Concerned and confused

[tkol123]

On 3 different dates with the same woman wh have gone to her apartment and started deep mouth kissing.  This went on for lenghty amounts of time. I also sucked on her breasts and we did alot of "dry humping" with me wearing jeans or corduroys and her wearing pajama bottoms with no underwear. She told me she was very wet each time. She rubbed her vagina over her pajama bottoms and a little inside them then she was rubbing my penis over my jeans with the same hand. She scratched me with her nails after rubbing inside her pajama bottoms. My pants stayed on the whole time on all 3 occasions even though she unbuckled my belt and reached down but I am not sure if she rubbed the tip of my penis or not. We have done these same activities on 3 different occasions. She told me she shot up drugs once but didn't share a needle. I don't know if she is telling me the truth.

Since she is of unkown status could this be cause for concern for contracting HIV? I am quite anxious about these encounters.

[tkol123]

Thank you and i have an appt with my psychologist this week to address this current OCD trigger.

[Edward W Hook, MD]

Last answer.  What your partners risk was would, logically not have ANY impact on the risk of oral sex. the questions are:
1.  dDd she have HIV?  You have no answer to this and as I've said, it is unlikely that she did.

and

2.  If she had HIV, would there be a risk from oral sex.  As I said above, there is NO scientific data to suggest that HIV is transmitted by oral sex.

This seems pretty clear.  I hope it helps you.  Address your OCD.

This will end this thread. EWH

[tkol123]

I have been thinking...suppose this person had shared needles and/or was HIV+ the exposures I had with her would still not warrant getting tested and I can move on without worrying about infecting others.

[tkol123]

I have been going through my OCD books. It seems I slipped back into the fear of uncertainty and wanting to pull away and avoid the situation so I can be 100% certain I don't contract HIV. Realizing where the malfunction is happening in my thinking I am going to go back to my psychologist and try to work through this.

[Edward W Hook, MD]

Glad to help. Thirty years into the epidemic, there is still no scientific data to link oral sex to risk for HIV.  EWH

[tkol123]

I learned something because I thought there was a chance with oral sex since they suggest dental dams etc and also by fingering the vagina or anus

[Edward W Hook, MD]

I think your OCD is getting the best of you.  If she was not going to be truthful, she would not have told you about having used druigs.  

If she had shared needles, the odds of her being infected are varaible but would tend to be low but over such a broad range that try to guess would be a waste of time.

If either of you have had unprotected sex with others since the last time you were each tested, using condoms until you have been tested makes good sense- for both of you. EWH

[tkol123]

Thank you very much for your advice. I was going to try and have a talk with her. Is it best practice to use a condom and both of us get tested for sure? I stress alot and not sure the "preferred" way to go about this.

I see the 1 in 10,000 but what if she didn't want me to judge and had really shared a needle. What would the odds be then?

Also I suffer from ocd with contamination issues being one of the main symptoms. I loose perspective and judgement on how far to take things to be safe. I have gotten alot of help for it but am in a stressful situation and it has flared up.

[Edward W Hook, MD]

Welcome to the Forum.  Let me start by agreeing with the information you have received earlier from the folks on the HIV Prevention Community site - this was a no risk activity.

A few more comments.  First, in general, "unknown status" is low risk.  Less than 1 in 10,000 American women who have not shared needles has HIV.  Second, HIV is spread only through penetrative vaginal or anal sex. Not by kissing, including deep kissing, not by oral sex, not by kissing a partner's breasts, not by mutual masturbation even though you may get wet with your partners' secretions during the activities.  HIV is also not transmitted through clothing.

One further comment.  You have not yet had penetrative sex but it sounds like the relationship is headed that way.  You have an opportunity to discuss both your own and her past sexual history, including previous tests for STDs before you have sex at this time. I would encourage you to do this. If she could tell you about having use IV drugs, she will tell you about her prior partners as well, particularly if you do so first.  This is a good way to start a relationship.  Most people tell the truth and appreciate this.  In your own case, it should also help to reduce your anxiety about further sexual contact with her.

I hope my comments are helpful. EWH