Bone strength improvement advise PLEASE

[Cherie762]

My neck was that of a "80" year old had surgery all is well do not want another surgery I am 47 had a hysterectomy, so no estrogen, also have hypertyroidism. What can i do to promote good bone health. I am taking 1000 IU of vitamin D, how much calcium should I take i eat lots of yougert cheese, dont drink milk but willing to start if so advised, I want a stronger skeleton. Open to all options my drs doing a discogram and I may need reclast infusion would like other options !!!

[Paxiled]

Milk is the worst thing you can do.  Have you had your bone density checked?  That's the first step.  Most Americans get tons of calcium, what they don't get is a balance of magnesium and calcium, and too much calcium leaches magnesium out of the body.  Bone health is a question of mineral balance, so the best place to start is green leafy vegetables, including seaweed, such as broccoli, kale, collards, and the like, and eat the hard stems, too, they have most of the calcium.  And cook them, none of these are digestible raw unless you juice them.  If you like raw, try spinach, but moderately, as it has an acid that breaks down calcium absorption, and dandelion greens, parsely -- again, green leafy vegetables.  Beyond that, there are bone building formulas made by many good companies.  Best thing is to consult with a good holistic nutritionist who can help you with this.  These ideas are just a start.

[Cherie762]

my dr seems to think a discogram, xray of vertebrae w contrast is better than a bone density gonna get one more opinion before I do that. Is there a blood test to determine mineral defficencys should i get that? I am a veggie eat tons of beans, not tried the roots you mentioned other than I eat broccoli weekly, willing to try them though! thanks so for the info.How about dark greens like collerd greens or such cooked?

[Paxiled]

I don't think I mentioned any roots, just greens, including collards.  It also might be that being a vegetarian might not be the best way to eat for you.  That has to do with many things, including digestion, ethnic background, blood type, etc.  For example, fish with bones in it, like sardines or canned salmon, are very good sources of both fish oil and calcium.  But this is complicated, and that's why I suggested a holistic nutritionist -- they can treat who you are, not who anybody else is, and yes, you can be tested for mineral deficiency, but to be accurate you really have to be tested over a period of time since that balance will change with the passing of hours, distance from a meal, and with the passing of days, as we don't eat the same thing every day.  Same with hormones; a test at one point in time won't tell you anything, and we know hormonal balance has a lot to do with bone strength.  A good nutritionist will try to balance hormones as well.  A lot goes into bone density -- vitamins, minerals -- one called boron that few know about is essential for proper bone development, for example -- and even herbs -- comfrey root helps damaged bones heal.  The complexity is why I recommend a nutritionist.

[Cherie762]

Ty so very much you sound very knowlegable about this. I will read up some on line and look into a nutritionalist. I like the idea of healthy eating far better than being put in more meds!

[FurballsMom]

In addition to everything Paxiled already mentioned, I would recommend going to mercola.com and use his search engine for his archive articles about vitamin D.  The reason I mention this is because the RDA for vitamin D is still set too low.  The best source for the right amount of vitamin D is from the sun, of course, because the body knows how to make the right amount without excess when getting vitamin D from the sun.  Most people don't get enough sun exposure even when they live where there are plenty of sunny days where they live.  I'm one who has difficulty with the sun, since I burn so easily, so it's necessary for me to take much more natural vitamin D 3 than it might be for someone else.  Anyway, he explains this with authority and his archive articles also have some links to the Vitamin D Counsel with even more information.  I am so glad my naturopath recommended getting my vitamin D tested, because that's how I discovered how severely deficient I was to begin with.  I'm one who needs to have my levels tested regularly, since I'm dealing with autoimmune issues and can't get all I need from sun exposure.

[Myown]

Hi cherie,
If you research natural progesterone cream, you may want to give it a try or discuss it with your doctor. The Emerita website is one of the sites that sells it.

MO

[Cherie762]

You know smothing its so odd you mentioned this last night i clicked on one of these "adds" on this site that lead me to a progestrone creme, I had a hyster about 5 years ago, complete, I am seriously going to try this,

[Myown]

Good, it's worth checking out.

Dr. John Lee wrote an EXCELLENT book "What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Menopause."

It's very-very interesting. I don't know what is recommended if a woman has a hyster because don't they usually want women to then take Estrogen? But I really don't know much about this subject, but then again,it  doesn't seem the doctors know enough either;o)  I think a womans body is much more complicated than a mans body.

I know taking "estrogen" scares most women (would scare me) because if our body doesn't utilize "our own" estrogen - that can in itself cause cancer, but I don't know much at all about what happens as far as hormones when a women has a hyster......

John Lee mentions that a womans estrogen can be within the normal range,,,BUT if her progesterone level is low, she is considered "estrogen dominate" and that can cause problems....It's all one big pain in the neck......its almost like we need a degree in medicine because our doctors aren't always the greatest help.

But maybe check out Dr. Lee's book. I read it quite a while ago and I had a saliva test and found my progesterone was very low. So bone loss can become a problem, but worse- cancer if estrogen dominate - and thats why my mother has cancer - too much estrogen in her body - so the doc had her on estrogen blockers - femora, but that caused problems too...

But good luck and maybe research more and talk to your doc before you make any changes....FYI Dr. lee also has a book that he recommends for Physicians to read. I was going to buy it and give it to my doctor, but I guess I forgot to because I just remembered now ;o)

Take care and good luck,
MO

[Paxiled]

Too much estrogen is common in industrialized countries, especially the US.  That's because, in addition to the ordinary imbalances women suffer, so many of the chemicals we've allowed industry to introduce in vast quantities into our environment are estrogenic.  That includes pesticides, many petroleum products, just a whole array.  And then there are the hormones put into much of our animal food, just to make sure it wasn't only vegetarians with the pesticides and fungicides suffering from this.  That's why progesterone is regarded as so important by the holistic healing community.  However, keep in mind that not all these creams are the same.  Some have estrogenic substances in them as well as progesterenic -- for example, you'll often find black cohosh in them alongside the "natural" progesterone synthesized from a molecule in the Mexican wild yam that looks very similar to human hormones and can be altered very easily in the laboratory.  Much milder than current pharmaceutical treatments, and was in fact the original pharmaceutical hormone treatment method until they invented completely synthetic forms that could cause harm to women -- wouldn't want them to get better all the way, where's the money in that?

[Myown]

Yup, agree with everything you've said. But most people don't realize all of this....and another thing is, it amazes me that many people think Flouride is good to have in their water supply and along with that mothers who go along with giving it to their babies in the vitamins...I saw on the shelf at the supermarket ,in the baby section, gallon jugs of flouridated water. This was a while back that I had seen this and I noticed the other day, it's still being sold and mothers are buying it for their infants. I feel sorry for these kids that are being given this. People haven't any idea how bad flouride is and its ashame - especially for the children being given it.

I saw what you said (other thread) about the bananna having sugar and thats not good before bed. I don't eat a bananna every night, but if I feel very wired up, I will sometimes have at least a piece of one an hour or two after dinner- but you're right about the sugar, but its better than a bowl of icecream;o)

Take care,
MO

[Paxiled]

No harm in a piece of banana.  And you're right about fluoride, we only need it on our teeth, not in our water, and only when young.  It's an immune system depressant in large quantities.  What a silly world.  My dentist, a homeopath, has had a petition against mercury in fillings and against fluoride in water for so many years, it's just so futile.  I drink spring water myself, filtered the way nature intended.

[Cherie762]

you 2 sure know alot! ty for all the info, estrogen is very contraversial, a cardio dr will say no a gyno will say yes, I think post hyster it depends on the womans symptoms. My gyno warned me he said 'I am worried about your bones' I dont know if lack of hormones is the cause of my degenertive disk disease, but I am guessing it play apart. , along w vitamin D being low. I am going for a complete physical and demanding all these levels be tested. It is kinda a shame as someone above said a pt needs to about be a dr and must advocate for self so. Some people dont have a clue how to begin to do that and are simply at a drs mercy.

[Paxiled]

Degenerative disc disease is not the same as bone strength problems.  Different animals, made of different stuff, fed by different nutrients.  Were you in a bad accident some years ago?  That can cause discs to slowly degenerate, and if doctors don't send us to a chiropractor, DO, or acupuncturist, the inflammation stays around and prevents nutrients from getting where they need to.  Had that happen to me.

[Cherie762]

yup two mvas in past 15 years whip lash in first one I was young stupid did not seek treatment did not even ice it, just laid around a few days I know such a thing can come back to haunt you years later.

[Paxiled]

Yup, exactly what happened to me.  Docs at the ER said everything's fine, then 15 years later I had a lower back problem and went to a chiropractor and he took an X-ray, noticed my cervical spine was degenerated and asked, to the year, if I had an auto accident at such and such a time.  I went to the orthopedist, who sent me to a physical therapist, who gave me some exercises to do, and I still do them, but it is confining.  I personally take natural antiinflammatories for it so I can stay as active as possible, but I sure wish that idiot at the ER had told me to at least get massage or something!

[Myown]

"estrogen is very contraversial, a cardio dr will say no a gyno will say yes",
---------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah its amazing isn't it? Depending on which doc you speak to, you will get a different answer. Its really scary sometimes.

I hope things work out for you soon.
MO

[Myown]

"My dentist, a homeopath, has had a petition against mercury in fillings and against fluoride in water for so many years, it's just so futile"
----------------
That's good that you have a homepath dentist. I have to find one because I have a couple of mercury fillings in the back that I want removed and you need someone that really knows what they are doing to do that.  

I had a blood test several years ago and I have alot of mercury in my system.. There is a video on Utube with a dentist rubbing a mercury filling and using some kind of x-ray thing or whatever (can't remember) and the vapors of the mercury coming off the tooth is frightning..

Yeah so I have to get these mercury fillings removed. But finding a dentist that really does it correctly will be the challenge.

MO

[FurballsMom]

Speaking of mercury fillings, a number of years ago I had a horrific experience at one of those low income dental clinics.  It was such a nightmare that I vowed never to set foot into that clinic ever again...

I had gone in with a problem with my bite.  I specifically told the dentist that I don't want amalgam or mercury filling to correct the problem.  I was in that office for a couple of hours, which was agony, since I have TMJ dysfunction, too, and the bite block wasn't used for some reason.  I can't remember why it wasn't used.  The dentist only complained that her back was in misery.  When it was all finished, I looked in the mirror and discovered that there was a silver colored filling where I had had the composite filling years before that.  You should've seen how pale I turned when I saw that.  I was horrified.  It was years later that I was lucky that a dental student managed to spend hours and hours to carefully remove the amalgam fillings that had replaced the composite filling I had paid good money for out-of-pocket.  He repaired the damage without my losing more of my tooth.  I am so grateful that he took so much effort to repair the amalgam.  I have health issues that the amalgam was clearly making worse and that low-income dental clinic dentist didn't even care.

I didn't know it at the time that the amalgam was being removed, but the amalgam should've been removed by a specialist, since it can cause problems for both the dentist and the patient if not done correctly.  I have no doubt that I still have heavy metals in my system from the mercury.

This was such a horrific experience that I have since warned my friends and associates to steer clear of this particular low-income dental clinic.  I would not be able to see a dentist than to ever step foot into that clinic ever again.  I will also never trust any of the dentists at any of the low-income dental clinics ever again.

[Myown]

That certainly was a horrific experience.
It's good you found a dentist that cared enough to take the time to do the job right. Some, or most I should say, dentists don't realize how dangerous it is to have all that mercury flying around when they try to drill out a mercury filling. Its not only dangerous for the patient, but for them too - the fumes, so that also has to be dealt with properly with the ventilation. It's alot of work if done the right way. I shouldn't be worried about the toxins in my body from a few fillings. My house is in the flight path of 2 airports, and that is probably alot worse for me breathing in those fumes;o)

Glad it worked out for you.
MO

[Paxiled]

My dentist is a homeopath, but he doesn't necessarily encourage removal of all the mercury in your mouth.  It's kind of like asbestos:  it's usually best left undisturbed, it's only when distributed into the air that it becomes a problem.  Care is needed.

[Myown]

I don't know about that - it seems the filling emit fumes when you even chew food or even gum. But I can understand what your dentist says, removing them could be a problem if its not done properly, but I tend to believe that they are always emitting some kind of fume.

[Myown]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ylnQ-T7oiA

When you get a minute, take a look at the video. This is what really convinced me.

[FurballsMom]

I believe I've seen this before on mercola.com.  He had a link to this.  I agree, and this convinces me, too.  And, I already have Multiple Chemical Sensitivity (MCS).  Dr. Mercola talked about his own experience.  He got very sick from the mercury at one point himself, and he is a very healthy person, too!

[Myown]

I like mercola's site too. Only one time did I read something that was really totally off. I can't remember who wrote the piece, it wasn't mercola, but someone else - whether this guy was a doctor or some other "expert" he invited to offer his info,,,,but anyway this man wrote about hcv and he was totally off the wall from what I recall and I was shocked that mercola didn't do his own research into this virus to be able to see this guy was nutso in his claims about hcv.

But other than that, I find a majority of the stuff on mercola's site is pretty good. But I had a hard time getting past what he allowed to be written on his site about hcv.

I have bought things from his site and was satisfied with everything. I even bought that tanning bed to try to keep my vitamin D level up in the winter months. He gave a good pitch for that thing and I bought hook, line and sinker, but actually its a good tanning bed, it does work well (hangs over the back of the door).

[Myown]

And also, as I think I mentioned in another post, I have alot of mercury, lead ....etc found in my blood test and hair analysis, but it was never mentioned if I had MCS. The doc also said I was allergic to several foods, yet I never felt or noticed any reaction to these foods. I found that strange because i know some people will get congested after eating a food they are allergic to or immediately get itchy or a rash, but I never noticed any reaction after eating something. Maybe these foods would only affect my mood? dunno, but that particular doctor who tested me told me if she eats icecream, she has a terrible mood swing which causes her to have a bad temper. So she has to avoid icecream. I found that interesting.

[Paxiled]

This doesn't necessarily mean anything for any individual, but blood tests show pretty much everyone with high levels of mercury and lead.  Lead was from the additives in gasoline that were sprayed all over us for years and haven't gone away yet, and in paint as well, and now in toys and who knows what, and mercury in fish and from coal plants.  So it isn't necessarily coming from fillings.  And if none of us had mercury fillings, we'd still have these high blood levels.  It's a mess out there, sports fans.

[Myown]

Okee-dokey. I agree that we all have some mercury and lead in us - even if we didn't have any mercury fillings,,,,BUT, the video from Utube that I posted above is a "must -see," just like "Gone With The Wind" starring Clark Gable - both a must see. ;o)

But seriously, if you didn't watch that video, come on, you should take a peek before you can really state what you said.  "FurballsMom" said she had seen the video before and that it also convinced her.

As far as what your dentist says with the asbestos/mercury filling analogy. Okay, true as far as > if you happen to have asbestos shingles on your house - left undisturbed - by not removing them I mean, yeah, probably wouldn't do any harm (except for the fact your house might not pass inspection if you put it on the market),,,,BUT what IF you started hammering them or scraping the asbestos shingles?

Do you think that the fumes or loose particles would cause harm if you breathed them in? Would it show up in your blood?

Well, that's the analogy I would give to your dentist if he were my dentist.

So anyhow, I don't know why you didn't look at the utube video I posted and if you did, what is your opinion? I don't know how you could disagree with me after watching that video,,,,,as a matter of fact, how does anyone EVER disagree with me?? I know I am always right!!! j/k

[FurballsMom]

I don't know if mercury levels cause MCS or not, but it definitely doesn't help to have high levels of any heavy metals when one's immune system isn't functioning properly.  MCS is often a symptom of Fibromyalgia, which I definitely have.  I keep meaning to ask my naturopath about a safe way to detox my body of heavy metals without making myself sick.  I know there must be, but I'm afraid to take the plunge since I'm already dealing with autoimmune issues.

[Myown]

Thanks for info.
Yeah having heavy metal in the body is not good for sure. I think ALA is good for chelation. I eat Cilantro and that supposedly helps too, but who knows. I know some people get the IV drips, but I wonder sometimes if thats really good for chelation because I think I read you can lose minerals doing that - but dunno. I am dizzy from reading all the time!

I know what you mean though about afraid of taking the plunge, you don't want to stir anything else up.- if thats possible,,,, I hope you feel better soon.

MO

[lilypotter]

Exercise is one great way to improve your bone strength.

Sure, sure. Everyone says you really must have lots of exercise. And if you are not getting any, they are right.

Two different kinds of cells determine the form and strength of all of your various bones. The osteoclasts build up your bone and the osteoblasts break it down. The workings of these cells is controlled by electric currents. The stress of causes a small current of electricity to pass through your bone. The osteoclasts are then encouraged to build up bone in the places where your bone has been stressed. The osteoblasts are designed to absorb minute particles of bone that is not stressed.

Diet is another great way to improve your bone strength.

The structural integrity of your bones comes from a crystal lattice called apatite. Apatite needs large amounts of calcium and some phosphorus. That is why calcium is such an important part of your diet. Vitamin D is needed to absorb and utilize Calcium. That is why Vitamin D is a milk additive.

Dairy products have lots of calcium and are a good source of protein as well. That is fortunate if you are a fan of exotic cheeses like Bokmakiri or Metsovone cheese. Ice cream, cream cheese, cottage cheese as well as milk all are good sources of calcium.

On the other hand, you can get plenty of calcium in your meals without any dairy products. There are two reasons for this. First of all, many nuts, legumes, green leefy vegetables (greefies) and grains are loaded with calcium.

Secondly, the nutrients in milk and other dairy products sticks to the calcium. Therefore, although there is quite enough calcium in dairy products, it is harder for your body to use it. So, if you are a vegan, you can get plenty of calcium.

One more thing. If your nutritionist tells you to take a calcium supplement, there is a great cheap and easy way to do this. Tums and Rolaids are primarily calcium carbonate. They provide plenty of calcium. However, don’t use them for an antacid because calcium actually makes your stomach secrete more acid. And take them with your meals.
By working toward a sensible diet and a daily exercise regimen, you can make great progress toward making sure that you have strong bones. Take care that you include calcium and vitamin D in your food and exercise at least three times a week.

[Paxiled]

Many people can't absorb calcium calcium carbonate, and tums and rolaids have all kinds of other **** in them, and no matter when you take them they will suppress stomach acid.  So why on Earth would anyone recommend them for calcium?  They shouldn't be recommended for anything but the trash can.  As for dairy, it has too much calcium and insufficient magnesium, therefore leaching magnesium out of the body.  Magnesium is just as important as calcium for strong bones, in fact more so since Americans get way too much calcium but way too little magnesium.  Consider this:  given that Americans drink gallons of milk when they're young, America should have very little problem with bone strength, since most of it is built when we're young.  Yet American is a world leader in osteoporosis.  Coincidence?  Hardly.  Then consider Asia, where milk is drunk very little if at all and when it is it's generally cultured, and yet there are far fewer bone density problems.  Coincidence?  hardly again.  Green leafy vegetables and seaweed are great sources of calcium and magnesium, nice and balanced, and as for vitamin D, if people would only go out in the sun and stop being afraid it'll give them cancer, it wouldn't be a problem.  I can't prove it, but I don't accept these cancers are suddenly being caused by sun, I think it's from all the pollution and poor diets in our lives now.  That explains the cancer epidemic in all its forms, because it's an immune system disease and if it doesn't get you in one form it just gets you in another.

[FurballsMom]

I agree about the antacid tablets.  I have GERD.  Those things are worthless.  They make my reflux a thousand times worse.  The comment about them belonging in the trash can is right on.  Those things are also full of hidden sulfites, which I didn't know about 'til recently.  (Something to do with labeling laws.)  So, it's no wonder the things actually make the things worse for me.  I know about others with the same issue.  And, I actually had learned the same information about calcium carbonate from somewhere else.  I can't remember where now, but I know that it isn't the best kind of calcium for people to actually be able to use.  

I agree about the sun, too.  In fact, that's exactly what Mercola talks about.  The sun has been villified unfairly.  We were designed to synthesize certain vitamins, such as vitamin D through our skin's contact with sun exposure.  That said, unfortunately for me, I need to supplement, because I burn so easily.  Getting sunburned too often is definitely the wrong thing to do.  But, tanning naturally is exactly the right thing to do.  And, actually some people only need a few minutes of daily sun exposure to get enough vitamin D.  Other people do need more sun exposure to get enough vitamin D.  Dr. Mercola's website even explains why and backs this up with authority.  It's a matter of moderation.