one to end up in jail for child porn or something. And yes, it's not normal for a man to be attracted to a child but it happens more than people think(especially in families).I beleive the proper term is genetic attraction disorder. I would definatly take my son if I found out something was happening, but other than that would stay out of it. Since the tape would be thrown out, they would just deny what was happening and I would look like a psycho. CPS is a sad joke around here, I know because my step dad smacked my brother and I around almost daily as kids and they never "found evidence" against him.
Oh boy. Any child who has sex with a parent is molested. PERIOD. And it is really upsetting that you'd refer to it as consent. I am hoping that you will leave this family own and address some things within that appear to be misguided.
This is a tough situation, and being pregnant makes it extra stressful for you. In the past, I sought therapy for anxiety. Lots of different things came up in my discussions with the therapist. One thing that came up was an incident I recall as a child, where an adult male neighbor tried some very inappropriate things with a pre-teen female child. The adult ended up being questioned by the police, and I remember there had been talk about what role the child may have played in the situation. The pscyhologist/therapist told me that even if the child had gone to the neighbor and thrown herself at him, it was the neighbor's responsibility as the adult to put a stop to it. She said that in situations like the one I described, it is always the adult's responsibility to make sure nothing gets started in the first place, and if something inappropriate happens, it is always 100% the adult's fault.
The law says all sex between adults and children is illegal. It doesn't matter if the child says yes or no. They consider it non-consensual. Some people are very close to their children and this includes hugs and kisses.
I was stating that a person has to look at all sides of an issue as complicated as this one. The reason I made my initial post was to get unbiased perspective, but I can clearly see that's not possible here. My personal experiences in life have shown me that even children are capable of making rational decisions that are negative or even evil. This world corrupts from a younger and younger age, thats not pessimisim its realism.
I am saddened that you think a 10 year old little girl would not be molested if she had sex with an adult or her father. I'm not sure what happened to you in your youth to be so alarmingly distrustful of children and to view a man's child as a sexual threat to you. From all that you've posted, it seems the best advice is to leave this child and her father alone. I'm fearful as you yourself are about to be a parent. Under the law, it is illegal for anyone to have sex with a 10 year old. She would be the victim. And again, one must wonder what type of abuse you had as a child that you would see it as anything other than that.
Well, good luck but it sounds like a man without children would be the best scenario for you.
I am very sorry...I truly was trying to be helpful, and I thought that by sharing what I was told by a therapist, I was giving you objective information. I do hope that you are able to get this issue resolved.
From your post, it sounds like your boyfriend doesn't think there is anything wrong with the way things are, and therefore doesn't think anything needs to change. It sounds like he thinks you are the one with the problem. Can you continue to live that way for the next several years? It is a hard situation to be in, and again, with you being pregnant, it's even more stressful.
I would be tempted to leave the situation. I know it is easier said than done. And as Specialmom said in her first post, I'd call CPS on my way out of there.
There is a very good reason that there are legal ages of consent in this country. That's because a child below a certain age does not developmentally have the cognitive ability or maturity level to consent to a sexual relationship. Make no mistake about it, if there is ANYTHING going on here, this child is nothing but a victim, even if indeed SHE was the one making advances.
ALL adults have the responsibility of protecting children, whether they are their children or not. You have the legal and moral responsibility to follow up on your concerns...if you don't, and there is something going on, you are just as culpable as the abuser.
Your posts indicate that you have a WHOLE lot of resentment toward this little girl, which is really sad, because her poor, inappropriate behavior is coming from one of two places...she is either being sexually abused, or she is a clingy child desperate for love and attention from her dad, for whatever reason...the broken family, her own issues, whatever. BOTH reasons are things that a 10 year old child cannot make sense out of and rationalize, let alone control. As a parental figure in her life, you would be wise to try to stop viewing this child as direct competition for your BF, and really try to start helping this child.
If you aren't willing to take an honest look at YOUR feelings in this situation, I don't think you'd be doing anything but making a bad situation even worse. I too would urge you to make a report to CYS, or talk to another authority figure about your concerns, unless you can find a way to rule out anything definitively. Even IF there is nothing going on here...this behavior by ALL parties involved needs addressed, as it isn't healthy.
You said you live with your BF's parents. Have you talked to then about this? Do they see this behavior and are they concerned? I know this is all stuff that is hard to hear, but everyone is just being honest with you. There are a lot of issues here than need ironed out...and this little girl needs an advocate. Her dad doesn't seem to be doing right by her in some way or another...it would be nice if you would help in some way to facilitate that.
If you were to use a nanny cam to catch anything then you aren't going to get into any trouble if you catch anything. If it indeed showed that he was molesting her, then you take it straight to the police and get the hell outta there with your son.
You sound like you are very jealous and resentful of this little girl and you shouldn't be. We are all born as sexual beings and if she's been molested most of her life then she may think that it's ok because eventhough it's her father that's doing it...she doesn't know how wrong it is and if she does then the pleasure over rides that. He is in the wrong completely and whether she even seduces him or not she is still being MOLESTED. There is no consent between a child and adult.
What worries me the most about this post is where you stated he is in her room snuggled in bed with the lights off for long periods of time and lies about it? That to me is a red flag. It sounds like it is to you by saying you see guilt. If something is going on it is not this childs fault no matter how she acts. She is ten.
I would agree that that is worrisome although the poster might have a temper and he may lie so as not to suffer her wrath. I am in my kids room at bedtime with the lights out and even snuggle with them sometimes. One is almost 8 and one is 9. Just our normal and nothing 'weird' is going on.
but agreed that under some circumstances, this would worry me too.
Honey, let me tell you, you are not crazy, nor are you wrong for being hurt, pushed aside and taken for granted. Most men with daughters from previous relationships don't realize that they're being too much of a friend and not enough of an actual parent until someone like you come along and brings it to their attention. My husband was the somewhat overly emotionally affectionate with his daughter, and it completely drove me nuts! I had to threaten to leave him several times if the matter wasn't handled appropriately, it's been about 5&1/2 years in the making but things have gotten a lot better these days. What I had to keep me sane was knowing that no matter how lonely, jealous and hurt I was feeling during this whole ordeal, was that she, his daughter, was probably feeling the same way inside or worse that she could have been sexually abused that caused her to seek such attention from her biological father. Although when you are in the midst of battling for your significant others attention, that is the last thing you want to submit to thinking, but I promise it helps you to keep your sanity and do harm to someone, if not your self:/! Some great techniques to try are: do your best to limit their alone time, so that they are not just left all day to do whatever.
:make sure you always make your presence known in conversations, derail conversations that may turn flirtacous between them.
:give him plenty of affection even if he seems reluctant at first, this allows his daughter to see that her dad also has another relationship outside of theirs.
:plan dates with just you and him, ad make him stick to it.
:spend one on one time with his daughter and in a gently way assure her that you are not trying to steal her dad or his attention.
:help her understand that you both are in his life now.
:reach out to her mother, suggest to her that she needs to spend more time with her, (in a nice way)..lol....
I know this post is super-old and I'm not sure anyone here is ever going to see this, but I can't help myself: I MUST say that I am VERY disappointed by how some people have reacted to CautiousGirlfriend. While I agree that children aren't old enough to give consent, and even if they "want" or appear to want sexual activity they are not to blame and any adults who give in to this behavior ARE to blame, I think everyone just sort of jumped down her throat when she revealed suspicions about the girl being a "Lolita" and forgot the facts in the original post.
FACT: He says he's on the computer, not that he's going to snuggle with his daughter. He's up there for hours, and looks guilty when girlfriend comes in. Even if girlfriend "has a temper" he wouldn't look guilty unless he FELT guilty, and he wouldn't have reason to feel guilty about innocently cuddling with his child-- and would have no problem allowing girlfriend or any other adult see this. Why is he lying and saying he's going to be on the computer? Why are they under covers? Why is he "using the computer" so late, anyway?Personally, I think Dad in Daughter's bedroom at night is wrong-- period. Except to tuck in and read a story to a VERY young (not 10) child, which can be done without any adult men getting under the covers with any little girls.
FACT: She straddles him while bouncing up and down on his lap. HE DOES NOT DISCOURAGE HER FROM DOING THIS. Any reasonable adult man would.
FACT: He does romantic gestures towards his daughter, like running fingers through her hair-- something he should be doing with his girlfriend, not his daughter. That's just not the way dads touch their daughters. They pat the head, or maybe stroke the entire length of hair ONCE with a palm; they don't "run their fingers through it." That's clearly a romantic gesture.
FACT: He discusses major life stresses with her 10-year-old daughter, not his girlfriend. In so doing, he IS putting his daughter in the role of lover-- emotionally, if not physically.
I think there very definitely is an inappropriate relationship here, if it isn't overt incest (yet?) it is at the very least covert incest: https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/love-and-sex-in-the-digital-age/201510/understanding-covert-incest-interview-kenneth-adams
Hope you got out of there and that the girl got/gets the help she clearly needs!
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