Heart stem cells for severe CAD

Hello, my husband is 44 years old with 8 stents to date, past by-pass and 2 heart attacks. We are looking at a stem cell company in Germany called X-cell Center. He has been accepted by them for the proceedure, but before we send the 19,300 USD we would like to hear from others that have been there or know someone that has received the stem cell treatment. Thank you for any information good or bad.

Patti

[curmudgen]

I assume you have researched this very well.  Can the clinic send you the names of US patients that they have treated?  Have you seen this web site?

[ed34]

Stem cell therapy is a very strange thing indeed. I watched an in depth documentary on this subject a month ago and it does pose many questions. I assume that your Husband is intending to have his heart muscle replaced with new tissue? because I don't believe stem cell research has reached coronary arteries yet. The documentary followed several individuals who had stem cell therapy and were from the UK but travelled to Germany. Echo scans, Nuclear scans and angiograms were taken from all patients prior to the procedure. Several weeks later, on another visit, the tests were repeated and there was no difference at all, according to the scans. However, what seems to baffle Doctors, is how much better the patients actually feel. One man was 68 and only 30% of his heart was working. He had 5 stents, then the scans. He then had stem cell therapy. Weeks later, he was walking long distances without his stick, yet scans said there was no difference. He was not short of breath or feeling any discomforts. So exactly WHAT is happening, seems to be a big mystery.

[curmudgen]

It is very hard/impossible to determine if stem cells actually ended up replacing or augmenting old heart tissue.  Placebo effect?  If the patient feels better then perhaps that's all the matters.

[jrbon]

I am sorry to say that, but are you aware that the X-Cell seems to be under investigation after a death?

See this:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/germany/8082935/Baby-death-scandal-at-stem-cell-clinic-which-treats-hundreds-of-British-patients-a-year.html

http://scnblog.typepad.com/scnblog/2010/10/questions-raised-about-xcell-center.html

If you go along, please ask for references on cases similar at yours.. they perform the treatment for a very lager number of diseases.

Jesus

[ed34]

"Placebo effect?"

You know, I keep wondering the same thing. Placebo effects are very strong indeed in many cases, and as you say, if they feel better, that's all that matters. However, they could make it a lot cheaper. I wonder if they claim to have produced a pill to mend the heart whether it would have the same effect?

[PattiandJohn]

Thanks for the replys, I have already seen the incident with the two children involving a different type of stem cell treatment, but I would still love to hear from anyone that has tried the heart stem cell treatment. Our goal is to have the stem cells generate small vessels to help supply blood to his heart not repairing it as his EF is still 60.

[PattiandJohn]

Thanks you arent the first one to ask if I had requested names of people in the US who have had it done. I think I'm affraid of the answer because we have had so much hope for this procedure. You see we were to go to Louisianna and be a part of the expanded access stem cell trial (20k lab fee for the cell process) but just recently the FDA halted them for some reason so we began looking elsewhere.
I did just send a email requesting names of US patients so that I could contact them to hear of their experience and progress. *crossing fingers*

Thank you

[kenkeith]

Recent studies have shown that treatments involving injection of stem cells into animals with damaged cardiac tissue result in improved cardiac functionality. (rules out a placebo effect).

2011, U.S. National Library of Medicine
National Institutes of Health

[ed34]

"rules out a placebo effect"
How can it rule it out when there are individuals with no observable difference?

Latest research on animal hearts is very different from the techniques used in humans. I recently read how it was discovered that the heart DOES have stem cells, whereas it was believed they didn't exist. When differentiated into heart muscle, those stem cells will repair scar tissue in the heart. This hasn't been observed with stem cells in humans harvested from different areas of the body, even though they have supposedly been differentiated into being cardiac tissue. Stem cells have been discovered virtually everywhere in the body, which has come as a surprise. Until about a decade ago it was believed that the brain was unable to make repairs or make new cells. It was believed we have to make do with the tissue we are born with. Stem cells have also been discovered in the brain.

[curmudgen]

Forgot to add web site to my first post - http://stemcelltreatments.org/clinics/germany/

"Placebo effect" was in reference to end of second posting where ed34 mentioned a person that received stems cells was walking better...did i miss something?  

Ed 34 - Whether these are truly stems cells or undifferentiated cells is a another matter.

[jrbon]

From your post, I understand that he has anginas due to blockages in small vessels.

I am almost sure that you have already looked into this but just in case have a look at:

catheter-based percutaneous myocardial revascularization or channeling (PMR/PMC), laser therapy.

http://www.aafp.org/afp/990901ap/tips/20.html

Jesus

[ed34]

I was offered this treatment a few years ago, due to the cardiologist believing I had refractory angina. However, when the blockage was discovered, causing the angina, I was then classed as stable angina. The treatment option was removed. I have no idea why.

[kenkeith]

I have provided a link that may be of interst to you.  Stem Cell Therapy at The XCell-Center
The XCell-Center is a private clinic group and institute for regenerative medicine located in Düsseldorf and Cologne, Germany. Bringing together therapeutical use of autologous adult stem cells and medical stem cell research, it is our mission to:

•Provide therapeutic application of autologous adult stem cells to patients at the highest medical standard;
•Extend existing knowledge on the effects of autologous adult stem cells by supporting pre-clinical and clinical research.
We offer patients with degenerative diseases the opportunity to undergo an innovative and promising stem cell treatment.

Since the start in January 2007, more than 4000 patients have safely undergone our various stem cell treatments.

Hope this provides a perspect for your questions. The USA is behind the curve on stem cell therapy based politics and funding.

Stem Cell Therapy at The XCell-Center
The XCell-Center is a private clinic group and institute for regenerative medicine located in Düsseldorf and Cologne, Germany. Bringing together therapeutical use of autologous adult stem cells and medical stem cell research, it is our mission to:

•Provide therapeutic application of autologous adult stem cells to patients at the highest medical standard;
•Extend existing knowledge on the effects of autologous adult stem cells by supporting pre-clinical and clinical research.
We offer patients with degenerative diseases the opportunity to undergo an innovative and promising stem cell treatment.

Since the start in January 2007, more than 4000 patients have safely undergone our various stem cell treatments.

Ken

[PattiandJohn]

Thanks Ken, I read that previously as we have researched this extreemly well for a couple of years. I just wish I could speak to someone that has actually been there for treatment to see if it helped and to make sure it is really legit before we toss 20,000 to it.

[kenkeith]

I can understand your reasoning, but I did read comments from previous patients and their experience and results.  You may not get any results from USA patients as it seems other countries are moving ahead more aggressively.  Thanks for your response. and positive stem cell research and application would help so many people it seems that result should be aggressively sustained and maintained.

Ken