How can I stay? (Long)

[blane2]

A few months ago, I found out that my husband(38) of almost 2 years cheated on me(26) with 2 different women during the our engagement, and that he was still in contact with one of the women whom he pent time London "as friends" last May without me knowing. When I found out, I packed my bags and booked a flight home, but in the end I decided to stay. He claims to have cut off contact with the other women now, and also claims that he hasn't slept with the one he spent time with in London since we've been married,but it doesn't feel like enough.
I moved out of the U.S.-away from my friends, family, and job to be with someone that I no longer trust or believe in. Why did I stay? I stayed because I do love him, and I also had an opportunity to go to graduate school this term. I started school thinking that I could handle it but that was a big mistake because everything from the affairs is still unresolved in my mind which makes it difficult to concentrate, and being around all of my young single classmates is starting to make me feel like I shouldn't be tied down to a lying cheat.

Background information...we've had a general lack of communication in certain aspects from the very beginning, he pretended to want kids when we were dating and changed his mind once he got me pregnant while we were engaged. He applied a lot of emotional pressure to get me to have an abortion and eventually I capitulated because I thought it was the only way to keep the relationship. Now I know that some of the cheating was going on right around the time I was still pregnant and that he was disregarding any impact on my health by having unprotected sex with these other women because he thought they were "clean". Of course, he has apologised profusely for everything. The thing is I'm not even angry with him anymore. I'm dissapointed and distrustful, but what I really want to know is if I'm wasting my time and just giving him another opportunity to pull the wool over my eyes.
I'm dealing with this on top of working full-time and being a part-time graduate student. I probably shouldn't have started school this term, but I don't think that I would still be here, in this country with him, if I hadn't.
He also offered to go to couple's counselling with me, but I don't have time for couple's counselling because none of the ones in the city we live in are available outside of normal office hours and I have a full-time office job. My husband's job offers more flexibiity so he could see a counsellor on his own if he wanted to, but he refuses to go by himself because he see the point since he doesn't think he has a problem anymore and "just wants to be with me" because "being married is different" from just being in a commited relationship with someone you love. I don't see how a person's propensity towards cheating would suddenly change once they are married if they cheat while they are engaged. This is my first marriage, but I'm his 3rd wife. His first 2 marriages ended due to other factors than cheating.
We had a huge argument last night. It started off as a question from me about whether he was in contact with any of his ex's who might want somthing more, then he got offended. This led to arguments about all sorts of unresolved issues. My husband told me that he was angry that I hadn't acknowledged that he had changed, or how much it had cost him to give up his friendships with his ex-girlfriends to make me more comfortable.It hasn't even been a full 4 months since I found out about all of this,so how am I supposed to acknowledge that he's changed when I don't know that he in fact has changed?

My husband believes that the fact that he able to cut off his sexual relationships with other women before he married me and isn't still sleeping around, should indicate that he has a different mind-set and therefore has changed. Maybe those things would matter more if he had been honest with me about everything before actually marrying me. If I hadn't just learned about all of this a few months ago, then I could have made an informed decision...and maybe I would have still married him with my eyes wide open. And, maybe the fact that he met with one of his ex's for a few hours in london without telling me wouldn't have pissed me off so much. Actually, I think I would have still been pissed off about that meeting because it was with one of the women he cheated on me with and I just don't think that was a considerate or honest thing to do.

Last night he tried to convince me that it was not normal for him to have to blow off his ex's, and said that he did it to make me more comfortable. So, you see how we have a fundamental problem here. I don't trust him because he cheated, and I don't think it's normal to want to be friends with someone that you cheated on your partner with regardless of whether anything is still going on.

My husband has a lot of emotional baggage and feels the need to reply to emails from any ex that contacts him. None of his ex's, except the one in London and his 2nd wife even knew he was married to me before I found out about the affair because he claims that he didn't want to upset them or ruin the friendships and he didn't think it was any of their business. Now, it's not like he was exchanging romantic emails with any of them. I've seen some of the emails and they were friendly, and whenever someone tried to cross the line (by flirting or saying they missed him) he ignored that part of their email in his reply; but I think I'm stuck on the principal. He was still in contact with these women for however long and they didn't know he was married. When my ex's email me, as they do from time to time, and ask me what is new with my life, my marriage is one of the first things I mention in my emails. I don't do it to be hurtful; i just see the disclosure as an indicator that any emails exchanged between us are going to be non-romantic in nature. Meanwhile, my husband actually apologized and wrote "I hope you understand why I didn't tell you" in an email to one of his ex's. Another one of his ex's, from before we met, emailed him last month after 5 years. she asked him about his move because she'd found out about him moving abroad online. He said that he told her that he was married in his reply and that was the end of it.

Even if that's true...I think the fact that he wouldn't have necesarily mentioned the fact that he was married if she had emailed him 5 months ago speaks volumes (not in a good way).

I'm unhappy about being married to someone who hasn't acted like he actually wanted to be married in the past. I'm unhappy about the cheating, the unprotected sex, the lying, and what the fact that he didn't tell his ex's about our marriage implies. Are there any men out there who can shed some light on this? If an old ex contacted you after however long, then would you feel obligated to tell them that you were married? And, would you ever think it was okay to spend time with someone that you cheated on your wife, or fiance with (even if the sexual part of your relationship with this person was definitely over)?

I feel conflicted because I love him, even now that I know how badly he has treated me. I also know that love may not be enoug, and. I can't afford to make any more emotionally driven decisions where he is concerned just because there's a part of me that has unconditional love for him. I have to make a smart choice. The smart choice involves hurting someone I love to save myself from even more stress and the heartache that this relationship entails: myself. Maybe my husband really believes that he will be faithful to me from now on because of the fact that he cut off his sexual relationships with other women before he actually married me,but I don't believe that he won't ever cheat on me again. Is being married somehow fundamentally different in terms of cheating?

[Fuzzz]

I didn't read the whole thing for lack of time, but I do not think you should put any more time into this marriage based on the first half of what you wrote.  

[Shara21]

Wow,

I read the whole thing.
I cannot really comment on whether or not he has infact changed, i can say though, that if i was in this situation, i would leave.
I understand that you love him and will probably always love a part of him. But it sounds like he's lying to you, aswell as himself.

You said it yourself that you wouldnt be surprised if he cheated again. That alone being said, why put yourself through this. He should not be appologizing to ther women for being married, he should be broadcasting it, saying "life is great, i met the love of my life...".

I mean, honestly hun, i dont know what else to say. I know you love him, but he's not being fair and there is no reason that you should waste another 5 years with him. After only 4 months you have every reason to still ask questions, after only 4 months i would still be LIVID and if i wanted him to do counseling, together or alone, he'd better have his tail in couseling asap.

Ex's should not interfere like this. It's cruel what he's doing and if you already know that you won't be able to trust... not to be blunt, but whats the point?

To answer how can you stay? honestly i dont think you should, can or deserve to. Go find someone who's not going to lie to you, or cheat on you. Go find a man that deserves your love =)
Good luck

[helperhelper]

Leave him. He is just going to hurt you again. He obviously has different values than you do. That just spells disaster like you have and are experiencing. You will save yourself years of heartache. Just do it. Don't look back, and just do it. In a months time, you will wonder why you didn't do it sooner.

[StepDad]

I read your whole post. I am a male. I married in mid 30's to make sure. I could devote 110% of my love my passion and my sex drive to one women. I had a good amount of x girlfriends that, I stopped communicating with to make my wife feel more comfortable in our relationship. She had come from a very unhappy marriage who she has a child with and he cheated on her all the time before marriage and during. She also cheated on him. But, she claims it was a revenge sorta thing. I would say, once a cheat always a cheat. I think your Husband is trying to convince you that he has change because, He does not converse with his X's Almost trying to make you think he made big sacrifices for you.  I would say if you can afford it hire a PI and watch him for a few weeks. Then you will know if he is a cheating DOG.
I hope i am wrong about once a cheat always a cheat.. I would be crushed if my wife cheated on me.
I wish you the best of luck....

[adgal]

I haven't been in your situation, so it's tough to say what I would do.  Love is a very powerful emotion.  I think I might be able to work past the actual cheating, however what bothers me the most is that he has maintained some contact and has failed to mention to some ex's that he is now married.  It would sort of make me feel like he was "keeping his options open".  I know for sure the only way I could work through this would be for my husband to cut off all contact with the other women.  Trust is such a big part of any relationship for me (friends, family and my husband).  Betrayal of that trust is hard enough to get through without having to worry that she is still around.  I hope I am making sense here.  From what you have written, it just seems to me that commitment and trust are far more important to you then to him...again, not necessarily based on the fact that he cheated, more on his attitude towards it now.  I can forgive mistakes, but if someone can't own up to it and take responsibility for it, and also do what they need to do to ensure you feel confident, well that's a lot harder to forgive.  Whatever you decide, I wish you well.

[Njsweetnlight]

Hello, the first thing I have to say is that women make too many sacrificies!! Why do women work, take care of the home and go to school and so on and then have to look the other way for a man that can't keep his privates in his pants. There is no excuse for cheating NONE! If he cheated in the past in past relationships and cheated with you then he will continue to cheat and just get smarter how he does it. You are obviously upset about the situation and you are now in what I call an unstable relationship which is worrying and stressing over a man that made you feel unstable. My husband cheated recently after not being married for a year. He cheated on his ex girlfriends and I thought he would change after he got married NO NOT me why would he cheat on me BECAUSE he's a cheater he has no respect for relationships or females so why not? We are now separating and we are not made at each other I just think I deserve better and want to move on to someone that doesn't have ISSUES.

We as women have to set standards to what we will allow in our life. If you let someone **** on you then they will. Never settle for someone that treats you bad and think of yourself as queen. Yes you will be lonely at first and then you will start to date again and then move on to someone else that you will treat you as you should be treated and you will back and say WOW I STAYED WITH THAT FOR WHAT?

I am lonely now and miss my husband but I love myself more and it is not worth catching AIDS or an STD because your husband can't be faithful and respect the marriage or relationship.  If he loved you he would have sacrificied one night of 15-20 minutes of pleasure for a life time of joy and someone to grow with.  

[blane2]

Njsweetnlight, Step-dad

It was more than a one-time thing. He slept with these women over a period of time while we were engaged. He actually met the one in London before me and was in some kind of secret long-distance relationship that I never knew about until December. So, he messed over her big time.
That being said, I know you are right to a certain extent. I feel as though I am constantly questioning why I'm still with him. Sometimes I think about just leaving, and at other times I think about getting even (I'm really not like that though). It's hard to see all the good things, or the reason why I should stay when I don't trust him.


I thought about snooping. When we had that argument a few weks ago about whether or not he was in contact with his ex's, he asked me how could he know if I wasn't reading his emails again and said that it seemed like I was trying to pick a fight to give myself a reason to leave. The thing is..if I had been reading his emails, then I wouldn't have had a reason to asl him about his contact with ex's because I would already know, and I don't need a reason to leave (I already have tons). Do you think it would be wrong to snoop on him given the situation at hand? Or, is the fact that I'm even thinking about it cause to just get out now?
I really don't believe that he is going to be faithful over the long-term, but I don't want to give up on the small hope that it could happen. I also don't want to give up on my post-graduate degree. Maybe that sounds cold and calculating, but I would feel more financially secure after getting an MBA and leaving versus leaving now in this bad economy. It's not like I'm a gold digger. He's not taking care of me financially, never really did. We each have our own bank accounts and I don't have access to his accounts. If I had, then maybe I would have at least known that he was sending his ex-wife money to help her take care of her (not his) daughter. This was going on even after she got a $30,000 settlement in the divorce. That has supposedly stopped now. did I mention that his ex-wife's daughter convined him to send her money to buy a spa gift-certificate for her mom for Christmas? She's 15 or 16 and doesn't have a job yet and thought it would be a good idea to ask my husband for the money and he gave it to her without even consulting me. I don't know his ex or her daughter, but isn't this the sort of thing that he should have consulted with me about first?
If I could leave with a degree, then I wouldn't ask him for anything.

[mami1323]

blane I think you already did leave him in your mind.  We talked over a pm a couple weeks ago.  I told you my story.  I think that if you have so many doubts, it's best to leave.  But only you know when is the right time to leave, no one can tell you that.  Do it when you are ready.  After my fiance's affair, I snooped through all of his things.  We even got into some serious arguments about me snooping.  He said he didn't trust me because I would go through his things and call the numbers I would see on his phone bill.  It got bad, then finally I told myself, what's the point in this?  I can't stop him from cheating if he's going to do it.  I was only becoming obsessed with catching him doing something.  I guess I didn't want to feel like a fool and feel like I was in the dark and he was doing things behind my back.  But now that I stopped snooping he is more open with things.  He leaves his phone laying around and I don't even go through it.  I guess at some point you have to give them the space and if they choose to cheat then they will do it regardless if you are sherlock holmes.  

[blane2]

Dear Mami,

I remember our conversations well. All I can say is that I'm still in the same state of mind: indecision. I don't know if I can/should ever trust him again, and I know that we are definitely going to end up getting a divorce if I can't trust him. But, we might end up getting one anyway if I try and he lets me down again.I don't want him to lie, or cheat; but I'm not an idiot either. The mere fact that he says that things are different doesn't really mean that anything has changed. Even if he believed that he would never do it again, I don't know if that would mean anything. His words are useless; I need to see some major changes and right now I don't see that. In the meanwhile, I'm trying not to obsess about who he could be emailing, what he could be doing behind my back, who he's spending time with while he is out on his business trips. If I was building a case against him, then I'd have to say that given everything that he has put me through staying with him is not a rational choice.
When I came back I wanted to forgive him. I still want to forgive, but I haven't done it yet. It's hard to let go of everything. Everything that I thought I had to put up with because I believed that things would be better in the future...because I believed that this was what we both wanted.
Now I find myself waking up in the morning and thinking about how I got here, and how I let it get this far. There were so many times when I could have just walked away and I didn't because I love him and I thought that meant I had to put up with everything...his ex-baggage, the hurtful things he's said to me in the past, the cold shoulder he would give me when he was upset with me, or the suspicions I always had because I knew that something wasn't quite right. This morning I woke up and thought about how the two of us weren't even speaking on my graduation day because the day before it dawned on him that he would be partially responsible for my debt from student loans if we got married. He gave me the cold shoulder the day before my graduation. He would barely speak to me so on the next morning I waited for my mom to pick me up instead of going with him. He still went to my graduation, but afterwards when I tried to extend an olive branch and invited him out to a celebratory lunch with my friends and family, he turned me down. This morning I woke up thinking about that and how it felt like I was being punished for not being rich. I worked all throughout university, and I had scholarships, but I also have a mother who was not financially stable and 2 younger siblings that I was helping to look after. I did what I had to do and I never once asked anyone for hand outs. I never asked him to pay off my student loans. I never even expected him to. The reason he was so upset has to do with how his ex-wife who used him for money. She treated him like ****, went a litte psycho and spent up his money, and he did have to pay off some of her bills when they got divorced. Hell, he must have liked it because he was still helping her take care of her daughter financially when we got together. He became friends with her even though she treated him like ****, and of course she was pissed when we got engaged because that was supposed to mean that the money train was ending but it didn't. And, while he was off placating that b£tch, and sleeping around with other women, he was treating me-the person who was really there for him- like ****.I believe that he must be self-destructive, but I'm starting to question if his self-destructive behaviour is my problem. I know it's not my fault, just like I know that if I don't stay it won't be my problem any longer.

[mami1323]

Please go read one of my journal entries "the angry letter" and go to today's journal entry "the test" and you will see what I went through during the affair and what I still go through 7 months later.  All I can say is it takes time, it takes a lot of effort on both parts.  Still sometimes I wonder why I stayed and why I stuck it out.  But in the end, my fiance has made changes, is treating me better and is trying to make it up to me.  If your husband isn't doing those things, you will not forgive him.  You have to see regret and remorse and changes in behavior that are for the better.  If those things are not happening, there is no reason why you should forgive him.  They should bend over backwards to make things right, to make you feel special, to be grateful that you've given him another chance.  If he's not doing that then there is more things wrong here than just his infidelity.  Why don't you try taking some space from him, just so you can rationalize your thoughts?  The thing is, if the infidelity came from the problems in the relationship, and neither one of you seeks counseling or seeks help for the problems, they are still there and it will happen again.  You have to change everything that was damaging to the relationship and build the relationship up to be a stronger one.  If it has cracks it will eventually crumble, but if you seal those cracks it can be just as sturdy and last through the test of time.  I think you have to see if he's really the man for you because it's ok to have those doubts but at some point you need to make a choice to stay or to go.  This wavering spot you are in (pergatory I like to call it), can only last for a short while before you have to decide up or down, in or out.

[crissy578]

I say leave him sweete. You are still young and obviously have a lot going for yourself. This man will probably never change.  And if he has changed then too bad because if he loved you like he says and if he is trying to protect you emotionally, then half of the shi*t he has done to you would not have ever been done. You need to get on that plane (nonstop) and start a new life without him. He is showing you over and over that he is not going to be the man you need him to be (married or not). I am young also and I know what a confused love feels like. You will do better without the stress, worry, diseases, and hurt that this man will eventually bring to your life.

[blane2]

This morning I laid the groundwork for a possible break-up. I decided to be somewhat honest and told him that I don't know that I'll ever be able to forgive him. I mean I thought I could, or at least I thought I should try, but I don't know that I actually have it in me. Living with him and trying to make it work is one thing, but actually forgiving him...I don't know that I can. I know that there's no point in dragging this on if I don't think I have it in me.  I could stay, but I'd still have all this anger and resentment and nothing would really ever be resolved for us.  
He keeps telling me that things have changed, that he has changed. My husband says he's ready to have kids now...he said that he is ready to be accept his age, but all this talk about kids just leaves me with a bad taste in my mouth. We could have had a child together if he hadn't messed me over before. I think it's just too late for us.
Then, there's the issue of privacy and trust. I don't have any trust and he values his privacy so much that his laptop at home is password protected. I'm the only other person there so I have to assume that the password is on there to keep me out which makes me think that he's still keeping things hidden. I'm tired of trying to uncover the truth. I think I'm just plain tired. This relationship has been so toxic to me. Not just emotionally toxic, but physically as well. My skin which was never perfect has gotten a lot worse since we've been together. Now I have hyperpigmentation that I'm going to have to get laser therapy to correct. I went natural when we met and my hair has been shedding and breaking like crazy ever since the termination--and I'm positive that this is related to all the stress I've been under. And, I guess I lied earlier when I said I wasn't angry. I am angry. I am hurt. I am resentful.  I'm not a violent person, but sometimes I catch myself thinking about hitting him or hitting something to help me release all this rage. I've also been fantasizing about getting even with him, not because I want to sleep with anyone else, but because I want him to feel as bad as I do. This is definitely not going to work while a part of me wants to make him as miserable as he has made me. This is definitely  not going to work as long as I can't forgive him because I don't feel that he's done enough to earn it.
The way that things are now...the way that I feel now tells me that this is not going to work unless we both make major changes.

I'm thinking about copying and pasting this post (or all of my posts) in an email to him so that he can have an inkling of how I feel. I am so messed up right now that I was angry when he told me that his sister-in-law was pregnant. He was so excited about being an uncle that he went out and bought some baby clothes to send to them...and he thought it would be a good idea to buy something for our baby too. Yeah, he actually did that...and if he hadn't pressured me into getting an abortion,or cheated on me, or lied by omission by not giving me the ability to make an informed decision when I married him...if he hadn't done all of those things, then maybe I would still be excited by the prospect of having a baby with him. Maybe I would be willing to overlook his other faults, or at least discuss them with him if he hadn't treated me that way, but he did. So, I don't want to even think about getting pregnant or having a baby right now. I get sad now when I think about him holding our baby or what our children would look like, when those thougths used to give me joy. I think it's over and I don't know how to tell him.

[mami1323]

I feel like I'm reading my life story.  It's really really really hard to move past infidelity.  My fiance has a trainer for his body building and his trainer cheated on his wife for over a year with some stupid girl that worked for the old gym he used to train at.  It's been almost 2 years since his wife found out and she still isn't over it.  Forgiveness doesn't have to come so quickly.  You can make it work and still not forgive him.  I struggle every day and put so much pressure on myself to try and forgive my fiance, but it's been almost 8 months and I still have no forgiveness yet but I'm still working on our relationship.  We were in therapy yesterday, things have been bad.  To the point where we were discussing taking a break.  I don't have any trust either and find myself "obsessed", that's what my therapist says, with tracking him down if he's the least bit late.  So I'm "obsessing" and he's pulling away because I'm not giving him that space and during the session he told our therapist that he doesn't think I will ever let it go.  Deep down I knew he was right.  I feel so disgusted by what he did, and so hurt and angry still that I don't know if I could ever move past it.  Plus, I don't trust him when he leaves my side.  How can it work?  Well I figured it can work if I give him that space.  If he were to do it again, it will be over.  They can only get away with it for so long and so if your husband is doing something it will come out.  I know your pride is eating away at you.  You don't want to be played for a fool and so you make sure that you hack into every computer, get every password and do everything possible to not be played.  But that's when you find yourself exhausted and tired and emotionally run down.  It's not a place I want to be anymore and it's not a place anyone should be.  You feel like hitting him, well I've done it.  My anger was so bad I've punched him, pushed him, and even threw a shampoo bottle at his back.  It was so bad that I felt like Chris Brown.  That anger is intense, but you have to control it.  I think therapy has helped a lot.  It really gives us the tools we need in order to succesfully continue to move forward.  We missed 2 weeks and we were ready to take a break.  After our session, we realized we were both communicating poorly and couldn't see each other's perspectives.  If you need to leave, then do it for your peace of mind but if you decide to stay, you need to go to counseling to release that anger and to rebuild the relationship.  I wish you the best, it's a very difficult road to travel.  Trust me, I know all too well.

[blane2]

So, my GP signed me off from work for 2 weeks because I am feeling overwhelmed with school, work, and my marriage. I have assignments due and zero motivation because all I can think about is how f***ed up everything is and how I'm not going to get to complete the degree if I get a divorce because my Visa will probably be invalidated. Then, there's work...2 people are off for health-related reasons and a 3rd person just quit so we're understaffed and overstressed. You already know about my discintegrating marriage from above. After I came back from the doctor's office, I went to work to notify my husband and my employer that I was taking some time off. My supervisor didn't take it well, obviously. And, what did my husband do? Well, he asked me if I had mono. I told him that I didn't have mono, and asked him why he would think that. He said that he had noticed that I seemed tired and drained all the time, but that still doesn't explain why he would think it was mono. So either he's still screwing around and got mono from someone, or he thinks that I'm screwing around and got mono. I mean, why mono as apposed to a cold, or flu?
Anyways, my doctor suggested that I see a therapist on my own, and he said that it would be a shame to give up everything I've worked for because of my husband. He said that I would be letting him win. MY GP said that I shouldn't be afraid to feel angry because it's a much more useful emotion than self-pity. His words actually worked on me. I came home and have been motivated to make a go at my assignments which are due next week. I really needed the time off from work because yesterday I was nearly in tears while still at work.

[charlienlola]

I have read all your  posts and  i  feel for you so much............but if you  read  back the  key  work in all  your posts are UNHAPPY..........

[blane2]

Thank you Charlie,
I know. The therapist told me that my relationship was dead.
It's not about whether or not he's worth forgiving...it's about what I'm worth and I can't make myself be the kind of wife who moves on from this and stays married. I tried that already. I know that I have to find a way to forgive for my own sake. And, I will have to learn how to trust others again, but I don't have to pretend like I trust him anymore. It's kind of liberating, but mostly depressing.
I can't stay here and go to school because I don't think I'd last without a support network. I have few friends here and my husband and I work in the same office. Every day I think about booking a flight home, or somewhere better if I can find a job.

[blane2]

So, I have a confession and a question to ask. I can't believe I'm putting this out there, but the anonymity helps. After I found out about all of my husband's indiscretions, I went to the doctor and got tested for STD's. I made sure that he was tested a well. We were tested for everything. He definitely gave me an STD. When I confronted him about it he said that he may have gotten it from years before because he had a previous partner who had this particular STD, which means that he could have had it all along. It's not HIV or AIDS, but it's an H.
Anyway, knowing about this and trying to deal with this has also factored into my stress level. I've known since January. I've been thinking about contacting the other women (the 2 that I know of) to tell them because I know that he won't. I seriously doubt that he will ever tell them...even if he is still in contact with them. And, I don't want to tell them just to scare them off if they are still in contact with them...but should I tell them anyway? Do I have a right to be the one to tell them?

I think they have a right to know so that they can get treatment and possibly be more careful about having unprotected sex in the future. I have both of their email addresses, and one woman's phone number. I feel like this is something I have to do. I've been putting it off for so long and they could have infected new partners in the time I've known. Of course they would have done so already given how long it's been since either of them has been with them.

[craigmfall]

i was a faithful husband of 20yrs and lost wife and best friend in the classic betrayal.  i had no physical contact for 2-1/2 yrs of separation and divorce until i was officially divorced.
Forgive the tone of what comes next; it is meant with love.

HE MAY BE WHAT YOU WANT. BUT HE IS NOT WHAT YOU NEED. YOUR SOUL IS BEING POISONED DAILY AGAINST ANY POSSIBILITY OF A REAL RELATIONSHIP BECAUSE YOU HAVE STEEPED IN THIS SO LONG THAT YOU ARE TOXIC. ARE YOU STUPID TOO? READ BACK THROUGH YOUR ENTRIES. THAT YOU LOVE IS GOOD, BUT YOURS IS PLANTED IN ROCKS AND WILL NEVER ROOT.

THE ONLY THING WORSE THAN BEING IN A BAD RELATIONSHIP FOR A YEAR IS BEING IN ONE FOR A YEAR AND A DAY!

From all you have said, the most telling is that HE NEVER TOLD THEM THAT HE WAS MARRIED.  NOW, HOW MUCH DO YOU THINK YOU MEAN TO HIM.  GET OUT NOW.

God bless and keep you,
Craig

[blane2]

Craig,
I'm not planning on staying, but thanks for that.
What I want to know is if it's okay for me to tell the 2 that I know about that they probably have the STD. They may or may not know, and if they do know it's not because he told them.
I just want help with the question I asked.
Would contacting them about this be overstepping?

[mami1323]

If what you have is HPV, which you don't have to answer, then he is correct.  He could've had this for years without knowing.  Or you could've had it for years without knowing.  I had contracted it (all before my current relationship) and when I went to my doctor she said that I could've gotten it from either my ex (the one I was with at the time) or I could've gotten it from my first boyfriend.  They also might not have cheated on me but might have gotten it before me.  So it's hard to say when it was contracted.  The problem with HPV is, it lays dorment in the body for sometimes many many years.  So he may not have given it to you during his indiscretions.  Now onto your question.  There may be no point to talking to these women because they may not have given it to him but if you feel like you should let them in on the fact that perhaps he did pass it on or get it from them, then that is purely on you.  I don't think you are overstepping your bounds.  You were the betrayed wife and therefore whatever you want to do is up to you.  I think that if I were in the dark about a possible STD, I would want to know.  Good luck.

[blane2]

Dear all,
I finally booked my flight home. Although my husband doesn't know it, I am leaving for good next week. I don't want to sound like one of those bitter ex's, but now that I am leaving I want to live in the truth. I don't want to leave him with any secrets that could be potentially damaging to others. Before I was just talking about leaving, but the final straw came last week when I found some of his flash drives with pornographic pictures and sex stories. The pictures were all of women bent over on all fours with their genitalia displayed...and to say that there were hundreds of pictures might be a brief understatement. Most of the sex stories were of adults, but some of them (25%) were of adult men with young women (as young as 10). I briefly skimmed through all of the files to see what he had been fantasizing about.  The men in these perverse stories were step-fathers, fathers, uncles, and strangers. The situations were diverse but the sex was always consensual (as if a child could consent). I found this very disturbing as this is someone that I was planning on having children with at one point. He erased all of the flash drives after I confronted him about them. When I asked him about those stories he said that he had been curious about that sort of thing at one point in his life and hadn't looked at the stories in 10 years. They didn't have flash drives 10 years ago. Why the hell would someone carry around sexual stories with them in a relatively new medium, that they haven't looked at in 10 years?. How the hell are you curious about sex with kids? That is a morbid curiosity indeed. I think he is sick..like I'm depressed by this whole situational and that's situational depression...but I think he might be seriously mentally ill.

What's really disturbing about all this is that his ex-wife has a teenage daughter who wants to visit him soon. She was just a child when he married her mother and was angry about the divorce. In August, he sent her money for school clothes without telling me or her mother about it, and in December when the **** hit the fan I found that she'd emailed him about ..well you'll see it below.

Excerpt:
"Her [mom's] pain is so bad that she has these syringes with pain medication in them that she takes when she starts to hurt. I asked her one time how long has she had this pain and she said off and on for seven years. I'm pretty positive thats why things went wrong with you two, and I think thats why she ended it with ****, and she won't date anyone. Mom, said  "some men don't understand its not wanting to, it's just to painful to, so why have another man cheat on me." ( I heard her tell her ***** that) I am assuming that has to do with sex.

Anyway, so i kind of want to do something nice for her for Christmas. I hope you can help. There is this spa place in *****, and I want to get her a manicure and pedicure. The massage portion is too pricey. But the manicure and pedicure is $75, and she gets her eyebrows done. Can you help with that?"

In December, I found this email and he admitted to sending her money without even consulting me first. I did mention to him that I felt it was inappropriate for her to discuss her mother's sex life with him, and he said that when he mentioned that to her she said that her mother wouldn't mind. I believe that her mother would mind if she knew that her teenage daughter was discussing things like this with her ex-husband whose not even the girl's father. All of his secrecy has also weighed heavily on me. I don't think a grown man should have these kind of secrets with children, and I think it speaks to his character that he never mentioned the discussion about sex to her mother. I once threatened to forward the email to her mother and he got really upset. Not only did he basically buy a Christmas gift for his ex-wife, but his relationship with her daughter is completely inappropriate.
So, I've just spilled all his secrets.
I want to contact the 2 women about the H, and I want to let his ex-wife (who hates me) know to think twice about leaving her daughter alone with him. I don't want to believe that he is capable of something like that, but I would hate myself if I found out that he had sex with her after I left and I didn't warn anyone.
When I leave he is going to be lonely, vulnerable and possibly more prone to acting on those fantasies. I really don't want to believe that he is capable of that, but what I've learned from all of this (starting with the affairs) is that I don't know him very well at all. I didn't know what I was getting myself into, and I don't know the person I married.
I've thought about staying for a while to get him to go to couple's and address his issues, but doing that would mean staying in a situation that makes me miserable. I'm a people pleaser. I overlooked all the red flags in our relationship because I wanted to believe in him. If I stay and go to counselling with him, then what? When do I get to leave? There may never be a right time, and counselling may not even really help him.
I'm so confused, but I'm not backing down. As of right now I have a flight back home next week. He thinks I'm visiting my family for a few weeks to get my head straight. He doesn't know that I'm not coming back. I don't believe that this marriage can be saved at this point. There are just too many issues. I would never be able to have children with him because I'd be too afraid of putting a child's life in danger. We would never have a normal sex-life because I am disgusted by all of this and because I know that he is unlikely to wear a condom when he cheats..which means that he could end up giving me AIDS if he cheats with more "clean" looking adult females. I think this has to end now. Everyone's going to hate me if I spill the beans and tell people what he's really  like. They probably won't believe me either. They'll probably shoot the messenger, but I don't think I should keep this to myself. The proverbial sh*t has hit the fan and it's time to show my mettle. If I back down now, what kind of life could I possibly have with him?

[mami1323]

Well that's a whole other story from just cheating on you....this is depraved behavior.  He is a sick man and if I were you I would warn the ex-wife and I would also tell the authorities about your findings.  I'm sorry, that's completely atrocious.  I'm glad you decided to leave him and I'm glad you found what you found.  There is nothing left to say.  Good for you.

[blane2]

Mami,

I don't think there is anything the authorities can do at this point. He erased everything as soon as I confronted him about it. Also,there weren't any pornographic pictures of children. The pictures were of women of all ages and colors in that provocative pose of being on all fours and looking back at the camera. Most of the sex stories contained normal sexual fantacies-men and women- sometimes threesomes 2 women and a man. There were a lot of stories over all but the ones that disturbed me contained female minors and I don't actually think it's illegal to have incest stories or pedo stories. That's why I don't think there's anything I can do other than to tell people and hope they believe me.
This man has too many issues for me to stay with him. On the one hand I want to help, I want him to get better because he is obviously messed up, but on the other hand I think that I'll only be making things worse if I stay only to force him to get help. I don't want to be with him now. I can't look at him the same way. I don't want to have a sexual relationship with him anymore because of...everything that has happened. So, I have to go. I've only confided in one person in my real-life about the sex stories and she said that the therapist I went to was right about my relationship was dead. Turning him into the kind of man I would feel confident having kids with would require too much work..more than I am capable of. Now, I'm actually glad that we don't have any children because I don't even know what I would do if I found all this out and we had kids. I was abused as a child so I know how you carry that pain with you your whole life. If I even thought that he had done that to a child of mine, not even God could protect him from me. I am so serious on that one. I can't give him the opportunity to make that mistake with a child. I was already terrified of having kids because of what happened to me, and now after this I don't know if I will want to have sex again.  I know that sounds crazy, but it's just too much to have to cope with.
I'm a good person.
I overcame my childhood trauma.
I went to therapy for 3 years while I was in college, while I was working to support my family.
I stayed in school.
I graduated Magna *** Laude from my University.
I met someone who I thought I could spend my life with and moved to another country with him.
I did all of that just to find out that he turned out to be a serial cheater with perverse sexual fantacies about young girls.
I'll spare you the why me bit because I'm not that kind of girl anymore.
The only thing left for me to do is to PUSH.

Cheers,
B

[mami1323]

I'm so sorry for what happened to you as a child, I'm understanding to it because I was in a similar situation as well.  I would kill anyone who dare touch my child.  You are doing the right thing.  This has given you strength, probably more than you know you had.  You learned from it and you will make sure that the next man in your life is really who he says he is.  I wish you the best of luck and keep me posted.  He definitely didn't deserve you.

[teko]

I did not read everyones post. But the one reason you can divorce your husband in the eyes of God, is adultry. Do you know how powerful that it. God knows the hurt, betrayal, trust issues, all that come up as a result of one cheating on someone who they claim to love. To me personally, this is the one thing I would not tolerate under any conditions, I would leave and hopefully without instilling major harm on him. Yes him. The women may not be blameless, but I believe it is a decision a man makes to zip or unzip. My heart goes out to you and all that have walked where you walk. Life is too short in my opinion trying to save something that the other just threw away with little or no forethought. To me, in order to do that to each other, you never had a relationship except in your mind.  I vote for leaving and getting your life back and move forward where you will meet someone who has a little more heart and less excuses.

[blane2]

So, I left for the trip to visit my sister on the 28th of last month and I haven't gone back yet. I've been fine for most of the time, but now I am starting to miss him a little bit. I don't understand why that is when I was anticipating getting away. I know that I shouldn't go back..that I should just end things. I miss the person I thought he was. He may have turned into that person by now, but it feels like it's too damned late. He said that he would do therapy if I came back, and warned me not to expect miracles because he's already dealt with all of his issues.
I need some support here.

[Ariom63]

I agree with Teko!  I read alot of your post...and I cannot believe half the things I was reading.  Change???  I don't think he is ever going to change.  He sounds very selfish and his first 2 marriages ended due to cheating and has cheated on you!  Life is a blessing and I certainly would not waste my life on someone who only cared about himself when he laid down with other women. Marriage is a sacred bond between 2 people...you love him and that is why you have not cheated.  It is so easy for anyone to say...."But I have changed, I am a different person."..really???  It does happen but from what you have written seems like he has alot of nasty baggage.  Something I could never have in my life or be a part of.  But then again this is just me!  
You said you miss him...I may be wrong..I think you miss the idea of a relationship, being married.  But after all the pain you mentioned..I would not even have to ask myself how I really felt inside!  It would have been over a long time ago!  

Good luck!

[mami1323]

I agree with Ariom63, of course you miss him.  You have been with him for a long time.  You will miss the good times and I'm sure at some point he was your best friend.  But he cheated on you numerous times and the whole porn and kiddie porn stuff is unforgivable.  The cheating maybe you could work through but not the other things.  He's saying to you "don't expect miracles" just shows he's unwilling to really change.  I would just stay where you are and continue to move forward with your life.  There is only a future of heartache if you stay with this man.

[blane2]

Thank you for your advice. I'm definitely not going back. I just loved him a lot and it's hard letting go, but I do know that I am better off without him. Today I am asking for a divorce. I would call him to discuss, but I'm going to be a total coward and send it in an email. He asked his ex-wife for a divorce in an email-so I figure turn for turn...I mean I know it's not unnaceptable in his book and I think it would be a bad idea for me to talk to him right now.

[Ariom63]

I personally wouldn't even ask him via e-mail...don't be a coward like him...you are so much better than that!  I would just serve him the papers...this is something he will never expect. he knows that even if you send him an e-mail....he will win!  This is just my opinion....too easy and not being sure of myself would make me do that!  but going to an attorney and let them do it....he wouldn't know what him him for 1st time in his life!  

[blane2]

I can't serve him with divorce papers now. I am in the US and there is a 90 day residency requirement in the state I'm from. If I had been here all along, then I could just file and 60 days later the divorce would be final. I could file in Scotland, but they have a mandatory 1 year separation period before it can be finalised.

[Ariom63]

I gotcha!  Didn't know where you are....: )  Then I guess you do know how and what to do!  Just know we are all here and want to help!  But in the end the decision is yours and I am sure you know that.  I wish the best and hope things turn out well for you, which I am sure they will.

[blane2]

Thank you Ariomi, and mami1323. I just have to wait it out here. He's been trying to convince me to come back, but I'm not budging. Sometimes I will need help and support, but I know that I will get through this.

[mami1323]

You are a strong woman, we are here when you are feeling weak and need the support.  Just hang in there.