Negative DUO at 3 weeks - Teak/ExtremeStress

Negative p24 and negative Anitibody at 3 weeks.  As I'm sure you recall,  my exposure was cunnilingus (brief 5-15 seconds) and deep finger penetration (10-15) seconds with stripper/csw.  She also grabbed my penis 2-5 seconds.  Nothing further.  You know I've been freaking out even with your kind reassuarance along the way that my risk was minimal at best.

Anyway, (lets pretend that you think I had a risk for the sake of numbers) how reliable is the 3 week DUO.  I saw somebody else post that its about 90 % reliable.  Do you agree with this.  I'm def. going to test out at least 6 weeks wth antibody because otherwise I'll g crazy, but I have to say I'm starting to feel better about this. (I know your going to tell me "i told you so").  What are your thoughts?  Am I at 90% reliability with testing alone?

[Teak]

You didn't need to test to begin with. You did not have a risk.

[ImStupid]

Thanks.  I hate to be a pest...but if we pretend for a minute that you believe I had a risk...do you think the test results are 90% reliable?

[misteryos]

That doesn't make any sense, dude. If you didn't have a risk, a negative test 30 seconds after the incident is completely conclusive.

[ImStupid]

Its funny how we rationalize risks in this forum.  Does vaginal secretion have hiv present.  Yes.  Is it possible to contact HIV orally.  Yes according to many experts although rare.  If i had a cut on my fnger, which I did, could the mixture of blood and vaginal fluid not allow for the virus to pass.  Rare I know, but certainly in theory.  Is a CSW a good candidate to be positive.  Yes I would say.  Is the disease scary as hell.  Yes.

Am I overreacting.  Most likely yes.  Believe me, I appreciate everyone's feedback and truly trust the opinion of a lot of people in here.  This forum has been whats got me through the last few weeks.  Feel free to call me crazy, but just curous on the accuracy of my test results.  Its not like I'm still questioning my results after 3 - 6 months like many on this forum.  Its only been 3 weeks !

Like my man Dr. Evil would say, "Throw me a freakin bone."  Be patient with my freak out sessions :)

What's the verdict on the Negative DUO at 3 weeks?

[ImStupid]

Couple questions:

1) I'm really concerned as I have small red bumps all over both knees today... the front.  I googled "red bumps on knee" and it came up as a symptom of ARS !

2)  My DUO test was actually 2 seperate tests.  Does that matter?  I was negative on the Elisa at 20.5 days and negative on the P24 at 21.5 days.  Is this still considered DUO and does the same realiability of 90% apply.

Please answer.  I'm getting worried again.  I have no other explanation for the knee bumps (almost pimple like).  Lots of them about freckle size.

[ExtremeStress]

Quit becoming that guy! You don't want to be that guy! You are fine.

[tmac1421]

Cripes, no risk here.

[ImStupid]

I really don't want to be that guy.  Its just funny how you never really pay attention to the body until you think something is wrong with it.  I will stop.  I'm seriously a mentally stable person (at least before this happened).  I've never really had an ailment my whole life.  I have moments of rational thought, and then I start playing the "what if" game.

I certainly don't want to be Goloka.  I don't sound that irrational do I?

[ExtremeStress]

Its funny you said that about not noticing the body until something happens. I didn't know what my penis was for until I watched the movie Top Gun and saw Kelly McGillis. From that point on, if the wind blew wrong I was in trouble! Kelly McGillis now would have the opposite affect!!! She has got old and is comfortable (what fat people say) with her body! Hopefully this made you laugh!!! Have a nice day!!!

[ImStupid]

Haha.  Ditto about Kelly McGillis.  Did you know she ditched hollywood and runs/owns a bar in Mexico.  Thanks for the laugh, and thanks for the patience.  I'll try to remain calm, at least for the rest of the day...

[ExtremeStress]

Yeah! That is when I decided not to look up her nude photos on google anymore. She has lost it!

[ImStupid]

Question about ARS rashes.  I am at 37 days post exposure.  From week 1.5-2.5 I had nearly every symptom including fever.  Now for about the past week or so I have seen rashes.  I want to believe they are anxiety related or due to poor circulation b/c of anxiety.  Do ARS rashes come and go really fast ... minutes and hours, and then reappear?  Or when it comes to a certain spot does it stay for days?  I feel like I have prolonged redness when pressure is applied anywhere to my body, but it then fades over several minutes and hours?  Am I being paranoid?  Do you think I could have other STDs causing issues.  Full panel was negative at 11 days.

[ImStupid]

Appreiate it buddy.  Comments like the one you just gave are reassuring.  You seem pretty knowledgable from your posts.  From everything I read I agree with most people's assessments that I am low/no risk.  The mind is tricky though, and I always say "Geez, what If I'm the one".  Somebody wins the lottery every week...although the odds are far fetched...its possible.  I know thats a bad way to mentally approach this, but unortunately I can't control my mind.  Please do me a favor and address these two questions as I haven't got a straight response yet from anybody regardng my test results.  Everyone continues to only address my risk...

1) A negative 3 week DUO...is this 90% reliable?

2) If the DUO was done of of two seperate blood sample (one day apart) is it still considered a DUO.  For example - day 20.5 Antibody...day 21.5 P24 antigen.

Humor a man trying to relax this weekend.  Also - just curious- what was your risk?

[ImStupid]

Thanks and good luck to you.  What are you more concerned about?  The occupatonal needle risk or the oral?  

[ImStupid]

Glad to hear your HIV negative, sorry to hear they can't determine what else is causing your issues.  Good luck, and thanks for taking the time to ease my mind today.  

[ExtremeStress]

see how other people on here have real worries. let it go and move on! you are still worried over nothing!

[ImStupid]

Thanks All.  Not to go off topic, but other STDS....

I had a complete STD panel done at 11 days post exposure and results were all negative.  Is that conclusive for bacterial STDs such as Syphilis and Clamydia (chlamydia)?  

[ImStupid]

Yeah, I'm assuming tests even at 11 days would have picked them up too.  Do you think its safe to begin having unprotected sex in my monagomous relationship again?  I would hate to infect my GF with anything.  If you all don't think I have a risk then I suppose it is not acting inethically.  Should I wait until at least a 7 week negative to be sure?

[ImStupid]

Chris - other than te incidet described, I have been in same relationship for 7 years.  The only possible chance at anything is the incident described.  Perhaps thats why I've been freaking out so much.  I've always been very careful....and very much so regret what happened.  I would hate to go down over a stupid trip to a strip club.  When did you finally give up on HIV being the possible cause to your symtpoms....after the 22 month?  Did you panic for 22 months...

[ConvincedOne]

Relax. I had similar encounter, with symptoms. Tested neg at 8 weeks elisa pcr. What symptoms did you experience? Just curious, i know symptoms don't mean anything.

[ImStupid]

Sore throat on night 7.  Diarhea (diarrhea) on night 8.  Then fever 9,10,11,12.  Pain in neck, abdomen, and bottom of feet.  Tingling in fingers.  Blotchy red hands (more so when pressure is applied) that last 10 seconds to 4 hours.  Nausea during 2nd week.  Lost 7 pounds during first 3 weeks which have since gained back.  Headaches for weeks but much worse durng week 1-3.  Dry cough week 3-4.  Other people were sick around me at the same time so I hope a combo of that and anxiety.  Now at week 5.5 and still have red blotches and feel like skin is crawling.  In other words I have had about everything.  My risk however was low/none by most standards.  Hanging in there as its comforting to read posts where others had all sorts of symptoms and then tested out such as yourself.

Chris, I truly hope you figure out whats wrong with you.  I agree about being knowledgable.  I don't even know much but had to expalin the P24 test to my doctor.

[ImStupid]

I'm still having some strange symptoms.  I think I am going to go in at the end of the week (i'll be at 6 weeks then) for a test.  I think it will help my anxiety.  Is rapid as accurate as regular ELISA?

[ExtremeStress]

sounds great. expect a conclusive negative! Yes to the last part of that question. A test is a Test.

[ImStupid]

Extreme - given my risk you think I can take the 6 week as conclusive?

[ExtremeStress]

yep! but you will probably test at 12 just to be sure, Right!

[ImStupid]

Its like you've known me my whole life.  Of course I'll probably test at 12 weeks.  But i think if (i pray to God) get a negative at 6 weeks I will at least be able to relax about it.  I'll keep you all posted.  I think I will get a full STD panel done.  Might as well not do it half a$$.

[ImStupid]

Okay... yet another question for you...I'm 6 weeks post exposure today (going for a test tomorrow as stated above)...
1) Majority of my symptoms were between weeks 1 and 2.5.  If they were indeed due to ARS would I have def. formed antibodies by week 6?  In other words, do antibodies always show up 2-3 weeks post ARS?
2)  If I got herpes frommy cunnilingus encounter...would I most likely have had a breakout already.

My test will include a a full STD panel.  Anyway, thanks again to all.  Please answer my questions and I will post my results when I get them.

[ImStupid]

Any thoughts on previous questions.  Hoepfully only a few more days of this intense anxiety.  Please bare with me until i get my results back.  Thanks.

[ImStupid]

So scared....waiting on 45 day test.  I am having trouble controlling the anxiety.  I just pray to God that I am negative.  I don't even know how to react if the news isn't favorable.  Doc said I won't have results back until Wednesday.  I'm going to lose my mind.  This whole experiene has been life changing....I simply hope for the negative and I will try to live my life much better...

[ImStupid]

Lets hope so Chris.  Knowledgable folks like yourself, Extreme, Teak, RegJoe and Mike No all seem to be certain about my negatiity.  I sure hope you guys are correct.  I wish I would have taken rapid test now.  The waiting is the hardest part (Isn't that a Tom Petty song?).  I'll let you know what happens.

[ConvincedOne]

   1st) pre-test on 6-8 weeks timing point.

2nd) final conclusive test on 13 weeks (3 months).





1)

statistical experience in last 20 years says: MINIMUM 97% OF ALL INFECTED PEOPLE WILL SEROCONVERT UNDER THE FIRST 6 WEEKS !

with a new modern technology, and with a new statistics in the last 4 years (2000-2004)
some doctors and researchers in microbiology area even say:

MINIMUM 98.5% WILL SEROCONVERT UNDER THE FIRST 6 WEEKS !

MAXIMUM 1.5% ARE POSSIBLE OUTLIERS FOR 7 WEEKS - 10 WEEKS PERIOD !

these doctors and researchers in microbiology area even say: AFTER 10 WEEKS HIV SEROCONVERSION IS - ALMOST - IMPOSSIBLE !


2)

if someone has ONE TIME (1x) LOW RISK EXPOSURE

then 6 weeks test CAN REALLY HELP HIM to calm down, to stop panic, to relax, to stay cool, to work, until final conclusive 13 weeks test.

if 6 weeks elisa test negative, then he is minimum 97% - 98.5% accurate to expect good news on the final test !


3)

personally, I think that 6 weeks elisa test is BETTER solution than 28. days PCR for ONE TIME (1x) LOW RISK EXPOSURE.

common PCR can not guarantee more than 98% for serious diagnostics ! ( because of possible errors, or undetectable virus level ! )

2% is the usual MINIMAL number of false (errors) on common PCR tests. sometimes that number can be 3% - 5% !

it depends from equipment/machinery !


IF SOMEONE GOT FALSE POSITIVE PCR (even with 100 or 400 copies small number result !),
HE CAN START TO THINK HE IS INFECTED AND ABOUT HOW TO COMMIT SUICIDE !!!

ON THE OTHER SIDE, HE CAN NOT RECEIVE FALSE POSITIVE ELISA !!!

FALSE POSITIVE ELISA IS - ALMOST - IMPOSSIBLE !!!

[ConvincedOne]

Relax, i had same low risk exposure with similar symptoms. Currently tested negative at 8 weeks PCR elisa1/2. Symptoms mean nothing.

[maybaby]

Can it happen? "yes"....Can I get hit by a plane while sitting in my office "yes"...Does it happen? "no"...Not a single case has been documented of someone aquiring HIV through the exposure you explain. A test at 3 weeks is 80-85% accurate.

[ConvincedOne]

Hi MG. Dr H would say a 6-8 week test is conclusive. He has also said that in a recent conference, he and 300 other HIV specialists were asked whether, in the last 5 years, they had seen a 6-8 week negative turn positive at 3 months. Not 1 put their hands up. If you consider Dr H gets through a few thousand tests per year and assume the other HIV specialists do too, that would be 3 milion HIV tests, with none that are negative at 6-8 weeks but positive at 3 months. If you are still worried, then follow the more conservative guidelines as described by the CDC and test at 3 months with the realization that it is very unlikely to change... :)

[ImStupid]

I'm freaked out again now.  Thats much higher than 1/10000 that everybody has been quoting.  My oral was performing cunnlingus (breif 10-15 seconds) on stripper/CSW.  It looked like the study was primarily male/male.  What do you think the odds are that the stripper was positive to begin with?  She seemed high end by the prices she quoted for further services.  Man, I'm scared.

[ExtremeStress]

ImStupid you need to quit worrying about it. As it was stated in the article, it is not conclusive that these people got it from just oral. And these are also guy on guy, not a guy licking *****! You are still no risk. You need to get off this computer and do some manly **** and watch Football. Saints are playing right now.

[ImStupid]

I had oral contact with vaginal fluid??  I think my oral health was good.  I do chew tobacco occaisionally and had done so earlier that day. (an hour before dance).  

[ExtremeStress]

let it go! move on buddy!

[ImStupid]

I am going to try and let it go once i get this 45 day test back.  Until then...these net 3 days will be hell.  What if, what if , what if.  I'm terrified potentially for my GF as well.  Anyway, thanks for comments, I'll let you know the results.  Cross your fingers for me.

[ImStupid]

I def. wont.  I didn't even mean too.  Though I was getting standard lap dance at a strip club.  Then she rubbed herself against my face and being drunk I let it happen.  I then fingered her deeply for 10-15 seconds.  Never meant or had intention for this to happen.  I regret every minute of it and will not venture down that road again.

[ExtremeStress]

It was just having fun at the club! Don't beat yourself up over it. You will be fine! When you get your negative go back to the club and do it again, because I'm going to miss writing to yah!

[ExtremeStress]

replied  to yah!

[ImStupid]

Oh boy....When I got blood drawn the doc really freaked me out. I really think that general docs don't have much HIV knowledge.  He said I had a high risk  !!  Please offer me some good reassurance right now.  I still have to wait 2 days for results.  I'm freaking again.  What if I am the outlier...the one in 10,000.  

[Daveansh]

see mate..ur test at 3 weeks is 95 % conclusive..and ur test at 6 weeks will be 98% conclusive...myself i believe...in regards to hiv its better to see specialist..at least they know what they are talking to you and know how to tackle ur fear..all the best..

[Daveansh]

one more thing...u didnt have a risk only...stay calm..

[ImStupid]

Thanks buddy...I take it that you have a high confidence in my negativity?  Totally agree on seeing a specialist...I felt lik I knew more about HIV than the guy I saw today.  Hopefully I won't be down this road again so it won't matter.  Daveansh - how is your situation progressing...?  Are you in the clear?

[peekawho]

You are negative if your "exposure" was as you stated.  You did not need a test to begin with.  I'm sorry you are freaking out over this non-event.  

[ImStupid]

Thanks Peekawho.  First of all I don't typically find myself in these situations.  Secondly my symtpoms all hit the documented timeframes.  I know not to pay attention to the symptoms, but it has been hard not too.  I don't think I would be freaking as much if I had never had a suymptom.  I think I could have let this whole thing go.  My exposure was exactly as stated (brief cunnilingus,deep fingering and she reached in pants and grabbed my penis briefly).  Thirdly it was because it was on a stripper/CSW.  She offered further sexual acts which then freaked me out during my dance.  I woud imagine there is a high probability of her being infected.  (although she wa high priced...$200 bor a BJ was what she quoted).

[Daveansh]

I am still in the waiting after my 7 weeks negative...i have been on this forum for a while now..lol..in fact today is 3 months exactly since i had my risk...but the doc told to me to come and get tested on 7 November....guess i am a bit scared..thats why i am not in a hurry to get myself tested..furthermore the biggest festival of my community is being celebrated on 9 November...i dont want any disturbance..just in case..also i am celebrating my 4th wedding anniversary on 29 October..so adding all these...i decided to test on the 7th November as being directed by my doc...so there it is..i am one of those people who have been waiting endlesslly for the 3 months to end..and now that its over...i am not in a hurry to get tested...life like that..i am still hoping for the best..but i still have that fear..u see...my major concern is due swelling i have at different places of the body....but i try to convince myself that symptoms mean nothing..lol...anyway...but for sur ur not at risk..enjoy life..and be careful henceforth..the risk is not worth taking...

[ImStupid]

Best wishes to you.  Your 7 week is looking pretty strong.  Your reassurance is comforting.  I have a personal question for you.  Have you resumed normal relations with your wife?  I am struggling with what to do in that area.  I guess upon my 45 day negative (God willing) I will proceed to have a normal love life with my GF.  I am terrified of potentially infecting her.  All my best.
-ImStupid

[Daveansh]

no....yet to resume normal relations with my wife..hopefully soon...in fact when i came back after the risk i thought i should be ok and i had relation with my wife...but since then i am more careful...

[ImStupid]

Is she not suspicious? or have you told her?  What was your risk again?

[Daveansh]

unprotected insertive vaginal and oral with a gal of unknown status..whom i met for the first time in a differrent country of mine...i try to give some hints that i may have hiv...but she trusts me so much that she cant think of this...she even brought me to a psy...i have told her i may have some illness but i am yet to know exactly what and lets wait for my final blood test on 7 nov...she is expecting me to do a complete checkup..she doesnt know i am going only for hiv test...

[ImStupid]

I wish you the best of luck.  I take it your mainly concerned because of the unprotected vaginal?  

[Daveansh]

tx mate...ya thats my only concern...i am not concerned bout the oral...whereas my unprotected insertive vaginal is a major risk and concern to me...i was foolish...and now m paying the price of it..i just hope that i wont have to pay the interest too...

[ImStupid]

I am scared.  Waiting on 45 day results which I should get back today.  Not sure what to be feeling right now.  I pray to God I've dodged the bullet.  I'll post results once I get them.

[Daveansh]

u sud be alrite mate..as u had a non existant risk..all the best...

[ImStupid]

Oh God.  So scared.  I called and they wouldn't give me results over phone.  Doc is calling back. They didn't do this last time !!!

[ImStupid]

Okay here it is.  I just tested a big fat NEGATIVE at 45 days post exposure.  What a relief, they freaked me out with their approach this time.  In fact I was negative for entire STD panel again. I already feel more relaxed.  With that being said...All Experts (Teak, RegJoe, Daveansh
,Extreme, Chris, etc) ...answer some questions for me to help bring me some closure

1)  Is the test 98% reliable?
2)  Given exposure and test results, would I basically be defying science if I tested positive beyond this point?
3)  Should I test at 3 months?
4)  With a negative STD panel at 11 days and 45 days, and no breakouts (herpes), is it conclusive that I don't have any STDs?
5) Can I without worry resume normal relations with GF
6 Did I highly over-react to this whole situation :) (be kind)

I would appreciate if as many as possible could answer because many of you have a different approach.  Thanks to all.  I don't want to say this is my last post because I don't know how the anxiety will shift once this initial relief has worn off.  You have all been a crutch for me during this episode and I am enternally grateful.