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Hi all...Hiv and Hep
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Hi all...Hiv and Hep

Can someone tell me if antibodies to HIV and Hepatitis C both take the same time to appear on a test?  I am confused about this, and new here. Someones help?  I tested at 2 months after a vaginal sexual exposure for Hep A,B, and C. All were negative.   Am I free of Hep??
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219662_tn?1223862160
Hep B is the only one of these that is transmitted via vaginal sex
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Avatar_m_tn
Is it true that the body often defeats Hep b?  I have heard that it is pretty common for the immune system to kick the s*it out of it and get it out of your body?  Anyone know?
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219662_tn?1223862160
Yes, Hep B infections are sometimes cleared by the immune system, like most viral infections are.
But sometimes it's not and people get chronic hepatitis, which is nasty.
There are Hep B vaccines available, so everyone should get them if they haven't yet.
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Avatar_n_tn
So, can I rely on my negative HEP C results?  I had neg. HIV test at 4 months after exposure....is there any way that my HIV results were delayed if possible HCV was not detected by 2 months after exposure?  

I am: white female, non-IV drug user.  I had unprotected vaginal for 15 min.  No noticable bleeding or other STDs.  Thanks
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219662_tn?1223862160
You definitely don't have either HIV or HCV.
HCV is not believed to be sexually transmitted in the first place.
I believe a test for HepB at months is quite reliable too, but I can't say exact numbers.
I don't think you got HepB either.
Why are you worried about all this, if you don't mind me asking?
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Avatar_n_tn
I honestly think it is brought on by guilt.  I am usually okay when I am alone and don't think about HIV as much as when I am with my boyfriend.  I am always looking at him seeing if he has any ARS symptoms, and pick out every spot or pimple on him, hoping it has nothing to do with HIV. then I go look up HIV symptoms and it freaks me out.  Right now he has poison ivy or something on his leg and I keep thinking it is a rash from HIV, thinking I had it and gave it to him, even though I tested for everything and it was neg.  Its the window period that kills me, still after I was tested at 4 months after.  I don't know...it's horrible.  Cheating has definately taught me a lesson, and this whole situation has changed my life dramatically.

Can you reliably say I am in the clear or HIV or any Hep?  I just can't get it out of my head.
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Avatar_m_tn
http://www.emedicine.com/emerg/topic244.htm

HCV can be transmitted sexually.

Incubation period of HAV is 2-7 weeks, with an average of 28 days
Incubation period for HBV varies from 30-180 days, with the average approximately 75 days
Incubation period for HCV runs 15-150 days
Incubation period of HDV is approximately 35 days (must be infected with HBV)Incubation period of HEV is 2-9 weeks with an average of 45 days
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Avatar_n_tn
For HCV to be sexually transmitted does blood have to get into an open sore or cut?  
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Avatar_m_tn
Yes, you can disreguard HIV at 4 months negative and yes you would need to have blood exchanged in HCV.
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219662_tn?1223862160
No disrespect to Teak, but you are making a mistake asking him these questions.
You won't get the answers you like, and most importantly, they will be incorrect.
Do yourself a favor, browse Dr.H.'s forum for the answers.
That's my last comment to you.
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Avatar_n_tn
Also, Disregarding HCV, can I rely on my negative 4 month HIV test?
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219662_tn?1223862160
So guilt it is.
You are definitely HIV and HepC negative.
And most likely HepB as well.

What I would do if I was you:
Ask your doctor if you had a HepB vaccine.
If "yes" then forget about HepB altogether.
If "no" then make sure you get it done.

Regarding comment from Teak above: Hep C is not believed to be sexually transmitted.
If you don't believe me (you shouldn't), search the doctor's forum for answers on Hep C.
People that claim to have gotten Hep C sexually are usually covering up their illegal IV drug usage.
So no way you got Hep C, in my opinion.

And also forget about HepA and the rest of them - no chance.
Teak scares people sometimes, maybe unwillingly, but sometimes I don't know.
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Avatar_m_tn
You should update yourself if you don't think HCV can be sexually transmitted. I've given you one of the website for you to verify.

http://wwwn.cdc.gov/travel/yellowBookCh4-HepC.aspx

So HCV can be transmitted sexually.

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Avatar_m_tn
I hope it is your last comment if you can't give these people all the facts.
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219662_tn?1223862160
It's the CYA-type stuff, many STD experts don't believe it.  Dr.H. doesn't, for one.  Neither does Dr.K. (SF Clinic)

You know, there a million links like that saying that receiving oral sex is risky for HIV.
You dismiss them, right?

My point is, there is no good data that Hep C is transmitted sexually.
So why spread this false info?  You really should not be scaring people for no reason, that's just wrong.
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Avatar_m_tn
I just give them the facts and where they can find the information. I have a sister in law that had HCV and she was not a drug user, nor did she have a blood transfusion. So before you go dismissing, have something to back yourself up.
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Avatar_m_tn
A and B  both are very common. HCV is on the rise.  But there are vaccines that if you are tested for an STD clinic you'll be asked to take them for A and B.
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Avatar_m_tn
how common is the transmission of Hep B is in gay men?  anyone know?
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Avatar_m_tn
oh okay....never knew HepA ever posed much of a risk.  That's interesting.  Thanks for answering.
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219662_tn?1223862160
I think  Hep A is just oroanal (A2M) type exposure...
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219662_tn?1223862160
I think this answers most questions on transmission and testing.

http://www.medhelp.org/forums/STD/messages/3943.html

In general, hepatitis C transmission requires direct blood exposure. It is not an STD, so I don't keep up on the details. But if you haven't shared injection equipment with an infected person and if you're not a health care worker subject to injuries with sharp instruments, you need not worry about it. Hepatitis B is more easily transmitted and includes sex as a common route. Most infected people (with either virus) have no symptoms; the only way to be certain you aren't infected is to have blood tests at least 6-8 weeks after the last possible exposure.
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219662_tn?1223862160
That does not mean your sister got it sexually, you realize that?
You can be exposed to blood without IV drugs or transfusions - razor blades, toothbrushes etc
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Avatar_m_tn
yeah that's true. But I figured just like any oral encounter, it shouldn't be such a big threat.  This makes me assume that HepA rests somewhere unusal in the mouth.

Man....I had one freakin shot of HepB vaccine. I hope that helps something.  argh.   I HATE SEX....argh
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219662_tn?1223862160
http://www.medhelp.org/forums/STD/messages/2665.html

Some people assumed sexual transmission because the prevlanece of HCV infection is higher in people married to HCV infected people than in the general population. But people who live together months and years in succession have lots of opportunty for blood sharing, in addition to sexual exposure to one another. HCV is no higher in the casual sex partners of infected people than in the general population, the virus is not present in large amounts in sexual secretions, and no research has ever documented that sex per se is a mechanism of transmission. So although sexual transmission may occur from time to time, it is not a dominant mode of transmission; and if sex didn't exist, the overall frequency of HCV infection would be no different than it is now.


Isn't Dr. H good?  Boy, is he good.
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Avatar_m_tn
Why didn't you give the rest of the information.

You'll probably get more reliable information than I can provide from CDC (www.cdc.gov, then search for hepatitis) and from the American Liver Foundation.
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219662_tn?1223862160
Well, you shouldn't hate sex, that's my point.
That's why I can't stand the whole "fear education".
You need to know the actual risks for STDs and act accordingly, that's all.
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Avatar_m_tn
Fingering and licking of the fingers after anal fingering you can be exposed. If one rims another one that is infected with HAV you can become infected.
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Avatar_m_tn
Now you can get your shots and do finish you HBV vaccine and then you won't have a risk and you sex life won't be shattered. :)
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Avatar_m_tn
that's the only way to get exposed for HepA right?  as you guys know, stupidly I had anal sex with another guy, but luckily none of that anal fingering or rimming took place.

I feel so shattered...lol.  I'm laughing out of pity.  How sad is that.  

Oh Lord..!
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Avatar_m_tn
By what you posted from Dr. H. you don't believe in giving everyone the full facts either. Giving someone the facts so that they can decide for one self if they need to test is not fear education. It’s being honest and truthful.

Here is the link to American Liver Foundation that Dr. H. quoted for more reliable information. http://www.liverfoundation.org/education/info/hepatitisc/
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Avatar_m_tn
I understand exactly what you are saying. I always like the ones that test positive HIV and say, I only received a bj, and then really question them and their story seems to change. Like you say, only a test will tell and all the excuses in the world won't get you out of it.
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172023_tn?1334675884
You know my stance on the subject.  Its not impossible for Hep C to be transmitted sexually, but it is very rare.  

And you'd think my husband was a damn Boy Scout, Teak.  I wish I had a tape recording of his pious denial of ever having used IV drugs or skin popping them, . He's one of the "rare" sexual transmissions.  

I'm only surprised he wasn't appointed as the last Pope.   Guess being married kept him out of the running.

You NEVER know what people have done or tried even once in their lives.  I've seen pregnant women positive for methampethamines on their drug tests, and they could win an academy award when you tell them they tested dirty.  They never admit it.  Never.  They cry, express their outrage, insist the test was wrong...anything but admit drug use, past or present.  

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Avatar_m_tn
lol...i just want to screeeeeeeaammmmm.  argh

you have no idea how much I am so sick and tired of going to clinics.  Yes, I will be strong and I will go and get those sexy shots (They hurt, btw!!) for myself.  
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219662_tn?1223862160
Yeah, what Peek said.

You want to be truthful and honest?  Then at least be consistent, say the same thing you say about acquiring HIV by receiving a blowjob

"There's never been a documented case of Hepatits C acquired sexually and you won't be the first."

Is it possible? Sure it is. But it has never been seen, that's enough to not bring it up.
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Avatar_m_tn
Suck it up and get the vaccines. Two less things to have to worry about.
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172023_tn?1334675884
Everyone should get the HepB vaccines.  It remains a serious cause of morbidity and mortality, and is indeed spread sexually, amongst other ways.  It is important to be vaccinated against this very serious disease.  

(We had one doctor bluntly tell my husband he was full of it with his sex story.  I thought he would kill the doc right there with his bare hands--he jumped up, overturned chairs, the whole nine yards.  He threatened to sue the doctor, even went so far as to contact an attorney, while I was practically dying with laughter the whole time.)


  
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172023_tn?1334675884
Very good point about the oral sex thing.  People here do seem to want to believe they can easily get HIV via oral sex, even though it probably doesn't happen.  

Its just human nature to believe the worst may happen to you.  
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Avatar_m_tn
Post that information that you just stated. "There's never been a documented case of Hepatits C acquired sexually and you won't be the first."

Now don't be stupid. You were given the same studies to view and the ongoing studies about oral sex. I backed myself up with scientific data now you back up what you've stated. You won't, because you can't. You're just upset because you got called on your information or shall I say lack of information that you gave.
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219662_tn?1223862160
But the fact remains, there has never been a documented case with Hep C, Dr. H. says it right there in plain English.  It's your job to fetch info on documented transmission, you're the one that insists that it happens.  How can I find proof of something that never happened???

About oral sex - you know that the Spanish study is not the only one that was done.  There were others done in the US and they did not come up with zeros, for sure.  You just keep quoting that one because those are the results you want to believe.
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Avatar_m_tn
does one need to worry about HepD and HepE?  I've no clue on this...
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172023_tn?1334675884
I'm not sure I'd go so far as to say there has never been a documented sexually transmitted case of HCV.  

"Never" is a strong word.  Never say never.  ;)
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219662_tn?1223862160
How about this non-Spanish study:

Objective: To investigate reported cases of oral HIV transmission in a cohort of persons with primary HIV infection. Methods: From 6/96 - 6/99 we enrolled 122 persons with primary HIV defined as within 12 months of documented HIV seroconversion or history compatible with primary HIV infection confirmed by less sensitive EIA test. Risk behaviors for the period during which infection occurred were elicited with self-administered and interviewer administered questionnaire. Potential oral sex transmission cases were reviewed following an investigation protocol of a follow-up interview by an epidemiologist, review of clinical notes and partner corroboration where possible. Results: There were 20 (16.4%) cases where the route of acquistion appeared to be oral sex on initial evaluation. Of these 20 cases, 3 provided insufficient additional information for classification. Of the remaining 17, 9 (53%) were subsequently reclassified as not associated with oral transmission due to other potential route of exposure. Two reclassified patients reported never engaging in anal sex but each reported a single episode of substance use associated with a blackout and risk could not be reliably recalled. Four patients reported a single incident of unprotected anal receptive anal intercourse and 1 reported a condom break during the period HIV was acquired. After follow-up investigation, 8 cases (6.6%) were classified as likely oral sex transmission. Each of the men believed oral sex represented no or minimal risk. Conclusion: Oral sex transmission may be over-reported. However, even with strigent criteria for classification, oral risk transmission represented 6.6% of infections in our study of primary HIV. Despite lower transmission risk, oral sex may be an important mode of HIV transmission due to its frequency. This finding has substantial prevention implications. Standardized investigation of HIV transmission via oral sex is needed to understand the epidemiology and risk of this behavior.
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219662_tn?1223862160
if one likes to worry...
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Avatar_m_tn
kool...thx
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219662_tn?1223862160
I agree.
All I'm looking for is a little consistency, you know?
Teak loves to repeat that no oral HIV acquisition has been documented.
So why is he not using the same criteria here for HCV?
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172023_tn?1334675884
I don't know.  I'm going back to bed.  I'm dizzy.  Later, gaters.  
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Avatar_m_tn
There you go. Now don't say it's never been documented and as Dr. H stated, You'll probably get more reliable information than I can provide from CDC (www.cdc.gov, then search for hepatitis) and from the American Liver Foundation.

http://janis7hepc.com/Modes%20of%20Transmission.htm
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Avatar_m_tn
San Francisco City Clinic-City Clinic is a specialty clinic which has been providing diagnosis and treatment of sexually transmitted diseases (STDs) to the San Francisco community since 1933

The University of California San Francisco and the San Francisco Dept. of Public Health just completed a study of men in San Francisco who have only had oral sex and found zero new HIV infections. A very recent study from Spain confirmed earlier studies that oral sex is safe sex in terms of HIV.
What's important is that other STDs like syphilis, gonorrhea, chlamydia and herpes are definitely transmitted through oral sex, and oral sex has likely contributed to San Francisco's current syphilis outbreak. Many of these infections are easily diagnosed with simple tests and can be treated with available medications.

So my advice is: Enjoy oral sex and get regular check-ups. A good check-up includes throat testing for gonorrhea, rectal testing for gonorrhea and chlamydia, urine testing for gonorrhea and chlamydia and blood tests for herpes, syphilis and HIV. We call that the grand slam!

To your health,
Dr. K

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219662_tn?1223862160
The HepC link is good, thanks.
Although, I'm not sure what you tried to say there?
From what I read there, there is no good evidence for sexual transmissions.
I'm not seeing any documented cases.  Am I missing it?

No Evidence of Sexual Transmission of Hepatitis C among Monogamous Couples: Results of a 10-Year Prospective Study

The risk of sexual transmission of hepatitis C virus (HCV) infection was evaluated among 895 monogamous heterosexual partners of HCV chronically infected individuals in a long-term prospective study, which provided a follow-up period of 8,060 person-years. Seven hundred and seventy-six (86.7%) spouses were followed for 10 yr, corresponding to 7,760 person-years of observation.

One hundred and nineteen (13.3%) spouses (69 whose infected partners cleared the virus following treatment and 50 who ended their relationship or were lost at follow-up) contributed an additional 300 person-years.

All couples denied practicing anal intercourse or sex during menstruation, as well as condom use. The average weekly rate of sexual intercourse was 1.8.

Three HCV infections were observed during follow-up corresponding to an incidence rate of 0.37 per 1,000 person-years. However, the infecting HCV genotype in one spouse (2a) was different from that of the partner (1b), clearly excluding sexual transmission.

The remaining two couples had concordant genotypes, but sequence analysis of the NS5b region of the HCV genome, coupled with phylogenetic analysis showed that the corresponding partners carried different viral isolates, again excluding the possibility of intra-spousal transmission of HCV.

The authors conclude, “Our data indicate that the risk of sexual transmission of HCV within heterosexual monogamous couples is extremely low or even null. No general recommendations for condom use seem required for individuals in monogamous partnerships with HCV-infected partners.”
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219662_tn?1223862160
Dr.K is right, as always.
People should enjoy oral sex and get regular check-ups for HIV.
No argument there - I would not dare to argue with him anyway.
But he never says that oral is "no risk", he says "very low risk" (see his std chart)
And that's the proper way, I think.

Well, this sure made the slow day go fast )))
Thanks for the informative conversation, everyone
I'm going home, catch you tomorrow.
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Avatar_m_tn
You said there were no documented cases of HCV by sex. I showed you that what you stated was not true. There are documented cases of HCV via sexual transmission.
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219662_tn?1223862160
where?  there's a lot of stuff on that link, so give me a quote, please
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Avatar_m_tn
Dr. K. said and I quote, "The University of California San Francisco and the San Francisco Dept. of Public Health just completed a study of men in San Francisco who have only had oral sex and found zero new HIV infections. A very recent study from Spain confirmed earlier studies that oral sex is safe sex in terms of HIV."

He doesn't say safer sex. he said safe sex in terms of HIV. If he thought their was a risk he would have stated so.  
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219662_tn?1223862160
yes, and where is hep c on his chart?
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219662_tn?1223862160
So what's the point in regular check-ups ))))
And why is it on his chart?
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219662_tn?1223862160
i meant a quote from the hcv page
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219662_tn?1223862160
ok, I'm really off this time
until tomorrow
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Avatar_m_tn
Dam it, dam it, dam it.   I hate sex too.  That's sad cause Im really good at it.  LOL.  :).  Seriously though, this effin sux.  Im so fin tired of subtypes, and freakin window periods I could puke.  I say again, this s**t suxxxxxx!!!!!
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Avatar_m_tn
You said, and again I quote, "You want to be truthful and honest?  Then at least be consistent, say the same thing you say about acquiring HIV by receiving a blowjob

"There's never been a documented case of Hepatits C acquired sexually and you won't be the first."

I proved to you on both counts that you were wrong in your statements. Now don't try to twist things around because you were wrong. Just admit that you were wrong and move on.
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Avatar_n_tn
Is people getting hepatititis and also getting hiv at the same time pretty common?
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Avatar_m_tn
No not really. But people with HIV like people without can contact hepatitis.
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79258_tn?1190634010
Don't know about hepatitis e, but I do know hepatitis d is only possible if you have hepatitis b. Hepatitis is complicated.

Sexually transmitted hepatitis c is highly unlikely, and worrying about getting it from sex is an enormous waste of time. Peek is right on as always. Everyone lies.

Mostly, I'm sorry so many of you have so much fear and anxiety around one of the greatest pleasures in life. Sex really is fun, but when you wrap it up with health anxiety and various phobias, plus guilt and all the negative messages we're flooded with about sex, well, it's not surprising most posters here are having meltdowns about it. It's still very sad, though. So if you decide you want to live differently, consider therapy and meds.
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219662_tn?1223862160
Wait a second.
I will gladly admit that I'm wrong if I see a documented case of sexual Hep C transmission.
I didn't find any at the link you kindly provided.
Speculation, guessing, suggestions, but no actual cases.
Point it out where is it on that page exactly, maybe I just missed it.
The only actual study that I did see there actually suggests the opposite - see the paragraph that I pasted above.
If you wish I will summarize it in the language you understand.

There were studies following serodiscordant couples where one person had Hepatitis C and the other did not.  These people were not using condoms for either vaginal or oral sex.  After 10 years of follow-up, not one person had contracted Hep C.  Not one.

Hope this helped.
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