Two four year olds exploring with putting their penis' on each other bottoms

[RMS123]

On Thanksgiving my 12 year old daughter overheard my four year old son saying to his four year old male nephew "let me put my penis in your butt" while playing in the bedroom along with my two year old son. My daughter came to the kitchen and told me immediately and I went into the room to find both four year olds with their pants down and my two year old with no pants nor his diaper on. They were scrambling to pull up their pants. My sister and I seperated them to talk with them about what they were doing. After all talks it was determined that it was my nephew's idea to remove their pants, my son's idea as to where to "put their penis' " and all of them had sniffed each other's penis'. Both older boys swear that they did not get the idea from anyone and that my four year old came up with it. It was a "game". I have went down every possible way to ask carefully that nothing has ever happened to him at the hands of anyone. It seems clear that it was just exploration but I am concerned at where he got the idea of where to put his penis.
My four year old has been pretty obsessed with his bottom. Bending over to pass gas or pretending to be peeing on stuff  is a fun pasttime for him even though it is discoraged. He has touched his bottom and smelled it or just pretended to put toys up his anus. Also saying "butt", "poop", "penis" or any of those words are all good fun for him and his brother.
Today I was watching the same nephew as the Thanksgiving incident and it happened again only this time they both actually put their penis' ON each other's bottoms. They were alone for maybe five minutes. When asked what happened my son asked me "how much did you see?". I told him I saw everything but wanted to hear from him what he was doing. He said told me that it was his idea and he just wanted to do it. I again asked him if anyone had ever tried to "play a game" like that with him or if anyone had touched him, asked him to keep secrets etc. Again the answer was no but this time he did say that the neighbor boy (age 7) pulled down his own pants and told him to touch him with his foot.
I seperated the boys, called my sister and ended up having grandma come to pick up my nephew. We told them that they had been told before what was appropriate and that they were told not to do that again so they could not play together if they could not follow the rules. They were not being punished for what they did rather for not following the rules.
My sister and brother-in-law are insistant that something has been done to my son. While I am very concerned with his behavior, after talking to him I do not feel that this is the case. My brother-in-law does not want them around each other anymore and wishes to file charges against my son so that the problem will be investigated. I have called my pediatrician and am awaiting a call back.
A little about my family dynamic:
My husband and I have been apart for almost two years. He immediately got a new girlfriend with three kids ages 13 (girl) , 8 and 6 (both boys). When I told my husband about Thanksgiving he was not concerned and said that his GF's boys had done stuff like that to each other such as drawing circles around each other's buttholes, playing doctor, touching and "normal" stuff like that. My four year old says that thos boys have not done anything to him.
My neighbor is my babysitter. She is the parent of the 7 year old who asked my son to touch him with his foot. My boys are not over there very often, maybe twice a month for a few hours. Not gonna happen anymore.
They do not go to daycare. Only my sister and my mother watches them outside of the neighbor.
To my knowledge they have never seen any sexually explicit things nor have they walked in on any private bedroom time at their father's house (I do plan to ask him when he comes for them tomorrow).
Any advice? Any suggestions? Any thoughts? All would be appreciated. Thank you.

[Carolina2806]

I'm sorry to hear that your brother-in-law wants to file charges; I think that is a bit extreme. I know this must be a stressful time for you.  I don't really have any advice for you, but your post sounded like you are searching for answers and dealing with a lot right now.  Your son might just be innocently exploring things. Or maybe something did happen to him, but he is afraid to tell you.  Whatever it is, it will come out in time.  I do hope that your brother-in-law changes his mind.
Good luck to you.

[savik]

I think filing charges is inappropriate because your son did not mean to hurt the other boy. And he is just a boy.  He has seen something or has been abused.  I think Teko is right about taking him to a doctor to see if he has been abused.

[kadkee]

I do not think that you son is the only one to blame. You stated that it was the nephews idea about the pulling down the pants, but your sons as to where to put them. In this case your nephew is just as much to blame as your son not saying anything bad I just think that filing charges would be a little outragous. Also I wanted to let you know that this has happened with my oldest son. He is now 3 but this happen while he was two. Him and my cousins 2 year old son where at my house playing one day and they are really hipped up boys if they are quite for even a second something is up. Anyway, we had noticed that it was all quite in my sons room so my husband and I decided we would supprise them thinging to catch them writing on walls or what ever. Anyways much to my supprise we walk in to them both sitting on the closet floor with each others hands on each others penises. My husband was embrassed and speechless as to what to say and I screamed in shock. My cousin came running in to see what was wrong and she snatched her son up and said I can not believe you (talking to her son) and took him to the front room and yelled at him and started whipping him. My husband and I thought that was crazy so I took my son and sat him down and asked him why. He told me that Ashton wanted to (the other boy). I said did he say why and my son said no. I went and told my cousin what my son told me and she asked her son. He said that his daddy made him put his in his mouth and she started to cry and held him really close. That same moment the police where at his door arresting him. The moral of the story is do not punish the child (either of them) until the whole story is told and you are down at the bottom of it all. Since then my son has had issues with his behavior. I have talk to his docter about this and he just told me that he may be able to forget it if it still progrees then counsiling will be needed. So far that has almost came to a stop now his anger problem is out of control. I feel this has nothing to do with each other, Good luck.

[ethan452]

I can't believe that happened.  That is unreal. I'm glad they got the guy for doing that.
RMS123 I think your son should see someone because you never know...

[momagain59]

I would bet that at least one of these children has been touched sexually by someone. My first suspects would be your x's girlfriends sons. It is not normal to draw circles around anyones anus. What about your X? Could he have done anything like this to your son and those other boys? He really seems like it is nothing to him. This doesn't seem like a normal response from a man.

My great nephew came over angry one day when I was watching him. His Mom told me that she had caught him and his sister messing around and he was mad. I asked him, "Why are you so angry?" and his response floored me. He said, "I don't see why we got in trouble and Don (Mom's boyfriend) didn't." He continued to talk and told me how Don was the one that taught him the game (pee pee in the butt game) and he should be in trouble too. Well I responded as I should have and that boyfriend is gone.

I would get your son in therapy asap. In order to be able to protect your son, you may need a therapist to testify in court for you someday. Sometimes things may seem so innocent but until you find out all of the details you really can't tell.