Ablation

I saw my "new" cardiologist yesterday, and he suggested I consider ablation; not right now, but should the episodes continue. He feels more than 1 is too many, as they can come at a bad time (vacation, at work, etc.

A little background: I'm a 55 year old male, and two years ago I experienced an episode of PAT, and ended up in the ER with a pulse of 208 and VTACH. My "old" cardiologist gave me a full work up, and told to stay away from caffiene. So I switched to dring 48 oz of decaf coffee. The irregular heart beats continued, but no where near as often.

In October I ended up in the ER again with a rate of 201. They converted me again, and started me on Toprol XL 25mg, once a day. My cardiologist took me off it, as I didn't like it, and I cut my decaf down to 24 oz.

In December I had a 3rd episode, and ended up in the ER again with a rate of 193. The gave me a prescription for Cardizem CD, which I took for two weeks, and asked my old cardiologist to take me off it, which he did.

I quit drinking ground decaf coffee, and switched to Folgers instant decaf crystals. So far so good; I have not had any irregular heart beats in over a week now, and  I have felt better than I've felt in a very long time. I still have two leaky valves (trace on both) but feel really good.

It appears I have a low tolerance to caffiene, but the Folgers seems to be working. From the research I did, Folgers is the only one that tests couldn't detect any caffiene in.

I would like to not have to worry about my next episode, so from you guys who have had ablation, is the risk worth it

[jtpost]

My daughter had an ablation. Her heart rate would reach about 200 and pretty much nothing would slow it down. She had an ablation a few years ago and has been great since. She says she can feel her heart getting started at times but then it does not race. She went in on a Friday morning and was home on Saturday morning. Other than the side effects from the anesthetic she did great and would do it again if she had to. Good luck to you!

[CollegeGirl143]

i had a great experience as well, and its the best thing i ever did for myself. Most procedures dont involve anesthetics (Except a local one where they insert the catheters), just a sedative. You take a nice nap, wake up, and no more heart problems. The concern with you is probably that eventaully the tachycardia will come on even without a stimulant. If you have it with the trigger, you can have it without.. And plus you'll be able to drink all the coffee you want :) good luck.

[bamagairl]

Hi there, for the ones who had the ablation, were the tacys sinus rhythm or arrythmias? I am having both and need some advice. THANKS-

[jtpost]

My daughter had supervantricular tachycardia. I think that is houw you spell it??

[Momto3]

Count me among the ablation success stories too!  I had two ablations in 2003, each targeting different foci (RVOT and LVOT). I was having 20000+ pvcs per day....In the six years I was with my EP up until that point in time, she had NEVER heard my heart beat without arrythmias.  I'm not sure about the heart rate as the pvcs always through that out of whack.  My pvcs triggered a cardiomyopathy (b/c of frequency, longevity) so it was antiarrythmics for life, or ablations.  I tried the meds, but ultimately had the ablations.  SO glad I did!

Good luck to you!

[sb786]

Wow tahts alot of pvcs!! how did you cope with so many? Did the ablation stop all the pvcs? were the pvcs the only arrythmia you had? I didn't realise you could get an ablation done for pvcs too. i have SVT and know you can have an ablation for svt though i haven't been told by my docs that i need one yet (touch wood!!).

[CollegeGirl143]

bama.. Mine was for SVT, ablations for sinus tach are a last ditch resort, because alot of patients end up with a pace maker...

[dquenzer]

Had an ablation for AFIB three years ago.  Worked like a charm.  Go to an experienced clinic like Cleveland or Mayo.

[sb786]

hello everyone,

Can someone help me out here. I'm trying my best not to get all scared again but i was told that i have pvcs (about 50-60 a day) and SVT. My cardiologist told me that the SVT and pvcs is all i have and that they wil not trigger another dangerous arrythmia such as VT because my heart is normal etc. I don't understand how Marc had an episode of PAT, (which i get) and it ended up as VT? All my docs told me over and over again that the PAT will not turn into VT etc.... HELP

[sb786]

momto3: Thanks for that,When i hear of stories like yours it makes me realise that my 60 pvcs a day is not much at all!! I'm so pleased for you that the ablations were a success and i hope you don't get that many PVCs again!! :)

[Momto3]

Yep, I definitely had a lot of pvcs!  I didn't feel the majority of them, though I was so used to my heart beating out of sync, that it actually felt normal to me.  

After the first ablation, the holter recorded about 6,000 pvcs and I was thrilled!  The doctor was not satisfied ;(  At her suggestion, I agreed to a 2nd procedure.  I was multifocal, and I knew ahead of time it might take more than one procedure.  Since the second ablation I still get pvcs, and an occasional run, but they don't go on for hours, days, weeks.  My arrythmias was primarily pvc-driven (bigeminy, tri, couplets, nsvt).

PVC ablations are not common.  I had mvp with 2-3+ mitral regurgitation and my EF had dropped from 55-60% to 40% in a short time. The doctors were concerned b/c of the valve and felt it was important to get control of the pvcs to try and improve my EF.  I tried antiarrythmics for about 7 months, but ultimately opted to try the ablation(s).  I had pvcs for about 25 years (that I know of) and even though I was having thousands, ablation was NOT a treatment option until my EF dropped.  

Good luck to you!  Hang in there....You're just beating to the tune of a different drummer : )

connie

[CollegeGirl143]

it wont, pat is an arrhythmia of the upper part of the heart, and vt of the bottom. There where obviously underlying factors that where not explained. You need to stop reading things on the internet that are scaring you do much or you will never get better.

[Momto3]

According to your doctor (a highly trained professional), you do NOT have a dangerous rhythm.  Has your doctor considered a beta blocker for you?  We are all different and there is no way you can compare your individual situation to Marc's or anyone else's.  I'm not sure why you are unable to believe your doctor, but perhaps a second opinion would help.  You are blessed to have a healthy heart, one that beats a little differently, but healthy nonetheless.  What alternatives has your doctor presented for getting past the anxiety?  What are you afraid of?  You have been assured that what you have is a benign arrythmia, yet you continue to look for danger...If pvcs were dangerous, I'd be LONG gone....I still get them, that's just the way it is. I'll stick with my pvcs, and thank God I don't have migraines.  Had 2 in my life and that was enough for me.  

Maybe a "vacation" from the internet would be helpful...try a good movie, a great book, exercise, a mini road trip, visit with friends, whatever will help you with the anxiety.  You'll probably find the busier you are, the less you notice the pvcs.

[CollegeGirl143]

ugh,i second that migraine comment, ive had one and i thought i was having a stroke! never again thank you very much! lol

[CollegeGirl143]

my goodness, god bless you, i cant even imagine getting 1-2 of those buggers a month..I remember when i had mine, even after the intial pain went away, the next day my head still felt so odd, really sensative.. Bla, im getting a headache thinking about it!! lol

[Momto3]

collegegirl, I'm with ya on the migraines!  I've had 2...talk about scared!! I can't even imagine how people handle those...

What are you studying?  Seems as though you have a keen interest in cardio stuff...hope you're considering medical school...Always room for great cardios : )

sb, I understand your frustration about the misdiagnosis, but it still isn't life threatening.  I'm wondering if working on that family would take your mind off the pvcs ; )  I went through 3 pregnancies, had 3 healthy babies and still flip-flopping.  Couplets, triples, salvos, you name it....still here. I won't tell you not to worry, cuz you'll still worry.  I'll just tell you that it isn't anything worth worrying over.  I'm definitely a worrier, so I understand your concern.  However, I'm seriously tellin' you there are lot better ways to consume your time....Now, about that baby : )

Feel better.

[CollegeGirl143]

momto3.. Definatly scary! i was up all night terrified i was having a stroke :\ it was horrid.

Im currently attending the UA college of medicine. They have also just recently opened an extension campus in phoenix (closer to the family) which i will be transferring to in the near future.. My goal is to go into cardiology, and specialize in either electrophysiology, or pediatric electrophysiology... I just hope i make it to the end! Unfortunatly, im not too close to that yet,(sometimes i think im going to be in school, internships, residency's and fellowships FOREVER) but luckily i have PLENTY of personal experience knowledge about some of the topics we talk about here, its nice to be around people who have similar interests.

Sb, i know you are so scared! its heartbreaking to hear you talk about how terrified you actually are.. You may have been misdaignosed with svt for ten years, but you're still here! And think of what you would have missed if you spent those ten years locked inside your house full of fear, for what? to find out you have a startling, but completely safe condition...Its not your heart that seems to be the biggest problem right now, its your mind.. The palpitations are probably not going to go away, so you have the choice to either spend the rest of your life locked in the house, or you can try and get some help for your mind, and release yourself from that prison you're in!! Its not going to happen on its own, you need to do it for yourself, and if you cant do it for yourself, do it for your family, and that baby you want :)

[Momto3]

OMYGOSH!! YOU CAN DO IT!!  It's so exciting to hear about your goals!  Just take it one step at a time.  Think of it as a tennis championship...First, you win a point, then a game, then a match, then it's set point!!! Win with one point at a time. :)

I took my first college English class just before my 40th birthday, as a personal challenge.  Six years after taking that class, I was receiving my master's degree.  The time flew by OK, not while I was taking finals, but.....hahaha) Someone said to me, the time will pass whether you go to school or not, so go!  I did, and he was right!  PLEASE do not give up!!  Medicine needs people like you, someone who is passionate about learning and someone who will treat patients with a "heart" (pun intended) :)

It's so exciting to hear the enthusiasm in your voice! GO FOR IT!! Don't look too far ahead, just one point at a time...

Imagine what you'll learn and where electrophysiology will be when you're in your residency!!

Good luck!!

[sb786]

Thank you to both of you.

You guys are so right i need to sort my head out not just for myself but for my hubby ad family. I need to accept the PVCs in the same way that i have now accepted the SVT. I don't know how i'm going to do it yet but i know i just have to. I'm embarrassed of the way i am dealing with the PVCs it is not like me at all. I'm just finding it really difficult to come to terms with the sudden onset of PVCs. I wonder how others cope?

Collegegirl i wish you luck with your education and hope you achieve all you ambitions and dreams you deserve to. All the hard work and effort is definitely worth it in the end! I graduated and it was hard and it feels like your at school and university all your life but when i look back now it was the best time of my life!!

[kitcurious]

Agreed.

I have been getting 1-2 migraines a month for some time now. For me they feel like my head is going to split open on one side for hours or even into the following day. Always on my right side. Head throbbing, stabbing ear pain, nausea, eye sensitivity and my right cheek goes numb.  YECH. Double YECH. Triple YECH. And yes, the first one made me wonder if this was what a stroke feels like too.

Some sources seem to play down food triggers, but I am  still deathly afraid of soy sauce LOL

[Momto3]

We're there for ya!!  Triple YECH!!  I thought, "this is it." OMYGOSH, so scary!  My mom used to get them really bad and I really couldn't comprehend the pain until I had one.  My daughter had them during college, and the RX's didn't really help her. So, guess what I did??  I asked the doctor if she could try beta blockers b/c sometimes they are helpful in preventing migraines in the first place.  It worked!!  She took them every day (10 or 20 mg, don't remember) for about a year and then weaned off of them.  I think she has had 1-2 bad headaches (not sure they were even migraines) since then, but she was getting them 3-4x/week prior to the BB's.  

I'll just keep flip-flopping my way along :)

[kitcurious]

Three a week! Your poor daughter! I have heard that beta blockers are helpful for migraines.  If I had them that often I would consider taking them because the migraines are disabling.

When I worked in school health there was one poor boy who needed Excedrin Migraine almost every single day and one day when he ran out of pills (he was 17 and very mature looking) he just started to cry.
That pain can really reduce one to tears.

My mother says she also used to get them, but eventually she stopped getting them. Mine just started in the last few years and hopefully they will disappear as well.

I get the palps on and off too. Often when doing leg lifts and such type exercise. I have ever-present mild tachycadria 100-120
(I didn't notice, the docs/nurses did at routine exams, guess it felt normal to me because it's always there) so don't generally notice the rate, but one time recently it accelerated and even I noticed. I stayed in bed for several minutes after it felt like it was winding up. When it slowed back down I got up, got my monitor and checked the rate. It was only 140 by then, have no idea what it had been.

I'd rather experience that again than a migraine.

[sb786]

Thank you. I don't know what to do about the anxiety. My world is falling apart and there is nothing i can do to stop it. I wish i could do what you said and watch a movie or visit my friends. Truth is it has been 3 months since i left my house.I wish i could accept the word of my doc but its hard to believe them when they spent 10 years misdiagnosing the SVT and all they had to do at the time was listen to me! I discovered that i had SVT the hard way. More than anything its the PVCs that scare me. They seem to have just appeared out of nowhere. i definitely didn't have them before and no one can tell me why i have started to have them now. Yes my docs and cardiologist tell me that they are benign and agree that i probably didn't have so many before. It is so hard to believe that they are benign when they prevent me from sleeping, eating bending etc. The scariest thing is that i can induce them by laying down and i know they will not stop until i don't get up!! Can they really still be benign if they just seem to start suddenly without warning? I'm scared that my docs may have missed something else just like they missed the SVT for 10 years. I know alot of people have pvcs but they seem to have had them more or less all their lives but mine have started out of no where doesn't that indicate a problem in your opinion? I don't just have single painful thumps but i get couplets and triplets too. If only i could trust the docs but i know i cannot. i feel so scared and alone. I talk to my hubby but i hate seeing him upset,  i feel guilty that i am making his life a misery too. The worst thing is we were going to try for our first baby but i feel like that will never ever happen now. i just want to be able to believe that the pvcs are benign but just cannot. Sorry for the long post :(

[CollegeGirl143]

i just wanted to also thank you so much momto3 and sb for the encouragment.. School has been getting very difficult this year, and as of late ive kind of been in a slump.. Unfortunatly for me, im the second child, and my brother graduated from mit, so being where i am isnt saying much in my family, and i sometimes dont get the encouragment and support i need to continue. sometimes i feel like im going to impload between the stress and difficulty of it all! Around big test times, between the cramming, and all the other courseload work, there are nights where i dont sleep, and othernights where i cant stay awake, but i cant go to sleep because i feel guilty for not studying all night. Ive literally ended up in a ball on the couch crying from being so over tired and frustrated... It makes me really appreciate doctors and where they came from. I have a great deal of respect and admiration for practicing physicians, and their advice and opinions to me, are priceless.. Its so difficult to achieve what they have. Sorry for the vent!!! Its just been really difficult lately and no one around me totally comprehends the pressure involved, coming from everywhere :(
:(

[Momto3]

We're here to cheer you on....Remember, it's one point at a time.  Oh, that reminds me....I messed up on the tennis scenario!  Duh!!  It's game, set, then match point!!  Senior moment.

Hey, I TOTALLY know about cramming for those blasted exams. I actually was in the midst of my undergrad degree when the doctor thought I needed my mitral valve repaired/replaced!!  WHAT???  Um, NO!!!  I'm in school now!!  I've got exams!!  Went for a followup at the CC and it was determined that I did not need surgery (at least not yet). Whew!!  

During my master's program, I had both ablations -- STRESS!!  One point at a time.  It might take you a little longer, or you might end up on a different path, but you will find your way.

Kudos to your brother on his degree from MIT.  But, don't let that set the pace for you.  Who knows, maybe he'll be designing the instruments you'll use someday in an EP lab :)  Never know where life will take ya.  Remember, it's point, game, set, match :)

I can't do the jumps, but I can cheerlead for ya!  Hey, if you need to slow the pace for your courseload, that's OK...no hurry.  When I finished my first english class, I thought about taking a few more classes.  I earned my Associate's degree, and started to focus on my first semester toward a Bachelor's, etc. Just take it one step at a time and you'll end up where you're supposed to...Don't look too far ahead as it can be overwhelming. There were be plenty of times you will consider quitting, but taking it one day at a time will help you through the rough spots.  Be sure to take time for yourself and time to smell the roses.  It's so easy to caught up in studying, research, projects and all of the demands of an education. Remember to take time for yourself too.

Connie

[kitcurious]

I think what you are doing is extremely admirable and very difficult. Hanging in there will be worth it in the end. Not only for you, but for all the people that you will help and already help everyday. You are a very bright, perceptive and empathetic person. You try to give people the advice that will best help them- kindly, but truthfully.

I'm not a middle child, but I am an only child of a person who had no respect for my interests or my pursuit of
education so I can relate. She actually tried to kkeep me from going away to school so she wouldn't be at home alone. It's very hard to feel out there in a little boat on the choppy water by yourself. It is difficult to watch other people being handed the kind of support you could also benefit from, but don't get. For some reason, some of us are regarded as not being needy. HA!  Still, there are some benefits to that self-reliant image.

I couldn't agree with you more about physicians. I know they are not all angels, and certainly not perfect, but they really worked to get that degree (and are also required to have continuing education) and they are not misrepresenting what they find to their patients. I can't imagine believing that, especially if I've seen more than one about the same concern.
That's why I can't really understand it, not entirely, when people try to blame their doctors for not "curing" them of problems that are sometimes of their own perception.

[sb786]

Just don't give in, keep trying. When i was at university i was struggling too. i was trying to cope with academic pressures and the SVT which at the time i did not know was SVT as my docs were not able to diagnose it. I remember getting no sleep on nights just before my exams, i used to think there was no way i would graduate but i did because it was something that meant the world to me. I even went on and did a masters too! At the time i got no support at all but I did it for myself and i'm so grateful i did. I'm 27 now and when i look back i think where on earth did i get the strength to carry on from? I'm in England so our education system is different to yours but its still just as valuable and the one thing that no matter what no one can take from you.

[Momto3]

CONGRATULATIONS to both of you for trudging through the muck to finish your degrees!!  The world is awaits!!  

Sb, don't let those pesky pvcs stop you now!  You've got a world to explore : )

[CollegeGirl143]

thanks guys! the words of encouragement mean so much... I know what you mean momto3 and sb, about the heart issues during school.. My first year at UofA medical college, I started getting the svt BAD... I had to miss a day of class, to get the ablation (in April, aka too close to FINALS!).. I had to stay overnight, because a nurse mvoed me too soon and i bled out.. To stop the bleeding they had to put so much pressure on my groin, they tore every muscle in that area, and i couldnt walk or even stand up straight due to the pain for two weeks! I had to go to school through all this, and it stunk.. I had a lingering svt attack 2 days after my ablation because of all the drugs still left in my system, my heart rate was 280, they had give me adenosine ( Never again!) TWICE, lol, and then cardizem just to get my heart rate below 140. I left straight from the ER to class on my crutches, my professor saw my grey skin color and how horrid and i looked and sent me home immediatly.. When things get rough i remind myself i made it through all that AND school at the same time. It sounds corny but i just wanna help people, and frankly, i need that dr salary to pay off all my school debt! lol