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Wrong meds? wrong diagnosis?
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Wrong meds? wrong diagnosis?

I have been working with my daughter on behavioral  and emotional issues since she was 3 yrs old. Before this time developmentally she was advanced. (crawling (4 months), standing (6 months), walking (7months), talking - one words 6 1/2 months-  sentences by 10 months), potty trained (1 1/2 yrs). Behavior wise she was great and would ask a lot of questions. at times a little demanding but nothing more then the average child at the age of 2.

It was a month before her 3rd birthday she fell down the 4 cement steps. She broke the small bones in the back of her nose and had a big welt on her right forehead. (i was at work when this happened. Her father put her down for a nap with out taking her to the ER) when I returned home to find her face extremely swollen and black eyes I took her the ER. they did not do a brain scan. The ER dr only looked into her nose and eyes. (only thing he said was her nose could effect her breathing when she got older.)

2 months later..... her behavior changed. she became rude, extremely aggressive (tipping over tables to trying to stab the cat with a fork), lying, fits of tantrums which far beyond what I had seen before. She started to display sexualized behavior and swearing. Not small words.. She dropped the "F" bomb in fits of rage. Very forgetful, can't remember what she did for the day or  when I ask her to repeat something, she can not. she does not interrupt  correctly what is said. she is impulsive, obsessive at times and will over react to something small. She can not make connections to her own behavior but if she is playing with my niece or nephew and they do something wrong she will give them a time out. She now is manipulative, steals, deceitful and malicious.  Some of her behavior is a normal 12 yr old yet some behavior is like she is still stuck in being 3yrs old. But I am worried because malicious behavior is new and so calculated and sneaky.

Over the course of 9 yrs 1,2,3 magic, I have done time outs in a quiet room, rewards for good behavior, taking things away; earning things back, giving 2 choices  a few minutes to decide which she will choose, positive feed back (you did a great job calming down or wow great job how does that make you feel?), explain punishment for behavior, if she refuses to do something and she is watching tv I will turn it off and let her know she can watch it when she is finished with what I asked her to do. Now she refuses to go to her room and will walk out of the house. She is too strong for me to take her to her room and she often will strike out at me (punching, kicking, slapping, pinching...)

Maybe I am fetching here but I cant help but think her behavior is connected to her fall. All diagnoses were made with out knowing the behavior change from when she fell. There is mental illness that runs in the family on her fathers side. Her diagnosis has been anything from ADD to Bipolar and ODD, anxiety and depression with possible PDD. Yet its speculation- symptoms. Medications do not work. the only medication that seemed to allow her to express when she was over whelmed was for ADD, but when it was switched to the time release it no longer worked. Antidepressants add to her aggression.

Am I reaching to ask her Dr to do a Spect scan on her? I have read some amazing things about the scans which can produce pictures of the brain which shows area that are over or under active. Also TBI or ADD (ring of fire) I feel like if they can get a look at her brain then they could understand which areas are preventing her to make the connections so therapy and medication can be introduced to help focus and tools can be given to learn things. . Rather then over medicating of symptoms...

(8 yrs of therapy has not made difference- I think some improvements are through maturity but her behavior stays the same when in a fit of rage)Now tools are given in therapy but she just is not making the connection

Any thoughts on this would be appreciated.

Thanks you!

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4 Comments Post a Comment
590454 tn?1218812436
i know exactly how you feel.  my son is 10 and experiencing the same exact thing.  only he hasnt fell like your child has.  he has been diagnosed with adhd anxiety odd ptsd factor 5 blood disorder and trichotillomania (hair pulling).  I am in the same search for his medicine issues also.  i am trying to see if a mood stablizer of some sort will help him as it has helped me in the past.  i have been through behavior therapy myself and see where he could benefit from it.  i think if they are willing to embrace this, they can learn to control their anger.  i have been working on breaking this down to his level so he can embrace this and move on.  the part about the memory lapses is normal for folks that are unbalanced.  as for my experience, i had to have a mood stablizer in order to focus, and also calm my seizure like symptoms.  it more or less calms you down.  helps to think clearly.  if you have any other questions you could email me at katelynn_2***@****.
13167 tn?1327197724
CP,  a couple thoughts.  I think a scan would be a good idea - why do you say that all her diagnoses were made by people who didn't know about her behavior change?  Were these diagnoses made without any input from you?

Secondly,  when a 3 year old drops the F bomb when she rages,  she is mirroring her environment.  It is no character flaw for a 3 year old to do that - she's copying someone (something?) she's watching.  Who else acts like that in her world?  

Are you 100% sure she fell down the steps,  and she wasn't abused?  Did she have other bruises indicating a fall - scraped knee,  hips,  elbows,  etc?

Last thought,  when you have a child who is both verbally and physically so far above the average bar,  it's hard to tell what "normal" should be for her.  A child who walks at 7 months is so far ahead of average in both impulsiveness and drive that it's hard to say whether all this aggression and impulsiveness isn't just part of her character.

Best wishes.  This sounds like a really hard situation to deal with.
Avatar n tn
Thanks for the reply.

She has been on mood stabilizers for about 4 yrs and although it takes a small edge off it does not change anything.

Therapy for 8-9 yrs has been hard because she can not make the connections with different tools we are constantly teach.

She has been in residential 2 times first when she was 7 diagnoses with possible PTSD for 2 months and then again in Sept 06 for a yr. PTSD has been part of one diagnose and also Bipolar (her father is diagnosed with Bipolar). She does display some behavior of Bipolar but many of the same symptoms are also shared with ADD (ring of fire)

Anxiety appears as defiant. I can only explain her behavior as if she is this balloon. Its like her behavior starts to blow this balloon up and it build and builds till finally it pops, when it pops (normally at the end of her fit of rage) she will melt, show remorse and cry. She will want a hug and apologize. But while the balloon is building up there is nothing you can do to stop it. redirecting does not work. Its like this tunnel vision which is only focused on her racing thoughts.

All of the tools given to re-adapt or to self modify does not work. In her rage I have either been the target of her violent acts or end up replacing door jams, windows, fixing holes in the walls  or other things broken. Little things can trigger her.

something is blocking the normal connections.

every day its something.

I have to constantly tell her she needs to stop and listen first before she reactions. its so impulsive and over reactive.

There are many services I have involved. We all are working on the same things with her. But like I keep saying there is something that is preventing the connections.

Thanks again for your thoughts.
Avatar n tn
I say the Dr did not know about the behavior change to that degree because I completely forgot about it. A few months ago I had to do an assignment for one of my pysch classes on the life span of a character from conception to death. As I was looked through my daughters baby book for ideas on how to begin my assignment I read her fall and the behavior difference. Because I had forgotten all about this I had not shared the degree of the behavior changes. I said the behavior changed when she was 3 with out the fall.

It was a fall. She had scraps on her face from the cement and her swollen face was from her falling on her nose and black eyes. And the welt on her forehead also had scraps on the lump. the palm of her hand was scuffed. According to her father she was walking down the steps looking at a photograph when she tripped. They were very steep, high steps and unlevel.

G rated tv shows only and limited at that growing up. When she was in Daycare there was a child that was uncontrollable - had a horrible mouth on him- when I went to get my daughter one time a staff member and this child were in the hall way and the child was in a hold. He called me a "**** and a *****" Never heard him say the F word.
I never used the word around her and I know her father never swore. I have no idea where she could have picked it up.

I agree that she was advanced. Everything with her learning was always at the same speed. She always would figure how things went together. Even her sippy cup. Her learning was above but her behavior was the same as other children with interacting and playing. she would make friends on the play ground easily and would interact well with them. she was not aggressive or rude. she was very helpful and used her manners. she was a ham and loved to make people smile and laugh.

after she turned 3, she became rude stopped using manners and even if in line at the store and someone said "how beautiful" she would scream and yell telling them not to look at her. She went from being sweet and adorable to fits of rage and her interaction with children changed. she became selfish, bossy and demanding. a few times she tried to choke her friend. Her learning changed and her attention change also.

Many things I have lived through, I can say this is the hardest.
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