Me Again- Dead End

[ANS04]

It has been awhile since I updated.

My son has had good days and bad at school. Today was bad...he hit a child in his class...he did it because that child took his dinosaur. Instead of suspending him the principal chose to keep him with her all day. After spending many hours with him she felt compelled to call me. She said that she feels my son is perfectly capable and confident...the reason he requires one on one attention...he can not stay focused...easily distracted...she said it pains her because she can tell he is crying out for help...he wants to behave and do well...she said his classmates were happy he wasnt in class and commented how quiet the class is without him. Anyways, we are FINALLY putting a 504 plan in place. It took some serious convincing with his Father...but he gave in.

The reality is that just about everyone believes my son has ADD...I myself believe this to be true. However, his Father refuses to accept this reality. He continues to say we just need to be old fashioned and be tough on him...drill it in to him...he will out grow this. I feel like he has been saying this for years...

Anyways...let me get to my point...the 504 plan will help my son academically...but it will not help him with his impulsiveness or lack of social skills. I feel like I have tried everyting...I have been at this for two years...I am consistent, stay on schedule, keep him stimulated, give him outlets for his energy, firm and direct, clear expectations/rules...

I just dont know what else to do. Most my family feels he needs medication...I personally am not 100% there...but even if I wanted to explore the option of medication...my son's Father would never ever ever go for it. EVER!

I feel helpless...what else can I do...how can I help my son...what other avenue can be taken to help a child with ADD? The principle is very sad/concerned about his situation with peers.

Help!

[benjimom]

Yes, when a child is being aggressive and when you spank him it makes things so much worse.  Spanking is not effective on my son.  The usual discipline techniques usually do not work on these types of children.  

[benjimom]

Yes he is going to have good/bad days, believe me, I'm going thru a similiar situation so I KNOW what you feel. IT's terrible to get bad reports.  My son is one on one right now, actually today had a good day!!  My family is like yorus they keep saying Why dont you try him on some medications and see how he does.  But it's easy for them to say that and tehy are not the ones puitting them on the meds and they don't know the side effects, etc.  Lay people often don't understand, I have to get a prescription and a diagnosis and I can't just go get it walmart and also these medications are not magic.  

I have come to the conclusion that my son needs help and I need higher expertise so toward the end of the month I am taking him to a child psychiatrist. I don't know what else to do.  They say teh one I have chosen is very conservative in his diagnosis and medication mgmt.

I find pickup to be a tough time, what did he do today? or not do.

Then today my neighbros came over, I live in a townhome and said their dog barks every afternoon and they think it's b/c of my son. I told them we are not home every afternoon. so now I am responsible for a dog barking.  My son is a kid and unfortunately kids can be loud at times much to everyone's dismay, but we don't party all night or do stuff like that. I feel lately like i cannot win!!  

[ANS04]

Sometimes I read your comments and think YES exactly...dropping my son off at school brings me so many emotions...sadness, anxiety, worry...and it can be very lonely...

I am hoping to learn better what is clearly an impulsive behavior with my son, a gray area and then just blatant bad behavior. I have focused so much on other aspects of ADHD but not the part about what is out of their control. Sandman do you have any light to shine on this? It would help my fiance and I be able to discipline more effectively.

I once watched an episode of the Duggars (19 kids and counting)...and I remember seeing Mrs. Duggar take all her kids and leave a grocery store because she had warned them if they didnt behave they would go right back to the van...and all I could think is if this woman can follow through with what she says (with lots of kids)...then I can follow through with just one kid. LOL! I definitely need to follow through...

Thanks again for the great info...info I already knew...but needed to be reminded of.

*hug*

[specialmom]

Good, and I'm sorry about the incident last Friday.  It really is so hard to be a parent when your child is struggling so.  I was thinking about things today as I walked my son to the bus stop.  We were waiting and I was sending him off for his day.  Most parents just do that without a care in the world.  I used to take my boy to school feeling like I was waiting for the other foot to drop.  It was so hard and I was always anxious.  I'm sure you feel that way.  I also felt very lonely because of it all.  So I am glad that your fiance is being supportive and hope you have people to talk and vent to as needed.  I didn't have too many myself, to be honest.  

I'm with you on discipline.  First if you have a child that shows aggression, it is crazy to think that showing him aggression in discipline is going to help him.  That is my opinion.  Spanking is as old as time and some people swear by it.  I've never done it.  I am not sure why it is, but my children understand my authority over them.  I'm the keeper of all good things in the home, for one.  I run their days and they are aware of this.  I'm very loving torwards my kids and making my disapproval known has had more affect than anything else.  If I'm mad just by changing my tone, my kids usually respond to it. I do what I say.  I give a warning and then I follow through.  If I say we are going to leave if my son yells and then he yells.  I pack us up immediately and leave.  By doing that all along, my kids know I mean business.  The consequences for their actions are logical.  If they throw a toy, the toy is taken away.  Always, no exceptions.  If they fight over a toy, no one plays with it.  That kind of thing.  

I'm aware what is sensory and not for my son.  I don't punish him for throwing a fit about washing his hands.  That he can't help.  But he is in trouble if he slugs his brother.  If he bumps into another kid, that is grey area and we work it out.  

But I think you are doing a good job.  Just keep trying and don't give up hope that it can and WILL get better.  Contact me anytime if you need anything or just need to vent.  goodl uck

[ANS04]

By the way my son's Father is not my husband...never was.

My Fiance is actually showing a lot of concern for my son's well being...and helping with the ADHD...wants to do whatever it takes.

[ANS04]

Great advice...about acting out social situations/scenarios. I went to the library and got books about how to treat our friends and the such. I also got the book Sandman suggested.

I am torn about how to properly discipline my son. I don't believe in spanking/yelling. I normally express my disappointment in his choices and we talk about what happened and how it could have been handled better. Then I give a consequence...like no TV or no scooter. BUT my son's Father is very harsh...spanking...yelling...putting my son down...he feels my son needs to have fear and be intimidated. But doesn't that just teach him that behavior...and then he will turn around and treat others that same way?

I found out today...amazing to me that this slipped through the cracks...my son actually hit one child and slapped another on Friday...they sent a letter in his background...I never got that...he ripped it up...said he didn't want me to know he had a bad day...or be upset with him...he actually got in school suspension for a full week. I found this all out this morning. Needless to say they will be calling me from hear on out.

My son's Father is aware of the school's position...he has been at the meetings...gotten the calls...he just won't accept any of it...he lives in his own reality.

Im definitely going to press forward with OT and implementing strategies from the book Sandman suggested.

[specialmom]

I think that I would go over and over the social skills like it is your mission.  We literally worked on it every day for 6 months and continue to work on it.  This will be really key to your child's peer interaction.  Try all the different games with the emotions and facial expressions---------  my son gets it too.  But it is the repitition that brings on the ability to use it when  he is overwhelmed at school.  It is a very big deal to my son to NOT interrupt his school mates.   He's learned that to be a good friend, you must be consious of others.  And at the preschool level (just had my younger sons review) they start looking for kids to work out conflict with peers with appropriate words.  You may need to really treat your child as if (whether he does or not) he knows nothing.  Get extremely basic.  Act out scenarios with peers at home and SHOW him how to handle it.  Make him practice.  At least that is what I would do.  

I also want to throw in one thing that I always tried to differentiate.  I'm sure you do this . . . but although my child has a delay that could cause certain behavior at times, I was intollerant of certain things.  He was not to ever lay a hand on another and delay or not, he felt my wrath.  I never have spanked my kids but my son clearly got my disappointment.  So I just say that because getting your son to the point in which he just knows that physical contact can't happen would be good.  


I thought sandman had some wise and interesting advice.  What if you let him take the calls for a period of time and deal with the school?  It would be much harder to deny a situation.  And at some point, if he is medicated at your home and not his, at least half the week he would have better days.  Your husband may see that and then realize that the meds are working.  Like I said, I don't like medication in kids, at all.  But at some point, it would be worth it. It may have to come to that.  I'm sorry as that adds an additonal layer of stress to it all.

As far as occupational therapists-------  well, I'd ask the school principal if she knows any good practices.  Get some names and then get out your phone book and call.  Have your insurance info handy on that first call and ask if they accept your insurance.  They'll let you know and then you can find out the particulars of your own policy.  

I wish you a lot of luck.  For now, more good days than bad is good, right?  Hang in there.  

[ANS04]

Thanks for the comments.

My son and I have worked on emotion faces...we have a poster at home...he is very aware of the different range of motions.

We talk about friends...his thoughts on friends...but I guess I haven't dug in like specialmom is describing. Ill work on this.

I am used to the good and bad days by now...I think now I am feeling helpless...yes what I do at home has helped...but he has so far to go...and I worry about how all of this is affecting him.

The principle did talk to both kids...they apologized to each other...but because my son hit...he either had to be suspended or stay with the principle. She felt it more important for him to stay in school.

The thing with my son's Father...he has read in depth about ADD/ADHD...in depth about medications...he is very aware of the condition...in the past he had admitted to me he feels he has ADD but always coped with it. All that said...he refuses to accept our son has ADD/ADHD.

I have not read any books...I started feeling extremely ill and dizzy...was out of it for about 2 weeks...anyways...severe anemia...couldn't focus on anything...but im getting better...so today I will get to the bookstore and start reading.

How do I find a place that offers occupational therapy within my insurance? What is it categorized under?

[Sandman2]

   Thank you for posting, I was wondering how it was going.  And by the way, its not a dead-end, just a freking, mindnumbing detour.
   I have been where your principal has been.  It's gotta be driving her nuts too.  Many times where the parent refused to acknowledge ADHD,I realized that they had it themselves and felt that somehow because they toughed it out, the kid can too.  What they never seem to realize is how much the kid suffers until they are able to cope with it.  The statistics of self medicating people with ADHD is very sad.  Universally, it is because they did not know how to cope with it.  By the way, what your principal did was wonderful.  Only thing that bothers me is that your son could wind up looking to spend time with her instead of in the class.  It would have been great if she had pulled both kids together and talked about it - and then after awhile released your son back to class.  
  Specialmom has a very good suggestion about working with your child at home.  What he needs to learn are those social skills she suggested.  If you can work on those at home, while the school is doing the same thing - it will be reinforced until it is second nature.  It doesn't happen overnight, but it will.
  Back to the childs father.  Has the principal and the school psyc talked to him about ADHD and how to work with it?  I also wonder (in a worse case scenario ) what would happen if they start suspending your child to him.  He has to interrupt his day and come down and pick him up.  All in all, he eventually will come around, I just hope its not to late.  His methods will not work.  They will only make things worse.  Hopefully, he will be able to figure that out.  But it is going to take a professional to lay it on the line to him.  Medication wise - nope sure how the legal system works.  Can you give it to him while in your care - and he doesn't?  I have seen numerous posts which seem to indicate that this is going on.
  Anyway back to the things you can deal with.  Social skills can be worked on as specialmom has noted.  The two years you have been working to help your son have helped!  Trouble is ADHD is a life long disorder.  The impulsiveness is really hard at this age (heck Michael Phelps is still having problems).  The good news is that the school recognizes why he is being impulsive - that's HUGE!  It will make a great difference in how they treat him.
  I think that of the books I recommended to you, I would get  "The ADD/ ADhD Answer book." , by Susan Ashley.  Its the shortest, most direct book with a lot of strategies that will help you help him.
  Finally, and I really want this to sound positive - you (and the school) are laying the foundation.  You are off to a good start.  But a house cannot be built overnight.  It will take time.  There will always be off days.  Deal with it, teach him how to deal with it, and move on.  By the time your new children arrive, the school should be in a help mode (compared to a punish mode) with your son.  Let them deal with him at school.  Try to reinforce at home the behaviors you  and the school want.  Enjoy all of your kids!

[specialmom]

Sorry to hear of this.  I think it is important to remember that when a child has a developmental delay or such that they will have good days with a few bad ones too.  But it still is painful as a mother.  No one wants to hear about peer issues.  I was there a few years ago and it crushed me for my child if you know what I mean.  It left a lasting impression upon both my child and myself.  

Glad you are going with the 504 plan.  Think that is smart and I didn't realize dad was what was standing in the way.  Sometimes you will have to be your child's advocate even with his own family.  But hopefully things will help.

Couple of questions-------   have you read any of the books that Sandman suggested?  They sound full of information with ways to deal with a child that potentially has add/adhd at school and at home.  

Have you talked to your son about friends?  I mean really talked to him as in this is a problem.  A good friend does not make it so their friends can't do their work.  A good friend does not lay hands on a friend.  A good friend makes sure his friends can hear the teacher.  I mean really drill it into him.  My child responded to this because he really wants to have friends and be a good friend.  We got kind of on a base level and taught friendship skills and you are going to have to.  Social cues such as facial expression-------  cut out pictures from magazines and have him identify them.  Then he acts the emotion out as well.  You role play the emotion and he identifies it and then he role plays it back to you.  My kid did lots of this--------  he was in a camp with 5 to 7 year olds in which they practiced this stuff over and over.  

Everyone will have their own say to this------  but I'd get an eval at an occupational therapist and see if they think ot will help him.  Your insurance may cover part or all of it.  The focas and peer issues are two things we work directly on.  They cover those issues.  The social skills class had kids with aspergers, add/adhd and sensory so I know they help all kinds of diagnosis.  

The person who started the occupational therapy institute where we go told us today that 6 is kind of a magic number.  That many kids get more control at 6.  I hope that is true for your child.  

I don't know what to tell you about medication.  If I'd tried many other things and all things indicated my child needed medication, I'd do it to be honest.  But not until after 6 (which is the age that psych practices in our area will begin to diagnosis add/adhd.  they don't diagnosis until the earliest of 6).  I don't know what to tell you about the interaction with your ex.  Hopefully you two can work together.  Your kid is depending on it.   good luck and may the 504 help.