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Did I do the right thing? What would you of done?
This probably isn't the right board to post this, but I didn't know what other board to post this on. This is what happened. On Tuesday my son had an appt in the morning so I didn't drop him off at his licensed daycare facility he attends til later that morning. Upon leaving his room I could hear a teacher yelling at one of the kids in another room down the hall telling her "you don't be mean to other kids, you don't hit". This room has children in it maybe 1-2 yrs old. When I came up to the door to walk by I saw this teacher had a little girl sitting in a little high chair that is built in to the table and had the little girl by the face, like she grabbed the girls face with her hand, and was close enuf to her face to the point where her nose was almost touching the little girls nose yelling this at her, directly in her face, and went on to tell the little girl she was a "bad bad girl". I was irrate, and of course I couldn't find anyone in management to report it. So I went to work (believe me I felt horrible I didn't know what to do). So when I got home from work I called my mom and my sisters to see what I should do from here, they suggested calling social services and reporting it. So when I dropped my son off this morning I left a letter for the manager of the facility because no one is there that early in the morning. Needless to say, one of the ladys in the office called me at work. She apologized for what I saw and assured me the teacher would be "talked to" and that this type of behavior from a teacher is not acceptable. She also made the comment to me "Well I hope she didn't leave any bruises on that little girls face". That made me even more pissed! So when I got home I got on the web, found my local social services website and reported the incident to them.
I feel incredably guilty that I didn't do something at that moment when I saw that but I didn't know what to do, I was shocked. I didn't sleep hardly at all that night. There is NO reason in hell that a daycare provider should be even touching a child. I'm still upset about it and extremely nervous about bringing my son there who has suffered abuse from his father.
Did I do the right thing? What would you of done??
I feel incredably guilty that I didn't do something at that moment when I saw that but I didn't know what to do, I was shocked. I didn't sleep hardly at all that night. There is NO reason in hell that a daycare provider should be even touching a child. I'm still upset about it and extremely nervous about bringing my son there who has suffered abuse from his father.
Did I do the right thing? What would you of done??
Thank you so much for the heads up new here i had just finished doing something else which required caps and i totally forgot to uncap got so overly involved with the situation i actually didn't even realize the caps were on i understand that it is considered to be poor etiquette. Once again Thank you
I am sure you are not yet aware and I would just like to give you a heads up-
ALL CAPS on forums and chat rooms is considered poor etiquette (SCREAMING!)
with the friendliest of regards
ALL CAPS on forums and chat rooms is considered poor etiquette (SCREAMING!)
with the friendliest of regards
The person I trust most where I work in a preschool of toddlers has had to deal with a boy who was so defiant- he laughed every time he was put in time out, he laughed when she corrected him and she still stayed in control of her own emotions- I would trust this caregiver with my own children and grandchildren: the face holding- I have seen her do this to the boy that is so defiant and she made sure and told me she is not being harsh and just trying to get his attention- I trust her.
The thing that bothers me more is that she called her "Bad"- when a mom or dad or caregiver/teacher says something like that to a toddler- it's a red flag to me!
I agree with rockrose- you most certainly have to hold a child's face somtimes to get their attention and you do not have to hurt them in any way doing that-
and a day without touching them? absurd!
I have also been on the child welfare board in Texas 5 years and I know you also did the right thing in following your heart and reporting something you thought was disturbing. It's for CPS to unravel now.
The thing that bothers me more is that she called her "Bad"- when a mom or dad or caregiver/teacher says something like that to a toddler- it's a red flag to me!
I agree with rockrose- you most certainly have to hold a child's face somtimes to get their attention and you do not have to hurt them in any way doing that-
and a day without touching them? absurd!
I have also been on the child welfare board in Texas 5 years and I know you also did the right thing in following your heart and reporting something you thought was disturbing. It's for CPS to unravel now.
AS A MOTHER I DON'T CARE WHAT THE SITUATION IS I AM LEAVING MY CHILD IN HANDS OF A PERSON THAT I BELIEVE WILL TAKE GOOD CARE OF MY KID NOT YELL AND SCREAM AND MAKE MY KID GROW UP TO BE A NERVOUS WRECK PERSONALLY I WOULD TALK TO THIS CHILDS MOTHER AND LET HER KNOW WHAT IS GOING ON I'LL BE DAMNED IF THIS SITUATION WAS TO HAPPEN TO ANY OF US MOTHERS WOULD WE NOT WANT TO KNOW ABOUT IT IF THIS DAYCARE PROVIDER IS HAVING A BAD DAY AND IS GOING TO GO TO WORK AND SCREAM AT A TWO YEAR OLD LET ALONE PLACE HER HANDS ON HER FACE WHAT ELSE IS SHE CAPABLE OF DOING GIRL YOU DO WHAT YOU HAVE TO DO YOU CALL CPS YOU LET THE MOMMY KNOW WHAT YOU WITNESSED SO SHE CAN HAVE INSIGHT OF THE MATTER WHAT IF THIS CHILD GOES HOME WITH A BRUISE WHAT WILL SHE TELL THE MOTHER OOOPS SHE FELL OR KNOCKED HERSELF ONTO SOMETHING HOW DARE SHE I WOULDN'T WANT HER TAKING CARE OF MY KID GOOD LUCK HUN WITH YOUR DECISION AND IM SURE YOU WILL DO THE RIGHT THING THE MANAGER OR SUPERVISOR WILL ONLY COVER UP THINGS WHO KNOWS WHAT ELSE GOES ON IN THIS PLACE.
I think its great that you are able to raise your children yourself however, not everyone is that fortunate. I wish I could stay home with my son all day but I'm a single mother and I have to work. I surely don't look at it as them "raising" my son.
Awesome job!!!! You were beyond right and am soo happy you spoke up! If it were my child and one of these other posters passed and thought , oh well, yikes!!! One thing is, such a young child ( a baby really) should never be violated like that ( in a high chair w/ her face grabbed and an adult screaming your a bad girl!) Hell no!! Part of being in the daycare field is you can not act as you want. You must find alternative ways to get a point across than what you feel is ok at home...ie Can't touch the kids. Second, it is perfectly normal, though not acceptable, that kids that age hit. They're learning!! And they'll learn that hitting isn't acceptable, but not by being scared by an adult in her face!
Thank you for stepping up to the plate. That mom should know how they handled her daughter and her behavior. I'm sure if it were your son, you'd be very grateful. Plus this keeps the 'demand' for daycares to maintain a standard when they know that parents are indeed watching!
Thank you for stepping up to the plate. That mom should know how they handled her daughter and her behavior. I'm sure if it were your son, you'd be very grateful. Plus this keeps the 'demand' for daycares to maintain a standard when they know that parents are indeed watching!
Mommyof2boys, my children were never in daycare, so that's probably why I came down so hard in favor of daycare workers.
I raised my children with love and never made other people discipline them. I agree, I would have been shocked and appaled to see my baby's face in someone's hands, with a teacher screaming in their face.
Fact of the matter is, I never put my child, or another adult in that position. I raised my own kids myself.
I don't know how I would react if I were forced to pay a stranger to raise my babies. Maybe I would react as you did.
I raised my children with love and never made other people discipline them. I agree, I would have been shocked and appaled to see my baby's face in someone's hands, with a teacher screaming in their face.
Fact of the matter is, I never put my child, or another adult in that position. I raised my own kids myself.
I don't know how I would react if I were forced to pay a stranger to raise my babies. Maybe I would react as you did.
Well, I did talk to another lady in the office of the daycare and they asked the teacher about it and she ADMITTED doing exactly what I saw! The teacher said the girl was being a "bully" and she was frustrated with her. The lady in the office said they tell their teachers to "CRADLE" their face and talk to them, I'm sorry but she didn't by any means craddle this girls face and she was screaming at her NOT talking to her. Nothing was done about it, and yes I did report it because it was not right what she did to that girl! Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, some of you think what this teacher did was ok, I disagree. You would seriously tell me that you would let a teacher at a daycare handle your child in this manner? Does my child still go here? Yes he does, fortunately I know his teacher and am not concerned about his saftey. I am however concerned for the 1-2 yr olds in that room with that teacher. And I made that known to them. I haven't heard anything else from them or social services.
I would be horrified if I saw this kind of reaction from a teacher in my child's daycare. I mean, how old are they, 1-2 years old??? Is it right for a parent to hold a child by their face and yell at them?? Certainly not, and many would be very quick to report them if this took place in a public place, so it is certainly wrong for somebody who is in the position of care for this children to do the same thing. I think they need to be reported. Maybe the child is a problem child, but that does not excuse abuse!!! My god, because one of our kids may be a trouble maker, does that mean we can do the same and abuse them. If that was your little boy sitting in the high chair, would you turn your back and let the teacher continue to hold his face and yell abuse at him??? I would hope not, and I am sure your motherly instincts would get you straight in that room and rescue him. SO why should the other kids be allowed to suffer?? If this has happened this once, the teacher may have issues with her own temper and where to draw the line and is no example to the children.
I think I would have felt sick to the stomach all day if I had witnessed that. I know you were taken back, but HOW could you have walked away and left it until the afternoon to attend to?? Why weren't you on the phone all day trying to get someone to address this situation?? I am sure the poor little kid is terrified of going to daycare, and how would the mother feel if she knew??? I think you did the right thing to report it, although I think you should have acted quicker. If it doesn't sit right with you, and if you wouldn;t want that to be your kid, than it is not right. I donlt know where you are, but in Australia the guidelines are so crazy, it may seem, but they are only allowed a limited contact with the children physically, and I am sure that would not fit in to the acceptable criteria.
Why do you leave your son there??? Did you ever hear what happened with the teacher or follow it up?? I would be very concerned if my child was in such a place.
I think I would have felt sick to the stomach all day if I had witnessed that. I know you were taken back, but HOW could you have walked away and left it until the afternoon to attend to?? Why weren't you on the phone all day trying to get someone to address this situation?? I am sure the poor little kid is terrified of going to daycare, and how would the mother feel if she knew??? I think you did the right thing to report it, although I think you should have acted quicker. If it doesn't sit right with you, and if you wouldn;t want that to be your kid, than it is not right. I donlt know where you are, but in Australia the guidelines are so crazy, it may seem, but they are only allowed a limited contact with the children physically, and I am sure that would not fit in to the acceptable criteria.
Why do you leave your son there??? Did you ever hear what happened with the teacher or follow it up?? I would be very concerned if my child was in such a place.
I am appalled at some of the responses to this post who think it's ok to hold a child's face and scream at them! There is no excuse for this. If anyone ever did that to my daughter I would sue their a$$ off. I've seen some very bad children in my time but it's up to the parents to correct that child's behavior and not a teacher or neighbor, whatever. This is clear and out right abuse towards the child.
As for the original poster, you did the right thing in calling the school. If you see something like that again, I would go up to the teacher/child and tell the teacher to remove herself from the situation until she can get control of herself. I would hate to have their jobs (teachers) because so many kids are out of control these days. Then I would stay with that child until you could get a parent to come get her. We need to protect our children from abuse. No wonder children turn to violence and early sex these days.
I am a stay at home mom and watch my daughter like a hawk. She knows that she cannot be disrespectful to other kids or adults. If she did, I would like to know about but I would be extremely angry if someone hurt her.
As for the original poster, you did the right thing in calling the school. If you see something like that again, I would go up to the teacher/child and tell the teacher to remove herself from the situation until she can get control of herself. I would hate to have their jobs (teachers) because so many kids are out of control these days. Then I would stay with that child until you could get a parent to come get her. We need to protect our children from abuse. No wonder children turn to violence and early sex these days.
I am a stay at home mom and watch my daughter like a hawk. She knows that she cannot be disrespectful to other kids or adults. If she did, I would like to know about but I would be extremely angry if someone hurt her.
:( ok I suppose you are correct... I just see so much abuse on the news and tv that is seems as though it is all around us all the time.. BUT.. the original poster also stated she held the little girls face so that there noses were almost touching and she was screaming in the little girls face, I guess my point is, noone, and I mean noone deserves to be screamed at like that. mY 9 year old pushes me sometimes where I could take her and do the same thing, But I dont, I do not want my child to FEAR me, to me screaming like that earns you no respect only fear, and thats no way to live.. (that comes from me who was in a severely abusive marriage for a short time but none the less it took its toll on me).. so with that said, I can SEE your point.. and it does make sense.
Babyprayers - you can't leave a child all day long in someone else's care, ever day of the workweek and not allow them to touch the child. Period. If this child's face was held in such a way that it left no marks, but in fact was a gentle holding (I don't know) as a way of getting the child to understand the gravity of the situation, in my opinion that's a totally acceptable thing to do. That's what a parent would do in the situation of a child repeatedly hurting other children, and that's what a day care worker should do too because there is no parent there. They are acting in loco parentis, in place of parents. The parent can't puppet discipline from across town, or hope to discipline a child effectively some 8 hours later when they come to get them. The day care worker has to do it.
I'm making a lot of suppositions here, that the holding was the kind every mother does to get a child's attention, and that the child was in fact guilty of hurting other children. That may not be the case, and that would be different.
In our daycare society it's a fact of life that if parents aren't there someone else has to be in charge, and not just call and report bad behavior over the phone without doing anything to correct it.
My opinion only.
I'm making a lot of suppositions here, that the holding was the kind every mother does to get a child's attention, and that the child was in fact guilty of hurting other children. That may not be the case, and that would be different.
In our daycare society it's a fact of life that if parents aren't there someone else has to be in charge, and not just call and report bad behavior over the phone without doing anything to correct it.
My opinion only.
I don't think it is ever bad to report someone to social services (unless it is malicious). I work at a daycare and I have been the reporter and the reportee (incidentally, I was reported by the person I reported, which is why I made the comment about malicious reporting)
Anyway, if there is something wrong, then you have reported it and will hopefully keep it from happening again. If there is nothing wrong, then social services will look into the situation and determine that nothing happened. They are the ones who are trained and paid to investigate these types of situations. Not you. DSS depends on other people to report questionable situations so that they can investigate and determine is something is wrong.
Would you have felt better not reporting it and then finding out that the child was being abused repeatedly in that teacher's care?
Anyway, if there is something wrong, then you have reported it and will hopefully keep it from happening again. If there is nothing wrong, then social services will look into the situation and determine that nothing happened. They are the ones who are trained and paid to investigate these types of situations. Not you. DSS depends on other people to report questionable situations so that they can investigate and determine is something is wrong.
Would you have felt better not reporting it and then finding out that the child was being abused repeatedly in that teacher's care?
bottom line is... Dont touch the kids.. she had no right to grab that little girls face as she did. mommy of 2boys35 I think you acted in an appropriate manner. If that was me I would have done the same thing, just think if it was your child, regardless of how bad some kids may be, they are not BAD... just badly behaved. I think you did the right thing, more people to need to get actively involved instead of ignoring this behavior.
I've worked in a daycare before I had my child. It's hard to trust other people with your own child. I can understand why you would be upset upon seeing that situation. But, I agree that if that particular child has behaved badly before and really hurts other kids then, I can see why the teacher took such a dramatic approach to get the point across. It's their job to ensure safety for their whole group of kids. If you felt that strongly about what happened then I agree with you going to management with the problem. As far as keeping your child there, if you feel comforable with his caregivers, I don't see a problem. Not everyone will react the same way. If you felt that strongly, you shouldn't feel bad.
RockRose, I disagree, but only partially.
First of all, the OP only saw the discipline in action, but did not see what the little girl did to receive it. As you said, that child could very well be one of the daycare's "problem kids" and on the verge of being expelled. My son's daycare has a couple "bullies" in his class that have bitten, kicked, punched with a closed fist to the face, and thrown hard toys at my son and other kids. My son has been sent home with bite marks, a puffy cheek, scratch marks and bruises on separate occasions, and the "bullies" are only disciplined by going to time out while they're in daycare, which I don't think works for kids when they're in time out in a corner of the same room for 2-3 minutes, then they can go back to playing, and that's that. Some lesson they learn.
Anyways, a couple months ago his daycare called me to inform me that my son had bitten a kid so hard that he drew a blood blister on the kid. They told me they put him in time out, but I needed to know that he'd injured another kid, and did I want to step in to discipline him while he was in school (i.e., talk to him on the phone or come to the daycare and see him personally)? I was quite pleased at how they handled disciplining him by contacting me to handle his bad behavior that was way more serious than the typical toddler outburst or a swat to another kid or something. I strongly feel that harsh disciplinary action that's necessary as a last resort, such as mild intimidation, physical punishment, or voice-raising, should be *only* for the parents to do and no one else.
I think when a teacher, family friend, extended family member, stranger, etc. steps in to discipline a child in place of the parents when it's clearly unnecessary and innappropriate is wrong. I think it can cause further behavioral problems in the child. The OP said the class the little girl was in was of 1-2 year olds. A teacher, IMO, does not need to be, nor has the right, to physically handle a child's face and shout into a child's face. If she is a "problem child," I think the teacher and daycare staff should remove the child from the room for discipline, sit her in a highchair, call the parents, and if the parents don't attempt to do anything to help fix the problem their child is causing, then the daycare should expell the child. Quick and easy, problem solved for the daycare and the kids in the class that were being bullied.
What I would have done was the same thing as the OP up to the point of leaving a letter. When I'd gotten the phone call, I would have made my statement about harsh discipline being up to the parents, not them. Then I would have asked to speak with that teacher personally and let her know how upset I was. From there, I would have told that teacher and the management staff that if ever I saw an incident like that again (which I'd be super observant about it now), I'd withdraw my son, report them to social services, and spread the news word-of-mouth to as many people as possible of the innappropriate disciplinary environment the daycare staff subjects the children to.
I would have given that warning first, because the little girl was obvioulsly not injured, so I'd give the benefit of the doubt *just once* before reporting them. At least then they'd know someone was watching and they'd be more motivated to revise their discipline techniques if needed.
First of all, the OP only saw the discipline in action, but did not see what the little girl did to receive it. As you said, that child could very well be one of the daycare's "problem kids" and on the verge of being expelled. My son's daycare has a couple "bullies" in his class that have bitten, kicked, punched with a closed fist to the face, and thrown hard toys at my son and other kids. My son has been sent home with bite marks, a puffy cheek, scratch marks and bruises on separate occasions, and the "bullies" are only disciplined by going to time out while they're in daycare, which I don't think works for kids when they're in time out in a corner of the same room for 2-3 minutes, then they can go back to playing, and that's that. Some lesson they learn.
Anyways, a couple months ago his daycare called me to inform me that my son had bitten a kid so hard that he drew a blood blister on the kid. They told me they put him in time out, but I needed to know that he'd injured another kid, and did I want to step in to discipline him while he was in school (i.e., talk to him on the phone or come to the daycare and see him personally)? I was quite pleased at how they handled disciplining him by contacting me to handle his bad behavior that was way more serious than the typical toddler outburst or a swat to another kid or something. I strongly feel that harsh disciplinary action that's necessary as a last resort, such as mild intimidation, physical punishment, or voice-raising, should be *only* for the parents to do and no one else.
I think when a teacher, family friend, extended family member, stranger, etc. steps in to discipline a child in place of the parents when it's clearly unnecessary and innappropriate is wrong. I think it can cause further behavioral problems in the child. The OP said the class the little girl was in was of 1-2 year olds. A teacher, IMO, does not need to be, nor has the right, to physically handle a child's face and shout into a child's face. If she is a "problem child," I think the teacher and daycare staff should remove the child from the room for discipline, sit her in a highchair, call the parents, and if the parents don't attempt to do anything to help fix the problem their child is causing, then the daycare should expell the child. Quick and easy, problem solved for the daycare and the kids in the class that were being bullied.
What I would have done was the same thing as the OP up to the point of leaving a letter. When I'd gotten the phone call, I would have made my statement about harsh discipline being up to the parents, not them. Then I would have asked to speak with that teacher personally and let her know how upset I was. From there, I would have told that teacher and the management staff that if ever I saw an incident like that again (which I'd be super observant about it now), I'd withdraw my son, report them to social services, and spread the news word-of-mouth to as many people as possible of the innappropriate disciplinary environment the daycare staff subjects the children to.
I would have given that warning first, because the little girl was obvioulsly not injured, so I'd give the benefit of the doubt *just once* before reporting them. At least then they'd know someone was watching and they'd be more motivated to revise their discipline techniques if needed.
Mommy, I'd say it depends on the actual situatiion. Is it possible this is a child who hits a LOT, and actually hurts other children (not just like a slapping hit, but maybe she keeps decking children with big toys?) and is on the verge of being kicked out of that daycare for her aggressive behavior? If that's the case, I honestly don't think that's over the top, to deal with her that way.
When you look up and down this board it's full of parents saying they have no control over their preschoolers. Sometimes, it takes this kind of reaction to teach kids who won't cut it out, to cut it out. If the child didn't actually hit the other child, or was reacting defensively for being attacked by another kid, that's another thing.
When I read this board, I get so weary of parents saying they don't know how to teach a small child to behave. What that day care worker was doing, maybe, was necessary.
When you look up and down this board it's full of parents saying they have no control over their preschoolers. Sometimes, it takes this kind of reaction to teach kids who won't cut it out, to cut it out. If the child didn't actually hit the other child, or was reacting defensively for being attacked by another kid, that's another thing.
When I read this board, I get so weary of parents saying they don't know how to teach a small child to behave. What that day care worker was doing, maybe, was necessary.
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