AGP's Insomniac Theatre Open for Business!

WELCOME TO INSOMNIAC THEATRE featuring AGP and the Trying To Concievers.  Today's program features Hot Flashes, Mood Swings, OPK, The Infamous Baby Dancers, and the much anticipated BFPs!   We hope Aunt Flo doesn't show up because she tends to ruin the show.  Be sure to boo her off the stage if you see her sneaking around!  We'll have a special appearance from donor 1982, DH and the Injectables.  Don't miss it!  It's sure to be a heck of a show.  

[fifi blue]

Lisa, you are too funny.  God bless ya.

f.

[babyalive]

Hey Cyber-sisters.  I wanted to say Happy Valentine's Day!!!!  I'm having a Valentine's Day party in my classroom today and not one, NOT ONE single parent answered my request to volunteer.  So, looks like it'll be a one woman show.  Oh well, seems I'm getting use to that theses days.

I want to leave you with a quote for this Valentine's Day.  I'm going to take the day off from thinking about ttc and celebrate my life (and body) just the way it is in this moment.  Because this moment is really ALL we've got!  

"The destination is "to be" and not to arrive somewhere else". (Paul SC, Collins, GM: Inneractions - Visions to Bring Your Outer and Inner Worlds Into Harmony.)

Well, off to celebrate this moment and take Dear Sparky on a walk. It's 5:30am, dark and cold outside and theres a mile long mountainous hill I must climb at the start of my walk.  Oh celebratory joy, I will enjoy each stride and moment of it!  (-:

[HeathJo]

Hey--I just pm'd you. I om on my out to get my progsterone test. Love the Insomniac Theatre reference!!!!

Talk to you later (hopefully). 8dpo,cd22 and feeling very much the Debbie Downer.

[magda_s]

Lisa that was GREAT!  The Insomniac Theatre thing, I mean.  And the Valentine's quote too.  I took the time to send my hubby a card in which I explained that despite the stresses of what we are trying to do and in case he's wondered at any given moment due to my moods etc... that I am SO lucky to have him in my life.

Heather, I'm so sorry you're still not feeling too great.  But honestly, sometimes I think you just have to let yourself be miserable and curl up on the couch with a tub of ice cream or whatever else you might want to spoil yourself with, whether that be a food item, a facial, or somthing else.  And all the while you have to just keep telling yourself that no matter how bad you might feel, that this too WILL pass because nothing lasts forever.  That's gotten me through a number of down phases when I haven't been able to do something to drag myself out of it... just tellin gmyself that when this day is over, it'll be a new day and I might feel better and if I don't then I just have to get through that day until another one comes along.

Personally, now that I've found my new doctor and we've come up with a date-plan, I'm going to spend the next few days trying very hard not to think about TTC at all.
And I'm also going to try to lose the TEN pounds of put on over the last few months.
Is there something about IVF that makes one gain weight?????  
Hugs and SSBD to all.

Helen, just an FYI... I'm not going to be in the 2WW until around the 4th of April now.

[Helen72]

Heather,
I bet your progesterone # is the highest it's ever been!  That will certainly cheer you up.

Lisa,
enjoy the celebration.  Your life certainly warrants a celebration!  An independent self-sufficient woman like yourself should be proud of your many achievements and healthy lifestyle.  I wish I could celebrate Lisa Day with a big drink but I am in 2ww  :(  I can only hope that Empty will have one for me!

Magda,
I am stuck in 2ww land but hope to move on in some direction in the nearest future (in a week).  I just wanted to say how much I admire your strength to live through what you went through with so much grace and to keep trying.  You are my inspiration!

[ms320]

Helen:  Or should I say Halya.  Your mention of your heritage brought back many fond memories of my early 20's when I became an honorary Ukie (of course it required a great many shots of Vodka, but it was well worth it. NASTROVIA)  Sorry to hear about the evil MIL.  Her loss is our gain.  Perhaps if she was the kind of person you could talk to, you wouldn't have stumbled upon this site.  Any symptoms or twinges?  Don't mean to add to the stress, just curious.

Lisa:  What's up with those parents.  Not even one willing to pitch in.  I am sitting here, not working now, I would have come to help.  I would have even gone for a walk with Sparky.  

Heather:  I am feeling a great progesterone #.  My fingers a crossed.


I am feeling a little crampy right now. Usually means AF in less than a day.  For the first time in a very long time, I welcome her with open arms.  The priming portion of my cycle is over.  Once AF shows, I begin the stim portion on CD2.

[magda_s]

Helen... sorry... how did THAT happen???  I'm obviously totally out of touch so do forgive me.  Here I thought you weren't going to be in 2WW for some time yet!  Duh!
Again, my apologies.  And thank you for the very kind words.  I feel they are totally undeserved because I feel that I had no choice in the matter, but thank you anyway!
I guess the same can be said for all of us... we get knocked down again and again but we're all still here supporting one another and plugging away at TTC.

Mary, you sound so positive and that's GREAT to hear.  Good luck.

Lisa, I can't say I'd have volunteered to help but I'd definitely have gone for a walk with Spraky!  (much as I'm desperate to have children and much as I love my friends' and family members' children, I'm SO not good with large numbers of little people!!!)

Right... I'd best gear up for the next bit of DH's daughter's visit... she was away for 3 days and much as she's been lovely, it was so much more stressful than I expected.  It's the first time one of them visit us since we were married and I can't stop stressing about whether she's happy or not, whether I'm crowding her or not spending enough time with her, whether she's bored, whether she likes the kind of food I cook... ooofffffff.... and frankly, at 36, I just don't feel equipped to deal with my DHs 24 year old daughter!  But in all fairness, it's gone fine.  I treat her like a friend and it's been fine... ten more days!!!

[HeathJo]

Magda--You probably think I am such a putz for being all moddy for no reason at all after what you have had going on! You are sweet :-) I agree about having full on pity parties when needed. This mood is different than sadness, it's like a void of emotion and motivation. Luckily, it's getting a bit better today, as I got some sleep. Thanks for your concern, and good for you for focusing on life, not just TTC.

Helen--I am a geographical and political idiot, so I don't even really understand the whole USSR, Russia, Ukraine thing. Pathetic, huh? What an advertisement I am for Tulane!! But, I have always wanted to raise my kids bilingual, or even trilinguil, as I know how difficult it is to learn a foreign language. When I lived in France I was amazed at how everyone in Europe spoke at least 2 languages. I also got an interesting viewpoint about the pros and cons of being an American citizen. I am so impressed by what a "woman of the world" you are! (Magda also--she and I have even exchanged a couple of pm's in French!) I love finding out more about each of us here, and it amazes me how much we can all relate to one another despite how different our backgrounds are.

Mary--I am so very excited for you. . .I have a great feeling that you will be pg soon. Must be nice to not mind AF coming, for once!  You know my prayers and thoughts are with you :-)

Lisa--You are so dang cheerful it makes me feel guilty! Seriously, you are in and of yourself an inspiration. The quotes are nice, but your own wisdom is always better in my opinion! Sorry about the lazy parents, but maybe it is a blessing, since they can probably be as bad as the kids at times :-D

Well, I did get the results of my progesterone test. My level was in the mid 40's! Zoinks! I guess I really did super-ovulate, since every other level has been in the 9 or 10 range. This means I don't have to fill the script for progesterone suppositories--YAY. Those don't sound too fun. I scheduled a blood test for pregnancy next Wednesday. I just cannot do the whole POAS thing. I don't trust it for some reason. (Gawd, I am beginning to sound like a paranoid schizophrenic!) I really don't feel any signs of AF, except a bit of soreness in the boobs. This is the first month in a looong time that my skin is clear, I am not all weepy, and not craving chocolate. It's such a mindf*ck, pardon my French. I don't know if it is my new regime, or if I could be pg, or what. I guess we'll find out next Wednesday. In the meantime, spontaneous bursts of extreme hunger and tiredness is what my world is all about.

Thanks again to each and every single one of you for being here for me during this rather rough last few days. I can honestly say I love you all!

I wonder how Lexima (Milana) is doing??? I miss her.

[Helen72]

Told ya!!!  I knew your level will be super high!  That's a good beginning.  Bursts of extreme hunger and tiredness are also promising. I bet this is going to be your month!

[ms320]

HeathJo:  Wow, what an awesome number.  Hope it is a sign that everything is falling into place for you.

[fifi blue]

Glad you're feeling a bit better.  Fingers are crossed for next Wednesday.

[babyalive]

Mary and Magda, thanks for wanting to go on my walk with Dear Sparky and me.  He and I would have really enjoyed the company!  

Heathjo, it is so funny how "cheery" I am feeling.  I was telling Helen in a pm earlier that I feel like the HCG was a happy pill. I've just been in this great mood and don't even know why!   However, last month I was feeling exactly as you are.  VERY, VERY depressed, lethargic, unmotivated and really rather hopeless.  It was by far the worst month I've had since ttc.   I don't know anything that brings one out of those feelings other than time.  Also, like I mentioned earlier, a change of scenery sometimes really helps too.  My prescription for you is to take a candle lit bubble bath, turn on some low mellow music, maybe even invite dh to join you in the bubble bath.  Have a good long cry and read a cheap taudry novel, or  if you're artisitc do some drawing/sketching or paints.  Feed your soul in some way completely unrelated to ttc.    My prayers and thoughts are with you!    Also, like Helen said this could very well be your month!


Helen, my steadfasts friend.  Thanks for the compliment.  Lisa day, very cute!!   I hope you and dh have a nice Valentine's Day dinner tonight.

Fiona - Have you and dh made romantic plans tonight?



I  had a fun, full exhausting day with the little tykes and then Sparky and I had a nice little evening walk as the sun was going down.  Then, I met my mother for a greasy, Valentine Day dinner.  Would much rather be with dh wherever he may be at this moment.  (See I get to live all the romance vicariously through each of you).  I can hear the collective moans now "ttc is NOT romantic!"  I know, I know, but my dreams are all I have at this moment.  Want to hear something else....I POAS!  LOL (I'm laughing so hard at myself right now!)  2 dpo, and I POAS.  Now I had my reasoning.  I wanted to just experience what seeing two lines would feel like.  (Oh gosh, I am just cracking up at myself!)  I thought that way I'll at least feel like it is possible.  Of course it was BFP.  (But really just the HCG)  think I 'll frame it.  (-:

[HeathJo]

Thanks guys. We shall see.

[magda_s]

Heather, you don't seem pathetic at all !!!  If I've learned anything from the last few months of TTC, it's that you really can't judge others because you just never know how something that you may know nothing about might be affecting them.  I've seen myself react to things in ways I never dreamed were 'me' and we have to accept that it all takes its toll.  Plus, I am absolutely certain that the lack of sleep is not helping you in the slightest.  My GOD!  The first thing lack of sleep does is affect your mood and energy levels!  However, I hope you're feeling a bit better for the high levels.

Helen, how are you doing in 2WW-land?

Lisa, you're TOO funny!  But the firghtening part is I SO understand you and now I want to do the same!!!  I have one HPT that I found in the bottom of my drawer and I'm thinking I might actually save it for the day I get the HCG shot just to see those two lines.  God how I'd LOVE to see those two lines!!!
Aren't we daft!?!?!

[HeathJo]

Oh how sad, I am the only one awake! I am running rampant in the Insomniac Theatre, turned up all the lights, and am cranking up the music as loud as it goes! Might as well, seeing as how I won't be disturbing any other of you nice folks.

I just got through reading a bunch of internet stuff on early pg signs and am convinced I will get a BFN. I am not nauseous, my bbs look the same color, no implantation bleeding--NADA senoritas! I am more trying to convince myself so I won't be too disappointed next week when I get the blood test. I am sure I will go ahead and cave in and POAS before Wednesday if I am still unsure.

Today is 9dpiui,cd23, so the earliest I would test would be Monday (12dpiui,cd26).

[magda_s]

I saw that a post from you came through and thought, "Oh NOOOOOO... she's awa-a-a-a-ake!!!!!!"
And Heather, I truly do understand the trying to convince yourself of a BFN.  That's very much me... I go a step further and can't admit that's what I'm trying to do because I tell myself I really have to BELIEVE it otherwise I'll jinx myself!!!!!  Talk about being daft!
But you know, my sister had no symptoms at all.  To the point that she was convinced the lab had got test results mixed up with someone else.  She didn't believe she was pregnant until she saw a heartbeat.
I'm sure you've tried everything there is to try but would warm milk help at all?  I used to suffer a fair bit from insomnia and much as it might sound like an old wives' tale, warm milk did actually help.

[empty]

Heather are you still up??? Well girls i had more wine tonight....i think i am now offficially getting dutch courage for the next 4 days before my appt with the clinic. What of they laugh at me and say it was all a dream and they actually meant i would have no chance of having a baby. ok obviously i need another drink to calm down now. hic!

[babyalive]

Emtpy - LOL, you sweet little lush.  (-:       I don't think there is any chance at all of that happening.  You have every chance of having a baby.  LOTs, and LOTs of women have babies with one good tube.  It only takes one tube, to release one egg, to produce one baby.  You've got it a goin' on girl!  You have the goods!!

Heatherjo - The insomonia is murder!  I once went 9 days without sleeping.  Came to find out my thyroid was off. But, boy did I become a different person in those 9 days and EVERYTHING, I mean EVERYTHING was magnigified.  Things that normally, I wouldn't bat an eye at, would send me over the edge.  On the rare occasion that I would sort of 1/2 drift off for 30 - 40 minutes, I would then wake up with the racing heart and panic attacks.  I think your insomonia that your experiencing now,  is hormonally induced.  At least you are able to get some naps in so your body and mind is at least getting some kind of rest.  Like Magda said I'm sure you've tried everything.   But, sometimes when it's been going on for a few days or more, the insomonia feeds on itself.  And it can just keep getting worse and worse.  I know your in 2ww, but maybe for just one night to maybe get yourself back on track - you should take something for it.  Tylenol PM, or if you have anything stronger like Ambien, or Xanax.  Just for one night might give you some reprieve.  Hope your sleeping now.


Magda - I  highly recommend you POAS when you KNOW it's going to be BFP.  It really does lift the spirits and gets you into the mind set, that YES this may happen after all.  

[fifi blue]

Heathjo, I feel so bad for your insomnia.  Can you take some herbal remedy like melatonin?  Of course the stress of tww isn't helping.  

You know I've never POAS!  

Lisa, I had a very unromantic Valentine's day.  My dh went home (Ireland) on Tuesday, he's not back until Monday.  I spent the night feeling sorry for myself, cried for a couple of minutes and then I watched Lost.  I love that show although I have no idea that's going on half the time.

Magda, you are an amazing lady and an inspiration.  

Empty, please have a drink for me.  Best of luck with your appt.
Helen, how is tww going.  I'm praying for you.

[ms320]

HeathJo:  I really feel for you.  I hope this insomnia works itself out quickly.  It must be especially difficult for you since your sleep was disrupted for years with your neck pain.  It is certainly not what you need now.  TTC and 2WWs are torturous even under the best circumstances.  I'm pulling for you

Empty:  I am a big fan of the whole liquid courage thing.  Just 4 more days until your appointment.  Good luck.

Fiona:  Sorry Valentine's day was a bust.  Mine was as well.  DH works his regular job on Thurdays, stays at his office and catches a few hours of sleep, then does an overnight shift.  The only time I got to see him was at 6am when he was on his way out to work.  He's usually exhausted by the time he gets back home at 5pm Friday.  What part of Ireland is your dh from?

Magda:  With every post you make, I am more and more impressed with your strength and courage.  You just seem to take everything in stride and look for the positive.  I am trying to do that now, aw well.  No more dwelling on the negative.

Lisa:   You always make me feel good.  Your attitude is so positive, and you emit such strong positive energy.  I wish I had more people like you in my life.

Helen:  What can I say.  I feel like you are the foundation of this group.  You provide so much strength and wisdom.  You can always be counted on to provide sound, factual information and you always offer so much encouragement.  You never ask for anything for yourself.  I hope you know that we would all like to help you as much as you have helped us.


As expected, AF showed up this morning.  I have to go to my clinic tomorrow (between 7-8am) for b/w and u/s.  If everything is as it should be, I will begin stimming tomorrow night.  Unless they change it, I will start with 450 Follistim and 150 Menopur.  Does anybody have any experience with these meds so I know what to expect?

[fifi blue]

Mary, good luck with your appointment tomorrow.  I took follistim last month and had no problems.  Going back to Gonal F next month but only because I wanted to change all my protocol after my disasterous retrieval.  Doing antagon instead of lupron and novarel instead of ovidrel.  Sorry your Valentine's was a bust, hopefully you get to celebrate another day instead.  My dh is from Co. Carlow, I'm also Irish from Co. Louth.  

[Helen72]

Mary,
finally we can celebrate AF coming!!!  When is your first u/s?  I am sooo excited for you!  Also, thank you for your kind words.  I am not a good foundation though since I am having regular melt-downs, about every 28 days  :)

Heather,
many women, including Mary experienced no symptoms till after a positive HPT.  Many of the signs you were describing will appear only in the 3rd trimester!  As for implantation bleeding, it's a rare sign and I am convinced that it's a bad sign.  Many friends of mine on this forum who had implantation bleeding ended up with an ectopic or early miscarriage.  No implantation bleeding to me is a GOOD sign.  This is just my personal observation, not a scientific fact!  Please don't get discouraged.  I wish I could make you smile and take your blues away but I am not a very funny person.  EMPTY is MUCH better at that: she always makes me laugh!!!

Well, I have zero symptoms myself and I am spending my spare time looking for a source to order my ivf meds from.  Yesterday I called my insurance and they confirmed that none of my drugs/treatments will be covered.  The ironic thing is that state of TX has a law that requires insurance Co's to offer infertility coverage including ivf coverage.  However, most employers who provide health benefits choose to decline it so this law is so useless!!!  

[magda_s]

Ladies thank you all for the positive comments but I'm a little embarrassed because I truly don't feel they're deserved!  However, thank you.

Fiona, you can at least take comfort in the thought that HAD your DH been around, he'd surly have done something special for you.  My DH had a lousy, crazy day at work and ended up having to collect his daughter who just returned form a trip to Petra off the side of the road where the taxi basically abandoned her so he totally forgot to bring me any flowers or anything and seeing as this is his daughter's first visit, we weren't about to do anything particularly romantic anyway so the whole thing was pretty much ignored!
Granted, it's all very commercial and all the rest of it but geez, at least I sent him a card with a meaningful soul-outpouring type of message due to a disagreement we had the other day.  What'd I get??  Nothin'!
Ah well... such is life.
As for Lost... I LOVED that show in the first season... mainly because of whatshisface... ooofff... what was his name?????  The good looking, unshaven one?  But then the total lack of plot just annoyed me.

Empty, you'll be fine!!!  I'm sure we've all had moments where we've thought... "OMG, what if I just CAN'T have children?" but we CAN.  We just have a few hurdles to jump over for whatever reason or none at all... point being, they're there and it makes the whole exercise a little more challenging but we can handle that because we get stronger with every passing day!!!!!!!

Mary, good luck tomorrow... sorry, I don't have any idea re the meds but I have my fingers crossed for you.

As for me, not to shatter any positive images and convince you all that I'm a total nutter... but I'm only just  starting to manage to convince myself that I'm not going to be punished for things going my way!!!  See, first the doctor here worked out then he told me that I could absolutely take more pills to delay AF and therefore go to my conference in Delhi which means being able to stop in Doha to visit my sister and I finally spoke to him and he confirmed that it's okay to take the pill for an extra 10 days rather than just a few days which means I can delay everything those few extra days so that my sister can come and visit me (for the first time in Damascus) during her mid-term break without me having to stay in bed due to having just undergone a transfer... it just all seems to be going my way and I find that really, really scary!!!!!!! I was speaking to my sister the other day and saying that perhaps I should cancel my trip just to spite myself and, in a way, "pay up" in advance!!!
Okay.. .I'd best shut up now... off to make dinner...

[HeathJo]

Oh Magda, Magda, Magda, we are sooooo very much alike! Of course, I am setting myself up for failure, and when things go my way I ALWAYS question or sabotage it! More so question now that I am older and God I hope a bit wiser! Take off your scarlet letter, you have no dues to pay, silly girl. Even if you did, you'd have paid them. Like you said, whether things happen for a reason or none at all, they happen and we just have to deal with them, however twisted our methods may be at times. An thanks for your concern about my sleep disturbances! I am just like a baybe myslef, and once I get off chedule I stay off for a while. I was up until 11 am this morning, and slept until about 3 pm, so I got about four hours in today. I should have checked back in here last night, but I figured I'd just be staring at the screen, willing my international friends to come and post!

Mary--You siad everything to everbody I would have said or would say now, except that we all know I am bit off thesedays! You are so naturally sweet and maternal, and I am so happy your new cycle has begun. I am excited to see what happens each and every day with you! I took follistim this month, but at a much lower dose (75) and within a different protocol. I can say that the stuff works! My ovaries produced like never before.

Helen--Thank God Mary has the sense and sensibility to say what she said, because you are a rock for us all. Your input about implantation bleeding was just what I needed to hear, it is like you read my mind! I did start having what I feel are more AF symptoms when I woke up from my nap today, but it ain't over till it's over. If you are feeling nothing, I  say that is a VERY GOOD (lack of a) sign! (Does that even make sense???) I agree about the law here in Texas--it's a ridiculous waste of legislative paper and ink. Businesses and organizations do not give a c r a p if you can have kids or not. In fact, they dicourage it, b/c it "takes up personal time and money". Why would they CHOOSE to pay more to cover us? The law has to be enforcable to be any good. Sheesh. Anyway, I hope this is YOUR month.

Fiona--Well I am 1/2 Irish by descent, and have ALWAYS, ALWAYS wanted to visit the motherland. How cool is it that you are Irish? Who knew? We have such an internationally diverse and savvy group here, it is astounding! How in earth did you and dh end up here? (HELEN--I meant to ask you the same question). Speaking of dh, I am sorry he was gone and you missed him. Poor baybe. Mine was here, but we just kind of hung out. He buys me flowers every week, so I always tell him everyday is like Valentine's! I got him a card and some Reese's peanut-butter hearts--which he loves. SO, not every couple is jetting off to Paris or something, but at least we were together. I am sorry you were alone :-( BTW--where are you in your cycle?

Empty--since taking the Metformin I aboslutely could not drink even if I were not in the 2ww. I am so jealous! A tall glass of red wine--Pinot Noir--would cure my insomnia and probably help my mood! I love your silly posts, they make me smile, but be sure to take good care of yourslef, too. Must be perky for that appt coming up!

Lisa--Yes, getting the naps in help, and I am so sorry you have experinced this nightmare yourself. I have had my thyroid, adrenals, and all that checked out, it just runs in the family. I pm'd you everything else, so excuse my lazy butt for not repeating it here. You know I love ya!

So, my symptoms seem to me to be turning a bit more in the AF direction, but on "paper" it looks like pg. My bbs are burning (like first month on Clomid) and I am cramping in I guess my uterus? I don't know what part of my anatomy it is, and if it IS my uterus, I have never had anything residing up in there, so how do I know where I am feeling anything? As much as I would love to think positively, I really in my heart think my body is just reacting to the new meds. It just feels like it did month 1 of Clomid. But, as I said, it ain't over till it's over.

Hugs and love and everything to all of you, my angels!!!! I would be oh -so-very-lost without each and evry single precious one of you! XXXXXX

[ms320]

Fiona:
How cool that both you and dh are from Ireland.  I have been over there a few times, and I swear the Irish people are the friendliest on earth.  Every time I have gone, I have looked up some relative of someone I know from NY, and they all take me in like I am a family member.  My mom is from the north -- Co. Antrim, and I still have many relatives living over there.  We actually had a 75th birthday party for my mom a couple of weeks ago, and of course one of my cousins whipped out the guitar and everyone joined in singing Irish songs.  It was lame, but fun.  
I actually hope to buy a place over there someday, so that I can visit once a year for vacation.

Anyway, have agreat weekend.

Mary

[HeathJo]

I'll go in on a house with you! We can take the babies over there where they won't sunburn :-)

I am such an American mutt, I am not even 3rd,4th, or 5th generation anything anymore. My mother is VERY into the social scene here (which, yes, is as bad as the old tv show Dallas, if not worse) and traed our ancestry all the way back to the original founders of the Texas Republic and the American Revolution. So, I am unofficially (she is, officially) a member of the Daughters of the Texas Republic and Daughters of the American Revolution.

So, isn't it great that my lineage as a "white" American can be traced all the way back to getting rid of the poor people who were here actually here first?? To make other people try and feel less American?? I'm so proud...

I wish I had some kind of culturally interesting family member, but I only do through marriage. My husband is third generation half Sicilian and half Lebanese--oh yes, La Cosa Nostra, people. Poor Lisa had to hear all about it in a pm, as I gave my MIL a verbal lashing after she called my husband FAT. Yes, her son, and no he is not fat. And no, she is not used to being told off. She has had the same red-headed beehive hairdo since we dated (me and dh, not me and MIL) in high school. She used to scare me back then. Not anymore. She is not used to being put in her place. It's gotten very dramatic, as she is playing the martyr on the cross and I am the mean DIL. I think secretly "the family" is probably getting a little satisfaction out of somebody standing up to this woman (yes, I have done this before, once, when she called me to tell me my dh was FIRED from the family business).

My FIL is an interior designer and antiques appraiser, who studied at Parsons and was on the Antiques Roadshow a lot, and they have an antique store in a shopping strip known as the "Rodeo Drive" of Dallas. DH and brothers all help run the store and the clients. Anyway, it's all a bit too close for comfort for me. I have like 8 people in my entire extended family--they have like 60 in their immediate family. Now, I am not saying they are like the mob LITERALLY, but it sure does feel like it sometimes. The oldest brother does not like women, and the middle brother lives across the street from in-laws with his wife and three kids. Need I say more? We live a whopping 2 miles away, but we put up a 10-foot wooden fence around the perimeter of our property, with no slats, and I made my husband throw his pager off of the boat on our honeymoon cruise. No, I am not joking!

OK, my original point was to you, Mary, and it was that I would love to go to Ireland, and I am jealous that you have culture around you. Somehow, I digressed. Can we say HORMONAL? Are you all starting to see me for the b i t c h  I can actually be?

I have a good heart, though. I think :-(

[empty]

Hey Magda - i posted on the old forum so just repeating myself here.

Magda - tell hubby i know where Orbost is - havent been there though. today was a big day for us here in Aust as it was the day that the govt said sorry to the aboriginal people for years of forcibly removing aboriginal children from their homes to be raised in institutions. This happened through the 1920s right up to 1970. It was very big deal here and i am sure he would have seen in online in the Aust papers.

If hubby was in Aust everyone would feel immensely  sorry for him for this allergy. Infact i am sure they will drink ot the fact that they are not him.

[empty]

Hi Fellas

Has anyone had sparkling reds? I love them.

My husband too has an Irish background. He was born in Aust but his grandparents left Ireland to come to Aust. I would love to go one day. Can i go thirds in the house please?

Heather of course you have a good heart - you wouldnt be here giving us your time if you didnt.

Speaking of culture - I am Indian (not the tepee sort, the curry sort)

Dee

[HeathJo]

Emp-Dee: Now it makes sense--and we finally get a name!!!! Hooraay! How are you cutie? Hittin' the sauce tonight??? (Just joking!) Indian women are so naturally beautiful, smart and gentle. I love getting to know more about you, Ms. Mysterious!

[empty]

Heather - i was thinking i should amke some butter chicken tonight ...haha. Its really warm here at the moment and we should really be out in our garden cutting down some overgrown plants but drinking a glass of cold wine won!

You can imagine the stress i get about being and indian girl with no kids!!! My hasband is white so when we finally have kids, they wont look  like either if us. The irony hey!

How are you feeling? Any symptoms? Will you POAS tomorrow?

[HeathJo]

Why is it a stress to be Indian with no kids?Are Indian women known to be super-fertile or something? Sorry I am so ignorant about this. Of course your babies will look like you guys!!! A mini dh and a mini-Dee!!! How cute!!!!!

My symptoms have taken a strange, bizarre and sinister turn. Earlier tonight I had such horrible AF-like cramps, got a full-on migraine with nausea and all, heartburn, and was in agony. It felt like I usually do the day AF arrives on a really bad cycle.

I am so confused b/c it would be very early for me to have such severe AF symptoms (9dpiui,cd23) as my cycles run 30-32 days. But, I just switched my meds, so I could just be reacting to that. It is a mindgame! If these are early AF symptoms, then when she does get here I will be in bad, bad shape. If it is a BFP, then I will be surprised by how similar these signs are to AF. It's just all up in the air!

I was going to stay away from POAS, and I can't find my hpts here. But, if I feel worse tomorrow and no AF, I will POAS just so I can take meds to relieve my symptoms.

[HeathJo]

Just found my hpts, POAS, got a BFN. I know it's too early, but caved in just as I said I would not do and tested. Today I guess is technically 10dpiui,cd24 (late Friday night/early Saturday morning). Should I try again if my symptoms stay this bad? If so, when?

[magda_s]

Heather, your DH is half Lebanese???  I'm Lebanese.  Actually, half too.  My dad was Lebanese and my mum is half Greek and half Egyptian.  I never knew much about Lebanon because of the war and that so it wasn't as if we ever visited and I grew up in Abu Dhabi but since I came back to this part of the world and spent time in Lebanon, I can't get enough of it.  Have you or your DH ever been?  It is such an incredible country and Beirut is a marvelous city that is so full of life.  
As for seeing you for the b i t c h you can be... aaaah... we had you sussed a long time ago!!  ;-)  Just kidding but do you really think the rest of can't be just as b i t c h y???  Well, okay... maybe some can't but I promise you, at least one can!!!!!!!!!!!

Dee, I envie you!!!  Did you mean it about making Butter Chicken?  I LOVE Indian food (the not too spicy kind!).  There is a large Indian community in Abu Dhabi and therefore lots of Indian restuarants and I LOVE the food but have never known how to cook any of it myself.

As for your government's apology to the aboriginal people... yes, heard all about it on BBC and DH was looking it up on the internet on ABC.
And frankly, you would have absolutely NO reason to visit Orbost unless you knew someone there.  It is a TINY little place.  Beechworth, though small too was really quite pretty.  

You've got a fourth for the house in Ireland... I have always had a fascination with anything Irish.  I LOVE the accent, I despise the fact that all the Irish can sing so beautifully (but I love listening to them do so), I love the culture and I have never known an Irish person, male or female, who I did not like... and I've known many.  Very seriously thinking of going this summer.  Won't we make a great pair... my DH can't drink and I will (hopefully... thinking positive) be rathe ron the large side and not drinking eaither so I guess we'll just stay away from all the Irish pubs and the Guinness!

Mary I too am so jealouse of "evertime you visit" Ireland.

And Helen, I have to agree with Heather... the info about symptoms and implantation bleeding was very interesting.  I was getting the impression that implantation bleeding was something that anyone should normally go through and was worrying that I didn't really get it!

Something else I don't really get... and I feel silly admitting this but there you go... POAS???  Okay... I understood it means testing and that but what does it actually stand for??? I can't figure it out.

[magda_s]

Oh Heather... Here I was thinking... she's not about... she must have managed to get some sleep!!!

[magda_s]

Sorry I can't answer your questions but you're not upset about the BFN are you??  You ARE aware that it's too early to test and so this doesn't mean a damn thing right????

[empty]

Magda - i know beechworth. theres a beautiful bakery there and quite famous. Yes i am seriously making butter chicken. My sister is coming over to pick her share up tomorrow...:). I cook indian food once or twice a week. My hasband has picked up some receipes and cooks too.
Yes it would be funny for you to go to ireland when DH cant drink. I had a irish guy at uni and i used to be completely melted everytime he spoke. Naturally he didnt even know i was in the same class.

i think we should all have a holiday in ireland with our future babies.

Heather - way too early for POAS (peeing on a stick magda). Try again in 3days buddy. In the meantime it sounds like you need to get some sleep. All that insomnia might be taking its toll on you. Have you been temping. My temp dropped the day A/F came. You know i have all my fingers crossed for you. Lotsa Hugs.

Dee

[HeathJo]

Magda--Oh, no, I am not upset about the BFN. I was mainly jut trying it out b/c it is a new type for me. Its one of those dollar ones that came with PreSeed that you actually dip in a cup of urine as opposed to POAS (peeing on a stick). I have never been to Lebanon, nor has my dh, but I believe other members have been. I know many have traveled to Rome. The interesting thing I have learned about the Lebanese people is that wherever they may live--Dallas,London, Germany--they are all a very tight-knit community. Not culturally so much, but in business and staying connected. It seems cool. And, I am glad to know I have a fellow b i t c h buddy!!!

Dee--You think three days, would that be Tuesday? I don't do the whole temping thing b/c my LH levels are unstable, and also it sounds too irritating. I much prefer the ultrasounds doing the work for me!

Yes, the insomnia is outta control. I have not felt well enough on these meds to do much of anything, much less exercise, which is the only thing that seems to help (besides medication, which I cannot take right now). This is pretty much why my life is at a complete standstill right now, and I am just too fatigued or have some other symptom like nausea or headaches or cramping to do anything but go to my RE appts. I told dh I will try one more month after this cycle, and then I need a break possibly.

Thanks for your support, guys. I am so happy I have my international buddies to chat with at this ungodly hour! (4:20 am Saturday here!)

[ms320]

Happy Saturday.  Heather, we've got to do something about that insomnia.  The house in Ireland is going to be a blast.  All of us, with all of our kids.  Awesome and crazy.  No wine for the kids tough Dee.  Magda, nice sentiment about the Irish all having lovely voices.  It is apparent you've never been at one of my family gatherings.  It is awful, the dogs start howling and all, but it is fun.

Went for my cd 2 b/w and u/s this morning.  Looks like I have 3 follies on the right and 4 on the left, all < 10cm, but that is what I would expect at this date.  Start stimming tonight.  I have a feeling the follies are going to start popping like the old "Jiffy Pop" commercial.  Sorry to the international group, you may not be familiar with it.  Actually, none of you may be familiar with it as I believe I am dating myself.  

Im off to the first birthday party for my niece/god daughter.  Hopefully, it won't  be too difficult.

[fifi blue]

Mary, that's great that you enjoy Ireland so much.  Antrim is a beautiful part of the country.  You made me laugh about the sing song.  Was at a party last weekend here in Boston and of course someone starts to sing and everyone joined in.  It's really part of who we are and the sadder the song the better.  Madga, I afraid Mary is right because I have made ears bleed with my singing.  
I moved to the states in 94, my dh came around 88.  Like most of the Irish back then, we came because there was no work.  You couldn't get a job bagging groceries in the supermarket!  Hundreds of people would apply for one job.  So, I came over and worked as a nanny for a couple of years (i'm not kidding).  
Mary, are you doing iui or ivf this cycle?  Good luck at the party.
Ladies, if I ever manage to have children I plan on moving back home to Ireland and you can all come visit me.  

[Helen72]

If I knew there was so much activity overnight I would have logged on!  Didn't sleep all night.  Fraternity next door had a party that went basically all night.  My bbt is up today but probably because I did not get any sleep.

A trip to Ireland sounds great!  I am a huge fan of James Joyce and Oscar Wilde and always wanted to go.

Heather,
sorry about BFN.  Like everyone said, it's probably too early.  If your symptoms are those of implantation you will not have enough HCG in your system till at least 2 days from now.   I also have those cheap sticks but will probably wait to POAS till monday.  Afraid to spoil my weekend with a BFN.

I moved to US about 15 years ago with my parents; dh is from Cleveland  :)
p.s. love your new picture!!!!

Mary,
7 follies on cd2 already!  This sounds very promising.  Glad you don't have any nasty side-effects.  I hope you can enjoy the b-day party although that would not be easy for anyone here.

[magda_s]

Fiona and Mary... I don't believe you for a minute!  In both Abu Dhabi and Hong Kong I somehow ended up having huge numbers of Irish friends of all ages and from all parts of Ireland and there was only ONE who couldn't sing.  I always insisted she wasn't truly Irish and that her mum must have taken a liking to a foreign milman or something!
However, even if you do have dogs-a-howling and ears-a-bleeding (hmmm... perhaps we can write a whole new irish tune based on that idea!!!) I'm sure the house will be full of song... only maybe we'll just play a CD or something!
Now I'm tempted to start writing a book (long-time dream)... 3 or 4 main characters who come together on the internet and buy a house in Ireland to one day meet up with their future children!!!

Dee... THANK YOU!  Who'd have thunk... POAS... Peeing on a stick!  It was killing me!!!!
Re the bakery... I had my first Aussi pie at that bakery!!!
You know... I may start hitting you up for some recipes!!!!!!
Or you can just do all the cooking at our lovely house in ireland.
You know... we could pick a night of the week for different regions... Saturday could be Indian, Sunday could be Middle Eastern, Monday could be Ukrainian (Helen????).  Anyone else???

Heather, so relieved to hear you're not upset.  Re the Lebanese being close knit... ha ha... I could go on about Lebanese stereotypes till the cows come home... and they're almost all true.  And yes, one of them IS that they are pretty close.  I recently got a joke email thing about how you can tell someone is Lebanese and here a couple of points:
- Wherever he goes, he has at least one cousin
- When he meets another Lebanese, he feels obliged to ask what village he's from and they will invariably wind up knowing someone in common
- He has more family in Canada, the United States, South America, Australia, France or Belgium than in Lebanon.
- He can always find a job by asking a friend whose friends father has a sister whose husband's cousin whose brother is married to the aunt of someone or other

[magda_s]

Ooooh... Heather... yes!  Just saw the pic.  Very nice!

[empty]

Morning Ladies - 9.15am Sunday here

Heather. Yup i would try again Tues. Tues i go for my appt so we can both hold hands for the next few days! I also use the cup thing (internet cheapies). They detect 10miu.

Mary - wow that sounds good with your follies this early. Hope the party went alright for you?

Fifi - i think you just got more than you bargained for on that offer :)

Off to have some coffee
Dee

[Lexima]

Hey guys, I'm back and I missed you All!!!  I've tried reading through the thead, but there is just so much it will take me a while to get through all of last weeks events.  Vacation was great, really took my mind of the 2ww at least for most of the time.

Here is my deal.  I'm 15DPO CD27 (haven't tested yet) on 12 and 13DPO I had very strong AF cramps, at about midnight on 13DPO as was was inserting progesterone (sorry TMI), I saw some redish brown blood, was sure that AF as arrived, but there hasn't been any bleeding or spotting since then, and no AF cramps either.  So I'm really confused.  One other thing it's that last 2 days I've been sleepy the whole day, but that doesn't mean much, we were at sea the whole day yesterday and the subtle rocking of the boat could've caused that and today we woke up early to leave the boat.  For now I'm continuing to use Progesterone.  I want to test tomorrow morning, but I'm so scared.  Also tomorrow is our 6 year anniversary so wouldn't that be a nice surprise.
Last cycle I got AF 17 dpiui, so maybe I should just wait one more day.

[Helen72]

Welcome back!!!!  I cannot believe you haven't tested yet.
Wishing you the best anniversary present: BFP!

p.s. I hope you don't have any signs of overstimulation.  Sounds like you worried for nothing.

[HeathJo]

Mary--Wel I slept from about 4:30am until now about 8pm, so the cycle continues, but at least I m getting some sleep. And, I am very familiar with Jiffy Pop? That was so high-tech and cool back in the '70s. (And hey, I am dating myself also, but who cares?) I actually made a refernce to feelink like pocorn was busting up inside me when I o'd last time as well--it really does feel that way! I am so very excited about your follicle level this early in the game, before stimming. I am so glad all systems are "go!"

Fiona--I was a nanny in college, and I went to France and was a nanny there! Now that you are here in the states and been through a couple of recessions, what do you think, honestly? I suppose it is much easier here than other places--something we take for granted, as competitive as the corporate world is here. But, people are hungry here as well, we just don't see it as prominently because the country is so big it is easy to hide from it. Was there not a huge job market that opened up in Dublin in the computer industry a few years back? I know that is only one city, but maybe it helped?? Oh, and you opened up a HUGE can of worms with the free lodging in Ireland issue!! YOu better buy a big place, or open up a B&B!!

Helen--Oh, the joys of campus life. . .I am sure you just love the sound of drunk frat boys and sorority girls echoing through the night. How frustrating! I'd be out there all grumpy in my robe probably screaming at people and calling the cops, the state I am in now! (Yes, I would become the joke I used to laugh at when I was partying!) You should always check into the Insomniac Theatre--it is so aptly named.

Magda--LOVE the Lebanese jokes. My husband didn't get them, he just thinks that is normal!!Ha! I am sure you left out some of the less desirable ways to identify the Lebanese--like how stubborn they are! Anyway, glad to know I am not alone in at least identifying this group as a bit of a handful. Hey, I worked in book publishing promoting authors for years, and have always wanted to write a book myself. Maybe once we get our BFPs we will have time to play this scenario out and market it!

Empty--I guess we are 2-3day wait buddies. Although, I am pretty sure this ain't happenin' this month for me. I am not upset yet, but another month or two and I will be.

Lexima--Welcome back--you were missed greatly! I hope you get a BFP this month--looks like you will be joining me and Empty (Dee) in testing the next couple of days. Glad you are back and getting settled.

Well, as for me, had a migraine BAD last night until early am, when I last wrote, and then slept ALL DAY LONG. Now I am up for who knows how long, but at least the headache is staying at bay for now. Cramping is gone, now I just feel blaoted. I just hope when AF comes she does not bring too much extra baggage!

[Lexima]

Thanks Helen,
I'm actually feeling fine, what ever I was feeling was probably just side affect of IUI and all the meds and not realy hyperstimulater, I'm really glad about that.

I'm still reading previous posts, btw I'm also from former Soviet Union, Lithuania came here 16 years ago with my family.  DH is from Odessa.

[HeathJo]

Holy cr a pola I love you gals from the "former Soviet Union." I call it that because I have no clue geographically what is going on there. I am a typical American whose knowledge of geography extends to Canada and Mexico :-(
I was just telling my dh how excited I am to how such culturally-diverse cyber-friends, as it seems no one in Dallas is NOT from somewhere close by. He goes, "Oh, I know, we live in silly, simple Texas." He has never left here and makes fun of me for making fun of Texas. I hope that makes sense??? I do complain every now and then about how boring it is here, or how much I loved living in this city or the other, but I always say home is where the heart is and he is my heart. Otherwise, you can bet your a** I would not be living here! No offense to Dallas or Texas, I just like the people as a whole in other places. That sounds so wretchedly bad!!!

Anyway, how cool is it that you guys are both from the Eastern part of Europe?? It would be wild if you actually name-dropped and knew people in common. It really is a small world.

[Helen72]

Lexima,
that is sooo funny that you are from Lithuania!  That's a very beautiful country!  When I was little we used to spend summers in Latvia, on Baltic sea.  I keep telling dh I want to go back there for a vacation.  Never visited Lithuania though...

HeathJo,
being from NY I had many stereotypes about living in TX.  However, I think it has a lot to offer.  Perhaps you should explore Dallas some and give it a chance.  It has a decent opera, the best balley in the state and supposedly the best art collection.  By the way, right now Dallas Museum of Art has Turner on exhibit; dh totally loves his style but we are a little bit too far to make the trip.  

Lisa,
how are you doing?  

[HeathJo]

You are right, I know, it is not so bad. . .I am just bored and cranky in general. And oh how it shows! I know the opera is not the same as the symphony, but we did go to the Meyerson and see the DSO over the holidays. And last summer we went to the DMA for a cool exhibit of Sterling Silver artistry. I had to look up Turner on the DMA website (my ignorance is showing!) We saw the Nutcracker Christmas before last, and it was quite good. I guess I just could use a change of scenery! My dh and I emailed our friend in Austin, "offering" to come down and hang out with her and her 3-year-old daughter, as we cannot make it to her wedding this May, but she had some sort of dental surgery, and now her and hubby-to-be and daughter all have the stomach flu. NO THANKS!!!

[babyalive]

Boy, I can't believe the similarities and vast differences in our backgrounds.    Magda and Empty's Aussie connection.  Magda and Heathjo's Lebanese connection, Mary and Fifi's Irish connection and Helens Ukraine connection with someone(? lol) I lost track Helen with who else was from the area you are from?  Wow, I just love the things we share and the new things we teach one another.

The donor was using in Oct./Nov. was full Irish and I had all these Irish names picked out for my baby.  The most recent donor I've used has Irish, English and Native American Heritage.  I have German, Irish, Scottish, English and Native American.  So, I am like you Heathjo, just a mish mosh of ethnicity.  

You'll be so proud of me I didn't POAS today.  5dpo and no peeing on a stick.  I've been so strong.  LOL.

Lexima - speaking of being strong.  OMG.  I can't believe you haven't tested yet.  Can't wait to hear what happens for the next few day with you.

Heather Jo, You're still in the game.  Ashort kept getting BFN's even at 15, 16 and 17 dpo.  It wasn't until she went in for her Beta that she got the BFP.  So, I'm not giving up on your bfp just yet.  

[babyalive]

By the way, LOVE your photo also.  So very cute!!

[empty]

Hey Lisa

How has your weekend been?

I have been seeing so many BFP posts that i think our lot is absolutely due for one.

Lexima - i so would have POASed everyday from 14dpo. You are so strong!

Dee
Sunday  5.07pm

[magda_s]

Good morning ladies... 10:09am here.  Heather, I hope you're sleeping!
Lexima welcome back... glad to hear you had a good trip!  and like th eothers, I'm most impressed that you haven't tested yet!!!  Good for you!
Lisa, I agree with you... I love the differences and connections.  I've always loved learning about people's backgrounds because so often there IS a story there and growing up in Abu Dhabi (which is an expat community) everyone was coming from somewhere and going somewhere else so whenever you met anyone new you were always asking them what their story was.  Then I went to Canada and I thought it was pretty cool that anyone who isn't native Canadian had to have come from somewhere and I was interested so I would ask people's backgrounds and oooofffff... did they get offended!  The typical response was a very determined, "I'M CANADIAN."  well, du-u-uh... but where is your family originally from?  "THEY'RE CANADIAN"   Aaaaah... I see... so you sprouted out of the ground did you?
whatever...
Heather, re the book thing... I'm actually hoping that once I do get a BFP I will be able to wrap my brain around the book I've been wanting to write for the last 6 years or so!  It's sort of a cross between Bill Bryson and Bridget Jones!!!!  In fact, it's almost written because it's going to be a compilation of emails and journal entries from the last 6 years held together with a few passages that are just the main character's memories.  So basically it's just a huge editing job but I think I avoid starting because I'm afraid of it not being any good.
I sound so egotistical saying I'm going to put a book together from my own emails.  I will have to vamp the whole thing up of course.  I've done a few interesting things over the last 6 years but my life's not THAT interesting!!
Right... must go as laptop battery's about to die and the electricity in the building died about an hour ago and hasn't come back yet!

[Lexima]

Good Morning ladies, I chickened out and didn't test this morning.  I'm so scared of a dissapointment.  bbs still hurt, but I do not feel "pg".  I'll see how today goes.

The world is so small especially here in NY there are a lot of immigrants from russia and everyone knows everyone it's freaky.

[Helen72]

I cannot believe you haven't tested yet!  I am itcing to test myself and I am only 10 dpo.  Will you just wait for AF day and test then?  

[babyalive]

Aren't you something like 15dpo?  Is AF due?  Is she late for her visit yet? I'm so anxious to hear from you and have a good feeling about you this cycle.

Helen it is usually on 10dpo that I cave and test every time.  You are so strong also!

[Helen72]

I am afraid that you will not be able to test early because of the trigger.  It may give you a false positive.  So, you have no choice but to stay strong (unless you test today or tomorrow and make sure that it is out of your system).  Do you have those cheap test sticks or are you using full price HPT's?  If you are using regular HPT's you may have to wait at least a week to test!  If you have cheap ones I would check whether the trigger is out.

[Lexima]

I'm 16DPO, CD 28  today and my cycles got so irregular that I no longer know when to expect AF.  Over the last few cycles it was different every time.  If I go by 30 day cycle then AF is not due for another 2 days.  Last month I had 33 day cycle.  I'll wait till this evening or tomorrow morning and then will test.  Bec 16DPO is the longest that I ever lasted.  
I'm trying to analyze the symptoms that I'm feeling, but there really isn't much.  I'm a bit drowsy today again, and maybe constipated, that's about it.  The only thing that confuses me is that red/brown CM on 13DPO.

[Helen72]

Lexima,
Brown Eyed Gurl had similar symptoms as you and she is pregnant with twins (triplets at the time of the BFP).  She had some mild spotting/bleeding early on.  

The earliest BFP that I saw here was at 8 dpo and the latest was at 15 dpo (ashort got no line at 14 and a faint line at 15 dpo).  Most people don't see anything till 12-13 dpo. So, not testing early saves you from a false negative.  However, those early tests can give you an idea about the timing of implantation.   I am 10 dpo today; not sure what to do...

To POAS or not to POAS: that is the question  :)

[Lexima]

so true.
I remember reading ashort's posts before vaca and at that time she still hasn't tested, but was already having some symptoms.  Yesterday I found her post where she wrote that she got a BFP.  

I have my family coming over this afternoon to wish us happy anniversary, so I already told DH that I'll test after everyone leaves.  I know that morning urine gives you best results, but I'll try in the evening.

For you I'd suggest to wait few more days before you test.  10dpo is a bit early.  Any symptoms?

[Helen72]

Ha-ha!  It's too late!  I already tested: BFN!  Waited for an evap line and didn't get even that!  Have no symptoms either so I guess it was expected.  

Happy Anniversary!!!  I hope you get the best present: BFP!!!!

[magda_s]

Helen, what day are you at??  This was too early for you to test wasn't it???  I hope that was the case!!

Lexima... good luck with tomorrow evening... and Happy Anniversary!


Lisa, out of curiosity... you said you had a lot more info on the donor at this new place... do you know this donor's background??

Guys, I feel silly asking this but it's been playing on my mind.  IAs I've said, this new doc here in Damascus won't transfer more than a max of 4 embies whereas my doctor in Beirut was willing to go with 6.  I know it's not all a numbers game but can't help thinking that surely one has a better chance with 6 than 4, no?  Am I doing the wrong thing going with this guy just because we don't want the hassel of driving back and forth?
I can't help feeling that we're doing the right thing going with this guy but then I have this nagging thing in my head with the whole 4 vs 6... particularly considering the hope for twins.  Any thoughts?

[HeathJo]

Lisa--Thanks for the encouragement! This has been a loooooooooong 2ww so far,as I know it has been for everyone. I got some more sleep: 2am until 2pm! I was a bit dizzy/nauseous last night, and have had consistent cramping. It hurts when I move, laugh, or sneeze--lower abdomen, like front AF cramps. I have a bit of O-type pain and just started having a bit of lower back pain. I have still been getting a bit of the "flushes" on my face. SInce I tested at 9dpiui and got a BFN I know the trigger is gone, so either my hormones are going really nutty from the new meds, or.  . .well, I don;t want to go there yet. I can see my saying it and AF showing up just to spite me! And, good girl for not testing AGAIN, since we know you already did just to see a BFP from the trigger! :-)

Magda--I am sure your life has been very interesting, and I know you as a person are! Go for the book project, whenever you are ready, of course. I will buy it! Regarding your new doctor, I'd stay with him. Don't get caught up in the numbers. If you have a good gut feeling about him, stick with that. It never fails me when I go with my instincts.

Lexima--Happy Anniversary!!! Sounds like you will have some distraction later today from the whole POAS, until this evening. I am eager to see your results!!!!

Helen--Well, like me, at least you know the trigger is out! Now I am 11dpiui,cd25, so we are close. This cycle is weird for me as it is the earliest cd/dpiui ratio I have ever had. In the recent past, I would be at cd26 or 27 by now. It's only a couple of days, but it seems weird. I just o'd a little earlier on the new stuff. SO, when are you planning to test again? I don't know for sure if I will before Wednesday. Maybe. We'll see how my resolve holds up!

Empty--I agree that our groups is due for at least one BFP!!! So many are popping up this month, it is bound to happen for one of us, I hope :-)

[babyalive]

Hi Ladies,  I've been having a very relaxing weekend.  Been taking nice walks in the am with dear sparky and the weather has been sooo beautiful!  Clear blue skys, cool crisp morning air, it's been great.  I had a good friend come stay the day with me yesterday and I got to cook and wait on her.  I just love having someone to take care of.  Of course she loved being waited on so it was a good day all around.  Haven't been feeling great, been feeling a bit under the weather so it's nice to relax this weekend.  I was supposed to go to a conference, but cancelled since I wasn't feeling great.   Didn't really want to spend my long weekend at a conference anyhow.  OK.  Now down to business

Lexima: I hope you have a good great day with your family celebrating your annivesary.  Good it'll help distract you for a period of time.  I'm so keeping fingers, toes and anything else I can cross, crossed for you.

Magda:  I would say not to focus so much on the numbers because I remember how concerned you were over the treterous drive from your other dr. to where you live now.   In my estimtion having less eggs able to settle because momma is able to relax at the crucial tim is better than more eggs being disrupted by being jossled around on the drive during the crucial time.  But ultimately, Heather Jo is right.  You must go with your gut.  Your gut instinct will stear you in the right direction.

Helen - So you POAS.  (-:  Good for you.  I'm sorry for the BFN though.  I'll save you the "it's too early speech"  because I know you know the rigamoro(sp?).  I know you've been preparing yourself for what's coming up next.  Focusing on what's ahead can make the current disappointment more bearable for sure.  

I'd used the dollar store HPT a few days ago when it showed the BFP.  So, I'll take your advise and POAS again to see if the HCG is out of my system.  If nothing else the shade of the line will help me to read the results.  Meaning if I get a faint line today and then a darker line at 10dpo, I'll know it's real.

HeatherJo - So glad to hear you are finally getting some sleep.  I also so understand the fear of "going there" in your mind and allowing yourself to believe in the BFP.  I hope your suffering recently is the result of your body undertaking a new construction.    

[babyalive]

I forgot to address your question.   Yes, I have some background info.  I know his medical history, academic history, some family history and a little bit about his career, hobbies, and philosophy on life.  Is there anything specific you were wondering about?

[Helen72]

I am spending my day researching ivf.  Trying to find an affordable source of meds.  I tried to look up the info about the relationship between number of embryos transferred and success rates.  Most likely I will have to decide between 2 and 3 (I am almost 35!).  Statistics are not as straightforward as one may guess.  For example, if you increase # of embryos transferred from 1 to 2, success rate does not double.  It goes up but it does not double.  If probability of an embryo implanting is 30% then transferring two will increase probability of pregnancy to 49%, not 60%.  Transferring 3, 4, 5, 6 will produce even smaller increases in probability of success.  So, there are diminishing returns to scale.  Most research is about decreasing probability of twins so I found no statistics about how you can increase your chances of multiples but for your age group most studies say that you are at risk if you transfer more than 3.  Also, probability of embryo implanting depends on the quality of the embryo.  I know that your old doc said that all of your 6 transferred embryos were grade 1.  However, even in the US different clinics apparently have different grading systems.  Perhaps you were misled or their grading system is too loose?  Working with a different doc and a different embryologist may give you a better success rate.  Don’t you feel like there is something wrong if they transferred 6 grade 1 embryos and none successfully lasted?  Also, I have not met either of your RE’s but if the second guy refuses to transfer more than 4, his standards may be higher.  If you cannot easily observe success rates for both clinics I personally would go with the one that can guarantee a good success rate with 4 embryos transferred.  So, my personal advice would be to concentrate on quality of the RE, not #’s of embryos transferred.  Of course, as others say, you met both doc’s and should go with your gut feeling.  We’ll support you no matter what choice you make.

[HeathJo]

Helen made two GREAT points:

1) If transferrng six embies did not work the first time, it really could be that the "grading" standards are lower than other doctors'.

2) Knowing that the new RE has a limit on the number of transfers shows an ethical interest in the health of both mother and child/children.

I believe you wouldn't even be trying a new doc if you were really, truly satisfied with the other one. I am not a psychic or anything, but it seems like this new guy knows what he is doing.

(If he turns out to be a quack, I am sorry!)

[Lexima]

I just started a new post:
Holy ****, I can't stop saying OMG.
I'm 16 DPIUI, and I finally tested using $1 tests, thats the only ones I have at home.  The line came up within 3 min, and although it's not as dark as control line, it's is pretty clear.  I hope the test doesn't line.  I will retest tomorrow morning.

OMG I can't believe this, I never ever had a line before.

[Helen72]

We've got our first BFP!!!
Does that mean I will be a cyber aunty?

[Lexima]

LOL,
My hands are still shaking, I have another cheap test at home.  I'll use it tomorrow first thing in the morning, and then will go out and buy a brand name.  I'll got for blood test on Tuesday before work.
Wow what a surprise for anniversary.

[HeathJo]

HOORAY!!!! I knew it! CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!! We ar ALL cyber-aunties, now. WAY TO GO!!! That vacation was timed perfectly!!

I am so happy for you guys, what an awesome anniversary present :-)

I am speechless I am so happy for you. I am rarely speechless!

(In sing-songy voice) "We got our first BFP, We got our first BFP, nyah,nyah,nyah, nyah!!!"

OMG I AM SO EXCITED!!!!

[Lexima]

You're all so so sweet.
I can't wait till tuesday for blood test, but I can't help it, i'm so excited.  I never ever had a line before wow.

I've been trying to think how many drinks I had over the week during vaca, I'd say I had 2 and a half mojitoes and a glass of wine and maybe couple of sips of beer from dh  I'm worried a bit, but then again a lot of people drink when they don't know that they are prego.  What do you think?

[ms320]

OMG - that is soooooo awesome.  I think we all have to go on vacation during the 2WW.  That must be the secret.  I am really happy for you - what a wonderful anniversary present.  I live close - I can baby sit!!!!!

[HeathJo]

Milana, don't worry about the beverages--implantation takes a week, and besides that it's not as if you were throwing down litres of vodka! I love mojitos. . . .yum. You are just fine, enjoy your BFP!!!!!

[babyalive]

Milana - Yes, as Heather Jo mentioned don't worry about the drinks.  It takes up to 12 days for implantation.  Your ok with the drinks.    I just had to check on-line because I talked to Heather Jo on the telephone.  We decided to take the bull by the horns and talk on the phone.  We've shared so many intimate details of our lives together that we thought "what the hay" let's share this in real time.  Boy, am I glad we did.  When she called and told me over the phone about your BFP I was sooooooooo excited!  Hearing the good news over the phone made it that much sweeter.   Couldn't wait to get on-line to read your good news.  

If any of you feel the same way, I am defintely open to exchanging numbers with any of you and we can communicate in real time.   Just PM me.  I think Heather feels the same, but I'll let her express that.  

OMG!!! Milana CONGRATULATIONS!!!  Let the BFP's begin!!

[HeathJo]

Yes, (if none of you are too afraid of me )I would love to chat by phone anytime, or keep it in writing here is fine also. Lisa and I figured that since we are the two biggest "communicators" (blabbermouths) we should just talk to each other sometimes as to not clog up this thread and all ya'lls pm inboxes!!

Lisa said good things happen in threes, so maybe two more of us will be as forunate as Lexima!

I have started having heartburn pretty badly, and another bad headache is encroaching.Still cramping, and my boos feel sore from like the pectoral muscles, behind the bbs. Very, very odd. I may test in the am again, but I am afraid to do so. I will be 12dpiui,cd26.

Helen, how are you holding up in the testing dept? Any urges to do so again tomorrow?

[Helen72]

I only have one cheap test stick left.  I guess I'll wait till Wednesday, 13 dpo.  I actually don't have any signs I may be prego so there is definitely no need to re-test this soon.

I'll hold my fingers crossed for you tomorrow!
I hope Lexima is contagious and her lucks rubs off on you  :)

[Lexima]

APG: Thank You for your kind words, I don't know how I would've done it without you and this site, you've kept me going through all the grueling protocols and 2wws.  I think I'm still in shock I can't believe it.  I really hope that this BFP rubbs off all the rest of you.

Heather, your symptoms sound very interesting, I'm crossing my fingers that it's a BFP, I'll be looking out for your post tomorrow morning.
Helen - sorry about BFN, but it was early, maybe there is still hope for you this cycle.  And if not, I know that you're starting the IVF process, that will give you much more chances and you will have renewed hope.

Now I need to get through this week to confirm results.  Good thing I didn't stop taking progesterone when I saw the blood on CD 13 I was really debating about that.

[Lexima]

Oh and Heather, I was reading that other post and just wanted to tell you.  Stalk away, I love hearing from you and all of the AGP sisters!!!

[HeathJo]

As you know, NO symptoms can be just as telling as having symptoms.Try to stay hopeful while not setting yourself up for a huge disappointment. (I should have just asked you to create world peace!) I know it's a tough balance, an almost impossible one, and I feel for you, as I am going through it as well.

I'm just glad we have each other and all the other gals. I will be testing Wednesday also, but at the doctor's, God willing AF does not show up. I will be 14dpiui, so we are just a day apart. I have 3 hpt sticks leaft, but I am just going to play it by ear as to whether or not I use them.

I am definitely "white-knuckling" it not to test!!!

[magda_s]

Lexima, that's FANTASTIC!!!  Hope the next one shows the same... I'm SURE it will !!!
Oh, and I know so many people who have or who know someone who has gotten totally sloshed just before finding out they were pregnant. As have said Heather and Lisa, I really wouldn't worry about it.
Heather, will you be number 2?????  That would be SOOOO cool.
Helen, thank you SO much for all the info.  I was wondering ever since I went to see the new doctor about probability and how one might calculate it for this sort of thing.  I figured it probably wasn't a straight forward doubling of chances with an additional embryo and that.
I have everything crossed for you now that I'm a bit clearer on the situation.  Sorry, earlier I'd lost track and didn't know if you were testing early or not!
Lisa, I was just wondering about his background in terms of where he's originally from.
Heather & Lisa, I think it's great that you guys picked up a phone... bit difficult for me out here as not even Skype works well !!!!  Just don't go getting attached to your phones and forgetting about the rest of us over here!! ;-)

[magda_s]

oh... and Helen & Heather, yes you're right... in fact the thing that made me think that I did want to try this new doctor is the fact that although I'm a little concerned that he won't go with more than four, it did make me think that this shows he's not about to compromise his principles and yes, it does make me wonder if perhaps he isn't more ethical and has higher standards.
Unfortunately, re going with the one who can guarantee a higher success rate with 4 or concentrating on the quality of the RE... like I said before, out here there are no standards to go by.  They can say whatever they want so there's no point in asking for statistics because you have no way of knowing if they're real or totally fictitious.
Now, this guy worked in the UK for about 20 years and only left 3 years ago so what I've done is I asked Silver82 if she knows if there's any way of checking out a doctor in the UK even after he's stopped practising there.  That way maybe I can at least find out if he was a doc "in good standing" or some such while he was there.

[empty]

Milana - OMG!!!!!!! i didnt log in at lunch and look what happens!!!!!!!!!!!! OMG OMG OMG!!!!! i am totally over the moon for you. YAY!!!!!!!!!!

omg omg i am totally shaking for you. Thats so great. Our very own AGP graduate.

OMG OMG!!!!! OK NOW I NEED TO CALM DOWN.

[HeathJo]

Lexima--Glad not to scare you, showing up on every thread regarding your BFP!!! I am almost as excited as I would be it it were my BFP! Almost, but not quite :-D Iam also glad you kept up with the Progesterone. That must have been implantation bleeding at 13dpo! Whisch gives me hope, as I am 12dpiui today, and no such sign. I know not everyone gets implantation bleeding, but if ones does get it at least it's a sign of some sort!

Magda--Don't worry, the phone is nor replacement for this forum where we can all come together anytime! It would be good if you could check out the doctor somehow through old UK records/sources. Have you tried google-in his name just to see what pops up?

Empty--Did you go grab a bottle to calm your nerves, mate? (Hee,Hee) Seriously, though, what is up with you? I know you have the appt. on Thursday, but have they got you on any meds yet?

Milana--We will be here for you every wonderful step of the way, including confirming your BFP. You have done everything right this cycle, so no need to worry. Just be happy :-)

[HeathJo]

How are you coming along? When do you start stimming?

[empty]

heather are you still up?? My appt is tomorrow at 8.30 am to decide that IUI is my next step.

OMG i still am so excited for Lexima.

[HeathJo]

Yes, I am awake! I did sleep from like 11pm-4am, so I am up early. I can't wait to hear how your appt. goes!!!

I am still so excited for Lexima as well. It's about time one of us got a BFP!!!! She is such a sweetie. And, what a great anniversary present!!

I am going to try and get some more sleep, but if I can't, I'll be back!!! Take care,hon.

[HeathJo]

I am starting a new AGP thread--DETOUR!

[empty]

yup i saw the detour. will you test tomorrow? i know i am a day ahead but just wondering?