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ED Issues
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ED Issues

I'm not stranger this forum but had a specific question.  I'm 26, and have dealt with ED intermittantly since I was 19.  I no longer wake up in the morning with erections, and I have an extraordinarily difficult time achieving erections even when masturbating on my own.  It has greatly affected personal relationships and I've been to numerous urologists and primary care physicians over the years who say I'm 100% normal and that there's nothing physically wrong with me.  I've suffered from depression in the past and have a somewhat stressful job, but I've been able to pinpoint an exact observation I was hoping someone could comment on.

What I've noticed is that it takes a while for me to achieve an erection even on my own and I need a substantial amount of physical stimulation.  What I've noticed is that my erections seem to go down rather quickly without stimulation because there is no longer any locking mechanism that keeps my guy erect.  It's as if that sensation/natural ability of the penis to hold blood inside is completely gone/deteriorated.  I don't understand.  I work out daily (twice per day three times per week) have a very healthy diet, I quit smoking cigarettes and marijuana about 2 months ago, and am still having this issue.  I've accepted I'm doomed forever to suffer from ED but wanted to know if anyone knows what the issue is.  Cialis works like a charm but it depresses me that I'd have to rely on a pill at 26 just to get an erection.  Please help...because no more doctors can...I'm so sick of dealing with this.
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1605559_tn?1314796678
Not sure if this helps - but I have also noticed sometimes when masturbating on my own that I can lose my erection.  However, I don't freak out about it or worry about it or get depressed about it.  I attribute it to the fact that I just needs lots of visual stimulation, for lack of a better term, when I masturbate.  When I am in physical relationships, it takes a lot to keep me going.  This made me feel inadequate for a while but, again, I reflected on it and noticed that the best partners I had, ones who made me ejaculate every time, are the ones who were "good participants" as I say.  These are the ones who talked - not necessarily dirty - but told me what I was doing felt good, ran their hands over me, scratched my nipples, grabbed my rear end, or whatever.  Its in your head, trust me.  Just calm down.  Accept the fact that not every sex episode (whether with someone else or alone) is going to be out of this world.  Keep us posted.  I'll add this to my watch list.
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Avatar_m_tn
It's extremely rare for men under 40 to have ED. Or at least it was before internet porn arrived. If you checked out ok with the Doc, then the question is -  it due to excessive use of internet porn?

Over the last 5 years our forums have filled up with young guys with porn-induced ED.

This is a good thread to read through.
http://www.medhelp.org/posts/Mens-Health/22-with-porn-induced-erectile-dysfunction/show/469209

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Avatar_n_tn
Hi Palpateit,

Thanks for the post. I read through the link like you suggested; however, there's a HUGE difference from what these guys were experiencing and what I'm experiencing.  I have enormous issues/trouble getting myself aroused even when I'm by myself!!! I can't remember the last time I woke up with a rock hard erection...just doesn't happen for me anymore.  I'm 26 years old, exercise daily have an impeccable diet, I've been to TONS of doctors (both GP's and urologists) who say that I'm completely physically healthy.  I went on testosterone therapy for a while...didn't do anything.  I went to see a sex therapist...didn't do anything.  I can't even maintain an erection when I'm in the comfort of my own home...it's like my sex drive has disappeared completely.  Thing is, I enjoy sex when I have it (which is only ever through the assistance of pills these days).  It's absolutely 110% pathetic that I'm can't perform naturally or have sex at will.  I've had this issue for years and honestly feel as though I'm doomed.  I'm waiting for the penis pills to stop having their effect and I get to the point where I'm completely impotent.  If you haven't noticed, I'm FUMING at how annoying this problem has become.  I have a job where I'm sitting behind a desk most of the day; however, I don't know if this could be correlated to ED.  Just need help and a magic pill to make this problem go away.  It's affected personal relationships and has completely inhibited me from starting new relationships.  I can't afford to get penis pills because my insurance won't cover it because I do have a clean bill of health, I won't use random pills that are sold online and quite honestly?...I don't think I should have to rely on pills at all at my age.  Like I feel my penis start to fill up but then before it even fills up all the way, it immediately goes away.  I'm sick of it.
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Avatar_n_tn
Sorry for the multiple posts, but I thought I'd mention that even talking dirty and looking at pornographic material doesn't turn me on or make me hard anymore.  I can barely hold onto an erection even when having these things discussed or watching porn.  Unbelievable.  Is there ANY help for me?
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Avatar_m_tn
Have you been using porn continously, that's the question. If you have then maybe it's the cause. It depends on how extreme the porn you are watching is, and how long you've been going at it.
As I said, we have guys who have ED as bad as you are describing. Really.
Look on that thread for my posts. There are links to presentations on ED and porn addiction, and to our sites. You are not that much different.
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Avatar_m_tn
I have a smililar problem. Same effects, but havent been to the doctors yet. I havent tried any pills yet either. I havent had morning wood in forever and masturbation takes a bit to get going. I too eat healthy and go to the gym daily and have similar problems. I can be in the middle of masturbation and I wont be as hard as I used to get. I do however climax, but it takes up to 20 minutes sometimes. I used to be able to rub one out in  or less. I have thought about a testosterone check-up, but at this time I am unable to take a day and visit the clinic. If I come across anything I will post up and let you know. At this point I'm about to give a pill a try and see if it is mental for me. If so than im hoping to use the pill until i forget or run out, then give it a whirl, drunk or sober to see how everything goes... I will be checking back soon. keep talking to us and sending updates
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Avatar_m_tn
Hey man. I suffer from a similar problem. I'm 24 years old and for the past I'd say 9 months I quit masturbating. I felt guilty because I'd been doing it since I was 14 years old. I'd also had sexual partners in the past. Anyway, point is, before I quit masturbating and messing around with girls, I could get these rock hard erections. I know what you mean about the "locking mechanism" too. When my penis would fill up with blood, I could sort of flex it and just feel that it was about to pop from being so hard. Now, though, I've met a girl and we want to fool around. But I can't get hard to save my life. I have this half-wood penis most of the time that can't even find its way into her vagina because it's so soft. The other night, we were fooling around and she ran to the closet to get a condom (literally like 10 seconds away) and when she got back I had gone totally soft. I don't know what the deal is, but its embarrassing as hell. When I was younger, I could literally get rock hard at will - whenever I wanted to. I think it may now have something to do with the fact that my penis hasn't been "exercised" in a long time and my mind isn't constantly on sex. But anyway, just thought I'd share that I know what you're going through.
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Avatar_m_tn
I just wanted to let you know that I completely understand what you are going thru. I'm a guy in my late 20's and I have struggled with erection problems in the past. I was addicted to P/M from a early age probably around 14 or so. Was shy around girls and used it as an outlet to release. Did not really get my first girlfriend till after college and had some issues w erections but was able to have a decent sex relationship and then after we broke up a few years back i got back into P/M heavily, I did not even understand that there was a connection between that and a lack of erections w my new girlfriend. I completely understand it when you say your erections are just non existent and masturbating takes along time if at all. I have not masturbated since mid January and not seen any porn since mid February. Its immensely frustrating to be attracted to your partner and not get that rock hard boner. I wish you luck on your journey and just hope that with more time and patience things will work out.
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Avatar_n_tn
So it's happening again.  

I've met an amazing girl, have been seeing her for the past month and have not hooked up, and then on Saturday, we went to have sex for the first time and I failed miserably.  I found myself feeling aroused and then the moment she said she wanted to have intercourse, I immediately went limp.  Even with her performing oral on me, I could not even gain the slightest erection.  What is wrong with me!?!?!?!?! This problem has been happening WAY TOO LONG for me to be calm about it anymore and it really does damage personal relationships.  I had to pop 20 mg of Cialis just to have sex and I've been noticing that it's losing its effectiveness for me.  Also, I went to fill out a prescription this morning for more Cialis and my insurance company won't cover it.  Am I just doomed to not be able to have sex anymore because I can't afford buying the pills out of pocket?  Is it safe to by generic versions of this medication online?  I'm sick of this.  I'm 26 years old and should not be having this issue.  For Christ's sake I should be in my prime right now.  I masturbate about 2-3 times per day and my f-ing erections are still weak and take forever to get hard (only achieve about 85-90% firmness these days).  I don't know what to do anymore.  I hate taking pills to have sex because at my age, I'd like for it to be a spontaneous thing, but it's not.  It's an f-ing chore and I hate it.  What can I possibly do at this point?  My doctors all say I'm 100% healthy and that there's nothing wrong with me.  I'm an athlete, eat very clean and stay in shape.  I don't know why my penis is not cooperating.  PLEASE HELP BEFORE I SNAP!!!
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Avatar_m_tn
You never directly answered the question. - Have you been masturbating to porn?

If the answer is yes, then what you are experiencing is quite normal. We have been seeing it for 5 years with thousands of guys. If you continue to masturbate to porn your problem will get worse. We have seen guys who not only cannot get erections with real-life partners, but cannot get erections to the raunchiest porn

Doctors, and the adivisors on this site, are ignorant of porn-induced ED.

Go back to this thread and "control + F" palpateit. Look at my first few posts and follwo the links to the presentations and articles. Then you will get it. ou will understand that the pills only work on the penis, but the problem is in your brain - where erections are conrolled.
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Avatar_m_tn
Here's one man's account (age 34) of getting his erections back after porn-induced ED:
-----------------------------------------------------
So it has been the full 90 days and then some, so I just wanted to update since 3 months seems to be the average amount of time to fully reboot, from what I've seen. And, well...everything is perfect. I can honestly say that I've never had a stronger or healthier libido. I am more sensitive than I've ever been down there, and like another gentleman wrote on YBOP, sometimes I actually have to concentrate on NOT getting a hard-on. Seriously. This whole thing is rather unbelievable.

I actually began MO every few days and that's just perfect for me. It all feels very natural and healthy. And I certainly don't do it just for the hell of it or because I'm bored. It's only when the urge truly strikes me and when it would in no way interfere with any other part of my life. For me, abstaining for a period of time was not only necessary to reboot, but also to teach myself some serious self-discipline in this area.

It's funny how much we obsess over this. We worry, freak out, feel like complete s**t, and we read and write volumes about how this problem is seriously f**king up our lives. Yet, the solution is very simple. We really couldn't ask for anything more. Yes, 3 months is a long time if you spend it inside of your head worrying like mad. So get a hobby. Get something to keep your mind occupied in another way. You have to take that option away from your brain.

So...that's that. A few facts:
1. This is 110% fixable*
2. It will likely be one of the most difficult things you've ever done
3. If you ever want a normal sex life again, you kinda don't have another choice.

WE ARE ALL CAPABLE OF FIXING THIS. SO FIX IT.

*I say this b/c I do feel about 10% better than I ever have @ my best
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Avatar_n_tn
Thanks for the feedback.  

I have actually stopped watching porn altogether for about a month now per your suggestion and am not noticing any changes.  I had even stopped smoking marijuana (about 2 months) and still...no change (physicians and urologists I've seen don't think this is the issue).

I'm going to continue abstaining from porn; however, I still masturbate about two - three times per day.  It's literally killing me inside the fact that I failed as badly as I did with this new girl.  It absolutely makes me feel less of a man and I feel pathetic.  I don't know what more I can do at this point.  Without changing anything about myself; however, I've been able to have sex normally with other women I've deemed less attractive for lack of a better term.  No issues, just straight sex.  This leads me to think it's more in my head, but I find it VERY hard to believe that an issue with my head would affect things so drastically like nighttime erections, etc.  Even masturbation I have a difficult time achieving and maintaining an erection.  Unless you experience it first hand, no one knows just how unbelievably depressing this is...
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Avatar_m_tn
It takes about 2- 3 months to recover from ED without porn AND masturbation. Most guys flatline - no libido - from week 2 on, for several weeks (but it is highly variable.)

We have not seen anyone recover from porn-induced ED that continued to masturbate everday during the recovery period. Especially if fanasize about porn.

It seems as though you have NOT follwed the links and watched the video series "porn and erectile dysfunction". Have you? Or the series on porn addiction?

Have you visited yourbrainonporn (the links were on the thread) and read the material?
If not, you really need to get educated. Nothing you are experiencing is unsusual at all.
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Avatar_n_tn
So I've made the conscious decision to refrain from pornography, smoking marijuana and masturbating for a bit to see if it helps at all.  I've tried all of these things before (minus the porn thing) but nothing ever seems to work.  People with whom I've spoken about this problem have said it sounds like I'm putting too much pressure on myself.  It's kind of impossible though to not when you know you have this problem.  It's like telling someone to NOT pay attention to the big pink elephant in the corner of the room.  It just ***** and sex in and of itself isn't fun.  I feel like at 26, I'm missing out on a lot...
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Avatar_m_tn
I do wish you well, however we wouldn't be having this discussion if you watched the presentations on 1) ED and Porn, 2) Porn Addiction at yourbrainonporn. The links are on the thread I posted.

You would understand the phjysiological mecanisms that lead to porn-induced ED, and exactly what to do and not to do. You would get it.  As stated, MD's and Sex therapists don't recognize this problem. It's too new, and neither understand adiction (addiction) neurobiology. I've taught anatomy physiology to future MD's so I know what they know.

The site has numerous accounts of guys recovering from ED, along with many articles on erection, porn, sex.

Make this easy on yourself - understand this problem. Oh by the way there is no research on marijuana causing ED.
Here's the only research ever done on porn and performance -
-------------------------------------------------------------

SCIENTISTS: TOO MUCH INTERNET PORN MAY CAUSE IMPOTENCE (2011)

It may not make you go blind, but Italian scientists have identified a worrying side-effect of watching too much pornography.

Researchers said Thursday that young men who indulge in "excessive consumption" of Internet porn gradually become immune to explicit images, the ANSA news agency reported.
Over time, this can lead to a loss of libido, impotence and a notion of sex that is totally divorced from real-life relations.

"It starts with lower reactions to porn sites, then there is a general drop in libido and in the end it becomes impossible to get an erection," said Carlo Foresta, head of the Italian Society of Andrology and Sexual Medicine (SIAM).

His team drew their conclusions from a survey of 28,000 Italian men which revealed that many became hooked on porn as early as 14, exhibiting symptoms of so-called "sexual anorexia" by the time they reached their mid-twenties.

There was some good news, however, as the condition was not necessarily permanent. "With proper assistance recovery is possible within a few months," Foresta said.

Other data presented at the SIAM'S annual conference in Rome suggested that Germans are the biggest consumers of online porn in Europe, with 34.5 percent of internet users logging on to watch smut.

France ranked second (33.6 percent), ahead of Spain (32.4 percent) and Italy (28.9 percent)
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Avatar_n_tn
I started to watch the links and the information you provided yesterday and plan on finishing reviewing them today.  A quick question regarding this though, not that I disagree with your assessment; however, pornography has existed for a long time (way before the internet even existed).  Were men experiencing these same problems when porn only existed in the format of movies and magazines?  Just curious as to what would make internet porn so much more damaging to a male's sex drive.

Again, I'll watch the videos and review the links and maybe these questions are answered in there already.  Was just curious.

Thanks.
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Avatar_n_tn
So I finally read through the link you provided and I definitely have to say I can relate to many of the men on that forum.  I had no idea that masturbating to pornography could have such damaging effects but when I think about my own situation, it makes sense and is probably the one avenue I've not yet explored.  

However, to my point above, as porn has been around for a long time (way before the internet) what is it about internet porn that makes it more damaging?  Has it always been this way and is only now being recognized as a cause of ED?  Also, I think it's important to note that even though I've looked at porn on a daily basis and have masturbated to it at least 1-2 times per day (sometimes more) for years, I've never gotten into extreme porn with hardcore fetishes.  Just something to note.

The one takeaway I took from that thread, and that was contrary to what I've read before, is that it's important to not stop masturbating...just stop masturbating to porn specifically as it robs you of your imagination.  Am I correct when I say that?

I'm still keeping very active, take vitamins, work out daily and will continue to do so as I imagine this could only help my chances.  Like I've said, I've checked out with numerous doctors (both urologists and primary care physicians) who all say I check out just fine physically and am actually more healthy than most people.  That's always a plus.  I'm going to refrain from smoking marijuana on a daily basis and keep it to a once or twice on a weekend type deal, keep masturbation down to once per day without porn, and give it a few weeks to see if there's any change.  Until then, I'm going to continue using cialis while engaging in sex for the time being until I hopefully start experiencing morning erections again and can easily masturbate.  The whole failure in bed thing is devastating to me as I've been struggling with it for so long, but I really really hope that I've finally identified what's been eating away at my libido and erections.

Let me know if I'm understanding the threads correctly and that this seems like a good course of action and I'll keep you posted with my progress.  Thanks again for the advice.
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Avatar_m_tn
All good questions. All answered at yourbrainonporn.
I am not allowed to post links, but there are links on my first 2 posts on that thread. That's why I gave your the thread, so you will follow the links to the website - yourbrainonporn. That's what I keep referring to - the website - NOT the thread I linked.

There are 2 video presentations on the site that answer everything you ask - and a whole lot more. Watch both ASAP
1) Porn and Erectile Dysfunction
2) Your Brain On Porn - Porn addiction

Go to FAQs on the site and start with this question - "Is my erectile dysfunction (ED) related to my porn use?"
It links to several articles and other FAQ"s on porn and ED, and all the guys accounts of recovery.

Go to Tools for change - and see what to do, not to do.

Please go to the website and save your self time and frustration.




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Avatar_n_tn
Thanks again for the recommendation of reviewing yourbrainonporn.com.  I watched the 4 part video series and also reviewed the FAQ section and many of my questions were answered; however, and maybe I missed this, but there's one component that makes me think that I MIGHT not have this issue.

From what I reviewed on the website, in addition to the testimonials posted on the page, it appears as though the men that were addicted to porn at the very least could achieve a normal erection while masturbating.  In other words, their ED issues were only experienced when they were masturbating without the visual aid of porn or were trying to engage in intercourse with a real-life partner.

My issue is that I have just as much trouble trying to achieve an erection even in the comfort of my own home when I'm by myself, even with porn.  I feel my penis start to fill up; however, it NEVER gets fully inflated and will quickly deteriorate without constant physical stimulus.

Again, maybe this was something I missed but if you could clarify, I'd appreciate it.  Thanks again for your help.
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Avatar_m_tn
We only put up a small sample of the accounts, but even some of those mention your symptoms. So yes, there were a few men that couldn't achieve erections even with porn. And many men who also required constant stimulus. Did you follow all the links in the ED question?

There are even men who say their penises have become smaller in length and girth due to porn, then return to normalm size once they recover. What that means is those men too were not becoming fully engorged with blood.

When porn users hit the wall, they usually move into more extreme or strange genre of porn in order to keep the excitement. Have you done that?

Either way, you sound like a classic case of porn-induced ED. Especially since you checked out fine medically, because what other cause could there be for somone your age? It's clearly not anxiety as you cannot get it hard when alone. Anxiety is the usual answer by sexologists. You are medically fine. Try what has worked for many men - returning your brain to normal sensitvity.

I would suggest looking at more FAQ's, such as Rebooting, and withdrawal, or any others that relate. And especially watch the 6-part series - your brain on porn - to really understand what has occured in the brain, Knowing helps you steer in the right direction.

Also check out the support page for active forums, you may need them to do this.
I know you are focused on your ED, as you should, but you will receive other benefits for leaving porn behind.
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Avatar_m_tn
Here's an account from a man who could not get erections no matter what he did. It was on the page I sent you to. Did you go to the bottom of the page? It has 4 links to many accounts.

As stated, we only put up a few on yourbrainonporn as they we get 100's of post per day sometimes - just on our forum over at reuniting. Once guys start talking to each other on the forums, they need no more acounts.

-------------------------------------------
"Before I started this healing process, I was having trouble with erections. I was needing more and more types of stimulation from porn and it still was not helping. I was getting really worried about the whole thing. It had been getting worse and worse for a couple years.

The anxiety just helped push me deeper into porn as it went along. Hard to believe I could keep getting deeper into it. I mean I probably used every type of porn image and video out there except for child porn. What scares me is, could I have gone that route, too, one day? Now I will never know. I am very grateful for that at least.

The more I go without porn masturbation and orgasm, the more difficult it becomes to not get an erection. LOL. Yeah, I have had one or two times in the last few weeks where I had to calm myself or be embarrassed.

So in my round about way I am trying to say that if you stay away from porn and masturbation your sexual desire will go up. It will go up in a good way. OK, that sounds funny rereading it. Did not mean it that way - bad wording. It is a serious topic and touchy. I know."
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Avatar_n_tn
I've not watched extreme or strange porn, but I guess my taste has definitely gravitated towards a more intense version of porn (e.g., groupsex, etc.).

Now that I've actually taken the time to reflect on my porn usage, I'd say that I most likely am a porn addict.  For years, I've watched porn two-three times per day and have masturbated just as much.  I thought this was normal for a guy and/or I just had a very active libido.  I've also been with a LOT of women and thought that maybe once you've seen as many vaginas as I have, you start to lose interest.  However, given that we as humans do have that primal urge to procreate, I can only imagine that our natural instinct is to NOT get bored of sex.  I've actually found myself in the company of women who I just knew I could get into bed and either A. I'd rather do something else (like go for a drink, see a movie, smoke marijuana, etc.) and I'm wondering if this is because I know in the back of my head that my sex drive/erections are not what they used to be, or B. was dreading getting into that situation because I had that fear in the back of my head of not being able to perform properly.

Also, does it sound as though I have an extreme case of porn addicition given what I just told you?  Again, while my erections were not 100%, I was able to perform multiple times per day sexually with a girl for a months (we broke up late January/early February).  

Let me know what you think whenever you can.  Thanks again for your continued support.

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Avatar_n_tn
Hey palpateit,

Quick question.  I've obviously been unable to think about much else other than my ED issue; however, had a quick question.  I've been refraining from masturbating and watching porn (nearly a week now) and haven't had much improvement yet :/.

I'm going to continue on this path and see how it works for me as I've already explored every other option, but was wondering if you or anyone else had any idea as to what the normal masturbation rate is for a guy at my age (26).  I know, I know...you're going to say "everyone's body is different" and I totally get that.  But I guess I'm more curious to find out if I was excessive for my age.  I basically would masturbate anywhere from 1-4 times per day for years (usually about 2-3).  Mostly ALWAYS with porn.  JW if that sounds like the excessive masturbation could also be a root cause for my issue.

Thanks.
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Avatar_m_tn
4 letters to remember DHEA, problem is that you are young, me I'm 63 going on 64 and I've just started taken it, and its working for me,  but you first need to read all about it and its side effects before you go any were near DHEA, theres lot of info on Web MD and on ED.
But heed the warnings, and thats a must, if it works then you like me will be back to happy days.
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Avatar_f_tn
I have had similiar problems...im 23 years old but masturbating is not a problem i can get hard and ejaculate just fine, but when it comes to the real thing sometines i cant performe and sometimes i can...i noticed that when im drunk i get hard and performe just fine but most times when im sober i cant get hard enough....i think my problem is psychological beacause i keep thinking " what if i cant get hard" and that messes with my mind and stops me fro getting hard, but when im drunk i just dont care....i havent tryed any pills for when im sober but im about too, to see what happens...what should i do, should i seek medical help? Please help thanx
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Avatar_f_tn
I have a similar problem...im 23 and when im drunk i can get hard and performe just fine, but when im sober sometimes i cant get hard enough to have sex...also masturbating is not a problem i get hard and all that stuff, the problem is when im sober....i think its psychological because i keep thinking what if i dont get hard and messes up my mind and thats exactly what happens i dont get hard, but if im drunk i dont think about it...i havent tryed taking any pills for when im sober but im thinking about it...should i see a doctor? I dont know what to do please help....thanx
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Avatar_m_tn
I get a Bonner even watching a full dressed hot girl. I have been watching porn videos a lot. MO has caused my penis tilting towards left from the base and even from the middle. I never had sex during my 20 years life. I am now worried a lot especially about the tilt.
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Avatar_f_tn
I wish i had an answer. But i am literally dealing with the same ******* thing and the only answer i found is Vascular leakage. Basically the veins that pump blood into the penis work but the veins that hold the blood dont function right. The symptoms seem to be what im basically dealing with. The problem is that surgery is the only answer. Its called Vascular artery bypass
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139792_tn?1299416777
You may google the following exercises or massage.
Male deer exerdise
kegel exercise
Circulating sexual energy around microcosmic orbit,
Peripheral anal prostate massage.
abdominal prostate massage,
Internal prostate massae,
Perineum massage Read them and pick up anyone you understand and like it. You may start with male deer exercise. Satkriya is for incresing sexual energy. prostate massages will help overall improvement in sexual activity. If done properly, they will give you permanent results.
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Avatar_n_tn
Looking for an update on your progress. Have you committed to a reboot (no porn, no visual fantasy, no mast.) and followed through?

I am very curious to hear back - I have been experiencing identical symptoms for some time now - over four months.
Cheers,
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Outside London, United Kingdom
80052_tn?1358657300
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jefelex
way off the beaten track!, BC
1236893_tn?1394988190
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gymdandee
NJ
8476383_tn?1405137991
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JacquiOlliver
New Zealand