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163305 tn?1333668571

SFPD to answer questions on fatal shooting of Alejandro Nieto

Yet, another wrongful death dealt out by the police. Why didn't they try talking to this young man before firing their weapons ???? OH

San Francisco Police Chief Greg Suhr will be on hand this evening [Tue/25] for a town hall meeting to discuss last week’s officer-involved shooting in Bernal Heights Park. The shooting victim, 28-year-old Alejandro Nieto, was a City College of San Francisco student, a Latino, and Bernal Heights resident who had hoped to become a youth probation officer.

Just before sunset last night [Mon/24], a group of about 150 friends, family members, and community supporters gathered for a vigil at the spot where he was gunned down by multiple police officers.
The community members lit candles, sang, burned incense, and conducted Buddhist chants in honor of his spiritual practice. Those who knew Nieto, whom they called Alex, described him as caring, ambitious, and committed to nonviolence.
“He was such a bright person,” said Ben Bac Sierra, an author and instructor at City College who knew Nieto through shared ties in the neighborhood. Nieto had been helping Bacsierra organize community events and book readings, he said. They’d rolled down Mission Street together in a classic low-rider for a parade, shouting “si se puede!” while onlookers cheered them on.

Torrance Bynum, former dean at City College’s Evans and Southeast Center campus and a former instructor of Administration of Justice, described himself to the Bay Guardian as Nieto’s mentor. “I would give him rides home from class,” he said. Nieto would stop by to visit him, and “if I was in a meeting, he would wait for me.” Bynum said he’d phoned Nieto on his birthday just a few weeks ago, March 4.

On Monday night, major questions still lingered about the events leading up to Nieto’s death.
A statement issued by the SFPD on March 21, about three hours after the shooting, said officers had arrived at the park in response to “911 calls of a male subject with a gun.” Police “encountered a male subject with a weapon,” the statement went on. “The male subject pointed a weapon at the officers, and multiple officers discharged their firearms.” (In an interview with the San Francisco Chronicle, Deputy Police Chief Lyn Tomioka indicated that he “appeared to draw a weapon.”) He was pronounced dead, the statement noted, “and an additional weapon was found.”

In the days following the shooting, however, friends and family members told reporters that Nieto had a stun gun, not a firearm, because he worked as a security guard at a nightclub. They also said Nieto was peacefully eating a burrito just before the shooting occurred.

According to California Bureau of Security and Investigative Services records, Nieto obtained registration to work as a guard/patrolperson in June of 2007, and obtained apermit to carry a baton in September of 2013. Security guards must complete a 40-hour course of required training before registering with the state.

A report in the San Francisco Chronicle suggested that just before the shooting, Nieto was “acting erratically and threatening passersby,” quoting an unnamed witness who said a man had threatened his dog with a “pistol-type stun gun” and yelled profanities. It also referenced a past incident involving Nieto's alleged use of a stun gun.
A person who declined to be named told the Bay Guardian that about half an hour before the shooting occurred, two men who were walking down the pedestrian pathway on the north slope of Bernal Heights Park alerted a jogger that there was a man ahead wearing a gun on his hip.

They told the jogger that they had called the police. The jogger, who was about 50 feet from the man and started moving away from him after receiving the warning, was too far away to see whether he had a weapon but noticed that he was “pacing back and forth” and “air boxing.”

When the Bay Guardian phoned the SFPD to ask what sort of weapon had been discovered, Sgt. Danielle Newman said she could not release that information.
“He was never arrested in his life,” Bac Sierra said of Nieto during the vigil. “He wanted to be a good person – and he was.”
Bac Sierra later told the Bay Guardian he'd first heard the news Saturday night, and spoke with members of Nieto’s family the following day. The family was not notified of what happened until 3pm the day after the shooting, he said. The report was that Nieto had been shot 14 times.

Sup. John Avalos, who represents the Excelsior District, said he had worked with Nieto in the past and knew him from Coleman Advocates for Children & Youth. “I was making sure that his life was going in a positive direction, and what we saw in Alejandro was that he had a really big heart,” Avalos said at last night’s vigil. “He gave it to a lot of people, and often probably didn’t give it enough to himself.”

He added, “Blood’s been shed, in this case, by people we’re supposed to trust. But … we have a lot of difficulty trusting our police, because from time to time these things happen."

Avalos also mentioned that when it comes to dealing with subjects who are mentally ill, SFPD has an established protocol. Under a program that began in 2011, specially trained officers with the department’s Crisis Intervention Team are to be dispatched to the scene when calls involve a mentally ill individual.
At tonight's meeting, Suhr is expected to answer questions from community members. Friends and supporters of Nieto are still in shock from the news.

“I don’t know what it’s going to take, but I think all of us here should call on the Office of Citizen Complaints, and make sure they do an investigation,” Avalos said. “We need to make sure that the officer who – I really hope, despite all the shots that were fired, are having trouble with their consciences right now. Because taking anybody’s life, or hurting anyone in such a way, is unconscionable. This young man, he deserves that from all of us, to make sure the senseless taking of his life was not done in vain, that it leads to something better.”

Avalos said he was also there on behalf of Mission District Sup. David Campos, who was unable to attend because he was in a hearing.
The SFPD town hall is scheduled for 6pm at Leonard Flynn Elementary School, located at 3125 Cesar Chavez Street.

Bac Sierra urged everyone gathered at the vigil to attend the town hall meeting. “Those cops have to feel this,” he said. “This neighborhood has to feel this.”

http://www.sfbg.com/politics/2014/03/25/sfpd-answer-questions-fatal-shooting-alejandro-nieto
26 Responses
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Avatar universal
I absolutely believe that.  Its worked for me where I know pointing something that looked like a gun would not have worked out.
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206807 tn?1331936184
His 2 options, Point a weapon at a Cop and get shot or don’t Point a weapon at a cop and probably not get shot.
For the record it is called Justifiable Homicide. You once studied Law so, you already know this.
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Avatar universal
If this guy listened to commands, dropped the taser, he would still be with us.

You really believe that?
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Avatar universal
Too many guns out there?  Perhaps.  Too many guns in the wrong hands?  I'd agree.  For the record, the armed individuals here were law enforcement and the perp aimed something that very much looked like a gun at the cops.... what would you expect them to do?  Are they supposed to sit and take fire or be proactive and stop the event?

"Shoot him in the leg".... Great in theory, but if this were a real gun and the cops shot him in the leg, you still have an armed individual with a gun and your problem is just getting started.  

If this guy listened to commands, dropped the taser, he would still be with us.  It's never a great idea to point anything at cops.  
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163305 tn?1333668571
No worries, I understand.
Part of what is not apparent from what I've written is that this is a fairly local event and I'm hearing reports on the radio about this sad event. There is already tension in the changing neighborhoods in S.F as gentrification comes in pushing older, established residents and their families out.

I agree, there are way too many irresponsible gun owners and the police can be jittery for good reason.
On the other hand, there seems to desperately need to be an attempt to heal the many wounds that exist in S.F/Oakland and else where, between the police and the citizens living in the neighborhoods.
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973741 tn?1342342773
Wanted to make sure you know that I don't think your opinion is wrong.  There really aren't enough details to come to an absolute conclusion.  I was just telling how I read it and my thoughts.  
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973741 tn?1342342773
Hm.  You are suggesting that the police were plain clothes cops and they didn't identify themselves?  Not sure I got that from what is written.  

I read that they told him to raise his hands and instead he reached for his taser.

It must be acknowledged that this was a bad and deadly choice for him.

The police ARE the authority.  You do as they say---  because the are the authority and also for YOUR own protection.  They have the right to act if they feel threatened.  Do I think 14 bullets were necessary, NO.  But the man's actions resulted in this event.

And I do agree with Mikesimon that currently, guns are so prevalent, that police are now in a state of constant worry about just making it through their shift.  I agree that there are too many guns.  And then when someone who is acting suspiciously, strangely, etc. and people are worried he's a danger and then he doesn't listen to their commands and starts to go for something in a holster, they are going to act to make sure they make it through their shift.  I get it and if it were my husband out there working as a police officer, that is what I'd want him to do. No, not kill someone but to defend himself if someone points a weapon at him.  Could he shoot in the leg or something?  That would be great.  I just don't know how realistic it is to do that.  But that would be good if they could shoot in the arm or leg and not kill but make sure they weren't hurt.

I'm ALL for these cameras for the protection of the suspect as much as for the protection of the police officers so no one questions the situation in which they act in the line of duty.  

I'm sure there are some bad cops out there.  Don't get me wrong.  And racism and profiling are a constant problem.  But from what is written, it doesn't really sound like that here.  
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163305 tn?1333668571
Did he draw his taser or was it on his belt ?
The dead man worked as a security guard and had a reason to have a taser on him.

If it were in his hand, and the police hadn't identified themselves, one could imagine him thinking he might be the target for a crime and pulled his taser out just in case.

If it were not for my knowledge of several incidents of police caused violence especially against minorities in the S.F/ Oakland bay area, I would not be so suspicious.

Some police departments now require police to have wearable cameras to help stop such problems as this one.
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Avatar universal
I didn't say it never happened.I said "..you probably don't see a lot of homicides at a shooting range either.." And apparently I was correct since you said "Even though it is rare...."

But again that misses the point I was attempting to make.
There are too many guns in the hands of too many people. And it is a high probability that a significant portion of those people are either criminals or knuckleheads or mentally challenged individuals who should never be in possession of firearms. And it is that culture that leads to this senseless murder/killing.
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Avatar universal
This is rich....
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206807 tn?1331936184
"That totally misses the point but I assume you knew that when you posted"
No, I'm not "wired" that way.

Even though it is rare, a highly decorated Sniper was recently murdered at a shooting range.
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Avatar universal
Yea, and you probably don't see a lot of homicides at a shooting range either. That totally misses the point but I assume you knew that when you posted.
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206807 tn?1331936184

This may have already been said but I didn't have time to read all of the post, Running late again!


“WE HAVE TOO MANY GUNS IN THIS COUNTRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That's part of the reason the cops can become trigger happy. They expect people to have guns”


I tend to disagree. During Hunting Season almost every person a Game Warden approaches has a gun but you hardly ever hear of a Game Warden shooting someone or getting shot. The reason is most hunters have a different mentality and even though they may not like the L.E. they don’t try to kill them. I think the problem is the mentality of people that have guns not guns.
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973741 tn?1342342773
Well, I guess one would have to question this man drawing the taser when they asked him to show his hands.  While it is most unfortunate that he was shot and killed, his actions did indeed cause the police to fire.  I don't think 'justified' is the word I'd use but it was an unfortunate choice on the man's part that resulted in the ultimate consequence.  He should have left the taser holstered and raised his hands.  

Being a police officer is a dangerous job.  I wouldn't want that job.  

I think there is truth in Mikesimon's comment that the amount of guns these days causes the police to react like this in these types of situations.  I do see that correlation.  
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163305 tn?1333668571

In a room filled with more than 200 people, Chief of Police Greg Suhr said that police officers who shot and killed 28-year-old Alejandro Nieto Friday night on Bernal Hill  thought the victim was pointing a hand gun at them. It was only after Nieto was down that they discovered the young man was carrying a taser.

“When officers saw the laser sight, they believed it to be a firearm,” said Suhr who had to pause throughout his brief presentation as shouts of “pig,” “liar,” and “murderers,” echoed through the room Tuesday evening at Flynn Elementary School.

To illustrate the similarities between the two, Suhr  provided a side-by-side photo comparison of a traditional handgun and the taser Nieto carried in a holster.  “When officers asked him to show his hands, he drew his taser from the holster,” Suhr said.

READ MORE

http://blog.sfgate.com/inthemission/2014/03/26/crowd-shouts-liar-as-police-explain-nieto-shooting/
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163305 tn?1333668571
I am not anti-cops.
There was a deputy sheriff killed by a very sick man who had killed someone then drove here from out of state, not long ago.
We all feel so sorry for this deputy and his family.

However, since none of us were in S.F and witnessed the police kill this young man, how can anyone say it was justified ? I'm not saying it might not have been but I also have witnessed young cops, in the city,  who seem like they are on steroids just waiting to 'kick butt'.

To me the problem still goes to how our police forces are being trained~ shoot first and ask questions later is not the way to create respect and communication between the police and citizens.
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Avatar universal
Alleged teen cop killers likely turned gun on selves, police say
By Vivian Kuo, CNN
updated 7:33 AM EDT, Thu March 27, 2014

http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/26/justice/florida-officer-teens-killed/index.html?hpt=hp_c3
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Avatar universal
More glorification which serves to fuel the crazy culture.

1 hour ago
Alabama candidate takes aim at Obamacare
CNN Political Unit

(CNN) - A U.S. House candidate in Alabama is literally shooting down Obamacare.

A video released by his campaign on Wednesday, shows Will Brooke using a variety of firearms to destroy a copy of the Affordable Care Act.

The ad begins with Brooke seated on the bed of a truck next to a stack of paper that he says is a copy of the law championed by the President.

The ad is titled "Let's Do Some Damage."

Brooke then drives off in truck, displaying a bumper sticker that reads "I prefer the dangers of a limited government!"

He arrives in a wooded area, loads the Obamacare papers into a wooden box starts shooting.

"We're down here to have a little fun today and talk about two serious subjects: the Second Amendment, and see how much damage we can do to this copy of Obamacare," he says in the ad.

After blasting it rhetorically and literally, Brooke loads the health care copy into a wood chipper and shreds what was left of it.

Brooke's campaign video was first reported by The Daily Caller.

Brooke is one of seven Republican candidates vying for the seat of retiring Rep. Spencer Bachus in the state’s 6th Congressional District.

The Alabama Republican isn't the first to use guns to hammer home a policy issue.

Democratic Sen. Joe Manchin of West Virginia used a rifle to "take dead aim at Cap and Trade" in a 2010 campaign ad against efforts to pass a sweeping environmental bill in Congress.

Republicans nationwide are aggressively campaigning against Obamacare, which aims to provide health coverage to millions of people without it. It passed Congress in 2010 without any Republican support. Republicans hope to expand their majority in the House and reclaim the Senate.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2014/03/26/alabama-candidate-takes-aim-at-obamacare/?hpt=hp_t3
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Avatar universal
Again - TOO MANY GUNS - PERIOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Avatar universal
Who kills more people police or gangs? Gangs. When a police shoots someone or a gang shoots someone who gets more attention? Where is more outrage? It is police, rarely is the attention or outrage justified.

Yet we don't hear about little Nicole in Oakland getting shot, because she was standing on a street corner when a drive by happens.

The culture of gang life needs to change.
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Avatar universal
Do you love it too?
Does that fact that I post here mean I love what I see here? I hardly think so.

I think it is the bizzaro world when I see Glass state categorically that "It was justified".
I think it is a bizzaro world when vance immediately mentions gangs as if that somehow excuses.

I don't think anyone has mentioned the critical point here.

WE HAVE TOO MANY GUNS IN THIS COUNTRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That's part of the reason the cops can become trigger happy. They expect people to have guns and often they're right to expect that. And what is the trend in this country? More and more people carrying guns because - why heck - they have to protect themselves from all of the other people with guns. I own guns but I don't carry them everywhere I go. We live in a crazy place and the cops are simply responding to the culture that the right wing NRA crowd has been instrumental in creating. So we're going to see more and more of this stuff unless we change the culture dramatically.
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973741 tn?1342342773
So, I read the above.  Clearly he pointed 'something' at the police.  And there were more than one officer there that ALL felt threatened by it in some way----  right?  It wasn't one officer that shot him.  

Now, I'm not sure why there were 14 shots or how many officers it was---  but I still in my heart of hearts do not believe that police officers ---  for no reason---  go around shooting people in public in a park.  If they shot in error, it was a mistake and not cold blooded killing.  Cops trying to do their job which is a hard one.  

Friends and family says he was doing X really isn't relevant unless they were there.  There was a call made that he had a gun in a holster and was acting strange.  He was scaring people enough that they altered their path of walking/running (whatever they were doing).

I hate that a young person was killed but in this story, to me it doesn't sound like he was completely gunned down without any part of the situation.  If I'm surrounded by cops, I don't point something at them!  Especially if they are worried about me enough to have their guns drawn.  

I don't believe all cops are good people or all situations are the victims fault---  I really don't.  But we have to be careful that we don't take EVERY situation and make it out to be such that the police did something wrong.  

It would be helpful to know what was found on him at the scene---  what exactly he pointed at the police officers.  

It is a bizarre world Mike but you keep coming back for more so you must just love it.  :>)
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Avatar universal
One stop comments are not constructive. Why not explain yourself?
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Avatar universal
It's the Bizarro World again.
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