War on Women

[Vance2335]

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/08/us/politics/as-obama-spotlights-gender-gap-in-wages-his-own-payroll-draws-scrutiny.html?_r=0

Shame on the white house

[teko]

I dont think people on a power trip, regardless of their gender is the issue. We will always have our share of those unfortunately.

But no one would argue that someone doing the same job, regardless of what is between their legs, should get equal pay. Obviously qualifications would be taken into effect before hiring either, but that could open a whole new can of worms and many discussions.

Im old enuff to remember when as a female, you were subjected the the male bosses sexual overtones in order to keep your job. Like it or leave it.

We have come a long way, but we are not there yet and yes I believe its time to make sure gender has nothing to do with the pay scale.

[R Glass]

SM/Barbe-
Don’t get me wrong, I’ve had my fair share of male P.Ms. that were equally as bad and probably worse. One was so bad; the Architect sent an email to the owner of our company (General Contractor) and requested the Project Manager does not come to any more Weekly Progress Meetings unless his presence is requested. This guy was so bazaar we all wanted to take Louisville Sluggers to him. One of those types that doesn’t have a clue about what’s going on but would take control of the meetings.

I’m not saying all female Construction Project Managers are inadequate. I’ve only had 4 and wasn’t impressed with any of them. In one of their defense (one of the criers) it was our company’s fault and hers. She was a Project Manager Assistant. The owner of the company wanted to move her up to P.M. They should have started her out on small “Build Outs” and work her way up. NOOOO, I was building a 3 Million addition on to a school and they sent her to me to show her “The Ropes” of the field. I guess the owner forgot to explain protocol to her because she thought she was to take my job over and I worked for her. After a week, I gave my 2-week notice

[Barb135]

I've had jobs with male managers that behave just as you describe, as well.  Many of them have been on power trips and were as unpredictable as any female.  In fact, the co-worker I mentioned above was on a power trip for most of the 6 yrs I worked with him - and talk about Sybil... this man had more personalities than you could shake a stick at; if you didn't like who was at a given time, just give him few seconds and he'd bring out another personality.

[specialmom]

Hm, not sure what you are saying RGlass.  You feel they weren't qualified to get the job done or you didn't like their styles?  

[R Glass]

I’ve worked Construction my entire life. I have had 4 Project Managers that were Women and was not impressed by any of them. All 4 were irrational (more like Sybil) I never knew which one of the personalities was going to show up. 3 of the 4 were on Power Trips, resented the fact that I didn’t work for them, and I controlled the Field. 2 of them actually broke down and cried in meetings.

[specialmom]

We were discussing why quotas exist and whether they are a good idea or not.  In general, if someone isn't qualified for a job, I don't think they should have it whether they are male, female, black or white.  (to each their own if they think Obama was qualified or not).  I personally would feel terrible if I thought I  had ever gotten a job based on a quota that needed to be filled.  I do agree that this is no way to get a job.  But, with some bias exists, that is how some have gotten in the door when they were equally qualified.   Quotas began in order to give some a chance when they didn't have it before.  I'm not aware of any quotas set for the presidency but if there is, it must be a woman's turn.  

It's a topic that I definitely see both sides to.  

However, equal pay . . .   that should always be the case.  Equal pay for equal work.  

[mikesimon]

Gee, that sounds so familiar. I think I heard a black guy say pretty much the same thing.

There are people who don't want a black man in power............like maybe the President for instance.

[Barb135]

I used to have a sign that read "Women have to work twice as hard to be thought half as good as men".  

That's very true and I had a similar experience in my job just before I retired.  The other person in my department was male and he was constantly trying to leave me out decisions, making me feel less than "wanted", etc. Like you, SM, I worked rings around him and it didn't take long for our boss and those in other departments to see that.  Of course, like you say, he resented me wholeheartedly.

[specialmom]

The only issue with hiring quotas is bias.  There ARE men who don't want a woman in power.  Flat out, they do not want to work for a woman or view women as equal.  I had an experience of feeling this way.  I was put down and left out because I was the only woman on a team.  My tact to counter that was to leave those men in the dust with my performance.  They just resented me more.  That is real life.

so, I do agree on the surface that quotas are wrong if a woman is being hired just because they need a female to make the numbers work and she isn't the best candidate---    but I do know that it is also the only way that women would even be considered for a job by SoME men.  

[Barb135]

Thought so; thanks for clarifying.

I agree that hiring quotas are b/s.

[el_em_en_oh]

I guess i misspoke!

Women & men getting paid the same pay for doing the same job, is a no-brainer.

Hiring quotas are the b/s part.

[Barb135]

Gender equality means that women should get paid the same as a man, for doing the same job.  For instance if the Homeland Security adviser were a man, who got paid $100,000/yr, then they hired a woman for the same job and only paid her $80,000, that would be gender inequality.  

There's a huge difference between gender equality (ie equal money for equal work)  and hiring quotas.

In view of that, do you really mean that you don't believe in gender equality?

[el_em_en_oh]

I don't believe in gender equality, forgive me for saying.

And please don't think me sexist.

I believe it should be "the best person for the job", PERIOD. If that's a woman, great. If it's a man, great.

Filling a position with a woman JUST BECAUSE you need to fill a "quota" is embarrassing, and frankly, if I was a woman, I'd be offended if that was the case.

Again, I'm not asexist, it's just the way I feel.

I feel much the same way about 'affirmative action'. Completely outdated and biased b/s, IMHO.

[Vance2335]

Thanks for the only comment RGlass.

[R Glass]

“Men and women in equivalent roles here earn equivalent salaries,” Mr. Carney said. “Some of the most senior positions in the White House are filled by women, including national security adviser, homeland security adviser, White House counsel, communications director, senior adviser, deputy chief of staff.”
He said that the 88-cent statistic was misleading because it aggregates the salaries of White House staff members at all levels, including the lowest levels, where women outnumber men.

As much as I dislike Jim Carney (to me, he’s just a “filler” for the weak minded), until I see an actual breakdown that disputes his claims, I have to agree with him.
Some would say, The Whitehouse should have more women to fill to higher levels. I have to give credit to Obama for hiring what who he feels is the best person to fill these positions regardless of gender. I’m not thrilled with his choices but I don’t think they are based on gender.

[mikesimon]

Who would ever believe that liberal rag?

Where did you see that - Drudge Report?

I just went to Drudge and I was absolutely right. That's how you got to the NY Times - teeheeheehee

You're way too predictable and what's funnier is that - oh never-mind.